Can you really go "lol mobile game" when the last 10 pages have been nothing but praise for a mobile game?
Yes.
You will never get me to seriously consider my phone a gaming device. It can kinda work for certain game types that don't need much in the way of precision input, but I'm not going to waste battery on my most vital link to the outside world when I have mobile gaming devices right here.
Also, there's the fact that microtransactions, no matter how tastefully implemented, piss me off and fuck anyone preying on people with that shit. It's fucking immoral.
You must not play any videogames anymore then. DLC is a micro transaction. I can't think of a single game that doesn't have some kind of dlc. Must suck not getting to play videogames anymore. Though there are some good classics.
Some DLC in console and PC gaming is a micro-transaction that offer nothing new and are just a shortcut to access existing content, like the cash cards bought in GTA Online. Other DLC, however, is legitimate extra content that is not accessed otherwise, like Red Dead Redemption's Undead Nightmare.
An overwhelming majority of mobile games are designed to take advantage of the former, using things like limited stamina bars or upgrade tokens to force the player to either walk away for some time (usually a day) or purchase to refill the counter. In this regard, Record Keeper seems to be pretty benign. I've seen some mobile games that put you in a situation where you need to use more tokens than can be earned naturally to beat the next level, usually by ramping up the difficulty and making the tokens the form of payment for upgrades. I admittedly don't know if FFRK does this, but I've yet to see them introduce a new, non-regenerating item used to hone an ability or upgrade equipment. In these cases, though, the player is left having to decide if (s)he is willing to spend the money or if (s)he's finished playing that game. I think it's games like those that Iwata had in mind when he used the term "free to start."
It's pretty disingenuous to compare freemium game microtransactions(what he's criticizing) directly to the DLC of games that use it to add meaningful or optional content to their games. Also, not every game has DLC but I'm you know that too.
It's still a micro transaction.
I'd say 90% of games have them now. Even bravely default did.
To expand as an example: FFRK has items in its cash grab gacha that add new limit breaks, which are meaningful additions to the gameplay.
While you may describe say the Dark Souls 2 DLCs where they added new areas, bosses, etc. as a "microtransaction," you'll have to accept that the word simply does not mean the same thing to most people, who regard microtransactions in the context of freemium games that are trying to get you to drop a dollar here or there.
Bravely default most definitely had microtransactions, which were greatly complained about because they were offensive and thankfully not needed.
If you describe DLC that are basically expansion packs as microtransactions, then you're the first person I've ever heard do so, so you'll have to be ready to have people be confused by you trying to compare the two like they're apples to apples.
I mean, most of us don't like DLC any more than we like microtransactions IF it feels like the developer just held something back to sell it later. That's offensive, just like microtransactions are, because most games that have them were clearly designed to try to subtly offend the player into spending money to keep playing or advance faster.
But if we're talking about like the Artorias of the Abyss DLC where it's a huge meaty expansion with new areas and bosses that they didn't have time nor budget to include in the base game, and enriches the game in a huge way, then at least we can be happy about buying that.
I have no dog in this fight because I'm not a fan of on the go gaming period. I've yet to see a mobile game that looks like it's worth my time. But more imortantly, I just don't like playing games on handheld devices period. I miss out on a lot of great games on 3ds and what not because I just don't like playing games on such systems. Maybe if I lived somewhere where I had to use public transport for hours a day or something I'd use them.
It's pretty disingenuous to compare freemium game microtransactions(what he's criticizing) directly to the DLC of games that use it to add meaningful or optional content to their games. Also, not every game has DLC but I'm you know that too.
It's still a micro transaction.
I'd say 90% of games have them now. Even bravely default did.
To expand as an example: FFRK has items in its cash grab gacha that add new limit breaks, which are meaningful additions to the gameplay.
So any distinction is a personal bias.
Except RK's gacha is a chance to get those new items, not guaranteed. You can spend and spend and spend and never get those items, so it's less "meaningful addition to gameplay" and more "lucky bonus if you ever draw it."
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DemonStaceyTTODewback's DaughterIn love with the TaySwayRegistered Userregular
It's pretty disingenuous to compare freemium game microtransactions(what he's criticizing) directly to the DLC of games that use it to add meaningful or optional content to their games. Also, not every game has DLC but I'm you know that too.
It's still a micro transaction.
I'd say 90% of games have them now. Even bravely default did.
To expand as an example: FFRK has items in its cash grab gacha that add new limit breaks, which are meaningful additions to the gameplay.
So any distinction is a personal bias.
The point is you *know* that's not what he meant when he said micro transactions. Unless you are just arguing the definition of the word which is needless pedantry.
Not that I thought I'd need to, but yes, when I say "microtransactions", I'm using the word the way that the mobile games industry does: to describe the small payments they attempt to coerce out of players.
A dollar to reset your bars.
A dollar for in-game currency.
A dollar for a chance at an item.
It's all built on the same principles as slot machines, attempting to get you to feed in one more coin, just one more coin, just one more coin. But unlike "real gambling", we don't regulate it and stick it in products people hand to their children.
Most people can be responsible about stuff like this, sure, but it's pretty shitty the way we're so accepting of companies that know their business model will prey unfairly upon a generation of future gambling addicts.
It's repulsive, and it's a large part of why I can't bring myself to play any of these things. I don't want to be another +1 to the download or player statistics.
I don't play games based on microtransactions not because I don't trust myself not to use them or even because I hate the idea of them. I don't play those games because I feel like any game that has them has been designed specifically to drive you to want to, which to me means a developer who has no integrity about the quality of their game.
If 20 years ago you said "What do you think video games would become if we told a bunch of MBAs at a consulting firm that video games are going to be super popular and asked them how they'd make money off them?" the answer would be what freemium mobile games are today. They're just little money making machines dressed up in a fun video game skin to pull dollars out of people.
All video games need to sell and make money, but there are way too many developers making quality games that don't have to do that for me to waste my time on the ones that do.
It's like when that dude at the EA shareholder meeting or whatever was daydreaming out loud about getting players of an FPS game less price sensitive so that when they run out of ammo in the middle of a mission they'd be willing to buy an ammo pack microtransaction. That's their dream, and it's fucking disgusting. I don't feel sorry for the white whales or people getting taken advantage of. I just can't support that shit because I don't want the entire industry to devolve into it.
In an interview with Famitsu, Square Enix's Shinji Hashimoto said that they have a considerable number of releases and announcements planned for PS4 this year. Please be excited! http://www.famitsu.com/news/201504/17076020.html
In an interview with Famitsu, Square Enix's Shinji Hashimoto said that they have a considerable number of releases and announcements planned for PS4 this year. Please be excited! http://www.famitsu.com/news/201504/17076020.html
In an interview with Famitsu, Square Enix's Shinji Hashimoto said that they have a considerable number of releases and announcements planned for PS4 this year. Please be excited! http://www.famitsu.com/news/201504/17076020.html
Please be excited.
I am willing to give them some begrudging anticipation.
It's pretty disingenuous to compare freemium game microtransactions(what he's criticizing) directly to the DLC of games that use it to add meaningful or optional content to their games. Also, not every game has DLC but I'm you know that too.
It's still a micro transaction.
I'd say 90% of games have them now. Even bravely default did.
To expand as an example: FFRK has items in its cash grab gacha that add new limit breaks, which are meaningful additions to the gameplay.
So any distinction is a personal bias.
The point is you *know* that's not what he meant when he said micro transactions. Unless you are just arguing the definition of the word which is needless pedantry.
This forum is nothing if not a hive of pedantry. That's like half the content of this particular thread even. It's pretty much the entire basis of any conversation about any character remotely female.
I see no reason not to continue this fine tradition.
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DemonStaceyTTODewback's DaughterIn love with the TaySwayRegistered Userregular
I don't play games based on microtransactions not because I don't trust myself not to use them or even because I hate the idea of them. I don't play those games because I feel like any game that has them has been designed specifically to drive you to want to, which to me means a developer who has no integrity about the quality of their game.
If 20 years ago you said "What do you think video games would become if we told a bunch of MBAs at a consulting firm that video games are going to be super popular and asked them how they'd make money off them?" the answer would be what freemium mobile games are today. They're just little money making machines dressed up in a fun video game skin to pull dollars out of people.
All video games need to sell and make money, but there are way too many developers making quality games that don't have to do that for me to waste my time on the ones that do.
It's like when that dude at the EA shareholder meeting or whatever was daydreaming out loud about getting players of an FPS game less price sensitive so that when they run out of ammo in the middle of a mission they'd be willing to buy an ammo pack microtransaction. That's their dream, and it's fucking disgusting. I don't feel sorry for the white whales or people getting taken advantage of. I just can't support that shit because I don't want the entire industry to devolve into it.
That was EA's CEO at the time John Riccitiello talking about the free to play model. But yeah, that's the point of it. If you don't want to support it, that's cool with me. :P
That said, you've (and many others) have skewed the context of that statement, because it was the idea that a player that has been playing for several hours of time being presented with that prompt for ammo; a more immediate example would be racing games in the arcade prompting you to pump coins in for 45 more seconds to try and beat the race mid-race. But essentially their dream is to bring back old school arcade pricing. That's all stamina/energy/etc is. You can't bait that specific level of engagement on a retail release, though if you make it free... and get a person hooked in, well. Yeah. But that's one form of micro-transaction; and quite possibly the oldest. (The worst offender (Edit: not so much worst as pretty blatant?): "WARRIOR NEEDS FOOD, BADLY.")
The other is one of convenience (buying currency/parts vs grinding).
The last is the gamble; the random packs. It could be argued to be a form of gambling though, but really I think that's kind of a reach. Though I do recall at least one case of a Japanese game with random packs that had some kind of legal regulations enforced upon it a few years ago for this reason.
tastydonuts on
“I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
FFRK is probably the best...um...toilet seat game I've played. Play for 5 minutes a couple times a day...hear some old nostalgic themes...get lootz...fun times.
I'm not far at all, like lv 8 ish, but I still have no idea where/how to spend money on the game. Like I can't find a menu or anything which allows purchases. I doubt I'll ever spend a dime, but this shit is hidden for me. Maybe it only appears when you run out of stamina??? I don't know. Lowest I've gotten my stamina is like 20.
A: Micro-transactions and DLC, as the terms are used in most conversations, are similar insofar as they're in-game purchases. The differece bet-... one of the differences between stuff like resetting bars and level packs are that the latter are static purchases that you keep. You can't, say, lose track of how much you've spent on level packs or new characters.
i'd say a good comparison would be to compare the in-app purchases in All The Bravest to those in Final Fantasy Dimensions.
B: The whole "extrapolate something different from the literal definitions of the words you used tactic is pretty goosey.
B2: Fighting goosery with goosery is never a noble endeavor.
C: Phone gaming on the can is fine, as long as you use your off-hand.
It's pretty disingenuous to compare freemium game microtransactions(what he's criticizing) directly to the DLC of games that use it to add meaningful or optional content to their games. Also, not every game has DLC but I'm you know that too.
It's still a micro transaction.
I'd say 90% of games have them now. Even bravely default did.
To expand as an example: FFRK has items in its cash grab gacha that add new limit breaks, which are meaningful additions to the gameplay.
So any distinction is a personal bias.
The point is you *know* that's not what he meant when he said micro transactions. Unless you are just arguing the definition of the word which is needless pedantry.
This forum is nothing if not a hive of pedantry. That's like half the content of this particular thread even. It's pretty much the entire basis of any conversation about any character remotely female.
I see no reason not to continue this fine tradition.
You can find another forum to talk about FF on, because you're done with it here.
Posts
Some DLC in console and PC gaming is a micro-transaction that offer nothing new and are just a shortcut to access existing content, like the cash cards bought in GTA Online. Other DLC, however, is legitimate extra content that is not accessed otherwise, like Red Dead Redemption's Undead Nightmare.
An overwhelming majority of mobile games are designed to take advantage of the former, using things like limited stamina bars or upgrade tokens to force the player to either walk away for some time (usually a day) or purchase to refill the counter. In this regard, Record Keeper seems to be pretty benign. I've seen some mobile games that put you in a situation where you need to use more tokens than can be earned naturally to beat the next level, usually by ramping up the difficulty and making the tokens the form of payment for upgrades. I admittedly don't know if FFRK does this, but I've yet to see them introduce a new, non-regenerating item used to hone an ability or upgrade equipment. In these cases, though, the player is left having to decide if (s)he is willing to spend the money or if (s)he's finished playing that game. I think it's games like those that Iwata had in mind when he used the term "free to start."
PSN: PLD_Xavier | NNID: Xavier1216
It's still a micro transaction.
I'd say 90% of games have them now. Even bravely default did.
To expand as an example: FFRK has items in its cash grab gacha that add new limit breaks, which are meaningful additions to the gameplay.
So any distinction is a personal bias.
Bravely default most definitely had microtransactions, which were greatly complained about because they were offensive and thankfully not needed.
If you describe DLC that are basically expansion packs as microtransactions, then you're the first person I've ever heard do so, so you'll have to be ready to have people be confused by you trying to compare the two like they're apples to apples.
I mean, most of us don't like DLC any more than we like microtransactions IF it feels like the developer just held something back to sell it later. That's offensive, just like microtransactions are, because most games that have them were clearly designed to try to subtly offend the player into spending money to keep playing or advance faster.
But if we're talking about like the Artorias of the Abyss DLC where it's a huge meaty expansion with new areas and bosses that they didn't have time nor budget to include in the base game, and enriches the game in a huge way, then at least we can be happy about buying that.
I have no dog in this fight because I'm not a fan of on the go gaming period. I've yet to see a mobile game that looks like it's worth my time. But more imortantly, I just don't like playing games on handheld devices period. I miss out on a lot of great games on 3ds and what not because I just don't like playing games on such systems. Maybe if I lived somewhere where I had to use public transport for hours a day or something I'd use them.
Except RK's gacha is a chance to get those new items, not guaranteed. You can spend and spend and spend and never get those items, so it's less "meaningful addition to gameplay" and more "lucky bonus if you ever draw it."
The point is you *know* that's not what he meant when he said micro transactions. Unless you are just arguing the definition of the word which is needless pedantry.
What you mean is THIS
And THIS is wrong so you are wrong
CHECKMATE L8R H8RS
A dollar to reset your bars.
A dollar for in-game currency.
A dollar for a chance at an item.
It's all built on the same principles as slot machines, attempting to get you to feed in one more coin, just one more coin, just one more coin. But unlike "real gambling", we don't regulate it and stick it in products people hand to their children.
Most people can be responsible about stuff like this, sure, but it's pretty shitty the way we're so accepting of companies that know their business model will prey unfairly upon a generation of future gambling addicts.
It's repulsive, and it's a large part of why I can't bring myself to play any of these things. I don't want to be another +1 to the download or player statistics.
If 20 years ago you said "What do you think video games would become if we told a bunch of MBAs at a consulting firm that video games are going to be super popular and asked them how they'd make money off them?" the answer would be what freemium mobile games are today. They're just little money making machines dressed up in a fun video game skin to pull dollars out of people.
All video games need to sell and make money, but there are way too many developers making quality games that don't have to do that for me to waste my time on the ones that do.
It's like when that dude at the EA shareholder meeting or whatever was daydreaming out loud about getting players of an FPS game less price sensitive so that when they run out of ammo in the middle of a mission they'd be willing to buy an ammo pack microtransaction. That's their dream, and it's fucking disgusting. I don't feel sorry for the white whales or people getting taken advantage of. I just can't support that shit because I don't want the entire industry to devolve into it.
Please be excited.
Blog||Tumblr|Steam|Twitter|FFXIV|Twitch|YouTube|Podcast|PSN|XBL|DarkZero
Please understand.
I am willing to give them some begrudging anticipation.
This forum is nothing if not a hive of pedantry. That's like half the content of this particular thread even. It's pretty much the entire basis of any conversation about any character remotely female.
I see no reason not to continue this fine tradition.
That was EA's CEO at the time John Riccitiello talking about the free to play model. But yeah, that's the point of it. If you don't want to support it, that's cool with me. :P
That said, you've (and many others) have skewed the context of that statement, because it was the idea that a player that has been playing for several hours of time being presented with that prompt for ammo; a more immediate example would be racing games in the arcade prompting you to pump coins in for 45 more seconds to try and beat the race mid-race. But essentially their dream is to bring back old school arcade pricing. That's all stamina/energy/etc is. You can't bait that specific level of engagement on a retail release, though if you make it free... and get a person hooked in, well. Yeah. But that's one form of micro-transaction; and quite possibly the oldest. (The worst offender (Edit: not so much worst as pretty blatant?): "WARRIOR NEEDS FOOD, BADLY.")
The other is one of convenience (buying currency/parts vs grinding).
The last is the gamble; the random packs. It could be argued to be a form of gambling though, but really I think that's kind of a reach. Though I do recall at least one case of a Japanese game with random packs that had some kind of legal regulations enforced upon it a few years ago for this reason.
I'm not far at all, like lv 8 ish, but I still have no idea where/how to spend money on the game. Like I can't find a menu or anything which allows purchases. I doubt I'll ever spend a dime, but this shit is hidden for me. Maybe it only appears when you run out of stamina??? I don't know. Lowest I've gotten my stamina is like 20.
you can borrow my phone...just don't touch the iPad :P
i'd say a good comparison would be to compare the in-app purchases in All The Bravest to those in Final Fantasy Dimensions.
B: The whole "extrapolate something different from the literal definitions of the words you used tactic is pretty goosey.
B2: Fighting goosery with goosery is never a noble endeavor.
C: Phone gaming on the can is fine, as long as you use your off-hand.
and/or are female, of course.
I don't know how long you take to pee, but I wouldn't have time for a single round
....new thread yet anyone?
If you're going 1 and 2, it's important.
Defeated...
You can find another forum to talk about FF on, because you're done with it here.