I feel like we already saw a bunch of people connected to Mr. Stone/Stone JR subpoenaed or am I just having crazy deja vu?
There's one guy who has been fighting his subpoena for months now, Andrew Miller.
At first I thought this was the one that got drunk/high and then went on pretty much all the daytime news shows in one day saying he’d ignore the subpoena, and was shocked he was still at it, but apparently I was thinking of Nunberg.
No wonder it’s taking months to get Stone.
Especially if they're going through the criminals alphabetically.
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BrodyThe WatchThe First ShoreRegistered Userregular
Holy shit I am dreading what tomorrow might bring. Or potentially even worse, that tomorrow goes by and nothing happens.
"I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."
I don't see her original source for this, but Marcy Wheeler says Mueller apparently ended his pursuit of Andrew Miller's testimony, which was supposed to be the hold up on Stone's indictment.
Also Concord Management, one of the indicted Russian firms, dropped their appeal. Which I think Kavanaugh was scheduled to hear.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
I don't see her original source for this, but Marcy Wheeler says Mueller apparently ended his pursuit of Andrew Miller's testimony, which was supposed to be the hold up on Stone's indictment.
Also Concord Management, one of the indicted Russian firms, dropped their appeal. Which I think Kavanaugh was scheduled to hear.
Does that mean Mueller gave up on getting that testimony or that maybe he found other evidence that would replace the need for that testimony against Stone?
No, I am not really communist. Yes, it is weird that I use this name.
I don't see her original source for this, but Marcy Wheeler says Mueller apparently ended his pursuit of Andrew Miller's testimony, which was supposed to be the hold up on Stone's indictment.
Also Concord Management, one of the indicted Russian firms, dropped their appeal. Which I think Kavanaugh was scheduled to hear.
Does that mean Mueller gave up on getting that testimony or that maybe he found other evidence that would replace the need for that testimony against Stone?
I would imagine he views it as nice to have but not required.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
I don't see her original source for this, but Marcy Wheeler says Mueller apparently ended his pursuit of Andrew Miller's testimony, which was supposed to be the hold up on Stone's indictment.
Also Concord Management, one of the indicted Russian firms, dropped their appeal. Which I think Kavanaugh was scheduled to hear.
Does that mean Mueller gave up on getting that testimony or that maybe he found other evidence that would replace the need for that testimony against Stone?
I would imagine he views it as nice to have but not required.
at this point anything Mueller wants has to be just another nail in a coffin made entirely out of nails.
Popehat is Ken White popular commentator and 1st amendment lawyer. The AP is a news service. Rudy Giuliani is some kinda lawyer guy.
EDIT: I'm taking this to be official. But if it was all theater, why let his previous lawyer put him through interview rehearsals?
Maybe it was a means to prove to him how unprepared he was.
Maybe it was the fear he would just decide one day to barge into Muller's office and demand an immediate interview.
Or it was all just theater meant to waste everyone's god damn time.
He's a shy overambitious dog-catcher on the wrong side of the law. She's an orphaned psychic mercenary with the power to bend men's minds. They fight crime!
Probably because they didn't put him through one. The ignorant asshole himself demanded it because he has the best brain, biggest hands, and definitely can run rhetorical rings around some pissant investigation.
So George Papadopoulus is asking for leniency from the judge ahead of his sentencing later today. It'll be interesting to see what happens. His status as coffee boy may help but I'm hoping the judge uses this as a message to others that are implicated. Scare more people into making deals or cooperating.
Makes me think the president is aware of something big coming out in the news and was being defensive about it but the news has not yet broken so he kinda gave himself away.
We've seen this pattern in the past where a tweet or rant came out of left field only for us to find out a month later that such and such was interviewed by Mueller.
Honestly, it seemed to me like the kind of flat denial an innocent person would make.
He’s clearly not innocent, I just wouldn’t read into that particular denial very much. He’s not Kavanaugh who spent the last few days trying (and failing) to tip toe around committing perjury by saying he did or didn’t do very specific things.
The important part here is "He went to jail". At white collar crime levels that alone can be inconceivable.
His low-end sentencing guideline range was probation only, so any kind of custodial sentence is significant, especially in the absence of a strong recommendation from the government.
The important part here is "He went to jail". At white collar crime levels that alone can be inconceivable.
Part of the problem withe white collar crime is the disparity between punishment based on the damages done when you compare it to what the rest of society faces for less. People causing billions of dollars of harm face less penalty than someone who smoke a little pot.
So no it's not okay that he goes to prison for just fourteen days. Yes, good he goes to prison, but it's a fucking joke of a sentence.
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Drake ChambersLay out my formal shorts.Registered Userregular
The important part here is "He went to jail". At white collar crime levels that alone can be inconceivable.
Part of the problem withe white collar crime is the disparity between punishment based on the damages done when you compare it to what the rest of society faces for less. People causing billions of dollars of harm face less penalty than someone who smoke a little pot.
So no it's not okay that he goes to prison for just fourteen days. Yes, good he goes to prison, but it's a fucking joke of a sentence.
More significant than any amount of jail time he might have received (between 0 and 6 months) is the fact that he's now a convicted felon, which carries more lifelong implications for his future prospects than the unpleasantness of a couple of months in jail would have amounted to.
I understand and empathize when people are upset to see white-collar criminals seemingly getting off easy with light prison sentences, but I think an important aspect of the purpose of the criminal justice system ends up being lost in the emotional desire for what basically amounts to vengeance. Felony convictions in many cases will serve their purpose in that they effectively bar the convict from ever again working in whatever industry previously employed them, thus protecting the public.
I say all this just to nudge people away from the fringes of "thieves and liars should be put away for life!". I'm in your camp -- I wish they went to prison for longer! -- but I get why they don't and having some perspective helps me not be as angry about it.
The important part here is "He went to jail". At white collar crime levels that alone can be inconceivable.
Part of the problem withe white collar crime is the disparity between punishment based on the damages done when you compare it to what the rest of society faces for less. People causing billions of dollars of harm face less penalty than someone who smoke a little pot.
So no it's not okay that he goes to prison for just fourteen days. Yes, good he goes to prison, but it's a fucking joke of a sentence.
More significant than any amount of jail time he might have received (between 0 and 6 months) is the fact that he's now a convicted felon, which carries more lifelong implications for his future prospects than the unpleasantness of a couple of months in jail would have amounted to.
I understand and empathize when people are upset to see white-collar criminals seemingly getting off easy with light prison sentences, but I think an important aspect of the purpose of the criminal justice system ends up being lost in the emotional desire for what basically amounts to vengeance. Felony convictions in many cases will serve their purpose in that they effectively bar the convict from ever again working in whatever industry previously employed them, thus protecting the public.
I say all this just to nudge people away from the fringes of "thieves and liars should be put away for life!". I'm in your camp -- I wish they went to prison for longer! -- but I get why they don't and having some perspective helps me not be as angry about it.
So the cap of your post is that it is wrong to be angry? Because that's how I'm reading it. Is anyone else reading it this way?
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Especially if they're going through the criminals alphabetically.
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Yo reread the politics rules thread. We don't need Friday news speculation.
Also Concord Management, one of the indicted Russian firms, dropped their appeal. Which I think Kavanaugh was scheduled to hear.
Does that mean Mueller gave up on getting that testimony or that maybe he found other evidence that would replace the need for that testimony against Stone?
I would imagine he views it as nice to have but not required.
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609
Popehat is Ken White popular commentator and 1st amendment lawyer. The AP is a news service. Rudy Giuliani is some kinda lawyer guy.
EDIT: I'm taking this to be official. But if it was all theater, why let his previous lawyer put him through interview rehearsals?
Maybe it was a means to prove to him how unprepared he was.
Maybe it was the fear he would just decide one day to barge into Muller's office and demand an immediate interview.
Or it was all just theater meant to waste everyone's god damn time.
OR
Can you just imagine if Obama or Clinton pulled this stunt.
OR
Fuck these people forever.
Depends how Kavanaugh goes.
pleasepaypreacher.net
Chuck Todd's source is Rudy Giuliani. Nobody from Mueller leaks.
Link CNN or CNBC.
This means his son and son in law don't love America, right?
At least if prior statements relation to truth continues.
pleasepaypreacher.net
We've seen this pattern in the past where a tweet or rant came out of left field only for us to find out a month later that such and such was interviewed by Mueller.
Honestly, it seemed to me like the kind of flat denial an innocent person would make.
He’s clearly not innocent, I just wouldn’t read into that particular denial very much. He’s not Kavanaugh who spent the last few days trying (and failing) to tip toe around committing perjury by saying he did or didn’t do very specific things.
Active participation or knowledge makes it worse, of course.
pleasepaypreacher.net
I hope it's that low because of cooperation?
His low-end sentencing guideline range was probation only, so any kind of custodial sentence is significant, especially in the absence of a strong recommendation from the government.
Padaopoulos can not guarantee he didn't tell trump about russia, what the fuck does that mean?
pleasepaypreacher.net
So no it's not okay that he goes to prison for just fourteen days. Yes, good he goes to prison, but it's a fucking joke of a sentence.
More significant than any amount of jail time he might have received (between 0 and 6 months) is the fact that he's now a convicted felon, which carries more lifelong implications for his future prospects than the unpleasantness of a couple of months in jail would have amounted to.
I understand and empathize when people are upset to see white-collar criminals seemingly getting off easy with light prison sentences, but I think an important aspect of the purpose of the criminal justice system ends up being lost in the emotional desire for what basically amounts to vengeance. Felony convictions in many cases will serve their purpose in that they effectively bar the convict from ever again working in whatever industry previously employed them, thus protecting the public.
I say all this just to nudge people away from the fringes of "thieves and liars should be put away for life!". I'm in your camp -- I wish they went to prison for longer! -- but I get why they don't and having some perspective helps me not be as angry about it.
I don't think the man actually understands what love is.