it was heartbreaking how they both thought he left her sixty years ago in real time, hits you right in the feels.
I understand that there's some theories out there that
that was supposed to be the ending until Coleman decided to stay on board for S9...buuuuut....I dunno; given that the scene was virtually identical to the scene in Time of the Doctor when 11 had grown so old; just in reverse, it felt purposefully 'false' to me.
it was heartbreaking how they both thought he left her sixty years ago in real time, hits you right in the feels.
I understand that there's some theories out there that
that was supposed to be the ending until Coleman decided to stay on board for S9...buuuuut....I dunno; given that the scene was virtually identical to the scene in Time of the Doctor when 11 had grown so old; just in reverse, it felt purposefully 'false' to me.
But we'll probably never know.
Regardless, the outcome we got was the best one!
Clara's grown on me from last season. She gels perfectly with this Doctor.
It kind of goes a bit against what Eleven said to Jo Grant in SJA ("It's like someone baked you."), but I don't care.
I thought it was a clear indication that he was
finally starting to mature as a person.
Hell, I just rewatched 11's run and there's indications all throughout this series from the very get-go that his companions have been having a lasting affect on him. This is just another one of those.
It kind of goes a bit against what Eleven said to Jo Grant in SJA ("It's like someone baked you."), but I don't care.
Well Eleven was all about youth and hiding age( look at what he did to old Amy). 12 has come to terms with that part of himself and he doesn't see people for what they look like just who they are his constant inability to realize Clara looks different aren't just jokes with this scene capping them off.
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
+1
Options
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
I honestly kind of hated it, except for
the fake-out at the end which was pretty great. If anything, that might have redeemed the episode.
The rest though, I dunno, I just found the story kind of average. And no real explanation as to why these random people all got head-crabbed out of nowhere. Though at least they kind of sort of explained why both The Doctor and Clara would have been.
I didn't hate it, but after the absolute perfection that was A Christmas Carol, none of them since have matched up.
Some random thoughts though:
Didn't much care for the double fake out ending. Like some have mentioned, it had all the abrupt feel of accommodating a last minute renewal of JLC's contract. And even then, I wasn't terribly interested in how they would potentially write her off. Hardly the worst way for a companion to leave though.
I'm slightly disappointed they didn't play the "Time travel in dreams" thing in reverse. Everybody was sorta from the same time period, give or take a decade or few. The grandma waking up in the wheelchair was an ok twist, but I was expecting somebody to be from an old time period.
I don't know if it's an intentional increase in this new Doctor's brusque personality, or if it was just shitty writing, or what. But the whole bit when he first leaves fell flat. "There are polar bears here, should I do something about them too?". I know what they're trying to go for... but they established earlier that the crabs were extraterrestrial. Extraterrestrial aliens killing humans, and even the Doctor admits that if it's a large enough invasion, then the human race is doomed. And his reaction is "Myehhh, not my problem.". Up until it becomes his direct problem, at any rate. The point they were trying to make just falls flat at best, and at worst flies in the face of epic moments like 11's official introduction he makes with the Atraxi.
And last, not a complaint, just a funny little plot hole you think should have happened.
"Grandma! Dinner's reaaaAAAAAAAGGGGGGGHHHHH!!!"
Really? Nobody noticed grandma in the living room with a giant crab on her face?
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
i just think new Doctor talks a lot of shit about how cold he is, and makes a lot of very dry jokes. I don't think we should take everything he says at face value.
I didn't hate it, but after the absolute perfection that was A Christmas Carol, none of them since have matched up.
Some random thoughts though:
Didn't much care for the double fake out ending. Like some have mentioned, it had all the abrupt feel of accommodating a last minute renewal of JLC's contract. And even then, I wasn't terribly interested in how they would potentially write her off. Hardly the worst way for a companion to leave though.
I'm slightly disappointed they didn't play the "Time travel in dreams" thing in reverse. Everybody was sorta from the same time period, give or take a decade or few. The grandma waking up in the wheelchair was an ok twist, but I was expecting somebody to be from an old time period.
I don't know if it's an intentional increase in this new Doctor's brusque personality, or if it was just shitty writing, or what. But the whole bit when he first leaves fell flat. "There are polar bears here, should I do something about them too?". I know what they're trying to go for... but they established earlier that the crabs were extraterrestrial. Extraterrestrial aliens killing humans, and even the Doctor admits that if it's a large enough invasion, then the human race is doomed. And his reaction is "Myehhh, not my problem.". Up until it becomes his direct problem, at any rate. The point they were trying to make just falls flat at best, and at worst flies in the face of epic moments like 11's official introduction he makes with the Atraxi.
And last, not a complaint, just a funny little plot hole you think should have happened.
"Grandma! Dinner's reaaaAAAAAAAGGGGGGGHHHHH!!!"
Really? Nobody noticed grandma in the living room with a giant crab on her face?
I'm not gonna try to defend the relationship between Danny and Clara but come on.
Her characterization revolved around Danny? No fucking way.
What her characterization this season actually revolved around was the Doctor, and understanding him (and thus herself) better than any other companion in the shows history, new or old. By the end of this season she and the Doctor understood each other in a way that we've never seen before. How many damn years did we have to watch the pining over Rose shit; when Davies could have only dreamed of having his characters have the depth of understanding Clara and this Doctor do.
They made up for how paper thin she was the last half of S7 and then some.
It would have been a damn fucking crime to send her off after doing her character so well this season. We finally (hopefully, they could obviously still piss it all away) get to see the payoff of a companion truly understanding the Doctor and the weight of what it actually means to be him; instead of getting almost there and then doing some shite hand waving to get rid of the character (see: Donna).
They have an opportunity to have a character oriented season the likes of which the show hasn't ever seen...or at best hasn't seen in decades.
To me the relationship doesn't work because there is no chemistry at all between the two on screen. They literally look like actors trying to play a couple.
Danny's characterization revolved around Clara, not the other way round. He was basically the kind of "girlfriend" in media that feminists complain about. Superficially interesting, but his backstory was barely examined, he was generally a killjoy in terms of adventure, and he got fridged.
+5
Options
MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
I liked that couple. I don't think I've seen a coupling in a tv show that doesn't have half the shows thread complaining about them.
(PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
I was happy to see Clara leave because of all of them I could see her being the one to just say "No more" and walking away at this point. I think the show could use another one of those in New Who era. Someone strong enough to just walk away without them having to write some bullshit as to why they can no longer travel with the Doctor.
I'm however not upset she's staying either because I really like her Interactions with 13 and think it'll be interesting to watch where this goes.
Mostly just huntin' monsters.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
I was happy to see Clara leave because of all of them I could see her being the one to just say "No more" and walking away at this point. I think the show could use another one of those in New Who era. Someone strong enough to just walk away without them having to write some bullshit as to why they can no longer travel with the Doctor.
I'm however not upset she's staying either because I really like her Interactions with 13 and think it'll be interesting to watch where this goes.
Really? Of all the companions, I see her as the least likely of ever doing that. She loves the Doctor life.
I was happy to see Clara leave because of all of them I could see her being the one to just say "No more" and walking away at this point. I think the show could use another one of those in New Who era. Someone strong enough to just walk away without them having to write some bullshit as to why they can no longer travel with the Doctor.
I'm however not upset she's staying either because I really like her Interactions with 13 and think it'll be interesting to watch where this goes.
Really? Of all the companions, I see her as the least likely of ever doing that. She loves the Doctor life.
Or more accurately she is an addict. Hiding her addiction from her partner. Sneaking off to get another hit of Who.
I was happy to see Clara leave because of all of them I could see her being the one to just say "No more" and walking away at this point. I think the show could use another one of those in New Who era. Someone strong enough to just walk away without them having to write some bullshit as to why they can no longer travel with the Doctor.
I'm however not upset she's staying either because I really like her Interactions with 13 and think it'll be interesting to watch where this goes.
Really? Of all the companions, I see her as the least likely of ever doing that. She loves the Doctor life.
Or more accurately she is an addict. Hiding her addiction from her partner. Sneaking off to get another hit of Who.
Cocaine Time travel's a hell of a drug.
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
There's actually a lot of interesting parallel between the Clara/Danny dynamic and any Doctor/companion one, this season. I choose to believe it was intentional, but even if not...
From the fairy tale beginnings to the dealing with lies and honesty, to grasping the real drive behind what makes the Doctor tick...to the ultimate understanding, in the end, of the awful reality that the Doctor has to deal with, from the loss of each and every person he has, and will, ever know and has known.
To the point that
the final fake out ending was the last thing Clara had to accept to fully understand him. She wanted to wake up, old and fulfilled. She didn't want to have to live each and every day of that loss and grief, even though "Danny" flat out told her that she needs to live her life. It was easier for her to dream herself on deaths door, never having to had to really experience the lifetime of sadness of losing someone you truly love.
But there it was, in the very end, the realization that, no, loss can't mean that everything stops. You can grieve and still live; you have to grieve and still live because to give up is to die.
In the season finale and much of the Christmas episode, her attitude toward the Doctor is that he is so cruel, that he doesn't understand what kind of loss she is feeling. But I think by the end, she realized that his apparent coldness wasn't from the lack of emotion, or understanding of loss, it was the opposite; he had experienced more loss than she could imagine, to the point that she was about to become another person he lost. He just couldn't let it stop him.
But he goes on. Because there's so much to do, so much to see. Through him she has learned that life is more than the individual connections we make, and lose; it's about all of that and the next story, the next person, and the next adventure.
So in a single season she's learned to get lost in adventure, to form a profound relationship with someone who can never fully understand you and what you do, learned how to lead, to give hope, to deceive for a cause, how to make impossible decisions and understand that sometimes a 'higher power' isn't going to fix things for you; and ultimately how to lose deeply, yet never give up.
She kept getting put into the Doctors shoes this season, over and over again, and each time she nailed that shit out of the park, even when it seemed like she had failed...the Christmas special was the perfect companion to Death in Heaven, it was her own little mini-arc on dealing with loss, Doctor style; and in the end she did it right. Independently each of those episodes might feel a bit weak, but together they're a great character story where we get to see, through Claras enlightenment, how you could live two thousand years with (relative) grace. EDIT: and every time she thought she was done with the Doctor, that she 'hated' him for this or that, it was really her coming to grips with his reality, the things he has to do every single day. It made her feel bad, so she didn't understand why it didn't make him feel bad. But in the end she realized that he did. It's just that, again, he couldn't just let it halt him in his tracks.
As an aside I have to take issue with the supposed lack of quality in writing this season. I think the writing has been fantastic. Now, some of the plots..yeah, forgettable or really just getting in the way of the actual story; but the writing itself has been top notch in my view.
This might be one of my favourite christmas episodes
I mean, often they are very silly.. Sillier than Doctor Who usually can be. This time everything was nice and christmas-y but with a decent in universe explanation
I was real worried this would undo the misery of the series finale, and it did not, for which I am super grateful. I loved that the reveal that they had lied to each other was so low key, and the part where Danny tells Clara not to get over it, but to be sad for 5 minutes a day and the rest of the time get over it? That was rad.
a send off, but then if that kid was alive enough to send back no reason Danny isn't just chilling. Or maybe Clara will be the most amazing companion ever and realize they have a time machine and can do something to get him back...
a send off, but then if that kid was alive enough to send back no reason Danny isn't just chilling. Or maybe Clara will be the most amazing companion ever and realize they have a time machine and can do something to get him back...
They can't travel into their own personal history!
a send off, but then if that kid was alive enough to send back no reason Danny isn't just chilling. Or maybe Clara will be the most amazing companion ever and realize they have a time machine and can do something to get him back...
They can't travel into their own personal history!
Everything is their own personal history. Take weather as a chaotic system. With all the changes in the past, there is quite the probability that the weather for a given day changes. This can change outcomes of historic events to an enormous extent (or not at all)
a send off, but then if that kid was alive enough to send back no reason Danny isn't just chilling. Or maybe Clara will be the most amazing companion ever and realize they have a time machine and can do something to get him back...
They can't travel into their own personal history!
I don't think it was the Doctor's history, since he wasn't there and wasn't aware that it had happened.
Since the Doctor didn't know, it's not a fixed point in time, so he could go and TARDIS nab Danny and drop some kind of synthetic clone body in his place to get hit. Or not drop a body there, since that would likely bring up some interesting questions when the real Danny showed up alive and well.
Posts
I understand that there's some theories out there that
But we'll probably never know.
Regardless, the outcome we got was the best one!
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Clara's grown on me from last season. She gels perfectly with this Doctor.
It kind of goes a bit against what Eleven said to Jo Grant in SJA ("It's like someone baked you."), but I don't care.
Followed closely by Santa's "It's bigger on the inside" and the elves "ooooooooh!".
The rest though, I dunno, I just found the story kind of average. And no real explanation as to why these random people all got head-crabbed out of nowhere. Though at least they kind of sort of explained why both The Doctor and Clara would have been.
Some random thoughts though:
I'm slightly disappointed they didn't play the "Time travel in dreams" thing in reverse. Everybody was sorta from the same time period, give or take a decade or few. The grandma waking up in the wheelchair was an ok twist, but I was expecting somebody to be from an old time period.
I don't know if it's an intentional increase in this new Doctor's brusque personality, or if it was just shitty writing, or what. But the whole bit when he first leaves fell flat. "There are polar bears here, should I do something about them too?". I know what they're trying to go for... but they established earlier that the crabs were extraterrestrial. Extraterrestrial aliens killing humans, and even the Doctor admits that if it's a large enough invasion, then the human race is doomed. And his reaction is "Myehhh, not my problem.". Up until it becomes his direct problem, at any rate. The point they were trying to make just falls flat at best, and at worst flies in the face of epic moments like 11's official introduction he makes with the Atraxi.
And last, not a complaint, just a funny little plot hole you think should have happened.
"Grandma! Dinner's reaaaAAAAAAAGGGGGGGHHHHH!!!"
Really? Nobody noticed grandma in the living room with a giant crab on her face?
Last point: Time is sped up!
YANA in that fan club
I really liked the two extremely sharp witted non-Clara Clara's.
Her characterization revolved around Danny? No fucking way.
What her characterization this season actually revolved around was the Doctor, and understanding him (and thus herself) better than any other companion in the shows history, new or old. By the end of this season she and the Doctor understood each other in a way that we've never seen before. How many damn years did we have to watch the pining over Rose shit; when Davies could have only dreamed of having his characters have the depth of understanding Clara and this Doctor do.
They made up for how paper thin she was the last half of S7 and then some.
It would have been a damn fucking crime to send her off after doing her character so well this season. We finally (hopefully, they could obviously still piss it all away) get to see the payoff of a companion truly understanding the Doctor and the weight of what it actually means to be him; instead of getting almost there and then doing some shite hand waving to get rid of the character (see: Donna).
They have an opportunity to have a character oriented season the likes of which the show hasn't ever seen...or at best hasn't seen in decades.
S9 could/should be incredible.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Writing hasn't exactly been the show's strong suit of late.
:rotate:
I'm however not upset she's staying either because I really like her Interactions with 13 and think it'll be interesting to watch where this goes.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
Really? Of all the companions, I see her as the least likely of ever doing that. She loves the Doctor life.
Unreal Engine 4 Developers Community.
I'm working on a cute little video game! Here's a link for you.
Or more accurately she is an addict. Hiding her addiction from her partner. Sneaking off to get another hit of Who.
I made a game, it has penguins in it. It's pay what you like on Gumroad.
Currently Ebaying Nothing at all but I might do in the future.
It seems a bit of a reversion for the character to just jump back in.
It's OK though I don't hate her so it's fine she's staying.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
Cocaine Time travel's a hell of a drug.
I'd believe it. Clara is less addicted to the life style than Amy was. Not that she isn't addicted to the Doctor.
From the fairy tale beginnings to the dealing with lies and honesty, to grasping the real drive behind what makes the Doctor tick...to the ultimate understanding, in the end, of the awful reality that the Doctor has to deal with, from the loss of each and every person he has, and will, ever know and has known.
To the point that
But there it was, in the very end, the realization that, no, loss can't mean that everything stops. You can grieve and still live; you have to grieve and still live because to give up is to die.
In the season finale and much of the Christmas episode, her attitude toward the Doctor is that he is so cruel, that he doesn't understand what kind of loss she is feeling. But I think by the end, she realized that his apparent coldness wasn't from the lack of emotion, or understanding of loss, it was the opposite; he had experienced more loss than she could imagine, to the point that she was about to become another person he lost. He just couldn't let it stop him.
But he goes on. Because there's so much to do, so much to see. Through him she has learned that life is more than the individual connections we make, and lose; it's about all of that and the next story, the next person, and the next adventure.
So in a single season she's learned to get lost in adventure, to form a profound relationship with someone who can never fully understand you and what you do, learned how to lead, to give hope, to deceive for a cause, how to make impossible decisions and understand that sometimes a 'higher power' isn't going to fix things for you; and ultimately how to lose deeply, yet never give up.
She kept getting put into the Doctors shoes this season, over and over again, and each time she nailed that shit out of the park, even when it seemed like she had failed...the Christmas special was the perfect companion to Death in Heaven, it was her own little mini-arc on dealing with loss, Doctor style; and in the end she did it right. Independently each of those episodes might feel a bit weak, but together they're a great character story where we get to see, through Claras enlightenment, how you could live two thousand years with (relative) grace. EDIT: and every time she thought she was done with the Doctor, that she 'hated' him for this or that, it was really her coming to grips with his reality, the things he has to do every single day. It made her feel bad, so she didn't understand why it didn't make him feel bad. But in the end she realized that he did. It's just that, again, he couldn't just let it halt him in his tracks.
As an aside I have to take issue with the supposed lack of quality in writing this season. I think the writing has been fantastic. Now, some of the plots..yeah, forgettable or really just getting in the way of the actual story; but the writing itself has been top notch in my view.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
I think a contender is
Middlesbrough/Teesside
Yeah,
They can't travel into their own personal history!
Everything is their own personal history. Take weather as a chaotic system. With all the changes in the past, there is quite the probability that the weather for a given day changes. This can change outcomes of historic events to an enormous extent (or not at all)
I don't think it was the Doctor's history, since he wasn't there and wasn't aware that it had happened.
Since the Doctor didn't know, it's not a fixed point in time, so he could go and TARDIS nab Danny and drop some kind of synthetic clone body in his place to get hit. Or not drop a body there, since that would likely bring up some interesting questions when the real Danny showed up alive and well.