On the subject of Brightest Day, there seems to be a James Robinson/Phillip Tan Hawkman series in the works.
Now, of all the people to make a Hawkman mini, they pick the two creators who could not be further apart from the character. I like Robinson's work (JLA #50 was really good), but Hawkman? Give the book back to Palmiotti and Gray, I liked their run.
He's written a Hawkman solo book before. Co-wrote the first trade of Hawkman's last ongoing with Geoff Johns.
They should give me the Wonder Woman rights. I'll retcon her to be a depressed teenager forced by an abusive Tea Party stepfather to wear a patriotic corset to enforce his ultra-militant political views while also inflicting unrealistic body self-images.
And then after she gets powers from trying to overdose on meth, her dealer/pimp will make her wear indestructible bracelets so she can't cut herself anymore.
They should give me the Wonder Woman rights. I'll retcon her to be a depressed teenager forced by an abusive Tea Party stepfather to wear a patriotic corset to enforce his ultra-militant political views while also inflicting unrealistic body self-images.
And then after she gets powers from trying to overdose on meth, her dealer/pimp will make her wear indestructible bracelets so she can't cut herself anymore.
It will be so deep and character-developing.
Not quite sure just what the point of this post is, unless you're commenting on the JMS Wonder Woman run which I haven't read.
Am I a bad person for reading this and thinking I've heard worse story ideas?
wirehead26 on
I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
0
Options
TexiKenDammit!That fish really got me!Registered Userregular
On the subject of Brightest Day, there seems to be a James Robinson/Phillip Tan Hawkman series in the works.
Now, of all the people to make a Hawkman mini, they pick the two creators who could not be further apart from the character. I like Robinson's work (JLA #50 was really good), but Hawkman? Give the book back to Palmiotti and Gray, I liked their run.
He's written a Hawkman solo book before. Co-wrote the first trade of Hawkman's last ongoing with Geoff Johns.
He wrote the stuff with Morales as artist, where Carter wants to date the Indian Archaeologist at the end? I didn't remember when reading that story seeing any of Robinson's usual traits.
edit: Looking at Amazon he totally did, wow. That's wrinkling my brain.
They should give me the Wonder Woman rights. I'll retcon her to be a depressed teenager forced by an abusive Tea Party stepfather to wear a patriotic corset to enforce his ultra-militant political views while also inflicting unrealistic body self-images.
And then after she gets powers from trying to overdose on meth, her dealer/pimp will make her wear indestructible bracelets so she can't cut herself anymore.
It will be so deep and character-developing.
Not quite sure just what the point of this post is, unless you're commenting on the JMS Wonder Woman run which I haven't read.
Am I a bad person for reading this and thinking I've heard worse story ideas?
I was sorta trying to parody the self-conscious and bad edginess that people were talking about upthread.
The fact that the above got Poe's Law'd is kind of terrifying.
On the subject of Brightest Day, there seems to be a James Robinson/Phillip Tan Hawkman series in the works.
Now, of all the people to make a Hawkman mini, they pick the two creators who could not be further apart from the character. I like Robinson's work (JLA #50 was really good), but Hawkman? Give the book back to Palmiotti and Gray, I liked their run.
He's written a Hawkman solo book before. Co-wrote the first trade of Hawkman's last ongoing with Geoff Johns.
He wrote the stuff with Morales as artist, where Carter wants to date the Indian Archaeologist at the end? I didn't remember when reading that story seeing any of Robinson's usual traits.
Yup. he co-wrote #1-6 (5 and 6 featured his version of the Spider from his Starman run as the villain) and #9-10 (which features Doctor Fate), and wrote #7 solo, which was a "lives past" issue about obscure DC western characters and Gentleman Ghost before he died.
On the subject of Brightest Day, there seems to be a James Robinson/Phillip Tan Hawkman series in the works.
Now, of all the people to make a Hawkman mini, they pick the two creators who could not be further apart from the character. I like Robinson's work (JLA #50 was really good), but Hawkman? Give the book back to Palmiotti and Gray, I liked their run.
He's written a Hawkman solo book before. Co-wrote the first trade of Hawkman's last ongoing with Geoff Johns.
He wrote the stuff with Morales as artist, where Carter wants to date the Indian Archaeologist at the end? I didn't remember when reading that story seeing any of Robinson's usual traits.
Yup. he co-wrote #1-6 (5 and 6 featured his version of the Spider from his Starman run as the villain) and #9-10 (which features Doctor Fate), and wrote #7 solo, which was a "lives past" issue about obscure DC western characters and Gentleman Ghost before he died.
You're right, for some reason I glossed over those issues with Green Arrow and the Western one and went right to the Atom issue where they eat dinner and for some odd reason that EVS drawn issue a few months later with the stalker guy.
TexiKen on
0
Options
Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
I don't think writers always have noble intentions, I think some of them are just hacks or lazy
This is kind of my main point. To me, there's nothing lazier than essentially saying, "Oh, you think you know [X]? Think again!" It's so stupid and easy.
And I don't want people to think that I don't want characters to struggle or change. It's just that ultimately, I think it's important for them to remain true to the core tenets of their character.
I pitched this to DC for a laugh years back. The idea was that, like Death of Superman, we had Rape of Wonder Woman; a twenty-two page rape scene that opened up into a gatefold at the end just like Superman did.
I pitched this to DC for a laugh years back. The idea was that, like Death of Superman, we had Rape of Wonder Woman; a twenty-two page rape scene that opened up into a gatefold at the end just like Superman did.
I pitched this to DC for a laugh years back. The idea was that, like Death of Superman, we had Rape of Wonder Woman; a twenty-two page rape scene that opened up into a gatefold at the end just like Superman did.
Look, if you guys can't handle his edginess, that just shows how hung up you are. He's challenging you with his unflinching... something... ness.
Well there is a rumor that DC used to be really eager to write a story where Wonder Woman gets RAPED.
Thankfully common sense has so far held that idiotic idea at bay.
No, I believe the rumor is that so many writers bring them that idea and they turn it down every time
Good for DC then. I am curous as to which writers have brought that idea up and their rationalizations for it.
Meltzer probably. Wouldn't be surprised if Winnick was one as well. It also sounds like something Millar would pitch.
Byrne (over at his website) used to mention that Paul Kupperburg (long time DC editor) would routinely have to turn down Wonder Woman pitches that involved the character being raped. And this was back in the early 90s.
Well there is a rumor that DC used to be really eager to write a story where Wonder Woman gets RAPED.
Thankfully common sense has so far held that idiotic idea at bay.
No, I believe the rumor is that so many writers bring them that idea and they turn it down every time
Good for DC then. I am curous as to which writers have brought that idea up and their rationalizations for it.
Meltzer probably. Wouldn't be surprised if Winnick was one as well. It also sounds like something Millar would pitch.
Byrne (over at his website) used to mention that Paul Kupperburg (long time DC editor) would routinely have to turn down Wonder Woman pitches that involved the character being raped. And this was back in the early 90s.
You know whats scary? One day DC is going to crack and we are going to have to read "the rape of Wonder Woman" storyline. WITH 5 DIFFERENT VARIANT COVERS.
Because this is comics and empowered women being heroes without a dark despicable trauma in their past is anthema.
Kipling217 on
The sky was full of stars, every star an exploding ship. One of ours.
I pitched this to DC for a laugh years back. The idea was that, like Death of Superman, we had Rape of Wonder Woman; a twenty-two page rape scene that opened up into a gatefold at the end just like Superman did.
Munch, it's sad/funny that you mention that when the first Meltzer JLA trade has an Oswalt-written introduction praising Meltzer's work on Identity Crisis and the JLA, which kind of kicked all this shittyness into overdrive at DC, long after Infinite Crisis was supposed to fix it.
For everything bad people say about Geoff Johns, beyond his gore/shock value moments, that dude is trying really hard to give us definitive interpretations of the characters while still doing new things with them and bringing back constant references to established continuity. Sure, there is stuff like Martian Manhunter in BD (which I think is even primarily Tomasi-written), but we know at the end of that J'onn J'onnz will be a hyped up version of his iconic self, and not some homeless meth fiend. BD is going to rebuild those characters and show how they triumph over all this dark crap, and that kind of makes it worthwhile in today's DCU.
I agree with this. Though he has done some dodgy work, Geoff Johns has also done some great writing and I think he very much does appreciate the characters. In all his Green Lantern run he allowed development and change and character moments but he also kept Hal jordan as Hal Jordan etc, which is something I very much appreciate about him as a writer. Some writers I would call bad, Geoff Johns I would say is a very good writer who has done some poor stories.
Green Lantern Rebirth was a great introduction to the mythos for me and his GL stuff after that was very enjoyable to read. The sheer scale and ambition of the emotional spectrum corps, their conflicts, and the Blackest Night concept was ambitious enough for me to respect the man for trying it, and I think overall he pulled it off very impressively.
Whereas you look at JT Krul and his changes of Arsenal and even if it wasn't terrible it would still be pretty bad. The concept, in itself, is not something I can appreciate like I can with Civil War etc, which are comics I disliked but which I could understand the appeal of the underlying idea.
Munch, it's sad/funny that you mention that when the first Meltzer JLA trade has an Oswalt-written introduction praising Meltzer's work on Identity Crisis and the JLA, which kind of kicked all this shittyness into overdrive at DC, long after Infinite Crisis was supposed to fix it.
For everything bad people say about Geoff Johns, beyond his gore/shock value moments, that dude is trying really hard to give us definitive interpretations of the characters while still doing new things with them and bringing back constant references to established continuity. Sure, there is stuff like Martian Manhunter in BD (which I think is even primarily Tomasi-written), but we know at the end of that J'onn J'onnz will be a hyped up version of his iconic self, and not some homeless meth fiend. BD is going to rebuild those characters and show how they triumph over all this dark crap, and that kind of makes it worthwhile in today's DCU.
On that Patton Oswalt thing, I only have one reply: "You look really sad." "Yeah, I'm pretty fuckin' sad, dude." Still one of my favorite comedians, even if he has terrible taste in comics. Though, he did do the intro for a volume of Boneyard, one of my favorite comics. So, I'm torn.
I do agree that Johns is good at getting to the root of a character, even if he can be really, really blunt about it. It's unfortunate that I'm not interested in any of the stories he wants to tell with those characters. His desire to combine Silver Age characters with over-thee-top violence does absolutely nothing for me.
I think Dex-Starr's origin story was the breaking point for me. Reading it, all I could think was that he had to have dictated that script to an assistant, because there was no way he could have typed it up with his gigantic ham-hands.
I pitched this to DC for a laugh years back. The idea was that, like Death of Superman, we had Rape of Wonder Woman; a twenty-two page rape scene that opened up into a gatefold at the end just like Superman did.
Mark millar: where good taste goes to die.
Millar is actually 2 kids, one on the others shoulders, both hiding behind a trench coat, a fedora, and a fake mustache.
I pitched this to DC for a laugh years back. The idea was that, like Death of Superman, we had Rape of Wonder Woman; a twenty-two page rape scene that opened up into a gatefold at the end just like Superman did.
Mark millar: where good taste goes to die.
Millar is actually 2 kids, one on the others shoulders, both hiding behind a trench coat, a fedora, and a fake mustache.
If that were true, then Nemesis would have turned out something like Axe Cop.
Which would have been much, much better, the more I think about it.
I pitched this to DC for a laugh years back. The idea was that, like Death of Superman, we had Rape of Wonder Woman; a twenty-two page rape scene that opened up into a gatefold at the end just like Superman did.
Mark millar: where good taste goes to die.
Millar is actually 2 kids, one on the others shoulders, both hiding behind a trench coat, a fedora, and a fake mustache.
They should give me the Wonder Woman rights. I'll retcon her to be a depressed teenager forced by an abusive Tea Party stepfather to wear a patriotic corset to enforce his ultra-militant political views while also inflicting unrealistic body self-images.
And then after she gets powers from trying to overdose on meth, her dealer/pimp will make her wear indestructible bracelets so she can't cut herself anymore.
It will be so deep and character-developing.
Not quite sure just what the point of this post is, unless you're commenting on the JMS Wonder Woman run which I haven't read.
Am I a bad person for reading this and thinking I've heard worse story ideas?
I was sorta trying to parody the self-conscious and bad edginess that people were talking about upthread.
The fact that the above got Poe's Law'd is kind of terrifying.
AntimatterDevo Was RightGates of SteelRegistered Userregular
edited October 2010
So, I read the original Sentry trade paperback last night
that was, without a doubt, the worst Marvel story I'd ever read
I derived more entertainment from Onslaught
I do not give a fuck that people forgot him, the fact that he made Peter Parker rich and famous, the fact that he was buddy buddy with Hulk at one time, the fact that he was nearly all powerful and that Mr. Fantastic respected him, no, just fucking no. I grew up reading the Essential Marvel stuff, X-Men, Spider-Man, Avengers, Fantastic Four, and I felt like my heart was being ripped out of my chest. The fact that it's canon made it worse. And, the fake interviews in the back, that made it seem like Stan Lee made him and forgot him? Ugh.
Considering the praise I've heard about it in GV, I read it with only the mildest reservations, seeing as I didn't like what I've read and heard of him beforehand.
My rage is only slightly exaggerated. I can see why some people enjoyed it, but it wasn't for me.
So, I read the original Sentry trade paperback last night
that was, without a doubt, the worst Marvel story I'd ever read
I derived more entertainment from Onslaught
I do not give a fuck that people forgot him, the fact that he made Peter Parker rich and famous, the fact that he was buddy buddy with Hulk at one time, the fact that he was nearly all powerful and that Mr. Fantastic respected him, no, just fucking no. I grew up reading the Essential Marvel stuff, X-Men, Spider-Man, Avengers, Fantastic Four, and I felt like my heart was being ripped out of my chest. The fact that it's canon made it worse. And, the fake interviews in the back, that made it seem like Stan Lee made him and forgot him? Ugh.
Considering the praise I've heard about it in GV, I read it with only the mildest reservations, seeing as I didn't like what I've read and heard of him beforehand.
My rage is only slightly exaggerated. I can see why some people enjoyed it, but it wasn't for me.
The first Sentry story pretty much was retconned away with the second Jenkins story "Sentry: Reborn" and Bendis expanding on Reborn's themes.
So, I read the original Sentry trade paperback last night
that was, without a doubt, the worst Marvel story I'd ever read
I derived more entertainment from Onslaught
I do not give a fuck that people forgot him, the fact that he made Peter Parker rich and famous, the fact that he was buddy buddy with Hulk at one time, the fact that he was nearly all powerful and that Mr. Fantastic respected him, no, just fucking no. I grew up reading the Essential Marvel stuff, X-Men, Spider-Man, Avengers, Fantastic Four, and I felt like my heart was being ripped out of my chest. The fact that it's canon made it worse. And, the fake interviews in the back, that made it seem like Stan Lee made him and forgot him? Ugh.
Considering the praise I've heard about it in GV, I read it with only the mildest reservations, seeing as I didn't like what I've read and heard of him beforehand.
My rage is only slightly exaggerated. I can see why some people enjoyed it, but it wasn't for me.
It seems some people are just terrible.
Like you.
Seriously though I can understand your fustrustration, but you have to understand that originally it was designed as an out-of continuity story, which would hopefully alleviate some of your issues. To each their own, though I don't quite see how it is the worst Marvel story ever though. Worse than Ultimatum? Worse than Reed's Ms Marvel run? Worse than the whole One More Day thing? I think not.
So, I read the original Sentry trade paperback last night
that was, without a doubt, the worst Marvel story I'd ever read
I derived more entertainment from Onslaught
I do not give a fuck that people forgot him, the fact that he made Peter Parker rich and famous, the fact that he was buddy buddy with Hulk at one time, the fact that he was nearly all powerful and that Mr. Fantastic respected him, no, just fucking no. I grew up reading the Essential Marvel stuff, X-Men, Spider-Man, Avengers, Fantastic Four, and I felt like my heart was being ripped out of my chest. The fact that it's canon made it worse. And, the fake interviews in the back, that made it seem like Stan Lee made him and forgot him? Ugh.
Considering the praise I've heard about it in GV, I read it with only the mildest reservations, seeing as I didn't like what I've read and heard of him beforehand.
My rage is only slightly exaggerated. I can see why some people enjoyed it, but it wasn't for me.
It seems some people are just terrible.
Like you.
Seriously though I can understand your fustrustration, but you have to understand that originally it was designed as an out-of continuity story, which would hopefully alleviate some of your issues. To each their own, though I don't quite see how it is the worst Marvel story ever though. Worse than Ultimatum? Worse than Reed's Ms Marvel run? Worse than the whole One More Day thing? I think not.
I think it's worth noting I said worst Marvel story I'd ever read
I avoided some of those because I knew for a fact they were terrible
and yeah, it does make me feel better to know it wasn't supposed to stay canon
Antimatter on
0
Options
TexiKenDammit!That fish really got me!Registered Userregular
edited October 2010
Did you read the Draco, antimatter?
TexiKen on
0
Options
AntimatterDevo Was RightGates of SteelRegistered Userregular
Posts
He's written a Hawkman solo book before. Co-wrote the first trade of Hawkman's last ongoing with Geoff Johns.
And then after she gets powers from trying to overdose on meth, her dealer/pimp will make her wear indestructible bracelets so she can't cut herself anymore.
It will be so deep and character-developing.
Not quite sure just what the point of this post is, unless you're commenting on the JMS Wonder Woman run which I haven't read.
Am I a bad person for reading this and thinking I've heard worse story ideas?
He wrote the stuff with Morales as artist, where Carter wants to date the Indian Archaeologist at the end? I didn't remember when reading that story seeing any of Robinson's usual traits.
edit: Looking at Amazon he totally did, wow. That's wrinkling my brain.
I was sorta trying to parody the self-conscious and bad edginess that people were talking about upthread.
The fact that the above got Poe's Law'd is kind of terrifying.
Yup. he co-wrote #1-6 (5 and 6 featured his version of the Spider from his Starman run as the villain) and #9-10 (which features Doctor Fate), and wrote #7 solo, which was a "lives past" issue about obscure DC western characters and Gentleman Ghost before he died.
Thankfully common sense has so far held that idiotic idea at bay.
You're right, for some reason I glossed over those issues with Green Arrow and the Western one and went right to the Atom issue where they eat dinner and for some odd reason that EVS drawn issue a few months later with the stalker guy.
No, I believe the rumor is that so many writers bring them that idea and they turn it down every time
Good for DC then. I am curous as to which writers have brought that idea up and their rationalizations for it.
And I don't want people to think that I don't want characters to struggle or change. It's just that ultimately, I think it's important for them to remain true to the core tenets of their character.
Tumblr Twitter
Meltzer probably. Wouldn't be surprised if Winnick was one as well. It also sounds like something Millar would pitch.
Tumblr Twitter
Look, if you guys can't handle his edginess, that just shows how hung up you are. He's challenging you with his unflinching... something... ness.
Byrne (over at his website) used to mention that Paul Kupperburg (long time DC editor) would routinely have to turn down Wonder Woman pitches that involved the character being raped. And this was back in the early 90s.
You know whats scary? One day DC is going to crack and we are going to have to read "the rape of Wonder Woman" storyline. WITH 5 DIFFERENT VARIANT COVERS.
Because this is comics and empowered women being heroes without a dark despicable trauma in their past is anthema.
Mark millar: where good taste goes to die.
I agree with this. Though he has done some dodgy work, Geoff Johns has also done some great writing and I think he very much does appreciate the characters. In all his Green Lantern run he allowed development and change and character moments but he also kept Hal jordan as Hal Jordan etc, which is something I very much appreciate about him as a writer. Some writers I would call bad, Geoff Johns I would say is a very good writer who has done some poor stories.
Green Lantern Rebirth was a great introduction to the mythos for me and his GL stuff after that was very enjoyable to read. The sheer scale and ambition of the emotional spectrum corps, their conflicts, and the Blackest Night concept was ambitious enough for me to respect the man for trying it, and I think overall he pulled it off very impressively.
Whereas you look at JT Krul and his changes of Arsenal and even if it wasn't terrible it would still be pretty bad. The concept, in itself, is not something I can appreciate like I can with Civil War etc, which are comics I disliked but which I could understand the appeal of the underlying idea.
On that Patton Oswalt thing, I only have one reply: "You look really sad." "Yeah, I'm pretty fuckin' sad, dude." Still one of my favorite comedians, even if he has terrible taste in comics. Though, he did do the intro for a volume of Boneyard, one of my favorite comics. So, I'm torn.
I do agree that Johns is good at getting to the root of a character, even if he can be really, really blunt about it. It's unfortunate that I'm not interested in any of the stories he wants to tell with those characters. His desire to combine Silver Age characters with over-thee-top violence does absolutely nothing for me.
I think Dex-Starr's origin story was the breaking point for me. Reading it, all I could think was that he had to have dictated that script to an assistant, because there was no way he could have typed it up with his gigantic ham-hands.
Tumblr Twitter
Millar is actually 2 kids, one on the others shoulders, both hiding behind a trench coat, a fedora, and a fake mustache.
If that were true, then Nemesis would have turned out something like Axe Cop.
Which would have been much, much better, the more I think about it.
Course, I can see him as the type to RUN with the joke and actually do it if DC had somehow let him.
XBL: JyrenB ; Steam: Jyren ; Twitter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4T8live_ig
i would read this.
XBL: MightyManotaur
PA: TheSecretSeventh
wait....
that was, without a doubt, the worst Marvel story I'd ever read
I derived more entertainment from Onslaught
I do not give a fuck that people forgot him, the fact that he made Peter Parker rich and famous, the fact that he was buddy buddy with Hulk at one time, the fact that he was nearly all powerful and that Mr. Fantastic respected him, no, just fucking no. I grew up reading the Essential Marvel stuff, X-Men, Spider-Man, Avengers, Fantastic Four, and I felt like my heart was being ripped out of my chest. The fact that it's canon made it worse. And, the fake interviews in the back, that made it seem like Stan Lee made him and forgot him? Ugh.
Considering the praise I've heard about it in GV, I read it with only the mildest reservations, seeing as I didn't like what I've read and heard of him beforehand.
XBL: MightyManotaur
PA: TheSecretSeventh
wait....
The first Sentry story pretty much was retconned away with the second Jenkins story "Sentry: Reborn" and Bendis expanding on Reborn's themes.
It seems some people are just terrible.
Like you.
It was pretty bad. Worse than the Sentry in any case.
But yeah not as bad as the other two, I'll give you that.
I think it's worth noting I said worst Marvel story I'd ever read
I avoided some of those because I knew for a fact they were terrible
and yeah, it does make me feel better to know it wasn't supposed to stay canon
nope, but I'm reading this review right now
Draco just makes absolutely no sense, and contradicts itself in later chapters.
Individual issues are another thing, those two stories are 4-6 issues of repeatedly bad storytelling.