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Apple released two new iPod Shuffles with an even smaller design today. The updates were predicted at the very last minute this morning.
The new 4GB devices are priced at $79 and can hold up to 1000 songs. These new iPod Shuffles adopt a more vertical shape than the previous model, but are smaller overall. The previous generation iPod shuffles remain available for purchase.
Apple also added a new "VoiceOver" feature that allows the iPod shuffle to speak your sing titles, arists and playlist names. All of the controls are located on the earphone cord.More details are available on Apple's iPod Shuffle section of their website.
I will never buy this version. The simple fact is that you cannot control it without the inline controls on the apple headphones, and apple headphones have shitty quality. Otherwise I really like it, but fuck apple, you can't even put any controls on it at all?
Seriously. That pisses me off. Let me control the player while still using headphones that don't sound like ass.
I will never buy this version. The simple fact is that you cannot control it without the inline controls on the apple headphones, and apple headphones have shitty quality. Otherwise I really like it, but fuck apple, you can't even put any controls on it at all?
Seriously. That pisses me off. Let me control the player while still using headphones that don't sound like ass.
If I know third party companies and their obsessiveness with accessories, I fully expect to see some sort of adapter by the end of the month.
iPods and Young People Have Utterly Destroyed Music
You know how most people are perfectly happy with Apple standard-issue earbuds, white plastic molded around a crappy audio experience? A Stanford professor's informal annual study shows that youngins like the "sizzle sounds" of MP3s.
Each year, Stanford Professor of Music Jonathan Berger does an informal test of his students by playing a bunch of different music in a bunch of different formats. Over email, here's how he told me performs the informal study:
Students were asked to judge the quality of a variety of compression methods randomly mixed with uncompressed 44.1 KHz audio. The music examples included both orchestral, jazz and rock music. When I first did this I was expecting to hear preferences for uncompressed audio and expecting to see MP3 (at 128, 160 and 192 bit rates) well below other methods (including a proprietary wavelet-based approach and AAC). To my surprise, in the rock examples the MP3 at 128 was preferred. I repeated the experiment over 6 years and found the preference for MP3 - particularly in music with high energy (cymbal crashes, brass hits, etc) rising over time.
In other words, younger people haven't just grown more tolerant of thin, soulless MP3 renditions of their favorite music, they actually like them. Shitty MP3s, even. O'Relly Radar quotes Professor Berger as saying that it's the "sizzle sounds" that people are loving because it's what they're comfortable with. So, yes Virginia, iPods really have killed music. People aren't just ignorant of high quality audio, they actually hate it. Gee, thanks for contributing to the downfall of civilization, Apple. Music is dead, everyone, carry on. [O'Reilly Radar, Image:Beard Papa/Flickr]
I will never buy this version. The simple fact is that you cannot control it without the inline controls on the apple headphones, and apple headphones have shitty quality. Otherwise I really like it, but fuck apple, you can't even put any controls on it at all?
Seriously. That pisses me off. Let me control the player while still using headphones that don't sound like ass.
If I know third party companies and their obsessiveness with accessories, I fully expect to see some sort of adapter by the end of the month.
Yea but then you have a dongle, which will increase headphone length, or special headphones with the controls in them, which means a new set.
I have an iPod touch, a 1GB 2nd gen shuffle, and an 80GB classic that normally sits in my car. I have $100 earbuds that I spent weeks shopping for, and I want to be able to plug them in to every device I have, and still be able to control the device.
I will never buy this version. The simple fact is that you cannot control it without the inline controls on the apple headphones, and apple headphones have shitty quality. Otherwise I really like it, but fuck apple, you can't even put any controls on it at all?
Seriously. That pisses me off. Let me control the player while still using headphones that don't sound like ass.
If I know third party companies and their obsessiveness with accessories, I fully expect to see some sort of adapter by the end of the month.
Yea but then you have a dongle, which will increase headphone length, or special headphones with the controls in them, which means a new set.
I have an iPod touch, a 1GB 2nd gen shuffle, and an 80GB classic that normally sits in my car. I have $100 earbuds that I spent weeks shopping for, and I want to be able to plug them in to every device I have, and still be able to control the device.
Still, to be fair, if you hate the Apple earbuds, this probably isn't the product for you. It's all about compactness and portability. You're not gonna be walking around wearing the big astronaut headphones with this thing.
I will never buy this version. The simple fact is that you cannot control it without the inline controls on the apple headphones, and apple headphones have shitty quality. Otherwise I really like it, but fuck apple, you can't even put any controls on it at all?
Seriously. That pisses me off. Let me control the player while still using headphones that don't sound like ass.
If I know third party companies and their obsessiveness with accessories, I fully expect to see some sort of adapter by the end of the month.
Yea but then you have a dongle, which will increase headphone length, or special headphones with the controls in them, which means a new set.
I have an iPod touch, a 1GB 2nd gen shuffle, and an 80GB classic that normally sits in my car. I have $100 earbuds that I spent weeks shopping for, and I want to be able to plug them in to every device I have, and still be able to control the device.
Still, to be fair, if you hate the Apple earbuds, this probably isn't the product for you. It's all about compactness and portability. You're not gonna be walking around wearing the big astronaut headphones with this thing.
oh man, I can see the accessory now. Astronaut headphones with a built in spot for the iPod shuffle. Either the greatest, or the worst thing ever.
I will never buy this version. The simple fact is that you cannot control it without the inline controls on the apple headphones, and apple headphones have shitty quality. Otherwise I really like it, but fuck apple, you can't even put any controls on it at all?
Seriously. That pisses me off. Let me control the player while still using headphones that don't sound like ass.
If I know third party companies and their obsessiveness with accessories, I fully expect to see some sort of adapter by the end of the month.
iPods and Young People Have Utterly Destroyed Music
You know how most people are perfectly happy with Apple standard-issue earbuds, white plastic molded around a crappy audio experience? A Stanford professor's informal annual study shows that youngins like the "sizzle sounds" of MP3s.
Each year, Stanford Professor of Music Jonathan Berger does an informal test of his students by playing a bunch of different music in a bunch of different formats. Over email, here's how he told me performs the informal study:
Students were asked to judge the quality of a variety of compression methods randomly mixed with uncompressed 44.1 KHz audio. The music examples included both orchestral, jazz and rock music. When I first did this I was expecting to hear preferences for uncompressed audio and expecting to see MP3 (at 128, 160 and 192 bit rates) well below other methods (including a proprietary wavelet-based approach and AAC). To my surprise, in the rock examples the MP3 at 128 was preferred. I repeated the experiment over 6 years and found the preference for MP3 - particularly in music with high energy (cymbal crashes, brass hits, etc) rising over time.
In other words, younger people haven't just grown more tolerant of thin, soulless MP3 renditions of their favorite music, they actually like them. Shitty MP3s, even. O'Relly Radar quotes Professor Berger as saying that it's the "sizzle sounds" that people are loving because it's what they're comfortable with. So, yes Virginia, iPods really have killed music. People aren't just ignorant of high quality audio, they actually hate it. Gee, thanks for contributing to the downfall of civilization, Apple. Music is dead, everyone, carry on. [O'Reilly Radar, Image:Beard Papa/Flickr]
Is he serious that peeved about this? I felt my neckbeard grow a tad just reading that.
I love how tiny it is. I had a 2G shuffle but the 1GB limit was a bit hard to swallow, so I ended up giving it to my sister when I got my iPod Touch with the educational deal back last June.
And the iPod Touch is nice, but the screen is getting scratched to hell (I do have a screen protector, but frankly I'm afraid to see if any of the scratches have been deep enough to penetrate it.) and it's overly large to deal with.
So it'll be nice to have something tiny that I don't have to worry about breaking or scratching easily.
Edit: Just saw on the site it's available Thursday. *twitch*
Oh well, maybe I'll wait a week or two after all. I can imagine that they'll be hard to come by at first anyway.
Is he serious that peeved about this? I felt my neckbeard grow a tad just reading that.
If I was a sound guy, I know I'd be pissed if people were starting to prefer their audio have compression artifacts in it.
Every bit of research in sound recording done in the past century has been trying to eliminate errors, making the experience more "real". And some professor discovers people don't like realism? I can sympathize with the dismay.
All of the controls are located on the earphone cord.
That's A-Grade bullshit right there. Even if they weren't shitty, shitty quality, I can't use Apple's ear buds because they don't stay in my ear unless I really jam them in there, which is then painful.
All of the controls are located on the earphone cord.
That's A-Grade bullshit right there. Even if they weren't shitty, shitty quality, I can't use Apple's ear buds because they don't stay in my ear unless I really jam them in there, which is then painful.
They have in ear headphones with the inline remote that is supposed to be half decent, but that's an $80 headphone for an $80 player.
honestly, I do like the form factor, if the controls were on the device, at $100 canuckistan dollars for 4GB I'd probably buy it. i have a 2nd gen shuffle that gets probably a couple of hours a use a week for me. This would be a nice upgrade if it had controls on the player.
Is he serious that peeved about this? I felt my neckbeard grow a tad just reading that.
If I was a sound guy, I know I'd be pissed if people were starting to prefer their audio have compression artifacts in it.
Every bit of research in sound recording done in the past century has been trying to eliminate errors, making the experience more "real". And some professor discovers people don't like realism? I can sympathize with the dismay.
When it's processed and autotuned to oblivion, a few artifacts here and there add some character.
I don't understand the appeal of the shuffle over a Sansa Clip or something similar. You're paying more for... what?
Fats on
0
KalTorakOne way or another, they all end up inthe Undercity.Registered Userregular
Man...I'm not a fan of Apple at the best of times, but this seems really short-sighted. I have a great set of headphones, and i like useing them in any kind of player. But not being physicaly able to press PLAY without the special earphones? 3 buttons is not hard. Play/pause, next, previous, it's not huge.
This just shows, to me, that Apple is more concerned with form than function.
Man...I'm not a fan of Apple at the best of times, but this seems really short-sighted. I have a great set of headphones, and i like useing them in any kind of player. But not being physicaly able to press PLAY without the special earphones? 3 buttons is not hard. Play/pause, next, previous, it's not huge.
This just shows, to me, that Apple is more concerned with form than function.
When did this become news to you?
Sometimes apple hits one out of the park. I love the design of the unibody macbooks(just need to drop the price). think the iMacs are beautiful computers. Love the apple keyboards.
But then they go and fuck up every so often, like the mighty mouse and the 3rd gen Shuffle. Or the Macbook Air.
Or the Macintosh LC, Performa 5200, System 7.5, OS 8...
And I'm an apple fan .
I was excited till I heard about the inline control thing too. I have good intra-aurals and no urge to (further) damage my hearing.
I do think Apple's shitty shitty headphones are, in one way, one of their great successes. Who'd have thought that all it takes to turn regular shitty headphones into popular shitty headphones is the colour white? Not me.
Argh, like other people have said, if it didn't have the damn control integrated into Apple's shitty headphones then I would buy this.
As it is, the Apple headphones just don't work properly when I commute due to background noise, I need sound-excluding in-ear thingys. So this is almost, but not quite, purchasable.
Now, if Apple were to just put a 3.5 mm jack on the controls... (Either that or some home surgery?)
Argh, like other people have said, if it didn't have the damn control integrated into Apple's shitty headphones then I would buy this.
As it is, the Apple headphones just don't work properly when I commute due to background noise, I need sound-excluding in-ear thingys. So this is almost, but not quite, purchasable.
Now, if Apple were to just put a 3.5 mm jack on the controls... (Either that or some home surgery?)
well what you're going to see I'm sure is a $20 dongle from apple with the controls that you can plug regular headphones into.
KalTorakOne way or another, they all end up inthe Undercity.Registered Userregular
edited March 2009
Maybe Apple is hoping their little headphone cord doohicky is going to become a universal feature on every pair of headphones. Heck, I really like the idea of the headphone cord doohicky, but Apple is tripping over itself trying to push a headstart here or something.
I don't understand the appeal of the shuffle over a Sansa Clip or something similar. You're paying more for... what?
For the brand.
Same with any iPod (other than possibly the touch)
The brand is a major factor, yes. But the wheel on the ipod is still my favorite method of controlling a device this small, and until they screw that up, I'll be an ipod person.
Not relevant for this new shuffle though. You couldn't pay me to use the thing.
I don't understand the appeal of the shuffle over a Sansa Clip or something similar. You're paying more for... what?
For the brand.
Same with any iPod (other than possibly the touch)
The brand is a major factor, yes. But the wheel on the ipod is still my favorite method of controlling a device this small, and until they screw that up, I'll be an ipod person.
Not relevant for this new shuffle though. You couldn't pay me to use the thing.
personally I find the wheel to be a hassle
to each their own, though
Evander on
0
Mike Danger"Diane..."a place both wonderful and strangeRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
What I found even more disappointing about this was the VoiceOver thing. I watched the video expecting something sleek and cool like the computer in a sci-fi movie, and it's just that generic AppleTalk voice.
I would consider getting one. Right now I'm using a giant Creative player, and it would be nice to carry around something smaller, but I don't want to use their headphones.
I guess I'll just wait until my phone contract runs out in August and pick up an iPhone.
Nimble Cat on
0
KalTorakOne way or another, they all end up inthe Undercity.Registered Userregular
What I found even more disappointing about this was the VoiceOver thing. I watched the video expecting something sleek and cool like the computer in a sci-fi movie, and it's just that generic AppleTalk voice.
I've only heard the AppleTalk voice once, when I set my clock to tell me what it was 10 pm, then forgot about it. I'm lying in bed reading later on and hear this sly, smooth voice go "It's ten o'clock..." It sounded like my computer was trying to seduce me.
That was a little too sleek and cool for me...
KalTorak on
0
Mike Danger"Diane..."a place both wonderful and strangeRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
Whoa, what? My AppleTalk voice is just the boring Microsoft Sam-ish one (I am pretty certain it was used for AUTO's voice in WALL-E as well)
Whoa, what? My AppleTalk voice is just the boring Microsoft Sam-ish one (I am pretty certain it was used for AUTO's voice in WALL-E as well)
What version you using? Alex in leopard is surprisingly decent.
I really like 'Cellos' and 'Pipe Organ'. I think it's because the hint of melody and effect processing helps conceal the glitches as it pieces together syllables.
I don't understand the appeal of the shuffle over a Sansa Clip or something similar. You're paying more for... what?
For the brand.
Same with any iPod (other than possibly the touch)
That's the thing, all the other iPods have interesting features, but the shuffle has nothing to offer. It's like buying a Ferrari branded towel. Given the form factor, they could at least make it waterproof and market it to runners or something.
I don't understand the appeal of the shuffle over a Sansa Clip or something similar. You're paying more for... what?
For the brand.
Same with any iPod (other than possibly the touch)
That's the thing, all the other iPods have interesting features, but the shuffle has nothing to offer. It's like buying a Ferrari branded towel. Given the form factor, they could at least make it waterproof and market it to runners or something.
Well it's tiny, clips on, is idiot-proof, resilient, has a long lasting battery, can live in my pocket and doesn't need looking at to use, and works with iTunes. Looks pretty too, even if my 'red' one is kind of pink. Also, it was fairly cheap.
That was the attraction to me.
Cheap was quite an important factor there. The new one, at £59, plus whatever raping Apple decides is appropriate for the external controls so I can use proper headphones, puts me off buying it.
Well it's tiny, clips on, is idiot-proof, resilient, has a long lasting battery, can live in my pocket and doesn't need looking at to use, and works with iTunes. Looks pretty too, even if my 'red' one is kind of pink. Also, it was fairly cheap.
That was the attraction to me.
Cheap was quite an important factor there. The new one, at £59, plus whatever raping Apple decides is appropriate for the external controls so I can use proper headphones, puts me off buying it.
I agree; I bought a shuffle last year when I started trying to run again, and it worked perfectly for that function (until I left it in my pocket and it had a wonderous adventure in the washing machine and drier).
However, I also think this is a terrible idea, at least for me - I like the ipod headphones for normal use, but for running they bounce out of my ears within 30 seconds, so I've always needed to use bigger around-ear ones for running.
I don't understand the appeal of the shuffle over a Sansa Clip or something similar. You're paying more for... what?
For the brand.
Same with any iPod (other than possibly the touch)
That's the thing, all the other iPods have interesting features, but the shuffle has nothing to offer. It's like buying a Ferrari branded towel. Given the form factor, they could at least make it waterproof and market it to runners or something.
Well it's tiny, clips on, is idiot-proof, resilient, has a long lasting battery, can live in my pocket and doesn't need looking at to use, and works with iTunes. Looks pretty too, even if my 'red' one is kind of pink. Also, it was fairly cheap.
That was the attraction to me.
Cheap was quite an important factor there. The new one, at £59, plus whatever raping Apple decides is appropriate for the external controls so I can use proper headphones, puts me off buying it.
To be? Lack of screen is the best thing. I love my iPod Touch because I'm afraid to take it anywhere because eventually I'm gonna drop the damn thing and it's gonna go from an iPod Touch to a iPod Shatter'd.
Not to mention I accidently carry it in the pocket with my keys way too often and that doesn't end well.
And to answer this entire page of questions, the best thing about the iPod is how fucking awesome iTunes is.
When you have some godawful sansa, or some offbrand chinese MP3 player, you don't get the ease of use that iTunes offers.
Holy jeez. There's only ONE CONTROL BUTTON. (Single click: play/pause. Double click: next song. Triple click: previous song. Click+hold: "Say" artist and track. Click+hold until a tone: Cycle through playlists.)
Controls on the earbuds is kind of annoying but not the end of the world for me personally, but good god, that control scheme would drive me absolutely bonkers within minutes of trying to use the thing.
Sometimes I think I must be the only person who hates itunes. I just want to double click a folder, and add music or delete music that resides in that folder, and I want that folder to be the music that my mp3 player plays. Is that so wrong? Does that make me a bad person?
Sometimes I think I must be the only person who hates itunes. I just want to double click a folder, and add music or delete music that resides in that folder, and I want that folder to be the music that my mp3 player plays. Is that so wrong? Does that make me a bad person?
I use songbird out of my seething hatred of itunes.
Also, while I'm in this thread:
I understand why its shiny and everything, but 80 dollars for a 4 gb player with one button on a proprietary cord with no screen is dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb..
Posts
Seriously. That pisses me off. Let me control the player while still using headphones that don't sound like ass.
If I know third party companies and their obsessiveness with accessories, I fully expect to see some sort of adapter by the end of the month.
That being said:
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
Yea but then you have a dongle, which will increase headphone length, or special headphones with the controls in them, which means a new set.
I have an iPod touch, a 1GB 2nd gen shuffle, and an 80GB classic that normally sits in my car. I have $100 earbuds that I spent weeks shopping for, and I want to be able to plug them in to every device I have, and still be able to control the device.
Still, to be fair, if you hate the Apple earbuds, this probably isn't the product for you. It's all about compactness and portability. You're not gonna be walking around wearing the big astronaut headphones with this thing.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
oh man, I can see the accessory now. Astronaut headphones with a built in spot for the iPod shuffle. Either the greatest, or the worst thing ever.
Is he serious that peeved about this? I felt my neckbeard grow a tad just reading that.
I love how tiny it is. I had a 2G shuffle but the 1GB limit was a bit hard to swallow, so I ended up giving it to my sister when I got my iPod Touch with the educational deal back last June.
And the iPod Touch is nice, but the screen is getting scratched to hell (I do have a screen protector, but frankly I'm afraid to see if any of the scratches have been deep enough to penetrate it.) and it's overly large to deal with.
So it'll be nice to have something tiny that I don't have to worry about breaking or scratching easily.
Edit: Just saw on the site it's available Thursday. *twitch*
Oh well, maybe I'll wait a week or two after all. I can imagine that they'll be hard to come by at first anyway.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
If I was a sound guy, I know I'd be pissed if people were starting to prefer their audio have compression artifacts in it.
Every bit of research in sound recording done in the past century has been trying to eliminate errors, making the experience more "real". And some professor discovers people don't like realism? I can sympathize with the dismay.
That's A-Grade bullshit right there. Even if they weren't shitty, shitty quality, I can't use Apple's ear buds because they don't stay in my ear unless I really jam them in there, which is then painful.
They have in ear headphones with the inline remote that is supposed to be half decent, but that's an $80 headphone for an $80 player.
honestly, I do like the form factor, if the controls were on the device, at $100 canuckistan dollars for 4GB I'd probably buy it. i have a 2nd gen shuffle that gets probably a couple of hours a use a week for me. This would be a nice upgrade if it had controls on the player.
When it's processed and autotuned to oblivion, a few artifacts here and there add some character.
I don't understand the appeal of the shuffle over a Sansa Clip or something similar. You're paying more for... what?
yes.
This just shows, to me, that Apple is more concerned with form than function.
FTC: HONK.
PAX Prime 2014 Resistance Tournament Winner
When did this become news to you?
Sometimes apple hits one out of the park. I love the design of the unibody macbooks(just need to drop the price). think the iMacs are beautiful computers. Love the apple keyboards.
But then they go and fuck up every so often, like the mighty mouse and the 3rd gen Shuffle. Or the Macbook Air.
And I'm an apple fan .
I was excited till I heard about the inline control thing too. I have good intra-aurals and no urge to (further) damage my hearing.
I do think Apple's shitty shitty headphones are, in one way, one of their great successes. Who'd have thought that all it takes to turn regular shitty headphones into popular shitty headphones is the colour white? Not me.
As it is, the Apple headphones just don't work properly when I commute due to background noise, I need sound-excluding in-ear thingys. So this is almost, but not quite, purchasable.
Now, if Apple were to just put a 3.5 mm jack on the controls... (Either that or some home surgery?)
well what you're going to see I'm sure is a $20 dongle from apple with the controls that you can plug regular headphones into.
For the brand.
Same with any iPod (other than possibly the touch)
The brand is a major factor, yes. But the wheel on the ipod is still my favorite method of controlling a device this small, and until they screw that up, I'll be an ipod person.
Not relevant for this new shuffle though. You couldn't pay me to use the thing.
personally I find the wheel to be a hassle
to each their own, though
I guess I'll just wait until my phone contract runs out in August and pick up an iPhone.
I've only heard the AppleTalk voice once, when I set my clock to tell me what it was 10 pm, then forgot about it. I'm lying in bed reading later on and hear this sly, smooth voice go "It's ten o'clock..." It sounded like my computer was trying to seduce me.
That was a little too sleek and cool for me...
What version you using? Alex in leopard is surprisingly decent.
I really like 'Cellos' and 'Pipe Organ'. I think it's because the hint of melody and effect processing helps conceal the glitches as it pieces together syllables.
That's the thing, all the other iPods have interesting features, but the shuffle has nothing to offer. It's like buying a Ferrari branded towel. Given the form factor, they could at least make it waterproof and market it to runners or something.
Well it's tiny, clips on, is idiot-proof, resilient, has a long lasting battery, can live in my pocket and doesn't need looking at to use, and works with iTunes. Looks pretty too, even if my 'red' one is kind of pink. Also, it was fairly cheap.
That was the attraction to me.
Cheap was quite an important factor there. The new one, at £59, plus whatever raping Apple decides is appropriate for the external controls so I can use proper headphones, puts me off buying it.
I agree; I bought a shuffle last year when I started trying to run again, and it worked perfectly for that function (until I left it in my pocket and it had a wonderous adventure in the washing machine and drier).
However, I also think this is a terrible idea, at least for me - I like the ipod headphones for normal use, but for running they bounce out of my ears within 30 seconds, so I've always needed to use bigger around-ear ones for running.
To be? Lack of screen is the best thing. I love my iPod Touch because I'm afraid to take it anywhere because eventually I'm gonna drop the damn thing and it's gonna go from an iPod Touch to a iPod Shatter'd.
Not to mention I accidently carry it in the pocket with my keys way too often and that doesn't end well.
And to answer this entire page of questions, the best thing about the iPod is how fucking awesome iTunes is.
When you have some godawful sansa, or some offbrand chinese MP3 player, you don't get the ease of use that iTunes offers.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
Controls on the earbuds is kind of annoying but not the end of the world for me personally, but good god, that control scheme would drive me absolutely bonkers within minutes of trying to use the thing.
All I'm saying is that I don't see the appeal of the shuffle in the small, cheap MP3 player market. The iPod/iTunes ecosystem in general is great.
Hidden feature: Find songs directly by clicking the title out in morse code.
Hahaha! Excellent :^:
I use songbird out of my seething hatred of itunes.
Also, while I'm in this thread:
I understand why its shiny and everything, but 80 dollars for a 4 gb player with one button on a proprietary cord with no screen is dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb..
GT: Tanky the Tank
Black: 1377 6749 7425