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My best work so far.... I think...

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Posts

  • toddleabootoddleaboo Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Thank you everyone for your comments and advice. Of course, I'm going to be a little defensive about my work because I've spent many hours putting it all together. With this book already 60% done, it completely undesirable to go back to the drawing board at this point.

    I will definitely be taking all your advice into consideration for future projects however.

    Cheers. ;-)

    toddleaboo on
  • Stupid Mr Whoopsie NameStupid Mr Whoopsie Name Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited April 2011
    toddleaboo wrote: »
    Of course Movie Comics is relevant. Your comments in this thread are obviously a reflection of your hatred for anything MC, especially the illustrator. (Gabe & Tycho bought an MC shirt and hung it on their wall by the way) We're not coming here stating that this is the best art ever, and everything can always be improved. We've actually been very receptive to all the feedback and constructive comments. Your comments are not constructive, and your revulsion for Flash is misguided. This book is going to be available as an animated storybook as well, so "going back to the basics" would not be very productive.

    Mike also slipped a picture of Squidi into one of their comics, so what are you getting at? That Mike has a snarky sense of humor? We know that, it's why we love PA. Movie Comics hasn't been on anyone's radar for nearly a decade, and it slipped into obscurity accordingly. No, Movie Comics is not relevant.

    What is relevant is the artwork you are posting here, and the tedious amount of effort put into taking short-cuts around learning the basics. Flash is an albatross in this case because it is being used as a substitute for the fundamentals. I understand your ambition is to do some animated pieces, but I question the conviction in that when you still have trouble with form and volume.

    And David, you're welcome to post here with your own account. No reason to hijack your sister's.

    Stupid Mr Whoopsie Name on
  • toddleabootoddleaboo Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Mike also slipped a picture of Squidi into one of their comics, so what are you getting at? That Mike has a snarky sense of humor? We know that, it's why we love PA. Movie Comics hasn't been on anyone's radar for nearly a decade, and it slipped into obscurity accordingly. No, Movie Comics is not relevant.

    Mike also read MC on a regular basis, emailing me with comments from time to time... I also spoke with Tycho on a few occasions. Doesn't mean much, I was just pointing out that a majority of PA's fanbase assumed we were at war or something. Also, I quit Movie Comics because I quit watching movies and didn't have an insane readership established to motivate me to continue doing something I didn't enjoy. We were at 6-7,000 readers a day when I pulled the plug. If I hadn't made that decision, it would still be going today. Your welcome.

    And I say Movie Comics is relevant in terms of how you approached commenting on this thread. If it was anyone else posting their work, you would have probably said something more like, "this is nice... but... you should try this..." But instead, you basically said, "You haven't improved... you suck... hope you step on a rake."

    People say this is a form of respect. Well... it goes both ways.

    toddleaboo on
  • Stupid Mr Whoopsie NameStupid Mr Whoopsie Name Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited April 2011
    Well, thank your for not continuing to this day.
    toddleaboo wrote: »
    Your welcome.

    Seriously dude, learn to accept critiques with grace. We're critiquing your work, not you as a person.

    Stupid Mr Whoopsie Name on
  • IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited April 2011
    I have no idea what the movie comics is about, or what you think mars is on about rather than what he is actually on about, but the AC isn't like full of rabid PA fans who care deeply if you talk to Gabe and Tycho and they are cool with you.

    We have a climate, and that atmosphere is "I see this project, heres some tips for it, but also heres how to improve your work overall." Sometimes that requires telling someone that their work needs a lot of work in a lot of general areas, its not "attacking".

    We have had some folks improve at warp speed, and its not usually at any real credit to the forum itself. They came with an attitude that they needed to improve at warp speed, and any little comment helped propel them forward. You seem to have come here with the mindset that you should be ready and willing to be defensive, well, cool your jets. Its not really going to help your artistic skills to defend every choice.

    Anatomy, form, light, and traditional concepts are the ones we all "conform" to because thats how artists learn to draw anything and everything. Is that something you are interested in?

    Iruka on
  • mullymully Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    I don't know why I think my words are going to help this at all, I just feel like I'm adding to the pile, but: I've watched all of your threads; I have read all of them thoroughly. I agree with what is being said by the friendly people of this forum - even when they have not said it in the friendliest of manners.

    Your backgrounds have improved - but your characters, all in all, have not improved at all and are still absolutely uninteresting and lack any sort of fundamentals. If you had paid attention to all the wonderful people in here taking the time to critique you on the areas you need the most assistance with, you might just be an amazing artist now; however, you didn't, and your characters are just barely skimming the line between "a finished drawing" and "a mindless doodle".

    Take it from me - I used to have the same attitude you have now when I was 16. In fact, when people started telling me that I didn't draw feet very well, I started using a "fog" in every image I drew in order to hide them -- I then got very defensive when people would say that I hadn't improved, where I felt that I had, since there were no longer any feet to critique. How wrong I was! And you're doing the same thing - trying to distract away from the problems by doing other things. Please, please rethink your stance here, from someone who has been there.

    mully on
  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Wait I am confused here

    You say it's a book

    But then say the reason it is done in flash is because it is gonna be animated

    Well, which is it

    Because there are two very different approaches for advice here

    The Lovely Bastard on
    7656367.jpg
  • melting_dollmelting_doll Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    No one told you to step on a rake.
    But getting saucy and trying to make attacks on the ENTIRE forum is sure to get some people fired up.

    I remember your old thread, and I'd say that you HAVE improved, but improvement does not translate to "the most amazing work you'll ever do", and it certainly doesn't mean you can't keep improving. Personally, I've improved, but that doesn't put me at par with professionals.

    Either take the advice you asked for, or gracefully walk away. Trying to troll us ABOUT OUR NAMES (wtf?) and make sad attempts to attack us will get you nothing, aside from laughed at.



    Also, the use of Flash as an excuse for it to be animated just makes it sound like you're going to be just as lazy about the animation as you are about making adjustments to the book. When I hear someone say they want to make Flash animations, I assume they don't actually know anything about animation, because using Flash means you don't have to. I'd suggest sticking with illustration before half-assing your way through anything else.

    melting_doll on
  • toddleabootoddleaboo Registered User
    edited April 2011
    I just did this last night in Illustrator. Never used it before, but it seems to respond to my Wacom tablet a lot more precisely. Now I need to learn how to color more realistically.

    clockwise_sketch.jpg

    clockwise.jpg

    toddleaboo on
  • toddleabootoddleaboo Registered User
    edited April 2011
    All colored.

    clockwise_color.jpg

    toddleaboo on
  • WassermeloneWassermelone Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    I suggest removing the lens flare and lighting effects filters. Filters should be avoided for the most part unless they are of the more subtle kind and you have the know how to put them to proper use. Lens flares and lighting effects are not among these. I too thought they were the coolest of cool when I started using photoshop, but, sorry, they are kind of a joke among anyone who knows the program.

    My advice would be to avoid anything that isn't in the blur or sharpen filter groups.

    Other than that, I think rather than critique specific portions a general suggestion of doing studies from life and studies from loomis/bridgman/etc. would be good for you.

    Wassermelone on
  • MustangMustang Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    I don't mean to be rude or disheartening, but this has all the hallmarks of someone who has spent far too much time learning photoshop tips and tricks, but not nearly enough time learning how to draw.

    Here are just a few of the flaws I've picked up:

    The hand is not grasping the cane at all, merely floating over the surface.
    The index finger (when extended) would be almost three times as long as the others.
    The belt is running directly into the side of the abdomen.
    The hat perspective is all kinds of wrong.
    The eyeballs is hanging out of the face and not sitting in the structural perspective of the head
    The watch is attached to what looks like a partially deflated tube of toothpaste.


    Until you start studying drawing fundamentals, this is as good as you're ever going to get.

    Mustang on
  • toddleabootoddleaboo Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Mustang wrote: »
    I don't mean to be rude or disheartening, but this has all the hallmarks of someone who has spent far too much time learning photoshop tips and tricks, but not nearly enough time learning how to draw.

    Here are just a few of the flaws I've picked up:

    The hand is not grasping the cane at all, merely floating over the surface.
    The index finger (when extended) would be almost three times as long as the others.
    The belt is running directly into the side of the abdomen.
    The hat perspective is all kinds of wrong.
    The eyeballs is hanging out of the face and not sitting in the structural perspective of the head
    The watch is attached to what looks like a partially deflated tube of toothpaste.


    Until you start studying drawing fundamentals, this is as good as you're ever going to get.

    Yeah, I never took the art class where you get to sketch the naked lady. :) I need to work on that stuff, but I see what you're saying. Here's an update. I'd enjoy some more comments before I shade it again.

    clockwise_update.jpg

    toddleaboo on
  • NightDragonNightDragon 6th Grade Username Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Could I suggest something for your next piece?

    Typically, it's a good idea to work out the drawing problems in the sketch stage...not the final stage. Bringing your art straight from a pencil drawing, unedited, to your computer...really makes it more difficult for you to change all the things that could've just been fixed in the pencil drawing.

    There is a lot that needs improvement in this piece, but it's more fundamental stuff, and I don't think it'd really help you to mention it at this point. For the next piece you post, however, you might want to hold off on bringing the drawing to the computer, until we've critiqued the pencil drawing. You may also want to draw a little larger, and try to stay truer to your pencil drawing when bringing it to a digital final. It doesn't make sense to do a two-step process (pencil sketch >> digital final) and change a bunch of things in the final. You might be adding "errors" back into your piece. It's not ideal practice.

    NightDragon on
  • IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited April 2011
    You could start with some basic still life drawing. Apples, glasses, balls, stuff like that. Alot of cartoon work is putting polygons together, and drawing naked ladies doesn't necessarily translate into great cartooning, so don't feel like you have to start there.

    toots1.jpg
    toots2.jpg
    toots3.jpg

    You are doing that thing where, instead of making volumetric forms, you are making a light line of color where ever a part of the outline is near the light source. I would do some really basic still life stuff, it will teach you a lot about what to do with light.

    Iruka on
  • Stupid Mr Whoopsie NameStupid Mr Whoopsie Name Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited April 2011
    I want to echo what ND said about working all the kinks out in the sketching phase first, and the reason I want to echo this is because I honestly feel like your original pencils had some much more going for them before you inked it in Illustrator. Seriously, those original pencils have so much more character and flow to it.

    Take a look at the face in your sketch versus the face inked in Illustrator. The little lower lip in the original? Wonderful! The structure of the jaw? Fantastic! The original eye is all around better than what you inked. In fact, I'd say if your original pencils were actually hand inked, you'd be on the right path. Keep your sketching loose, don't concern yourself with trying to get the final lines in place with your pencils. Light and loose, so you have an idea of what you want, then make the final strokes when inking it. That way, you don't lose all of that great rhythm and flow, or lose any of the "character" that's working.

    Also bear what Iruka has to say in mind. She's brilliant with color and one of the people on this board that constantly inspires me to tighten my grasp on using color and lighting effectively (She's also got some great advice regarding form and volume there).

    This was a great exercise for you, I think, and I look forward to seeing your next piece. Try posting the sketches at an earlier phase next time, please.

    Stupid Mr Whoopsie Name on
  • toddleabootoddleaboo Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Iruka wrote: »
    toots1.jpg
    toots2.jpg
    toots3.jpg

    Wow. Thanks for doing that!

    Mister - I'm not sure why I screwed with the jaw, but my sister didn't like the lip. Maybe I'll make it smaller.

    I have until may 20th to draw up all of our characters for a preschool artshow... so I'll be sure to post the sketches here first.

    Thanks.

    toddleaboo on
  • Stupid Mr Whoopsie NameStupid Mr Whoopsie Name Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited April 2011
    I would also highly encourage both of you to post from your own accounts.
    And by encourage I mean, please post from your own accounts.

    Stupid Mr Whoopsie Name on
  • feistypawsfeistypaws Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Taking everything into consideration, here is the latest version. I'm pretty happy with it now.

    clock3.jpg

    feistypaws on
  • feistypawsfeistypaws Registered User
    edited April 2011
    compare.jpg

    feistypaws on
  • melting_dollmelting_doll Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Eee that left hand! (Our right) Put your left hand on your hip in a fist and look at it. Your palm should jutt out from the wrist on the other side- right now he's got a right hand on his left arm.

    melting_doll on
  • FugitiveFugitive Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    So, is he just kind of keeping his chain bunched up in his pocket, but it's heavy enough to counter-balance the watch? Is there another watch in there? What's the significance of the 16 hour watch?

    These riddles are ruining what would otherwise be a great piece.

    Fugitive on
  • feistypawsfeistypaws Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Hehe... I'll fix the watch and the hand. Those are both areas I knew there was a problem.... but I suppose a part of me was waiting for someone to say something. Thanks.

    feistypaws on
  • flowerhoneyflowerhoney Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    Why wait if you already knew it was a problem?

    flowerhoney on
  • feistypawsfeistypaws Registered User
    edited April 2011
    Why wait if you already knew it was a problem?

    I'm learning a lot this week about how off my art has been. Something about the hand seemed off, but for whatever reason, I failed to visualize it correctly. I'm going to stick to sketches from now on until I have it perfect. I do spend too much time in front of the computer trying to figure out details.

    This looks better I think:

    clock4.jpg

    feistypaws on
  • feistypawsfeistypaws Registered User
    edited April 2011
    I'm still not sure what to do about the watch chain. The watch is suppose to be connected to a long chain that is mostly shoved in his pocket, but the watch is dangling out.

    feistypaws on
  • Stupid Mr Whoopsie NameStupid Mr Whoopsie Name Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited April 2011
    Hand on the hip looks much better now! Honestly, I'd recommend calling it a day on this piece and starting up something fresh, otherwise you could spend a really long time just nickel & diming changes. Take what you've learned and put it into another piece.

    Stupid Mr Whoopsie Name on
  • feistypawsfeistypaws Registered User
    edited April 2011
    I'll bring this thread to an end with an animated video I made several months back. I lost interest, so it's only about a min long.

    http://feistycats.com/wakeupcall.htm

    feistypaws on
  • Spectre-xSpectre-x Registered User regular
    edited April 2011
    You've got a bunch of timing issues. Your movements are quite wooden and lack almost any kind of fluidity. It's really obvious that you just used a bunch of generic Flash shortcuts and so on to animate the thing and the end result is about as mediocre as you'd expect from something like that.

    Go and check out the Animator's Survival Kit by Richard Williams. It's quite excellent and it'll teach you a LOT of things about movement and timing.

    Spectre-x on
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