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[Music] Better lyricists than DMB and John Mayer
ChopperDave
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
My girlfriend is pretty great, and I like her a whole heck of a lot. She does have one glaring flaw (for me at least): she loves Dave Matthews Band and John Mayer (like, number 1 and 2 all-time favorite artists for her, respectively), and is hellbent on getting me to appreciate them as well.
This ain't gonna happen. I dislike DMB and John Mayer for quite the handful of reasons which I don't think I need to go into. Now, the girlfriend knows that I have greater knowledge about music and instrumentation than her, so she's not even attacking my contempt for her favorites by that route. No - she's pulling the trickier English major strategy, and claiming that DMB and John Mayer are some of the best lyricists in modern music. She teases that I must not know anything about lyrics if I think their lyrics average/mediocre. She says she's in the process of creating a mix CD displaying their lyrical (and musical, I guess) prowess.
I disagree, of course. Now in order to defend my own audiophile and English major cred, I have taken it upon myself to create a mix CD playfully entitled "Musicians who Write Better Lyrics Than DMB and John Mayer." She's actually fairly open to new music of different genres, and will generally listen to and even like a lot of what I give her. She also has a good sense of humor, so she should get a kick out of it.
Unfortunately, most of my favorite music has been pretty punky and/or instrumental, and I don't pay attention to lyrics as much as I could. So this is where you guys come in: help me put together a sick mix CD!
tl;dr: I'm looking for music with really great lyrics, obviously - not just "better than DMB/Mayer" quality, but genuinely amazing, well-written stuff. I don't really care what the genre is, and I'd actually like to have some variety with this thing, so feel free to suggest anything! Please try to keep it to bands who you can actually understand in their recordings, though, cause she probably won't go looking up the ones she can't make heads or tails of.
Here's what I'm considering so far (not necessarily in this order). Feel free to suggest other songs by these artists that you think have better lyrics (or shoot me down on my choices :P):
The Magnetic Fields - "The Death of Ferdinand de Saussure"
Bob Dylan - "Don't Think Twice It's Alright"
The Mountain Goats - ? ("Get Lonely," maybe, though that's a crummy song to put on a CD for a girlfriend)
The Weakerthans - "My Favorite Chords" (anyone into Propoghandi, btw? haven't listened to much of them, but I want to. do they write good lyrics?)
Bright Eyes - "Arienette"
Nick Drake - "From The Morning"
Radiohead - "Let Down"
Sufjan Stevens - "To Be Alone With You"
Immortal Technique - "Creation and Destruction"
The Notorious B.I.G. - "Everyday Struggle"
Fionn Regan - "Put A Penny In The Slot"
The Decemberists - "Apology Song"
The Beatles - "Eleanor Rigby"
Elliott Smith - "Memory Lane"
Wu-Tang Clan - ? (honestly can't decide...)
Belle & Sebastian - ? ("The Boy With The Arab Strap," probably)
Rilo Kiley - "A Man/Me/Then Jim"
Johnny Cash - "Cocaine Blues"
Simon & Garfunkel - "The Sound of Silence"
The Smiths - "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out"
This ain't gonna happen. I dislike DMB and John Mayer for quite the handful of reasons which I don't think I need to go into. Now, the girlfriend knows that I have greater knowledge about music and instrumentation than her, so she's not even attacking my contempt for her favorites by that route. No - she's pulling the trickier English major strategy, and claiming that DMB and John Mayer are some of the best lyricists in modern music. She teases that I must not know anything about lyrics if I think their lyrics average/mediocre. She says she's in the process of creating a mix CD displaying their lyrical (and musical, I guess) prowess.
I disagree, of course. Now in order to defend my own audiophile and English major cred, I have taken it upon myself to create a mix CD playfully entitled "Musicians who Write Better Lyrics Than DMB and John Mayer." She's actually fairly open to new music of different genres, and will generally listen to and even like a lot of what I give her. She also has a good sense of humor, so she should get a kick out of it.
Unfortunately, most of my favorite music has been pretty punky and/or instrumental, and I don't pay attention to lyrics as much as I could. So this is where you guys come in: help me put together a sick mix CD!
tl;dr: I'm looking for music with really great lyrics, obviously - not just "better than DMB/Mayer" quality, but genuinely amazing, well-written stuff. I don't really care what the genre is, and I'd actually like to have some variety with this thing, so feel free to suggest anything! Please try to keep it to bands who you can actually understand in their recordings, though, cause she probably won't go looking up the ones she can't make heads or tails of.
Here's what I'm considering so far (not necessarily in this order). Feel free to suggest other songs by these artists that you think have better lyrics (or shoot me down on my choices :P):
The Magnetic Fields - "The Death of Ferdinand de Saussure"
Bob Dylan - "Don't Think Twice It's Alright"
The Mountain Goats - ? ("Get Lonely," maybe, though that's a crummy song to put on a CD for a girlfriend)
The Weakerthans - "My Favorite Chords" (anyone into Propoghandi, btw? haven't listened to much of them, but I want to. do they write good lyrics?)
Bright Eyes - "Arienette"
Nick Drake - "From The Morning"
Radiohead - "Let Down"
Sufjan Stevens - "To Be Alone With You"
Immortal Technique - "Creation and Destruction"
The Notorious B.I.G. - "Everyday Struggle"
Fionn Regan - "Put A Penny In The Slot"
The Decemberists - "Apology Song"
The Beatles - "Eleanor Rigby"
Elliott Smith - "Memory Lane"
Wu-Tang Clan - ? (honestly can't decide...)
Belle & Sebastian - ? ("The Boy With The Arab Strap," probably)
Rilo Kiley - "A Man/Me/Then Jim"
Johnny Cash - "Cocaine Blues"
Simon & Garfunkel - "The Sound of Silence"
The Smiths - "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out"
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Kyle
The Decemberists - Here I Dreamt I Was an Architect
Elliott Smith - The White Lady Loves You More
...over your current choices from Meloy and Smith (respectively), and I'd further suggest...
The Wrens - Ex-Girl Collection
The Thermals - St. Rosa and the Swallows
The Knife - Heartbeats
...as a few songs I would cite as lyrically exceptional.
And I'm going to ninja in Richard Shindell - Che Guevara T-Shirt, because I'm on thin ice with my girlfriend, and mentioning her favorite singer/songwriter will earn me some brownie points.
Fantastic choice on Dylan, by the way.
This song shows up all over the place in soft-rock radio commercial and the like, and many have heard it and never really listened to it. Count me among them up until about 8 months ago, when someone said to me, "no, listen," and I did.
Musically, it's fucking catchy, and there's no doubting that. It does things that, while maybe old hat now, were new for the time. But forget that. For the purposes of this thread: music, feh.
The important thing is, this song is one of the most beautiful, from a linguistic perspective, that I've ever heard. Every word and every sound and every extra syllable seems carefully chosen to flow while still making sense in a (quite meaningful) context, and it comes together in an impossibly fluid way. There are plays on words and language in this song that are fun, but it's more than that. It actually manages to make English feel beautiful.
When you listen to this song, don't worry about what they're saying the first time through. Just let the sound wash over you.
(I wonder how badly this post is going to get me made fun of. >.> )
That's why I hate posting in music threads (here or anywhere).
"Hey guys, here's something that touches my soul!"
"The lyrics are trite, the singing is pitiful, the album is weak, and the vibrato during the cello solo is all wrong."
"._."
Yeah.. sometimes there's no accounting for taste (yours or anyone's), and after a while it just becomes about appreciating people for all the different ways and places in which they can find a little beauty.
But if you're going to try to get her to take You Can Call Me Al seriously, you probably shouldn't show her the music video.
(Hehe, okay, I have the song going in the background, and the ninja eyes are moving in time.)
Wilco - At Least That's What You Said
Mercury Rev - Holes
Sparklehorse - Gold Day
Sonic Youth - Tunic (Or something else...that's the song that popped in my mind)
M83 - Safe (for something simple...because elongated lyrics doesn't equal meaning) or Farewell/Goodbye
King Crimson - The Court Of The Crimson King
Bob Schneider - Big Blue Sea
Fantastic Plastic Machine - Love is Psychadelic
Seachange - News from Nowhere
Oh and I think Radiohead's A Wolf At The Door has great lyrics...moreso than Let Down. But that's me.
Also too tired to make a description of every song in ceres's manner. Listen to the songs, look up the lyrics and if you like it, go for it.
Dan le Sac vs Scrubious Pip - Really great hip hop/poetry duo, although a lot of their best stuff isn't on the myspace...
The Postal Service - Very charming electronic indie, with very sweet lyrics. Bunch of free downloads here.
I always like Rage Against the Machine for whenever I need to rage against the machine. If you like Radiohead, Thom Yorke's solo album 'The Eraser' is a good bet too. Flaming Lips are great fun too. Klaxxons for crazy. Anything connected to Damon Albarn will have solid lyrics, so blur, Gorillaz or The Good the Bad and the Queen.
DMB and John Mayer the best modern lyricists? Egad!
Way to have The Smiths and The Mountain Goats up there!
I love You Can Call Me Al as well (nice one ceres). In fact most of what is on Graceland is beautiful but I'd like to suggest "Under African Skies" which is on there as well.
I could pick just about anything from Bob Dylan. I like "Changing Of The Guards" but that's very epic and grandiose and not particularly easy to decipher. "Subterranean Homesick Blues" is pure cool. "I Want You" is wonderful. Oh and "Things Have Changed" is incredible.
Wolves - Josh Ritter. I think he's shaping up to be an extremely good lyricist, he's already got some gems.
I like the lyrics of The Feeing on their album Twelve Stops & Home because they are very easy to relate to and they've touched on many things I've gone through.
I enjoy The Shins' lyrics. New Slang is the usual choice there but I also like Mine's Not A High Horse and "A Comet Appears" among others
The Decemberists rock, as you already know I guess. Alot of great songs so it's hard to choose one. Wasted pixel's song suggestion is a great one though. I love "We Both Go Down Together".
Cat Stevens - lots to choose from, I like "Father & Son" and "Tea For The Tillerman"
The Clash - something off of London Calling. Maybe "Lost In The Supermarket" or "Train In Vain" or "Death Or Glory"
Oh jeez, Bruce Springsteen Once again, so many to choose from, but listen to the album The Rising. It was written as his reflections on the September 11 attacks, it's just amazing. I honestly can't pick a single track for you. Then again, I think a Springsteen album needs to be enjoyed in it's entirety.
NEIL YOUNG. Album: Harvest. Songs: Out On The Weekend and anything else really
I could go on all day so I'll leave it there. Hope that helps.
P.S. Lou Reed and/or The Velvet Underground, Elvis Costello, Nick Cave And The Bad Seeds, The Band.
I have to stop now!
Fixed
Thanks!
Augie March - Cold Acre
Augie March - "Thin Captain Crackers"
Augie March - "Mother Greer"
Augie March - Just Passing Through
you can probably see where I'm going with this
edit: woops forgot about videos embedding themselves
Brick
Still Fighting It
Fred Jones Part 2
The Luckiest
Oh jeez and how could I forget Neil Finn! Almost anything from the Crowded House catalogue. Couple of examples:
The World Where You Live
Don't Dream It's Over
I also have to recommend Can't Stand Me Now by The Libertines, which is about two of the band members (Pete Doherty and Carl Barât) and how their friendship was torn apart by Pete's drug addiction.
YES. The only trouble here is that I don't know which single song to recommend. For a combination of "great lyrics" and "themes that won't immediately turn off a person who mostly listens to Dave Matthews", maybe go with "Do You Love Me? (Part 2)" from Let Love In or "Spell" from Abattoir Blues/The Lyre of Orpheus.
Also, Leonard Cohen. "Famous Blue Raincoat" would be a good start.
Neutral Milk Hotel
Just give her the whole "Int he Aeroplane Over the Sea" album
We Looked Like Giants is a good song, and Cath... aswell.
Awesome advice. I would do this.
Owls - "Everyone is my Friend" is pretty lyrically awesome. It's not necessarily the most accessible of songs, but holy shit, the guy is a fucking poet.
each girl I’ve brought back home to bloom
all fold on close inspection
each one leaves a banner hanging from the eaves
marking the eve of election
ex-girl collection
why
into why not
into what else you got?
it’s just how men mark time
ann slams in
another lightning round begins
this could get interesting
where’s ann been?
she pours herself a don’t-ask gin
no ice and light on the bitters
I’m done with quitters
"why?
charles, I found out
wipe that smile off your mouth
I think it’s tell-me time…"
britt hit hard
she found my box of beth’s best cards
hand cut and signed with ‘x’s
called at work
"happy anniversary, jerk"
and I just laughed at the timing with you on hold line 2 still crying
"why
play sex on the cuff?
does beth like it rough?
and learn your dirty lines?
and keep her hair cropped"
(the other shoe dropped)
"is this how men mark time in couples?" she cursed
(this sounds too rehearsed)
as ann, hand on hip, accusing me to the rafters
the words turn and spit and scorch right through to the plaster
I’m called 10 kinds of a bastard
curses came faster
ann stands down
I think she thinks there's still some ground
to run manoeuvres on
but ann's so smart
you couldn't even guess beth's part
she said "beth must find you daring
I'm way past caring"
why
into why not?
into charles gone to pot
in hotter water
line up to lift up a toast
to the ones I hurt most
and how the well’s gone lime
with charles on the plow
I’m roger over and how
slower now men mark time
fine
why, what else you got?
As for Nick Cave, I'd suggest perhaps Gates to the Garden from "No More Shall We Part".
I feel like I want to suggest all of Tori Amos' album "Boys for Pele", but while I find all the lyrics on that CD hauntingly beautiful the meanings are puzzling and mired in abstraction, so it's probably not the best example.
I would definitely recommend Something for Kate's Beautiful Sharks and Pinstripe as some of the best lyrics ever written. But you may have trouble finding that outside of Aus.
Also, There is No Such Place by Augie March, but ditto about difficulty finding it.
http://newnations.bandcamp.com
i'd also second the crowded house suggestion.
oh and nick cave - into my arms is fairly affecting, or anything really from his best of cd.
and paul kelly, goodness. to her door is fantastic and i wouldn't forgive myself if i didn't mention everything's turning to white - it's based on a carver short story, one of the best regarded in all of contemporary literature, so it can't help but transfer some of that incredible drama
Also, Aesop Rock is an amazing lyricist. He's all about the word-play, even going so far as to write two songs that are basically yin and yang....Daylight and Nightlight use the same lyrical framework, but are still very opposite to each other. I'm terrible at describing it, so listen and understand:
http://www.last.fm/music/Aesop+Rock/_/Daylight
http://www.last.fm/music/Aesop+Rock/_/Night+Light
Or if you're looking for less wordplay, and more meaning to the lyrics:
http://www.last.fm/music/Aesop+Rock/_/No+Regrets
Yay
At any rate, I now have to pare these down to a manageable level so I can fit them to one CD! Maybe I'll splurge and turn this into a two-CD mix...
Keep it up guys, this is great!
Don't worry. I'll listen to her music without complaining (too much), and I think I've made it pretty clear to her that I'm not in the business of judging her or her music. If she insists on continuing to love this stuff, I might even buy her tickets to a show if they come through (jury's still out on whether I'll go with her though, hah!).
Besides, she's the one telling me that I have no musical taste if I don't appreciate Matthews or Mayer :P
This is all in good fun. If anything, it's a way for expanding my own musical library, because like I said earlier, my collection leans towards the punk-with-indecipherable-and/or-silly-lyrics and instrumental stuff. It'll be nice to get some more solid lyricists in there.
Honestly, she's hit or miss, but overall I think Ani DiFranco is an amazing lyricist. I prefer her more narrative songs rather than the lyric ones. My favorites are:
School Night
Shy
Both Hands
Rush Hour
Superhero
Hello Birmingham
Untouchable Face
When it comes to songs with great lyrics, there are a few that come to mind.
Frank Sinatra - My way -- I absolutely love this song and the lyrics are truly beautiful.
Queen - Bohemian Rhapsody -- Lyrics are awesome if you pay attention to them, and the instrumentals in the song are great, which I'm sure you already know.
Megadeth - A Tout Le Monde -- Hardcore band, and this song is very awesome.
Bone Thugs N Harmony - Crossroads or Home (2 seperate songs) -- Back when I used to listen to rap heavily, I loved these songs. I actually still love thme and this rap group is pretty much the only rap I still listen to.
also, Cake? maybe? Their lyrics are at least amusing in every song, and generally have more meaning behind them.
but they're listening to every word I say
Invisible Ink
Little Bombs
Nightmare Girl
That's Just What You Are
Save Me
Her lyrics hold up on paper much the same as a well-written piece of music will still sound good as a midi, but her delivery is as much of a song as the content she provides.
They're basically all NSFW, yet definately worth listening to.
It's cool if I link them here right? Not breaking any rules I don't know about?
Seriously
I guess that showed it was ok to link some YouTube videos, so here goes. Tim Minchin songs:
"Dark Side", my favorite song by him. Not really NSFW.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I15rCluWLac
"Inflatable You", another good song. Pretty NSFW.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6raVzrbqrM
"Ten Foot Cock and a Few Hundred Virgins". Super goddamn NSFW. Pretty funny though.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Tp0NPC8OGU
http://www.timminchin.com/merchandise/
School Night
Napoleon
Dilate
Little Plastic Castle
Untouchable Face