Having finished The Magister Trilogy, I have finally picked up Shadow & Claw, the first half of the Book of the New Sun. Hopefully it lives up to the hype.
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JacobyOHHHHH IT’S A SNAKECreature - SnakeRegistered Userregular
Finished City at the End of Time by Greg Bear recently.
Still not sure I understand any of what happened, but that's time travel + alternate timeline shenanigans for you.
Gene Wolfe gives me the same "ugh, I don't come from the same universe you do" vibes as Graham Greene and CS Lewis. Not sure why.
What do you mean?
There's always this...inhuman quality to the internal lives of the characters. I can't quite describe it.
His characters never stop thinking things through. They're rarely all that intuitive or given to making snap judgements. Sometimes they're dumb or dishonest, but they're rational in a way most people aren't.
I suspect the inside of Gene Wolfe's head is a strange and busy place.
Speaking of Joe Hill graphic novels, does anyone know when the final Locke & Key volume is meant to come out? Volume 4 was about to be released when I started reading them and was followed by 5 in fairly quick succession but I can't even find a future listing for 6 on amazon.
I would guess late summer, if there are no delays
there are supposed to be 7 issues in this last arc, and issue 3 comes out in Feb
I'm reading The Fall of Hyperion because Dan Simmons has never disappointed me and Hyperion is one of those series I always meant to get around to reading. Great stuff, but having read Ilium and Olympos first I have to say that it feels like he was ripping himself off when he wrote those. Just a bit. A lot of parallels in his world-building, characters, and themes. But I think this is better, because Olympos in particular turned into a surreal clusterfuck.
Ordering up the Endymion books for when this is done. After that, I feel like i want to read some good fantasy again. Recommendations? ASOIAF is of course great and I really liked The Black Company books. Something that isn't a series of ten 1000-page tomes would be preferable, but if there's something really epic and good that I've overlooked I'm open to suggestion.
Endymion is not that great. But I guess you gotta try it yourself.
As for fantasy, what are you in the mood for exactly? What style?
Anything well-written
No seriously that's my only criteria. Take it as you will. Hard fantasy is a genre I haven't really read all that much of, besides the two series I mentioned above I've read just about everything by Tolkein and.... well, that's basically it. A Raymond E. Feist book once (gross). Lots of fantastical-but-not-really-fantasy stuff by Mieville.
Part of my desire to read more fantasy is to become more familiar with the genre. I have heard good things about Steven Erikson, but I'd like something a bit shorter to start with before deciding if I'm up for Epic Fantasy.
Erikson's Malazan Book of the Fallen is, indeed, great. In my opinion it's the best fantasy series ever written, but it quite literally IS ten 1000-page tomes. It's also very polarizing. It features an incredibly large cast of characters with no clear individual protagonist. The books sometimes don't go chronologically (ie, books 2 and 3 take place at the same time on different parts of the continent with different casts of characters). It's very very much High fantasy, with tons of sorcery, meddling gods, and ancient powers, which I know is a turn off to people who like/expect magic to be some mysterious rarely seen force. So there are absolutely legitimate reasons why someone might be turned off. Also the first book, Gardens of the Moon, is arguably the worst book in the series, which serves as a high barrier of entry. There is also a very different and complex set of rules how magic and godhood work, and they're never explicitly explained to you: Erikson gives you the benefit of the doubt of being smart enough to figure out how things work through context. I know of people who were confused by this and didn't like it.
If none of that turns you off, it's a huge sweeping epic story over 10 books. It has some of the most memorable characters and fantastically written dialogue of any fantasy in my opinion. Each character has a unique voice rather than just talking like everyone else with the occasional accent thrown in (characters like Kruppe and Tehol come to mind). No character is safe, but neither are characters disposed of nonsensically the way they are in ASoIaF. Erikson is a stickler for detail, so everything has meaning, and every character has a reason for doing what they do, which means a refreshing lack of deus ex machina cop outs (although there probably are some). It also has one of the most original settings I've had the pleasure of reading in Fantasy. There are no goblins, dwarves, trolls, etc. I'd recommend reading the first book, you'll probably decide pretty quickly if it's something you feel like sticking with. Most people I know either can't finish the first book, or devour the whole series in a marathon. Another plus side is the series is completed at 10 books, so there's no waiting for a new volume.
An alternative selection might be Memory Sorrow and Thorn by Tad Williams. It's a fun, easy to read series. It's kind of like The hobbit meets ASoIaF. In fact, I'm convinced GRR Martin lifted the setting right out of Memory Sorrow and Thorn for his series (ASoIaF started right when MS&T ended, both involve a large empire which goes into civil war because of the death of a high-king, there's a great wall in the north that keeps out some long lost race of evil creatures, there's even a great big strong simpleton character, etc.). MS&T is much more simpler though. Fewer characters, a clear protagonist, and it's more of an adventure, rather than a military or political fantasy novel. I believe it was written as a tribute 'throwback' book to earlier fantasy series like the Hobbit. I read it when I was much younger, and again recently this last year. I still liked it but recognized it wasn't as good as I remembered it.
The Long Price Quartet's already been mentioned. It's pretty good, but I would summarize it as this: Nothing really happens, but it's still entertaining to read. It's more character driven rather than event driven.
i should really get around to the last book in the Malazan series at some point
I'll admit I started to get a little turned off the 8th and 9th book by him constantly spinning off new plotlines that I didn't care about while neglecting characters that had been around forever.
Gene Wolfe gives me the same "ugh, I don't come from the same universe you do" vibes as Graham Greene and CS Lewis. Not sure why.
What do you mean?
There's always this...inhuman quality to the internal lives of the characters. I can't quite describe it.
His characters never stop thinking things through. They're rarely all that intuitive or given to making snap judgements. Sometimes they're dumb or dishonest, but they're rational in a way most people aren't.
I suspect the inside of Gene Wolfe's head is a strange and busy place.
That's unusual? Oh dear, that's what I'm like all the time.
I'm reading The Fall of Hyperion because Dan Simmons has never disappointed me and Hyperion is one of those series I always meant to get around to reading. Great stuff, but having read Ilium and Olympos first I have to say that it feels like he was ripping himself off when he wrote those. Just a bit. A lot of parallels in his world-building, characters, and themes. But I think this is better, because Olympos in particular turned into a surreal clusterfuck.
Ordering up the Endymion books for when this is done. After that, I feel like i want to read some good fantasy again. Recommendations? ASOIAF is of course great and I really liked The Black Company books. Something that isn't a series of ten 1000-page tomes would be preferable, but if there's something really epic and good that I've overlooked I'm open to suggestion.
Endymion is not that great. But I guess you gotta try it yourself.
As for fantasy, what are you in the mood for exactly? What style?
Anything well-written
No seriously that's my only criteria. Take it as you will. Hard fantasy is a genre I haven't really read all that much of, besides the two series I mentioned above I've read just about everything by Tolkein and.... well, that's basically it. A Raymond E. Feist book once (gross). Lots of fantastical-but-not-really-fantasy stuff by Mieville.
Part of my desire to read more fantasy is to become more familiar with the genre. I have heard good things about Steven Erikson, but I'd like something a bit shorter to start with before deciding if I'm up for Epic Fantasy.
Erikson's Malazan Book of the Fallen is, indeed, great. In my opinion it's the best fantasy series ever written, but it quite literally IS ten 1000-page tomes. It's also very polarizing. It features an incredibly large cast of characters with no clear individual protagonist. The books sometimes don't go chronologically (ie, books 2 and 3 take place at the same time on different parts of the continent with different casts of characters). It's very very much High fantasy, with tons of sorcery, meddling gods, and ancient powers, which I know is a turn off to people who like/expect magic to be some mysterious rarely seen force. So there are absolutely legitimate reasons why someone might be turned off. Also the first book, Gardens of the Moon, is arguably the worst book in the series, which serves as a high barrier of entry. There is also a very different and complex set of rules how magic and godhood work, and they're never explicitly explained to you: Erikson gives you the benefit of the doubt of being smart enough to figure out how things work through context. I know of people who were confused by this and didn't like it.
If none of that turns you off, it's a huge sweeping epic story over 10 books. It has some of the most memorable characters and fantastically written dialogue of any fantasy in my opinion. Each character has a unique voice rather than just talking like everyone else with the occasional accent thrown in (characters like Kruppe and Tehol come to mind). No character is safe, but neither are characters disposed of nonsensically the way they are in ASoIaF. Erikson is a stickler for detail, so everything has meaning, and every character has a reason for doing what they do, which means a refreshing lack of deus ex machina cop outs (although there probably are some). It also has one of the most original settings I've had the pleasure of reading in Fantasy. There are no goblins, dwarves, trolls, etc. I'd recommend reading the first book, you'll probably decide pretty quickly if it's something you feel like sticking with. Most people I know either can't finish the first book, or devour the whole series in a marathon. Another plus side is the series is completed at 10 books, so there's no waiting for a new volume.
I'm really chuckling at this. Erikson has some strong points, but "stickler for details" is not one of them. Any sort of timeline or the like for the series is a fucking mess. Shit just doesn't line up from book to book frequently.
His prose is on average decent, veering between good and purple frequently. There's some highlights in the characters, but frequently they all have the same "common soldier that is actually a deep philosopher" schtick. Plots are full of shit kinda ... just happening.
That said, it is suitably epic with a capital EPIC, the world can be interesting (as long as you ignore that he loves slapping extra zeros on to everything) and has some good points. Gets steadily worse as the series goes along though. Especially Toll the Hounds (worst book I've read in years) Worth a try to see if it's your thing.
An alternative selection might be Memory Sorrow and Thorn by Tad Williams. It's a fun, easy to read series. It's kind of like The hobbit meets ASoIaF. In fact, I'm convinced GRR Martin lifted the setting right out of Memory Sorrow and Thorn for his series (ASoIaF started right when MS&T ended, both involve a large empire which goes into civil war because of the death of a high-king, there's a great wall in the north that keeps out some long lost race of evil creatures, there's even a great big strong simpleton character, etc.). MS&T is much more simpler though. Fewer characters, a clear protagonist, and it's more of an adventure, rather than a military or political fantasy novel. I believe it was written as a tribute 'throwback' book to earlier fantasy series like the Hobbit. I read it when I was much younger, and again recently this last year. I still liked it but recognized it wasn't as good as I remembered it.
MS&T has alot of good points, but it's also slow as slow can be.
The Long Price Quartet's already been mentioned. It's pretty good, but I would summarize it as this: Nothing really happens, but it's still entertaining to read. It's more character driven rather than event driven.
Nothing really happens? Bullshit.
The 3rd and 4th book alone have more "stuff really happening" then many books.
An alternative selection might be Memory Sorrow and Thorn by Tad Williams. It's a fun, easy to read series. It's kind of like The hobbit meets ASoIaF. In fact, I'm convinced GRR Martin lifted the setting right out of Memory Sorrow and Thorn for his series (ASoIaF started right when MS&T ended, both involve a large empire which goes into civil war because of the death of a high-king, there's a great wall in the north that keeps out some long lost race of evil creatures, there's even a great big strong simpleton character, etc.). MS&T is much more simpler though. Fewer characters, a clear protagonist, and it's more of an adventure, rather than a military or political fantasy novel. I believe it was written as a tribute 'throwback' book to earlier fantasy series like the Hobbit. I read it when I was much younger, and again recently this last year. I still liked it but recognized it wasn't as good as I remembered it.
GRRM has said straight up that Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn was a big inspiration for him deciding that there were indeed interesting stories to tell in a fantasy setting and starting asoiaf.
And then if you want to get really meta, Tad Williams' Shadowmarch trilogy is pretty much Williams doing a jazz riff on his previous trilogy, taking some more ideas from asoiaf.
Shadowmarch is actually sort of interesting, it's basically got all the same archetypal characters in the same starting positions in a very similar ancient castle that used to be owned by elves as MS&T, but then they go in very different directions. It's pretty amusing.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
An alternative selection might be Memory Sorrow and Thorn by Tad Williams. It's a fun, easy to read series. It's kind of like The hobbit meets ASoIaF. In fact, I'm convinced GRR Martin lifted the setting right out of Memory Sorrow and Thorn for his series (ASoIaF started right when MS&T ended, both involve a large empire which goes into civil war because of the death of a high-king, there's a great wall in the north that keeps out some long lost race of evil creatures, there's even a great big strong simpleton character, etc.). MS&T is much more simpler though. Fewer characters, a clear protagonist, and it's more of an adventure, rather than a military or political fantasy novel. I believe it was written as a tribute 'throwback' book to earlier fantasy series like the Hobbit. I read it when I was much younger, and again recently this last year. I still liked it but recognized it wasn't as good as I remembered it.
GRRM has said straight up that Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn was a big inspiration for him deciding that there were indeed interesting stories to tell in a fantasy setting and starting asoiaf.
And then if you want to get really meta, Tad Williams' Shadowmarch trilogy is pretty much Williams doing a jazz riff on his previous trilogy, taking some more ideas from asoiaf.
Shadowmarch is actually sort of interesting, it's basically got all the same archetypal characters in the same starting positions in a very similar ancient castle that used to be owned by elves as MS&T, but then they go in very different directions. It's pretty amusing.
I haven't read Shadowmarch, maybe I'll take a look at it. My backlog right now is too long as it is, but that's kind of a good thing.
I have a hard time judging what's a "slow" book unless I get bored, because I read stupid fast. But I don't remember MS&T feeling slow at all, except for parts of book 2 which just scream, "gotta move X to Y before Z plot gets going!"
Which actually Shadowmarch is pretty bad at too, but he's a bit more deconstructionist about it all and it's fun anyway.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
Finally started A Storm of Swords. Also reading Sepinwall's The Revolution was Televised on the side.
I'm planning on buying the eBook of this eventually, I just have been waiting until I got through a bit of my backlog (so great feeling behind in every aspect of life.) I read the entire first chapters upto the Soprano's from the preview, and listened to quite a few of his interviews.. So, let me know what you think.
Still haven't cracked Under Heaven, so I might switch to something non-fiction or just take a break from serious reading for a while.
Finished the first book of the New Sun series. I enjoyed it quite a lot, though I'm certain I'm not catching everything on this read through. Thankfully it came packaged together with the second book in the ebook version, so I don't have to wait to read more.
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
I have finished A Memory of Light, and with it the Wheel of Time Series.
I'm going to go curl up in a corner somewhere and mull this over. I'm feeling. Odd
Finished the first book of the New Sun series. I enjoyed it quite a lot, though I'm certain I'm not catching everything on this read through. Thankfully it came packaged together with the second book in the ebook version, so I don't have to wait to read more.
Wait, did someone say Erickson *doesn't* rely on deus ex machina? Because while I've only gotten through two and a half of the books, that seems like pretty much his favorite thing to do. Gods and godlike beings showing up, or characters turning out to have previously hidden/unmentioned superpowers that save the day is incredibly common. That's not a knock against the series, I like what I've read of it so far, and the constant one-upping of powerful characters is pretty entertaining.
Also, I too finished A Memory of Light last night. I'm not sure what to do now.
Wait, did someone say Erickson *doesn't* rely on deus ex machina? Because while I've only gotten through two and a half of the books, that seems like pretty much his favorite thing to do. Gods and godlike beings showing up, or characters turning out to have previously hidden/unmentioned superpowers that save the day is incredibly common. That's not a knock against the series, I like what I've read of it so far, and the constant one-upping of powerful characters is pretty entertaining.
Also, I too finished A Memory of Light last night. I'm not sure what to do now.
All I was trying to say is that the roof will never cave in on top of the monster to save the main character. Or the cavalry won't arrive just in time when the knife is about to fall. I did mention this does happen occasionally, but for the most part he explains why characters are where they are and why they're doing what they're doing. Even if they're side characters with minor roles, he'll follow their story long enough to set up why they'd be in the position to affect the outcome of a situation. So the Machina part might be there, but not the Deus part (or maybe the other way around). If a main character is surrounded by an enemy, or in a fight he can't win, he's probably going to die.
Wait, did someone say Erickson *doesn't* rely on deus ex machina? Because while I've only gotten through two and a half of the books, that seems like pretty much his favorite thing to do. Gods and godlike beings showing up, or characters turning out to have previously hidden/unmentioned superpowers that save the day is incredibly common. That's not a knock against the series, I like what I've read of it so far, and the constant one-upping of powerful characters is pretty entertaining.
Also, I too finished A Memory of Light last night. I'm not sure what to do now.
All I was trying to say is that the roof will never cave in on top of the monster to save the main character. Or the cavalry won't arrive just in time when the knife is about to fall. I did mention this does happen occasionally, but for the most part he explains why characters are where they are and why they're doing what they're doing. Even if they're side characters with minor roles, he'll follow their story long enough to set up why they'd be in the position to affect the outcome of a situation. So the Machina part might be there, but not the Deus part (or maybe the other way around). If a main character is surrounded by an enemy, or in a fight he can't win, he's probably going to die.
But people become gods at the drop of a hat when its necessary. The level of power creep is pretty absurd. i like the series but preplanned and thought out it ain't
Having finished The Cassandra Project, I'm not sure that I can recommend it to anyone as sci-fi. It's an okay...I suppose the word is 'thriller'? The sort of thing Dan Brown writes, only without the ticking clock. I think it's the only mystery plot I've read where there are literally no consequences for failure on the part of the protagonists. There's a mystery, but if they fail to riddle out the truth the fallout is that nobody knows what happened; which, in the context of the story, has been the case for some 50 years already.
There's very little in the way of sci-fi in there outside of everyone using Skype through their TVs, which barely counts as sci-fi since I think you can buy a Samsung that does that already. A dude goes to the moon but the entire trip lasts for about a chapter and a half.
Honestly, I think I'd have been okay with the whole thing -- lack of tension and super-near-future setting and all -- if the ending had been good, but it wasn't.
Plot/Ending spoilers:
So the premise is that some publicly released NASA data indicates that someone landed on the moon prior to Apollo XI but that it was covered up for unknown reasons. Eventually it turns out that two missions landed on the back-side of the moon during the Apollo pre-landing test missions. The whole thing happened and was subsequently covered up because they found a dome of alien construction containing a tablet with a message indicating that the aliens, somewhere between 500 BC and 70AD, had attempted contact with us only to have their ambassador killed. Nixon thought it would incite riots by people thinking that the alien was Jesus, so had a fake tablet made up with an anti-war, anti-technology message but decided against using it and, instead, just buried the whole thing.
So fast forward to 2019 when a private industrialist goes to the moon immediately in the wake of the whole 'possible hidden moon landing' thing making headlines. He finds the old landing stages and parts of the dome. The sitting president arranges for him to find the fake tablet in an archive of stuff from the Apollo missions, but he figures out that it's a fake and confronts said president. The prez fesses up and shows him the real deal, along with Nixon's message, and the industrialist dude decides that the best course of action is to hoax the world with the fake tablet.
The whole ending was just so weird and bullshit that I felt like they'd written the book up to that point with no clear idea what the big secret was and, in the final chapter or so, decided that they really ought to come up with something that Nixon and the Russians would have wanted to hide. The heavy-handed, "belief in religion is too important to challenge with proof of fucking aliens" message didn't help it any. An a-political athiest decides to perpetuate a coverup that he spent a billion dollars and subjected himself to public ridicule to destroy on the basis that "oh no, people might think Jesus was an alien"? Seriously?
So finished the First Law trilogy. The first book was really slow to get going, the plot seemed non-existent and the different settings felt very disjointed. Given that the first book is really more of a setting/character introduction, it works for what it is, but clearly wouldn't work stand-alone. I even wrestled briefly on continuing with the series, I was so ambivalent about the story at the end of book one. My opinion on books two and three couldn't be further removed from book one. What a great story, amazing characters, some nice twists - definitely worth a read.
Spoilery trilogy musings (including ending):
I had some trepidation about the ending, as I'd read a few very vague comments about "that ending" and I got the impression I would be dissatisfied in a Stephenson kind of way, but I thought the books wrapped up nicely, you got a good sense of where things stood while leaving some avenues open for further exploration in later books. I also like that the third book ended pretty much the same way the first book began, with Logan taking a high dive into a river. Nice symmetry. I really enjoyed the ruthlessness of all the characters, where there wasn't really a good or innocent person in the bunch. Sand dan Glokta has got to be my new favorite character in any book I've read in the last decade. So many facets to him and he gets to play the ultimate bad guy and still get a sympathetic read, it's wonderfully dirty.
Finished Book of the New Sun, I loved the ending even if it confused the hell out of me just like the first three books. Have just started in on Dune, and I cant believe I have made it this far in my reading career without this book. I crushed book one in the first two days and had to put it down so I can savor it a bit.
So finished the First Law trilogy. The first book was really slow to get going, the plot seemed non-existent and the different settings felt very disjointed. Given that the first book is really more of a setting/character introduction, it works for what it is, but clearly wouldn't work stand-alone. I even wrestled briefly on continuing with the series, I was so ambivalent about the story at the end of book one. My opinion on books two and three couldn't be further removed from book one. What a great story, amazing characters, some nice twists - definitely worth a read.
Spoilery trilogy musings (including ending):
I had some trepidation about the ending, as I'd read a few very vague comments about "that ending" and I got the impression I would be dissatisfied in a Stephenson kind of way, but I thought the books wrapped up nicely, you got a good sense of where things stood while leaving some avenues open for further exploration in later books. I also like that the third book ended pretty much the same way the first book began, with Logan taking a high dive into a river. Nice symmetry. I really enjoyed the ruthlessness of all the characters, where there wasn't really a good or innocent person in the bunch. Sand dan Glokta has got to be my new favorite character in any book I've read in the last decade. So many facets to him and he gets to play the ultimate bad guy and still get a sympathetic read, it's wonderfully dirty.
The best part is the stand-alone sequels are far, far better than the trilogy.
'She crouched on the floor like a wounded thing, and Dorian Gray, with his beautiful eyes, looked down at her, and his chiselled lips curled in exquisite disdain. There is always something ridiculous about the emotions of people whom one has ceased to love. Sibyl Vane seemed to him to be absurdly melodramatic. Her tears and sobs annoyed him.
“I am going,” he said at last in his calm clear voice. “I don’t wish to be unkind, but I can’t see you again. You have disappointed me.”
She wept silently, and made no answer, but crept nearer. Her little hands stretched blindly out, and appeared to be seeking for him. He turned on his heel and left the room. In a few moments he was out of the theatre.'
So finished the First Law trilogy. The first book was really slow to get going, the plot seemed non-existent and the different settings felt very disjointed. Given that the first book is really more of a setting/character introduction, it works for what it is, but clearly wouldn't work stand-alone. I even wrestled briefly on continuing with the series, I was so ambivalent about the story at the end of book one. My opinion on books two and three couldn't be further removed from book one. What a great story, amazing characters, some nice twists - definitely worth a read.
Spoilery trilogy musings (including ending):
I had some trepidation about the ending, as I'd read a few very vague comments about "that ending" and I got the impression I would be dissatisfied in a Stephenson kind of way, but I thought the books wrapped up nicely, you got a good sense of where things stood while leaving some avenues open for further exploration in later books. I also like that the third book ended pretty much the same way the first book began, with Logan taking a high dive into a river. Nice symmetry. I really enjoyed the ruthlessness of all the characters, where there wasn't really a good or innocent person in the bunch. Sand dan Glokta has got to be my new favorite character in any book I've read in the last decade. So many facets to him and he gets to play the ultimate bad guy and still get a sympathetic read, it's wonderfully dirty.
Abercrombie visibly improves as an author as the series progesses. This definitely carries through the standalone sequels; Best Served Cold, The Heroes and Red Country are progressively more entertaining and better written. Best Served Cold is a tragically hilarious farce, The Heroes is a brilliantly written bitter melodrama, and Red Country is probably the best "fantasy western" I have ever read. Even if the trilogy was bad (which it isn't, it's only flawed) it would be worth reading to set the stage for the 3 sequels.
Finished Book of the New Sun, I loved the ending even if it confused the hell out of me just like the first three books. Have just started in on Dune, and I cant believe I have made it this far in my reading career without this book. I crushed book one in the first two days and had to put it down so I can savor it a bit.
In a few months, come back to New Sun and read it again. You'll be more familiar with the vocabulary, and in a better place to savour Wolfe's richly erudite prose and the sheer lushness of his vision. Then read it again in another year or so, and you'll start picking up on the things you missed the first couple of times. Then again in a year or two, you'll realise that there are still many layers of this glorious palimpset yet to be revealed. And that Severian is kind of an asshole. And a liar.
Just finished Angelmaker by Nick Harkaway. It was mostly good, and great in spots, but didn't live up to The Gone Away World. While I would say the writing is overall better - especially the dialogue, which is often hilarious - the story just didn't have quite the same impact on me as his first book did. The main character was interesting, but for some reason I never really cared about him and there weren't very many surprises along the way. Still really looking forward to whatever he writes next though. Maybe it's just because he is British and has a bit of an offbeat and whimsical writing style, but I get a pretty strong Douglas Adams vibe from him.
Also almost done the seventh book in the Wool series. I've never read anything as fast as I read these. Amazing story telling that is very simply written and easy to read.
I have no idea what to read next though. What's some good fantasy that isn't a long series and has maybe a bit less gore and torture than the First Law trilogy? The Name of the Wind and Lies of Locke Lamora look kind of interesting.
Just finished Angelmaker by Nick Harkaway. It was mostly good, and great in spots, but didn't live up to The Gone Away World. While I would say the writing is overall better - especially the dialogue, which is often hilarious - the story just didn't have quite the same impact on me as his first book did. The main character was interesting, but for some reason I never really cared about him and there weren't very many surprises along the way. Still really looking forward to whatever he writes next though. Maybe it's just because he is British and has a bit of an offbeat and whimsical writing style, but I get a pretty strong Douglas Adams vibe from him.
Also almost done the seventh book in the Wool series. I've never read anything as fast as I read these. Amazing story telling that is very simply written and easy to read.
I have no idea what to read next though. What's some good fantasy that isn't a long series and has maybe a bit less gore and torture than the First Law trilogy? The Name of the Wind and Lies of Locke Lamora look kind of interesting.
Either of those are excellent choices, though I'd lean toward the heisty, Hustle-esque vibe of Lamora, personally.
I have no idea what to read next though. What's some good fantasy that isn't a long series and has maybe a bit less gore and torture than the First Law trilogy? The Name of the Wind and Lies of Locke Lamora look kind of interesting.
'She crouched on the floor like a wounded thing, and Dorian Gray, with his beautiful eyes, looked down at her, and his chiselled lips curled in exquisite disdain. There is always something ridiculous about the emotions of people whom one has ceased to love. Sibyl Vane seemed to him to be absurdly melodramatic. Her tears and sobs annoyed him.
“I am going,” he said at last in his calm clear voice. “I don’t wish to be unkind, but I can’t see you again. You have disappointed me.”
She wept silently, and made no answer, but crept nearer. Her little hands stretched blindly out, and appeared to be seeking for him. He turned on his heel and left the room. In a few moments he was out of the theatre.'
I have always loved Dorian Gray. It's really a fascinating premise and a masterly look at how this character responds to the situation he's in. Wilde was such a talented crafter of characters.
I didn't realize those other Abercrombie books were sequels...so I should read through all the First Law books prior, yes?
I'd say yes.
They aren't specifically sequels, but they do take place chronological afterwords and have characters from the previously written books in them. The books are written to not spoil the trilogy as much as possible, but it still spoils some stuff.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
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as fast and as hungrily as my eyes will allow me to do so.
nom nom nom.
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Still not sure I understand any of what happened, but that's time travel + alternate timeline shenanigans for you.
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There's always this...inhuman quality to the internal lives of the characters. I can't quite describe it.
His characters never stop thinking things through. They're rarely all that intuitive or given to making snap judgements. Sometimes they're dumb or dishonest, but they're rational in a way most people aren't.
I suspect the inside of Gene Wolfe's head is a strange and busy place.
yesssssssssssss
I would guess late summer, if there are no delays
there are supposed to be 7 issues in this last arc, and issue 3 comes out in Feb
Erikson's Malazan Book of the Fallen is, indeed, great. In my opinion it's the best fantasy series ever written, but it quite literally IS ten 1000-page tomes. It's also very polarizing. It features an incredibly large cast of characters with no clear individual protagonist. The books sometimes don't go chronologically (ie, books 2 and 3 take place at the same time on different parts of the continent with different casts of characters). It's very very much High fantasy, with tons of sorcery, meddling gods, and ancient powers, which I know is a turn off to people who like/expect magic to be some mysterious rarely seen force. So there are absolutely legitimate reasons why someone might be turned off. Also the first book, Gardens of the Moon, is arguably the worst book in the series, which serves as a high barrier of entry. There is also a very different and complex set of rules how magic and godhood work, and they're never explicitly explained to you: Erikson gives you the benefit of the doubt of being smart enough to figure out how things work through context. I know of people who were confused by this and didn't like it.
If none of that turns you off, it's a huge sweeping epic story over 10 books. It has some of the most memorable characters and fantastically written dialogue of any fantasy in my opinion. Each character has a unique voice rather than just talking like everyone else with the occasional accent thrown in (characters like Kruppe and Tehol come to mind). No character is safe, but neither are characters disposed of nonsensically the way they are in ASoIaF. Erikson is a stickler for detail, so everything has meaning, and every character has a reason for doing what they do, which means a refreshing lack of deus ex machina cop outs (although there probably are some). It also has one of the most original settings I've had the pleasure of reading in Fantasy. There are no goblins, dwarves, trolls, etc. I'd recommend reading the first book, you'll probably decide pretty quickly if it's something you feel like sticking with. Most people I know either can't finish the first book, or devour the whole series in a marathon. Another plus side is the series is completed at 10 books, so there's no waiting for a new volume.
An alternative selection might be Memory Sorrow and Thorn by Tad Williams. It's a fun, easy to read series. It's kind of like The hobbit meets ASoIaF. In fact, I'm convinced GRR Martin lifted the setting right out of Memory Sorrow and Thorn for his series (ASoIaF started right when MS&T ended, both involve a large empire which goes into civil war because of the death of a high-king, there's a great wall in the north that keeps out some long lost race of evil creatures, there's even a great big strong simpleton character, etc.). MS&T is much more simpler though. Fewer characters, a clear protagonist, and it's more of an adventure, rather than a military or political fantasy novel. I believe it was written as a tribute 'throwback' book to earlier fantasy series like the Hobbit. I read it when I was much younger, and again recently this last year. I still liked it but recognized it wasn't as good as I remembered it.
The Long Price Quartet's already been mentioned. It's pretty good, but I would summarize it as this: Nothing really happens, but it's still entertaining to read. It's more character driven rather than event driven.
Just my opinions of course! YMMV
I'll admit I started to get a little turned off the 8th and 9th book by him constantly spinning off new plotlines that I didn't care about while neglecting characters that had been around forever.
That's unusual? Oh dear, that's what I'm like all the time.
I feel sorry for my wife now.
I'm really chuckling at this. Erikson has some strong points, but "stickler for details" is not one of them. Any sort of timeline or the like for the series is a fucking mess. Shit just doesn't line up from book to book frequently.
His prose is on average decent, veering between good and purple frequently. There's some highlights in the characters, but frequently they all have the same "common soldier that is actually a deep philosopher" schtick. Plots are full of shit kinda ... just happening.
That said, it is suitably epic with a capital EPIC, the world can be interesting (as long as you ignore that he loves slapping extra zeros on to everything) and has some good points. Gets steadily worse as the series goes along though. Especially Toll the Hounds (worst book I've read in years) Worth a try to see if it's your thing.
MS&T has alot of good points, but it's also slow as slow can be.
Nothing really happens? Bullshit.
The 3rd and 4th book alone have more "stuff really happening" then many books.
GRRM has said straight up that Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn was a big inspiration for him deciding that there were indeed interesting stories to tell in a fantasy setting and starting asoiaf.
And then if you want to get really meta, Tad Williams' Shadowmarch trilogy is pretty much Williams doing a jazz riff on his previous trilogy, taking some more ideas from asoiaf.
Shadowmarch is actually sort of interesting, it's basically got all the same archetypal characters in the same starting positions in a very similar ancient castle that used to be owned by elves as MS&T, but then they go in very different directions. It's pretty amusing.
I disagree with almost everything you said. And that's ok with me.
I haven't read Shadowmarch, maybe I'll take a look at it. My backlog right now is too long as it is, but that's kind of a good thing.
Which actually Shadowmarch is pretty bad at too, but he's a bit more deconstructionist about it all and it's fun anyway.
I'm planning on buying the eBook of this eventually, I just have been waiting until I got through a bit of my backlog (so great feeling behind in every aspect of life.) I read the entire first chapters upto the Soprano's from the preview, and listened to quite a few of his interviews.. So, let me know what you think.
Still haven't cracked Under Heaven, so I might switch to something non-fiction or just take a break from serious reading for a while.
I'm going to go curl up in a corner somewhere and mull this over. I'm feeling. Odd
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You didn't, trust me on this.
Also, I too finished A Memory of Light last night. I'm not sure what to do now.
All I was trying to say is that the roof will never cave in on top of the monster to save the main character. Or the cavalry won't arrive just in time when the knife is about to fall. I did mention this does happen occasionally, but for the most part he explains why characters are where they are and why they're doing what they're doing. Even if they're side characters with minor roles, he'll follow their story long enough to set up why they'd be in the position to affect the outcome of a situation. So the Machina part might be there, but not the Deus part (or maybe the other way around). If a main character is surrounded by an enemy, or in a fight he can't win, he's probably going to die.
But people become gods at the drop of a hat when its necessary. The level of power creep is pretty absurd. i like the series but preplanned and thought out it ain't
There's very little in the way of sci-fi in there outside of everyone using Skype through their TVs, which barely counts as sci-fi since I think you can buy a Samsung that does that already. A dude goes to the moon but the entire trip lasts for about a chapter and a half.
Honestly, I think I'd have been okay with the whole thing -- lack of tension and super-near-future setting and all -- if the ending had been good, but it wasn't.
Plot/Ending spoilers:
So fast forward to 2019 when a private industrialist goes to the moon immediately in the wake of the whole 'possible hidden moon landing' thing making headlines. He finds the old landing stages and parts of the dome. The sitting president arranges for him to find the fake tablet in an archive of stuff from the Apollo missions, but he figures out that it's a fake and confronts said president. The prez fesses up and shows him the real deal, along with Nixon's message, and the industrialist dude decides that the best course of action is to hoax the world with the fake tablet.
The whole ending was just so weird and bullshit that I felt like they'd written the book up to that point with no clear idea what the big secret was and, in the final chapter or so, decided that they really ought to come up with something that Nixon and the Russians would have wanted to hide. The heavy-handed, "belief in religion is too important to challenge with proof of fucking aliens" message didn't help it any. An a-political athiest decides to perpetuate a coverup that he spent a billion dollars and subjected himself to public ridicule to destroy on the basis that "oh no, people might think Jesus was an alien"? Seriously?
Blech.
Spoilery trilogy musings (including ending):
The best part is the stand-alone sequels are far, far better than the trilogy.
I like coldness in my characters.
'She crouched on the floor like a wounded thing, and Dorian Gray, with his beautiful eyes, looked down at her, and his chiselled lips curled in exquisite disdain. There is always something ridiculous about the emotions of people whom one has ceased to love. Sibyl Vane seemed to him to be absurdly melodramatic. Her tears and sobs annoyed him.
“I am going,” he said at last in his calm clear voice. “I don’t wish to be unkind, but I can’t see you again. You have disappointed me.”
She wept silently, and made no answer, but crept nearer. Her little hands stretched blindly out, and appeared to be seeking for him. He turned on his heel and left the room. In a few moments he was out of the theatre.'
Abercrombie visibly improves as an author as the series progesses. This definitely carries through the standalone sequels; Best Served Cold, The Heroes and Red Country are progressively more entertaining and better written. Best Served Cold is a tragically hilarious farce, The Heroes is a brilliantly written bitter melodrama, and Red Country is probably the best "fantasy western" I have ever read. Even if the trilogy was bad (which it isn't, it's only flawed) it would be worth reading to set the stage for the 3 sequels.
In a few months, come back to New Sun and read it again. You'll be more familiar with the vocabulary, and in a better place to savour Wolfe's richly erudite prose and the sheer lushness of his vision. Then read it again in another year or so, and you'll start picking up on the things you missed the first couple of times. Then again in a year or two, you'll realise that there are still many layers of this glorious palimpset yet to be revealed. And that Severian is kind of an asshole. And a liar.
Also almost done the seventh book in the Wool series. I've never read anything as fast as I read these. Amazing story telling that is very simply written and easy to read.
I have no idea what to read next though. What's some good fantasy that isn't a long series and has maybe a bit less gore and torture than the First Law trilogy? The Name of the Wind and Lies of Locke Lamora look kind of interesting.
Either of those are excellent choices, though I'd lean toward the heisty, Hustle-esque vibe of Lamora, personally.
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Read this? Then you should!
http://www.amazon.com/Lyonesse-Suldruns-Garden-ebook/dp/B004KZQN20/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1357856903&sr=8-2&keywords=vance+lyonesse
I have always loved Dorian Gray. It's really a fascinating premise and a masterly look at how this character responds to the situation he's in. Wilde was such a talented crafter of characters.
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I'd say yes.
They aren't specifically sequels, but they do take place chronological afterwords and have characters from the previously written books in them. The books are written to not spoil the trilogy as much as possible, but it still spoils some stuff.
His literature videos really make me happy, figured you guys would enjoy it too