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I'm at least partially serious with the question. Given that the Star Wars universe (or any other fictional universe, scifi or no) has a variety of seeming incompatibilities with ours, why should we assume we can predict how scenarios not depicted will work out? Out knowledge of the universe is, in strict terms, limited to official cannon, which is the closest we can get to unbiased observation.
But, as I've previously noted, Star Wars is at best a documentarian recreation of events, so who's to say its presentation of the Jedi is any more accurate than Homer's works or Caesar's notes on Celtic religion?
As a reader, we have two assumptions about a fictional universe we're reading about
1) Things work just as they do in our universe, unless specified otherwise.
2) Information given by the author/narrator is accurate.
To take your Star Wars example, canon has no information on how the Law of Gravity works in that universe. So we assume it does just as in ours. You can't have a story where the main characters are stuck in a pit, but get out because (hey we forgot to mention!) after a given depth below any planet's surface gravity reverses itself so the characters fall out of the hole!
And yes, it's possible that all the information we got about SW is biased, and the Jedi are really evil dictators and the Sith are noble freedom fighters. But again, this sudden reversal has to be hinted and forshadowed somehow. Maybe we're told that everything we read was written by Jedi, and includes mention of how the Jedi nobly disposed of defenseless evil widows clutching children while the Sith tried to stop them? But if the author doesn't hint anything like that, well it'd be like reaching the end of Episode III, after Anakin betrays the Jedi and turns to the Dark Side and slaughters the children in the Temple, and ending with "oh by the way the Jedi were really evil all along, so Anakin did the right thing. Thank you, good night". I'm sure you can see how that's a betrayal of the storyline and cheats the readers.
Richy on
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BobCescaIs a girlBirmingham, UKRegistered Userregular
I just read through some pages of the Old Republic MMO thread and apparently people are outraged that there will be jedis in their game. Also, Justinsane claims he finishes 40 hour games in one week.
I think it takes me a few months to finish a 40 hour game, assuming I don't start over half way through because I forgot what I was doing.
I beat KOTOR twice in a week and it's a 25 hour game.
And the TOR MMO thread is a bit retarded. People are arguing about how powerful Jedi should be in context of lore (when really, Jedi are as powerful as the plot dictates they be) and not in terms of game balance.
Do you just play a lot or just play fast?
And yea, that's the stupidest thing, people are already complaining that jedis will be overpowered. The game isn't even in alpha testing yet.
Both, really. I can marathon from the time I get home (4:30) to the time I go to bed (midnight) on the same game and not even notice. Because I only work 9-5 and have no other commitments, I have a lot of evening time to do stuff.
But I'm also fast at this stuff. I hate when games limit the pace I can move towards the end with needless bullshit. Good example, sticking with KOTOR, is the turrett minigame they "randomly" force you into. Fuckkkk you, I don't want to shoot fighters down with this slow ass fucking turrett. I just want to get to the next planet so I can kill some mans. It's completely pointless garbage.
And I don't see why the viewer/reader needs an indication that the story is a lie--if your story is meant to have some level of realism, why should I expect the narrator to betraythe tale on the last page?
Supposing, as you say, that the Jedi are evil, it would make far more sense if the films or whatever material they're based in would maintain the ruse throughout. They would evidently be propaganda, and propaganda has no interest in undermining itself or that which it advocates.
Ps: it's hopefully clear by now that my comment about nerds has not derogatory; since I'm doing the see thing myself.
Well that part of Half-Life 2 was significantly less boring
First of all, fufufufufufu.
Second, which part?
Ravenholm
Yes, that one is quite awesome. Slightly more awesome than the rest of Half-Life 2. I do not understand how you can think anything about Half-Life 2 is boring.
I guess your opinion is simply bad, whereas mine is correct.
Well that part of Half-Life 2 was significantly less boring
First of all, fufufufufufu.
Second, which part?
Ravenholm
Yes, that one is quite awesome. Slightly more awesome than the rest of Half-Life 2. I do not understand how you can think anything about Half-Life 2 is boring.
I guess your opinion is simply bad, whereas mine is correct.
last night I spent like 40 minutes zipping around a series of gray and brown tunnels in a boat with some difficulty making right turns
Shit, now I'm wondering how a jedi holds up against old fashioned bullets.
The only way is if their sabers somehow just melt bullets into nothingness.
Still, something like a vulcan cannon would utterly shred them, simply too many rounds in the air I would imagine.
This happens at the end of Ep. III when Ki-Adi Mundi is killed. The guy with the tall head. He can't deflect all the blaster fire because there's too much of it.
And according to your typical EU bullshit, slug rounds were an excellent method of killing Jedi because lightsabers can't stop them.
I would say Elendil's criticism of hl2 is also relevant because the player is forced to experience at least some of the tedium present in what we percive as an authentic universe, rather than constantly being presented with opponents as in many videogames.
Well that part of Half-Life 2 was significantly less boring
First of all, fufufufufufu.
Second, which part?
Ravenholm
Yes, that one is quite awesome. Slightly more awesome than the rest of Half-Life 2. I do not understand how you can think anything about Half-Life 2 is boring.
I guess your opinion is simply bad, whereas mine is correct.
last night I spent like 40 minutes zipping around a series of gray and brown tunnels in a boat with some difficulty making right turns
The fan boat section actually makes me motion sick.
I'd say my main complaint with the game are that it has these puzzles which are intended, I suppose, to make the game feel less linear than most shooters, but the game ends up being exactly as linear as every other FPS, just with more wandering around trying to figure out where the game wants you to go.
The puzzles are really contrived and artificial, too, which doesn't help.
I'd say my main complaint with the game are that it has these puzzles which are intended, I suppose, to make the game feel less linear than most shooters, but the game ends up being exactly as linear as every other FPS, just with more wandering around trying to figure out where the game wants you to go.
The puzzles are really contrived and artificial, too, which doesn't help.
I think they're mostly in to showcase what the engine can do, actually. Most of them boil down to 'push object X on button Y' anyway.
The only part I didn't like was having to ride the dumb hanging metal coffin/cocoon thing towards the end. If ever there was a time for a time-condensed cutsceen, that was it.
That should be another rule of games: if there's water, it should be pristine and beautiful. It needs to make me want to swim in it. I don't go through escapism to experience muddy brown water, or sewage or sludge.
I think the real question is why isn't everyone wearing shield belts?
'cos they attract the worms and drive them into a frenzy.
FakeEDIT: shit. wrong sci-fi extravaganza. carry on.
Dune was fucking awesome about shields. Dune shields are badass shields because they form a huge part of why stuff works in that world the way it does. Because shields are pretty badass anyway and would obviously have huge ramifications.
It's been years since I've read any Dune books, but that was the one where shooting an active shield would cause a huge nuclear-scale explosion or something? Or is that a different series?
I'd say my main complaint with the game are that it has these puzzles which are intended, I suppose, to make the game feel less linear than most shooters, but the game ends up being exactly as linear as every other FPS, just with more wandering around trying to figure out where the game wants you to go.
The puzzles are really contrived and artificial, too, which doesn't help.
I think they're mostly in to showcase what the engine can do, actually. Most of them boil down to 'push object X on button Y' anyway.
My favorite ones are those that can only be attributed to divine intervention
Gordon gets stuck in a real pickle, only for some ridiculously unlikely occurrence to blow open a grate/give him a ramp to freeeeedooooom
It's been years since I've read any Dune books, but that was the one where shooting an active shield would cause a huge nuclear-scale explosion or something? Or is that a different series?
Lasgun + shield = kaboom.
Echo on
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HonkHonk is this poster.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
I'd say my main complaint with the game are that it has these puzzles which are intended, I suppose, to make the game feel less linear than most shooters, but the game ends up being exactly as linear as every other FPS, just with more wandering around trying to figure out where the game wants you to go.
The puzzles are really contrived and artificial, too, which doesn't help.
I think they're mostly in to showcase what the engine can do, actually. Most of them boil down to 'push object X on button Y' anyway.
My favorite ones are those that can only be attributed to divine intervention
Gordon gets stuck in a real pickle, only for some ridiculously unlikely occurrence to blow open a grate/give him a ramp to freeeeedooooom
Perhaps he exists in a dimension where Rube Goldberg is The Creator.
Also, the car blows donkey dick when it comes to trying to get the Little Rocket Man achievement. Seriously, the thing has absolutely no friction to keep the gnome from sliding everywhere. This is made even more impossible when you're under attack while trying to drive.
I actually completed it, got the gnome to the rocket and finished the game, only to realize that I'd forgotten to close the door on the rocket. So I get to do it all over again.
It's been years since I've read any Dune books, but that was the one where shooting an active shield would cause a huge nuclear-scale explosion or something? Or is that a different series?
Lasgun + shield = kaboom.
Cool, I really need to reread the first two or three. After that they got seriously fuckweird.
Also, how come nobody told me how completely awesome Wonderella is? The writing and dialogue for that comic is pure genius.
Posts
1) Things work just as they do in our universe, unless specified otherwise.
2) Information given by the author/narrator is accurate.
To take your Star Wars example, canon has no information on how the Law of Gravity works in that universe. So we assume it does just as in ours. You can't have a story where the main characters are stuck in a pit, but get out because (hey we forgot to mention!) after a given depth below any planet's surface gravity reverses itself so the characters fall out of the hole!
And yes, it's possible that all the information we got about SW is biased, and the Jedi are really evil dictators and the Sith are noble freedom fighters. But again, this sudden reversal has to be hinted and forshadowed somehow. Maybe we're told that everything we read was written by Jedi, and includes mention of how the Jedi nobly disposed of defenseless evil widows clutching children while the Sith tried to stop them? But if the author doesn't hint anything like that, well it'd be like reaching the end of Episode III, after Anakin betrays the Jedi and turns to the Dark Side and slaughters the children in the Temple, and ending with "oh by the way the Jedi were really evil all along, so Anakin did the right thing. Thank you, good night". I'm sure you can see how that's a betrayal of the storyline and cheats the readers.
(*listening to early Radiohead*)
Both, really. I can marathon from the time I get home (4:30) to the time I go to bed (midnight) on the same game and not even notice. Because I only work 9-5 and have no other commitments, I have a lot of evening time to do stuff.
But I'm also fast at this stuff. I hate when games limit the pace I can move towards the end with needless bullshit. Good example, sticking with KOTOR, is the turrett minigame they "randomly" force you into. Fuckkkk you, I don't want to shoot fighters down with this slow ass fucking turrett. I just want to get to the next planet so I can kill some mans. It's completely pointless garbage.
The only way is if their sabers somehow just melt bullets into nothingness.
Still, something like a vulcan cannon would utterly shred them, simply too many rounds in the air I would imagine.
feels old
I know. I was 12 when Pablo Honey first came out, and must have been about 14 when I got into Radiohead (around the time "The Bends" was released).
First of all, fufufufufufu.
Second, which part?
Did you like how they wrap up the saw blades, fuel canisters, and zombies coming through a doorway into a little giftwrapped package for you?
Supposing, as you say, that the Jedi are evil, it would make far more sense if the films or whatever material they're based in would maintain the ruse throughout. They would evidently be propaganda, and propaganda has no interest in undermining itself or that which it advocates.
Ps: it's hopefully clear by now that my comment about nerds has not derogatory; since I'm doing the see thing myself.
Yes, that one is quite awesome. Slightly more awesome than the rest of Half-Life 2. I do not understand how you can think anything about Half-Life 2 is boring.
I guess your opinion is simply bad, whereas mine is correct.
MeTanerds, please.
This happens at the end of Ep. III when Ki-Adi Mundi is killed. The guy with the tall head. He can't deflect all the blaster fire because there's too much of it.
And according to your typical EU bullshit, slug rounds were an excellent method of killing Jedi because lightsabers can't stop them.
Edited for accuracy.
'cos they attract the worms and drive them into a frenzy.
FakeEDIT: shit. wrong sci-fi extravaganza. carry on.
The puzzles are really contrived and artificial, too, which doesn't help.
Play STALKER! The water is squeaky clean!
Also, radioactive.
It's been years since I've read any Dune books, but that was the one where shooting an active shield would cause a huge nuclear-scale explosion or something? Or is that a different series?
Gordon gets stuck in a real pickle, only for some ridiculously unlikely occurrence to blow open a grate/give him a ramp to freeeeedooooom
Lasgun + shield = kaboom.
Boat was excellent, stop being wrong.
Yes.
Yes.
I actually completed it, got the gnome to the rocket and finished the game, only to realize that I'd forgotten to close the door on the rocket. So I get to do it all over again.
Cool, I really need to reread the first two or three. After that they got seriously fuckweird.
Also, how come nobody told me how completely awesome Wonderella is? The writing and dialogue for that comic is pure genius.