Quick Legal Question - Good Samaritan Law? Warning about a pedo? Wall o' Text
Sheep
Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
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Run down:
My girlfriend got into a shouting match with her sister. Basically, her sister is a pretty shitty person. They've never gotten along. Her sister had a pretty rough childhood and that affected how sister treated girlfriend when they were younger.
So, they don't really speak. They exchange snipes from time to time, but it never reached boiling point. Until recently. Girlfriend made a comment on her blog that sister misconstrued to be about her. It wasn't. But oh well.
Sister and girlfriend get in shouting match over phone, sister's boyfriend makes physical threats against girlfriend, I told sister's boyfriend that I don't care to get involved with this at all, and that I better not hear of any physical threats being made.
There's a pretty solid reason to believe that sister's boyfriend is sexually abusing sister's two children. There's no absolute proof, but the evidence is pretty strong and is corroborated by several family members that are relatively estranged from the sister. Basically, when a 4 year old girl starts talking about how things hurt and people touching her, well, it's pretty safe to draw conclusions.
Anyway... Girlfriend pretty much tells sister that she wants nothing to do with the sister and that she's a horrible person for letting her boyfriend get away with what he's doing, and some goading of the boyfriend takes place. Phone call ends.
Later that night, sister makes a paranoia fueled Facebook post basically claiming that her estranged family are the ones responsible, and this is all a conspiracy against her. Me included. Even though I've only been in the picture for about 7 months. So, girlfriend makes a retaliatory post on her blog. Things go quiet for about two weeks. Figured it was over. We were told to never call sister again. Even though we never do.
Well, this past Saturday, sister's boyfriend's father starts calling girlfriends mom and making legal threats over the blog post. Why, I dunno. He has no dog in this fight and neither does girlfriend's mom. He starts calling girlfriends phone and leaving voice mails. Cordial. He's not being a dick or anything, but she doesn't want to talk to any of them. She was serious when she said, "I want nothing to do with you or your family." Since leaving voice mails costs us money, I call the guy and tell him to stop calling, that we want nothing to do with it. He tries to tell me how things started, when I was there. I just informed him that things got out of hand after they made the physical threats and after they made the offending blog post. The guy starts getting flustered and starts stuttering and then tells me he'll see me in court. For the record, I was nothing but respectful. Yes sir, no sir, etc. The only thing that could be misconstrued as being out of hand was basically me interrupting taking over the conversation and telling him how things actually happened.
So, the guy hangs up. About 45 minutes later he calls back and asks if my parents own a certain business. I say yes sir and he hangs up. I figured he might try to harass my parents about it, so I call and let them know what's going on. My parents are classy people. Dad just tells me to not bother with him and that they'll just call the police and their lawyer if he shows up.
Another 45 minutes pass and he calls back and asks for my parents number. I tell him I've already informed my parents and that they don't care to speak with him as none of what is going on is any of their business. Guy says he'll go by and speak with them today.
So. Backstory is out of the way. I'm just curious. There is solid reason to believe that the boyfriend is a pedo. Would this be covered under Good Samaritan laws?
I'm not worried in the slightest about a court case. If they hire a lawyer to draft up a cease and desist letter, then maybe we'll pull the blog post. If we do have to appear in court, we'll probably go, make a statement, and have child services there as well.
I just think it's weird. No one that knows these people read the blog. Taking it to court and getting it attention isn't the best way to go about it. But, you know, rednecks.
My girlfriend got into a shouting match with her sister. Basically, her sister is a pretty shitty person. They've never gotten along. Her sister had a pretty rough childhood and that affected how sister treated girlfriend when they were younger.
So, they don't really speak. They exchange snipes from time to time, but it never reached boiling point. Until recently. Girlfriend made a comment on her blog that sister misconstrued to be about her. It wasn't. But oh well.
Sister and girlfriend get in shouting match over phone, sister's boyfriend makes physical threats against girlfriend, I told sister's boyfriend that I don't care to get involved with this at all, and that I better not hear of any physical threats being made.
There's a pretty solid reason to believe that sister's boyfriend is sexually abusing sister's two children. There's no absolute proof, but the evidence is pretty strong and is corroborated by several family members that are relatively estranged from the sister. Basically, when a 4 year old girl starts talking about how things hurt and people touching her, well, it's pretty safe to draw conclusions.
Anyway... Girlfriend pretty much tells sister that she wants nothing to do with the sister and that she's a horrible person for letting her boyfriend get away with what he's doing, and some goading of the boyfriend takes place. Phone call ends.
Later that night, sister makes a paranoia fueled Facebook post basically claiming that her estranged family are the ones responsible, and this is all a conspiracy against her. Me included. Even though I've only been in the picture for about 7 months. So, girlfriend makes a retaliatory post on her blog. Things go quiet for about two weeks. Figured it was over. We were told to never call sister again. Even though we never do.
Well, this past Saturday, sister's boyfriend's father starts calling girlfriends mom and making legal threats over the blog post. Why, I dunno. He has no dog in this fight and neither does girlfriend's mom. He starts calling girlfriends phone and leaving voice mails. Cordial. He's not being a dick or anything, but she doesn't want to talk to any of them. She was serious when she said, "I want nothing to do with you or your family." Since leaving voice mails costs us money, I call the guy and tell him to stop calling, that we want nothing to do with it. He tries to tell me how things started, when I was there. I just informed him that things got out of hand after they made the physical threats and after they made the offending blog post. The guy starts getting flustered and starts stuttering and then tells me he'll see me in court. For the record, I was nothing but respectful. Yes sir, no sir, etc. The only thing that could be misconstrued as being out of hand was basically me interrupting taking over the conversation and telling him how things actually happened.
So, the guy hangs up. About 45 minutes later he calls back and asks if my parents own a certain business. I say yes sir and he hangs up. I figured he might try to harass my parents about it, so I call and let them know what's going on. My parents are classy people. Dad just tells me to not bother with him and that they'll just call the police and their lawyer if he shows up.
Another 45 minutes pass and he calls back and asks for my parents number. I tell him I've already informed my parents and that they don't care to speak with him as none of what is going on is any of their business. Guy says he'll go by and speak with them today.
So. Backstory is out of the way. I'm just curious. There is solid reason to believe that the boyfriend is a pedo. Would this be covered under Good Samaritan laws?
I'm not worried in the slightest about a court case. If they hire a lawyer to draft up a cease and desist letter, then maybe we'll pull the blog post. If we do have to appear in court, we'll probably go, make a statement, and have child services there as well.
I just think it's weird. No one that knows these people read the blog. Taking it to court and getting it attention isn't the best way to go about it. But, you know, rednecks.
Sheep on
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The blog post is basically the guys picture with "KEEP YOUR CHILDREN AWAY". Since there's a good reason to believe this to be true, would this be covered under Good Samaritan laws?
The sister has already been investigated once. Part of her bad childhood was being molested by her father, who she routinely left her daughters with. There wasn't enough evidence to file charges.
Report it again, tell them about how the kid is complaining about how someone is hurting her parts.
I think Child Protection Services may have more power than you think. If you are worried about the safety of the child then I would look in to what they are able to do, especially if you have as strong evidence as you say.
The fact that your fiancée posted that without undeniable proof is worrisome. IANAL of course, but this seems like defamation of character to me without proof, even if you think all signs point to it.
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I just really don't want to have to pay for any court costs. Making this thread was just a feeler out for information. My normal legal consul often goes to Oscar Zeta Acosta type of excess and I'm not surprised whenever he disappears for a week or so.
Being a Good Samaritan would involve informing Child Protective services and the police if you feel actual physical abuse is taking place. You say the sister was investigated, but you said nothing about whether or not the boyfriend was. Without taking any actual steps to protect these kids, it seems to me you and your girlfriend are simply trying to attack them, then claim some dubious high ground you don't deserve.
The facebook thing? I mean sure it's slander/libel, but no more so than saying it at a party or event. The problem comes in when it affects their day to day lives or getting a job. If you said something so damaging (that was a lie) that the person couldn't go shopping or the likes, they could probably effectively sue you. Saying "You're a pedo" to someone on a website probably isn't much of anything.
You'd probably be protected just from that. But sic child services on them hard this time, really hard. Have multiple family members report the issue.
You all are not trying to "THINK OF THE CHILDREN" when you're posting petty, possibly false, shit on the internet. If you were really looking out for them you would be getting child services to go after the boyfriend to try to get some proof that what you THINK is going on is actually going on.
Grow up, take lame internet stuff down, cut them from your life completely. If you really want to help the kids, call child services some more.
The post isn't necessary and isn't protected under any Samaritan laws. I could be construed as slander and therefore could go either way in any legal battle. I would get rid of it, you never know they may not have printed it out yet.
If you want to be a good Samaritan call social services on them and recommend to anyone whom has had the similar interactions with him or the kids to do the same.
Who are you trying to communicate to with your blog post? Police? Friends? Or just be kind of a dick because you don't like the guy or you think he's an asshole? I mean, your approach is kind of like trying to get in a fight with a dude behind a bar, instead of going to an authority figure.
No it's not.
It's pretty close to libel actually, as you have no hard evidence, since the guy has neverbeen investigaged and no proof has been show up.
Someone needs to grow up and take down the post. If you're truly concerned for the children call Child Protective services.
If you're not sure enough to report him, take that rubbish of facebook.
I can't know what your definition of "pretty solid reason" is, but I'd not use that wording unless I was at a stage where I would think about maybe taking it further than the great tribunal of facebook.
Basically, if it didin't start with "I was walking by and I saw a stranger..." it's going to be a reach.
Also, 4 year olds are terrible witnesses. I know a four year old who was just a few days ago telling me Iron Man was sick, and another that thinks "space" is where you ice skate, and another one that thinks I'm black because I'm big, and he's heard the phrase "big black guy" over and over from his redneck mother.
That's just fantasy, divorced of their desire to explore and/or please - if you ask a kid a question in an even slightly leading way, you can produce a desired answer. That's why there are entire fields of study in properly deposing kids for legal purposes.
Also, if I was dating a girl, and she got in some bonkers-ass girlfight with her sister, and her sister's boyfriend posted I was a pedophile on facebook, I'd be almost literally fit to murder you. If you look at it from how pissed the guy should be if he's innocent, he's acting pretty mildly. You don't get to post something up for a guy's friends and neighbors calling him a pedophile and then go "that's it, that's the last word, I'm not picking up the phone"
That's a fucked up thing to do, actually.
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That kid is SAYING SOMEONE IS TOUCHING HER!!! AND YOU'RE WORRIED ABOUT A FUCKING BLOG??
Pull your collective head out and get in touch with child services so they can talk to the kid. Worrying about being sued for libel while a child is potentially being molested is fucking sad. Seriously, this makes me sad.
How in the world would that make you a good samaritan? It just makes you an asshole, because either you don't actually think this guy is a pedophile and you're making shit up, or you do actually think this guy is a pedophile and all you're doing about it is posting on the internet.
Take down the libelous blog post (because it is absolutely libel), and either report him to CPS or just stop talking to him entirely.
DO
THAT
NOW
Just cause I'm a nice guy, I'd like to point out that Sheep didn't post the pic of girlfriend's sister's boyfriend the alleged pedo on face book. Sheep's GF did. Still wrong. Still should come down. Still should get in touch with CPS if you really do believe it to be the truth.
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If not, it seems to me you're adding fuel to the fire by being bitchy and petty towards this guy and trying to cover your ass with Good Samaritan laws which, by the way, would not cover defaming someone in a blog post.
Cause getting CPS called on you for no reason can not be fun, and if you're doing it to be vindictive can be grounds for a civil suit.
I spoke with her about taking it down, and she said she wouldn't. I can't force her, so I'm gonna do what it takes to support her in whatever way I can.
I'd highly suggest getting visibly and audibly involved with the "take it down" crowd. CYA and all.
Of course it's more complex than that. You can work out the details if you don't want to be involved in the nastiness.
This. When this thing goes to court, this is only going to hurt your GF.
IANAL, BTW.
So I gather you're going to be paying for her attorney? :eyeroll:
Yeah, okay, so this.
Follow the advice in the post I'm quoting, it's the best advice you're going to get on the topic. Also, distance yourself from this legally where ever it comes up. Get used to repeating this line: "I didn't post it and the post in question does not represent my opinion".
There's a good disincentive against the other party actually going to court, but at the same time, you don't want to be standing too closely by if summons start getting served.
CUZ THERE'S SOMETHING IN THE MIDDLE AND IT'S GIVING ME A RASH
Don't be stupid.
CUZ THERE'S SOMETHING IN THE MIDDLE AND IT'S GIVING ME A RASH
It was sarcasm.
this all feels spectacularly backwards. First off, if you think you might get in some legal trouble because of some needless libel on the internet, it's probably time to take that fucker down. What purpose does it even serve, other than to spark an argument?
Secondly, if this pedophilia shit is serious, there is something hideously wrong with letting it slide. You need to fucking get to the bottom of that.
If you are tied to that blog posting and he sues for libel, you might get held responsible by the judge and forced to pay up. Even if you are not judged to be responsible for libel, you will still very likely accrue substantial legal fees. That's where your risk lies.
CUZ THERE'S SOMETHING IN THE MIDDLE AND IT'S GIVING ME A RASH
What the hell? Seriously? You think posting unsubstantiated claims on a blog could possibly be legally protected? Are you crazy?
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Tell her that the blog post may make it harder to help her sister's kids. And that's what's important right? Not winning the arguement with her sister.
Right now the sister's boyfriend could just point out that any call to CPS as being part of a vindictive family fight. Which could cause CPS to ignore any future allegations.
Then you need to learn to read, because almost every post from the very beginning mentioned calling Child Protective Services.