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[DnD 4E Discussion] ITT we all get behind gnomes.

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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    REG Rysk wrote: »
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    REG Rysk wrote: »
    I want the d10's specifically. Broadsword + weapon expertise is probably fine enough.
    In the long run, this is going to be better for you than Bastard Sword.

    I agree. If you want the d10's this is probably the way to go.

    You'll still be one below on your to-hit with a dagger.

    What race, incidentally?

    That's in debate. At the moment, Drow, but I'm not sure. Definately NOT half-orc.

    Depending on your talent, you're not looking at a very high damage increase between broadsword and dagger. Essentially +4 prof d4 vs +2 prof d10. Always remember, you don't do damage on a miss (unless it's a daily, of course) so in my book, hitting on 8s instead of 10s is a damage increase of 20%. When you factor in sneak damage and Ruthless Ruffian or the cha bonus on Sly Flourish if you go with Artful Dodger, it's essentially...

    +4 Prof d4 + 2d6 + dexmod + chamod for Sly Flourish
    +2 prof d10 + 2d6 + dexmod + chamod for Sly Flourish

    If your dex and cha are both 18, these both even out to close to the same, but one doesn't cost you a feat.

    Of course, this is all just metagaming. If you want to use a broadsword because it's cool, go for that shit.

    Pinfeldorf on
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    yeah man if the dude wants to swing a broadsword

    i say let him step up to the plate

    personally i might go for longswordy eladrin but that's just me

    i like the longsword

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
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    OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    REG Rysk wrote: »
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    REG Rysk wrote: »
    I want the d10's specifically. Broadsword + weapon expertise is probably fine enough.
    In the long run, this is going to be better for you than Bastard Sword.

    I agree. If you want the d10's this is probably the way to go.

    You'll still be one below on your to-hit with a dagger.

    What race, incidentally?

    That's in debate. At the moment, Drow, but I'm not sure. Definately NOT half-orc.

    Depending on your talent, you're not looking at a very high damage increase between broadsword and dagger. Essentially +4 prof d4 vs +2 prof d10. Always remember, you don't do damage on a miss (unless it's a daily, of course) so in my book, hitting on 8s instead of 10s is a damage increase of 20%. When you factor in sneak damage and Ruthless Ruffian or the cha bonus on Sly Flourish if you go with Artful Dodger, it's essentially...

    +4 Prof d4 + 2d6 + dexmod + chamod for Sly Flourish
    +2 prof d10 + 2d6 + dexmod + chamod for Sly Flourish

    If your dex and cha are both 18, these both even out to close to the same, but one doesn't cost you a feat.

    Of course, this is all just metagaming. If you want to use a broadsword because it's cool, go for that shit.
    Hitting on 8's instead of 10's is a 10% increase in accuracy, not 20%.

    I would agree that from a purely damage or effectiveness standpoint, there are much better things to be spending your feats on, though.

    OptimusZed on
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    PotatoNinjaPotatoNinja Fake Gamer Goat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    Hitting on 8's instead of 10's is a 10% increase in accuracy, not 20%.

    Hitting on 8's instead of 10's is an approximately 20% increase in average DPR.

    Hitting on a 10 is a 55% chance to hit. Hitting on an 8 is a 65% chance to hit. So you're looking at about an 18.2% increase on DPR when you calculate hits and misses, assuming one attack per round. A 20% increase would be hitting on 11 and 9, respectively.

    If you're only hitting 50% of the time, and now you're hitting 60% of the time, you've increased the number of your attacks that hit by 20%. The more likely you are to hit the less important an attack bonus becomes and the more important a damage bonus becomes. On the flip-side, an attack bonus is more valuable than a damage bonus as your chance to hit decreases.

    In more stark terms, imagine hitting only on a 20 and missing only on a 1. A one point shift in your attack bonus could easier double your chance to hit (5% to 10%), essentially increasing your DPR by 100%, or would change your chance to hit from 95% to 90%, which is going to be around a 5.5% drop in DPR.

    PotatoNinja on
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    OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    If you're only hitting 50% of the time, and now you're hitting 60% of the time, you've increased the number of your attacks that hit by 20%.
    Is his that "new math" I've been hearing about?

    Edit: Nevermind, I get it.

    I'm usually in the camp of to hit being king, since damage bonuses only matter if they're actively putting things down faster, which a +1 or extra die step rarely actually does.

    OptimusZed on
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    RiusRius Globex CEO Nobody ever says ItalyRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    If you're only hitting 50% of the time, and now you're hitting 60% of the time, you've increased the number of your attacks that hit by 20%.
    Is his that "new math" I've been hearing about?

    It's that confusing shit.

    See, if you go from hitting 5/10 to 6/10, that's a 10% increase. But if you're hitting 50% of the time and you go up to 60% of the time, that's a 20% increase of that 50%.

    Rius on
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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    If you're only hitting 50% of the time, and now you're hitting 60% of the time, you've increased the number of your attacks that hit by 20%.
    Is his that "new math" I've been hearing about?

    Edit: Nevermind, I get it.

    I'm usually in the camp of to hit being king, since damage bonuses only matter if they're actively putting things down faster, which a +1 or extra die step rarely actually does.

    It's just adjusting percentages. While going from hitting on a 10 to an 8 is only a 10% chance to hit increase in the abstract, it is a 20% increase over the 50% chance that you *had*.

    It's this kind of shit statisticians do to make results look different than they are. If murder comprised 2% of deaths in 2008 and 4% of deaths in 2009, they could say 'the rate of murder increased by 100% in 2009.' In reality, it is a 2% increase to the overall statistic, but compared to the previous percentage, it *is* double. Convoluted, yes, but still accurate.

    Well, Zed gets it now, so I guess this post was just kicking a dead horse. But, seriously, fuck those dead horses.

    Pinfeldorf on
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Rius wrote: »
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    If you're only hitting 50% of the time, and now you're hitting 60% of the time, you've increased the number of your attacks that hit by 20%.
    Is his that "new math" I've been hearing about?

    It's that confusing shit.

    See, if you go from hitting 5/10 to 6/10, that's a 10% increase. But if you're hitting 50% of the time and you go up to 60% of the time, that's a 20% increase of that 50%.

    how the crap did this get into percentages. the examples were 'hit on a ten' and 'hit on an eight'.

    we don't use percentile dice to roll hits. one of them is basically +2 over the other.

    makes it easy to know where you stand in terms of rolling d20's.

    Horseshoe on
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    PotatoNinjaPotatoNinja Fake Gamer Goat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Its mostly relevant to understanding how attack and damage bonuses have different effective values depending on your chance to hit or miss.

    Attack is more important when you're likely to miss, damage when you're likely to hit. That's discounting some of the more peculiar mechanics like multiple attacks, rerolls, half-damage-on-miss abilities, and the tactical advantages of applying an effect that only triggers on a hit.

    I think there's also a psychological motivation for players to go for hit instead of damage because missing is really boring.

    Generally speaking, rogues (properly built) are very accurate, so trading some accuracy for damage may be a good exchange for the player.

    PotatoNinja on
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    REG RyskREG Rysk Lord Rageface Rageington The Exploding ManRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    A percentage increase in how often you hit is not the kind of stat I'm looking to convince me in the way you presented it. Presenting the 10% additional is what I would see to make me see it better.

    It's likely that I will start with a longsword and graduate to broadswords by level 15 when weapon expertise can be changed for a +2 instead of a +1. The only real difference in the end game is that you don't need expertise for high proficiency weapons unless you want to super guarantee a hit. Broadswords is what I want to do, and a non-strength based race as well.

    REG Rysk on
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Its mostly relevant to understanding how attack and damage bonuses have different effective values depending on your chance to hit or miss.

    +2 to hit makes a hell of a lot more sense than wondering whether it's a 10% or 20% increase.

    Pretty sure combat advantage isn't described in the book as increasing your chance to hit by 20%, leaving you to do some math and figure out how much it actually adds to the roll.

    When someone says "+2" you know exactly what you've got. REG gets it.

    You dudes and your maths. I'm quite happy with only needing addition and subtraction to play this game. Hell, thanks to new critical hit system I don't even have to multiply anymore.

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    REG Rysk wrote: »
    A percentage increase in how often you hit is not the kind of stat I'm looking to convince me in the way you presented it. Presenting the 10% additional is what I would see to make me see it better.

    It's likely that I will start with a longsword and graduate to broadswords by level 15 when weapon expertise can be changed for a +2 instead of a +1. The only real difference in the end game is that you don't need expertise for high proficiency weapons unless you want to super guarantee a hit. Broadswords is what I want to do, and a non-strength based race as well.

    I'm tellin' ya man.

    Eladrin Longsworder.

    Fey Step gives you a guaranteed flank (or escape) once per encounter.

    Also the extra skill training in any damn skill.

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    REG Rysk wrote: »
    A percentage increase in how often you hit is not the kind of stat I'm looking to convince me in the way you presented it. Presenting the 10% additional is what I would see to make me see it better.

    It's likely that I will start with a longsword and graduate to broadswords by level 15 when weapon expertise can be changed for a +2 instead of a +1. The only real difference in the end game is that you don't need expertise for high proficiency weapons unless you want to super guarantee a hit. Broadswords is what I want to do, and a non-strength based race as well.

    I'm tellin' ya man.

    Eladrin Longsworder.

    Fey Step gives you a guaranteed flank (or escape) once per encounter.

    Also the extra skill training in any damn skill.

    I like where this man comes from. 3-10 > 1-10, no fancy math involved!

    Pinfeldorf on
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Exactly.

    This is supposed to be the edition that makes it easier to play.

    No fancy math required.

    Hell, not even the remedial math that they taught the football team back in the day to bring up their GPA.

    Breaking shit down into percentages and other such hoohah is missing the point.

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
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    PotatoNinjaPotatoNinja Fake Gamer Goat Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    Its mostly relevant to understanding how attack and damage bonuses have different effective values depending on your chance to hit or miss.

    +2 to hit makes a hell of a lot more sense than wondering whether it's a 10% or 20% increase.

    Pretty sure combat advantage isn't described in the book as increasing your chance to hit by 20%, leaving you to do some math and figure out how much it actually adds to the roll.

    When someone says "+2" you know exactly what you've got. REG gets it.

    You dudes and your maths. I'm quite happy with only needing addition and subtraction to play this game. Hell, thanks to new critical hit system I don't even have to multiply anymore.

    What's going on is basically the diminishing value of a linear increase. A +2 to hit is equivalent to a 10% increase in your overall chance to hit (each number on a d20 is 5%, you're secretly using percentile dice and you didn't even know it).

    However, a 10% increase in your overall chance doesn't mean 10% more of your attacks hit. If you hit 50% of the time (5 out of 10) and now you hit 60% of the time (6/10), that's a 20% increase in the number of your attacks that will hit (5 x 1.2 = 6).

    If you hit 80% of the time (8 out of 10) and now you hit 90% of the time (9/10), that's only a 12.5% increase in the number of your attacks that will hit (8 x 1.125 = 9).

    Then you take the square root of pi, subtract the hypotenuse of the sun and divine by zero. But only one your first critical hit of every encounter.

    PotatoNinja on
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    Its mostly relevant to understanding how attack and damage bonuses have different effective values depending on your chance to hit or miss.

    +2 to hit makes a hell of a lot more sense than wondering whether it's a 10% or 20% increase.

    Pretty sure combat advantage isn't described in the book as increasing your chance to hit by 20%, leaving you to do some math and figure out how much it actually adds to the roll.

    When someone says "+2" you know exactly what you've got. REG gets it.

    You dudes and your maths. I'm quite happy with only needing addition and subtraction to play this game. Hell, thanks to new critical hit system I don't even have to multiply anymore.

    What's going on is basically the diminishing value of a linear increase. A +2 to hit is equivalent to

    airhornsman.png

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
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    DelmainDelmain Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    Its mostly relevant to understanding how attack and damage bonuses have different effective values depending on your chance to hit or miss.

    +2 to hit makes a hell of a lot more sense than wondering whether it's a 10% or 20% increase.

    Pretty sure combat advantage isn't described in the book as increasing your chance to hit by 20%, leaving you to do some math and figure out how much it actually adds to the roll.

    When someone says "+2" you know exactly what you've got. REG gets it.

    You dudes and your maths. I'm quite happy with only needing addition and subtraction to play this game. Hell, thanks to new critical hit system I don't even have to multiply anymore.

    What's going on is basically the diminishing value of a linear increase. A +2 to hit is equivalent to

    *snip*

    This is not SE++

    Delmain on
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    it was the first thing that popped into my head

    Horseshoe on
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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    it was the first thing that popped into my head

    I think a Phoenix Wright picture may have been more appropriate.

    Or Edgeworth. He is better.

    Pinfeldorf on
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    it was the first thing that popped into my head

    I think a Phoenix Wright picture may have been more appropriate.

    Or Edgeworth. He is better.

    Y'know I never actually played those particular vidjagames... those are from vidjagames, right?

    goddamnit Horseshoe be less ignorant of pop culture. watch tv once in a while or... or something


    ANYWAY


    Does anyone have the Dragonborn player's book thing?

    From what I can tell in the Character Builder there's some nice content.

    Wondering if it's also a good read.

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
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    RatherDashingRatherDashing Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Aegeri wrote:
    It's by far the most broken power published in 4E. Worst of all, once you get to epic if the Summoner goes for the right PP and epic destiny, I think you could get the power up to four times a day.

    Four encounters with at-will dominate? Why thank you.

    Little late to the party on this one, but was just wondering if I'm missing something... what makes this so broken? I mean yeah, at-will dominate is crazy, but really, the succubus has what, 1/2 of the wizard's hp? At level 9, when you get this, it's gonna have maybe 25 - 30 hp. Seems like it'd be pretty easy for it to get taken out, especially since the range is only 5, so it has to be in fairly close.

    Or is it the fact that you can set it an auto-pilot while you're just dazed? That is pretty amazing too... but then, any enemies on you would ruin your day pretty quick when you couldn't shift away.

    Maybe this is something that breaks down later in paragon or epic? Most 4e games I've played are heroic through early paragon, so maybe that's why I'm not seeing it...

    Hmm, and I wonder why half the creatures in that article target enemies only when let loose, even though they have the sidebar that specifically talks about "watch out, they may attack your allies when it says creatures!"

    RatherDashing on
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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Aegeri wrote:
    It's by far the most broken power published in 4E. Worst of all, once you get to epic if the Summoner goes for the right PP and epic destiny, I think you could get the power up to four times a day.

    Four encounters with at-will dominate? Why thank you.

    Little late to the party on this one, but was just wondering if I'm missing something... what makes this so broken? I mean yeah, at-will dominate is crazy, but really, the succubus has what, 1/2 of the wizard's hp? At level 9, when you get this, it's gonna have maybe 25 - 30 hp. Seems like it'd be pretty easy for it to get taken out, especially since the range is only 5, so it has to be in fairly close.

    Or is it the fact that you can set it an auto-pilot while you're just dazed? That is pretty amazing too... but then, any enemies on you would ruin your day pretty quick when you couldn't shift away.

    Maybe this is something that breaks down later in paragon or epic? Most 4e games I've played are heroic through early paragon, so maybe that's why I'm not seeing it...

    Hmm, and I wonder why half the creatures in that article target enemies only when let loose, even though they have the sidebar that specifically talks about "watch out, they may attack your allies when it says creatures!"

    The problem is that you "steal" one of the DM's monsters, without actually giving up your standard action - since the succubus will continue using its instinctive action while you're dazed. So, assuming the succubus hits, it's a power-shift of TWO monsters, which completely junks up encounters with say 3 monsters, when one of them suddenly decides to switch sides.

    That is, it's the same reason you don't use 2 Brains In Jars against a 4-player party, because you'll end up "stealing" two players, completely throwing off the encounter balance. 1 versus 4, sure. 2 versus... 6, maybe. Aegeri's complaint is that if there's a solo in a combat, the succubus dominates the solo, thus removing like 80% of the XP from that encounter budget and furthermore swings it onto the players' side to decimate the remaining 20% of the XP budget.

    hippofant on
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    TerrendosTerrendos Decorative Monocle Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Furthermore, dominate is a condition that does not occur very often for PCs. I think the earliest one can get a dominate power is the Bard's level 5 daily (which targets a single creature), and even that lasts only until the end of the next turn, and only when it hits.

    It would be reasonable to expect maybe a single target save ends dominate on a Wizard as a level 9 daily. Being able to dominate like the Succubus would probably trivialize 1/3 of encounters, basically anything with an Elite or Solo.

    Terrendos on
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    RatherDashingRatherDashing Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    hippofant wrote:
    The problem is that you "steal" one of the DM's monsters, without actually giving up your standard action - since the succubus will continue using its instinctive action while you're dazed. So, assuming the succubus hits, it's a power-shift of TWO monsters, which completely junks up encounters with say 3 monsters, when one of them suddenly decides to switch sides.

    That is, it's the same reason you don't use 2 Brains In Jars against a 4-player party, because you'll end up "stealing" two players, completely throwing off the encounter balance. 1 versus 4, sure. 2 versus... 6, maybe. Aegeri's complaint is that if there's a solo in a combat, the succubus dominates the solo, thus removing like 80% of the XP from that encounter budget and furthermore swings it onto the players' side to decimate the remaining 20% of the XP budget.

    Ahh fair enough, I can see that... easy fix(well partially I guess) would be that the succubus can in fact target your allies when on auto-pilot. Still don't get why that's not the case already. "Oh hey you have me here against my will, but I'm totally going to fight for you anyway!" o_O

    RatherDashing on
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    squall99xsquall99x Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    This is for those of you that have managed to get a PHB3 already. I am going to be DMing one of the gameday events for PHB3 and one of the loots that is listed in the adventure is this "and one talent shard per character in the group". Just curious if anyone can clue me in on what a talent shard is, as I do not have the book yet.

    squall99x on
    oHqYBTXm.jpg
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    REG RyskREG Rysk Lord Rageface Rageington The Exploding ManRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Problem with dominating an ally means that the wizard then controls the ally, not the succubus. So still on your side.

    It's overpowered.

    REG Rysk on
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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    squall99x wrote: »
    This is for those of you that have managed to get a PHB3 already. I am going to be DMing one of the gameday events for PHB3 and one of the loots that is listed in the adventure is this "and one talent shard per character in the group". Just curious if anyone can clue me in on what a talent shard is, as I do not have the book yet.

    Talent shard totally sounds like something that would drop in FFXIII to give you more CPs.

    Pinfeldorf on
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    ravensmuseravensmuse Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Anyone going to the DnD Encounters things starting up next week? I'd heard some rumblings about it, but I guess the announcement for stores just went live?

    Starts next week, you can either use a pregen or make your own character (you get extra Renown for using PHB3 content), and you're doing one or two encounters in Undermountain. Runs until June.

    Going to the new store that opened up like, ten minutes from me. Anyone else?

    ravensmuse on
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    squall99xsquall99x Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Encounters this season is Undermoutain, adventure is Halaster's Lost Apprentice. It's 12 encounters in all, with one encounter every week. Store I go to is running it and I'm DMing (at least the first week). Basically a neat concept to introduce DnD to people in bite size pieces.

    squall99x on
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    ravensmuseravensmuse Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Out of curiosity I went to see if I have any LFR events anywhere near me.

    Nope. I think the only place is in Boston, which kind of kills it for me.

    I'd kill for a face to face group like mad.

    ravensmuse on
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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    ravensmuse wrote: »
    Anyone going to the DnD Encounters things starting up next week? I'd heard some rumblings about it, but I guess the announcement for stores just went live?

    Starts next week, you can either use a pregen or make your own character (you get extra Renown for using PHB3 content), and you're doing one or two encounters in Undermountain. Runs until June.

    Going to the new store that opened up like, ten minutes from me. Anyone else?

    Been debating it, but it all will boil down to how long the encounter is. The closest place doing Encounters, to me, is about 40 minutes away from my house. If the session is 90 minutes, I'm looking at 80 minutes of driving for 90 minutes of game play, which is...not ideal.

    Pinfeldorf on
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    squall99xsquall99x Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    That is probably about right, they say to plan for 90 minutes - 2 hrs. It is literally one encounter a week and from what I have seen assuming you are playing with experienced players and not new ones (which is really who they are trying to attract) it will take far less. I am not sure however if they are including set up time, explanation etc etc as part of the two hrs. From memory, 11 of the encounters are actual fights, with one encounter being a two part skill challenge (with a chance of a fight built in).

    Honestly though like I said, players who have been playing, and come to the table ready to play, I could see some of the counters taking < 30 minutes.

    squall99x on
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    ravensmuseravensmuse Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    I'm hoping that the store I'll be going to will have someone running like, Delves or something.

    ravensmuse on
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    squall99xsquall99x Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    ravensmuse wrote: »
    I'm hoping that the store I'll be going to will have someone running like, Delves or something.

    Unless they are using old stuff, they won't be, the Delves don't exist anymore, they were replaced with the Encounters program.

    squall99x on
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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    So, what do you think? Should I go? I've got at least one of each role concepted and rolled out, would just need to print the sheets up, so that business is all done.

    Pinfeldorf on
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    squall99xsquall99x Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    Honestly man, it just depends on whether you think its gonna be worth your time. The adventure is pretty good for what it is, but as I said its one encounter a week for 12 weeks. You start at level 1 and will probably be just a hair into level 2 at the end of it. Also at the moment I don't think (but could be wrong) that characters transfer over between seasons. Fun fact, season 2 is confirmed as Dark Sun and I believe that starts in August or there abouts.

    So basically - Mostly geared towards people who have never played before, still fun though especially if you just like playing in the public and meeting new/cool people (hopefully)

    squall99x on
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    snypersnyper Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    squall99x wrote: »
    This is for those of you that have managed to get a PHB3 already. I am going to be DMing one of the gameday events for PHB3 and one of the loots that is listed in the adventure is this "and one talent shard per character in the group". Just curious if anyone can clue me in on what a talent shard is, as I do not have the book yet.

    I don't have the book on hand atm (lending it to a friend), but I'm almost positive a talent shard is a consumable magic item that gives +1 or 2 to the next skill check you or an ally roll, and it scales with the different level versions.

    snyper on
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    squall99xsquall99x Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    snyper wrote: »
    squall99x wrote: »
    This is for those of you that have managed to get a PHB3 already. I am going to be DMing one of the gameday events for PHB3 and one of the loots that is listed in the adventure is this "and one talent shard per character in the group". Just curious if anyone can clue me in on what a talent shard is, as I do not have the book yet.

    I don't have the book on hand atm (lending it to a friend), but I'm almost positive a talent shard is a consumable magic item that gives +1 or 2 to the next skill check you or an ally roll, and it scales with the different level versions.

    So basically a Healing Potion for skill checks, sorta. Eh, was kinda hoping it was something cooler.

    squall99x on
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    AegeriAegeri Tiny wee bacteriums Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    edited March 2010
    hippofant wrote:
    The problem is that you "steal" one of the DM's monsters, without actually giving up your standard action - since the succubus will continue using its instinctive action while you're dazed. So, assuming the succubus hits, it's a power-shift of TWO monsters, which completely junks up encounters with say 3 monsters, when one of them suddenly decides to switch sides.

    That is, it's the same reason you don't use 2 Brains In Jars against a 4-player party, because you'll end up "stealing" two players, completely throwing off the encounter balance. 1 versus 4, sure. 2 versus... 6, maybe. Aegeri's complaint is that if there's a solo in a combat, the succubus dominates the solo, thus removing like 80% of the XP from that encounter budget and furthermore swings it onto the players' side to decimate the remaining 20% of the XP budget.

    Ahh fair enough, I can see that... easy fix(well partially I guess) would be that the succubus can in fact target your allies when on auto-pilot. Still don't get why that's not the case already. "Oh hey you have me here against my will, but I'm totally going to fight for you anyway!" o_O

    In all honesty I've looked at it quite a lot and this isn't a power you can easily fix. Other solutions either nerf it too hard so it's practically useless or give it something equally as silly like an at-will daze. While it's true you can kill a summon, the encounters where this summon trivializes them are traditional solo fights, a fight centered around an elite and that sort of thing. Plus with an action point you can reuse her dominate and have 2 dominated creatures off the bat. That could be two elites in the encounter as an example, which pretty much could instantly wipe 60% of the encounter off in one round. Just stack them together somewhere and AoE them to death (then make them hit one another on their turn).

    It's really not a power that can be fixed without rewriting its intent. The fact you can get the dominate anyway is insult to injury. You could use a power that penalizes an enemies defenses and then hit with the succubus. For that matter if you are bloodmage/have a bloodmage you could just blood pulse the dominated creature and then make it charge its speed. Effectively making it do 5*speed damage and a melee basic against whatever creature is furthest away.

    Monsters having at-will dominate is okay, it's just important to bear in mind you shouldn't have encounters full of the things or you're just sadistic. 1 PC out of 5 is a pretty big loss, but 1 solo in an encounter is often the entire encounter.

    Aegeri on
    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
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    ravensmuseravensmuse Registered User regular
    edited March 2010
    squall99x wrote: »
    ravensmuse wrote: »
    I'm hoping that the store I'll be going to will have someone running like, Delves or something.

    Unless they are using old stuff, they won't be, the Delves don't exist anymore, they were replaced with the Encounters program.

    Heh, I meant I hoped that someone would crack open the Dungeon Delve book and run something, ha.

    ravensmuse on
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