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I'm looking for a good city building style game to get into. I used to be a fan of the old Caesar and SImcity games. is there anything newer that's similar? I'm not really into the combat aspect like Total War...
The game was just so relaxing though. Which is rare in a city building game. The visuals were sweet too and while warfare was really non existant the economics were great.
Ordering in 200 bricks from my previous mission played city is super sweet.
Emperor was also quite nice, as well as zeus/poseidon. Probably not as good overall as pharoah, but they're probably better introductory games.
I liked children of the nile, though I know some didn't. Although it's more of a small town/villiage than city simulator. Never tried caeser IV, though.
I greatly enjoyed Pharaoh, and its expansion, Cleopatra.
You mother fucker I was going to come in here and pull that one out and act all awesome with my incredible niche game knowledge.
What a great game.
My God, Pharoah... I freaking loved that game. So very relaxing... I remember building massive, massive temples and placing statues and monuments all around it... having the festivals in the centre of town, oh God yes, what a game.
Rohan on
...and I thought of how all those people died, and what a good death that is. That nobody can blame you for it, because everyone else died along with you, and it is the fault of none, save those who did the killing.
I greatly enjoyed Pharaoh, and its expansion, Cleopatra.
You mother fucker I was going to come in here and pull that one out and act all awesome with my incredible niche game knowledge.
What a great game.
You are still all awesome because you like Pharaoh and went to the trouble in providing an awesome Pharaoh screenshot.
Awesome job.
We can be awesome together.
I would be awesome as well if a "friend" of mine didn't "borrow" my copy before suddenly leaving town without a word...
I miss that game. How does Children of the Nile stack up to it? Considering it's from the same people that made Pharaoh.
victor_c26 on
It's been so long since I've posted here, I've removed my signature since most of what I had here were broken links. Shows over, you can carry on to the next post.
This week is going to be expensive: WipEout HD + Children of the Nile = $40 = No Sleep.
victor_c26 on
It's been so long since I've posted here, I've removed my signature since most of what I had here were broken links. Shows over, you can carry on to the next post.
I know this isn't exactly what you meant per se, but the Blockland retail game is great if you love just building and playing around. It's a "game" for the same type of player that might be into traditional city builders.
If you've never seen it, it's basically just building things with legos. For only $20 you definitely get way more than what you pay for. The community has a lot of cool additional mods in the forums.
The original warcraft. I cared infinitely more about lining my roads up than I did about killing my opponent. Actually, if I recal correct, the 10 year old me would slaughter my opponenent, and leave them with like one farm or something left, and then I would spend the rest of the time working on my cities.
jeddy lee on
Backlog Challenge: 0%
0/8
PS2
FF X replay
PS3
God of War 1&2 HD
Rachet and Clank Future
MGS 4
Prince of Persia
360
Bayonetta
Fable 3
DS
FF: 4 heroes of light
0
HardtargetThere Are Four LightsVancouverRegistered Userregular
This week is going to be expensive: WipEout HD + Children of the Nile = $40 = No Sleep.
I was in the beta of Children of the Nile and I loathed it.
They put 3D in it for the sake of 3D, removing many gameplay elements from Pharaoh in the process!
I mean, insanely brilliant thing about Pharaoh (and Stronghold + Settlers 2) was that you could get a complete overview of the gameworld at a glance: Just by glancing at your storage yards, you could see exactly how large stacks of goods you had of all the different types. And glancing in your fields, you could predict how large the harvest was going to be. The best thing was that if you looked back at your storage yard for a few more moments, you could actually judge how long a resource was going to last, by the amount of goods stacking up or getting removed, right before your eyes!
With 3D, they completely murdered those wonderful details, which made the world seem really alive. Instead, you were forced to click and read text menus instead to get the same information. The game was reduced to looking at numbers and spreadsheets, and the graphics, instead of being a part of the gameplay itself, became completely superficial and unnecessary.
There was a lot of other things I loathed about CotN as well, but I've managed to supress those horrible memories.
PS. In Sweden, Pharaoh was extra cool because the narrator for every mission, and every in-game help text, was Hans Villius, a very famous and prolific historian with a really, really characteristic voice. He was sort of the Donald LaFontaine of documentaries in Sweden and hearing him in Pharaoh brought an incredible authority to the game.
EDIT: Ok... somewhat of a hypocritical recommendation: Anno 1701. The graphics are absolutely drop dead bloody gorgeous, like Crysis good! I bet these guys could easily recreate the detail of Sim City 4 in 3D if they wanted to. Sadly, the gameplay is rather dumbed down, so it lacks replay value. But the first play through is great fun. (Very annoying AI diplomacy, though, which is extremely basic.)
eobet on
Heard the proposition that RIAA and MPAA should join forces and form "Music And Film Industry Association"?
Please no Sim City 4. That game was gaarrrrbbbaageee. Sim City 3000 is still the best in the series, if you want a Sim City game.
Also from Sierra, Emperor: Rise of the Middle Kingdom is a great game. Very similar to Pharaoh, except it's in Asia. They released it three years later too.
Those are all the city building games Sierra released. Apparently Caesar IV was the last title released (I don't count the Sid Meier game).
I think I have Caesar II somewhere. I remember playing it as a kid and just not getting it. My city would always scream at me "PLEBS ARE NEEDED!" and I had no idea what that meant so my cities would fall apart.
This week is going to be expensive: WipEout HD + Children of the Nile = $40 = No Sleep.
I was in the beta of Children of the Nile and I loathed it.
They put 3D in it for the sake of 3D, removing many gameplay elements from Pharaoh in the process!
I mean, insanely brilliant thing about Pharaoh (and Stronghold + Settlers 2) was that you could get a complete overview of the gameworld at a glance: Just by glancing at your storage yards, you could see exactly how large stacks of goods you had of all the different types. And glancing in your fields, you could predict how large the harvest was going to be. The best thing was that if you looked back at your storage yard for a few more moments, you could actually judge how long a resource was going to last, by the amount of goods stacking up or getting removed, right before your eyes!
With 3D, they completely murdered those wonderful details, which made the world seem really alive. Instead, you were forced to click and read text menus instead to get the same information. The game was reduced to looking at numbers and spreadsheets, and the graphics, instead of being a part of the gameplay itself, became completely superficial and unnecessary.
There was a lot of other things I loathed about CotN as well, but I've managed to supress those horrible memories.
PS. In Sweden, Pharaoh was extra cool because the narrator for every mission, and every in-game help text, was Hans Villius, a very famous and prolific historian with a really, really characteristic voice. He was sort of the Donald LaFontaine of documentaries in Sweden and hearing him in Pharaoh brought an incredible authority to the game.
EDIT: Ok... somewhat of a hypocritical recommendation: Anno 1701. The graphics are absolutely drop dead bloody gorgeous, like Crysis good! I bet these guys could easily recreate the detail of Sim City 4 in 3D if they wanted to. Sadly, the gameplay is rather dumbed down, so it lacks replay value. But the first play through is great fun. (Very annoying AI diplomacy, though, which is extremely basic.)
CotN was a completely, entirely, absulutely different game from Pharoah. They literally have virtually nothing in common aside from that you place buildings down and build things. I don't think that makes CotN a bad game, though. It's a really amazing simulation of a barter economy, and it's one of the few city building games where every individual person is modelled. My only real problem with it is once you've built a big pyramid, amassed an army, etc, there's not much else to do. Scenarios past the first few in the campaign don't really add a whole lot.
But complaining that it's not the same as pharaoh is like compaining that Everquest wasn't like Ultima online, or that Neverwinter Nights wasn't like BG2. Different games, different systems, different goals, different implementations.
This week is going to be expensive: WipEout HD + Children of the Nile = $40 = No Sleep.
I was in the beta of Children of the Nile and I loathed it.
They put 3D in it for the sake of 3D, removing many gameplay elements from Pharaoh in the process!
I mean, insanely brilliant thing about Pharaoh (and Stronghold + Settlers 2) was that you could get a complete overview of the gameworld at a glance: Just by glancing at your storage yards, you could see exactly how large stacks of goods you had of all the different types. And glancing in your fields, you could predict how large the harvest was going to be. The best thing was that if you looked back at your storage yard for a few more moments, you could actually judge how long a resource was going to last, by the amount of goods stacking up or getting removed, right before your eyes!
With 3D, they completely murdered those wonderful details, which made the world seem really alive. Instead, you were forced to click and read text menus instead to get the same information. The game was reduced to looking at numbers and spreadsheets, and the graphics, instead of being a part of the gameplay itself, became completely superficial and unnecessary.
There was a lot of other things I loathed about CotN as well, but I've managed to supress those horrible memories.
PS. In Sweden, Pharaoh was extra cool because the narrator for every mission, and every in-game help text, was Hans Villius, a very famous and prolific historian with a really, really characteristic voice. He was sort of the Donald LaFontaine of documentaries in Sweden and hearing him in Pharaoh brought an incredible authority to the game.
EDIT: Ok... somewhat of a hypocritical recommendation: Anno 1701. The graphics are absolutely drop dead bloody gorgeous, like Crysis good! I bet these guys could easily recreate the detail of Sim City 4 in 3D if they wanted to. Sadly, the gameplay is rather dumbed down, so it lacks replay value. But the first play through is great fun. (Very annoying AI diplomacy, though, which is extremely basic.)
CotN was a completely, entirely, absulutely different game from Pharoah. They literally have virtually nothing in common aside from that you place buildings down and build things. I don't think that makes CotN a bad game, though. It's a really amazing simulation of a barter economy, and it's one of the few city building games where every individual person is modelled. My only real problem with it is once you've built a big pyramid, amassed an army, etc, there's not much else to do. Scenarios past the first few in the campaign don't really add a whole lot.
But complaining that it's not the same as pharaoh is like compaining that Everquest wasn't like Ultima online, or that Neverwinter Nights wasn't like BG2. Different games, different systems, different goals, different implementations.
If you read carefully, I do nothing of the sort.
My complaint is that the 3D game world they added eliminated the need for a 3D game world. You could no longer use the game world to read the game. You had to look away from the 3D game world in order to understand what was going on, hence turning it into a game of reading numbers in menus.
In Pharaoh and Stronghold (and Settlers 2 mostly), the game world itself contains all the information you need.
eobet on
Heard the proposition that RIAA and MPAA should join forces and form "Music And Film Industry Association"?
It's a bit of a city builder mixed with some smaller block by block managing - but Monopoly Tycoon is insanely good. You can easily find it for around $10 and it's well worth it. It's basically building up areas of a city competitively with CPU or Human players with streets and themes from Monopoly.
This week is going to be expensive: WipEout HD + Children of the Nile = $40 = No Sleep.
I was in the beta of Children of the Nile and I loathed it.
They put 3D in it for the sake of 3D, removing many gameplay elements from Pharaoh in the process!
I mean, insanely brilliant thing about Pharaoh (and Stronghold + Settlers 2) was that you could get a complete overview of the gameworld at a glance: Just by glancing at your storage yards, you could see exactly how large stacks of goods you had of all the different types. And glancing in your fields, you could predict how large the harvest was going to be. The best thing was that if you looked back at your storage yard for a few more moments, you could actually judge how long a resource was going to last, by the amount of goods stacking up or getting removed, right before your eyes!
With 3D, they completely murdered those wonderful details, which made the world seem really alive. Instead, you were forced to click and read text menus instead to get the same information. The game was reduced to looking at numbers and spreadsheets, and the graphics, instead of being a part of the gameplay itself, became completely superficial and unnecessary.
There was a lot of other things I loathed about CotN as well, but I've managed to supress those horrible memories.
PS. In Sweden, Pharaoh was extra cool because the narrator for every mission, and every in-game help text, was Hans Villius, a very famous and prolific historian with a really, really characteristic voice. He was sort of the Donald LaFontaine of documentaries in Sweden and hearing him in Pharaoh brought an incredible authority to the game.
EDIT: Ok... somewhat of a hypocritical recommendation: Anno 1701. The graphics are absolutely drop dead bloody gorgeous, like Crysis good! I bet these guys could easily recreate the detail of Sim City 4 in 3D if they wanted to. Sadly, the gameplay is rather dumbed down, so it lacks replay value. But the first play through is great fun. (Very annoying AI diplomacy, though, which is extremely basic.)
CotN was a completely, entirely, absulutely different game from Pharoah. They literally have virtually nothing in common aside from that you place buildings down and build things. I don't think that makes CotN a bad game, though. It's a really amazing simulation of a barter economy, and it's one of the few city building games where every individual person is modelled. My only real problem with it is once you've built a big pyramid, amassed an army, etc, there's not much else to do. Scenarios past the first few in the campaign don't really add a whole lot.
But complaining that it's not the same as pharaoh is like compaining that Everquest wasn't like Ultima online, or that Neverwinter Nights wasn't like BG2. Different games, different systems, different goals, different implementations.
If you read carefully, I do nothing of the sort.
My complaint is that the 3D game world they added eliminated the need for a 3D game world. You could no longer use the game world to read the game. You had to look away from the 3D game world in order to understand what was going on, hence turning it into a game of reading numbers in menus.
In Pharaoh and Stronghold (and Settlers 2 mostly), the game world itself contains all the information you need.
To really do anything beyond a superficial level in pharaoh(IE import and export goods, make sure you have a good enough harvest, stockpile goods for projects/gifts/etc) you have to read numbers in menus. This is an odd compaint, especially as you can get pretty far in CoTN just by clicking on houses and looking at the demand indicators or clicking on individual people and watching them for a while.
I honestly don't know what you'd need to even look at numbers in a menu that much for, unless again you were intentionally stockpiling goods to send to other settlements or that kind of thing.
Your complaint just honestly really doesn't make a lot of sense in the context of both games.
This week is going to be expensive: WipEout HD + Children of the Nile = $40 = No Sleep.
I was in the beta of Children of the Nile and I loathed it.
They put 3D in it for the sake of 3D, removing many gameplay elements from Pharaoh in the process!
I mean, insanely brilliant thing about Pharaoh (and Stronghold + Settlers 2) was that you could get a complete overview of the gameworld at a glance: Just by glancing at your storage yards, you could see exactly how large stacks of goods you had of all the different types. And glancing in your fields, you could predict how large the harvest was going to be. The best thing was that if you looked back at your storage yard for a few more moments, you could actually judge how long a resource was going to last, by the amount of goods stacking up or getting removed, right before your eyes!
With 3D, they completely murdered those wonderful details, which made the world seem really alive. Instead, you were forced to click and read text menus instead to get the same information. The game was reduced to looking at numbers and spreadsheets, and the graphics, instead of being a part of the gameplay itself, became completely superficial and unnecessary.
There was a lot of other things I loathed about CotN as well, but I've managed to supress those horrible memories.
PS. In Sweden, Pharaoh was extra cool because the narrator for every mission, and every in-game help text, was Hans Villius, a very famous and prolific historian with a really, really characteristic voice. He was sort of the Donald LaFontaine of documentaries in Sweden and hearing him in Pharaoh brought an incredible authority to the game.
EDIT: Ok... somewhat of a hypocritical recommendation: Anno 1701. The graphics are absolutely drop dead bloody gorgeous, like Crysis good! I bet these guys could easily recreate the detail of Sim City 4 in 3D if they wanted to. Sadly, the gameplay is rather dumbed down, so it lacks replay value. But the first play through is great fun. (Very annoying AI diplomacy, though, which is extremely basic.)
CotN was a completely, entirely, absulutely different game from Pharoah. They literally have virtually nothing in common aside from that you place buildings down and build things. I don't think that makes CotN a bad game, though. It's a really amazing simulation of a barter economy, and it's one of the few city building games where every individual person is modelled. My only real problem with it is once you've built a big pyramid, amassed an army, etc, there's not much else to do. Scenarios past the first few in the campaign don't really add a whole lot.
But complaining that it's not the same as pharaoh is like compaining that Everquest wasn't like Ultima online, or that Neverwinter Nights wasn't like BG2. Different games, different systems, different goals, different implementations.
If you read carefully, I do nothing of the sort.
My complaint is that the 3D game world they added eliminated the need for a 3D game world. You could no longer use the game world to read the game. You had to look away from the 3D game world in order to understand what was going on, hence turning it into a game of reading numbers in menus.
In Pharaoh and Stronghold (and Settlers 2 mostly), the game world itself contains all the information you need.
To really do anything beyond a superficial level in pharaoh(IE import and export goods, make sure you have a good enough harvest, stockpile goods for projects/gifts/etc) you have to read numbers in menus. This is an odd compaint, especially as you can get pretty far in CoTN just by clicking on houses and looking at the demand indicators or clicking on individual people and watching them for a while.
I honestly don't know what you'd need to even look at numbers in a menu that much for, unless again you were intentionally stockpiling goods to send to other settlements or that kind of thing.
Your complaint just honestly really doesn't make a lot of sense in the context of both games.
What is the number one things you do in Pharaoh to manage your city? Making sure the level of food & resources is balanced.
By being able to see the contents of your storage yards directly in the game, you can not only see the current stock, but also see the rate by which it disappears or stacks up. You don't have to click, you don't have to search, you don't have to read anything. Because it's actively in your field of view at all times, your awareness of it becomes almost subliminal, and much more tangible than a boring, lifeless number in a menu. Also, to see the rate of consumtion in a menu, you'd need a graph.
But perhaps you think looking at a graph is more fun than looking at actual goods being moved around the game world?
eobet on
Heard the proposition that RIAA and MPAA should join forces and form "Music And Film Industry Association"?
This week is going to be expensive: WipEout HD + Children of the Nile = $40 = No Sleep.
I was in the beta of Children of the Nile and I loathed it.
They put 3D in it for the sake of 3D, removing many gameplay elements from Pharaoh in the process!
I mean, insanely brilliant thing about Pharaoh (and Stronghold + Settlers 2) was that you could get a complete overview of the gameworld at a glance: Just by glancing at your storage yards, you could see exactly how large stacks of goods you had of all the different types. And glancing in your fields, you could predict how large the harvest was going to be. The best thing was that if you looked back at your storage yard for a few more moments, you could actually judge how long a resource was going to last, by the amount of goods stacking up or getting removed, right before your eyes!
With 3D, they completely murdered those wonderful details, which made the world seem really alive. Instead, you were forced to click and read text menus instead to get the same information. The game was reduced to looking at numbers and spreadsheets, and the graphics, instead of being a part of the gameplay itself, became completely superficial and unnecessary.
There was a lot of other things I loathed about CotN as well, but I've managed to supress those horrible memories.
PS. In Sweden, Pharaoh was extra cool because the narrator for every mission, and every in-game help text, was Hans Villius, a very famous and prolific historian with a really, really characteristic voice. He was sort of the Donald LaFontaine of documentaries in Sweden and hearing him in Pharaoh brought an incredible authority to the game.
EDIT: Ok... somewhat of a hypocritical recommendation: Anno 1701. The graphics are absolutely drop dead bloody gorgeous, like Crysis good! I bet these guys could easily recreate the detail of Sim City 4 in 3D if they wanted to. Sadly, the gameplay is rather dumbed down, so it lacks replay value. But the first play through is great fun. (Very annoying AI diplomacy, though, which is extremely basic.)
CotN was a completely, entirely, absulutely different game from Pharoah. They literally have virtually nothing in common aside from that you place buildings down and build things. I don't think that makes CotN a bad game, though. It's a really amazing simulation of a barter economy, and it's one of the few city building games where every individual person is modelled. My only real problem with it is once you've built a big pyramid, amassed an army, etc, there's not much else to do. Scenarios past the first few in the campaign don't really add a whole lot.
But complaining that it's not the same as pharaoh is like compaining that Everquest wasn't like Ultima online, or that Neverwinter Nights wasn't like BG2. Different games, different systems, different goals, different implementations.
If you read carefully, I do nothing of the sort.
My complaint is that the 3D game world they added eliminated the need for a 3D game world. You could no longer use the game world to read the game. You had to look away from the 3D game world in order to understand what was going on, hence turning it into a game of reading numbers in menus.
In Pharaoh and Stronghold (and Settlers 2 mostly), the game world itself contains all the information you need.
To really do anything beyond a superficial level in pharaoh(IE import and export goods, make sure you have a good enough harvest, stockpile goods for projects/gifts/etc) you have to read numbers in menus. This is an odd compaint, especially as you can get pretty far in CoTN just by clicking on houses and looking at the demand indicators or clicking on individual people and watching them for a while.
I honestly don't know what you'd need to even look at numbers in a menu that much for, unless again you were intentionally stockpiling goods to send to other settlements or that kind of thing.
Your complaint just honestly really doesn't make a lot of sense in the context of both games.
What is the number one things you do in Pharaoh to manage your city? Making sure the level of food & resources is balanced.
By being able to see the contents of your storage yards directly in the game, you can not only see the current stock, but also see the rate by which it disappears or stacks up. You don't have to click, you don't have to search, you don't have to read anything. Because it's actively in your field of view at all times, your awareness of it becomes almost subliminal, and much more tangible than a boring, lifeless number in a menu. Also, to see the rate of consumtion in a menu, you'd need a graph.
But perhaps you think looking at a graph is more fun than looking at actual goods being moved around the game world?
So what you're saying is that you completely lack any understanding of how Children of the Nile works on even the most basic levels and/or have it confused with some other game. Ok I can accept that.
If castles can count as cities (and they had their own economies, so I'd say yes for the sake of argument), then I'd recommend Stronghold, which has been mentioned in passing in this thread. There is a heck of a lot of building you can do, and the cottage industries feel a lot more interesting than big business. Plus, when you get bored of building, you can besiege the Tower of London as it was in the eleventh century.
Also, if you can get past the graphics, Dwarf Fortress.
These games are more for the small-scale civil engineer, though.
It was made by ex-Bullfrog employees, they did Populous and Dungeon Keeper, which means I shouldn't have to say too much more. It's old 3D but it holds up pretty well. I remember it being quite addictive.
Pharaoh is pretty much the best game in the genre. I love it so much. Setting up massive industrial areas with loads of tiny guys carting stuff about and producing things and then having a quarter of my city made up of storage yards due to massive overproduction and oh god where did all this flax come from, where am I going to put it all...
It was made by ex-Bullfrog employees, they did Populous and Dungeon Keeper, which means I shouldn't have to say too much more. It's old 3D but it holds up pretty well. I remember it being quite addictive.
Also worth noting that the voice over guy did the voice for the Hitchhikers Guide in the radio series.
[IMG]http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e1/meatflower/StartopiaScreen.jpg[/IMG
Startopia
It was made by ex-Bullfrog employees, they did Populous and Dungeon Keeper, which means I shouldn't have to say too much more. It's old 3D but it holds up pretty well. I remember it being quite addictive.[/img]
Also worth noting that the voice over guy did the voice for the Hitchhikers Guide in the radio series.
I just reinstalled mine and it's not only Vista 64 compatible, it also has native widescreen support. Pretty good for a Direct X 8 game from 2001. Looks pretty damn good at 1920x1200 with all the settings cranked.
Posts
www.waywardgamer.com
You mother fucker I was going to come in here and pull that one out and act all awesome with my incredible niche game knowledge.
What a great game.
You are still all awesome because you like Pharaoh and went to the trouble in providing an awesome Pharaoh screenshot.
Awesome job.
We can be awesome together.
Ordering in 200 bricks from my previous mission played city is super sweet.
I liked children of the nile, though I know some didn't. Although it's more of a small town/villiage than city simulator. Never tried caeser IV, though.
My God, Pharoah... I freaking loved that game. So very relaxing... I remember building massive, massive temples and placing statues and monuments all around it... having the festivals in the centre of town, oh God yes, what a game.
Nothing's forgotten, nothing is ever forgotten
You rule.
Really, it's not as robust as many of the mentioned city builders, but there's something about being the dictator of a Caribbean island.
Do not engage the Watermelons.
Same company, and almost identical games, I just preferred Caesar.
Both Caesar III and Pharoah are on Gametap, by the way.
Black and White 1. Plenty of just dicking around, building cities, and having your creature step on cows.
I would be awesome as well if a "friend" of mine didn't "borrow" my copy before suddenly leaving town without a word...
I miss that game. How does Children of the Nile stack up to it? Considering it's from the same people that made Pharaoh.
This week is going to be expensive: WipEout HD + Children of the Nile = $40 = No Sleep.
If you've never seen it, it's basically just building things with legos. For only $20 you definitely get way more than what you pay for. The community has a lot of cool additional mods in the forums.
PS2
FF X replay
PS3
God of War 1&2 HD
Rachet and Clank Future
MGS 4
Prince of Persia
360
Bayonetta
Fable 3
DS
FF: 4 heroes of light
I was in the beta of Children of the Nile and I loathed it.
They put 3D in it for the sake of 3D, removing many gameplay elements from Pharaoh in the process!
I mean, insanely brilliant thing about Pharaoh (and Stronghold + Settlers 2) was that you could get a complete overview of the gameworld at a glance: Just by glancing at your storage yards, you could see exactly how large stacks of goods you had of all the different types. And glancing in your fields, you could predict how large the harvest was going to be. The best thing was that if you looked back at your storage yard for a few more moments, you could actually judge how long a resource was going to last, by the amount of goods stacking up or getting removed, right before your eyes!
With 3D, they completely murdered those wonderful details, which made the world seem really alive. Instead, you were forced to click and read text menus instead to get the same information. The game was reduced to looking at numbers and spreadsheets, and the graphics, instead of being a part of the gameplay itself, became completely superficial and unnecessary.
There was a lot of other things I loathed about CotN as well, but I've managed to supress those horrible memories.
PS. In Sweden, Pharaoh was extra cool because the narrator for every mission, and every in-game help text, was Hans Villius, a very famous and prolific historian with a really, really characteristic voice. He was sort of the Donald LaFontaine of documentaries in Sweden and hearing him in Pharaoh brought an incredible authority to the game.
EDIT: Ok... somewhat of a hypocritical recommendation: Anno 1701. The graphics are absolutely drop dead bloody gorgeous, like Crysis good! I bet these guys could easily recreate the detail of Sim City 4 in 3D if they wanted to. Sadly, the gameplay is rather dumbed down, so it lacks replay value. But the first play through is great fun. (Very annoying AI diplomacy, though, which is extremely basic.)
Also from Sierra, Emperor: Rise of the Middle Kingdom is a great game. Very similar to Pharaoh, except it's in Asia. They released it three years later too.
Edit: Oh by the way.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_Building_Series
Those are all the city building games Sierra released. Apparently Caesar IV was the last title released (I don't count the Sid Meier game).
I think I have Caesar II somewhere. I remember playing it as a kid and just not getting it. My city would always scream at me "PLEBS ARE NEEDED!" and I had no idea what that meant so my cities would fall apart.
SECOND EDIT:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City-building_game
Check out this. This is a list of City Building Games from various companies, not just Sierra.
CotN was a completely, entirely, absulutely different game from Pharoah. They literally have virtually nothing in common aside from that you place buildings down and build things. I don't think that makes CotN a bad game, though. It's a really amazing simulation of a barter economy, and it's one of the few city building games where every individual person is modelled. My only real problem with it is once you've built a big pyramid, amassed an army, etc, there's not much else to do. Scenarios past the first few in the campaign don't really add a whole lot.
But complaining that it's not the same as pharaoh is like compaining that Everquest wasn't like Ultima online, or that Neverwinter Nights wasn't like BG2. Different games, different systems, different goals, different implementations.
If you read carefully, I do nothing of the sort.
My complaint is that the 3D game world they added eliminated the need for a 3D game world. You could no longer use the game world to read the game. You had to look away from the 3D game world in order to understand what was going on, hence turning it into a game of reading numbers in menus.
In Pharaoh and Stronghold (and Settlers 2 mostly), the game world itself contains all the information you need.
To really do anything beyond a superficial level in pharaoh(IE import and export goods, make sure you have a good enough harvest, stockpile goods for projects/gifts/etc) you have to read numbers in menus. This is an odd compaint, especially as you can get pretty far in CoTN just by clicking on houses and looking at the demand indicators or clicking on individual people and watching them for a while.
I honestly don't know what you'd need to even look at numbers in a menu that much for, unless again you were intentionally stockpiling goods to send to other settlements or that kind of thing.
Your complaint just honestly really doesn't make a lot of sense in the context of both games.
What is the number one things you do in Pharaoh to manage your city? Making sure the level of food & resources is balanced.
By being able to see the contents of your storage yards directly in the game, you can not only see the current stock, but also see the rate by which it disappears or stacks up. You don't have to click, you don't have to search, you don't have to read anything. Because it's actively in your field of view at all times, your awareness of it becomes almost subliminal, and much more tangible than a boring, lifeless number in a menu. Also, to see the rate of consumtion in a menu, you'd need a graph.
But perhaps you think looking at a graph is more fun than looking at actual goods being moved around the game world?
So what you're saying is that you completely lack any understanding of how Children of the Nile works on even the most basic levels and/or have it confused with some other game. Ok I can accept that.
There anything remotely recent that is sim city, settlers etc like?
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I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
Also, if you can get past the graphics, Dwarf Fortress.
These games are more for the small-scale civil engineer, though.
http://www.gametrailers.com/player/21384.html
A nice video showing the city building aspect, though there is fighting involved to some degree.
Startopia
It was made by ex-Bullfrog employees, they did Populous and Dungeon Keeper, which means I shouldn't have to say too much more. It's old 3D but it holds up pretty well. I remember it being quite addictive.
So good.
Also worth noting that the voice over guy did the voice for the Hitchhikers Guide in the radio series.
I just reinstalled mine and it's not only Vista 64 compatible, it also has native widescreen support. Pretty good for a Direct X 8 game from 2001. Looks pretty damn good at 1920x1200 with all the settings cranked.
Sim Safari is where it's at. I had so much fun with it.