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Friends going behind your back.
TheGreatestAliasEver
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Alright, i'm not even sure this should upset me, but for some reason, it seriously does.
Me and this girl, irene, were going out for a LONG time. we were very close, but (long story short) cut the relationship out because we thought it was unhealthy for us at the time. We took some time to work on things, and we were thinking of picking the relationship back up. This is a girl that means the world to me.
I met this guy, Matt, who is a nice dude. He was like a brother to me for a long time. This is a kid who i took off from work for, jsut to see if he wanted to hang out. I went out of my way every weekend to try and liven up his life, because he always made it seem like he had a dull and drab and depressing one. Unfortunately, a lot of times he said he was too tired to get out of bed and wasn't up to hanging out.
I just found out that Matt is going to take Irene to her favorite romantic restaurant in New york City tommorrow. He never even gave me a hint that they talked. I found out from irene's friend who accidently let it slip, than (gloriously) typed "Oh shit, i wasn't supposed to type that to you."
My friend, who always says i'm like blood to him, is usually "too tired" to hang out and now i find out he's going to new york city with my ex and he never even had the fucking courtasy to tell me he was going anywhere. i go out of my fucking way every weekend to try and get this kid to hang out with me and he always says he's too tired and that he's not up to it. and then i find out he's going to the FUCKING CITY with my ex girlfriend, whom he knows i still love and he's recently single.
Is it odd/bad that i feel quite, QUITE betrayed and am on the verge of having a panic attack?
Me and this girl, irene, were going out for a LONG time. we were very close, but (long story short) cut the relationship out because we thought it was unhealthy for us at the time. We took some time to work on things, and we were thinking of picking the relationship back up. This is a girl that means the world to me.
I met this guy, Matt, who is a nice dude. He was like a brother to me for a long time. This is a kid who i took off from work for, jsut to see if he wanted to hang out. I went out of my way every weekend to try and liven up his life, because he always made it seem like he had a dull and drab and depressing one. Unfortunately, a lot of times he said he was too tired to get out of bed and wasn't up to hanging out.
I just found out that Matt is going to take Irene to her favorite romantic restaurant in New york City tommorrow. He never even gave me a hint that they talked. I found out from irene's friend who accidently let it slip, than (gloriously) typed "Oh shit, i wasn't supposed to type that to you."
My friend, who always says i'm like blood to him, is usually "too tired" to hang out and now i find out he's going to new york city with my ex and he never even had the fucking courtasy to tell me he was going anywhere. i go out of my fucking way every weekend to try and get this kid to hang out with me and he always says he's too tired and that he's not up to it. and then i find out he's going to the FUCKING CITY with my ex girlfriend, whom he knows i still love and he's recently single.
Is it odd/bad that i feel quite, QUITE betrayed and am on the verge of having a panic attack?
TheGreatestAliasEver on
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But, and I don't know if you're calm enough to hear it right now, but what your "friend" is doing, that whole "I'm too tired, I'm too x," thing is all too familiar. Girls and guys do it when they don't want to hang out with you and yet think that they are being nice to you. I don't think your friend thinks of your relationship in the same terms that you do and may consider your attempts to get him to hang out with you as somewhat annoying and smothering. That being said, I don't know how he got a hold of your ex, but perhaps this was what he was doing when he was "too tired," to hang out with you.
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I can tell you that I would probably feel the way you do and you are somewhat justified in my eyes.
But you do need to try your best to let go of those negative feelings, because they will only end up consuming you. The fact is, you aren't with her right now. You need to get your priorities straight.
You could talk to you friend and just be like "hey man... whats the deal with that?". Like asking for an explanation, not demanding one or being hostile about it though.
Maybe you should reconsider how good of a friend this guy is to you. Or; maybe he doesn't realize how you feel about the girl still.
Also you have to think that the girl is making choices here too. If she chooses to do this with him, its as much her "betraying*" (I say that because that is how you perceive it, I can tell you they most likely don't have that intent in their minds) as he is.
* I don't like using that word here because I dont really see it as a betrayal on her behalf.
Maybe I am rambling here but I hope I have given you some help.
What a worm that he can't even tell you the fucking truth.
I would be in a murderous rage.
Its going to be stressful for you, but you need to do your best to not let this get you down.
Cut your losses and and cut them both loose. This is betrayal of the highest order.
(maybe he never wanted to hang out with you, not because he was tired, but because he didn't really want to hang out with you?)
No. There are no rules. Fuck that nonsense. I'm not saying what he did was right or wrong, but there are no rules. That's silly.
Shogun Streams Vidya
There may not be rules, but there is a big arse list called "things you damm well shouldn't do to friends cause you'd be a dick if you do".
This is right up the top of the list. Along with complaining about the beer that your friend gives you for free when you are over at his place.
Satans..... hints.....
You're thinking of this thing called common courtesy.
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The first part is the most high school crap I have ever heard. How old is everyone involved, btw? She's moved on, you should too. I know, love, and all that. Been there, done that, cry it out and then move on.
The second part is important. From your OP, it sounds like you are around him just because you pity him. If you have them, I would simply stop bugging him and hang out with them. Even if he was once a 'brother' to you, you obviously doesn't feel the same way if he lies to you. It's happened to me before, people just grow apart and you can't force relationships. It will just start a chain reaction of woe. Give them one last call, then delete them from your phonebook. Works for me.
Pray tell, when is it ok for a friend to go behind another friend's back and date their ex girlfriend that they had a long term relationship with?
Or is just calling me juvenile your answer to that.
It's not that we're all sitting here condoning the behaviour of the friend, I think most of us would label it as deploarble, but still, when you come in and start chucking around steadfast rules like "Ex's are ALWAYS off limits unless the friend gives the all clear and says its ok. Punishment for breaking said rule can be end of friendship. ALL people know this" then it just sounds... juvenile. It's like you've decided that for this particular crime there is this particular punishment and the rule should always be followed.
And to answer you question since you seem so keen on recieving a hypothetical situation, I think that it's probably acceptable for a friend to go behind another friends back if the former friend and the latter friends girlfriend have a truley special relationship (read: love) and they make each other amazingly happy, and after seeking permission from the latter party the first party was denied permission. Far less acceptable is lying about it when directly asked about it as per the situation in the OP's updates.
There are hundreds of situations like this, so don't go around spouting stupid 'rules' like they're inherent in the very fabric of the universe.
Things aren't always black and white, and it's just stupid to try and apply rules like this to real life situations.
Whenever the ex-girlfriend wants to? You don't get to make claims on people you're no longer in relationships with. That's stupid tribal crap.
Just as Cat says, women (ex-girlfriends or no) are NOT your property -- ever. Not when you were dating them, and most certainly not now. Requiring your friends to ask permission to date them is both 1) Totally arrogant and insecure and 2) Wholly rude to the girl involved, seeing as she's, you know, a person, too.
To the OP: I can understand a feeling of betrayal, since he seems to have lied or at least exaggerated things to avoid seeing you, but people do that. Perhaps you should try not to devote so much of your own time to someone who isn't willing to offer the same in return.
It does seem as if you are noticing some classic signs of depression (hanging out alone, etc), but if he's asked a girl out on a date, I think he's a fully functional human being, and you shouldn't be tied down to this buddy.
If you really do feel like you're going to have a panic attack, maybe you should talk to a counselor of some sort. Otherwise, work on focusing on other, more important things -- even if it's just a breathing exercise, though some hobby would be preferable. Take up basket weaving if it would help.
I can understand why the OP is so upset, it's because it's evident that these two have been talking and forming a relationship behind his back. Of course there isn't a rule that this shouldn't be done, but it's hurtful none the less.
Also, not everyone wants to hang out all the damn time, even if they are your friend. My friends have a hard time getting me excited about doing anything unless it involves girls or crowds of people. However I'm always willing to chat with them on the phone or join a game on Xbox Live without fail.
I agree with this completely. It kind of sounds from the original post like, as far as your friendship with him goes, you are pestering him. Everyone is different and not every person always wants to go out -- it doesn't even mean he didn't like hanging out with you or that he wasn't your friend. I have had friends that I enjoyed hanging out with, but there have been periods where I just wouldn't want to go out.
I know I would and often did get ticked off if my friends would pester me about it and/or stop over just to try to get me to go hang out with them if I didn't feel like it.
As far as the girl goes, the problem is more with the way your friend is treating it than with the whole situation. It's not his fault he has feelings for the girl, and obviously the girl wasn't all THAT interested in getting back together with you if she decided to date this other guy. There's nothing wrong with them dating, there IS however something wrong with him lying to you and hiding things.
Calling him up like that seems kind of passive aggressive. You need to just call your friend and say "Hey, look, I know what's going on. I want to talk. You know you can tell me what's going on, why didn't you tell me about this. Also, while we're here, can we talk about hanging out. Do you really not want to/am I bothering you?" -- you need to clear the air. It sounds like a whole lot of miscommunication just because he's not being very direct in telling you what's up. He probably just doesn't feel comfortable/feels like you'd get angry, but it's no excuse.
Fix the situation by taking control of it and figuring out what's going on. Don't be mad that he's dating her, if you're going to be mad, just be mad that he lied to you. If you can get over that, do not hold a grudge with him just for being in the relationship.
I'm sorry, but at the very least he might expect some notification here. He stated in the OP that he would consider getting back together with the ex, and she still meant a lot to him. If his friend knew either of those things, what he did was sleazy. Sure, the friend and the ex don't need his permission to do anything. This is really just a matter of etiquette, and as a friend he should have realized that getting together with this girl would really hurt the OP, or at least might make him uncomfortable. Had they talked, and the friend had even given the OP a heads-up, things might be different, but not only did he keep the OP in the dark over a touchy issue, he lied about it.
Really, going by what you said it might be alright if guy A were to go out with friend B's girlfriend because they both wanted to, while the relationship was still going on, behind friend B's back. Neither of them require B's permission, or anyone's permission for that matter, so why would he need to be consulted? It's really just a case of doing something really shitty, in the case of this hypothetical, and something just a little shitty in the case of the OP. I'd say the friend is more in the wrong than the ex is, but from what we've been told he doesn't sound like much of a friend to begin with.
Basically OP, your friend isn't considerate at all of your feelings here, and this type of lack of consideration doesn't need to be tolerated, especially since you've gone out of your way to make time for this guy, and how considerate you've been. Drop the pal, and move on.
No, that's not silly. You obviously have never been in the situation if you think it is.
Really? Then I guess its just the adults in the thread that agree with me. I've been in this situation and it is painful, but again handle it like an adult. Spouting nonsense about 'rules' is fucking horseshit and anyone who is mature and has this thing in their head called 'reason' will know it. What happened to 'all's fair in love and war?' I'll tell you what happened its just as much nonsense as the 'rules.'
OP drop the 'friend.' I'm a somewhat cold hearted person, but when my good opinion is lost it is lost forever. But first see about the girl. Just because she's going out with dude doesn't mean she's head-over-heels for him. If you really do love her you need to find out her situation. If its too late I'd probably drop her too. Not good to dwell. Have a good cry and move on.
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This has nothing to do with the girl. It has everything to do with the actions of the friend. Read what I wrote. Your retort is that it's alright for your friend to betray you if your ex girlfriend lets him. Nice.
It's only a betrayal if they had a prior agreement that he wouldn't do it. Such an agreement may have been "assumed" in your fraternity or whatever the fuck, but the real world works as per Tube's post.
There isn't enough lime in a truck full of limeade.
You haven't talked to the girl yet, right? I suggest you do and that you don't beat around the bush, just tell her you know of the date and how you feel about it. Preferable face to face. Don't start going down the "I thought you loved me?"-road, everyone just lies then. Even Meatloaf.
Seriously, you sound as much like a romantic as me, it's in your best interest to stop looking at people as your "brothers" or "soul mates" or whatever. Chances are that they don't feel the same about you. Especially when you're all in high school.
It's really about who you talk to first. I have a feeling you should talk to your buddy first. Give him the benefit of the doubt - maybe he thinks you're going through a lot of stress and doesn't know you want to rekindle your relationship with the girl, and is simply waiting until something happens soon and he can give it to you at a "more appropriate time."
I don't have that kind of relationship with my friends - if you have something to tell me, tell me now and not later - but with girls I'm like that. If I know my girlfriend is stressed out beyond words I won't tell her something she doesn't need to hear until later. If it's something big, on the other hand, I would tell her.
This is something big.
Thats really sad. I guess I'll have to start talking to new friends about all sorts of agreements we need to make. "Now Johnny, we're friends and all, so lets lay out some ground rules. For one, please dont put your cock in my ass while Im asleep. Also, try not to stab me. Thats just not cool. Im glad we made these agreements cause it would have been cool for you to do either of those to me if we hadn't."
Thanks for the reality check about the real world. Only look out for your own interests. Dont take your friends feelings into consideration. Check, got it.
Keep this conversation in mind when a friend of yours sleeps with your wife whom you forgot to lay out proper agreements with beforehand.
Have you ever considered the possibility that some guys aren't as possessive and jealous as you are? I mean what kind of sick fuck thinks that an ex-girlfriend and a current wife are analogous relationships in the first place?
This guy, Matt or whatever, obviously knows that, which is why he's lying to the OP. The OP has every right to feel betrayed and upset, but the healthy thing is to realize that Matt is not the friend you thought he was and to move on with it.
I've seen a friendship end here and there because of this type of stuff, and I've seen some friendships linger on with bad blood lying in between which would flare up from time to time, never with good results. The guy is a prick, the girl is free to do what she wants, don't have a panic attack, just move on.
1. Relationship was dead. Fair game: probably.
2. Should he have asked? Yeah.
3. Is he trying to avoid OP? Proabably. Is it because he feels ashamed or guilty, rather than actively trying to fuck over the OP? Maybe. Is it because he's twisting his moustache with a cape, cackling at how he's screwing over the OP by dating an ex-girlfriend behind his back? Very doubtful.
I don't understand why all of you are vilifying Matt. He screwed up by not asking if it was cool, but guess what: it's his right to date her anyway. If he's worth being your friend, you'd let it happen, even if you were uncomfortable for a while.
I would feel bad if I was the OP, but I don't think this guy has done anything really wrong.