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iPhowned

GrimReaperGrimReaper Registered User regular
edited September 2007 in Games and Technology
Just read this apparently with the iPhone even if you turn it off it still is actually powered on and every so often uses a data connection to check email etc.

The downside to this of course is that since you expect it to be turned off, you kinda expect it not to do anything. Therefore some rather unfortunate person has learned to their chagrin never to take their iphone on holiday. As they took it with them, turned it off and expected it not to do anything.. however, they've just been hit with a $4800 bill.

There is some class stuff happening in a slashdot on this such as the oft repeated "Just take out the battery, oh wait...".

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«1

Posts

  • emnmnmeemnmnme Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    What about when a pilot tells you to turn off all cell phones and electronic devices before takeoff? You could unwittingly kill everyone aboard the plane!

    emnmnme on
  • SnowconeSnowcone Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Oh snap.... Remind me not to get an iPhone.

    Edit: My favorite part is the quote about costing an arm and a leg outside the US. What exactly does that have to do with the fact that "off" means "on, but you can't tell I'm on, but I'm going to steal your money."

    Snowcone on
  • quovadis13quovadis13 Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    If they werent going to use the iPhone at all, why did they bring them in the first place???

    quovadis13 on
  • GreekStreekGreekStreek Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    If you keep it set on airplane mode, it will not use any sort of data connection. This is the preferred way of not defaulting on your house loan if you take your iphone on vacation for a week. They should also tell you this when you set it up for international calling.

    I have no idea if it actually ignores the airplane mode setting while it is off...that would be an interesting little bug.

    My guess is these people just didn't pay attention.

    GreekStreek on
  • SnowconeSnowcone Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    If they werent going to use the iPhone at all, why did they bring them in the first place???

    That's a good question, but ultimately should you have to wonder if your electronics are going to have a mind of their own before taking them places?

    Snowcone on
  • brynstarbrynstar Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    emnmnme wrote: »
    What about when a pilot tells you to turn off all cell phones and electronic devices before takeoff? You could unwittingly kill everyone aboard the place!

    It has an airplane mode that shuts down all receivers and basically makes it an iPod Touch.

    EDIT: Blast you GreekStreek! I'll get you next time! :)

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  • EchoEcho ski-bap ba-dapModerator, Administrator admin
    edited September 2007
    Sounds more like they used the sleep mode, and I doubt that is labeled "off".

    Echo on
  • mntorankusumntorankusu I'm not sure how to use this thing.... Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    If they werent going to use the iPhone at all, why did they bring them in the first place???
    In case of emergencies???

    Crazy, I know.

    mntorankusu on
  • GrimReaperGrimReaper Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    If they werent going to use the iPhone at all, why did they bring them in the first place???

    The same reason everyone does, in case they need to make an emergency call. I've taken my mobile with me on my last few holidays to Aus and NZ. Public telephones are a rarity nowadays.

    EDIT: Curse you mntorankusu!

    GrimReaper on
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  • oldmankenoldmanken Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Couldn't you also disable automatic email checking?

    oldmanken on
  • SporkAndrewSporkAndrew Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited September 2007
    You can also use them when, and this is very shocking, you are in the airport waiting to take off / get picked up.

    SporkAndrew on
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  • mausmalonemausmalone Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    If you keep it set on airplane mode, it will not use any sort of data connection. This is the preferred way of not defaulting on your house loan if you take your iphone on vacation for a week. They should also tell you this when you set it up for international calling.

    I have no idea if it actually ignores the airplane mode setting while it is off...that would be an interesting little bug.

    My guess is these people just didn't pay attention.

    Even if they "just didn't pay attention," it's not unreasonable to assume that OFF means it won't be doing anything. That's what I'd assume.

    mausmalone on
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  • quovadis13quovadis13 Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    If they werent going to use the iPhone at all, why did they bring them in the first place???
    In case of emergencies???

    Crazy, I know.


    Okay, why did they have to bring all 3 of their iPhones then???

    quovadis13 on
  • SenjutsuSenjutsu thot enthusiast Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    emnmnme wrote: »
    What about when a pilot tells you to turn off all cell phones and electronic devices before takeoff? You could unwittingly kill everyone aboard the plane!

    Then you put it in "Airplane Mode". Or, you know, turn it off.

    See, this asshole didn't actually turn off his iPhone. He held down the sleep button which (get this) only puts the iPhone to sleep. He didn't read the manual or anything, he just assumed it was off and let it keep racking up data charges while he was gone.

    Senjutsu on
  • urahonkyurahonky Cynical Old Man Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Wow that sucks. I would murder someone if that happened to me!

    Also: Best topic name ever!

    urahonky on
  • Rhesus PositiveRhesus Positive GNU Terry Pratchett Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    If they werent going to use the iPhone at all, why did they bring them in the first place???
    In case of emergencies???

    Crazy, I know.


    Okay, why did they have to bring all 3 of their iPhones then???

    In case of an emergency involving two of them?

    Rhesus Positive on
    [Muffled sounds of gorilla violence]
  • urahonkyurahonky Cynical Old Man Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    If they werent going to use the iPhone at all, why did they bring them in the first place???
    In case of emergencies???

    Crazy, I know.


    Okay, why did they have to bring all 3 of their iPhones then???

    In case one of them got lost maybe?

    EDIT: Rhesus Positive you're a dead man!

    urahonky on
  • mntorankusumntorankusu I'm not sure how to use this thing.... Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    If they werent going to use the iPhone at all, why did they bring them in the first place???
    In case of emergencies???

    Crazy, I know.


    Okay, why did they have to bring all 3 of their iPhones then???

    Maybe they weren't together all hours of every day???

    mntorankusu on
  • redfenixredfenix Aka'd as rfix Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    yeah, lern2phone

    redfenix on
  • GreekStreekGreekStreek Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    mausmalone wrote: »

    Even if they "just didn't pay attention," it's not unreasonable to assume that OFF means it won't be doing anything. That's what I'd assume.

    You're right, and it sucks for them, but you really are specifically told when you sign the iphone up for international calling (for which you must talk to a real person on the phone and get an actual credit check) that the ONLY way to guarantee no charges abroad is to keep it on airplane mode. I agree that this is not exactly intuitive.

    Maybe their customer service rep did them an injustice, but when I got mine activated he really stressed that point.

    Maybe a patch will change this?

    GreekStreek on
  • HarshLanguageHarshLanguage Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    I've never used an iPhone, but it sounds like a common UI issue in more recent devices. The "power on/off" button has become a "sleep" button, but it still looks to less-sophisticated/knowledgeable users like it turns the power off. If there's no obvious indication of the difference, it's a bad UI design.

    On desktop Macs, which I think also have the power/sleep button issue, the button will gently glow in pulses to visually indicate that it's asleep and not off (and other manufacturers have copied this). I'm surprised the iPhone doesn't do something similar. Not sure that's an oversight they can rectify without a hardware change. A software fix could make it easier to really turn off the data connection... "airplane mode" probably isn't an obvious choice for that to a lot of folks.

    HarshLanguage on
    QSwearing_trans_smooth_small.gif
    > turn on light

    Good start to the day. Pity it's going to be the worst one of your life. The light is now on.
  • urahonkyurahonky Cynical Old Man Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    I'm sure they weren't too intelligent as far as phone knowledge goes... They probably bought the iPhone because it's the cool thing to do nowadays.

    urahonky on
  • apotheosapotheos Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited September 2007
    Dear user: Please to be reading the manual for the device and figuring your shit out.

    apotheos on


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  • EchoEcho ski-bap ba-dapModerator, Administrator admin
    edited September 2007
    Well, I won't be getting any useful information on how it actually works either here or on Slashdot, so I'll just wait for John Gruber to shine a ray of light.

    Echo on
  • Cameron_TalleyCameron_Talley Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    This is a non-story, people. Just another case of some idiot who didn't RTFM and learn how to use his device properly. You can switch to Airplane mode, and there IS a way to turn the phone OFF. Or you could just set it up so it doesn't check the damn email so often (or at all).

    Cameron_Talley on
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  • Rhesus PositiveRhesus Positive GNU Terry Pratchett Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    And I bet they didn't even get any decent email in the time they were away.

    Rhesus Positive on
    [Muffled sounds of gorilla violence]
  • ZackSchillingZackSchilling Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    I think the real problem here is that the data charges added up to $4800, which is beyond ludicrous. That's not even pricing, that's extortion.

    So I look at the article. $25 for 20MB. Either they downloaded 3.75 GB on their phones or the overage charges are totally unreasonable.

    Also: Directly from Apple's user manual:
    Lock iPhone                        	Press the Sleep/Wake button. 
    Unlock iPhone                   	Press the Home  button or the Sleep/Wake button, then drag the slider. 
    Turn iPhone completely off	 	Press and hold the Sleep/Wake button for a few seconds until 
                                             the red slider appears, then drag the slider. 
                                             When iPhone is off, incoming calls go straight to voicemail. 
    Turn iPhone on                   	Press and hold the Sleep/Wake button until the Apple logo appears. 
    

    ZackSchilling on
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  • EchoEcho ski-bap ba-dapModerator, Administrator admin
    edited September 2007
    $25 for the first 20 megs. After that? The article fails to tell.

    Echo on
  • taliosfalcontaliosfalcon Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Eh, it seems like apples at least partly to blame for such a bloody stupid UI decision. Like Harsh said, problems like this are to be expected if your device has a button that seemingly turns it off, but doesn't. I'm just surprised there hasn't been a bigger uproar about it already

    taliosfalcon on
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  • DigDug2000DigDug2000 Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    apotheos wrote: »
    Dear user: Please to be reading the manual for the device and figuring your shit out.
    Heh. I love how Apple supporters continually talk about how things should "just work" or "just make sense", and then quickly fall back to "those idiots should read the users manual" whenever technology doesn't work like people expect it to.

    DigDug2000 on
  • EchoEcho ski-bap ba-dapModerator, Administrator admin
    edited September 2007
    Well, around here we're tech savvy. We know that "sleep" does not equal "turn off".

    That guy? Who knows.

    I'm still waiting for someone that actually owns an iPhone to tell me what the interface looks like.

    Echo on
  • GreekStreekGreekStreek Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    I should add that I'm currently posting on this forum from my iphone, which I feel adds a very appropriate level of irony to all this.

    GreekStreek on
  • urahonkyurahonky Cynical Old Man Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    I should add that I'm currently posting on this forum from my iphone, which I feel adds a very appropriate level of irony to all this.

    How so?

    urahonky on
  • apotheosapotheos Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited September 2007
    DigDug2000 wrote: »
    apotheos wrote: »
    Dear user: Please to be reading the manual for the device and figuring your shit out.
    Heh. I love how Apple supporters continually talk about how things should "just work" or "just make sense", and then quickly fall back to "those idiots should read the users manual" whenever technology doesn't work like people expect it to.

    This is how cel phones work. This has nothing to do with Apple.

    Also, if i read that article correctly, that $20 international plan is not the standard roaming data rate.

    apotheos on


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  • mausmalonemausmalone Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Echo wrote: »
    $25 for the first 20 megs. After that? The article fails to tell.

    Also, AT&T is a phone company. So it's $25 for the first 20 megs, but lord only knows what kind of service, connection, and routing fees they charge on international roaming.
    apotheos wrote: »
    DigDug2000 wrote: »
    apotheos wrote: »
    Dear user: Please to be reading the manual for the device and figuring your shit out.
    Heh. I love how Apple supporters continually talk about how things should "just work" or "just make sense", and then quickly fall back to "those idiots should read the users manual" whenever technology doesn't work like people expect it to.

    This is how cel phones work. This has nothing to do with Apple.

    Also, if i read that article correctly, that $20 international plan is not the standard roaming data rate.

    Oh come on. Even my N-Gage has a better UI for turning off the phone than the iPhone does. I hit the power button, then it asks what I want to do, and I choose "Turn Off" from that menu.

    Apple, the supposed kings of UI, should've been able to come up with something that simple for turning off the phone. There should be no ambiguity, no need to hold a button and move a slider, none of that noise. It should be simple.

    mausmalone on
    266.jpg
  • DarkWarriorDarkWarrior __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Echo wrote: »
    Well, around here we're tech savvy. We know that "sleep" does not equal "turn off".

    That guy? Who knows.

    I'm still waiting for someone that actually owns an iPhone to tell me what the interface looks like.

    Even though sleep doesn't mean off, it should mean "Not checking shit and running up bills for you when you could do this when you turn it on and actively use it".

    DarkWarrior on
  • SeptusSeptus Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    apotheos wrote: »
    DigDug2000 wrote: »
    apotheos wrote: »
    Dear user: Please to be reading the manual for the device and figuring your shit out.
    Heh. I love how Apple supporters continually talk about how things should "just work" or "just make sense", and then quickly fall back to "those idiots should read the users manual" whenever technology doesn't work like people expect it to.

    This is how cel phones work. This has nothing to do with Apple.

    Also, if i read that article correctly, that $20 international plan is not the standard roaming data rate.

    Apple does make things that just work, most of the time. But some people just can't be helped.

    Septus on
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  • bloodyroarxxbloodyroarxx Casa GrandeRegistered User regular
    edited September 2007
    mausmalone wrote: »

    Even if they "just didn't pay attention," it's not unreasonable to assume that OFF means it won't be doing anything. That's what I'd assume.

    You're right, and it sucks for them, but you really are specifically told when you sign the iphone up for international calling (for which you must talk to a real person on the phone and get an actual credit check) that the ONLY way to guarantee no charges abroad is to keep it on airplane mode. I agree that this is not exactly intuitive.

    Maybe their customer service rep did them an injustice, but when I got mine activated he really stressed that point.

    Maybe a patch will change this?

    If he had it off the whole trip I don't think he had it set up for international calling so your point doesn't really apply here.

    bloodyroarxx on
  • GreekStreekGreekStreek Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    urahonky wrote: »
    I should add that I'm currently posting on this forum from my iphone, which I feel adds a very appropriate level of irony to all this.

    How so?

    Sorry, I should proofread my post and/or say what I mean.

    I'm posting on this forum from my iphone from outside the country.

    But I'm also connected to a WiFi network, and you only pay far out the ass for Edge/GSM, so...

    GreekStreek on
  • ZackSchillingZackSchilling Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    While most users realize that locking their phone is not the same as turning it off, I think what threw everyone off here was that email continues to check in the background. I don't think the people in the article thought their phones were off, they just thought that since they didn't make any calls, they shouldn't be charged. They just didn't consider the email charges. I think the iPhone should disallow international/roaming data unless explicitly allowed either by asking the user when the situation arrives or simply not using different data networks unless the user has set a preference.

    ZackSchilling on
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