Morning news anchor and cameraman shot dead in Virgina

Bucketman

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/08/26/wdbj-virginia-news-crew-shot-live-on-air_n_8042578.html

So yeah this happened this morning on live TV. They were interviewing at a mall when a guy who use to work for the station came in and shot some people. The anchor, Alison Parker age 24, and the Cameraman, Adam Ward age 27, were killed. The lady they were interviewing was also shot, and is in critical condition.

The gunman was being chased by police and shot himself a few minutes ago

http://www.wchstv.com/news/features/eyewitness-news/stories/WATCH-Shots-Fired-At-Strip-Mall-In-Virginia-190763.shtml#.Vd3xOvlViko

Holy shit this is crazy. The Cameraman was engaged to a producer at the station and today was their last days before they left together to get married. Oh and the anchor was seeing one of the other anchors at the station.

This kind of stuff is just...man. I dunno. Really fucked.

Magic Pink

I can't believe they have pictures from the video on that site

you're literally seeing a woman getting killed.

god this was awful, those poor people

Magic Pink

I can't believe they have pictures from the video on that site

you're literally seeing a woman getting killed.

god this was awful, those poor people

Raijin Quickfoot

The shooter posted the videos online I believe.

This is just an awful awful situation.

Kaplar

This whole thing was so pointless.

Magic Pink

Raijin Quickfoot wrote: »

The shooter posted the videos online I believe.

This is just an awful awful situation.

I know I just think it's horrible to link them in the story itself

I personally don't want to ever see them

Raijin Quickfoot

Magic Pink wrote: »

Raijin Quickfoot wrote: »

The shooter posted the videos online I believe.

This is just an awful awful situation.

I know I just think it's horrible to link them in the story itself

I personally don't want to ever see them

Oh absolutely. I wasn't saying that because I think it makes it OK to link to them.

Bucketman

Also I guess he was Tweeting about why.

From what I can tell he was fired because of the Cameraman turning him into HR for something, and the young lady was his replacement.

This was wasn't "crazy" he didn't have a mental illness, he had no priors, he was just angry and had access to a weapon and went did something awful and stupid.

Zuel

I wouldn't rule out mental issues.
He apparently thought everyone he worked with was racist.

Raijin Quickfoot

I mean, in order to get angry enough to kill people then yourself... I would have to think there was some mental instability going on.

I've been outright pissef at people but I never thought about killing anyone.

tynic

If we classify everyone who kills anyone as mentally unstable the term loses a lot of meaning. He knew what he was doing.

The 'mentally ill/we need better mental health care' thing is, in cases like these, usually a way to distract from gun legislation issues. Of courts it's very relevant for suicides, but only a percentage of plain ol asshole killers have actually been 'failed' by the health system.

UnbrokenEva

tynic wrote: »

If we classify everyone who kills anyone as mentally unstable the term loses a lot of meaning. He knew what he was doing.

The 'mentally ill/we need better mental health care' thing is, in cases like these, usually a way to distract from gun legislation issues. Of courts it's very relevant for suicides, but only a percentage of plain ol asshole killers have actually been 'failed' by the health system.

it also does a disservice to all of the people dealing with mental health issues who manage to not murder anyone

Langly

I agree with tynic but from his manifesto he was clearly in some ways disturbed. He wanted to continue the race war that Dylan Roof started and he listed other mass killers as inspirations, specifically the VA Tech shooter.

Straightzi

Yeah, the problem with calling him mentally unstable is that phrase is usually followed by a shrug of the shoulders and a "nothing we can do, there's no way to fix crazy"

Which is, y'know, it's own problem

But is often used to distract from other pertinent issues

#pipe

tynic wrote: »

The 'mentally ill/we need better mental health care' thing is, in cases like these, usually a way to distract from gun legislation issues.

1000% this.

The same fucking people who say all shooters are mentally ill actively prevent access to mental health services and campaign against healthcare reform. It is the cowardly call of desperation to cling to the status quo.

Langly

A man claiming to be Bryce Williams called ABC News over the last few weeks, saying he wanted to pitch a story, and wanted to fax information. He never told ABC News what the story was.

This morning, a fax was in the machine (time stamped 8:26 a.m.) almost two hours after the shooting. A little after 10 a.m., he called again, and introduced himself as Bryce, but also said his legal name was Vester Lee Flanagan, and that he shot two people this morning. While on the phone, he said authorities are “after me,” and “all over the place.” He hung up. ABC News contacted the authorities immediately and provided them with the fax.

In the 23-page document faxed to ABC News, the writer says “MY NAME IS BRYCE WILLIAMS” and his legal name is Vester Lee Flanagan II.” He writes what triggered today’s carnage was his reaction to the racism of the Charleston church shooting:

“Why did I do it? I put down a deposit for a gun on 6/19/15. The Church shooting in Charleston happened on 6/17/15…”

“What sent me over the top was the church shooting. And my hollow point bullets have the victims’ initials on them."

It is unclear whose initials he is referring to. He continues, “As for Dylann Roof? You (deleted)! You want a race war (deleted)? BRING IT THEN YOU WHITE …(deleted)!!!” He said Jehovah spoke to him, telling him to act.

Later in the manifesto, the writer quotes the Virginia Tech mass killer, Seung Hui Cho, calls him “his boy,” and expresses admiration for the Columbine High School killers. “Also, I was influenced by Seung–Hui Cho. That’s my boy right there. He got NEARLY double the amount that Eric Harris and Dylann Klebold got…just sayin.'"

In an often rambling letter to the authorities, and family and friends, he writes of a long list of grievances. In one part of the document, Williams calls it a “Suicide Note for Friends and Family."

He says has suffered racial discrimination, sexual harassment and bullying at work
He says he has been attacked by black men and white females
He talks about how he was attacked for being a gay, black man
“Yes, it will sound like I am angry...I am. And I have every right to be. But when I leave this Earth, the only emotion I want to feel is peace....”

“The church shooting was the tipping point…but my anger has been building steadily...I’ve been a human powder keg for a while…just waiting to go BOOM!!!!”

Langly

I mean I agree with everyone on mental health as an excuse but he does cite Jehovah as the entity telling him to do this

Magic Pink

Langly wrote: »

I mean I agree with everyone on mental health as an excuse but he does cite Jehovah as the entity telling him to do this

A HUGE number of people say that every day. Look at that clerk in Kentucky not issuing marriage registrations. Read some of the comments on "God saved my insert-whatever-here" videos.

bwanie

yeah lets not do that.

man that is some nasty shit.

Langly

Magic Pink wrote: »

Langly wrote: »

I mean I agree with everyone on mental health as an excuse but he does cite Jehovah as the entity telling him to do this

A HUGE number of people say that every day. Look at that clerk in Kentucky not issuing marriage registrations. Read some of the comments on "God saved my insert-whatever-here" videos.

I feel this is being disingenuous when we're talking about a mass shooting.

there's a difference between saying that you felt god speaking to you in a religious context and that Jehovah with a capital J told you to kill people.

Magic Pink

Langly wrote: »

Magic Pink wrote: »

Langly wrote: »

I mean I agree with everyone on mental health as an excuse but he does cite Jehovah as the entity telling him to do this

A HUGE number of people say that every day. Look at that clerk in Kentucky not issuing marriage registrations. Read some of the comments on "God saved my insert-whatever-here" videos.

I feel this is being disingenuous when we're talking about a mass shooting.

there's a difference between saying that you felt god speaking to you in a religious context and that Jehovah with a capital J told you to kill people.

Is there? Because those are two ways of saying exactly the same thing. Just because the background of one thing is a horrible crime doesn't really change that.

He knew what he was doing.

bwanie

So we are doing this?

cr0w

There's a big difference between someone being mentally ill and someone just flat out being broken.

Jasconius

we got 0.6 pages before people started taking umbrage with others innocent expressions of grief

good work everyone, new record

Sterica

It seems to me like the fact that we can't separate "hears voices suggesting mass murder" and "has anxiety problems" into VERY different degrees of mental issues suggests we got a real problem on educating people about mental health.

This doesn't make the gun issue go away. Shit can be multi-faceted, like Roof being a toxic mix of racism and guns.

Hexmage-PA

So if it's not mental illness, what do we call it when someone feels as if they've been so thoroughly wronged that murder is their only chance for release?

cr0w

A tragedy.

Bucketman

Langly wrote: »

I agree with tynic but from his manifesto he was clearly in some ways disturbed. He wanted to continue the race war that Dylan Roof started and he listed other mass killers as inspirations, specifically the VA Tech shooter.

Oh man, I hadn't heard that. I wonder what the issue that got him fired was.

Bucketman

I think its a stretch to say that someone who Believes, with a capital B, in a higher power is mentally ill. This type of belief is the kind that people say Jesus was on their toast, or angels told them to quit their job and start a nonprofit to help the poor. These people may been weird, or off putting, but belief and feeling like you saw a sign of some kind are not inheritly crazy.

This guy sounds like he had other issues, and was motivated to spark some kind of race war. He may not have had a mental illness, he might have just had a strong sense of Belief, and also was really angry. I don't think its safe to jump to conclusion on his full mental state, though I did do that. For now with the evidence present I think the most we can say is "He was angry, he felt hurt and bullied, he wanted to make someone pay, he wanted to start a race way, he felt like Jehovah told him to do it."

Also my phone auto corrected Jehovah to Jenova. Appearently he was going to summon Meteor.

Transporter

Bucketman wrote: »

Langly wrote: »

I agree with tynic but from his manifesto he was clearly in some ways disturbed. He wanted to continue the race war that Dylan Roof started and he listed other mass killers as inspirations, specifically the VA Tech shooter.

Oh man, I hadn't heard that. I wonder what the issue that got him fired was.

Corrected

Bucketman

Oh...well fuck. Settling out of court is always like a big red flag to me.

Javen

Transporter wrote: »

Bucketman wrote: »

Langly wrote: »

I agree with tynic but from his manifesto he was clearly in some ways disturbed. He wanted to continue the race war that Dylan Roof started and he listed other mass killers as inspirations, specifically the VA Tech shooter.

Oh man, I hadn't heard that. I wonder what the issue that got him fired was.

He called racism and sued.

They settled out of court.

Which is code for, "Yeah, he was fired because of racism".

Like this is going to be a clusterfuck. I am honest a little scared right now.

The news station who he sued was in Florida, and wasn't this one, and none of the pople harmed were even tangentially involved with the suit. It was 15 years ago, which would have made the victims 9 and 12 years old when the settlement took place.

Langly

He was fired from the Virginia station because of anger problems. He had been channeled to HR because of things he said and did to co-workers.

Transporter

Javen wrote: »

Transporter wrote: »

Bucketman wrote: »

Langly wrote: »

I agree with tynic but from his manifesto he was clearly in some ways disturbed. He wanted to continue the race war that Dylan Roof started and he listed other mass killers as inspirations, specifically the VA Tech shooter.

Oh man, I hadn't heard that. I wonder what the issue that got him fired was.

He called racism and sued.

They settled out of court.

Which is code for, "Yeah, he was fired because of racism".

Like this is going to be a clusterfuck. I am honest a little scared right now.

The news station who he sued was in Florida, and wasn't this one, and none of the pople harmed were even tangentially involved with the suit. It was 15 years ago, which would have made the victims 9 and 12 years old when the settlement took place.

Thanks for the correction.

Blackhawk1313

Umm... not sure where you got that because the only thing I read was that he sued and the case was dismssed, not settled...

Magic Pink

Bucketman wrote: »

I think its a stretch to say that someone who Believes, with a capital B, in a higher power is mentally ill.

You are 100% wrong if you think that's what I'm saying. I'm saying we can't label him as crazy just because he says God told him to. That phrase does not have to literally mean "I sat down with God and he said go shoot up some people for me". I've seen, heard and know people who use the exact wording just to mean "this is what is says in the bible".

Hexmage-PA

It's weird to me that blaming mental illness for gun violence apparently shifts the focus away from gun control. If anything, it should make gun control even more important because we don't know how many would-be killers are out there. I guess it's because the popular idea of mental illness is full-blown schizophrenia when the truth is that most people probably have at least a mild mental illness.

As a person with an anxiety order myself, I can believe that someone could potentially be driven to violence by even supposedly minor mental illnesses. I've tried to overcome anxiety with only middling results, and in the past year I've suddenly found myself having spikes of anger that I never had before because I just get feeling so resentful and bitter about how my anxiety has held me back and how my life could have been different and how other people hurt me in ways I can't figure out how to defend against. I could easily imagine someone getting so sick of feeling powerless to defend themselves against psychological abuse that they turn to violence.

Daypigeon

some classmates of mine were friends with one of the victims

this feels weird. I don't really know what to say to them or if I should even bring it up, I'm sure they're getting a lot of that already

Jasconius

Langly wrote: »

He was fired from the Virginia station because of anger problems. He had been channeled to HR because of things he said and did to co-workers.

he also had to be escorted out of the building by police at the virginia station because he didn't take his firing too well


anyway one of the problems with declaring "mental health" and walking away is that its really fucking hard to do something about someone you think might have a problem but hasn't actually done anything yet

even if you have the tools to do so

In Florida if you suspect someone of trouble like this you can call the police and they have the legal right to detain the person and have him evaluated, but it's still up to the police to decide whether or not your report is credible...

Magic Pink

wow the video was being played constantly, almost on a loop, on 9 of the 10 tvs at my gym. 4 or 5 different stations

revolting.

Paladin

Mental health, when applied correctly, is supposed to be interventionist. People who think "crazy = nothing we could have done" neglect the abilities of medical, social services, and society to spot these before they turn into tragedies. Sure, the claims have to be evaluated, but the people in charge of this are trained and legally culpable.

Some people use it as a smokescreen. Those people aren't owning the responsibility of making that call.