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The Business of TV
Jacobkosh
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mod edit: Elki, here. Just made this into a thread to talk about TV business.
I think...I think the TV industry has been in a state of constant flux and turmoil for like ten years now. It was pretty static throughout the 1990s - a Boy Meets World or 3rd Rock from the Sun from 1999 looks more or less the same as a Head of the Class from 1990 - but right at the turn of the century we saw technology and ambition get to the point where we could create sitcoms and dramas with the kind of production values and casts that you previously could only get in movies, and the advent of DVD also made serial storytelling a lot more doable.
The first season of 24, for instance, blew me away at the time. It was like nothing that I had seen up to that point, like having a new Die Hard movie delivered to my living room every week. Malcolm in the Middle wowed me with its camera that went places besides the classic sitcom family couch two-shot.
But at the same time as these innovations were happening, we also had the internet and technology really digging in and turning a lot of the traditional revenue models to cheese. Pirating and DVRing have gotten huge and viewing numbers and DVD sales are stagnating. Shows like Heroes open to huge ratings and then fall off just as quickly. Even HBO, which made a string of can't-miss shows, seems to be flailing and trying to recapture its mojo.
So basically I think the people who make TV are every bit as confused as you and I are. They're trying to master a game where the rules are still changing every second. Do people want big-budget TV shows that compete directly with movies and are subsidized by DVD sales, or do they want cheaply-made stuff that can be supported by internet advertising? Do they want innovation or comfort food? Are people even still watching TV or are they off playing the vidjagames?
The downside of times like this is that cool ideas like Kings get shot down almost before they get a chance to pick up steam. But on the other hand new stuff is constantly being tried, and some of it will be awesome, and come from the most random places. If you told me ten years ago that an adult swim cartoon would be one of the best shows on TV, or that Alec Baldwin would be in a weekly sitcom, I would have laughed my ass off. In a way, I almost dread the day when TV reaches some new equilibrium, because that's when they'll start cranking out whatever new formula they've found.
And I mean I wish I could understand what makes a successful show and what doesn't, especially considering new tech. I thought Dollhouse & Kings would be be canceled, for sure, but one survived and the other didn't make it.
I like some of the stuff happening on TV right now. Stuff like 30 rock, low budget/almost experimental shows like It's Always Sunny, and with cable creeping on networks' production values and viewership someone is bound to take more risky projects like Kings, right? But see, I have no idea what I'm talking about, really, I'm just blowing shit out of my ass.
I think...I think the TV industry has been in a state of constant flux and turmoil for like ten years now. It was pretty static throughout the 1990s - a Boy Meets World or 3rd Rock from the Sun from 1999 looks more or less the same as a Head of the Class from 1990 - but right at the turn of the century we saw technology and ambition get to the point where we could create sitcoms and dramas with the kind of production values and casts that you previously could only get in movies, and the advent of DVD also made serial storytelling a lot more doable.
The first season of 24, for instance, blew me away at the time. It was like nothing that I had seen up to that point, like having a new Die Hard movie delivered to my living room every week. Malcolm in the Middle wowed me with its camera that went places besides the classic sitcom family couch two-shot.
But at the same time as these innovations were happening, we also had the internet and technology really digging in and turning a lot of the traditional revenue models to cheese. Pirating and DVRing have gotten huge and viewing numbers and DVD sales are stagnating. Shows like Heroes open to huge ratings and then fall off just as quickly. Even HBO, which made a string of can't-miss shows, seems to be flailing and trying to recapture its mojo.
So basically I think the people who make TV are every bit as confused as you and I are. They're trying to master a game where the rules are still changing every second. Do people want big-budget TV shows that compete directly with movies and are subsidized by DVD sales, or do they want cheaply-made stuff that can be supported by internet advertising? Do they want innovation or comfort food? Are people even still watching TV or are they off playing the vidjagames?
The downside of times like this is that cool ideas like Kings get shot down almost before they get a chance to pick up steam. But on the other hand new stuff is constantly being tried, and some of it will be awesome, and come from the most random places. If you told me ten years ago that an adult swim cartoon would be one of the best shows on TV, or that Alec Baldwin would be in a weekly sitcom, I would have laughed my ass off. In a way, I almost dread the day when TV reaches some new equilibrium, because that's when they'll start cranking out whatever new formula they've found.
Jacobkosh on
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I am actually really bad about keeping up with stuff like youtube and newgrounds and all the other likely places for web stars to emerge. Heck, for all I know, there's some really great stuff already out there, but I don't have the time to hunt for it or even to hunt for the people who can do the hunting for me. One of the things I have become increasingly cognizant of as I get older is that the internet is this wonderful, wide-open place, but it taketh away even as it giveth, and what it takes is time - so in the end, I find myself reading Entertainment Weekly and Ain't It Cool and forums to find out what's good, just as I was doing way back in the day.
You mislead people with shoddy advertisements about the show's purpose, you fail to show a Superbowl spot, you put it on Sunday even though weekends are generally perceived as throw-away times for repeats by the general public, put it to a worse time slot on Saturday that has even less respect than Sunday (after only 4 episodes!), then you refuse to show it even on that timeslot until Summer, and don't even let people know it's back on?
The only thing that is stopping me from illegal activities is the fact that NBC has yet to actually say it's canceled. Which leads me to believe they are going to show season 1 again next year on a better slot and see how it does. It seems like such a massive waste of time and money otherwise, and such an unnecessary amount of effort in burying it.
Black Donnelys turned into webisodes about halfway through its run. NBC cancelled it, but had the last half of the season already done so they just kept releasing in on time online. It was pretty neat (and a hell of a way to burn a lunch hour at work). There are (or were last time I was there) a couple web exclusive shows on ABC's player, too.
I know it wouldn't fit on SyFy (an NBC subsidiary), but Kings strikes me as something that needs to be shopped around on cable channels where it will actually be advertised. Hell, I watched the first 4 and then never found it again. Are the episodes all up on Hulu at least?
You know where it might actually work? AMC. It could hang out with Mad Men and Breaking Bad.
Honestly, I rarely ever watch broadcast networks anymore. But cable networks? Burn Notice, Leverage, In Plain Sight... there's lots of good shit out there.
https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197970666737/
I have a few - Lost, Big Bang Theory, and House. I need to watch Leverage - sounds very much like a show I would like.
I still watch a lot of network television. Chuck, 24, Lost, Heroes (although that's really only just because it's something to watch), House. All hourlongs, though, I really don't find any good sitcoms anymore.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
:^:
Only Lost bests it for best television show.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
The only things I watch on television (though not now because it's all reruns) are 30 Rock, Big Bang Theory, and How I Met Your Mother. The three best sitcoms on TV right now I think - they are all well-written and have actors who work well together.
Other than those it's competition reality shows (Project Runway, Top Chef, Amazing Race, So You Think You Can Dance) - programs where the actual substance takes precedent over the interpersonal drama aspect.
Last season I had a conversation with some coworkers about what was on TV, and 90% of the crap they watched was...well, crap. Two of us watched Dirty Sexy Money, which was probably the best show running on network TV (or at least arguably). The rest of those yokuls couldn't be bothered to stop watching Ruby or America's Top Next Chef/Model.
Then again, I still rage with hate that Carnivale was killed.
Fuckers.
It started in a terrible timeslot, and moved to a worse one.
Also, Burn Notice is the best show on TV right now. Everyone else's opinions are wrong. ;-)
https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197970666737/
I hate this.
But I understand why they do it.
They charge to watch them first-run. If they were cheaper on DVD people wouldn't get HBO at all, they'd just wait for the DVD release.
HBO is a different beast when it comes to shitty decisions. They've been horrible at replacing their A-list shows. Letting Rome end after two seasons was shitty. I've already brought up Carnivale as well. But there's no fucking excuse for how they treated Deadwood.
And to think, they killed both Rome and Deadwood shortly after The Sopranos was off the air. It's a surprise to me they didnt' go under.
What's worse is that anecdotes abound of TV shows that were greenlit by one TV exec who then left before it hits the air. The exec who succeeds him doesn't want his predecessor to get the credit for a hit, so he does anything he can to torpedo the show.
Of course, things can occasionally go the other way. Seth McFarlane got a $100 million producing deal, the biggest deal in the history of television. Family Guy isn't THAT popular.
The main problem with those shows is that their budgets become so unwieldy that it doesn't matter how well they were being received, they just simply become a giant money pit.
At least that was my understanding.
Didn't HBO sink 80-90 million into the first season of Rome alone?
There is nothing wrong with Top Chef.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
Hey! Top Chef is great. It has a little "I like it but don't want anybody to know" reality stuff, smoking hot hostess (Padma Lakshmi), and all sorts of delicious looking food. Also my wife doesn't mind watching it, and it is great to find something we can watch together since she doesn't like serialized drama or campy sci-fi.
EDIT: Hi5 Syphon!
I'm glad so many people are saying they like Big Bang Theory... that's really all I have to add right now.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
I would imagine they share a lot of viewers
I sometimes watch complete trash television too (I mean crap like VH1 reality shows, bottom of the barrel shit), but that doesn't make those shows good.
What HBO doesn't seem to get, and this goes with a lot of TV moguls but with the premium channels especially, is that the DVD's are a marketing tool that will hopefully get people to consider getting HBO. If you set the price point to high, you ruin any marketability the DVD has.
Frankly, if I had been willing to spend 80 bucks on Entourage 2 years ago, I probably would have had HBO for those two years. Although I do have it now. And Entourage is fucking awesome.
I did watch the first episode of Kings at work during lunch last week. I am going to watch the rest maybe this weekend
My brother last night made fun of how many times Scifi has shown the first episode of Warehouse 13 in the past 3 days
But the problem is, without shows of that quality, no ones gonna watch in the first place.
HBO was only succeeding because it was the best. It had Rome, The Wire, Deadwood, Carnivale, The Sopranos, etc.
WTF do they have now?
haha I noticed that too. I also have another network that mostly reruns episodes other stations had running Warehouse 13. I mean, I liked the show, but wow are they showing it a lot.
Entourage, True Blood, Hung
Granted, maybe none of those have the gravitas of the Sopranos, but they are as well recieved and popular as Deadwood and the Wire.
Well, we'll have to see about Hung, it's only on episode 2. But True Blood is pretty good, without the high costs that Rome and Deadwood had.
None of those are near the quality of Rome or The Wire, or near the widespread popularity of The Sopranos.
Well, quality being subjective, I'll just let that slide. Like I said, none of those have NEAR the budget of Rome or the Wire, but still manage to be decent shows. And I already said they don't approach the popularity of the Sopranos, although Entourage does have a huge following.
I'm not overly sure what your point is, except that the shows I mentioned aren't "as good" as Rome or the Wire, which I won't argue with. That being said, Rescue Me isn't as good as the Shield, but it's still a fine program.
The point is simple and exactly what I said earlier. To quote the original phrase: "They've been horrible at replacing their A-list shows." HBO has simply been unable to field the kind of top quality lin-up they had only like 5 years ago. Their top shows have disappeared and been replaced by either less popular or less good (still good, but just not as good) offerings.
If your gonna make people pay for TV, you gotta give them something worth it. HBO has slipped tremendously on this front.
Hell, Entourage itself is like the last gasp of that era (it having started like 5 years ago) and even that is like a male, less popular version of Sex and the City.
The same way most people do.
Look, I don't want to start a whole thing here about HBO, but your perceptions are wrong.
Soprano's viewership never got higher then 14 million or so, which is not completely out of reach of where True Blood is now.
And again, I don't really know how to argue about the "quality" of a show.