Core 2 Duo Proccesser Install

Distram

Hey guys,

Does anyone know what installing an Intel Core 2 Duo processor entails? I have the chip and it's a lot different than the processor I installed a few years ago.

The C2D I have has no pins - at least not that I can see. Also, the directions don't call for any thermal grease to be applied to it.

Anyone know what's going on here?

HalberdBlue

Does your motherboard support it? And the little grey spots on the processor are Intel's thermal grease (I don't know if thats what they call it, but it does the same thing) so you don't need to worry about applying any thermal grease.

saggio

The first question is, what sort of motherboard do you have? The second question is, are you going to use anything other than the stock headsink?

bbmartini

the grease is on the the stock heatsink. if you're not using the stock heatsink youll need to acquire some, and check the mobo or cpu manual it should describe the process well.

if not read up on it here
http://www.intel.com/support/processors/core2duo/inuse.htm

and here
http://www.intel.com/cd/channel/reseller/asmo-na/eng/299985.htm

Fats

The pins are on the motherboard now, you just set the processor in and clamp the load plate over the top of it. Much nicer setup.

VVV Nope, nothing wrong with the stock heatsink. They're pretty nice these days.

Distram

I bought a new motherboard also. One that supports C2D and Quad Core.

Yes I am using the stock heatsink and fan. Unless that isn't reccommended. I typically don't use the stock heatsink or fan but the reviews for this processor, and the heatsink and fan that came with it, were pretty good on Newegg.com.

TychoCelchuuu

The stock HSF is fine unless you're overclocking or something. To install it, just read the manual, unless your cat shredded it or something, in which case you need to open up the slot on the mobo by lifting up the lever, line up the little marker on the CPU with the little marker on the mobo, GENTLY lower the CPU straight down into the slot, close the slot and relock it with the level, and then apply the HSF. Putting the cooler on is a harrowing experience that tries the souls of even the hardiest of men, but without it your CPU will burn ever so briefly and brightly and then expire, like John Lennon. Basically you hook up the HSF to its power source, lower it into place on top of the CPU, then simultaneously push down two of the locking mechanisms diagonally across from each other, then push down the other two. This will make a noise that sounds EXACTLY like you are breaking everything in the computer, and it will feel like it too, but 9 times out of 10 you're actually doing it right. Give it a slight nudge to make sure it's actually on, then bada-bing. You're done. The stock HSF comes with a thermal pad pre-applied.

Good luck! Let me know if you need even more detailed instructions or if the cat has only clawed up a certain part of the manual.

Distram

Thanks guys!

I knew I could count on penny-arcade posters for good advice.

I'll let you guys know how it goes.

Also, I got an 512MB 8800GT graphics card. Would it benefit me to just slap an addional 8800GT in there now and SLI them together or could I run whatever the hell I want with just one for now?

vonPoonBurGer

As someone who's had to unbend a CPU pin, I have to say, I really like the pinless contacts on the bottom of the Core 2 Duo. Then again, if you talk to me in a few years, I may have a mangled socket pin horror story by that time.

As for the video card, you should be good to go with an 8800GT. Pretty much the only thing it won't be able to do is run Crysis at the highest settings. I'd say try it as is before you go SLI. It's easy to add a second 8800GT if you find your really need the extra oomph, but it's hard to unspend several hundred dollars.

TychoCelchuuu

One 8800GT is more than enough. With the money it would take to SLI a couple together, you could instead buy a better video card a few years down the road and get much better performance later for not a very big dip right now. An 8800GT will run every game at high, most with near-full AA and AF, right now.

Distram

I must be confused about how video cards even work then.

I assumed that the main thing that mattered about a video card is the Video RAM.

So, to me, 1024 MB of VRAM is more powerful than 512 MB of VRAM. See, I have an 512MB ATI X1300 right now and I'm having trouble running games. So, it doesn't make sense to me that an 512MB 8800GT will run games better than my current 512MB card. However, I probably just don't have a clue anymore about how video cards work as much as I used to.

In retrospect, my P4 3.0 GHZ processor could have been what was causing my games to dip in performance.

I probably should have posted here before I bought anything...

I just dabble in computer construction. I know how to build a machine for the most part but I don't keep up with the technology as much as I used to because I do more console gaming now. So, I don't know what is most important to games like Crysis or Hellgate:London or The Witcher - Processor speed/cores, graphics card tech, VRAM, RAM, etc.

All I really go on is, and I know you'll laugh at me here, bigger numbers > smaller numbers.

BlochWave

So, to me, 1024 MB of VRAM is more powerful than 512 MB of VRAM. See, I have an 512MB ATI X1300 right now and I'm having trouble running games. So, it doesn't make sense to me that an 512MB 8800GT will run games better than my current 512MB card. However, I probably just don't have a clue anymore about how video cards work as much as I used to.

Thinking that's the defining and only major characteristic of video cards is like thinking clock speed is the only major characteristic of a processor. Your C2D probably has a lower clock speed than 3.0 Ghz, right? Yet obviously it's superior

saggio

BlochWave wrote: »

So, to me, 1024 MB of VRAM is more powerful than 512 MB of VRAM. See, I have an 512MB ATI X1300 right now and I'm having trouble running games. So, it doesn't make sense to me that an 512MB 8800GT will run games better than my current 512MB card. However, I probably just don't have a clue anymore about how video cards work as much as I used to.

Thinking that's the defining and only major characteristic of video cards is like thinking clock speed is the only major characteristic of a processor. Your C2D probably has a lower clock speed than 3.0 Ghz, right? Yet obviously it's superior

...because the C2D has a way bigger cache, a crapload more transistors, and two processor cores compared to one. The 512MB 8800GT has faster memory, faster GPU, and more pipes compared to the X1300, and is thus faster.

BlochWave

...because the C2D has a way bigger cache, a crapload more transistors, and two processor cores compared to one. The 512MB 8800GT has faster memory, faster GPU, and more pipes compared to the X1300, and is thus faster.

which...was my point >_> I think you were just expanding on what I implied with actual knowledge though, but when I first read it I wasn't sure if you misread my post

TychoCelchuuu

The best way to look at 3d cards IMHO is holistically; you can compare pipes and memory and clock speed until the wee hours of the morning, but when it comes right down to it there are a limited number of cards to choose from and it makes more sense just to choose the best card for you based on each individual card's performance. Sites like Tom's Hardware or GPU Review make it super easy, and why an 8800GT ends up being the best card for just about the entire world right now is less important than being able to reach that conclusion by looking at benchmarks and stuff. Suffice to say RAM amount is nowhere near the defining characteristic. If you have enough RAM to hold the textures/etc of the game you're running, any extra isn't going to help much and can even result in a minor performance hit.

If that's not good enough for you, think of it like this. RAM is where the video card stores stuff like textures. This is only a small part of the card's performance; it also has to render everything to the screen, do stuff like anti-aliasing and anisotropic filtering, and stuff like that. Stuff like shaders have almost nothing to do with the card's RAM, and instead depend on its pipe configuration, clock speed, and stuff like that.

Distram

Well, you guys are illuminating a lot about how the parts work and what matters.

I knew enough not to judge my processor purchase on clock speed because I knew the C2Ds have lower clock speeds but having the two cores make it powerful.

Like I said, I know how to build a machine but I'm kind of a layman when it comes to the tech and how it works. I don't keep up on advances in shader technology or whatever other new 3D card tech is being developed all the time.

Frankly, I'm not much of a PC gamer anymore because of the expense and because the technology moves so fast. If I buy a console, I get some life out of it. If I buy PC parts, I pretty much get fucked over in a few months. I'm really just upgrading the family computer for my little brother who got some PC games for christmas that our current machine won't run.

OK, here's what will be my new system specs. In case you wanted to know.

Processor: 2.2 ghz Intel C2D
Motherboard: ASUS P5N-E SLI LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 650i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard
Graphics Card: GeForce 8800GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card
Ram: 3GB DDR2 Ram
PSU: 700 watt

TychoCelchuuu

You don't get "fucked over in a few months" with PC parts. My Radeon 9600 lasted a few years before I upgraded to my 8800GTS which will also last me a few years. Basically the 9600 has lasted as long as an original XBOX or Gamecube would have lasted.

I'd recommend dropping a gig of that RAM (3 gigs really isn't going to do much for you unless you do RAM intensive stuff like photo editing). What's the model number of that C2D? An E6750 is generally your best bet these days.

Distram

Well I should have said *sometimes* I get fucked over or I *used to* get fucked over - with buying PC parts. Probably due to my own ignorance of the way the technology works and when the best time to buy it is.

To be fair, I've had my current computer for a good while and I'm comfortable with what my family is paying to upgrade it. I'm just hoping it wont be all like "Wow! I can run Crysis at max settings!" and then a year later "Man, I have to run *cool new game of tomorrow* at medium."

Here is a link to the processor I got:
http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16819115031

Model number is E4500

Also, will I get any long term benefit, at all, of doing an SLI set-up? I mean, I bought all my parts with SLI in mind. Seems kind of a waste not to do it now...

And, the extra gig of ram was bought on a whim - it was cheap. Also, sometimes my little brother does to photo editing and other crap in photoshop. If it isn't neccessary I have another desktop that needs some more RAM anyway - I'll just slap it in there.

TychoCelchuuu

SLI is a waste of money; for what you spend on a second card, you could just sock that money away and buy a much better card next time you need better performance. The E4500 is basically the bottom of the barrell for Core2Duo processors. You want an E6X00. I'd go for an E6750 or an E6550.

Distram

The E4500 is basically the bottom of the barrell for Core2Duo processors. You want an E6X00. I'd go for an E6750 or an E6550.

What's the difference?

Deusfaux

E4500 is not "bottom of the barrel". In fact, the only between it and E6XXX line is the amount of cache. It's on the lower end sure, but the bottom of the barrel would be the Pentium Dual Core line

corcorigan

Deusfaux wrote: »

E4500 is not "bottom of the barrel". In fact, the only between it and E6XXX line is the amount of cache. It's on the lower end sure, but the bottom of the barrel would be the Pentium Dual Core line

Pentium Duel Cores aren't Core 2s though?

Unless Intel has made its naming scheme even more cryptic.

Deusfaux

It is and it isn't. Regardless, they are the bottom of intel's current line of desktop processors.

They have the E2XXX naming scheme

VThornheart

I bet it'll still work well for modern games though, especially with the video card. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

But I would be careful with the heatsink. If they're still using those four plastic push pins to hold the heat sink in place, I'd try to find an alternative heatsink if possible (In my opinion, of course). It could just be my experience, but I never feel like they're actually secure in place. I'd take a latch-based heatsink securing system any day. But I could just be paranoid.

Technicality

The stock heatsink can be tricky. Make sure you work out any stiffness in the mechanism before doing it for real or it might drive you crazy.

Distram

Ok. Upgrade successful.

So, system req. lab says my new comp still doesn't meet the reccommended requirements for Crysis.

What kind of beast from hell do I need to run Crysis on max?

Nakatomi2010

I'm going to install a Core 2 Quad tomorrow into my gaming till I get an HDTV, it'll be combined with my Radeon X1950 Pro..... Wonder if that would be sufficient...

VThornheart

Technicality wrote: »

The stock heatsink can be tricky. Make sure you work out any stiffness in the mechanism before doing it for real or it might drive you crazy.

Aye I ended up going with an AMD chip the next time I needed to buy one, in honesty... I'd never had so much trouble with a heatsink, and it makes me VERY nervous when a heatsink doesn't feel like it's properly attached. The new AMDs have the old reliable latch mechanism. I think I could hang an overweight midget off of that thing and it still wouldn't come off. ;-)

Deusfaux

Distram wrote: »

Ok. Upgrade successful.

So, system req. lab says my new comp still doesn't meet the reccommended requirements for Crysis.

What kind of beast from hell do I need to run Crysis on max?

Nobody cant currently run Crysis on max with any kind of decent framerate

Distram

Nobody cant currently run Crysis on max with any kind of decent framerate

Okay, good. I don't have to be dissapointed then. I was it was my 2MB L2Cache or something like that. I should've spent the extra money and got an E6XXX C2D processor but I was ignorant of the importance of the L2Cache and didn't pay much attention the 2MB difference between the E4XXX (2MB) and the E6XXX (4MB). Now I'm stuck with a semi-inferior processor when I could've gotten the better one for some thirty dollars more.

How much ram do I need? I have 2GB now but I've done some poking around on the net and I've seen that Crysis likes to have 4GB, especially if you're running Vista. Which brings me to my next question - should I bother upgrading to Vista? I've heard it sucks.

Also, I put on the heatsink with little trouble. I was a little weirded out by the design but what you guys have posted made me take extra care with it - which is they I probably didn't have much trouble with it. So, thanks. :-)

Gihgehls

TychoCelchuuu wrote: »

The stock HSF is fine unless you're overclocking or something. To install it, just read the manual, unless your cat shredded it or something, in which case you need to open up the slot on the mobo by lifting up the lever, line up the little marker on the CPU with the little marker on the mobo, GENTLY lower the CPU straight down into the slot, close the slot and relock it with the level, and then apply the HSF. Putting the cooler on is a harrowing experience that tries the souls of even the hardiest of men, but without it your CPU will burn ever so briefly and brightly and then expire, like John Lennon. Basically you hook up the HSF to its power source, lower it into place on top of the CPU, then simultaneously push down two of the locking mechanisms diagonally across from each other, then push down the other two. This will make a noise that sounds EXACTLY like you are breaking everything in the computer, and it will feel like it too, but 9 times out of 10 you're actually doing it right. Give it a slight nudge to make sure it's actually on, then bada-bing. You're done. The stock HSF comes with a thermal pad pre-applied.

Good luck! Let me know if you need even more detailed instructions or if the cat has only clawed up a certain part of the manual.

No joke. When I installed my C2D, the clamps on everything were actually slightly bending the mobo. It was really scary.

Nakatomi2010

Gihgehls wrote: »

TychoCelchuuu wrote: »

The stock HSF is fine unless you're overclocking or something. To install it, just read the manual, unless your cat shredded it or something, in which case you need to open up the slot on the mobo by lifting up the lever, line up the little marker on the CPU with the little marker on the mobo, GENTLY lower the CPU straight down into the slot, close the slot and relock it with the level, and then apply the HSF. Putting the cooler on is a harrowing experience that tries the souls of even the hardiest of men, but without it your CPU will burn ever so briefly and brightly and then expire, like John Lennon. Basically you hook up the HSF to its power source, lower it into place on top of the CPU, then simultaneously push down two of the locking mechanisms diagonally across from each other, then push down the other two. This will make a noise that sounds EXACTLY like you are breaking everything in the computer, and it will feel like it too, but 9 times out of 10 you're actually doing it right. Give it a slight nudge to make sure it's actually on, then bada-bing. You're done. The stock HSF comes with a thermal pad pre-applied.

Good luck! Let me know if you need even more detailed instructions or if the cat has only clawed up a certain part of the manual.

No joke. When I installed my C2D, the clamps on everything were actually slightly bending the mobo. It was really scary.

I concur, I did system building for a privetly run business and every Socket 775 install I ever did always had a tendancy to bend the motherboard.... Even my own machines... The chip is one of the best, don't get me wrong... Just, could've been thught through better....

vonPoonBurGer

Gihgehls wrote: »

No joke. When I installed my C2D, the clamps on everything were actually slightly bending the mobo. It was really scary.

I've been a big fan of Zalman HSFs for years now, not least of all because they tend to be really gentle on the mobo. For most of their units, all the serious stress gets applied to the HSF itself and the mounting hardware supplied.

Nakatomi2010

vonPoonBurGer wrote: »

Gihgehls wrote: »

No joke. When I installed my C2D, the clamps on everything were actually slightly bending the mobo. It was really scary.

I've been a big fan of Zalman HSFs for years now, not least of all because they tend to be really gentle on the mobo. For most of their units, all the serious stress gets applied to the HSF itself and the mounting hardware supplied.

Most 3rd party HSF come with mounting brackets to replace the existing ones... The Intel supplied ones come with plastic divits which poke through a hole and simply use pressure to keep things in place... As a result they have a tendancy to pull up... 3rd parties on the other hand keep things even by recycle the old tried and proven method of HSF mounting....


On a side note, I'm starting to get sick and tired of waiting for UPS to drop off my next day air package.... Drop off should've been at 10am this mornig (like yesterday) but I still got nothing.... I'm fairly confident that, for now at least, the Core 2 Quad Q6700 is giong to have to go into my gaming rig while the Core 2 Duo it currently holds will go into the HTPC, which of the following should I do...

Option A: Swap the processors and put the old C2D into the C2Q packaging and wait for UPS with the RAM, then upgrade the HTPC?

Option B: Perform the upgrades, split the RAM from the gaming rig between the two computers until UPS drops off the goods....

Option C: Upgrade the HTPC using the C2Q make sure the HD playing software really doesn't like the TV, then put it into the gaming rig?

Option Be patient, let them drop off their goods.... Then do all the work....

Option E: Frack it, wait for FedEx tomorrow to drop off the wife's case and do a system build, while doing a system rebuild, while doing an OS reinstall... (This option would involve installing three operating systems, but also mean that at no time would a computer component need to sit in anti static bags, or out in the open for any period of time... Technically the safest option as I could directly "scoop" the contents of the HTPC into her machine, then the new parts into the HTPC, then minor tuning after that (Depending on which machine gets the processor)

The time is currently noon EST, since UPS did not drop off at 10am the next delivery should be around 5pm... The amount of work involved will be the gutting of a computer, and two operating system installs...

UPS is bringing me the replacement TV Tuner (HVR-1800 replacing 1600, needed the PCI-E 1x card) and 2GB of RAM....

In theory everything would be back online and opeational before UPS gets here and I would have to do further work after their arrival to get the HVR-1800 to work properly...

TychoCelchuuu

Distram wrote: »

Nobody cant currently run Crysis on max with any kind of decent framerate

Okay, good. I don't have to be dissapointed then. I was it was my 2MB L2Cache or something like that. I should've spent the extra money and got an E6XXX C2D processor but I was ignorant of the importance of the L2Cache and didn't pay much attention the 2MB difference between the E4XXX (2MB) and the E6XXX (4MB). Now I'm stuck with a semi-inferior processor when I could've gotten the better one for some thirty dollars more.

How much ram do I need? I have 2GB now but I've done some poking around on the net and I've seen that Crysis likes to have 4GB, especially if you're running Vista. Which brings me to my next question - should I bother upgrading to Vista? I've heard it sucks.

Also, I put on the heatsink with little trouble. I was a little weirded out by the design but what you guys have posted made me take extra care with it - which is they I probably didn't have much trouble with it. So, thanks. :-)

I'm running Crysis on max with ~30 FPS. It depends on how much AA you want and what kind of resolution you're running it at. We need to know more than just your processor to know what kind of Crysis performance you're getting, but like you said there's less L2 cache on the 4XXX line (among other stuff) which can negatively impact performance (something I mentioned).

In any case, an E6700 + 2 gigs of RAM + 8800GTS 640MB runs Crysis on max at 1280x1024. I would stick with 2 gigs because anything more than 3 requires an upgrade to Vista which blows chunks. I have 2 gigs and it's more than enough for anything except perhaps image editing or heavy duty 3d modelling or something.

Distram

C2D 2.2 GHZ E4XXX
8800GT 512 MB
2GB DDR2 RAM
Windows XP

TychoCelchuuu

Now that I think about it, this is a lot of unnecessary voodoo. Just download the demo. That'll solve it.

Distram

I bought and installed it [Crysis]. I can run it on 'high' with few visually noticeable dips in frame rate thus far. I'm happy with that; it looks great.

Does anyone know the difference between having physics on High vs. Very High? I'd see for myself but you need Vista or the 'very high hack' (or whatever its called) to set anything on very high. Just wondering if I get any extra cool stuff happening if physics are on 'very high.'

Thanks again for all the input, guys. Was a big help.

TychoCelchuuu

There aren't a ton of differences. The ground looks more detailed and the rays from the sun look much nicer. Apparently it also does some sort of neato smoothing thing which you can see on this website. This page has more comparisons.

Nakatomi2010

Heh, I was going to say "Let me pop this Quad core into my computer and see how Crysis performs on that baby...", but my Radeon X1950 Pro gets a natural 45 frames less in Doom 3 at max settings, meaning it would perform poorly in Crysis.... Nto well enough to warrant the Quad cored....

Unless the popular census here is try it anyways....

Distram

Well, you are just the best person ever.

I think I'll stick with my settings on High for now - and I'll stick with XP too.

I'm fine with the graphics on high - they look great and I think I would suffer a big frame rate drop if I went up to Very High. I just wasn't sure if I'd get more physics bells and whistles on Very High - that's the only thing that would make it worth it for me.