Viability of PAX for the future?

MasterHelios

I hate to ask this, but is PAX gonna still be around in, say, five years?

I ask only because I'm 17, and this is my second year coming, and I'd really love to come when I'm 21 so I can go and get drunk and have a good time with all of you fine video game lovers, instead of hopping a bus back to Bellevue at six. (No I don't drive, my folks won't let me get a license till I'm 18, it's retarded, I know.)

But I'm just a bit nervous; I've seen cons like these come and go before, and I'd really hate to see this one go, both for obvious reasons and for the fact that I would feel like I never really got to experience it to its fullest.

So what do you think? Is it a safe bet for PAX '12?

randomguy

Safer than a hooker from Montana.

Moe Fwacky

Aunt Jemima?

tr0tsky

Well, considering how much it's grown since '04 I think (barring some crazy earthquake where Seattle sinks into the sea taking Gabe & Tycho with it) it will be going strong for many more years.

Having a place to go each year to celebrate geekiness of almost all flavours is a fantastic thing.

Beranabus

I say hell ya. Gabe and Tycho do this as a party for us remember? As long as we keep supporting them and penny-arcade PAX will live on for years and well...I guess until we all die or around that time anyway.

Caelesto

Think of the Rampant success of the Gaming Convention in general. Little local indie cons have been going on since before I was born. Think of bigger cons like the San Diego Comic Con, which has been around since the 70s. These venues start out small and only a few hundred or few thousand people go to the first few runs. After a while though they have a history of becoming their own beasts. Just look at PAX, when it started it wasn't always in the Washington State Convention & Trade Center. In fact it has doubled in size each year...I don't think it's going away, and certainly not in five years. This "PAX" thing is just getting started Padawan, you wait and see.

Coldbrew

tr0tsky wrote: »

Well, considering how much it's grown since '04 I think (barring some crazy earthquake where Seattle sinks into the sea taking Gabe & Tycho with it) it will be going strong for many more years.

Having a place to go each year to celebrate geekiness of almost all flavours is a fantastic thing.

OMG don't jinx it! The "Seattle area" is overdue for a "massive" earthquake, much larger then the one 7 years ago or whenever that was.

Beranabus wrote: »

I say hell ya. Gabe and Tycho do this as a party for us remember? As long as we keep supporting them and penny-arcade PAX will live on for years and well...I guess until we all die or around that time anyway.

And yes, PAX has grown immensely each year since it started, and at the rate it's going it won't die down anytime soon. So yeah, as long as we keep supporting them, I'm sure that will help too. Speaking of which, The Penny Arcade Adventures: On The Rain Slick Precipice of Darkness, Episode 1, is finally launching next Wednesday (5/21) for only $20. Support it people!

kropotkin

With the imminent death of E3 thanks to many companies refusing to attend it this year and some actually going so far as leaving the ESA, PAX has raised its prominence over the past 3 years as a result.

E3 2006 was the last big blow out and we are not likely to see anything like that again. Something had to step in and fill the void and it certainly wasn't going to be E4 Everyone. PAX is for people who like gaming, regardless of its form and we also share the humour of Mr Tyco and Mr Gabe. It is for that reason that it has some people dubbing it 'Gamers Mecca'. In other words if you're a gamer you have to go, at least once, in a sort of pilgrimage way.

It is because of the above reasons that PAX is not likely to vanish any time soon. Sadly however nothing lasts fo ever, but I think 5 years from now they'll still be a PAX, especially if Gabe and Tyco continue to make us laugh with their satirical swipes against the hobby we all have far too much interest in....

MasterHelios

Well that's good to hear.

I wouldn't worry so much for an earthquake as for old Rainier pulling a St. Helens and turning Seattle into Pompeii.

That, or a tsunami.

Coldbrew

well I think St. Helens is more active then Rainier right now, but yeah that is something to worry about because when Rainier blows it's top it'll be worse then St. Helens was back in the 80's.

And no more talking about natural disasters, China just lost 12,000+ in a major earthquake... And that would kinda suck

leaf

Attendee numbers have yet to start leveling out in a general trend yet, if that tells you anything. We haven't even seen the peek of attendant numbers.

randomguy

leaf wrote: »

Attendee numbers have yet to start leveling out in a general trend yet, if that tells you anything. We haven't even seen the peek of attendant numbers.

Not sure I would want to even see peak numbers. Granted its good that people show up, but it is not good for me to wait longer than 15 minutes to play me some videogames.

VThornheart

I would say "hopefully we'll just expand as more people come", but short of doing it in two locations I don't think we can do much better than filling the entire convention center, which it sounds like we're coming very close to doing this year... which is an intimidating thought!

MurphysParadox

What would happen is that they take over a very large convention center AND the ballrooms of nearby hotels. So, for example, they'd have the entire Seattle convention center for video games and other electronic events AND the Sheraton conference area for, say, tabletop/card games since it is only 1.5 blocks away. They could also simply move it to another, larger, convention center elsewhere in the USA now that Gabe seems to have his fear of flying (and more) under control.

Edit: I retract my vote because Moe is a smart guy.

Moe Fwacky

Okay, we're not doing the "I think PAX should be in x" All that leads to is everybody voting for something close to where they live.

Shade

I think that after another year or two PAX might have to do two showings to disperse the attendees a bit. That or build its own convetion center in th middle of nowhere andadd on to it each year.

Moe Fwacky

Well, the Sheraton is still right next door and has utilizable facilities, but so far, PAX hasn't even used the entire WSCTC yet. There's still room to spread out in Seattle before it gets like it was in Bellevue in 06.

That_Guy

Moe Fwacky wrote: »

Well, the Sheraton is still right next door and has utilizable facilities, but so far, PAX hasn't even used the entire WSCTC yet. There's still room to spread out in Seattle before it gets like it was in Bellevue in 06.

Oh man. '06 was fucking cramped. I remember the line to get into the expo hall was so long, I just gave up. And the smell. Oh god the smell. As soon as I walked in the entrance it hit me like a punch to the face. With that many people crammed into such a small place, it was bound to happen, though.

Coldbrew

That_Guy wrote: »

Moe Fwacky wrote: »

Well, the Sheraton is still right next door and has utilizable facilities, but so far, PAX hasn't even used the entire WSCTC yet. There's still room to spread out in Seattle before it gets like it was in Bellevue in 06.

Oh man. '06 was fucking cramped. I remember the line to get into the expo hall was so long, I just gave up. And the smell. Oh god the smell. As soon as I walked in the entrance it hit me like a punch to the face. With that many people crammed into such a small place, it was bound to happen, though.

lol yes '06 brings back interesting memories. That place was insanely packed, and it was like 90 degrees outside. I remember the line just for the Red vs Blue panel and it wrapped at least half way around the convention center. And at the rate PAX is growing each year, I'm sure it may eventually use up the entire WSCTC, but like Moe said, even if that was the case, there's other places "next door" that could be used.

eelektrik

Coldbrew wrote: »

That_Guy wrote: »

Moe Fwacky wrote: »

Well, the Sheraton is still right next door and has utilizable facilities, but so far, PAX hasn't even used the entire WSCTC yet. There's still room to spread out in Seattle before it gets like it was in Bellevue in 06.

Oh man. '06 was fucking cramped. I remember the line to get into the expo hall was so long, I just gave up. And the smell. Oh god the smell. As soon as I walked in the entrance it hit me like a punch to the face. With that many people crammed into such a small place, it was bound to happen, though.

lol yes '06 brings back interesting memories. That place was insanely packed, and it was like 90 degrees outside. I remember the line just for the Red vs Blue panel and it wrapped at least half way around the convention center. And at the rate PAX is growing each year, I'm sure it may eventually use up the entire WSCTC, but like Moe said, even if that was the case, there's other places "next door" that could be used.

I didn't make it in '06, but I remember the line for the concert in '05 went around the block and people were stopping in their cars and asking what the line was for. I was somewhere past the Dairy Queen. The Meydenbauer just wasn't designed to contain all that awesome.

Everything I've heard about '06 almost makes me glad I didn't get to go that year. Almost.

At least at the WSCTC they've got room to grow for the next few years.

BigRed

06 wasnt as bad as people made it out to be. I enjoyed it becuase we had a better handle on things and I honestly like crowds. Last year was my least favorite. Too open, too spread out, new venue, people not knowing whats going on, etc. This year should be better though

ElectricTurtle

BigRed wrote: »

06 wasnt as bad as people made it out to be. I enjoyed it becuase we had a better handle on things and I honestly like crowds. Last year was my least favorite. Too open, too spread out, new venue, people not knowing whats going on, etc. This year should be better though

I think your view is colored by your Enforcer status. Objectively from every attendee I've talked with about it, 06 was the "worst" year. Not that it wasn't enjoyable, I'd do it over and over in a heartbeat. However, the crowds, combined with a anti-climactic Omegathon, made things less than they could have been in a larger facility and if those n00bs had known how to play freakin' Tetris...

Kwisatz Haderach

Shade wrote: »

I think that after another year or two PAX might have to do two showings to disperse the attendees a bit. That or build its own convetion center in th middle of nowhere andadd on to it each year.

lol we could make it like a "Burning Man" for gamers...set up next to a nuclear power plant to make sure we never run out of power, and voila!

BigRed

ElectricTurtle wrote: »

BigRed wrote: »

06 wasnt as bad as people made it out to be. I enjoyed it becuase we had a better handle on things and I honestly like crowds. Last year was my least favorite. Too open, too spread out, new venue, people not knowing whats going on, etc. This year should be better though

I think your view is colored by your Enforcer status. Objectively from every attendee I've talked with about it, 06 was the "worst" year. Not that it wasn't enjoyable, I'd do it over and over in a heartbeat. However, the crowds, combined with a anti-climactic Omegathon, made things less than they could have been in a larger facility and if those n00bs had known how to play freakin' Tetris...

Or maybe its just colored by the people you talked to :P I know a lot of people that I met at pax (my list of general pax people on my IM lists is like well over 150) that enjoyed 06. But the majority (60%) of them were BYOC and able to escape crowds :P
I like crowds myself so thats why I enjoyed 06 more than 07. Plus I liked the MBC better in general over the convention center. Too many rules/regulations to follow in the WSCTC

MasterHelios

ElectricTurtle wrote: »

BigRed wrote: »

06 wasnt as bad as people made it out to be. I enjoyed it becuase we had a better handle on things and I honestly like crowds. Last year was my least favorite. Too open, too spread out, new venue, people not knowing whats going on, etc. This year should be better though

I think your view is colored by your Enforcer status. Objectively from every attendee I've talked with about it, 06 was the "worst" year. Not that it wasn't enjoyable, I'd do it over and over in a heartbeat. However, the crowds, combined with a anti-climactic Omegathon, made things less than they could have been in a larger facility and if those n00bs had known how to play freakin' Tetris...

yeah that was a horrible game of tetris
I wasn't there, though, I just saw the video, but holy crap, who plays tetris that badly?

Qs23

MasterHelios wrote: »

yeah that was a horrible game of tetris
I wasn't there, though, I just saw the video, but holy crap, who plays tetris that badly?

Well judging by the comments from the back rows of the huge crowd watching... nobody else in that building.

And I do have to say that 06 and 07 felt different to me. I can't say that one was better then the other since they both had pros and cons... but I was feeling a different vibe the second year. I'll let you know after this year's PAX what my final judgment is for the 3 of them. (since a group of 3 is the smallest group where one can be considered an outsider of the other two.)

ASimPerson

We've still got entire floors of the WSCTC we haven't used yet. There's actually another, smaller convention going on up there while we're there. UPS had some meetings up there last year, as well.

We got space.

VThornheart

Oh, I was under the impression that we were using almost everything.

BigRed

VThornheart wrote: »

Oh, I was under the impression that we were using almost everything.

Uhh no :P pax is only using about 60% of the wsctc right now.

People underestimate how large the 6th floor is :P

Moe Fwacky

At that amount, and the rate of growth of PAX, it could double two or three more times before needing to look to other add-on venues.

Shade

Moe Fwacky wrote: »

At that amount, and the rate of growth of PAX, it could double two or three more times before needing to look to other add-on venues.

from 19,000 to 37,000 was a quite a leap. If it keeps doubling, we're not going to have to worry about running out of space, we're going to have to worry about running out of oxygen.

nearlysober

PAX '06 was my first PAX so even though it was crazy packed & a bit stinky it holds a special place in my heart.

One part of me like the hustle & bustle feel of how busy it was... and how close everything was and whatnot... its the same reason I like living/working downtown... busy with lots of people... but it had it's problems.

Last year PAX felt "empty" in comparison despite the fact that twice as many people showed up. I think once PAX figures out how to optimize the space at WSCTC it'll be even cooler. I don't want to feel packed, but I also don't want to feel like some events are just way out there by themselves down the street and under a rock. One of the issues with WSCTC is how open/public it is, with the stores and vendors all over we can't just control one or two entry points and claim the rest of the building to ourselves

BigRed

nearlysober wrote: »

PAX '06 was my first PAX so even though it was crazy packed & a bit stinky it holds a special place in my heart.

One part of me like the hustle & bustle feel of how busy it was... and how close everything was and whatnot... its the same reason I like living/working downtown... busy with lots of people... but it had it's problems.

Last year PAX felt "empty" in comparison despite the fact that twice as many people showed up. I think once PAX figures out how to optimize the space at WSCTC it'll be even cooler. I don't want to feel packed, but I also don't want to feel like some events are just way out there by themselves down the street and under a rock. One of the issues with WSCTC is how open/public it is, with the stores and vendors all over we can't just control one or two entry points and claim the rest of the building to ourselves

This guy gets what im saying about me liking 06 over 07

This year should be a lot better to remove some of the empty feeling.

MR.T

So, just out of curiosity how is the smell at the WSCTC? I've heard horror stories of the stench in several forums. I've even heard desperate plees for showers and deoderant. o_O You pack a lot of people into one place, and you're bound to get some interesting aerial chemistry!

Moe Fwacky

The WSCTC was surprisingly fresh. The A/C was kicking ass the whole time and the only instances when I ran into foul odor was at the concerts, mostly near the stage. Occasionally somebody particularly rank will walk by and shit their pants at the same time. Other than that, a marked improvement from previous years.

nearlysober

Wasn't a problem overall.

You can always get screwed and end up sitting next to "that guy" at a panel... and by the end of a hot August day in Seattle, odds are in any area where there's a stationary crowd (a booth in the expo hall, a line for a panel, or in a panel itself) you're gonna get a bit of a wiff from some inconsiderate fellow who's stinking up the place.

But in the open areas, walking around, most the expo hall, etc... wasn't a problem. But anytime you're shoulder to shoulder with people, gamers or not, there is usually someone who is a bit ripe.

ElectricTurtle

I'm so lucky I'm almost olifactorily blind.

eelektrik

nearlysober wrote: »

...by the end of a hot August day in Seattle...

Just be glad its not down here in California. I would gladly take your hot august days instead of the ones here. Hell, Its not even officially summer yet and its hotter here in May than its been the 3 years I've been to PAX. Its another reason I love going, to get out of the heat here for a weekend.

MR.T

Well it sounds like it'll be nothing I can't handle. I used to be a computer science major in school. We had this cramped glorified broom closet for a computer lab. Small room, no windows, no A/C. Just enough room for lots of hot computers and many sweaty computer nerds! Boy that place smelled ripe at the end of the day.

mentok1982

ElectricTurtle wrote: »

I'm so lucky I'm almost olifactorily blind.

Mike Krahulik big word joke:

Is that some kind of factory that makes Olifs?

MasterHelios

mentok1982 wrote: »

ElectricTurtle wrote: »

I'm so lucky I'm almost olifactorily blind.

Mike Krahulik big word joke:

Is that some kind of factory that makes Olifs?

No, then it would be an Olif-factory.
Olifactory is a factory that makes Olis.