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A GST On Bullying And Social Opprobrium

AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
So, in the SCOTUS thread, there's been a bit of a discussion about what, exactly bullying is in a social context. Allow me to plant my flag with Hedgie's Personal Definition Of Bullying:
Bullying in a social context is the use of social pressure and opprobrium with the intent of abuse and oppression.

What that means for me is that the use of social pressure against a person or group is not bullying - bullying requires the aspect of abuse and oppression. Or to put it another way, a group applying negative pressure against someone for being transgender is absolutely bullying - but a group placing negative pressure on an abuser is not. And yes, this does get complicated in the more gray areas - for example, when dealing with former abusers who are going through genuine rehabilitation via contrition, atonement, growth, and penance, how others should work with them socially is complicated (observers should give them some leeway in my opinion, but their victims and those who have been harmed in similar ways should not be obliged to (and part of their contrition is accepting that their victims may never forgive them.))

Ultimately, social pressure is a tool, and that tool can be wielded for good or ill - and that changes everything.

XBL: Nox Aeternum / PSN: NoxAeternum / NN:NoxAeternum / Steam: noxaeternum

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    HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    I'm the one who objected to the use of the word bullying. As a highly introverted person who doesn't care about "being cool", I got bullied a lot, and it left scars. My objection was not related at all to Justice Roberts, but simply because when you casually use a term like bullying as an acceptable behaviour, you are making it easier for all bullying to be acceptable behaviour. I think bullying is a serious issue (it lead me to a suicide attempt), and should be treated as such.

    If you think Justice Roberts was swayed by public pressure, the media, peer pressure, social pressure, a phone call from Harlan Crow relayed by Thomas, or anything else, use those words. Everyone in the SCOTUS thread that claims that what happens to Roberts isn't bullying because of the power disparity is, ironically, supporting my position while trying to correct me.

    This is what is horrifying to me: Not that Roberts was pressured into voting one way over another, but rather that it was casually described as "bullying works". Because that attitude will lead to real bullying occuring for the same justification.

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    MonwynMonwyn Apathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime. A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered User regular
    "Bullying (works/is good), actually" is a common Twitter refrain to justify dragging Today's Main Character. The idea that it's about punching up is mostly complete bullshit. It's about being able to justify and make righteous the endorphin rush from our Two Minutes Hate.

    uH3IcEi.png
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    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    There is practical, demonstrable value in making people feel bad about themselves to achieve some external goal. I would just prefer not to be good at doing that. I was trained pretty well by bullies at my school and by harsh parenting to subjugate people using guilt and social pressure. Using those tools makes me hate myself. Even if I achieve that goal.

    I could see using tough love to eventually have the person be stronger and more secure once they come out the other side, but I've seen what happens when these approaches fail - you just do harm. I'm not strong enough to accept I'm going to harm a lot of people before I can guarantee harsh methods work.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
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    mcdermottmcdermott Registered User regular
    Monwyn wrote: »
    "Bullying (works/is good), actually" is a common Twitter refrain to justify dragging Today's Main Character. The idea that it's about punching up is mostly complete bullshit. It's about being able to justify and make righteous the endorphin rush from our Two Minutes Hate.

    Yeah there are cases where it’s pretty inarguably “punching up” and the subject is actively choosing to be the main character…Elon Musk at the moment being the perfect example. But for every one of those, you’ve got ten of “random woman makes bad joke on twitter, whole world piles on during flight” which is…not that.

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    FANTOMASFANTOMAS Flan ArgentavisRegistered User regular
    I think the bad joke on plane example would be considered "dogpiling" and not bullying. Since we are in the business of making language inmutable and as narrow as possible.

    Yes, with a quick verbal "boom." You take a man's peko, you deny him his dab, all that is left is to rise up and tear down the walls of Jericho with a ".....not!" -TexiKen
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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited June 2023
    Monwyn wrote: »
    "Bullying (works/is good), actually" is a common Twitter refrain to justify dragging Today's Main Character. The idea that it's about punching up is mostly complete bullshit. It's about being able to justify and make righteous the endorphin rush from our Two Minutes Hate.

    And if you've ever heard people who need to be on social media for their jobs talk about what people say and how it affects them, the idea that it's fine and/or doesn't matter actually if they are more famous or successful then me rings pretty hollow too. Yeah, "bullying works". In that it works the same way it does anywhere else.

    shryke on
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