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Health Care Cost Negotiators?!?
tachyon
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
I'll try and keep this short.
My wife's best friend and her husband have no health insurance. The reason, can't afford the health plans provided by his employer. They have one child state assistance.
Trick is, they want to have another kid, like now. Stupid to me. Anyway when my wife tried to explain that having a kid with no health insurance is like financial suicide, her friend informed her that they were going to hire an 'agency' that negotiates with doctors/hospitals to receive cheap health care costs. This sounds like a major scam to me.
Google reveals only advice on folks with insurance negotiating for 'medicare rates' or cheaper then normal health costs, but nothing about groups of people you pay to do this for you.
In their weird logic, this is somehow better then either a) not having another kid right now or b) saving money or increasing their income somehow in order to afford the husband's employers plan.
I feel that the wife and I are at the point where our advice (or anyone else's) is not going to change their mind when it comes to the 'put off having the baby', but if I can find that this negotiation service is a scam, then maybe we can help them from making that mistake.
Any help is appreciated!
My wife's best friend and her husband have no health insurance. The reason, can't afford the health plans provided by his employer. They have one child state assistance.
Trick is, they want to have another kid, like now. Stupid to me. Anyway when my wife tried to explain that having a kid with no health insurance is like financial suicide, her friend informed her that they were going to hire an 'agency' that negotiates with doctors/hospitals to receive cheap health care costs. This sounds like a major scam to me.
Google reveals only advice on folks with insurance negotiating for 'medicare rates' or cheaper then normal health costs, but nothing about groups of people you pay to do this for you.
In their weird logic, this is somehow better then either a) not having another kid right now or b) saving money or increasing their income somehow in order to afford the husband's employers plan.
I feel that the wife and I are at the point where our advice (or anyone else's) is not going to change their mind when it comes to the 'put off having the baby', but if I can find that this negotiation service is a scam, then maybe we can help them from making that mistake.
Any help is appreciated!
tachyon on
0
Posts
But you don't need to hire an agency to do this for you. That's a waste of money. All you need to do is call the business office of the hospital where you're planning on receiving your care, explain to them that you're broke and uninsured, and ask to speak to a financial advisor. Most large hospitals have one. When I was without insurance I was often able to get my bills cut by half, sometimes more if I was able to pay cash immediately the day services were rendered.
Also, in some cases you might be able to get assistance from the US Department of Health and Human Services. (877) 696-6775. Keep in mind that hold times are atrocious - the best time to call is 9 am on a Monday and expect to spend the better part of the morning on hold.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
Get this, they are going to take the equity out of their house for the money...
I'm not sure if there is a difference, but the child is the only one on state assistance. I don't see the state paying for the birth.
With the average cost of giving birth around $10K for a normal birth (she's high risk) I just don't see where the logic is. I figure if I can show them that this negotiation service is actually a scam, then maybe it will give them pause. (as they were using this as rationale for having the baby now, w/o insurance). I should also add that she was turned down for individual insurance due to some pre-existing conditions.
This is what I figured. All the google hits recommend this for both insured, and uninsured people.
Keep in mind, this is the same husband/wife that spent close to $300 on a 'service' that basically went out on monster/careebuilder to get him a job. In IT of all things... Why they feel they have money to piss away is beyond me.
This is the same thing. They can do this with one phone call, to the hospital's business office. Paying somebody to do this for them is stupid.
That said, they should not expect huge discounts. Like I said, I was able to get my fees cut in half - but those were just professional fees. Not all of a $10k bill is going to be physician fees, some of it is going to be facility fees, some of it is going to be supplies and drugs. Those are harder to get breaks on than physician fees. Even if the bill is $10k, and they get it negotiated down by half, $5k is still a lot of money and if they're mortgaging their house to do this, this is an incredibly irresponsible financial decision.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
Doctors are usually legally required to charge the patients a fee similar to the highest fees an insurance provider that they work with will pay for a service. The health insurance companies got that law in place to keep doctors from offering patients lower fees for not using insurance (although some doctors charge a lot less for cash transactions...). Hospitals can manage to provide cheap/free coverage to people with no money because the government and private endowments usually back them financially—partially because they’re required to provide emergency care.
As for the woman with no money and no insurance who wants to have a kid...why the hell is it that stupid people love breeding?
I may try to approach her (I believe the husband just doesn't care, and is just going along with it to keep her quiet) and try to explain that I understand where they are (my wife and I were worse off 5 years ago) and that I wish that I had someone saying these things to her, to me when I was making the same type of irresponsible financial decisions.
It will probably not work, but the wife and I don't want to see them destroy their life (God, that sounds pretentious)
Sure. Which is why the bill that you first get in the mail shows the full fees. But there's nothing in the law that says that the provider can't forgive part of the bill after the charges are incurred.
Usually it's the larger hospitals and physician networks that are willing/able to do this rather than smaller clinics or private practices. But I have done it a number of times for myself and people close to me.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
This type of policy is *only* for emergency services though. I'm not sure how it would apply to childbirth. And I can't imagine it's significantly less expensive in the end than just paying for health insurance through the guy's employer.
http://www.thelostworlds.net/
I think you really need to try to address the underlying problem of this family having another child when it's not financially smart. I don't want to intrude on anyone's right to procreation - regardless of how much I may want to - but having a kid is a helluva lot more costly than the initial hospital fees. If the family doesn't have enough income to afford a health insurance plan then I'm boggled at how they are going to afford to care for another child.
This is where the story gets muddy.
First, they plan to sell their house (worth around $200K) in the next 8-12 months. However, they plan on taking maybe half the equity out to pay off credit cards, and to pay for the birth. Without going into too much detail, the husband has an IT job near a major US city. He has successfully pitched a telecommuting agreement with his current company, and will move the family to an area of the country with close to zero IT jobs. They are moving there because they will be able to live for free in a family owned house. The idea, I suppose, is to survive until that time they move into the free house.
Some problems I see, and still debating on how to best bring them to light.
1) With the amount of equity they plan on taking out of the house, coupled with closing costs (which they will most likely roll into the loan) I don't see how they are going to make a profit, or break even, on the sale of the house.
2) The house needs work, and I'm willing to bet that noone will make an offer without conditions. They will not have the money to meet these conditions, so they will have to sell the house way below what they think they will get for it.
3) If they do sell the house they will have no cash to move. After realtor fees, closing fees, etc, I don't see how they will make it to the new location.
4) This is major, it is highly unlikely that this arrangement with his company will last. Either the company will fold/get bought out, and will cancel this telecommuting arrangement, leaving him with no job. I guess there's always Wal-mart...
The only reason why I am thinking of bringing all of the above up is because I really don't think I will make an progress with the baby issue. I can see it as too emotional. Maybe if I can have them self realize this via the money issues...