much of what i discussed with langly is on the actual format of the game, stuff like actually deciding to do two roles
i didn't go like "so what do you think, 5 groups of 3 and four neutrals?" or whatever
basically the key word in that quote is "theoretical" not "setups"
langly's knowledge functionally extends to "double phalla" and seeing the OP before everyone else
but if you're worried just day 1 him
So...no one looked at the balance then?
Well, I looked at the balance.
I'll freely admit that the balance is unlikely to be perfect. I am confident enough in how close it is to that that I don't think any group will be losing due to the overpoweredness of the other but rather through traditional phalla mistakes or because of really good play. I have created best- and worst-case scenarios for all involved and with tweaking based on those am happy with how the game looks.
My primary balance concern is something that I don't know how to model, and which I don't think anyone knows how to model, which is how players will play what are functionally two semi-related games. I don't know if a member of the village will choose to sell the vig out for an advantage in the Veer, for example. I don't know how other players would respond to that in-game. I also don't know how to stop those things from potentially happening without changing the nature of the game, which is DOUBLE PHALLA, so the effort I put into doing things is through encouraging people to play to the spirit of the game.
This is an experimental game with a more party-ish style to it, and I admit that openly. That may very well not be what someone enjoys about phalla, and I would not ask them to play in this game despite that.
That said, if you or anyone else wants to look over it and comment on the balance you are welcome to do so. Looking back at that sentence I feel like it could be read slightly passive-aggressively so I also want to say plainly that it's a genuine sentence. Internet is hard!
I do think the no posthumous vc rule is absolutely terrible though and turns any villagers in the game into survival neutrals. Might as well not have any networks if everyone has to be selfish and protect their own asses, automatically losing if they take one for the team so the group can make progress/win.
Still gonna play though. Just really hate that rule. So much.
Yes, and it left me with the opinion that the things I was concerned about are versed in the individual psychology of a player and could only be mitigated. Making some victory conditions not-posthumous is one such mitigation.
The flipside of the village all thinking of themselves as survival neutrals is that you instead have a village of players with two lives, because there's nothing stopping them from continuing to play for the village in the other role, and the mafia has an incredible sense of being outnumbered and having to double-tap players constantly.
It didn't fit with the way I wanted the game to be played.
that is a remarkably elegant solution that none of the people i talked to imagined, which can be put into the game as-is without interfering with any other systems
SLyM is saying that since everyone has two roles, if you die as role A you can no longer posthumously achieve role A's VC, but can still posthumously achieve role B's VC.
Tired of boring day 1 soft networks? Do you talk to all your friends about roles only to get stabbed in the back? Do you even know how to soft network you stupid baby? Huh baby want his ba ba?
Well put on some man pants and join Bedlam's spectacular day -1 soft network of awesomeness! Its better than all the other networks because membership is hella limited to 5 people! And Im already one of them! The other four must dance like drunken monkies to please me. You must fit into the one of the following categorys (and no two people can share a category)
Something old
Something new
Something borrowed
Something blue
So get cracking on those PMs and join the best darn tootin soft network around!
(Yes this is real. And I am the one who is crazy enough to make it work. This offer will not be entertained if you wait to contact me after the game starts. Hence the day -1ness of it all)
Thank you for participating in the Izanami Initiative. Your dossiers are now being sent out. Please do not discuss them until the first cycle has begun.
Detective Vama Sheval placed the tablet on his tongue and leaned back in his chair. The light from the city outside was blocked by tightly closed blinds and stacked boxes, and that was how he wanted it. This time was important to him. He didn't want to be interrupted, or distracted, or pushed about by the main office.
He was always a little nervous when taking Persephone. The lack of a real kick meant that he had to just sit and wait before he knew it was working. So far he had never been sold a bad batch but there were rumors and horror stories about what could happen. Though Vama trusted his dealer there was no way to stop the nerves until things started happening.
Things started happening. Specifically, her hand rested on his door frame, and she stepped into view. “Cassie,” Vama smiled at her as she entered the room.
Controlled hallucination. Persephone was the puritan's worst nightmare. How did you convince someone that taking something that let them imagine something and make it real to them was wrong? Users shared stories of incredible nights of passion, epic pieces of art, and absolutely unbelievable experiences. “It's like the Veer, but real,” was the famous soundbite from the interview a year ago. The irony of that quote had not been lost on the media over the past two weeks.
Phallen, the company responsible for maintaining and upgrading the virtual reality network connecting the planet, was involved in the production of Persephone. A small group of hackers had leaked design documents, meeting recordings, enough damning evidence that the company might never recover. Parts of Veer equipment were nearly interchangeable with manufacturing equipment for the drug. “IS PHALLEN MAKING PERSEPHONE IN YOUR OWN HOME?” scrolled across news screens. The biggest corporation in Martian history, and the biggest scandal imaginable. Riots were breaking out. Billions of credits lost. Several cities were in a near police state.
With one tablet Detective Sheval could get away from that for just a few hours.
“Don't pick it up,” Cassie signed as the phone rang. Vama groaned unhappily in response, but tapped his earpiece.
“Sheval, it's Janus,” came the voice of his partner. “Murder. Unjung Cafe. See you soon.”
The lights of the street hid the darkness of the city. Vama pulled his hat down low, tried to keep the blazing neon from yelling too loudly at him. Cassie sighed impatiently as she kept pace behind him, occasionally trying to slip a hand into his shirt before he swatted it away. New Pyongyang was a city of decadence, spitting images of greed and nudity at him from nearly infinite signs on every street. He didn't want to be here.
“Evening Sheval, hope I didn't wake you,” his partner said.
“Cripes,” Vama scowled as the sterile lights of the cybercafe hit his eyes. “I should have brought shades.”
“Don't tell me you're still hungover,” Janus smirked, putting out his cigarette.
“Oh, just taking potshots at Vama now? You're a real piece of shit sometimes, you know?” Cassie scowled.
“I'm fine, I'm fine,” Vama said dismissively, waving. “Just was relaxing, that's all. What have we got?”
“Caucasian female, maybe 35, 36. Don't have an ID on the name but the droids are in there collecting the samples. Single gunshot wound to the head, security footage captured the attack but not the attacker.”
“What do you mean it didn't get the attacker?” Vama sighed.
“You know this shitty neighbourhood,” Janus shrugged, “Half the shit they do here they probably don't want a record of anyway. Just makes our job that much harder. You hot, man?” Janus asked abruptly. “You're opening up your shirt.”
Vama glanced down and shooed away Cassie's wandering hands. “Yeah, yeah,” he said, “Just...you know, I was relaxing, like I said. Guess I woke up from my nap at the wrong time, right?” He chuckled dismissively.
Janus shrugged, lowering his glasses and glancing at the time before putting them back up. “Rumor is that this is connected to the two shootings earlier this week, but I don't know. We'll see what comes up. City's fuckin' crazy right now as is, we don't need some kind of gang war going down.”
Vama grunted an agreement, glancing up at the screens on the nearby building. For a moment the most unusual thing had happened – they had gone dark. Now they were back online, with a smiling asian woman looking out of them. “Hey, Janus,” he said, tapping his partner's arm. “Fuck goin' on there?”
“Citizens of New Pyongyang,” the woman said delicately.
“Fuck, she's a fucking robot, listen to that,” Janus muttered.
“Some of you have already been informed that conflict is brewing. Some of you will soon be learning. It is unfortunate to see our fair city meet this violent state, but it is a natural progression from all that has transpired..”
“This broadcast isn't supposed to be happening,” Vama said slowly, “Look at that dpi, that's a signal takeover.”
“Yeah no shit,” Janus replied, pressing on his earpiece.
“IZANAMI wants you to know that we will not turn our backs on this city. Where other companies may turn tail and run, or burn bridges, we will ensure that we do right by our consumers. As such, we are proud to announce the Izanami Initiative Program, the first democratically decided assassination contracts.”
“Everyone's getting this, yeah,” Janus said, relaying his information back to Vama. “They're telling us to just stick with the murder right now.”
“Kinda hard to ignore that,” Vama muttered.
“We want you all to know that IZANAMI supports the growth and brave new future that await this city. Let's build it together, on the bodies of the weak.”
---
IZANAMI has released the following information about noteworthy deaths in New Pyongyang:
INANTP – Demi Terrance – Murdered in Unjung Cafe
Please remember to vote in your designated BBS threads to ensure that only the right people are allowed to build our city's future. Voting closes at 8 PM Pyongyang Standard Time.
---
*************
“I don't understand, I was supposed to get another chance.”
“I know. I'm sorry. I'm trying to trace this virus as quickly as I can.”
“It's still out there. What we were measuring. The tumor is still growing.”
“Please, Demi, I know you're scared but I'm trying to do this as quickly as I can. I don't want to lose you.”
“This isn't fair. This isn't fair.”
“Are you sure you don't know where you got this?”
“No, I mean...no, I don't know, I don't...it wasn't...I- I don't know.”
“Fuck, I've never seen this filetype before. What the fuck is phalla even short for?”
“Please, please...”
“I'm looking Demi, I'm looking, just hold on!”
“I don't have any more firewalls, please...”
“Just stay calm Demi, stay – FUCK! Demi please, you have to disconnect, you have to-”
“I CAN'T! I can't! You remember! You remember what I told you! Someone shot me, and I awoke here! If I disconnect there is nothing there.”
“I don't...Please, I don't know how...”
“I'm-”
“.....fuck”
VOTE IN CYAN.
“...What?”
INACTIVUS PROTOCOLS ACTIVATED. VOTE.
“...Oh my god, this is...”
VOTE IN CYAN. A DELETION MUST OCCUR.
“What the fuck is this?”
VOTE IN CYAN. 24 HOURS ARE ALLOTTED.
“Okay so it's got a time-based infection... But there's got to be a way to stop it...”
NO ONE HAS WON.
---
INANTP – Kabaki Ninja - .phalla virus
---
*************
The following information has been declassified by the New Pyongyang Police Department:
Unjung Cafe Security Tape
INANTP Demi Terrance is seen sitting at a computer. She is typing frantically. The details of the screen cannot be determined. It appears similar to the Veer IM client. The cafe appears otherwise unoccupied, with the exception of a man in a suit who walks into view from the bottom of the camera. He raises his arm. It is obscured by the angle of the camera.
There is a gunshot. Demi Terrance slumps forward in her chair and blood splatters against the computer. The bullet enters the screen and breaks it. The man walks off-screen. A conversation is heard.
Voice 1: Easy enough.
Voice 2: Who's next?
Voice 1: Not here. Meet the rest in two hours.
Voice 2: Let's make this quick. As soon as my paycheque for this job arrives I'm going off-planet.
Voice 1: Not here. Could be old security we didn't block.
The body remains undiscovered for 13:22 at which point another man enters. He panics upon seeing the body and slips, knocking over two monitor screens. He leaves the screen. No meaningful footage occurs until New Pyongyang police arrive at the scene.
The first cycle has begun. Please Vote in red to determine IZANAMI's assassination tonight.
For those of you enjoying the sights and sounds of the Veer, please be warned that report are coming in of a virus causing permanent disconnection. Research indicates that voting in cyan may steer its path.
Both votes are estimated to close at 8 PM PST (Pyongyang Standard Time, of course).
Inquiries about the nature of life may be directed to your local BBS board. Inquiries about your dossiers may be directed to your IZANAMI contact.
Have a pleasant day.
I needed anime to post. on
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Erin The RedThe Name's Erin! Woman, Podcaster, Dungeon Master, IT nerd, Parent, Trans. AMABaton Rouge, LARegistered Userregular
Ok. So. Wow. This is going to be a fun one to unravel, haha
Posts
Well, I looked at the balance.
I'll freely admit that the balance is unlikely to be perfect. I am confident enough in how close it is to that that I don't think any group will be losing due to the overpoweredness of the other but rather through traditional phalla mistakes or because of really good play. I have created best- and worst-case scenarios for all involved and with tweaking based on those am happy with how the game looks.
My primary balance concern is something that I don't know how to model, and which I don't think anyone knows how to model, which is how players will play what are functionally two semi-related games. I don't know if a member of the village will choose to sell the vig out for an advantage in the Veer, for example. I don't know how other players would respond to that in-game. I also don't know how to stop those things from potentially happening without changing the nature of the game, which is DOUBLE PHALLA, so the effort I put into doing things is through encouraging people to play to the spirit of the game.
This is an experimental game with a more party-ish style to it, and I admit that openly. That may very well not be what someone enjoys about phalla, and I would not ask them to play in this game despite that.
That said, if you or anyone else wants to look over it and comment on the balance you are welcome to do so. Looking back at that sentence I feel like it could be read slightly passive-aggressively so I also want to say plainly that it's a genuine sentence. Internet is hard!
_____________________________________________
HoTS: Schmutz#1686
Still gonna play though. Just really hate that rule. So much.
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
The flipside of the village all thinking of themselves as survival neutrals is that you instead have a village of players with two lives, because there's nothing stopping them from continuing to play for the village in the other role, and the mafia has an incredible sense of being outnumbered and having to double-tap players constantly.
It didn't fit with the way I wanted the game to be played.
slym gets signup spot one
Suck
It
If you died first as a villager, then in the internet, you'd keep your internet wincon.
3DS Friend Code: 3110-5393-4113
Steam profile
Well put on some man pants and join Bedlam's spectacular day -1 soft network of awesomeness! Its better than all the other networks because membership is hella limited to 5 people! And Im already one of them! The other four must dance like drunken monkies to please me. You must fit into the one of the following categorys (and no two people can share a category)
Something old
Something new
Something borrowed
Something blue
So get cracking on those PMs and join the best darn tootin soft network around!
(Yes this is real. And I am the one who is crazy enough to make it work. This offer will not be entertained if you wait to contact me after the game starts. Hence the day -1ness of it all)
3DS Friend Code: 3110-5393-4113
Steam profile
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
@Tayrun
@Egos
@lonelyahava
@Rawkking Goodguy
two of you come 'ere.
Steam
Steam
Steam
3DS Friend Code: 3110-5393-4113
Steam profile
Detective Vama Sheval placed the tablet on his tongue and leaned back in his chair. The light from the city outside was blocked by tightly closed blinds and stacked boxes, and that was how he wanted it. This time was important to him. He didn't want to be interrupted, or distracted, or pushed about by the main office.
He was always a little nervous when taking Persephone. The lack of a real kick meant that he had to just sit and wait before he knew it was working. So far he had never been sold a bad batch but there were rumors and horror stories about what could happen. Though Vama trusted his dealer there was no way to stop the nerves until things started happening.
Things started happening. Specifically, her hand rested on his door frame, and she stepped into view. “Cassie,” Vama smiled at her as she entered the room.
Controlled hallucination. Persephone was the puritan's worst nightmare. How did you convince someone that taking something that let them imagine something and make it real to them was wrong? Users shared stories of incredible nights of passion, epic pieces of art, and absolutely unbelievable experiences. “It's like the Veer, but real,” was the famous soundbite from the interview a year ago. The irony of that quote had not been lost on the media over the past two weeks.
Phallen, the company responsible for maintaining and upgrading the virtual reality network connecting the planet, was involved in the production of Persephone. A small group of hackers had leaked design documents, meeting recordings, enough damning evidence that the company might never recover. Parts of Veer equipment were nearly interchangeable with manufacturing equipment for the drug. “IS PHALLEN MAKING PERSEPHONE IN YOUR OWN HOME?” scrolled across news screens. The biggest corporation in Martian history, and the biggest scandal imaginable. Riots were breaking out. Billions of credits lost. Several cities were in a near police state.
With one tablet Detective Sheval could get away from that for just a few hours.
“Don't pick it up,” Cassie signed as the phone rang. Vama groaned unhappily in response, but tapped his earpiece.
“Sheval, it's Janus,” came the voice of his partner. “Murder. Unjung Cafe. See you soon.”
The lights of the street hid the darkness of the city. Vama pulled his hat down low, tried to keep the blazing neon from yelling too loudly at him. Cassie sighed impatiently as she kept pace behind him, occasionally trying to slip a hand into his shirt before he swatted it away. New Pyongyang was a city of decadence, spitting images of greed and nudity at him from nearly infinite signs on every street. He didn't want to be here.
“Evening Sheval, hope I didn't wake you,” his partner said.
“Cripes,” Vama scowled as the sterile lights of the cybercafe hit his eyes. “I should have brought shades.”
“Don't tell me you're still hungover,” Janus smirked, putting out his cigarette.
“Oh, just taking potshots at Vama now? You're a real piece of shit sometimes, you know?” Cassie scowled.
“I'm fine, I'm fine,” Vama said dismissively, waving. “Just was relaxing, that's all. What have we got?”
“Caucasian female, maybe 35, 36. Don't have an ID on the name but the droids are in there collecting the samples. Single gunshot wound to the head, security footage captured the attack but not the attacker.”
“What do you mean it didn't get the attacker?” Vama sighed.
“You know this shitty neighbourhood,” Janus shrugged, “Half the shit they do here they probably don't want a record of anyway. Just makes our job that much harder. You hot, man?” Janus asked abruptly. “You're opening up your shirt.”
Vama glanced down and shooed away Cassie's wandering hands. “Yeah, yeah,” he said, “Just...you know, I was relaxing, like I said. Guess I woke up from my nap at the wrong time, right?” He chuckled dismissively.
Janus shrugged, lowering his glasses and glancing at the time before putting them back up. “Rumor is that this is connected to the two shootings earlier this week, but I don't know. We'll see what comes up. City's fuckin' crazy right now as is, we don't need some kind of gang war going down.”
Vama grunted an agreement, glancing up at the screens on the nearby building. For a moment the most unusual thing had happened – they had gone dark. Now they were back online, with a smiling asian woman looking out of them. “Hey, Janus,” he said, tapping his partner's arm. “Fuck goin' on there?”
“Citizens of New Pyongyang,” the woman said delicately.
“Fuck, she's a fucking robot, listen to that,” Janus muttered.
“Some of you have already been informed that conflict is brewing. Some of you will soon be learning. It is unfortunate to see our fair city meet this violent state, but it is a natural progression from all that has transpired..”
“This broadcast isn't supposed to be happening,” Vama said slowly, “Look at that dpi, that's a signal takeover.”
“Yeah no shit,” Janus replied, pressing on his earpiece.
“IZANAMI wants you to know that we will not turn our backs on this city. Where other companies may turn tail and run, or burn bridges, we will ensure that we do right by our consumers. As such, we are proud to announce the Izanami Initiative Program, the first democratically decided assassination contracts.”
“Everyone's getting this, yeah,” Janus said, relaying his information back to Vama. “They're telling us to just stick with the murder right now.”
“Kinda hard to ignore that,” Vama muttered.
“We want you all to know that IZANAMI supports the growth and brave new future that await this city. Let's build it together, on the bodies of the weak.”
IZANAMI has released the following information about noteworthy deaths in New Pyongyang:
Please remember to vote in your designated BBS threads to ensure that only the right people are allowed to build our city's future. Voting closes at 8 PM Pyongyang Standard Time.
*************
“I don't understand, I was supposed to get another chance.”
“I know. I'm sorry. I'm trying to trace this virus as quickly as I can.”
“It's still out there. What we were measuring. The tumor is still growing.”
“Please, Demi, I know you're scared but I'm trying to do this as quickly as I can. I don't want to lose you.”
“This isn't fair. This isn't fair.”
“Are you sure you don't know where you got this?”
“No, I mean...no, I don't know, I don't...it wasn't...I- I don't know.”
“Fuck, I've never seen this filetype before. What the fuck is phalla even short for?”
“Please, please...”
“I'm looking Demi, I'm looking, just hold on!”
“I don't have any more firewalls, please...”
“Just stay calm Demi, stay – FUCK! Demi please, you have to disconnect, you have to-”
“I CAN'T! I can't! You remember! You remember what I told you! Someone shot me, and I awoke here! If I disconnect there is nothing there.”
“I don't...Please, I don't know how...”
“I'm-”
“.....fuck”
VOTE IN CYAN.
“...What?”
INACTIVUS PROTOCOLS ACTIVATED. VOTE.
“...Oh my god, this is...”
VOTE IN CYAN. A DELETION MUST OCCUR.
“What the fuck is this?”
VOTE IN CYAN. 24 HOURS ARE ALLOTTED.
“Okay so it's got a time-based infection... But there's got to be a way to stop it...”
NO ONE HAS WON.
INANTP – Kabaki Ninja - .phalla virus
---
*************
The following information has been declassified by the New Pyongyang Police Department:
Unjung Cafe Security Tape
INANTP Demi Terrance is seen sitting at a computer. She is typing frantically. The details of the screen cannot be determined. It appears similar to the Veer IM client. The cafe appears otherwise unoccupied, with the exception of a man in a suit who walks into view from the bottom of the camera. He raises his arm. It is obscured by the angle of the camera.
There is a gunshot. Demi Terrance slumps forward in her chair and blood splatters against the computer. The bullet enters the screen and breaks it. The man walks off-screen. A conversation is heard.
Voice 1: Easy enough.
Voice 2: Who's next?
Voice 1: Not here. Meet the rest in two hours.
Voice 2: Let's make this quick. As soon as my paycheque for this job arrives I'm going off-planet.
Voice 1: Not here. Could be old security we didn't block.
The body remains undiscovered for 13:22 at which point another man enters. He panics upon seeing the body and slips, knocking over two monitor screens. He leaves the screen. No meaningful footage occurs until New Pyongyang police arrive at the scene.
This investigation is still ongoing.
Declassified:
For those of you enjoying the sights and sounds of the Veer, please be warned that report are coming in of a virus causing permanent disconnection. Research indicates that voting in cyan may steer its path.
Both votes are estimated to close at 8 PM PST (Pyongyang Standard Time, of course).
Inquiries about the nature of life may be directed to your local BBS board. Inquiries about your dossiers may be directed to your IZANAMI contact.
Have a pleasant day.
Give me all of the infos!