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Plastic Surgery: Cool!
Loren Michael
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
http://www.slate.com/id/2207049/
That's a lot of moral waffling in that story. I say, shit, bring on the plastic surgery. What do you think about cosmetic surgery? I'm prepared to argue that I think a society is only enhanced by plastic surgery. I think it's a great thing. Medical technology is still, well, at a state where a lot of this kind of surgery is expensive and/or dangerous, but as it gets better, cheaper, safer, I think the effect of more people having access to surgery will ultimately increase the quality of life and, dare I say, culture the world over.
What do you think? I think, you're not happy with how you look, the option to change it is an unambiguously great thing.
Don't look now, but a woman in Ohio has a new face. And the world has a new kind of medicine: socially necessary surgery.
The operation, announced yesterday at the Cleveland Clinic, was a face transplant from a corpse. Similar procedures have been done three times before, but this was the biggest. Doctors replaced 77 square inches of the patient's face, from her eyelids to her chin. Go look at yourself in the mirror. That's practically the whole you.
Medically, it's a triumph. Transplants used to be mortally necessary and relatively simple: kidneys, livers, hearts. Patients got these surgeries because if they didn't, they'd die. And though the surgeries were risky, the tissues involved were straightforward. The blood vessels that had to be connected were manageable in number and size.
The operation, announced yesterday at the Cleveland Clinic, was a face transplant from a corpse. Similar procedures have been done three times before, but this was the biggest. Doctors replaced 77 square inches of the patient's face, from her eyelids to her chin. Go look at yourself in the mirror. That's practically the whole you.
Medically, it's a triumph. Transplants used to be mortally necessary and relatively simple: kidneys, livers, hearts. Patients got these surgeries because if they didn't, they'd die. And though the surgeries were risky, the tissues involved were straightforward. The blood vessels that had to be connected were manageable in number and size.
Art Caplan, an ethicist who used to oppose face transplants, now endorses the Cleveland procedure. "The stigma of severe facial deformity is so enormous, so staggering, that many simply withdraw from society," he writes. "After talking to some people with severe facial disfigurement, I realize it makes ethical sense to offer a form of surgery that might kill the patient, because the suffering of the afflicted is so great that they are willing to risk death." Even if the suffering is social, patients are entitled to decide that ending it is worth that risk.
But if social suffering justifies procedures whose physical risks outweigh their physical benefits, where does that logic end? For Caplan, it goes all the way. "There are no second chances with face transplants—the damage of rejection makes that impossible," he observes. So if a patient risks death for a normal face and loses that face to immune rejection, she might prefer death. "What if someone facing this horrendous prospect—life with no face at all—says no to artificial feeding or breathing?" Caplan asks. "What if they beg for morphine to help them die painlessly and more quickly?" Doctors, he concludes, must "be ready to help that person in any way necessary, including assistance in dying."
That's a lot of moral waffling in that story. I say, shit, bring on the plastic surgery. What do you think about cosmetic surgery? I'm prepared to argue that I think a society is only enhanced by plastic surgery. I think it's a great thing. Medical technology is still, well, at a state where a lot of this kind of surgery is expensive and/or dangerous, but as it gets better, cheaper, safer, I think the effect of more people having access to surgery will ultimately increase the quality of life and, dare I say, culture the world over.
What do you think? I think, you're not happy with how you look, the option to change it is an unambiguously great thing.
Loren Michael on
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I just don't want to feel like surgery needs to be the course of action taken to look "proper." As if there's some ideal people need to live up to, and surgery should be on the table to live up to that ideal.
Not that people need to be monks free of all desire and vanity, nor that they're not allowed to do what the want because of some backward morals.
Do what you want if it makes you happy.
But I just would prefer to see that the action and motives are... a little more... prudent.
I mean, you wouldn't say, "Shit yeah. I mean, if heroin and cutting are what make you happy."
However, it a good for folks who suffers from acid or burn scars.
If of course the person involved wants to risk it.
So... how do you deal with it? Ha ha :P
I want laser hair removal on my chest and sack but it's so damn expensive.
Sometime like, right after highschool I suddenly got a lot more attractive. Part of it was that I learned how to dress effectively, but a big part of it was, I dunno, I just started to look different.
There was a noticeable difference.
Since coming to China, I've been losing weight, and again, I'm just getting better and better looking, and I'm again finding this being socially extremely, extremely beneficial.
Sounds like the self confidence is helping the most too, good deal.
I'm reasonably sure there's a positive feedback cycle with self confidence and appearance. Confident people appear more attractive, and attractive people are more self confident. Positive feedback from others keeps adding in, with people being more receptive to a confident attitude and an attractive person...
We're talking about people who are incredibly ugly here. People whose faces are incredibly unpleasant to look at.
I don't see a compelling reason to limit our observations to them. It's just a matter of degree in many cases, though it may be extreme. Terrible acne can be socially crippling, for example, even if our abilities in the realm of eating, sleeping, and pooping and such aren't affected.
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That said, a lot of people are ugly mostly because they have no fucking clue how to use makeup and end up looking like Mimi from the Drew Carey sitcom.
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Of course, there also needs to be some transparency here, otherwise there will be endless tides of medical expenses because nobody will know to not breed with someone whose genetic line is hideous.
yeah, obviously. I got a lot more confident once I realized how good looking I was.
Mind you, it's not like the feedback loop is endless. You most definitely hit a wall at some point. And then you know, you have to work on the stuff that actually matters in life.
Well, not yet anyway.
Nature's way of weeding out the ugly and undesirable members of a population was by making them ugly and undesirable. Moths that don't have the right coloring, birds that can't sing the right song, their genes don't get passed on. Altering someone who wouldn't normally get the chance to reproduce due to what they look like is cheating natural selection, basically tricking the human race into accepting inferior genes in the long term for short term "beauty" satisfaction.
I think that for the kind of people that would go through with a face transplant surgery, they'd do so because of some physical injuries scarring etc that wouldnt be reflected in their genes.
I'm pretty sure nobody is born ugly enough to risk death over.
The guy who is getting passed up now because of his thick, rubbery skin may find himself in demand when it turns out that he's immune to the deadly radiation that starts bathing the planet in 2014, after all.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Things like symmetry are always in the equation of good looking though, regardless of place or time. Some people will always be regarded as ugly as fuck.
t geckhan - have you ever seen those "Extreme Makeover" shows? The stuff the people go through... massive facial plastic surgery, massive dental surgery, all kinds of liposuction, breast implants, calf implants... Any surgery that requires you be put under general anesthesia means you're risking your life.
How much should we care about that, though? Shouldn't our interest be on the welfare of individuals, not some weird concern about genetic perfection?
And isn't this only bad for our genes in the same way that, say, civilization is bad for our genes? We simply have changed the aspects that are being selected for. If appearance is mutable, won't we start making selections based on other aspects, such as intelligence and personality and talent, and isn't that ultimately more beneficial than genetic concern about appearance?
Things like tans being bad, then being good are something that we as a species cycle through faster than others might (due to the complex nature of our brains and the sexuality contained therein). There's also a lot of variation around the world as to what constitutes a beatiful woman, though it's starting to become somewhat more homogenous due to international media availability.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
No it's not my naive little friend.
Attractive people are more likely to have other positive qualities associated with them. Taller people get paid more, attractive people go further in life with the same talent.
You are more likely to get hired for a job if you are attractive all other things equal, more likely to be paid more in that job, more likely to sell things to other people, to convince other people.
Jail sentences for crimes can be reduced for attractive people. Not convictions, but sentences.
(Although on the other hand if the reason for the crime is deemed trivial they tend to be increased.)
Sorry son being beautiful pretty much governs your whole life.
In particular if you are good looking people will tend to like you more and you can get away with more shit. It has it's limitations but it's benefits are large and permanent.
Why do you get a better job? Because they want to fuck you.
Why do they give you a reduced sentence? Because they want to fuck you.
It's a gift/reward system. It doesn't matter what the gift (higher pay, better job, reduced sentence) is, the potential "reward" is fucking. The more gifts you give to the pretty person, the better chance you have of passing on your genetic material.
Cavemen didn't drag Mastodons back to the prettiest cave chick's cave because she was the best cook. They did it because they wanted to fuck her.
Perhaps, taking the facial features of a convicted terrorist and swapping them with an undercover cop so that he may infiltrate the criminal underworld?
Let's call it the "Pug strategy"
So ugly it's cute!
Arch,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_goGR39m2k
it's better than ripping it off of someone who's still alive.
So basically Daniel Craig then.
It's not sex related. Attractive males get more from other males. Attractive females get more benefits from other females.
It's too homogenous of an effect to be all about the sexings. It can happen in situations where they'll never ever be able to.
Basically your little theory is hopelessly simplistic and is basically only one possible explanation for a certain number of these behaviors lost and alone in a whole spectrum of other explanations.
So you didn't solve the whole puzzle there chap. Back to the thinking.
What do more attractive females have that less attractive females don't? Men.
What happens when Mr. Attractive is all boned out? His less attractive friends move in on the females he's currently not boning.
What happens when Miss Attractive is over-occupied? Her less attractive friends move in on the males she can't take care of.
Just because we're human, doesn't mean we're not still animals. Seriously, if you want the best chance to pass on your chromosomes to the most attractive mate, are you going to hang out with a bunch of your sweaty, smelly friends? Nope, you're going to make friends with the kind of guy who might just be nice enough to give you a lead on a receptive female, and if you're a girl you're going to position yourself next to the prettiest girl you can find and hope guys see you as an acceptable second choice.
Sure, there are a lot of decisions with very limited social contributing factors at all. I'm in pain, I will be out of pain if I get surgery X, and surgery X is cheap and safe. That's not really a social decision.
However, let's say a wheelchair would also alleviate that pain. Now I have to gauge the inconvenience of a wheelchair versus the risk of surgery. The inconvenience of a wheelchair depends a lot on how my physical environment is constructed - which is in turn rooted in society and economics and politics. Does my workplace have wheelchair ramps? Is there a wheelchair friendly transit system? Will my boss and my family be understanding if it takes me a little longer to get places because I'm in a wheelchair?
If I'm living somewhere that is not socially/architecturally/politically wheelchair-friendly, that might push me closer to getting the surgery. Is that surgery then "socially necessary?" It is, to a degree.
That's just one example. It's also really obvious in psychiatry - people take antidepressants and anti-anxiety and anti-ADHD medication largely to fit in better with school or work or friends or family. Pain management: the social stigma of taking addictive opioid medication and the political and legal ramifications of prescribing opioid medication are major considerations. Aging: there is a social expectation that old people will necessarily have to endure more pain and illness than younger people.
Ultimately, we're social creatures. Decrying a difference between a surgery that is "medically" necessary and one that is "socially" necessary is a little silly... we need to interact with other people as much as we need shelter and clothing.
Most of these ethical conundrums can really be sorted out on an individual level by asking some very simple questions:
How much will the patient benefit (socially, medically, economically) from treatment?
What is the cost (in economic, social, and physical terms) of treatment?
What is the risk of undesired consequences from treatment?
Are there less risky and/or costly measures (including social, behavioral, or medical measures) available?
These might be complicated questions but at least they have answers. In any given set of cases, it's a solvable puzzle.
Now, there is a separate question about whether our culture places too much value on beauty, and whether the standards of beauty that we value are reasonably attainable for the average person. I think the answers to these questions are clearly "yes" and "no," not just because of the popularity of plastic surgery, but because of the commonality of eating disorders, body image disorders, and so on. I don't think it's possible for humans to put zero value on beauty, and every conceivable human society would value beauty to some degree. But I think we, right now, value it too much, and value a standard that is impossible for all but a tiny fraction of the population.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
Plastic surgery? Fine. Looking good is a fucking blessing and it's bigoted to deny that to people who lost the genetic lottery.
The one thing that does worry me is people taking the decision too lightly. In Spain there are adverts for PS all over the place. I gather that's the same in at least some parts of the USA? I think that's idiotic. Too many people will default to it without fully thinking it through. And not enough people learn to live with their imperfections. If you don't master that (I mean, I have this weird rib thing...), then how are you going to come to terms with yourself as a person?
So, yes in general, especially yes if really unlucky, but unenthusiastic about casual PS for small imperfections and decisions made for bad reasons.