dang, how come i figured out a way to have fun with the paladin quest right before i'm going to impulsively dust it? this thing makes for some epic games:
dang, how come i figured out a way to have fun with the paladin quest right before i'm going to impulsively dust it? this thing makes for some very fun games:
Impulsively disenchant?
I'd never disenchant something that has its own theme song.
"Galvadon! The last kaleidosaur. He's got stealth and a whole lot more.
Galvadon! The Last Kaleidosaur. He's not that bad if you don't dieeee turn four."
:whistle:Yeah
One, two, princes in your packs, now
That's what I said, yo
Princes, Princes who will bore you
Just dust ahead, now
One steals, life and taunts all classes
No 4 cards though,
This one, 3/3 is all he amasses
No 3 cards is bad yo
:whistle:
Le gasp! I have a gold one of those too! Thanks for the reminder! I do not have nearly as much dust stocked up as I did before Un'Goro, mostly due to the fact that they basically have two class legendaries per expansion now. I think it's cool they're adding in more cards and changing up how they're played and all, but it makes your dust that much more precious, so I don't end up crafting any legends until a month in once there's a consensus on which are worth it.
Anyway so since we still have time before KFT I wanna give some ~*Hot Takes*~ on the class design and direction this time around.
SPOILERED FOR LARRRRRGE
Warrior: Warrior seems to have a pretty solid vision and direction. They're pushing (non-Taunt?) Control and Tempo/Midrange, mostly the latter. Blood Razor seems crazy crazy good for both. Forge of Souls is an excellent tutor and will most certainly be run as a one-of in basically every deck. I'm not sure about Bring It On! and Dead Man's Hand, but they're interesting, at least. The rest definitely lean towards Tempo, we'll see how good they are. I'm pretty hopeful for Tempo! It looks solid.
Legendary/DK: I mean, I wanna believe, right. Rotface looks like a straight up better version of Confessor Paletress. There's obvious synergy here with Scourgelord Garrosh and all the other various whirlwind type effects. But maybe it's too slow and maybe Tempo Warrior just doesn't want it. Similarly, Scourgelord Garrosh was MADE for Tempo, giving you a really good weapon and Whirlwind as a Hero Power. But is it good enough? Hm.
Paladin: Pushing Divine Shield Aggro and Control. I'm not sure about the former, but goddamn does the latter look insane. A Charge+Lifesteal minion, Keeper of Uldaman as a 2 mana spell, Divine Shield tutor (good enough to run? Hm), Blackguard, DK Uther... All really really solid. Gonna be a contender. Divine Shield Aggro, though? Hmmm. I'm not sure the cards are good enough, honestly. Light's Sorrow seems ridiculously slow, I'm not sure an aggro deck really wants a 3 mana 2/2 (even if it tutors), Bolvar is a trashfire (get itttt)... Righteous Protecter seems good though. But I'm willing to bet that card could even see play in Control, so.
Legendary/DK: As noted, Bolvar is just awful. He was bad the first time around, he'll be bad this time around. He's just "pile of stats" except with a Divine Shield and a Divine Shield contingency. Ebon Blade Uther is fucking sick. 20 points of healing, 2/2s for a HP, and a potential way to literally win the game on the spot if your opponent can't clear them. Some people were theorycrafting an OTK with it (INCLUDING MYSELF, OKAY), and that's probably not exactly feasible. Just having them be 2/2s is really damn good and totally fine on its own. Buuuut maybe you do just, slot in Beardo anyway? Like, if you have two Horsemen on board already, Beardo wins you the game with one single spell that costs 3 or less. Not an OTK, but a wincon nonetheless.
Shaman: I mean, they finally realized that they can't just print a 1/3 weapon that gains +2 attack to try and push a slow Shaman archetype. Good on them! So Freeze Shaman. I'm really not sure about this. There's only like, what, 2 Freeze Synergies? Icebreaker (legit good! basically kill 3 minions when you have freezes) and Moorabi (ehhhhhh noooo? 6 mana 4/4, seems way too win more and not great. if you wanna refill your hand, spirit echo??). And sure they printed a bunch of new (good!) freeze cards like Voodoo Hexxer and Brrrloc (activators, not synergy cards), but I'm not sure 2 synergies an archtype makes. I will say that regardless of how Freeze Shaman turns out, I appreciate that they're trying to push the class in a radical new direction.
Legendary/DK: Moorabi is no bueno. 6 mana 4/4 win-more value card. And like I dunno, are they expecting you to freeze your own board or something? With that neutral one? Hm. Deathseer Thrall, though, is fantastic. Slots right into Token Shaman, easy. Very powerful DK.
Hunter: Welp. They're certainly pushing a slower Control-y Hunter, that's for certain. I applaud their effort, I really really do. The problem is, I'm not sure it's going to work. Secrets Hunter might come back in a big way, but will that morph into "Secrets Control Hunter" or just stay the tempo/midrange deck that it is? I want Control Hunter to work but I'm not sure it got the right tools. It got a LOT of tools, but not necessarily the ones it needed. Like Shaman, though, I do appreciate that they're pushing the class in a different direction.
Legendary/DK: Putricide is interesting. It's the Fandral/Lyra of the set, it demands an immediate answer or else it will snowball. And it can create secrets not included in your deck! That's really good. I'm willing to say it's good, but it depends on how good Secrets Hunter is. Deathstalker Rexxar.... aaaaagh, I really want this one to work. It's probably the coolest DK in my opinion, I love the Hero Power... but realistically I'm not sure Hunter can support it.
Rogue: Hmm. Rogue is a bit... scattered. A lil' bit all over the place. Not a particularly focused vision, but the cards are definitely good at least. Shadowblade looks great and fills a hole Rogue was missing. Doomerang looks KIND OF INSANE? Like literally recycle your weapon for free without losing any of the damage. Runeforge Haunter and Roll the Bones are interesting but I don't think they're good? Leeching Poison seems decent...? But hard to say (maybe Rogue would just rather run Bloodworm instead, idk). Plague Scientist has interesting applications, might replace SI:7 in some lists. Bone Baron seems pretty decent, actually, gives extra combo/Sherazin activators. Spectral Pillager seems pretty cool, but Vilespine exists, soooo.
Legendary/DK: Lilian Voss... I said in the thread earlier that I think she has potential. People said Shaku was gonna be bad, too, and he turned out to be pretty good. I mean, hey, never count out gaining random spells from your opponent, that's a powerful effect. Valeera the Hollow looks fucking nuts. I can't wait to see what people do with that.
Druid: Ummmm... Ehhhhh.... I mean, okay. They had a goal for Druid at least, right? Slow/Control-y! I get it, I see it, I understand it. I don't think most of those cards are very good. Crypt Lord maybe has a place in Aggro Druid, but then again Tar Creeper at least contests stuff on opponent's turn. Spreading Plague is MUCH worse now that we've seen how it works; it's not Unleash the Scarabs. Webweave/Druid of the Swarm are much too slow and not that good. Fatespinner.... probably not good enough, sadly. Gnash is interesting, literally just 3 mana Bite/Claw... but maybe not good enough. Bolster Bear (Strongshell Scavenger) was clearly meant to be comboed with the dumb Scarabs, but it's not good enough. Ultimate Infestion is VERY good and perhaps one of the only playable Druid cards. Not looking great for Druid this go-around.
Legendary/DK: Hardline stance: Hadronox is good. It is a good fuckin' card, come at me, I'll fight you in the streets. "But you get a bunch of 1/5s and shit from it!!" Then don't build your deck that way! Build a Ramp Taunt Druid deck instead, include high value cards like BogChamps and PrimoDrakes and Dark Arakkoa and The Lich King... etc etc etc. Like, it's N'Zoth but for Taunts, and you wouldn't build a N'Zoth deck full of dinkers, right? For Malfurion the Pestilent.... I wanna say it's good, but I'm not sure what deck would run it...? Maybe just slap him in Ramp Druid? Hm.
Mage: Uhhhhh, whoof. Whoof. There's barely any sort of direction here. A random smattering of ideas, a mishmash of thoughts, an assortment of concepts. No sort of congruity here to be found. They're trying to push "Frozen Mage" again, but the only synergy cards are Cryomancer and now Coldwraith (and new activators as well, but they're not synergy cards). And like Shaman, I'm not sure two synergies an archetype makes. There's some new Secret cards? Frost Clone seems... bad, Glacial Mysteries is unplayable. Ghastly Conjurer might've been good if it had taunt itself, Doomed Apprentice is meh, Simulacrum is just... what??? At least Burn/Secrets/Freeze Mage will still be a thing...
Legendary/DK: Frost Lich Jaina seems good. You can pull off a slower Elemental deck literally because Ice Block exists. If Ice Block were not a thing I'd question it. But it is, and thus it can work. Will it be good? Questionable, there weren't any new Elementals printed (I mean there was, but it's not good), but maybe the standard Elemental Shell can work. Sindragosa seems neat! Obvious synergy with this theoretical Elemental Control Mage. Ping off the Frozen Champ, summon a Water Ele, get a random Legendary in hand, repeat the next turn! Definitely slanted towards a slower deck.
Warlock: Hrrrrrrnnn. They tried to print some new Zoo/Discard cards and also a few new Handlock cards. I'm not sold. Howlfiend might be okay for Disco Zoo (3 mana 3/6? hmmm!), Sanguine Reveler doesn't seem good enough. Unwilling Sacrifice is lul. Gnomeferatu is a River Crocolisk. Treachery might seem good with Doomsayer for Handlock, but it's a dead card otherwise (and probably isn't needed with the million board clears it has). Defile seems fucking great. Drain Soul seems decent. Despicable Dreadlord seems good. I'm not sure those three cards are enough to push Handlock back into existence though.
Legendary/DK: Lana'thel is... bleh. I get it! I get it. You can pump her up and ohhhh man lookit that lifesteal she gives you, whoaaa! But she seems flimsy, and is a control-slanted card for an aggro-slanted deck. And like, if Handlock wants Lifesteal, hello Bloodworm? Bloodreaver Gul'dan... Man it seems powerful. The problem though is that there's just, not enough good Demons for the battlecry? I'm sure this card is gonna be crazy in Wild. But I don't think it's good enough for Standard, even with the insane Hero Power. Also, consider this: It's a Control card, meant for Handlock (or... Demon... Handlock...??), but Handlock already has a much better Hero Card already with Jaraxxus. THE OG HERO CARD.
Priest: Hoooooo boy Priest got some good good shit. Spirit Lash is incredible, the return of Resurrect Priest, Entomb 2.0, an incredible lategame minion (deathrattle!!), three total Lifesteal cards... aaaand some memes. Also while not strictly a Priest card (though it MIGHT AS WELL BE), Bone Drake fits right into Dragon Priest. And it can pull Dragons from other classes!
Legendary/DK: Archbishop Benedictus is... *barf*. I mean it's just, ugh. What a waste of a Legendary card. It's memetrash! It's just memes. Shadowreaper is interesting though. I guess you slot him into Control Priest or something? Is this something Dragon Priest can even run, or? Huh. It's not meant to be some kind of insane 9-card OTK (sigh, thanks Reddit), it's just meant to provide extra removal/board control. Or some extra face damage sometimes? I think it's... good... but.... Ehhhh. Yeah I dunno! I dunno what kind of Priest deck could really utilize this. "I think it's good, but" seems to be the central theme of this expac, huh.
THAT'S IT. If I had to rank the DK cards:
Top Tierest: Uther, Thrall... Valeera?? Donais said she was busted, I will trust him this time even if I can't see it in my head quite yet.
Still Pretty Decent Tier: Jaina, Malfurion
I Honestly Have No Idea Tier: Rexxar??? Garrosh???? Rexxar and Garrosh depend on whether or not the decks can actually work... If yes, they get bumped up to Still Pretty Decent. If not, they get bumped down to Maybe Next Time.
Maybe Next Time Tier: Gul'dan, Anduin. Gul'dan just doesn't have enough support I think, and... I dunno, I'm just not sure what sort of Priest deck can actually utilize Anduin. It's a pretty big tradeoff to lose the ability to heal your board/face.
Edit: Also I touched on this on my other post about Neutrals a bit, but prediction for most underrated Neutral card in the set: Bloodworm. Neutral Lifesteal, 5 mana 4/4. Azure Drake was the same statline, albeit with cycle/spellpower over Lifesteal. But more often than not, it'd stick. I think Bloodworm can get a lot of potential value and will be able to stick. Even if it doesn't, it's still 4 points of healing. It's good! I think it's good and will surprise people. And HEY, it's a Beast! That can get drawn from Curator!! Not bad at all.
Dibby on
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
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3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
Garrosh for me is basically a question of, is it better than Taunt Warrior.
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AuralynxDarkness is a perspectiveWatching the ego workRegistered Userregular
Opening packs permitting, I think I may try a Tempo Warrior that includes Brass Knuckles and / or Fool's Bane pulls via Forge of Souls. I'm not sure that's the way to go but it seems like it may be the best way to enable the Swiss Army Knife weapons.
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GoodKingJayIIIThey wanna get mygold on the ceilingRegistered Userregular
I think quest warrior and DK warrior want to do different things. The former wants a nice slow game because it has inevitability on its side, but I think the new Garrosh pushes a much more proactive and aggressive approach. It's not all in like pirate warrior, but it'll want to do a lot more than drop a taunt every turn, and in fact it might be more interesting to play because there is potentially more decision making. Garrosh has such great synergy with so many warrior cards and the weapon is bonkers for controlling the board so your minions can punch through.
Is he good enough? Yeah I dunno, maybe a deck like that doesn't want a 9 cost card, but I think he has potential to push a certain kind of warrior we haven't seen in a while.
I discovered the class-specific theorycrafting threads on the competitiveHS subreddit yesterday and fell in love with the insane depth of analysis there. Threads are populated with lots of people who exclusively pilot one class (or have been focusing on making one class super viable), so you get tons of history-of-the-class analysis and lots of kinda unique and quirky ideas. I hit up the Rogue thread for like my entire lunch break and loved delving into the up-and-down history and all of the "what if" commentary.
But because I am a flighty idiot, I am now gravitating towards trying to make C'Thun Druid viable again. I guess none of this matters because the meta is going to be a hilarious mess as of this afternoon and I'm going to try to use whatever I open in my packs rather than crafting anything out of the gate.
Edit: Btw, I finally downloaded Hearthstone Deck Tracker last night. It's super easy to use, and it's going to be really, really useful in helping me remember what's in the bizarre, constantly-changing decks that I put together starting tonight. Also love that it tracks W-L, because I typically do that on paper when I'm trying to see if something is working.
Posts
a.m. Morning. 4 hours past midnight tonight.
I'm gunna be taking a nap in a while so I can last out that long. I needs to open packsssss.
Impulsively disenchant?
I'd never disenchant something that has its own theme song.
https://youtu.be/d83RIvWsYZg?t=5m127s
"Galvadon! The last kaleidosaur. He's got stealth and a whole lot more.
Galvadon! The Last Kaleidosaur. He's not that bad if you don't dieeee turn four."
That should wait until the heat death of the universe, my dude.
I've been holding off opening packs until then.
Yes, it's in. Opening party!
One, two, princes in your packs, now
That's what I said, yo
Princes, Princes who will bore you
Just dust ahead, now
One steals, life and taunts all classes
No 4 cards though,
This one, 3/3 is all he amasses
No 3 cards is bad yo
:whistle:
Le gasp! I have a gold one of those too! Thanks for the reminder! I do not have nearly as much dust stocked up as I did before Un'Goro, mostly due to the fact that they basically have two class legendaries per expansion now. I think it's cool they're adding in more cards and changing up how they're played and all, but it makes your dust that much more precious, so I don't end up crafting any legends until a month in once there's a consensus on which are worth it.
the other guys are just traaaaaashhhh
yeah you sure fucked up not having extra dust two years later
So I have this great Prince deck idea....
Steam: betsuni7
Are you sure it doesnt start until FT unlock?
And all the Old Gods.
We should have a Prince-decks only mini tournament!
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
You monster.
Fuck it, make it Highlander as well. God is dead and life has no purpose.
Think about it, the two drop one buffs C'thun! The synergy!!!!
SPOILERED FOR LARRRRRGE
Paladin: Pushing Divine Shield Aggro and Control. I'm not sure about the former, but goddamn does the latter look insane. A Charge+Lifesteal minion, Keeper of Uldaman as a 2 mana spell, Divine Shield tutor (good enough to run? Hm), Blackguard, DK Uther... All really really solid. Gonna be a contender. Divine Shield Aggro, though? Hmmm. I'm not sure the cards are good enough, honestly. Light's Sorrow seems ridiculously slow, I'm not sure an aggro deck really wants a 3 mana 2/2 (even if it tutors), Bolvar is a trashfire (get itttt)... Righteous Protecter seems good though. But I'm willing to bet that card could even see play in Control, so.
Shaman: I mean, they finally realized that they can't just print a 1/3 weapon that gains +2 attack to try and push a slow Shaman archetype. Good on them! So Freeze Shaman. I'm really not sure about this. There's only like, what, 2 Freeze Synergies? Icebreaker (legit good! basically kill 3 minions when you have freezes) and Moorabi (ehhhhhh noooo? 6 mana 4/4, seems way too win more and not great. if you wanna refill your hand, spirit echo??). And sure they printed a bunch of new (good!) freeze cards like Voodoo Hexxer and Brrrloc (activators, not synergy cards), but I'm not sure 2 synergies an archtype makes. I will say that regardless of how Freeze Shaman turns out, I appreciate that they're trying to push the class in a radical new direction.
Hunter: Welp. They're certainly pushing a slower Control-y Hunter, that's for certain. I applaud their effort, I really really do. The problem is, I'm not sure it's going to work. Secrets Hunter might come back in a big way, but will that morph into "Secrets Control Hunter" or just stay the tempo/midrange deck that it is? I want Control Hunter to work but I'm not sure it got the right tools. It got a LOT of tools, but not necessarily the ones it needed. Like Shaman, though, I do appreciate that they're pushing the class in a different direction.
Rogue: Hmm. Rogue is a bit... scattered. A lil' bit all over the place. Not a particularly focused vision, but the cards are definitely good at least. Shadowblade looks great and fills a hole Rogue was missing. Doomerang looks KIND OF INSANE? Like literally recycle your weapon for free without losing any of the damage. Runeforge Haunter and Roll the Bones are interesting but I don't think they're good? Leeching Poison seems decent...? But hard to say (maybe Rogue would just rather run Bloodworm instead, idk). Plague Scientist has interesting applications, might replace SI:7 in some lists. Bone Baron seems pretty decent, actually, gives extra combo/Sherazin activators. Spectral Pillager seems pretty cool, but Vilespine exists, soooo.
Druid: Ummmm... Ehhhhh.... I mean, okay. They had a goal for Druid at least, right? Slow/Control-y! I get it, I see it, I understand it. I don't think most of those cards are very good. Crypt Lord maybe has a place in Aggro Druid, but then again Tar Creeper at least contests stuff on opponent's turn. Spreading Plague is MUCH worse now that we've seen how it works; it's not Unleash the Scarabs. Webweave/Druid of the Swarm are much too slow and not that good. Fatespinner.... probably not good enough, sadly. Gnash is interesting, literally just 3 mana Bite/Claw... but maybe not good enough. Bolster Bear (Strongshell Scavenger) was clearly meant to be comboed with the dumb Scarabs, but it's not good enough. Ultimate Infestion is VERY good and perhaps one of the only playable Druid cards. Not looking great for Druid this go-around.
Mage: Uhhhhh, whoof. Whoof. There's barely any sort of direction here. A random smattering of ideas, a mishmash of thoughts, an assortment of concepts. No sort of congruity here to be found. They're trying to push "Frozen Mage" again, but the only synergy cards are Cryomancer and now Coldwraith (and new activators as well, but they're not synergy cards). And like Shaman, I'm not sure two synergies an archetype makes. There's some new Secret cards? Frost Clone seems... bad, Glacial Mysteries is unplayable. Ghastly Conjurer might've been good if it had taunt itself, Doomed Apprentice is meh, Simulacrum is just... what??? At least Burn/Secrets/Freeze Mage will still be a thing...
Warlock: Hrrrrrrnnn. They tried to print some new Zoo/Discard cards and also a few new Handlock cards. I'm not sold. Howlfiend might be okay for Disco Zoo (3 mana 3/6? hmmm!), Sanguine Reveler doesn't seem good enough. Unwilling Sacrifice is lul. Gnomeferatu is a River Crocolisk. Treachery might seem good with Doomsayer for Handlock, but it's a dead card otherwise (and probably isn't needed with the million board clears it has). Defile seems fucking great. Drain Soul seems decent. Despicable Dreadlord seems good. I'm not sure those three cards are enough to push Handlock back into existence though.
Priest: Hoooooo boy Priest got some good good shit. Spirit Lash is incredible, the return of Resurrect Priest, Entomb 2.0, an incredible lategame minion (deathrattle!!), three total Lifesteal cards... aaaand some memes. Also while not strictly a Priest card (though it MIGHT AS WELL BE), Bone Drake fits right into Dragon Priest. And it can pull Dragons from other classes!
THAT'S IT. If I had to rank the DK cards:
Top Tierest: Uther, Thrall... Valeera?? Donais said she was busted, I will trust him this time even if I can't see it in my head quite yet.
Still Pretty Decent Tier: Jaina, Malfurion
I Honestly Have No Idea Tier: Rexxar??? Garrosh???? Rexxar and Garrosh depend on whether or not the decks can actually work... If yes, they get bumped up to Still Pretty Decent. If not, they get bumped down to Maybe Next Time.
Maybe Next Time Tier: Gul'dan, Anduin. Gul'dan just doesn't have enough support I think, and... I dunno, I'm just not sure what sort of Priest deck can actually utilize Anduin. It's a pretty big tradeoff to lose the ability to heal your board/face.
Edit: Also I touched on this on my other post about Neutrals a bit, but prediction for most underrated Neutral card in the set: Bloodworm. Neutral Lifesteal, 5 mana 4/4. Azure Drake was the same statline, albeit with cycle/spellpower over Lifesteal. But more often than not, it'd stick. I think Bloodworm can get a lot of potential value and will be able to stick. Even if it doesn't, it's still 4 points of healing. It's good! I think it's good and will surprise people. And HEY, it's a Beast! That can get drawn from Curator!! Not bad at all.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Is he good enough? Yeah I dunno, maybe a deck like that doesn't want a 9 cost card, but I think he has potential to push a certain kind of warrior we haven't seen in a while.
the word tempo has lost all meaning
it is hilariously anti-tempo
it is the slowest possible fucking thing you could be doing in that deck
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
And you can always activate Grom with hero power past turn 9
e: I'd say gaining 5 armor and equipping a flamestrike is worth 8 mana since flamestrike is 7 and iron hide is 1
Maths!
I'm pretty sure The Lich King is a tempo card!
go play Gnash
I'm not totally convinced "tempo" ever had any meaning in the context of card games.
Savage.
Steam ID: Obos Vent: Obos
1) DK Valeera is OP
2) DK Uther is overrated
3) Control paladin will be tier 1 at launch and tier 2-3 by month 2.
4) Priest struggles to find tier 2 decks. (This will be evident by week 3-4)
5) Zoo warlock makes a comback at some point during the meta.
6) Token druid, control mage, valeera rogue, and evo shaman are top decks by week 3.
7) People continue to play pirate warrior and jade druid which stay high tier 2 and shit on everything. At least try something new people!
that's been in the meta forever tho
But because I am a flighty idiot, I am now gravitating towards trying to make C'Thun Druid viable again. I guess none of this matters because the meta is going to be a hilarious mess as of this afternoon and I'm going to try to use whatever I open in my packs rather than crafting anything out of the gate.
Edit: Btw, I finally downloaded Hearthstone Deck Tracker last night. It's super easy to use, and it's going to be really, really useful in helping me remember what's in the bizarre, constantly-changing decks that I put together starting tonight. Also love that it tracks W-L, because I typically do that on paper when I'm trying to see if something is working.
It does, just most people don't understand it or use it incorrectly to express the idea of gaining board control.