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PAX South Space

macbittmacbitt Atlanta, GARegistered User regular
edited April 2014 in PAX General Discussion
For those wondering why San Antonio was chosen for PAX South available convention space was probably a factor.

The total usable space at the Henry B. Gonzalez Convention Center in San Antonio is 841,000 square feet (78,100 m2), and that doesn't include the 2,300 seat theatre on site. The entire complex is 1.3 million square feet (120,700 m2).

Compare that to the available space at PAX Prime and PAX East:
  • Washington State Convention Center - 432,700 square feet (40,200 m2) + The Conference Center - 71,000 square feet (6,600 m2) + 2,500 seat theatre
  • Boston Convention and Exhibition Center - 1,126,100 square feet (104,600 m2), which does include the concert area
So PAX South space is much larger than that of PAX Prime but smaller than PAX East's space, even accounting for the theatre.

macbitt on

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    zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited April 2014
    so this comes up a lot but the space at the bcec that you reported is only expo space. the actual interior space at the bcec is far more than that (over 1 mil sq ft, take a look at actual floorplans, not Wikipedia). anyhow, San Antonio should be fine.

    zerzhul on
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    macbittmacbitt Atlanta, GARegistered User regular
    zerzhul wrote: »
    so this comes up a lot but the space at the bcec that you reported is only expo space. the actual interior space at the bcec is far more than that (over 1 mil sq ft, take a look at actual floorplans, not Wikipedia). anyhow, San Antonio should be fine.

    Thanks for the tip. I pulled floor plans for Prime and East and redid my numbers. So much for everything being bigger in Texas ;)

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    WickershamWickersham Registered User regular
    Space is definitely a factor, but San Antonio is a good convention city in a lot of ways. Bigger than Austin, cheaper than Dallas, better weather than Houston, and definitely more to see and do than the latter two. It's much more visitor-friendly, tourism being one of the city's biggest industries, and the convention center is undergoing a major expansion so there will be a lot of additional space available.

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    manta173manta173 Registered User regular
    I love San Antonio... it's just far away for me as well. I wish it had been Nashville or Atlanta, but I can understand why it wasn't.

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    MattauiMattaui Dallas, TXRegistered User regular
    I live in Dallas, and I like the DFW metroplex, and I'm glad they're having it somewhere like San Antonio which is much more tourism focused, as was already mentioned. There are so many restaurants along the riverwalk alone, and it makes getting around the downtown area a lot easier.

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    El OsoEl Oso Registered User regular
    Wickersham wrote: »
    Space is definitely a factor, but San Antonio is a good convention city in a lot of ways. Bigger than Austin, cheaper than Dallas, better weather than Houston, and definitely more to see and do than the latter two. It's much more visitor-friendly, tourism being one of the city's biggest industries, and the convention center is undergoing a major expansion so there will be a lot of additional space available.

    Let's be reasonable - San Antonio has the Alamo, and that's it. The Riverwalk is a dirty creek, and six flags - who cares? Dallas is bland, I agree with that. Houston has terrible traffic and the humidity is awful, but the food variety cannot be beat. Austin is the best city - its diverse, far more interesting places to visit/things to do, and the weather is generally the best in Texas.

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    ohkateyohkatey Owner of Bitch Team Alpha Austin, TXRegistered User regular
    Austin is a great city, but the convention center here is TINY and traffic is already worse here than any other Texas city (and ALMOST anywhere in the country, according to a bunch of recent studies apparently). There also aren't a lot of hotels downtown/near the convention center, to be honest. I say this with love, but Austin couldn't support a convention the size of PAX.

    pax primer @ <3
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    El OsoEl Oso Registered User regular
    ohkatey wrote: »
    Austin is a great city, but the convention center here is TINY and traffic is already worse here than any other Texas city (and ALMOST anywhere in the country, according to a bunch of recent studies apparently). There also aren't a lot of hotels downtown/near the convention center, to be honest. I say this with love, but Austin couldn't support a convention the size of PAX.

    I've lived in Houston and Austin, traveled to San Antonio and Dallas. There is nothing - NOTHING worse than Houston traffic. Austin has bad traffic, but its nothing compared to Houston. Dallas is actually not bad for a major city. San Antonio is a non factor.

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    zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    Debating which city you like most in Texas is not really on topic for PAX. PAX South is in San Antonio.

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    macbittmacbitt Atlanta, GARegistered User regular
    Not trying to debate (as I'm not from Texas and don't have a horse in that race) but I have been doing some travel research for San Antonio and so far it is looking like a good spot for PAX.

    I quickly found a dozen hotels within a 10 minute walk to the convention center, many within a 5 minute or less walk and many again are pretty big. I can only imagine the hotel room capacity around the convention center.

    The convention center hosts other large conventions and has glowing reviews on Google and various travel sites. I haven't looked at food options yet, but there is a restaurant in the convention center, another in the hotel connected to the convention center, and the hotel's lounge becomes a sushi bar in the evenings. There's also a mall a 5-10 walk away which I assume has a food court and surrounding restaurants. Even the airport is only 8 miles away, though it looks like PAX is at the very end of the public bus route so it will feel a lot longer ;)

    As for things to do... I haven't looked at that yet but even with a Thursday arrival I wouldn't expect to have that much time to be a tourist. Surely there will be new pre and post-PAX events and traditions started and late parties, not to mention PAX itself.

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    NinjinNinjin ArizonaRegistered User regular
    The Amtrak station is also literally next to the convention center.

    Texas Train Trip, anyone?

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    TimDisasterTimDisaster San AntonioRegistered User regular
    I live in San Antonio, and this will be a damn good spot for PAXsouth. Not terribly expensive, a good downtown and plenty of things to do in the area.

    Twitter: TimDisaster PSN: TimDisaster XBL: xTimDISASTERx
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    QuintiousQuintious Registered User regular
    macbitt wrote: »
    For those wondering why San Antonio was chosen for PAX South available convention space was probably a factor.

    The total usable space at the Henry B. Gonzalez Convention Center in San Antonio is 841,000 square feet (78,100 m2), and that doesn't include the 2,300 seat theatre on site. The entire complex is 1.3 million square feet (120,700 m2).

    Compare that to the available space at PAX Prime and PAX East:
    • Washington State Convention Center - 432,700 square feet (40,200 m2) + The Conference Center - 71,000 square feet (6,600 m2) + 2,500 seat theatre
    • Boston Convention and Exhibition Center - 1,126,100 square feet (104,600 m2), which does include the concert area
    So PAX South space is much larger than that of PAX Prime but smaller than PAX East's space, even accounting for the theatre.

    Well, for one, your numbers are off. BCEC is bigger than that once you factor in all the available space - and your numbers ignore the fact that Prime consumes every ballroom, theatre, orchestra space, lobby, and outhouse in the entire Seattle downtown area. I'm not sure how much square footage that equates to, but I'd bet money it equates to more space than BCEC all said and told.

    The question becomes, as in another thread, whether South will ever need even close to that much space given the odd time of year it's at, the largely underserviced airport in the city (even if you include AUS), etc.

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    zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    I don't think that prime uses more space than East. I certainly could be wrong, but it would surprise me. Either way, it appears that South will have plenty of space at least for a couple of years. Enough to discover how much they will need, anyhow.

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    SkeleVaderSkeleVader Your Friendly Dark Lord of Destruction Registered User regular
    zerzhul wrote: »
    I don't think that prime uses more space than East. I certainly could be wrong, but it would surprise me. Either way, it appears that South will have plenty of space at least for a couple of years. Enough to discover how much they will need, anyhow.

    I made an estimation sheet awhile back to compare the sizes of WSCC, BCEC, & the OCC (since a few people were saying Portland was much bigger) and I just added the off site areas used in Prime 2013 to it.
    The main Convention center areas I used an On screen estimating program to calculate the exact Square footage of available space based on the floor plans. The additional area for Prime I just added what square footage the hotel website said they had for the areas Pax used.
    Even with being generous with the Paramount & Benaroya, Prime still falls well short of East.

    IhtGIyi.png
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    zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    I fully expect this to be similar to East. I think East started out with a short contract to test the waters, then once they realized the BCEC is perfect for pax they did the huge extension. If the San Antonio space isn't great after 2 years, they'll probably move it somewhere else for the 4th or 5th year. It looks like it will be a good spot though, with all the hotels nearby and in close proximity of the convention center. As East has shown, it's not /all/ about the surrounding area being great to make a good pax, and simply having close hotels will make things good.

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    TimDisasterTimDisaster San AntonioRegistered User regular
    zerzhul wrote: »
    I fully expect this to be similar to East. I think East started out with a short contract to test the waters, then once they realized the BCEC is perfect for pax they did the huge extension. If the San Antonio space isn't great after 2 years, they'll probably move it somewhere else for the 4th or 5th year. It looks like it will be a good spot though, with all the hotels nearby and in close proximity of the convention center. As East has shown, it's not /all/ about the surrounding area being great to make a good pax, and simply having close hotels will make things good.

    I agree, but Downtown San Antonio is quite small and full of interesting things to explore.

    Twitter: TimDisaster PSN: TimDisaster XBL: xTimDISASTERx
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    WickershamWickersham Registered User regular
    I agree, but Downtown San Antonio is quite small and full of interesting things to explore.

    This is true. The Alamo is half a mile from the convention center, the Riverwalk is across the street, and off the top of my head I can think of half a dozen outstanding bars and restaurants within walking distance.

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    QumadenQumaden World's Mightiest Mortal Registered User regular
    I was super happy when they announced this...since I live in San Antonio. I just hope I don't miss the badge sales for this like I do every other PAX and end up having to buy them off ebay.

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    zealezeale Saint LouisRegistered User regular
    Qumaden wrote: »
    I was super happy when they announced this...since I live in San Antonio. I just hope I don't miss the badge sales for this like I do every other PAX and end up having to buy them off ebay.

    Dibs on couch space!

    dgiab0m7h15x.png

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    DaNickaDaNicka Studly Nurd Peoples Republic Of Massachusetts, DunstableRegistered User regular
    What a nice thing to encroach on Magfest.

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    NickTheNewbieNickTheNewbie Registered User regular
    edited April 2014
    DaNicka wrote: »
    What a nice thing to encroach on Magfest.

    I don't blame them since they had no way of knowing. MAGFest has consistently been the first half of january for as long as I've been going. Also, they apparently did their market research and found only a 5% crossover between pax east and pax prime, so apparently geography is a pretty heavy influence.

    NickTheNewbie on
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    DolarrahDolarrah New JerseyRegistered User regular
    I could be wrong but tough to get bigger then BCEC anywhere in continental US in a dedicated convention center. After the new expansion they doing it is suppose to be the largest in the western hemisphere. As far as bigger being better in Texas, the best comment I heard was in Alaska.. If Texas is sick of being the second largest state, we can help them up, we could make 2 states out of Alaska, and then they would be third :)

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    PurpleSkyPurpleSky Registered User regular
    If all of PAX can fit in the Henry Gonzalez center then I think SA fits PAX. As far as I know, 4 PAX Easts in BCEC and things still haven't been moved off site. So obviously Boston was the right choice. Prime, well things were moved out of the convention center starting around 08/09ish I believe. Seattle does not fit prime but since it is the PA hometown an exception can be made, plus I love visiting Seattle :)

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    PurpleSkyPurpleSky Registered User regular
    To clarify when I say "does not fit" I mean in terms of physical space. Not in terms of atmosphere.

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    VGVideoGalaxyVGVideoGalaxy Northern VirginiaRegistered User regular
    Since I live near DC, I'll just stick to Magfest. East and Prime will most likely be the only two I go to.

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    QumadenQumaden World's Mightiest Mortal Registered User regular

    zeale wrote: »
    Qumaden wrote: »
    I was super happy when they announced this...since I live in San Antonio. I just hope I don't miss the badge sales for this like I do every other PAX and end up having to buy them off ebay.

    Dibs on couch space!

    Sadly, that space was spoken for within moments of the tweet!

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    jj4thjj4th Registered User regular
    So it's my hometown, making me a bit biased, but San Antonio is an awesome city. I wish they had gotten the Alamodome but I suppose that was always a pipe dream :) The new H.B.G. is actually pretty awesome, I've walked it before for a couple of local conventions. The theater is quite large and unlike the BCEC, there are a ton of hotels in the area. I will say one thing to those thinking of coming in for this... our airport is kind of lame, plan on a taxi or arranging for a hotel shuttle to downtown, don't even try the buses or you'll be waiting FOREVER. That said, you won't be paying what you would for a hotel near the BCEC or near the WSCC, and everything in downtown is within walking distance. I'm a 20+ year resident, so feel free to poke me with questions :)

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