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Beating a dead horse: Pregnancy chances?

kj01kj01 Registered User regular
edited February 2007 in Help / Advice Forum
I know this topic has probably been done (no pun intended) millions of times... but I was just curious of the chances of pregnancy when the girl is on a birth control pill and takes it as instructed. My girlfriend and I have recently begun to really begin to start thinking more seriously about it, and she's been on the pill for menstrual reasons. We haven't fully done it... but it's gotten close (proximity-wise... there hasn't been any _real_ penetration). So, again, just curious.

kj01 on
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    RuckusRuckus Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    kj01 wrote: »
    I know this topic has probably been done (no pun intended) millions of times... but I was just curious of the chances of pregnancy when the girl is on a birth control pill and takes it as instructed. My girlfriend and I have recently begun to really begin to start thinking more seriously about it, and she's been on the pill for menstrual reasons. We haven't fully done it... but it's gotten close (proximity-wise... there hasn't been any _real_ penetration). So, again, just curious.

    The pill is something like 98% effective when used properly.

    Condoms are slightly higher. Condoms also protect against other things.

    Use a condom.

    Ruckus on
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    ZeromusZeromus Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Use both.

    Zeromus on
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    DeusfauxDeusfaux Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Condoms are LOWER ruckus, jesus.


    You'd think this kind of information would be gospel by now.


    OP, look up the various birth control methods on wikipedia, they'll list both "perfect use" rates, and "typical use" rates.

    The pill is 99.9% perfect use, and 95% typical use.

    Compare that to 98% and 82-90% respectively for the condom.

    Combination of both would be better than all rates there.

    Deusfaux on
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    SarcastroSarcastro Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Ruckus wrote: »
    kj01 wrote: »
    I know this topic has probably been done (no pun intended) millions of times... but I was just curious of the chances of pregnancy when the girl is on a birth control pill and takes it as instructed. My girlfriend and I have recently begun to really begin to start thinking more seriously about it, and she's been on the pill for menstrual reasons. We haven't fully done it... but it's gotten close (proximity-wise... there hasn't been any _real_ penetration). So, again, just curious.

    The pill is something like 98% effective when used properly.

    Condoms are slightly higher. Condoms also protect against other things.

    Use a condom.

    This is not true. Condoms are substantially less effective than the pill in preventing preganacy. They are more effective in preventing disease transmitted by bodily fluids.

    If you are both disease free, and are certain that the other is monogamous, than the pill, taken exactly as instructed, is the most effective birth control method bar none.

    Sarcastro on
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    AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Birth Control works wonders.

    If you use it as instructed.

    That usually means taking it every single day at the same time every day.

    If you aren't certain she's taking her birth control properly, use a condom.

    AbsoluteZero on
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    TobyToby Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I'm going to go ahead and ask a stupid question; what do the rates actually mean? Does 98% mean you get two babies for every hundred times you have sex? Does it mean for every hundred cycles, two of them will be regular, baby-possible cycles? Or is it per year somehow? If you fall in the two per cent, do you definitely get pregnant, or does it just mean you are at risk?

    Toby on
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    AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Toby wrote: »
    I'm going to go ahead and ask a stupid question; what do the rates actually mean? Does 98% mean you get two babies for every hundred times you have sex? Does it mean for every hundred cycles, two of them will be regular, baby-possible cycles? Or is it per year somehow? If you fall in the two per cent, do you definitely get pregnant, or does it just mean you are at risk?

    It is a statistic. I couldn't tell you the specifics, but typically it means that out of a finite number of test subjects who used the condom properly for (usually) a year, 98% did not experience a pregnancy.

    "The Pill" is typically 99.9% effective.

    AbsoluteZero on
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    DeusfauxDeusfaux Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Toby wrote: »
    I'm going to go ahead and ask a stupid question; what do the rates actually mean? Does 98% mean you get two babies for every hundred times you have sex? Does it mean for every hundred cycles, two of them will be regular, baby-possible cycles? Or is it per year somehow? If you fall in the two per cent, do you definitely get pregnant, or does it just mean you are at risk?


    Out of 100 women per year, how many will experience a pregnancy

    Deusfaux on
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    TobyToby Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Oh thanks, that's way simpler than I thought

    Toby on
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    If you really don't want children, use a condom, too.

    Thanatos on
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    CimmeriiCimmerii SpaceOperaGhost Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I'm just gonna chip in here to reccomend Nuvaring.
    Pills are notoriusly picky, and for best results need to be taken at the same time every day. Which, to me at least, is an inconvenient pain in the ass.
    I also had an allergic reaction to the glue used in the patch (orthoevra), so if she is allergic to much, just be careful. I reccomend Nuvaring because of it's slightly better protection (98 typical use, I believe I'll look up more if you want)

    Also, use a condom.

    Cimmerii on
    *Internally Screaming*
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    SarcastroSarcastro Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Cimmerii wrote: »
    I'm just gonna chip in here to reccomend Nuvaring.

    Oooooo. Good one. I had forgotten about that one, its pretty recent. Its the pill, but way harder to forget and mess it up.

    Sarcastro on
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    GoodOmensGoodOmens Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I'll join on the "use a condom too" bandwagon. The combination of the two means that you will basically never have a baby scare. Trust me, they suck.

    GoodOmens on
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    corcorigancorcorigan Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Thanatos wrote: »
    If you really don't want children, use a condom, too.

    Or don't have sex. You play with fire, expect to get burnt, etc.

    corcorigan on
    Ad Astra Per Aspera
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    Seattle ThreadSeattle Thread Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    She's already on the pill for menstrual reasons. Adding anything else (besides a condom, and even that is a bit excessive) is just overkill.

    Don't listen to corcorigan, pregnancy is not a punishment for premarital intercourse. However, it still is a possibility, so you should have a chat with your girlfriend about what you two will do should she get pregnant. Better to have it cleared up beforehand, even if it never happens, than to scramble when it does.

    Seattle Thread on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2007
    Makershot wrote: »
    She's already on the pill for menstrual reasons. Adding anything else (besides a condom, and even that is a bit excessive) is just overkill.

    Don't listen to corcorigan, pregnancy is not a punishment for premarital intercourse. However, it still is a possibility, so you should have a chat with your girlfriend about what you two will do should she get pregnant. Better to have it cleared up beforehand, even if it never happens, than to scramble when it does.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    corcorigancorcorigan Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Makershot wrote: »
    She's already on the pill for menstrual reasons. Adding anything else (besides a condom, and even that is a bit excessive) is just overkill.

    Don't listen to corcorigan, pregnancy is not a punishment for premarital intercourse. However, it still is a possibility, so you should have a chat with your girlfriend about what you two will do should she get pregnant. Better to have it cleared up beforehand, even if it never happens, than to scramble when it does.

    I never said pregnancy was punishment. I quite enjoy pre-marital sex. Same way I go out drinking. I know that increases the chances of me drunkenly stepping in front of a car or getting beaten up, but it's well worth the risk.

    corcorigan on
    Ad Astra Per Aspera
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2007
    corcorigan wrote: »
    Makershot wrote: »
    She's already on the pill for menstrual reasons. Adding anything else (besides a condom, and even that is a bit excessive) is just overkill.

    Don't listen to corcorigan, pregnancy is not a punishment for premarital intercourse. However, it still is a possibility, so you should have a chat with your girlfriend about what you two will do should she get pregnant. Better to have it cleared up beforehand, even if it never happens, than to scramble when it does.

    I never said pregnancy was punishment. I quite enjoy pre-marital sex. Same way I go out drinking. I know that increases the chances of me drunkenly stepping in front of a car or getting beaten up, but it's well worth the risk.

    Funny you should use that example as I stand roughly twice as much risk of getting hit by a car this year as I do of impregnating a girl who is using the pill properly, assuming I were to find one to have sex with for the duration of the year.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    corcorigancorcorigan Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    corcorigan wrote: »
    Makershot wrote: »
    She's already on the pill for menstrual reasons. Adding anything else (besides a condom, and even that is a bit excessive) is just overkill.

    Don't listen to corcorigan, pregnancy is not a punishment for premarital intercourse. However, it still is a possibility, so you should have a chat with your girlfriend about what you two will do should she get pregnant. Better to have it cleared up beforehand, even if it never happens, than to scramble when it does.

    I never said pregnancy was punishment. I quite enjoy pre-marital sex. Same way I go out drinking. I know that increases the chances of me drunkenly stepping in front of a car or getting beaten up, but it's well worth the risk.

    Funny you should use that example as I stand roughly twice as much risk of getting hit by a car this year as I do of impregnating a girl who is using the pill properly, assuming I were to find one to have sex with for the duration of the year.

    Really? Pill's on the NHS, so it's safer, more fun, and cheaper.

    What a wonderful excuse to stay in. :)

    corcorigan on
    Ad Astra Per Aspera
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    crakecrake Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    This may be a dumb question? Are there different doses of the pill? Like if a girl is taking it for menstrual reasons, would she be having a lower dose of it?

    Something to keep in mind?

    crake on
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    ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2007
    Remember though it is VERY easy to lie with statistics.

    Obs on
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    EtchEtch Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    If you're REALLY concerned, get a vasectomy and then have it reversed when you decide you want kids. From what I hear, it's pretty much safe, and it's not hard to get everything back into working order. I'll probably do that eventually, but for now I stick to condoms....well, not for now because I'm currently not sexing for a while.

    Etch on
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    a penguina penguin Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Vasectomy reversal is not %100.

    Not being able to have children when you decided you want to would be a bad thing.

    a penguin on
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    ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2007
    Not being able to have children when you decide you want to would be the worst thing. People have killed themselves because of it.

    Obs on
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    Kewop DecamKewop Decam Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Obs wrote: »
    Not being able to have children when you decide you want to would be the worst thing. People have killed themselves because of it.

    Really? Never heard of that one.

    The pill is fine, but do you trust her enough to take it correctly? People are very forgetful.

    Kewop Decam on
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Etch wrote: »
    If you're REALLY concerned, get a vasectomy and then have it reversed when you decide you want kids. From what I hear, it's pretty much safe, and it's not hard to get everything back into working order. I'll probably do that eventually, but for now I stick to condoms....well, not for now because I'm currently not sexing for a while.
    This is a terrible idea. Reversal is not 100% (not even close), and it's a pretty serious procedure (unlike the vasectomy itself).

    If you're going to get a vasectomy, have some of your sperm frozen for later use, so you can just do in vitro later.

    Another good idea is to get a prescription for the morning after pill, so that if you do have a condom break or a missed pill or something you can be absolutely sure it's not a problem.

    Thanatos on
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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Thanatos wrote: »
    Etch wrote: »
    If you're REALLY concerned, get a vasectomy and then have it reversed when you decide you want kids. From what I hear, it's pretty much safe, and it's not hard to get everything back into working order. I'll probably do that eventually, but for now I stick to condoms....well, not for now because I'm currently not sexing for a while.
    This is a terrible idea. Reversal is not 100% (not even close), and it's a pretty serious procedure (unlike the vasectomy itself).


    Another point is a recent study linking dementia with vasectomy. That's some seriously bad shit there.

    DevoutlyApathetic on
    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Thanatos wrote: »
    Etch wrote: »
    If you're REALLY concerned, get a vasectomy and then have it reversed when you decide you want kids. From what I hear, it's pretty much safe, and it's not hard to get everything back into working order. I'll probably do that eventually, but for now I stick to condoms....well, not for now because I'm currently not sexing for a while.
    This is a terrible idea. Reversal is not 100% (not even close), and it's a pretty serious procedure (unlike the vasectomy itself).
    Another point is a recent study linking dementia with vasectomy. That's some seriously bad shit there.
    Really? You have a link?

    Thanatos on
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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Thanatos wrote: »
    Really? You have a link?
    Link

    They look like relatively small numbers for a study, but it's disturbing none the less.

    DevoutlyApathetic on
    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    EggyToastEggyToast Jersey CityRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    The problem with statistics for pregnancy is that a) test subjects lie and b) it's impossible to get 100% for human behavior.

    In other words, a condom is technically 100% effective. No sperm passes through it, they're impervious to breakage, and they stay on the penis.

    Does that mean that everyone keeps them well-stored (reduces sturdiness), or doesn't wear 2 at a time (breaks them), or doesn't check it occasionally to see if it's still on, or doesn't slather their penis in lube prior to putting one on? Or that they don't get close, take them off, and then ejaculate on their woman's stomach and miss, hitting their vulva and labia? Or are people never going to use Trojan Breaktacular Truckstop Brand condoms (trojans are the only condoms I've ever heard people have break, and have had one break on me as well)?

    Same with the pill. Does everyone take it within the same time frame every single day?

    There's a lot that people can do that cause these things to be below 100%. It's reasons like that why you hear people recommend 2 different methods, because the likelihood of both failing simultaneously is phenomenally low. However, the problem is that the test for failing birth control results in a baby.

    My wife has no problems with abortion, and readily admits to me that if we were to have a problem with our birth control methods, she would get one. I support the idea. Your girlfriend may not, though, which is why you should talk about things.

    If you're confident in her ability to take birth control regularly and responsibly, you should have no problems. If you're not all that serious about her, and haven't taken blood tests (and you're not both virgins), you should wear a condom anyway, as you could pass something between you (such as HPV).

    Don't stress too much. Be responsible, but have fun. You're going to have more issues with sex if you're stressed out so much about something. If you take precautions and talk about it with your partner, you know you'll both be on the same page, and you'll be able to enjoy the moment that much more.

    EggyToast on
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    EtchEtch Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Thanatos wrote: »
    Etch wrote: »
    If you're REALLY concerned, get a vasectomy and then have it reversed when you decide you want kids. From what I hear, it's pretty much safe, and it's not hard to get everything back into working order. I'll probably do that eventually, but for now I stick to condoms....well, not for now because I'm currently not sexing for a while.
    This is a terrible idea. Reversal is not 100% (not even close), and it's a pretty serious procedure (unlike the vasectomy itself).

    If you're going to get a vasectomy, have some of your sperm frozen for later use, so you can just do in vitro later.

    Another good idea is to get a prescription for the morning after pill, so that if you do have a condom break or a missed pill or something you can be absolutely sure it's not a problem.

    Yeah, I meant to add something about freezing sperm but I think I forgot...

    And you can get a prescription for the morning after? Or did you mean just pick it up from Planned Parenthood or something?

    Etch on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2007
    Obs wrote: »
    Not being able to have children when you decide you want to would be the worst thing. People have killed themselves because of it.

    Really? Never heard of that one.
    Yes, really. For some reason the majority of people seem to think that eventually reproducing is some kind of imperative, something that must be done in order for them to be considered a worthwhile or whole human being by their peers and their community. When someone is in a position where they believe that there is no way for them to avoid irreparable stigma, or worse yet that they're a failure as a person, suicide is one of the popular responses.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    EggyToastEggyToast Jersey CityRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Plan B (the morning after pill) is OTC now, and you should be able to find it in a local pharmacy. It's another example of a "secondary birth control" method. For instance, if you supplement condoms with Plan B, then the process is "condom broke or slipped off, take Plan B."

    It prevents an egg from being released, as it's just essentially a megadose of the same stuff in birth control pills. Therefore it's also safe for those who are ethically opposed to abortion, as despite propaganda it does nothing to abort an embryo.

    EggyToast on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2007
    EggyToast wrote: »
    Plan B (the morning after pill) is OTC now, and you should be able to find it in a local pharmacy. It's another example of a "secondary birth control" method. For instance, if you supplement condoms with Plan B, then the process is "condom broke or slipped off, take Plan B."

    It prevents an egg from being released, as it's just essentially a megadose of the same stuff in birth control pills. Therefore it's also safe for those who are ethically opposed to abortion, as despite propaganda it does nothing to abort an embryo.

    For some people. Not for people who believe that life begins at conception, for them even condom use is equivalent to abortion. Heil Pope Benedict and all that.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    EggyToastEggyToast Jersey CityRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Life begins at conception means either the egg and sperm meet, or that embryo is implanted in the uterine wall, right? As Plan B prevents an egg from being released at all, it would indeed address "life begins at conception," as conception couldn't occur.

    But yes, papal edicts that deign sex without the purpose of reproduction to be a sin would indeed not be covered by Plan B or condoms, but I can't imagine they would be investigating sex at all :D

    EggyToast on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2007
    EggyToast wrote: »
    Life begins at conception means either the egg and sperm meet, or that embryo is implanted in the uterine wall, right?

    According to the people in all the Catholic churches I was forced to attend growing up, "life begins at conception" = "as soon as you do teh sex, you're a parent".

    ViolentChemistry on
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    RuckusRuckus Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    BTW in my post I meant "Use a Condom also." I figured if she's taking Birth Control for regulatory reasons she wouldn't stop...

    Ruckus on
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    kj01kj01 Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    My general cause for curiosity is this: My friend had sex (full-on, penetration and all) with his girlfriend, unprotected every day for a month. She wasn't on birth control. He didn't, as mentioned, use condoms. Both were virgins beforehand. She never got pregnant. So should I really be worrying if there was never any real penetration, especially when she's on the pill (and is very trustworthy to take it same time everyday)? Or did they just have really good odds, and I could possibly not have such great odds?

    kj01 on
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    Dread Pirate ArbuthnotDread Pirate Arbuthnot OMG WRIGGLY T O X O P L A S M O S I SRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    kj01 wrote: »
    My general cause for curiosity is this: My friend had sex (full-on, penetration and all) with his girlfriend, unprotected every day for a month. She wasn't on birth control. He didn't, as mentioned, use condoms. Both were virgins beforehand. She never got pregnant. So should I really be worrying if there was never any real penetration, especially when she's on the pill (and is very trustworthy to take it same time everyday)? Or did they just have really good odds, and I could possibly not have such great odds?

    Your friend is a retard who got incredibly lucky.

    Dread Pirate Arbuthnot on
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    EggyToastEggyToast Jersey CityRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    You can flip a coin 10 times and get all heads in a row, or, perhaps more comparable, roll a die and get either a 1 or 6 10 times in a row.

    You can also be infertile or have problems conceiving. Who knows sometimes. Some people have problems having kids, others seem to have kids thanks to one slip-up. The real problem is that the way you find out if your birth control method failed is that you have a kid on the way. But it's all levels of risk. I know couples who are pretty lazy with birth control because they're not trying to have kids but wouldn't be opposed to the idea. I know others who are really religious (like, my uncle w/ 7 cousins who each have like 3 kids each) who don't really care and so far have had babies until they have surgery to stop. And lots of close friends who are obviously doing all they can to make sure they don't have babies now.

    Your friend was really lucky, or they have something wrong with them. Not exactly paragons of responsibility if it's just luck, though.

    EggyToast on
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