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[The Walking Dead] Season one is over "Man I'm gonna get shitfaced drunk, again"

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    ArthilArthil Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Arthil wrote: »
    Think of it like this, we're kinda into the zed apocalypse by the point the show starts, right? How much medicine do you think is still around?

    How long did people in the past survive after getting a horribly infected wound, while not having antibiotics of any kind to allow them to deal with it? Not very long at all.

    I don't think it's any sort of infected wound though. Like, if you get bitten by a wild cat in the world of TWD, I don't think it'll give you a huge fever that makes your skin feel like it's on fire and ultimately kills you. I think it's only the zombie's bite that infects you with the weird zombie disease that leads to the fever.

    Eh... well, same general idea really. Zombie Fever or not, if you've gotten a wound of any size, from a simple cut on the finger to losing a limb, without antibiotics or the ability to keep it properly cleaned. As you've seen at least in Rick's hometown, the towns hot water isn't working. Then it has a high chance of being infected via normal means, and through this... you're probably gonna die.

    So yeah a cat biting/scratching you could still turn you into a zed, technically, if you have fucked luck.

    Arthil on
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    Handsome CostanzaHandsome Costanza Ask me about 8bitdo RIP Iwata-sanRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    the scene I loved the most, besides anything with Black Bauer in it:

    When Rick says hes sorry to his wife and kids and is about to off himself, then looks up and immediately goes in the open tank hatch... fucking excellent film making right there.


    or
    Daddy I got this sumvabitch I'm gonna smack him dead! *nonchalant head shot from point blank*

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    President RexPresident Rex Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    The action and drama and such is great, but the way you're describing the workings of the zombification process is ridiculous.
    Is it presented the same way in the written work (i.e. people develop fevers from bites or scratches?). Because if you're already infected with the virus it makes no sense that you would magically get a fever from some other injury that kills you nigh instantaneously.

    And if that were true, then there's not reason Rick's bandage at the beginning of the show wouldn't have naturally festered and somehow transformed him into a zombie while he was comatose.

    If the zombies aren't transferring the 'disease' via bites and scratches, then the worst they're doing when they bite or scratch you is creating wounds full of terrible, disease-causing bacteria. When you die you don't magically get killing fingers filled with poison, ergo scratches zombifying you in a matter of hours is ridiculous.

    (Yes, even in a fantasy world where animated corpses hunger for flesh. If you're going to suppose your fiction is in an alternate reality that works on the basis of this reality then you need to be consistent with our universe).


    But that's all sort of ridiculous. The show is enjoyable and (like Watchman or any other written work transformed for a new media) the explanation behind the show's mechanics and personalities may be different.

    President Rex on
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    Delta AssaultDelta Assault Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Arthil wrote: »
    Think of it like this, we're kinda into the zed apocalypse by the point the show starts, right? How much medicine do you think is still around?

    How long did people in the past survive after getting a horribly infected wound, while not having antibiotics of any kind to allow them to deal with it? Not very long at all.

    I don't think it's any sort of infected wound though. Like, if you get bitten by a wild cat in the world of TWD, I don't think it'll give you a huge fever that makes your skin feel like it's on fire and ultimately kills you. I think it's only the zombie's bite that infects you with the weird zombie disease that leads to the fever.

    Is it a wild cat that has been rotting for the past 3 months?

    This is important. Think about why I'm asking this question.

    Well, a wild cat that's been rotting for the past 3 months wouldn't be biting anyone. Only humans turn into zombies, not animals. A zombie apocalypse with animals would be far far more dangerous then this one.

    But yea... I don't think it's just being rotten. Having rotting flesh and bone creating an open wound wouldn't be any sort of a picnic, I agree, but the description of the fever feeling like a fire when you hold your hand over the victim... that doesn't sound like any normal infection. That sounds pretty damn supernatural to me. You might well die from an infection without antibiotics, but you might not. The zombie bite's infection/fever kills 100% of the time.

    Delta Assault on
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    ArthilArthil Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Rick had his wound tended to for quite a while, not sure how long he'd been in that hospital bed for but he was obviously getting antibiotics for a time so his wound was probably healed, he just hadn't recovered since... well he had been in a coma with no one keeping an eye on him.

    Arthil on
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    ArthilArthil Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Arthil wrote: »
    Think of it like this, we're kinda into the zed apocalypse by the point the show starts, right? How much medicine do you think is still around?

    How long did people in the past survive after getting a horribly infected wound, while not having antibiotics of any kind to allow them to deal with it? Not very long at all.

    I don't think it's any sort of infected wound though. Like, if you get bitten by a wild cat in the world of TWD, I don't think it'll give you a huge fever that makes your skin feel like it's on fire and ultimately kills you. I think it's only the zombie's bite that infects you with the weird zombie disease that leads to the fever.

    Is it a wild cat that has been rotting for the past 3 months?

    This is important. Think about why I'm asking this question.

    Well, a wild cat that's been rotting for the past 3 months wouldn't be biting anyone. Only humans turn into zombies, not animals. A zombie apocalypse with animals would be far far more dangerous then this one.

    But yea... I don't think it's just being rotten. Having rotting flesh and bone creating an open wound wouldn't be any sort of a picnic, I agree, but the description of the fever feeling like a fire when you hold your hand over the victim... that doesn't sound like any normal infection. That sounds pretty damn supernatural to me.

    Couldn't it be science fictional rather than supernatural?

    Arthil on
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    Mr.SunshineMr.Sunshine Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I like my explanation and am sticking with it.

    Mr.Sunshine on
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    SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    In the written work it's all conjecture. They don't know shit. The audience figures it out the same time the characters do.

    I'm done with this argument. It's been perfectly legitimate for legions of fans of the graphic novel that a zombie bite kills you really fucking quickly. I don't see why it isn't okay with you guys.

    Nothing is ever explained from a position of authority in the graphic novels, why do you need it to be that way on the screen?

    Spawnbroker on
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    President RexPresident Rex Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Arthil wrote: »
    Rick had his wound tended to for quite a while, not sure how long he'd been in that hospital bed for but he was obviously getting antibiotics for a time so his wound was probably healed, he just hadn't recovered since... well he had been in a coma with no one keeping an eye on him.

    The black guy actually says he changed Rick's bandage and it was festering pretty badly when he has him tied up all bondage style.

    President Rex on
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    Delta AssaultDelta Assault Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Arthil wrote: »
    Couldn't it be science fictional rather than supernatural?

    Ummm, sure I guess. But I've never read about any sort of science fiction answer in the comics.

    Here's what I've been led to believe:

    Zombies bite you and infect you with horrible zombie germs. These germs create a zombie fever that kills you.

    Death has been altered by a vengeful God up in heaven and now turns you into a zombie filled with horrible zombie germs.

    Delta Assault on
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    KageraKagera Imitating the worst people. Since 2004Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    so being exposed to a virus that you already have makes you develop a fever?

    why????

    You know how bees are disappearing in droves? A popular theory that the combination of two diseases acting at the same time super fucks the colonies up so that they all die.

    So think of the zombie virus as two variants. One is a dormant version that activates upon death and the other is a fast-acting catalyst to get the infected people dying and thus reanimating.

    Why would you want a dormant version and a killer version? So you can selectively cause outbreaks where and when you want. I'm guessing that the dormant version isn't supposed to activate upon normal death but then it mutated.

    Of course this is all conjecture the explanation has never been made and may never be because a popular thing in zombie fiction is to never explain it.

    In any event about
    the guy in the tank. Sure the hatches were open probably because he was with others who decided to make a break for it while he was dying or dead. Hell he may have had a broken leg or other issue that made him unable to join them.

    Kagera on
    My neck, my back, my FUPA and my crack.
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    ZampanovZampanov You May Not Go Home Until Tonight Has Been MagicalRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    when you're talking about survival, the why doesn't really matter so long as you know the rules

    important information is if someone dies you take out the brain to be sure and if someone gets bit, it's as good as being dead

    You don't have time to care about why, and I like that aspect of the story. I hope it never gets explained, it would cheapen that feeling.

    spoilered in case I wasn't vague enough

    Zampanov on
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    durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Yeah basically. Zombie Fever will kill you quick, but dying in general will still make you a zombie. So if a dude gets a paper cut, don't off him and dump the corpse. But having Zombie Fever makes you die so quick it's not worth looking for treatment.

    It is not really a complicated idea.

    Everything else: zombies do not actually function in for-real life situations because of being a fiction.

    durandal4532 on
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    TomantaTomanta Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Edit: so, zombie apocalypse

    Basically I'm prepared:

    Escape plan: set up bunker in abandoned missile base
    Emergency weapon: Warhammer, 1-shot kill on zombies with the con of taking high stamina to swing
    Preferred firearm: Any kind of shotgun, high ammo efficiency low accuracy requirement

    Abandoned missile base is... ok, I suppose. For a group, a prison is a pretty good choice if you can clean it out. Especially if you can manage to get a food supply going.

    Warhammer is an awful melee weapon, though. Too heavy and requiring big swings, useless in close quarters. Best emergency weapon is a crowbar. Because it is multifunctional and more than capable of bashing a skull in. Just be sure not to use the hooked end, don't want it to get stuck. Machetes and handaxes are good as well, but blunt weapons are better.

    Firearms all have their pros and cons. Anything with high ammo capacity is good. Ideally you would have a shotgun, rifle, and at least two backup pistols.

    Tomanta on
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    durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    My only weapon in the zombie apocalypse would be urination and screaming.

    durandal4532 on
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    override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    My hammer is short, about 1 meter, and has very sharp spikes on the top and bottom, you can easily use it as a stabbing weapon in close quarters

    I bought it at a ren faire to release some aggression on my endless supply of obsolete computers (which I recycle the remains of responsibly)

    override367 on
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    ArthilArthil Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Tomanta wrote: »
    Edit: so, zombie apocalypse

    Basically I'm prepared:

    Escape plan: set up bunker in abandoned missile base
    Emergency weapon: Warhammer, 1-shot kill on zombies with the con of taking high stamina to swing
    Preferred firearm: Any kind of shotgun, high ammo efficiency low accuracy requirement

    Abandoned missile base is... ok, I suppose. For a group, a prison is a pretty good choice if you can clean it out. Especially if you can manage to get a food supply going.

    Warhammer is an awful melee weapon, though. Too heavy and requiring big swings, useless in close quarters. Best emergency weapon is a crowbar. Because it is multifunctional and more than capable of bashing a skull in. Just be sure not to use the hooked end, don't want it to get stuck. Machetes and handaxes are good as well, but blunt weapons are better.

    Firearms all have their pros and cons. Anything with high ammo capacity is good. Ideally you would have a shotgun, rifle, and at least two backup pistols.

    Or go for no firearms at all since the gunshots seem to be like a dinner bell.

    Arthil on
    PSN: Honishimo Steam UPlay: Arthil
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    CenoCeno pizza time Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    If you guys want to discuss how you would survive the zombie apocalypse, I have an old thread just for you.

    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showthread.php?t=95438

    Ceno on
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    i often feel that people in zombie fiction do not take enough precautions not to get zombie gore on them

    given that, if the zombie disease is a disease that makes any kind of logical sense

    you prooooooobably don't want zombie gore getting in your mouth or any wounds you have or whatever

    be as bad as a bite, really

    it's why in max brooks' book he's like "actually chainsaws are completely retarded"

    Pony on
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    Delta AssaultDelta Assault Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    The Walking Dead really illustrates the lack of a good zombie video game to me. Seriously, they all fail in some aspect. Left 4 Dead, Dead Rising, and Resident Evil are all supposed to be zombie games but they never get the details right. If you get bitten in those games, do you get infected and turn into a zombie? Well, no... you're somehow magically immune. Just down a pill or drink some orange juice and you're all better. This is horseshit.

    And what about getting headshots? You can just spray and pray every zombie in the torso in Left 4 Dead and they'll still die. Resident Evil is somewhat better in that respect, I think. Getting headshots is incredibly important for stopping zombies. Either that or chopping them up so they can't actually function. But a spray of bullets to the torso shouldn't have much of an effect in stopping them.

    Delta Assault on
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    KageraKagera Imitating the worst people. Since 2004Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Tomanta wrote: »
    Edit: so, zombie apocalypse

    Basically I'm prepared:

    Escape plan: set up bunker in abandoned missile base
    Emergency weapon: Warhammer, 1-shot kill on zombies with the con of taking high stamina to swing
    Preferred firearm: Any kind of shotgun, high ammo efficiency low accuracy requirement

    Abandoned missile base is... ok, I suppose.

    Abandoned missile bases require some specialized maintenance actually as someone who chose such a setting for their zombie apocalypse fiction mentioned. One thing in particular is moisture seeping into the concrete walls and weakening them as well as allowing bacterial growth.

    So, um, yeah also for any other similar man made structure you'd probably want to watch like Life After Humans or read the book The World Without Us so you can learn about how much work goes into maintaining infrastructure and what an ideal place would be made with.

    Kagera on
    My neck, my back, my FUPA and my crack.
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    KageraKagera Imitating the worst people. Since 2004Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Pony wrote: »
    i often feel that people in zombie fiction do not take enough precautions not to get zombie gore on them

    given that, if the zombie disease is a disease that makes any kind of logical sense

    you prooooooobably don't want zombie gore getting in your mouth or any wounds you have or whatever

    be as bad as a bite, really

    it's why in max brooks' book he's like "actually chainsaws are completely retarded"

    Well yeah it's not like the people who make zombie fiction are actual virologists.

    Kagera on
    My neck, my back, my FUPA and my crack.
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    KageraKagera Imitating the worst people. Since 2004Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    The Walking Dead really illustrates the lack of a good zombie video game to me. Seriously, they all fail in some aspect. Left 4 Dead, Dead Rising, and Resident Evil are all supposed to be zombie games but they never get the details right. If you get bitten in those games, do you get infected and turn into a zombie? Well, no... you're somehow magically immune. Just down a pill or drink some orange juice and you're all better. This is horseshit.

    And what about getting headshots? You can just spray and pray every zombie in the torso in Left 4 Dead and they'll still die. Resident Evil is somewhat better in that respect, I think. Getting headshots is incredibly important for stopping zombies. Either that or chopping them up so they can't actually function. But a spray of bullets to the torso shouldn't have much of an effect in stopping them.

    Well shit it's like you can't actually make a game like that because the first time you would get damaged you would die. Most people don't want to play such a game.

    It's called creative license.

    Kagera on
    My neck, my back, my FUPA and my crack.
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    The Walking Dead really illustrates the lack of a good zombie video game to me. Seriously, they all fail in some aspect. Left 4 Dead, Dead Rising, and Resident Evil are all supposed to be zombie games but they never get the details right. If you get bitten in those games, do you get infected and turn into a zombie? Well, no... you're somehow magically immune. Just down a pill or drink some orange juice and you're all better. This is horseshit.

    And what about getting headshots? You can just spray and pray every zombie in the torso in Left 4 Dead and they'll still die. Resident Evil is somewhat better in that respect, I think. Getting headshots is incredibly important for stopping zombies. Either that or chopping them up so they can't actually function. But a spray of bullets to the torso shouldn't have much of an effect in stopping them.

    well, a few things relevant to Left4Dead, specifically

    the main characters being immune is why they are even alive in the first place. in Left4Dead, the Green Flu (zombie virus) is airborne.

    so the player characters being immune is why they are actually player characters at all

    also in Left4Dead they are not proper undead, they're "infected", ala 28 Days Later. they're living, breathing people with a disease that is making them crazy (or in the case of the special infected, mutating them into something inhuman)

    shooting a living person in the heart and lungs is gonna put em down fast, even if they have the brain-crazies due to drugs or disease

    so they might not die "realistically" according to popular zombie fiction but if you see them as batshit crazy people the way they go down makes a lot of sense

    Pony on
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    valiancevaliance Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Pony wrote: »
    i often feel that people in zombie fiction do not take enough precautions not to get zombie gore on them

    given that, if the zombie disease is a disease that makes any kind of logical sense

    you prooooooobably don't want zombie gore getting in your mouth or any wounds you have or whatever

    be as bad as a bite, really

    it's why in max brooks' book he's like "actually chainsaws are completely retarded"

    this. so hard. fuck getting zombie gore all over you. i loved the riot face mask rick used to bash the zombiee with the bat

    valiance on
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    Delta AssaultDelta Assault Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Pony wrote: »
    The Walking Dead really illustrates the lack of a good zombie video game to me. Seriously, they all fail in some aspect. Left 4 Dead, Dead Rising, and Resident Evil are all supposed to be zombie games but they never get the details right. If you get bitten in those games, do you get infected and turn into a zombie? Well, no... you're somehow magically immune. Just down a pill or drink some orange juice and you're all better. This is horseshit.

    And what about getting headshots? You can just spray and pray every zombie in the torso in Left 4 Dead and they'll still die. Resident Evil is somewhat better in that respect, I think. Getting headshots is incredibly important for stopping zombies. Either that or chopping them up so they can't actually function. But a spray of bullets to the torso shouldn't have much of an effect in stopping them.

    well, a few things relevant to Left4Dead, specifically

    the main characters being immune is why they are even alive in the first place. in Left4Dead, the Green Flu (zombie virus) is airborne.

    so the player characters being immune is why they are actually player characters at all

    also in Left4Dead they are not proper undead, they're "infected", ala 28 Days Later. they're living, breathing people with a disease that is making them crazy (or in the case of the special infected, mutating them into something inhuman)

    shooting a living person in the heart and lungs is gonna put em down fast, even if they have the brain-crazies due to drugs or disease

    so they might not die "realistically" according to popular zombie fiction but if you see them as batshit crazy people the way they go down makes a lot of sense

    Yea, that's true. Left 4 Dead is really more of a 28 Days Later game then a real zombie game. I don't have any problem with 28 Days Later's infected being killed by torso shots.

    Just sorta illustrates that there aren't really any true zombie games, with the kind of scenario portrayed in TWD.

    Delta Assault on
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    also

    in the first Dead Rising, Frank West is infected with the virus and just takes longer to turn, but he will eventually

    the last chunk of the game involves getting the ingredients together for a cure

    in Dead Rising 2, there's a drug called Zombrex that can help fight off the zombie infection if you take it every 12 hours. it doesn't work on people who've already turned, but people who are infected but haven't turned (like the main character's daughter), it staves off the zombie disease

    so

    Pony on
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    you could make a zombie video game where 1 bite=death, but then you have to make it so that every time a zombie grabs you, you have like, a stamina bar that gets used up as you fight them off and avoid the bite

    multiple zombies grabbing you at once would deplete the bar at a far accelerated rate

    when the bar empties out, you get bit and are now proper fucked

    this is a thing a game could do, if it so chose

    Pony on
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    Delta AssaultDelta Assault Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Pony wrote: »
    you could make a zombie video game where 1 bite=death, but then you have to make it so that every time a zombie grabs you, you have like, a stamina bar that gets used up as you fight them off and avoid the bite

    multiple zombies grabbing you at once would deplete the bar at a far accelerated rate

    when the bar empties out, you get bit and are now proper fucked

    this is a thing a game could do, if it so chose

    Yea, I'd play that game.

    Delta Assault on
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    Handsome CostanzaHandsome Costanza Ask me about 8bitdo RIP Iwata-sanRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Encore presentation starting now.

    Handsome Costanza on
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    ArthilArthil Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Second Encore Presentation starting now, you mean.

    Arthil on
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    override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    One thing I've never got, why doesn't anybody just wear a nice suit of chainmail?

    If a shark can't bite through it, a zombie cant

    override367 on
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    Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    This was fantastic. They pretty much got every single thing right (minus the lack of black and white. Or should I be saying "minus the addition of color"?).

    My mother was brushing aside a couple of tears during the more personal (and very well-acted) moments, and I had to seriously bite my tongue to not spoil for her how things will be getting far, far worse.

    New favorite show this year. Hate that there's only six episodes this season.

    Professor Snugglesworth on
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    jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    One thing I've never got, why doesn't anybody just wear a nice suit of chainmail?

    If a shark can't bite through it, a zombie cant

    I'd imagine a group of zombies would just pull you apart like a piece of chicken.

    jkylefulton on
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    Handsome CostanzaHandsome Costanza Ask me about 8bitdo RIP Iwata-sanRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Arthil wrote: »
    Second Encore Presentation starting now, you mean.

    Shh people who haven't seen it yet don't know that.

    Handsome Costanza on
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    Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    One thing I've never got, why doesn't anybody just wear a nice suit of chainmail?

    If a shark can't bite through it, a zombie cant

    I'd imagine a group of zombies would just pull you apart like a piece of chicken.

    Case in point, this episode:
    the horse :(

    Also that was some seriously great makeup regarding the
    half-zombie

    Honestly one of the creepiest zombies I've seen in anything.

    Professor Snugglesworth on
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    Mr.SunshineMr.Sunshine Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    One thing I've never got, why doesn't anybody just wear a nice suit of chainmail?

    If a shark can't bite through it, a zombie cant

    Zombies also like to pull things apart. It'll be like wearing chainmail in a pool of crocs, they can't bite through either, but they'll roll your ass till something rips off.

    Mr.Sunshine on
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    One thing I've never got, why doesn't anybody just wear a nice suit of chainmail?

    If a shark can't bite through it, a zombie cant

    couple things

    1. a full suit of chainmail heavy enough to avoid zombie biting is also heavy as shit to wear and unless you're a real athletic sort you will sweat like fuck and tire quickly

    2. you would need nothing less than a full suit, because if any part of your body was uncovered, that's where they are going to go

    3. a full suit of chainmail inevitably has uncovered spots, inevitably around the joints and such where you actually need to be able to move

    4. you need something to put a chainmail suit together. traditionally, leather straps/belts are used, but regardless of what you use unless it's a series of solid steel clasps or something (massively increasing the already heavy weight) a horde of zombies that knocked your ass to the ground will tear that shit off you.

    5. chainmail will not protect you from blunt force trauma or any other injury you sustain in the course of a zombie attack, and will impair your mobility (which is your greatest asset against a zombie)

    6. it will significantly slow down your movement speed, for all the reasons mentioned above. considering the most useful thing against slow-moving shambling zombies is to stay away from them, this is a pretty huge sacrifice for not a lot of real benefit.

    Pony on
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    Mr.SunshineMr.Sunshine Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I would wear metal gauntlets and glove though. One glove, the other hand is for shooting. For zombie punching and if zombie wanted something to bite I'll instinctively block with my metal covered forearm.

    Mr.Sunshine on
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    Delta AssaultDelta Assault Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Instead of chainmail, a leather jacket seems like a good idea. Maybe the sort of full body leather outfits that motorcycle racers wear? Unless a zombie's bite is significantly stronger then a normal human's, it's not gonna get through that.

    Delta Assault on
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