All Paramount needs to do is stay HD-DVD only till No Country for Old Men comes out. Then I don't care what they do.
Are you in the UK? In North America, NCFOM is being released by Walt Disney Studios, so it's Blu-ray exclusive.
MegaMan on
"Any fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction."
- Albert Einstein
Technically, Blu-Ray is superior in terms of storage space, but some studios have used shitty codecs on their Blu-Rays. This is not really an issue of the format.
They use the same codecs. AVC and VC-1.
What, were there maybe two or three of the first Blu-rays ever released, two or something years ago, that used MPEG-2? And now none of them do.
Now to see if Bluray can be more successful than SACD and DVD-A. Remember those? Didn't think so.
It's deja vu all over again.
not nearly.
and I'll bet a lot of people remember those.
I remember them ..... as complete and utter failures.
they are failures, though intense audiophiles like them.
my point was more, as has been argued before, that the difference from bluray to dvd is more apparent to the average person than from dvd-a or sacd to cd.
I guess I could be very wrong but just from how much most people I talk to know about bluray vs how many have even heard of those audio formats I think I'm right.
What I find interesting about HD Movie threads is this:
When a webforum of techno-geeks like ourselves can be split in our "giving a crap" about HD movies, I find it hard to conceive of how even greater the hurdle must be to get people that don't know the differences between HDMI and DMI or 1080i and 720p on board.
Progress is progress. Newer, better technologies always eventually replace old ones. That is common knowledge.
The question has never been, "Will DVD ever be replaced?" No, the question has always been, "When will DVD ever be replaced?"
Part of that "when" includes a question of when a technology that is significantly superior to the DVD format arrives, and becomes not only affordable, but economic to replace your current setup and movies; some people argue that BluRay is that technology. A lot of people argue that BluRay's upgrades over DVD - for what people care about - are not enough to overcome the price gap in both players and movies, let alone replacing their current equipment, let alone rebuying DVD movies. (or not, depending on what kind of person you are).
Of course BluRay drives and movies will go down in price eventually. That's the nature of technology; it improves, and older designs can be made more cost-effectively. But how long will it take for the technology to mature and become cost efficient enough to win out over DVD? And at what price are players and discs going to have to be to really start getting people to change over?
What hurdles are HD movies facing right now, besides high cost of players and high costs of discs and low numbers of good titles that people want on the market?
Well, it's been mentioned at least once. HD confusion. Confusion over what constitutes HD content, when it's being displayed, how it's being displayed, etc etc. I think an article was linked earlier, but this one gets the job done. The "when" here is when enough of the market understand and cares about taking full advantage of their HD sets with HD movies.
It's fair to assume that "the market" will become "educated" on these things, eventually. But it's just another factor that steps in the way of a new HD media format succeeding DVD, and when it will happen.
At least what DVD had going for it was that the market didn't really need to be "educated" about its advantages over VHS - the advantages were huge and very easily apparent and obvious and outstanding. The advantages of BR over DVD? Well.. whether they are as significant or not (I'd argue that they are not), they are at least not as readily apparent and obvious.
Also, good upscaling DVD players are getting popular now, too. Another hurdle.
I would be slightly concerned with the market largely ignoring BluRay and the format truly taking off, but it seems to me that too many companies have important, vested interests in it now to let it slide. I guess that even if the market doesn't care about the format for a very, very long time, it will almost inevitably become the successor simply because the battle over the standard was so long and hard fought.
The only problem is if a better option comes down the pipe before Bluray can truly become #1 and start reveling in it's easy years.
If Bluray starts taking the top spot from DVD around the time something else starts brewing on the horizon, many people may not bother to switch over for the "flash in the pan" Bluray and wait on what's next.
The only problem is if a better option comes down the pipe before Bluray can truly become #1 and start reveling in it's easy years.
If Bluray starts taking the top spot from DVD around the time something else starts brewing on the horizon, many people may not bother to switch over for the "flash in the pan" Bluray and wait on what's next.
Yeah, I've considered that..
I'm kind of wondering just how much of a vested interest all of these companies involved have in BluRay. I can imagine that after a long and expensive format battle, and finally agreeing on a standard and backing it, that they'll want to stretch it out as long as they can; at the expense, possibly, of supporting a better format down the line. Possibly.
Of course, it is possible that a newer technology comes out that so greatly improves upon DVD that it makes sense to transfer over, if people don't really get into the BluRay thing. I mean, there have been instances in the past where improved technology came out after VHS, but people didn't really move on until something very significantly advantageous arrived; being DVD.
Still, call me a cynic, but I would suspect that the companies involved here are going to hold fast and strong to this BluRay format for a while. But I still think that it's going to take forever for BluRay to really catch on
The problem I think HD players are having is that it's already a significant investment for an average household to purchase a 1080p HDTV. After that, not many will want to buy an expensive player and $30 movies when all their DVDs still look great.
When DVDs came out, they were $20 each, which I think was the perfect price. Blu-rays costing over $20 seems ludicrous. I think if they can get the disc price down comparable to DVDs, they will sell, even if the player itself is expensive. Paying a one-time fee for an HD upgrade (the player) feels a lot more justifiable than deciding with every single movie whether it's worth $10+ (50-200%) extra for the difference in quality.
The problem I think HD players are having is that it's already a significant investment for an average household to purchase a 1080p HDTV. After that, not many will want to buy an expensive player and $30 movies when all their DVDs still look great.
When DVDs came out, they were $20 each, which I think was the perfect price. Blu-rays costing over $20 seems ludicrous. I think if they can get the disc price down comparable to DVDs, they will sell, even if the player itself is expensive. Paying a one-time fee for an HD upgrade (the player) feels a lot more justifiable than deciding with every single movie whether it's worth $10+ (50-200%) extra for the difference in quality.
What world was this? DVDs were $30-40 when they first came out. Hell if you go to a brick and mortar you'll find tons that are $25-30. Of course online is always the best option nowadays(much cheaper), but it wasn't a terribly good one when DVDs first came out.
Oddly enough the two are converging in price somewhat. Hopefully this trend continues and prices don't go back to retail.
The problem I think HD players are having is that it's already a significant investment for an average household to purchase a 1080p HDTV. After that, not many will want to buy an expensive player and $30 movies when all their DVDs still look great.
When DVDs came out, they were $20 each, which I think was the perfect price. Blu-rays costing over $20 seems ludicrous. I think if they can get the disc price down comparable to DVDs, they will sell, even if the player itself is expensive. Paying a one-time fee for an HD upgrade (the player) feels a lot more justifiable than deciding with every single movie whether it's worth $10+ (50-200%) extra for the difference in quality.
What world was this? DVDs were $30-40 when they first came out. Hell if you go to a brick and mortar you'll find tons that are $25-30. Of course online is always the best option nowadays(much cheaper), but it wasn't a terribly good one when DVDs first came out.
Oddly enough the two are converging in price somewhat. Hopefully this trend continues and prices don't go back to retail.
Hah, yeah. People seem to forget that DVD was expensive as Hell when it first came out. The players were several hundred dollars, I believe 400 and up, and the discs were just as expensive as HD movies are now. It wasn't an overnight success. The sentiments were the same as they are now, "It's so expensive, and VHS is still fine for me." As prices came down, however, as they will with high definition technology and content, DVD became a success.
I can see Blu-ray becoming a success, as well. If you go into any retail store now looking for a TV, chances are pretty much all they'll carry are HDTVs. There may or may not be one tiny isle in the back where they have a few bulky SDTVs, none of which are big screens. And when they shop for a new TV, odds are people are going to be buying an HDTV. They may or may not want some HD content to go along with that, but that content is something a good salesman will probably stress so he can make more money.
Look how big the Blu-ray and HD-DVD isles were getting. At my Best Buy, in some very small city, it was a very large and prominent section, and right in the front of the store. That good salesman is probably going to make sure you know about these things. Each time I've talked to one in the stores when I went looking for my perfect television, I did have someone try informing me of all the details, so that he could sell me more product.
All I'm saying is never say never. I don't see digital downloading becoming all that big, at least not very soon. Too much money is being put into this new format for them to start abandoning it for digital download boxes and services, I think. That and much of America still doesn't have broadband. Those that do don't even have that good of a service. I have cable with a 1 MB download rate, and I pay about 50-60 dollars for that service. It's ridiculous.
And people are material. We like to "own" something. So while we may be seeing digital download services now, I don't think that's going to be the primary focus for some time. In time, when more people have better broadband, or just broadband altogether (my small home town only recently got DSL, a DSL service that's slow as potatoes), perhaps that will change.
Dashui on
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The problem I see with digital distrabution... . most ISP's are already starting to stress of bandwidth. Coming up with new tactics to the world of online videos. Some blocking specific content, others putting together online packages where you only get so much usage, anything over you get charged for (like cell phones)
If this becomes the norm (in which case if it does, I'm going back to leaching internet off my neighbors, cause fuck that) then I can see how BR could eventually take off. People wouldn't want to waste their online "usage" on movies, when its already burned to a disc for them.
pretty much. here in australia i pay $50 for a decent (not great) broadband connection with a mere 20 gigs of downloads per month - 7 peak, 13 off-peak (between 2am and 12pm). i don't know if that's even enough for a full hd, feature length movie - if it is, it's certainly not many of them.
from an american perspective, where broadband is currently cheap and unlimited, it's easy to say how simple direct digital content might be to implement - but from where i am, i don't see it happening for a long time. to me, a retail-level product which is paired (by default) with the biggest change in television technology since colour sets seems to have much more a chance of succeeding.
pretty much. here in australia i pay $50 for a decent (not great) broadband connection with a mere 20 gigs of downloads per month - 7 peak, 13 off-peak (between 2am and 12pm). i don't know if that's even enough for a full hd, feature length movie - if it is, it's certainly not many of them.
from an american perspective, where broadband is currently cheap and unlimited, it's easy to say how simple direct digital content might be to implement - but from where i am, i don't see it happening for a long time. to me, a retail-level product which is paired (by default) with the biggest change in television technology since colour sets seems to have much more a chance of succeeding.
Telstra are investing seriously money in the digital delivery tech - they understand it's going to be the future. But the problem is that Telstra (Australia's major telecom network, for those OS) has the capacity to deliver high speed broadband to 98% of Australia, right now - but refuse to because the government will force them to share it BELOW COST with it's competitors. The government doesn't want to give Telstra that much market dominance, which is understandable....So.....we're stuck getting left behind. Hoorah!
Anyway, that's completely off topic.
PhilthePill on
I'm gonna sing the DOOM SONG now. DOOMY doom domm doom doom doom doom doom doom doomy doom-doom...
Yeah, screw Blu Ray. I don't trust Sony with anything, especially not media formats. I wanted HD-DVD to win, because it had easier marketability, but now that Blu Ray is champion I'm just going to sit out of this whole thing. Upscaling DVD players for the win... for now....
Yeah, screw Blu Ray. I don't trust Sony with anything, especially not media formats. I wanted HD-DVD to win, because it had easier marketability, but now that Blu Ray is champion I'm just going to sit out of this whole thing. Upscaling DVD players for the win... for now....
Ditto, I'dve rather seen HDDVD in.... Sadly though, with my dual format drive in my HTPC I just bought into both formats and quickly realized my Blu-Ray outnumbered my HDDVD 2 to 1.... Even this past week I bought American Gangster HDDVD, We Own the Night BluRay, and Michael Clayton BluRay.... 2 to 1....
pretty much. here in australia i pay $50 for a decent (not great) broadband connection with a mere 20 gigs of downloads per month - 7 peak, 13 off-peak (between 2am and 12pm). i don't know if that's even enough for a full hd, feature length movie - if it is, it's certainly not many of them.
from an american perspective, where broadband is currently cheap and unlimited, it's easy to say how simple direct digital content might be to implement - but from where i am, i don't see it happening for a long time. to me, a retail-level product which is paired (by default) with the biggest change in television technology since colour sets seems to have much more a chance of succeeding.
Telstra are investing seriously money in the digital delivery tech - they understand it's going to be the future. But the problem is that Telstra (Australia's major telecom network, for those OS) has the capacity to deliver high speed broadband to 98% of Australia, right now - but refuse to because the government will force them to share it BELOW COST with it's competitors. The government doesn't want to give Telstra that much market dominance, which is understandable....So.....we're stuck getting left behind. Hoorah!
Anyway, that's completely off topic.
this is the same Telstra BigPond service who thinks the bright new idea in content delivery is to post it to you in the mail? this is a service provider who seems absolutely intent on holding the evolution of the medium back as far as possible. if australia's digital delivery systems perk up soon, i can promise it won't be with thanks to telstra.
How I'm looking at it is that the newer format past DVD is going to be a hell of a lot more useful for collections than DVD was, and that DVDs are still going to be printed until the cost of Blu-Ray goes down and DVDs have had their time in the spotlight.
I bet Microsoft is glad it didn't build the HD-DVD drive into the 360 now. Or, perhaps that would have changed things...
Uh that definitely would have changed things seeing as how the 360 has sold a fuckton.
....and it might not have done had it been more expensive to cover the cost of a HD-DVD drive...?
Even still it wouldn't have been that much more. And look at the PS3, yes it may not be the best selling console right now, but it has helped Blu-Ray win.
Yeah, and it cost the PS3 the console war. Remember the $600 price tag?
In case you havent noticed the console war is ongoing and barely entering its second full year for 2 of the 3major participants... and the PS3 actually seems to have benefitted from the addition of blu ray.
The initial price tag was a huge blow to what many expected to be a sure fire top selling system. They came out the door too late and too expensive and have been crawling out of that hole ever since.
And you know what caused both the delay and the high price? Bluray.
...and that can all be changed when some better games come out which is already happening
What, these games will tear a whole in spacetime and release the PS3 a year earlier at a lower price point?
Exactly :roll:
Well, at least your consistent in your lack of sense.
I was saying that when new, better games come out more systems will sell and will make up for coming out late. As for the high price it has been lowered to match the price of the 360 so thats not a problem either
And at the same time, the 360 is also getting new and better games. And is also cheaper.
So people only have the choice to get a 360 or a PS3. They can't get both?
No, but the PS3 is behind. To get out of 3rd it doesn't just need to sell good, it needs to sell BETTER then the competition.
It's not gonna pull that without offering something the 360 doesn't.
Worldwide, the PS3 is currently outselling the 360. It also sold more consoles in its first year than the 360 did in its first year, despite the high price, and the 2 competing consoles, and despite releasing later in Europe.
Personally, I own all 3 consoles, but you'd have to be an idiot to think Sony can't catch up this year with the games they have lined up. Plus, now the 40GB is a decent choice for a BR player for anyone who was on the HD fence.
You have to remember that the PS3 is selling in basically 3 regions, Asia, North America and Europe. The 360 is selling in North America and Europe, and an odd system every now and again in Asia. I would guess that PS3 will be third place everywhere except Japan, where it will be a distant second.
I'm just saying this to point out that it can be misleading to compare international sales and use them to show a general trend.
Despite techies not jumping on the HD train (which I think is because we are cynical unless something really grabs us...or it's an apple product), I know many non-tech folks looking at HD-DVD and Blu-Ray. Basically everyone I know that is looking at a HD tv, asks me and other tech folks at the office whether they should get HD or BR. They are already dropping a ton on the TV (and usually on credit or a payment plan) so they may as well get a player that will give them movies that amke the TV worth it.
I actually know several people who have BOTH, so they could be sure to get exatly what they want, movie-wise.
I think around here we forget how much the average American will spend on luxury items. There is a reason so many people are so deep in dept.
Monkeydrye on
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AbsoluteZeroThe new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered Userregular
Hm, I found this Poll run by Gamefaq's main site to be somewhat interesting, and pertinent to this thread:
I have to say, I'm one of the "meh, I'll stick with DVD" crowd.
Also, lol @ the 699 people with HD DVDs. :P
I used to be in the "meh" crowd until I got an HDTV. I have an OPPO upconverting DVD player, which is easily one of the best DVD players on the market... and it still bugs me how soft DVDs look compared to HD programming. It's like my eyes have become accustomed to seeing all this extra detail that just isn't there with regular ol DVD.
The only problem is if a better option comes down the pipe before Bluray can truly become #1 and start reveling in it's easy years.
If Bluray starts taking the top spot from DVD around the time something else starts brewing on the horizon, many people may not bother to switch over for the "flash in the pan" Bluray and wait on what's next.
Yeah, I've considered that..
I'm kind of wondering just how much of a vested interest all of these companies involved have in BluRay. I can imagine that after a long and expensive format battle, and finally agreeing on a standard and backing it, that they'll want to stretch it out as long as they can; at the expense, possibly, of supporting a better format down the line. Possibly.
Of course, it is possible that a newer technology comes out that so greatly improves upon DVD that it makes sense to transfer over, if people don't really get into the BluRay thing. I mean, there have been instances in the past where improved technology came out after VHS, but people didn't really move on until something very significantly advantageous arrived; being DVD.
Still, call me a cynic, but I would suspect that the companies involved here are going to hold fast and strong to this BluRay format for a while. But I still think that it's going to take forever for BluRay to really catch on
They might be invested, but ultimately, they will sell whatever the consumer wants to buy.
The problem I see with digital distrabution... . most ISP's are already starting to stress of bandwidth. Coming up with new tactics to the world of online videos. Some blocking specific content, others putting together online packages where you only get so much usage, anything over you get charged for (like cell phones)
If this becomes the norm (in which case if it does, I'm going back to leaching internet off my neighbors, cause fuck that) then I can see how BR could eventually take off. People wouldn't want to waste their online "usage" on movies, when its already burned to a disc for them.
Huh?
Did you just get on the internet yesterday?
Those things you're describing are the way that things were for many years. We are moving AWAY from them, not towards them.
The problem I see with digital distrabution... . most ISP's are already starting to stress of bandwidth. Coming up with new tactics to the world of online videos. Some blocking specific content, others putting together online packages where you only get so much usage, anything over you get charged for (like cell phones)
If this becomes the norm (in which case if it does, I'm going back to leaching internet off my neighbors, cause fuck that) then I can see how BR could eventually take off. People wouldn't want to waste their online "usage" on movies, when its already burned to a disc for them.
Huh?
Did you just get on the internet yesterday?
Those things you're describing are the way that things were for many years. We are moving AWAY from them, not towards them.
No, Evander, you're the one who has it wrong. At least in Canada, all major ISPs (Bell, Rogers, Telus) are continuously tightening bandwidth restrictions and throttling. In the last couple years Bell Sympatico, which I use, has halved speeds but kept the same prices, introduced bandwidth caps, started throttling, traffic shaping, you name it. The reason I stay with them is that the others are even worse.
Now to see if Bluray can be more successful than SACD and DVD-A. Remember those? Didn't think so.
It's deja vu all over again.
not nearly.
and I'll bet a lot of people remember those.
I remember them ..... as complete and utter failures.
they are failures, though intense audiophiles like them.
my point was more, as has been argued before, that the difference from bluray to dvd is more apparent to the average person than from dvd-a or sacd to cd.
I guess I could be very wrong but just from how much most people I talk to know about bluray vs how many have even heard of those audio formats I think I'm right.
Dude, most people in my extended family and their friends still hook their HDTVs up with RF cables, and think it looks great. The saddest moment was when I went to a friend's house to watch football - they had an HD cable box hooked up to their LCD TV through, I am NOT shitting you, a RF MODULATOR :O - I don't know why the fuck they did so, but they did - then a new guy walks in and goes "WHOA!!! Great lookin' TV picture man!!!".
If random people still think RF looks great as long as it's on a shiny new flatscreen TV, bluray is doomed.
Here is the US I believe AT&T? proposed creating a tiered system where they charge more for the highest bandwidth users. I'm not sure what the latest word on that was. ISP's would love to implement such policies since the bulk of their bandwidth/expenses are used up by a proportionally small number of users. Competition is probably the only thing keeping them at bay. As soon as one or two implement the system, others will probably follow suit.
Rakai on
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You have to remember that the PS3 is selling in basically 3 regions, Asia, North America and Europe. The 360 is selling in North America and Europe, and an odd system every now and again in Asia. I would guess that PS3 will be third place everywhere except Japan, where it will be a distant second.
I'm just saying this to point out that it can be misleading to compare international sales and use them to show a general trend.
Your "guess" isn't very good.
The PS3 and 360 monthly sales can vary, but in general, in the US, the 360 is consistantly just ahead (although the PS3 has closed the gap to the point where it jumped ahead last month, though that's unlikely to happen all the time). In Europe, the PS3 has clearly outsold the 360 every month since the end of summer 2007, and in Japan, well, the 360 may as well just not have bothered.
Of course, overall, the 360 is still about 6-7 million ahead thanks to its year headstart, and that will take some overcoming. Nothing will catch the Wii though, there seems to an endless stream of people buying it, though its attach rate of just under 3 (counting Wii Sports and Wii Play) is a little worrying.
Posts
I remember them ..... as complete and utter failures.
http://www.deepdiscount.com/viewcategory.htm?categoryId=476505&keywords=&sortby=price&count=500
Huge sale. 12$/movie for many good movies. I will be picking a few up for sure. The format may be dieing, but I'm going to reap the benefits :P
*infinite loop*
Rest In Peace, High-Density Digital Versatile Disc.
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Are you in the UK? In North America, NCFOM is being released by Walt Disney Studios, so it's Blu-ray exclusive.
- Albert Einstein
They use the same codecs. AVC and VC-1.
What, were there maybe two or three of the first Blu-rays ever released, two or something years ago, that used MPEG-2? And now none of them do.
But isn't it Paramount Vantage?
Edit: Oh wait I just checked its Paramount Vantage in Non-Us and Miramax in the US. Shit
they are failures, though intense audiophiles like them.
my point was more, as has been argued before, that the difference from bluray to dvd is more apparent to the average person than from dvd-a or sacd to cd.
I guess I could be very wrong but just from how much most people I talk to know about bluray vs how many have even heard of those audio formats I think I'm right.
:P
No
When a webforum of techno-geeks like ourselves can be split in our "giving a crap" about HD movies, I find it hard to conceive of how even greater the hurdle must be to get people that don't know the differences between HDMI and DMI or 1080i and 720p on board.
Progress is progress. Newer, better technologies always eventually replace old ones. That is common knowledge.
The question has never been, "Will DVD ever be replaced?" No, the question has always been, "When will DVD ever be replaced?"
Part of that "when" includes a question of when a technology that is significantly superior to the DVD format arrives, and becomes not only affordable, but economic to replace your current setup and movies; some people argue that BluRay is that technology. A lot of people argue that BluRay's upgrades over DVD - for what people care about - are not enough to overcome the price gap in both players and movies, let alone replacing their current equipment, let alone rebuying DVD movies. (or not, depending on what kind of person you are).
Of course BluRay drives and movies will go down in price eventually. That's the nature of technology; it improves, and older designs can be made more cost-effectively. But how long will it take for the technology to mature and become cost efficient enough to win out over DVD? And at what price are players and discs going to have to be to really start getting people to change over?
What hurdles are HD movies facing right now, besides high cost of players and high costs of discs and low numbers of good titles that people want on the market?
Well, it's been mentioned at least once. HD confusion. Confusion over what constitutes HD content, when it's being displayed, how it's being displayed, etc etc. I think an article was linked earlier, but this one gets the job done. The "when" here is when enough of the market understand and cares about taking full advantage of their HD sets with HD movies.
It's fair to assume that "the market" will become "educated" on these things, eventually. But it's just another factor that steps in the way of a new HD media format succeeding DVD, and when it will happen.
At least what DVD had going for it was that the market didn't really need to be "educated" about its advantages over VHS - the advantages were huge and very easily apparent and obvious and outstanding. The advantages of BR over DVD? Well.. whether they are as significant or not (I'd argue that they are not), they are at least not as readily apparent and obvious.
Also, good upscaling DVD players are getting popular now, too. Another hurdle.
I would be slightly concerned with the market largely ignoring BluRay and the format truly taking off, but it seems to me that too many companies have important, vested interests in it now to let it slide. I guess that even if the market doesn't care about the format for a very, very long time, it will almost inevitably become the successor simply because the battle over the standard was so long and hard fought.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
If Bluray starts taking the top spot from DVD around the time something else starts brewing on the horizon, many people may not bother to switch over for the "flash in the pan" Bluray and wait on what's next.
Yeah, I've considered that..
I'm kind of wondering just how much of a vested interest all of these companies involved have in BluRay. I can imagine that after a long and expensive format battle, and finally agreeing on a standard and backing it, that they'll want to stretch it out as long as they can; at the expense, possibly, of supporting a better format down the line. Possibly.
Of course, it is possible that a newer technology comes out that so greatly improves upon DVD that it makes sense to transfer over, if people don't really get into the BluRay thing. I mean, there have been instances in the past where improved technology came out after VHS, but people didn't really move on until something very significantly advantageous arrived; being DVD.
Still, call me a cynic, but I would suspect that the companies involved here are going to hold fast and strong to this BluRay format for a while. But I still think that it's going to take forever for BluRay to really catch on
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
wut?
When DVDs came out, they were $20 each, which I think was the perfect price. Blu-rays costing over $20 seems ludicrous. I think if they can get the disc price down comparable to DVDs, they will sell, even if the player itself is expensive. Paying a one-time fee for an HD upgrade (the player) feels a lot more justifiable than deciding with every single movie whether it's worth $10+ (50-200%) extra for the difference in quality.
Yeah thanks I already figured this out
I have to say, I'm one of the "meh, I'll stick with DVD" crowd.
Also, lol @ the 699 people with HD DVDs. :P
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Although this isn't the EXACT target market for high end HD movie stuff, but it's pretty close.
What world was this? DVDs were $30-40 when they first came out. Hell if you go to a brick and mortar you'll find tons that are $25-30. Of course online is always the best option nowadays(much cheaper), but it wasn't a terribly good one when DVDs first came out.
Oddly enough the two are converging in price somewhat. Hopefully this trend continues and prices don't go back to retail.
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Hah, yeah. People seem to forget that DVD was expensive as Hell when it first came out. The players were several hundred dollars, I believe 400 and up, and the discs were just as expensive as HD movies are now. It wasn't an overnight success. The sentiments were the same as they are now, "It's so expensive, and VHS is still fine for me." As prices came down, however, as they will with high definition technology and content, DVD became a success.
I can see Blu-ray becoming a success, as well. If you go into any retail store now looking for a TV, chances are pretty much all they'll carry are HDTVs. There may or may not be one tiny isle in the back where they have a few bulky SDTVs, none of which are big screens. And when they shop for a new TV, odds are people are going to be buying an HDTV. They may or may not want some HD content to go along with that, but that content is something a good salesman will probably stress so he can make more money.
Look how big the Blu-ray and HD-DVD isles were getting. At my Best Buy, in some very small city, it was a very large and prominent section, and right in the front of the store. That good salesman is probably going to make sure you know about these things. Each time I've talked to one in the stores when I went looking for my perfect television, I did have someone try informing me of all the details, so that he could sell me more product.
All I'm saying is never say never. I don't see digital downloading becoming all that big, at least not very soon. Too much money is being put into this new format for them to start abandoning it for digital download boxes and services, I think. That and much of America still doesn't have broadband. Those that do don't even have that good of a service. I have cable with a 1 MB download rate, and I pay about 50-60 dollars for that service. It's ridiculous.
And people are material. We like to "own" something. So while we may be seeing digital download services now, I don't think that's going to be the primary focus for some time. In time, when more people have better broadband, or just broadband altogether (my small home town only recently got DSL, a DSL service that's slow as potatoes), perhaps that will change.
If this becomes the norm (in which case if it does, I'm going back to leaching internet off my neighbors, cause fuck that) then I can see how BR could eventually take off. People wouldn't want to waste their online "usage" on movies, when its already burned to a disc for them.
from an american perspective, where broadband is currently cheap and unlimited, it's easy to say how simple direct digital content might be to implement - but from where i am, i don't see it happening for a long time. to me, a retail-level product which is paired (by default) with the biggest change in television technology since colour sets seems to have much more a chance of succeeding.
Telstra are investing seriously money in the digital delivery tech - they understand it's going to be the future. But the problem is that Telstra (Australia's major telecom network, for those OS) has the capacity to deliver high speed broadband to 98% of Australia, right now - but refuse to because the government will force them to share it BELOW COST with it's competitors. The government doesn't want to give Telstra that much market dominance, which is understandable....So.....we're stuck getting left behind. Hoorah!
Anyway, that's completely off topic.
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Ditto, I'dve rather seen HDDVD in.... Sadly though, with my dual format drive in my HTPC I just bought into both formats and quickly realized my Blu-Ray outnumbered my HDDVD 2 to 1.... Even this past week I bought American Gangster HDDVD, We Own the Night BluRay, and Michael Clayton BluRay.... 2 to 1....
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this is the same Telstra BigPond service who thinks the bright new idea in content delivery is to post it to you in the mail? this is a service provider who seems absolutely intent on holding the evolution of the medium back as far as possible. if australia's digital delivery systems perk up soon, i can promise it won't be with thanks to telstra.
Worldwide, the PS3 is currently outselling the 360. It also sold more consoles in its first year than the 360 did in its first year, despite the high price, and the 2 competing consoles, and despite releasing later in Europe.
Personally, I own all 3 consoles, but you'd have to be an idiot to think Sony can't catch up this year with the games they have lined up. Plus, now the 40GB is a decent choice for a BR player for anyone who was on the HD fence.
I'm just saying this to point out that it can be misleading to compare international sales and use them to show a general trend.
I actually know several people who have BOTH, so they could be sure to get exatly what they want, movie-wise.
I think around here we forget how much the average American will spend on luxury items. There is a reason so many people are so deep in dept.
I used to be in the "meh" crowd until I got an HDTV. I have an OPPO upconverting DVD player, which is easily one of the best DVD players on the market... and it still bugs me how soft DVDs look compared to HD programming. It's like my eyes have become accustomed to seeing all this extra detail that just isn't there with regular ol DVD.
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Indeed. It's funny, because NO ONE knows that exists. If Toshiba had marketed it like that, I'm sure Europe would have been a lot more pro-HD-DVD.
Oh well, I have my HD-DVDs, and I won't be going blu-ray until (if) I pick up a PS3. Even then it's hard to get excited about it.
They might be invested, but ultimately, they will sell whatever the consumer wants to buy.
Huh?
Did you just get on the internet yesterday?
Those things you're describing are the way that things were for many years. We are moving AWAY from them, not towards them.
Dude, most people in my extended family and their friends still hook their HDTVs up with RF cables, and think it looks great. The saddest moment was when I went to a friend's house to watch football - they had an HD cable box hooked up to their LCD TV through, I am NOT shitting you, a RF MODULATOR :O - I don't know why the fuck they did so, but they did - then a new guy walks in and goes "WHOA!!! Great lookin' TV picture man!!!".
If random people still think RF looks great as long as it's on a shiny new flatscreen TV, bluray is doomed.
Your "guess" isn't very good.
The PS3 and 360 monthly sales can vary, but in general, in the US, the 360 is consistantly just ahead (although the PS3 has closed the gap to the point where it jumped ahead last month, though that's unlikely to happen all the time). In Europe, the PS3 has clearly outsold the 360 every month since the end of summer 2007, and in Japan, well, the 360 may as well just not have bothered.
Of course, overall, the 360 is still about 6-7 million ahead thanks to its year headstart, and that will take some overcoming. Nothing will catch the Wii though, there seems to an endless stream of people buying it, though its attach rate of just under 3 (counting Wii Sports and Wii Play) is a little worrying.