Did the plastic knife bypass my guard on Sir Fab, or was I roleblocked?
The knife was busdriven from deamon to sir fab. Your guard was busdriven from sir fab to deamon. Deamon set this up in consultation with sir fab.
And now you learn the lesson I did in the Denizen games: busdrivers make guards sad.
To a certain extent you were working upstream against the pretty well-ingrained expectations we all have about what'll be in any given game around here. Definitely a case where a bit more information for the village could've made a big difference.
I wouldn't have called it a normal game from the outset. I wasn't gonna have time to dig into a weird game and I don't think I was the only one who got blindsided by that.
Giving all villagers a role is always neat. Giving most villagers a role detrimental to the village is really throwing a heavy curve ball, especially when combined with my first point. I was gonna withdraw early but decided to stick it out, and was summarily confused the rest of the game. I don't think there was a chance for the village to learn the mechanics, nor would they have had the time to learn the mechanics. This game definitely was network-reliant, and we had a really bad bit of luck day 1 that prevented a network from really getting formed.
The evolving rate of disease also looks like a mechanic that would have been cooler with a larger game, along with at least one or two people who knew what the heck was going on. I wasn't even aware of most of the mechanics in play til post-game, and that's just weird to me, unless I was just that oblivious to what was going on.
Overall interesting mechanics that could easily see future use, but this was the most uninformed I've felt in a game for awhile. Thanks for running it disc, even if I spent a lot of it annoyed :P
And uh, did Sir Fab really agree to being busdriven when he already had a guard? >.<
Sir FabulousMalevolent Squid GodRegistered Userregular
Hey guys! Wow that was fun!
Unironically, that was fun!
As you may have learned, I got killed by busdriver shenanigans. It's truly unfortunate too. After the night was over, I probably would have formed a core network with Deamon, TRV and probably Heffling, which would have made things way easier.
Essentially, the way that the busdriver power worked was not to pick two targets every night and reverse them. Instead Deamon picked one target each night. On the first night, he picked TRV, and that did nothing.
Then, I asked him to Seer me on the second night (I didn't know he was a bdriver at this time). Most of the people that got back to me said that they had targeted me but actually received results on TRV, which is when I started piecing things together.
(On a tangent, I was really surprised Nion died green. He was the only person who targeted me that night and actually got a result for me, which of course made me think he was just a fibbing mafia.)
So at this point I thought that the bdriver required one day of setup, and then activated on the second day. I thought it was cool, because bdrivers are usually very powerful and I thought that this essentially even-day bdrivering was a cool mechanic.
I asked Deamon to target himself, thinking that it would set up something for Night 4, but instead it just changed the Sir Fab->TRV drive to a Sir Fab->Deamon drive. And then Deamon had the unfortunate luck of being targeted for a kill that night. Whoops!
Switch Friend Code: SW-1406-1275-7906
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AuralynxDarkness is a perspectiveWatching the ego workRegistered Userregular
Yeah, I think you were in a bit of a privileged position vis-a-vis enjoying this one, Sir Fab, but there was definitely a lot of potential out-of-the-box fun to be had In this design.
That was a fun Phalla, was a bit confusing, and I'll admit, I don't really understand the disease mechanics, even after the explanation. But still, looks like I was right in my guess I was a naive seer!
FTC: honk.
FTC: HONK.
PAX Prime 2014 Resistance Tournament Winner
I wouldn't have called it a normal game from the outset. I wasn't gonna have time to dig into a weird game and I don't think I was the only one who got blindsided by that.
About this:
I did this originally because I didn't think it would play that differently from a vanilla phalla, and because it seemed like a fun thing to be worked out day 1.
Honestly, I was expecting, if people didn't have time/effort for the seeing mechanics in this game, that they would dump all that information on someone else.
Now it didn't look like as many people did that day 2 to Sir Fab as I would've expected... Maybe they didn't believe the vig call when they realised I had turned everyone into seers?
I mean, I didn't even see the guard contact the vig.
And no-one at all dumped that information into the thread after Sir Fab died, which is what I expected to happen.
I mean, if your true information is out there, and there's multiple seers, then it doesn't really matter that much if the mafia takes a day to kill you if 2-3 more are running around figuring stuff out. At the very least, knowing other peoples targets would have helped the child power move around a bit.
And so long as you keep cycling targets in this case, then you can devote all your energy into analysing vote posts instead of worrying about the seeing game, which granted were a bit thin until I jumped on the inactivitus train.
This misjudgement aside, telling everyone that they were seers would have only really changed day 1.
The extended day day 1 was to set a few things up, but it was also to give the village time to realise that they were all seers.
Not telling the village about all the seers also meant that the vig would have to decide whether he told everyone that they were seers (as vig, guard, seer seer and mafia all knew that everyone thought they were seers), or get deluged by PMs the next day, which also didn't happen and made me sad.
Otherwise, there was no other information I could have really revealed to the village and have it make more sense.
The disease passing mechanic achieved a grand total of 2 swaps on day 1 and then none thereafter. If I had revealed this, all the villagers would have assumed their results were even more unreliable.
I couldn't reveal the disease names as that would have moved against the disease passing mechanic, as well as being fairly closely linked to the seer powers.
So in the end, I felt a bit bad about lying to the village about the seers, as it didn't really add anything and it did trick people into joining a game they may otherwise not have wanted to join.
Probably why I had so many inactives.
This was probably not enough:
Yeah, I didn't really figure out how my power worked until after I managed to get Sir Fab killed. I didn't feel too bad as I did it under his recommendation but it would have been much better if I had been taken out early. Oh well, it was a fun if crazy game. Thanks for running it discrider.
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38thDoelets never be stupid againwait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered Userregular
So I've only been in a few phallas but I'm learning that "standard phalla" is almost universally a lie
Only person you can trust to run a normal game and mean it is Ahava.
Standard games just aren't called standard games. They are called newbie phalla, or (title) phalla. Actually I think the spygame I ran a bit ago was pretty close to standard.
Standard games are standardly non standard should probably be in the OP of the Signup Thread.
@discrider Thank you for running the game. Was that the first one you ran?
Ironically, I think my biggest mistake in this game was tricking myself by originally calling this a vanilla game.
I had thought that by listing it as such would inform players that there was a vig and a guard and that they should reveal everything to the vig. Like in a vanilla game.
Now it seems that expecting all players to do this even in a vanilla game is a stretch. So in this game, where everyone is a seer, this was very unlikely, and I was just misleading myself.
Personally, it seems like the Mafia got really lucky with Day 1 seer kills and the busdriver death of Sir Fab.
Both of those really weakened the village. Now, maybe more cooperation after Day 2 would of helped, but we got a super good start and the village never seemed to recover.
If either of those events hadn't happened, the game may of ended very differently.
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38thDoelets never be stupid againwait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered Userregular
Posts
The knife was busdriven from deamon to sir fab. Your guard was busdriven from sir fab to deamon. Deamon set this up in consultation with sir fab.
And now you learn the lesson I did in the Denizen games: busdrivers make guards sad.
To a certain extent you were working upstream against the pretty well-ingrained expectations we all have about what'll be in any given game around here. Definitely a case where a bit more information for the village could've made a big difference.
I wouldn't have called it a normal game from the outset. I wasn't gonna have time to dig into a weird game and I don't think I was the only one who got blindsided by that.
Giving all villagers a role is always neat. Giving most villagers a role detrimental to the village is really throwing a heavy curve ball, especially when combined with my first point. I was gonna withdraw early but decided to stick it out, and was summarily confused the rest of the game. I don't think there was a chance for the village to learn the mechanics, nor would they have had the time to learn the mechanics. This game definitely was network-reliant, and we had a really bad bit of luck day 1 that prevented a network from really getting formed.
The evolving rate of disease also looks like a mechanic that would have been cooler with a larger game, along with at least one or two people who knew what the heck was going on. I wasn't even aware of most of the mechanics in play til post-game, and that's just weird to me, unless I was just that oblivious to what was going on.
Overall interesting mechanics that could easily see future use, but this was the most uninformed I've felt in a game for awhile. Thanks for running it disc, even if I spent a lot of it annoyed :P
And uh, did Sir Fab really agree to being busdriven when he already had a guard? >.<
Confusion will be my epitaph
Unironically, that was fun!
As you may have learned, I got killed by busdriver shenanigans. It's truly unfortunate too. After the night was over, I probably would have formed a core network with Deamon, TRV and probably Heffling, which would have made things way easier.
Essentially, the way that the busdriver power worked was not to pick two targets every night and reverse them. Instead Deamon picked one target each night. On the first night, he picked TRV, and that did nothing.
Then, I asked him to Seer me on the second night (I didn't know he was a bdriver at this time). Most of the people that got back to me said that they had targeted me but actually received results on TRV, which is when I started piecing things together.
(On a tangent, I was really surprised Nion died green. He was the only person who targeted me that night and actually got a result for me, which of course made me think he was just a fibbing mafia.)
So at this point I thought that the bdriver required one day of setup, and then activated on the second day. I thought it was cool, because bdrivers are usually very powerful and I thought that this essentially even-day bdrivering was a cool mechanic.
I asked Deamon to target himself, thinking that it would set up something for Night 4, but instead it just changed the Sir Fab->TRV drive to a Sir Fab->Deamon drive. And then Deamon had the unfortunate luck of being targeted for a kill that night. Whoops!
Switch Friend Code: SW-1406-1275-7906
Also everyone always thinks I'm mafia because I'm too quiet so I need to start posting every crazy theory that goes through my head
I'll be running a couple standard phalla later in the summer, for realsies. I need to test some behind-the-scenes management stuff.
And you know you can trust me
3DS Friend Code: 3110-5393-4113
Steam profile
Island Name: Felinefine
I'm laughing so hard right now.
People think everyone is mafia unless the narration proves otherwise.
3DS Friend Code: 3110-5393-4113
Steam profile
Says Kime. That's like the alcoholic telling you to lay off the booze.
FTC: HONK.
PAX Prime 2014 Resistance Tournament Winner
About this:
I did this originally because I didn't think it would play that differently from a vanilla phalla, and because it seemed like a fun thing to be worked out day 1.
Honestly, I was expecting, if people didn't have time/effort for the seeing mechanics in this game, that they would dump all that information on someone else.
Now it didn't look like as many people did that day 2 to Sir Fab as I would've expected... Maybe they didn't believe the vig call when they realised I had turned everyone into seers?
I mean, I didn't even see the guard contact the vig.
And no-one at all dumped that information into the thread after Sir Fab died, which is what I expected to happen.
I mean, if your true information is out there, and there's multiple seers, then it doesn't really matter that much if the mafia takes a day to kill you if 2-3 more are running around figuring stuff out. At the very least, knowing other peoples targets would have helped the child power move around a bit.
And so long as you keep cycling targets in this case, then you can devote all your energy into analysing vote posts instead of worrying about the seeing game, which granted were a bit thin until I jumped on the inactivitus train.
This misjudgement aside, telling everyone that they were seers would have only really changed day 1.
The extended day day 1 was to set a few things up, but it was also to give the village time to realise that they were all seers.
Not telling the village about all the seers also meant that the vig would have to decide whether he told everyone that they were seers (as vig, guard, seer seer and mafia all knew that everyone thought they were seers), or get deluged by PMs the next day, which also didn't happen and made me sad.
Otherwise, there was no other information I could have really revealed to the village and have it make more sense.
The disease passing mechanic achieved a grand total of 2 swaps on day 1 and then none thereafter. If I had revealed this, all the villagers would have assumed their results were even more unreliable.
I couldn't reveal the disease names as that would have moved against the disease passing mechanic, as well as being fairly closely linked to the seer powers.
So in the end, I felt a bit bad about lying to the village about the seers, as it didn't really add anything and it did trick people into joining a game they may otherwise not have wanted to join.
Probably why I had so many inactives.
This was probably not enough:
Only person you can trust to run a normal game and mean it is Ahava.
Standard games just aren't called standard games. They are called newbie phalla, or (title) phalla. Actually I think the spygame I ran a bit ago was pretty close to standard.
Standard games are standardly non standard should probably be in the OP of the Signup Thread.
@discrider Thank you for running the game. Was that the first one you ran?
i seered three people, two of them mafia (ebum and obi) and called void in the thread corretly?
damn. if only my seers turned up something other tan nothing
but then i seered Sir Fab om day 3 and then he died and i got his hat. but was told my ability adn't changed.
but it had? cause i was a vig. but i thought i was a useless seer so i targeted kime. and then killed him. oops.
so.confused.
sorry for failing at playing.
Democrats Abroad! || Vote From Abroad
Your role hadn't changed but your power had and announced itself to you.
I'm sorry for that confusion.
I ran a Portal themed everyone-has-busdrivers, two-competing-teams-and-mafia game last year.
I had thought that by listing it as such would inform players that there was a vig and a guard and that they should reveal everything to the vig. Like in a vanilla game.
Now it seems that expecting all players to do this even in a vanilla game is a stretch. So in this game, where everyone is a seer, this was very unlikely, and I was just misleading myself.
Submitted responses from the google form should now be viewable:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1UJ1BqdO6nru6Q-oh9d8wssLwrPXC4Fe7HsxEMxEU8dg/edit?usp=sharing
And the master spreadsheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1vYIUuHdAIeHTKC8NxuaFXY8S0G_CuuY-EfgIU3RwmjU/edit?usp=sharing
You just learned the first rule of mechanic-heavy games: The village will never coordinate as much or as effectively as you think they should.
Both of those really weakened the village. Now, maybe more cooperation after Day 2 would of helped, but we got a super good start and the village never seemed to recover.
If either of those events hadn't happened, the game may of ended very differently.
I think its just, the games never go the way they do in your head. Not ever. Not even once.
You should run more games.