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Taking piano lessons, buying a keyboard
Feral
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So I've started piano lessons and my instructor is strongly encouraging me to buy a keyboard so I can do exercises at home. Of course, I know nothing about keyboards (and, frankly, next to nothing about music in general) so I'm turning to H/A to help me look for something reasonable for a beginning student.
I would like it to at least be something I can hook up to my computer in case I want to, ohidunno, build loops or something someday down the line when I stop sucking. Would I need a MIDI-USB adapter or somesuch thing for that? Are weighted keys worth the premium to somebody who's just starting out?
I would like it to at least be something I can hook up to my computer in case I want to, ohidunno, build loops or something someday down the line when I stop sucking. Would I need a MIDI-USB adapter or somesuch thing for that? Are weighted keys worth the premium to somebody who's just starting out?
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
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First off, are you sure you can't swing a real piano? If you're at all serious about piano, you are going to want a real piano very soon. If you can afford one and fit one, buy one. It is 1000x better than playing on the best keyboard ever made. Now, if you live in an apartment and can't afford the noise/size/cost, I can understand going for a keyboard. Otherwise, look into buy a nice used upright. Try to find one made of real wood, rather than particle board - they'll hold their value far longer and sound much better, even if the initial cost is slightly higher.
Now, if you have your heart set on a keyboard, you will want a weighted one if you are learning. This is really not an option. Learning on an unweighted keyboard is like learning to play a saxophone by buzzing through the mouthpiece - sure, the shape of your mouth is the same, and you can kind of make notes, but it's an entirely different beast once you strap the saxophone to it. This will also prevent you from excessive frustration - I honestly can't play on an unweighted keyboard for more than an hour or so before I start going crazy and thinking strange, violent thoughts, most of which involving me bludgeoning the keyboard with various handtools. I'd also recommend getting a keyboard with the full 88 notes. You can do with a 6 octave keyboard in a pinch, but you'll eventually want a full range.
You should also consider that a digital keyboard is different from a digital piano. A digital keyboard is more of a studio workstation tool - something you'd use for programming MIDI instruments or loops and such. They're generally cheaper, but not weighted and usually small. The included piano samples also sound like shit, as a rule. A digital piano is more of a electronic piano substitute - weighted and with 88 keys, they'll lack a lot of the added functionality that you won't need on something that's meant mainly for playing music, as opposed to programming it. For learning to play, I'd strongly suggest the latter over the former. It'll cost a bit more, but learning is tough enough without having to battle with shitty instruments every time you want to practice.
For a model to look at, one that I've actually played and loved almost as much as a real piano is a Korg T3. Yeah, it's a synth and not a digital piano like I was harping about above, but it's a really wonderful keyboard to play. They're fairly rare, so snagging one might be tough, but if you can, for $700 or so you can have one of the best keyboards I've ever played. Wonderful weighting to the keys, of which there are a full 88, and a really decent piano sound. The only disadvantage to it would be the size - it's a good 6 feet long, 2 feet wide, 5" deep and about 150-200lbs. Any weighted keyboard will weigh a lot, though, and it's built like a tank. Many big, big acts used these as their gigging keyboards while on tour.
Keyboards in general are pretty horrific though. I'd go with DM's advice and look into getting a cheap upright, you can get them for a few hundred pounds at piano auctions in the UK, find out whether that's possible in the US.
PS DM, the Korg T3 you played might have 88 keys, but the one pictured in the link you provided only has 5 octaves (61), which is pretty useless. Looks like you might need to check the version if you get one Feral, make sure it has a full range.
The other thing is that you're unlikely to find "just a keyboard" that has the range you'll need without spending a pretty penny, and there'll probably be knobs and other things that you simply won't use.
Yeah, I'm not going to recommend a midi controller keyboard for piano lessons. Even semi-weighted keys will be bad for practice, and the usual size is only 3 or 4 octave keyboards. Your teacher is recommending you get something at home because practicing daily is pretty much the only way to become proficient at playing an instrument, even if it's only for a little bit. And you need to be comfortable using the same thing no matter where you're playing, so that a) your teacher doesn't spend the first 15 minutes getting you back up to speed from where you left off, with no real gain in ability, and b) so you can play the real piano the same as your "piano" at home. Synth and organ style keyboards are good for speed, but they don't build up finger strength and it's harder to get a lighter touch.
I'd suggest visiting a music store and looking at their digital pianos. They're usually not too expensive.
If you live in a house, you can get a cheap old upright(obviously a new piano, depending on the type, is gonna be 10-30k)but for obvious reasons it's not suitable for an apartment(which I live in)unless it's a huge apartment, you have a huge door, and the walls are mighty thick, and unsuitable for someone who's just started learning and may not care in a few months
Still, I don't forsee you getting a real piano for less than 1000 bucks, while a good keyboard, as the one guy mentioned one, can be had for under 1000. Which is the whole point of getting a keyboard. Size, weight(there's no way on God's green earth you're gonna get a real piano into a second floor apartment without hiring someone)can wear headphones or adjust the volume, and price
My understanding is that modern keyboards, as far as recreating the feel of a piano, are pretty good if you get nice ones. It's nearly impossible to reproduce the sound right of course, but they try
Edit: Once you get into pianos under 1000 bucks you have to wonder if they need work, suffer from a loss of sound quality, need constant retuning, new strings, or more extreme repairs
Anyhoo I was also looking for advice on specific models of keyboards to look at, as I've moved into an apartment and don't have too much money. I was hoping to keep it around 500 dollars
http://www.priviapiano.com/products/PX-110/
It's done me well so far. I chose it because it was not too terribly expensive but was lightweight and portable. It does have the full 88 keys. I got the little wooden stand to go with it (not the X-frame, which is difficult to put your knees under when not standing up), and though it comes only with the one damper pedal (on a cord) you can purchase the others if desired, or purchase them built into the frame.
It's the "middle of the road" in terms of keyboard quality, but by the time you're certain you want to excel at the piano, you can then graduate to a "real" one.
I do like to play my piano at 4:30 in the morning, so being able to do so with headphones on is excellent, especially considering I live in a house shared with other people.
Anyway, I sure like this one and it hasn't disappointed at all.
The primary ones that were obviously not crappy but still under a 1000 dollars was the PX-110, as suggested above, but for the lower price of 499, and the Yamaha P70, for 599
I think I like the P70's sound more, but I was looking at online reviews and it looked like the speakers aren't that great, and there's maybe some issues with headphone compatibility.
Very likely though I'll get the PX-110. The lower sound quality vs. the more expensive models is obvious, especially in the bass, but this one was good for the price
Yes.
I live in a second-floor city apartment with no elevator and can't afford the noise or size.
Also, I'm not going to invest $1000 in something until I get better. $500 I can justify, $1k I can't.
So what characteristics about the T3 make it so special? 88 keys, good piano sound, and weighted keys. Anything else about it?
Both, really.
Most of the music I listen to is electronica and synth-pop so obviously I have an attraction to synth and keyboards. But I'm trying to broaden my horizons, too, and I really like the sound of a real piano. Ultimately my main purpose in learning piano is that I want to learn music theory and composition, but I'm the type of person who learns by doing. So being able to play a complete piece on an acoustic piano is a goal, but a secondary goal; being able to plink a few tracks into Logic or Acid from a MIDI controller and eventually massage them into something that's not going to make peoples' ears bleed is my real goal.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
It doesn't make me want to beat it with a sledgehammer when I have to play it, which is not something I can say for many keyboards. It's also quite a good value on the used market. New in the 90s they were about $12k. That you can now get that keyboard, slightly used, for a few hundred dollars is amazing. As I also mentioned, it's built like a tank. In case of nuclear war, I would suggest curling up under your keyboard stand as opposed to your desk. To be honest, it's quite rare for a keyboard to have all three of the characteristics you mention. Once you start trying out keyboards at music stores you'll understand. It'll seem like everything with 88 keys will either be unweighted or expensive, and if you do ever find a model both full scale and weighted you can be assured it'll sound like the piano they sampled was filled with dying cats.
Oh, and as Not Sarastro mentioned, the review I linked to is for a shorter version of the T3. You want the full 88 key version.
I doubt you can find a half decent keyboard - especially if you're buying one with fully (not partially) weighted keys - that doesn't have a full complement of MIDI ports. This will make it a perfectly sufficient MIDI controller for the situation you stated above. Just be sure to check for the ports before you buy whatever model you choose.
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