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Depression and Anxiety / Parents Divorce
KoopahTroopah
The koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
The koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
So, I'm a pretty active member here usually around the Gaming & Technology forums. Pretty frequent in the Steam thread and other stuff. Mostly I've come to terms that the community here (or at least in the Steam thread) are some of the nicest I've virtually met ever. I figured I would try to open up to anyone about what's going on in my life (even if it's to complete strangers on the internet), and maybe get a helpful opinion that would help get me through the foreseeable future.
For the past 5-6 years my mother has been a bi-polar tornado of chaos, plagued with depression, that practically ruins everything she's involved with. Just a complete mess. I'm not even sure where or how it started because I was just leaving for college when symptoms arose and afterwards rarely visited home due to her disease. She's very good at misconstruing even the smallest inclination of a mistake as intentional ill-will towards her, which then leads to her making a big scene, and in the end just overall makes me feel like a complete failure. This would happen at least once every time I visited, so to keep myself from hurting I just distanced myself, focused on my studies and life at school, and rarely visited home. It was just so much better for me to be away from home mentally, emotionally and physically.
I just graduated college in June and moved back home to live with my parents while I look for jobs and figure out what the next steps in my life are. Here's the rundown of everyone else in my immediate family:
My father is a workaholic because he needs to be, he's paying for all of the bills by himself because my mother hasn't had a steady job since I was in high school. So it's weeks of 12 hour shifts with a few days off here or there, hasn't had off for the holidays in years. This past year or two, him and my mom had their final falling out which has lead to several separations and he's pushing for divorce. Papers filed, they're both talking to lawyers, my mom is dragging her feet a bit on it, but it's basically a done deal. In my opinion he's done or is doing all he can to salvage what has become a failed marriage with a destructive person, all while keeping a roof over our head and food on the table. I can't even begin to explain the respect I have for him.
My sister is 11, and just started 6th grade. She's been around for the worst of my mother and has seen pretty much all of the terrible things that have happened in the house while I was away. She takes it well most of the time, but she has her moments like I do where she just needs someone to cry on, which makes me happy that I'm here for that now. She's even started seeing professional help about it all, and I think she likes being able to talk to someone who isn't biased or involved with the family. I'm starting to think I should start doing that too.
My older brother is 28, and moved out of the house about when my dad first separated from my mom. My brother had to live here with her and my sister by himself which drove him to completely new bounds of crazy. He now lives by himself in an apartment and has a good paying job which as far as I know has been the best thing for him in his life. Currently he's in a text war with my mother and father, digging his nose into their divorce and saying just nasty venomous things to my mother (which doesn't help out for the rest of us that live here). There's also some things about borrowing my mother's car when his broke down until he fixed his last one, and my mom returning some packages of his that showed up at our door step against his will, kid shit really. He started using me to get information on when my parents were home so he could come get things that belonged to him, or if I could horde packages that he had delivered to our house before his big argument so he can come claim them without them being returned. Eventually I got sick of it and have been ignoring his texts or Steam messages. Right now, I think none of us are on speaking terms with him.
So for the past 3 months since I've moved home I've had maybe 3 or 4 interactions with my mother that I would consider a positive experience. I might be exaggerating at the amount, but even something as simple as a casual conversation without being berated would easily check off as "a good day". Then there are countless examples of any interaction, or even me doing something against her liking would set her off into an unfix-able rage. Even if they're the most trivial things in the world. The most recent and reason for this post being that I did not fold her laundry immediately after removing it from the dryer, before she came down and noticed that I was finishing it for her in the first place. Her reaction was to instantly yell and scream in my face: "YOU KNOW WHAT?! I'M GETTING FUCKING SICK OF EVERYONE'S SHIT! WHY SHOULD YOU CARE ABOUT MY CLOTHES BEING FOLDED?! JUST FUCKING CLUMP THEM UP INTO A BALL IN MY BASKET! Get the fuck out of my way! *proceeds to the living room and dumps her clothes on the couch* No, fuck all of my stuff. No one gives a shit about me anyway. Just care about your own fucking clothes. Can't even ask me to get my shit out of the fucking way first before just tossing them into the basket." Honest to god, I was even going to fold her clothes for her after I was finished emptying out the dryer lint into the trash can before starting my own clothes in the dryer. In between being disciplined for what I was considering a good deed finishing her wash for her, I'm constantly apologizing, telling her I'll fold them, etc... But she just keeps going and going. Things like this always push me to the point of just breaking down, leaving the room to go somewhere by myself, crying in my arms, and just mentally reminding myself that it's not her fault that she treats everyone around her like garbage. And this petty bullshit is what drives me into a shaking depression practically once a week since I've been home.
I used to think my greatest fear was ending up alone by myself somewhere, now I know for a fact my greatest fear is to end up like her. Hating everything and everyone around me and pushing away those who truly care for the smallest of reasons. Unfortunately, some days I just can't help but feel like I have her depression. Not her bi-polar tendencies to flip out on people, but to just feel weak and generally a failure. Earlier last week I found it almost impossible to just get out of bed. I finally dragged myself out around 6-7pm in the evening, ate leftover dinner by myself with my cats, and then went to go help my father pick up my car from the shop as it was due for inspection. From the shop he drove my sister to the library and I drove home. When I got home I opened the bill for my car inspection and just heavily wept in my car. Not that it was extremely expensive, but the fact that I haven't gotten a job yet, the incredible stacks of student loan bills are starting to come in, and I couldn't even help pay for my own car, I just felt like such a burden for my father and it didn't go away for the rest of the day. To a more frequent extent there are days where I just don't want to see anyone outside of my house. I like being able to just vegetate on my computer and play video games, or work on my own stuff without seeing my friends or family. Finally, I recently broke up with a long term(1 - 1.5 years) girlfriend early last month who I now consider too long of distance away to be with when I have literally zero income. Just dealing with all this is becoming a little to much for me to handle and some days I just don't want to deal.
So I guess what I need help with is, what's the best way to deal with my mother during these issues or even at all? And would it be best to confront my father about my own depression and perhaps seek medication or psychiatric help? From my opinion my depression is really mild, as those bad days are very rare and I don't feel affected by it to the point where it's keeping me from regularly looking for jobs, or from working on my games, or from just talking to people. But really, I just want a job and to move to a place away from this house where I don't have to deal with confrontations with my mother on a constant basis.
For the past 5-6 years my mother has been a bi-polar tornado of chaos, plagued with depression, that practically ruins everything she's involved with. Just a complete mess. I'm not even sure where or how it started because I was just leaving for college when symptoms arose and afterwards rarely visited home due to her disease. She's very good at misconstruing even the smallest inclination of a mistake as intentional ill-will towards her, which then leads to her making a big scene, and in the end just overall makes me feel like a complete failure. This would happen at least once every time I visited, so to keep myself from hurting I just distanced myself, focused on my studies and life at school, and rarely visited home. It was just so much better for me to be away from home mentally, emotionally and physically.
I just graduated college in June and moved back home to live with my parents while I look for jobs and figure out what the next steps in my life are. Here's the rundown of everyone else in my immediate family:
My father is a workaholic because he needs to be, he's paying for all of the bills by himself because my mother hasn't had a steady job since I was in high school. So it's weeks of 12 hour shifts with a few days off here or there, hasn't had off for the holidays in years. This past year or two, him and my mom had their final falling out which has lead to several separations and he's pushing for divorce. Papers filed, they're both talking to lawyers, my mom is dragging her feet a bit on it, but it's basically a done deal. In my opinion he's done or is doing all he can to salvage what has become a failed marriage with a destructive person, all while keeping a roof over our head and food on the table. I can't even begin to explain the respect I have for him.
My sister is 11, and just started 6th grade. She's been around for the worst of my mother and has seen pretty much all of the terrible things that have happened in the house while I was away. She takes it well most of the time, but she has her moments like I do where she just needs someone to cry on, which makes me happy that I'm here for that now. She's even started seeing professional help about it all, and I think she likes being able to talk to someone who isn't biased or involved with the family. I'm starting to think I should start doing that too.
My older brother is 28, and moved out of the house about when my dad first separated from my mom. My brother had to live here with her and my sister by himself which drove him to completely new bounds of crazy. He now lives by himself in an apartment and has a good paying job which as far as I know has been the best thing for him in his life. Currently he's in a text war with my mother and father, digging his nose into their divorce and saying just nasty venomous things to my mother (which doesn't help out for the rest of us that live here). There's also some things about borrowing my mother's car when his broke down until he fixed his last one, and my mom returning some packages of his that showed up at our door step against his will, kid shit really. He started using me to get information on when my parents were home so he could come get things that belonged to him, or if I could horde packages that he had delivered to our house before his big argument so he can come claim them without them being returned. Eventually I got sick of it and have been ignoring his texts or Steam messages. Right now, I think none of us are on speaking terms with him.
So for the past 3 months since I've moved home I've had maybe 3 or 4 interactions with my mother that I would consider a positive experience. I might be exaggerating at the amount, but even something as simple as a casual conversation without being berated would easily check off as "a good day". Then there are countless examples of any interaction, or even me doing something against her liking would set her off into an unfix-able rage. Even if they're the most trivial things in the world. The most recent and reason for this post being that I did not fold her laundry immediately after removing it from the dryer, before she came down and noticed that I was finishing it for her in the first place. Her reaction was to instantly yell and scream in my face: "YOU KNOW WHAT?! I'M GETTING FUCKING SICK OF EVERYONE'S SHIT! WHY SHOULD YOU CARE ABOUT MY CLOTHES BEING FOLDED?! JUST FUCKING CLUMP THEM UP INTO A BALL IN MY BASKET! Get the fuck out of my way! *proceeds to the living room and dumps her clothes on the couch* No, fuck all of my stuff. No one gives a shit about me anyway. Just care about your own fucking clothes. Can't even ask me to get my shit out of the fucking way first before just tossing them into the basket." Honest to god, I was even going to fold her clothes for her after I was finished emptying out the dryer lint into the trash can before starting my own clothes in the dryer. In between being disciplined for what I was considering a good deed finishing her wash for her, I'm constantly apologizing, telling her I'll fold them, etc... But she just keeps going and going. Things like this always push me to the point of just breaking down, leaving the room to go somewhere by myself, crying in my arms, and just mentally reminding myself that it's not her fault that she treats everyone around her like garbage. And this petty bullshit is what drives me into a shaking depression practically once a week since I've been home.
I used to think my greatest fear was ending up alone by myself somewhere, now I know for a fact my greatest fear is to end up like her. Hating everything and everyone around me and pushing away those who truly care for the smallest of reasons. Unfortunately, some days I just can't help but feel like I have her depression. Not her bi-polar tendencies to flip out on people, but to just feel weak and generally a failure. Earlier last week I found it almost impossible to just get out of bed. I finally dragged myself out around 6-7pm in the evening, ate leftover dinner by myself with my cats, and then went to go help my father pick up my car from the shop as it was due for inspection. From the shop he drove my sister to the library and I drove home. When I got home I opened the bill for my car inspection and just heavily wept in my car. Not that it was extremely expensive, but the fact that I haven't gotten a job yet, the incredible stacks of student loan bills are starting to come in, and I couldn't even help pay for my own car, I just felt like such a burden for my father and it didn't go away for the rest of the day. To a more frequent extent there are days where I just don't want to see anyone outside of my house. I like being able to just vegetate on my computer and play video games, or work on my own stuff without seeing my friends or family. Finally, I recently broke up with a long term(1 - 1.5 years) girlfriend early last month who I now consider too long of distance away to be with when I have literally zero income. Just dealing with all this is becoming a little to much for me to handle and some days I just don't want to deal.
So I guess what I need help with is, what's the best way to deal with my mother during these issues or even at all? And would it be best to confront my father about my own depression and perhaps seek medication or psychiatric help? From my opinion my depression is really mild, as those bad days are very rare and I don't feel affected by it to the point where it's keeping me from regularly looking for jobs, or from working on my games, or from just talking to people. But really, I just want a job and to move to a place away from this house where I don't have to deal with confrontations with my mother on a constant basis.
KoopahTroopah on
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The key is to be consistent. If she yells, leave. If she follows you, go where she can't follow you. Leave if you need be. Go somewhere and cool down. Don't be angry, be firm and impartial. You don't care what her problems are, if she can't speak to you rationally, she doesn't deserve to speak to you.
You have to be prepared to leave their residence, maybe look into living with your brother if you can, or see if there's someone you can crash with. Don't keep anything valuable you can't lose at the house because she will find a way to use that as leverage. Crazy people do crazy things.
She strikes me as a narcissist rather than bipolar. Bipolars have manic swings where they'll be happy at least sometime, seems like she's pretty miserable all the time, at least from your description. Your family situation is very similar to my girlfriends.
As a fellow PAer, just know, it's nothing you have done, everything is on her. You are a swell person.
The best way to talk to your father is to talk to your father. I would talk to your doctor and see about getting a referrals for depression and psychiatric help. Who knows you might not even be depressed, the stress of dealing with this can really take a toll on you in general. You should still talk to someone.
I agree with your last statement, that should be your goal.
Stick with it koops, be strong and you'll persevere, you're stronger than you think you are. We're here for you either way, it's okay.
Either way, you and the rest of your family should definitely talk to someone yourselves. If your parents are getting divorced, can you and your sister stay with him instead of her?
Well that's the thing, just yesterday she was very happy. More so than I've seen probably my entire time home since June. She had dinner with the family, easy and kind conversations with little to no mention of drama. She offered to give me some crystal for my friends wedding in October. She even asked me to put music on her tablet for her, which I did almost immediately. She's definitely not psycho all the time, just most of the time.
This seems hard. Being that my lively hood is my PC tower and that I don't really have anywhere to put it since I'm on it practically 24/7. I have family, aunts who offer to let me crash at their place every now and then. Though I really can't see myself living with the majority of them as they have their own issues as well. One's an alcoholic, the other is a crippled animal lover who goes a little overboard surrounding herself with animals. Definitely not my brother, being here during high school with his conspiracy-theory-gun-toting days is something I really don't want to submit myself to again. Just sort of feel stuck here until the divorce is settled and either we sell the house and move, or my mother moves to my grandfather's house.
Very kind words Bowen though, thank you. I'll try to confront my dad about my issues the next time we're both home.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Yeah, like I mentioned to Bowen I think she was clinically diagnosed as bipolar. I think it's just really easy to remember the bad days and not the good ones. She has tried dozens of medications. Doctors keep putting her on stuff which helps for a couple weeks and then doesn't work anymore, so she changes medications again which has the same effect and the cycle repeats.
She does have a lot going on in her life. I'll give her that. Her father is very senile now and lives with her brother who only half takes care of him. He expects my mom to pick up the slack when he can't or if he has to work or whatever. My uncle is constantly setting up appointments which he can't take care of so my mom either has to take care of them or frustratingly cancels and sets up for better times. Between retirement and my uncle's job they're making a pretty absurd amount of money between them a month, and yet they never seem to have any money. Which stresses my mom out to no end.
I think the divorce gets to her because she doesn't want to get divorced, but really my father, my sister and I have had enough of her. It's not that we don't appreciate her, obviously we do she's my mom, but these sort of confrontations are just too stressful for us. So she feels like she's kind of being left to fend for herself after however many years of marriage that she's been in now.
And not having a steady job for 5-6 years must be emotionally taxing, I can barely deal with 3 months.
My father was taking medication for depression but I think he stopped, there were some events that are pretty personal so I won't get into them. Let's say that I think he's better off without it and that I think his head is currently in a good state of "let's just get divorced, I'll keep working to support everyone, I don't want to fight about anything, it's better this way for everyone. And it is what it is". He's also extremely lenient on his terms as well, but I don't think she's taking them seriously and will fight most of them because she feels shafted for whatever reasons.
I'm free of custody being 24, like I could leave right now and say to hell with the both of them but I won't. My sister on the other hand should be given the choice to go with whoever she wants. I have a feeling that my mother will fight for custody over her though, even though she's currently jobless and an emotional wreck the majority of the time. I will probably stay with my father wherever he goes for as long as I have to. I love that man for everything he's done for me while still dealing with my mother and he deserves my support.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
You really probably ought not to live with her if you can.
As for yourself, you probably don't need to worry about turning out like your mother. I mean, if you are feeling down and anxious it is totally understandable. You lost your job, your parents are getting divorced, and your mother is mentally ill. That's a hell of a trifecta. So, I wouldn't be too certain you are clinically depressed. It wouldn't hurt to talk to someone about it, but I wouldn't rush to think something is medically wrong with you.
I think you just need to distance yourself from the things you can't change and concentrate on the things you can. That's the main thing.
but they're listening to every word I say
I will listen to Bowens advice when she goes off next time and try to calmly tell her that unless she can talk to me like a human being then I don't have anything to say to her.
I explained what happened to my dad with the laundry, but not about how upset I was last week yet. I think that's another conversation to have later.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
This is something to definitely speak to your father about if he isn't already aware. IANAL but considering your mothers lengthy unemployment and psychological issues, I assume there is a good chance he could get full custody as long as he fights for it. With you and him gone, if your sister stays, she will most likely have to take on the entirety of your mothers outbursts, no 11 yr old should have to deal with that.
As for your own depression, speaking as someone else who is going through a lengthy job hunt post college, it's bound to make anyone slip a little (especially if student loans are a factor), it doesn't make you like your mother. You're the kind of guy that puts on a gaming marathon to raise money for children, not the kind that would ever berate someone over not folding your laundry fast enough.
Stay strong fellow Steam Threader.
This will absolutely kill your sister's self confidence and take a toll on her mental health, your sister is basically my girlfriend 20 years ago. If it comes down to it, you might have to speak on her and your father's behalf in a hearing with a judge to determine custody.
You may want to sit down and talk to her and reassure her that your mother's outbursts are nothing that your sister did or can control.
Also, I didn't see this really mentioned so I don't know if you're employed currently, but good luck on your job hunt if you're not.
That's not a bad idea. Yeah, I understand what I'll have to do if the worst should happen. *insert Pirates of the Caribbean reference here*.
She's quite aware of what's going on. She's been told several times what the outcome of the divorce will be and that she'll have the choice of staying with my dad, and I think I remember her telling me she wants to stay with my dad. She's also been told several times that it's not her fault if my mom goes berserk on her by a myriad of people. So I think she'll be okay, plus she's already seeing someone for professional help just to talk to an unbiased third party.
And no, still unemployed.
This is reassuring. Thanks for that. I'm pretty confident she'll be okay and will end up staying with my father and I.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
I'm still living at home and haven't found a permanent job yet, but I have found a couple temporary ones since September, so I don't feel nearly as bad as I did then since I can pay my bills, loans, and all that. However, I have not seen my mother outside of her room or in anything but pajama clothes since about a month ago around my birthday. Maybe a week before. She was going to visit one of her doctors, either psychological or medical, I'm not sure. Ever since then she has been bed ridden and silent. She regularly doesn't come down to dinner, and she barely speaks to my father or myself. Last time I saw her outside of her room was about a week or more ago I think, she came downstairs to feed the cats. I mean she does leave her room, I just don't see her do it. Ever. But she has to at least be getting showers because towels appear in the laundry basket in the bathroom, the dishwasher is usually finished it's cycle without anyone else running it, cats are sometimes fed in the morning without my father or myself tending to them. But except for these one or two chores or stuff randomly appearing, you wouldn't even tell that she's here. She didn't even come down for Thanksgiving. My dad went to go invite her to Thanksgiving dinner after it was ready, but she sat in her room. It's just depressingly eerie, she's turned into this phantom of a person. At this point, I think her medication has changed twice since I last posted, and we haven't seen any results at all. For all intents and purposes, she's catatonic to my dad and I. I've popped my head into her room to see if she needed anything once or twice, but I stopped as of late. She was supposed to pickup my sister from school all last week but I ended up doing it because she was feeling "too shaky" to do it. I have not spoken to her in person probably since Wednesday or Thursday of last week.
My dad has been working like clockwork. I think he's had maybe 5 or 6 days off in the past 60. He pays most of the bills, he goes grocery shopping, most of the time he makes dinner, he takes my sister and me to the movies, he does more now than I have ever seen him do in my life. We just got done having a conversation about what to buy my sister for Christmas. She has a list on the fridge with things and I just wanted to make sure that we don't get the same stuff for her. I'll probably get her a new Fire tablet. Then I mentioned how I was going to use this Kay jewelry discount card we got in the mail to get my mom a nice necklace and earrings from my sister and I. At which point he apologized to me for this whole situation with my mom. The divorce is stagnant because of lawyers not returning phone calls. He has no idea what to do with her now since she's not improving, and if nothing happens by Christmas he's going to make the call to have her taken to a mental care facility (again), force-ably if necessary. It's gotten to the point where we think she could be a harm to herself, and we don't want to risk one of us coming home and checking on her to find out she hurt herself. God forbid, my sister come home from school to that while my dad and I are at our jobs. We're all scared and worried for my mom, but really my dad just wants to protect my sister from the off chance of witnessing something tragic.
Other than that I've stopped speaking with my brother completely because my grandmother invited him to Thanksgiving at her boyfriends earlier in November, and he gave a weekend when he wasn't busy or working, to which my grandmother & co. rescheduled to accommodate him, and he no-showed. Even after being reminded, and given phone calls, blah blah blah. So really I'm at the level where if he's going to be a selfish prick, then fuck him.
As far as good news, I just started a new temporary position at Chase which has the potential to grow into a longer period. It's closer and pays better than my last temporary job, not by much but it's enough to keep me steady for the next few months as well as splurge a little for Christmas and Steam sale. I started working on my game again and getting into pixel art so I can start designing playable characters and enemies. I also had inspiration for a "Breath of Fire"-like RPG that I want to do, so maybe I'll work on that after this one. I've been super positive about well, everything. I can't really explain it, like I just broke last week and got fed up of doing the same thing every day, feeling useless, and being stuck here in this shitty situation. So I've been taking time out every day since to work on my games, or hit the gym a little, or teach myself piano. Eventually this game I'm working on will get to a stage where I can finally present it and show it off, and I'll make a thread in Indie Dev and probably kick start it, then basically pray for the best.
Finally, my sister has been awesome. She's top of her class, she does Science Olympiad and Computer Club, she both watches reads Attack on Titan and Deathnote, she plays video games, she might be the coolest kid that I know. I'm really glad that she's not following in my brothers footsteps and doing the bare minimum in school because that would straight kill my father's and my morale.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Keep it up, you're doing everything it looks like you should be doing.
Ugh, I just want A) to move out and away, and/or
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
12-23:
After dinner tonight my mom asked me to come upstairs and fix her Amazon account for her. Some woman who she used to go to high school with was very generous and gifted her a $100 gift card for Amazon to give to my sister. So now my sister has $100 on Amazon that she's going to have free range to spend under supervision of my mother after Christmas, which is cool.
Then she showed me some text from my brother. Apparently my mom had sent him a text saying in her words "Hey, I heard you lost your job. Just wanted to make sure you're okay." and he replied with something like "What part of fucking leave me alone forever don't the two (meaning her and my father) of you get. Go back to leeching off your stupid husband or I'll call the police for harassment." Now I haven't spoken to him in a little over a month, but he lost his job just after Thanksgiving for supposedly improperly filling out his time card. The hospital he was working IT for called him out on it and he said no it's filled out fine, so they fired him. And not to be spiteful, but good. He's been such a little shit to my parents for the past X years that I don't expect anything less. He smokes weed every day, and is becoming more and more unstable because of it. All I hear from him are government plots, half-cooked schemes to try and separate himself from our government's law, and ways to get out of growing the fuck up and being a decent person for once.
Afterwards she sorta spiraled into talking basically about everything else. She has a disability court hearing in January because they denied her going on disability (I guess, again). Her father and brother found a place in Massachusetts where they can keep their dog, so they're going to be moving over there soon. Which means that my grandpops house will be open and my mom can move into there without having to pay rent. They even offered to pay for her utilities until she gets back on her feet which sounds like a great deal to me. She said that if she can move out of here and support herself by February or March than she's doing it. I'm really, really praying that she does. It doesn't matter that she's up and moving. She's barely doing chores around the house and is constantly sending passive aggressive comments into conversations. "Maybe if SOMEONE didn't do *x*, well that's not MY fault, etc..." Stuff keeps disappearing, nothing important but just random things like vases or silverware that she bought for the house. "I took that and packed it away because it's MINE." Just... stupid regular bullshit. She "can't be blamed for not spending time with her kids when she's sick because that's what happens when you have depression, you can't do anything." WHICH I'm not denying, I'm really not, I understand being depressed. But even now, while she's awake and active this is the first real time she's tried to speak in me practically since coming home from school in June.
Next, she went into the divorce. I'm going to need some law advice or opinions on this, because I'm not sure what to think of it. Apparently, she filed for divorce herself back in 2011 and according to her and her lawyer, they can't do anything until my father withdraws the new papers. Now either A) she's lying out her ass and just delaying the divorce papers from being signed so she doesn't get kicked off of insurance/phones/whatever or
Finally, she went into details about my sister's custody. According to her, in the state of Pennsylvania, the mother has 100% custody over any children under the age of 18, and if my father would try to keep my sister without lawful approval, it could be considered kidnapping. Also something I know nothing about and would need advice on. She's convinced that my father does nothing but work and come home, which I mean is obviously wrong. He's taken care of my sister and I for an extended period of time while she's done literally nothing but sleep in bed all day. Not only that, but she doesn't see why my father would want custody over my sister because he works all the time. And I'm sitting there like, "Why would you want custody over her if you're just going to randomly get sick and sleep all day?"
Ultimately, I can see this getting really ugly real quick before it gets any closer to better. I'm really trying my best to stay out of it, and focus on myself since that's all I really want. Is to focus on my personal shit, get out of this house, and let them hash out whatever needs to get done.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
The past few days have been a real zinger. Chase is renewing my contract to continue working there because they want me to do more data entry things. Which is fine by me, the job was only supposed to be temporary but it's paying my bills and student loans so I don't really mind it. It's just boring and unfulfilling work. Well my first contract technically ended yesterday, and they're still getting the paperwork signed and approved for my extension. So yesterday I lost all my security access to the online systems and card access to enter the buildings and get to my desk. I usually get in around 7:30 but didn't get an update from my supervisor til 9:45 saying that the paperwork wasn't completed yet and to just go home until I get a call from them. They definitely need me back and the project head is actually pissed off at Chase because we're at a complete stand still on our work. I'm assuming I won't be back there til the start of next week, but I thought it was also convenient that this happened yesterday so I could sit home today while my parents got into another argument.
Some other stuff with my cousin happened which pissed my mom off that I'm not really sure about. I guess she took advantage of my mom or something, or my mom feels like she did, I dunno. My mom tends to take everything from everyone personally even if it wasn't intended as an insult. So whatever, there's that. Also, my sister was helping my mom do something on her tablet over the weekend. My mom got frustrated that she didn't understand something or how my sister was acting and told my sister "to stop being a little bitch" which when my sister told me about it almost drove me over the freaking edge. How much of a terrible person can you turn into? I really do wonder.
Then my dad got very sick this past weekend and needed to call off work. It was just a big cold at first but he was coughing his head off all weekend. He took off work on Monday and went to see a doctor and found out he has a hernia and needs surgery done to get it fixed. He's taking off the rest of the week and will be getting the surgery done on Friday. He just had his checkup appointment to get examined and finish out the details today. Which leads us to my mom packing the rest of her shit and leaving today...
Apparently they had a big argument this morning where she took off and didn't come back until an hour ago. I'm not sure what the argument was about but I only assume it was the same "You need to do this"/"No, you need to do this" argument they've been having for months. My dad left for his checkup and my mom showed up practically 15 minutes later, after not being in the house all day. She starts grabbing wall decorations, vases, ceramics, knick-knacks, photos, our cuckoo clock, wind chimes, pretty much a wide array of decorative things that were out and about in the house (most of which were hers, but I can't be sure of all of it because of the sheer volume). And stuffed her SUV full of whatever she had. She asked me to help her move some big boxes into her car which I was fine doing since I really didn't want her living here anymore. While I was helping her she told me that her car needed a jump while my dad was at his surgery appointment and when she asked my father to go help her, she got mad that he couldn't go help her. And that was the straw that broke the camels back and made her move out? You're joking, right? How fucking conceited are you? I assured her that he was at his doctor's getting ready for his surgery on Friday, and she reminded me that she doesn't give a shit and the world revolves around her. Afterwards I texted my dad to make him aware of the situation but he was on his way home anyway and came in just in time to see her off. There was a small exchange between them where she intends to come back to get even MORE things, and he tried to calmly explain to her that she can't keep coming in and out of the house when she pleases. Like once she's gone, she's gone. I don't think she got the message. She said that she intends to come back so she can take my sister to school and pick her up to drop her off here, to which my father replied "You need to worry about yourself and focus on getting better.", and she finished that with "You need to fuck off and focus on not being a fucking jerk off." Then the door slammed and my dad called his lawyer.
So, I guess this is progress, yeah? Baby steps, but at least I don't have to deal with her sarcastic attitude or passive aggressive comments towards my dad while he's in need of surgery. If it means that he can stop being stressed out all the time while he's at home then hallelujah. He deserves some rest after the overtime he's been putting in at work and at home. Not to mention the obvious negative attitude she's been putting on my sister. So... yeah. Progress.
Oh, she also legally changed her name back to her maiden name without telling anyone. So there's that too.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Also, see if you guys can have a policeman there for when she comes back, and change the locks as soon as you can.
Please keep us updated; you have our support.
Papers are already being filed for custody stuff. Locks were changed not 15 minutes after she left. Dad mentioned to his lawyer that he'd like to file a PFA to keep Mom from doing physical harm, but lawyer said since she hasn't actually done anything physical yet that it's not going to fly in court. They're working on the next level of restraining order.
As an addendum to the last post, apparently it was an hour to an hour and a half before my dad's appointment that her car broke down and he said no I can't do anything, sorry that he's on sick leave, can't pay to fix your car, etc... To which she flaunted around some guy she's been seeing coming and helping her out instead, and "thanks for nothing", "at least someone cares", yada yada yada... And that's when she came over and grabbed stuff.
I just went and picked my sister up from school, she seems to be taking it well.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
My mom just sent the cops over with a temporary PFA taking my sister away from us until a court hearing on Thursday. My dad's working on taking care of it but we're both pretty much on tilt. There's nothing he can do about it right now since it's passed office hours and we don't have personal contact with his lawyer. Who I guess didn't know jack about our county because according to the cops they issue out PFAs like crazy around here. Half the shit she has on here is bullshit anyway so I don't blame the court for passing it since she made it sound god awful.
While we were waiting for her to show up she had the gaul to text me asking for shit out of her room to give to my sister. Unbelievable. I completely ignored it.
My dad tells me he's got a good idea on how to proceed but anything I should be aware of that I wouldn't normally know would be nice.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Honestly under the circumstances I don't think she has much of a leg to stand on, but I am super duper not a lawyer.
If there is concern about how your sister is being treated in the interim here, you can ask the police to do a welfare check on her. They'll just stop by and ask to speak to her to make sure she isn't being mistreated or anything.
But on second thought, that could trigger something negative happening itself. Ugh...I'm sorry! Hang in there!
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
I really just can't believe her. It's been one day and she can't even pick up my sister from school. This whole situation is stressing me out like mad.
Dad's current lawyer said there's no way the PFA should have passed considering how halfassed and poorly written it is. He's working on getting it overturned and in the meantime my dad called another lawyer who he liked and has worked with before to try and speed things along. If the first one doesn't start showing results soon hopefully this other one will.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
In a nutshell: My wife's sister's family is insanely similar to your situation. My wife's sister is verbally abusive, incredibly self-centered, and an addict to boot. She has symptoms that have led us to think bipolar is a distinct possibility as well.
In her case, my 14 year old niece is the primary victim - hospitalized for depression caused in part due to her mother's treatment of her, and when it was time for her to be released her mother told them she didn't want her home yet, that she wanted to put her in a home for homeless girls so she could "see what it's really like to be miserable". In the end, her father stepped in and took custody and despite being a bit on the immature, broke side of things himself, he's done a good job keeping her away from her mother, including legally. However, during various stints of him being between women and apartments she's ended up living with my wife and I for months at a time as well. We've had many sleepless nights figuring out the least traumatic way to shelter a young girl from her mother...including ongoing questions of if we need to take legal steps ourselves.
It's incredibly difficult, but you have to keep reminding yourself that taking care of your sister is absolutely vital. No matter how sick you know your mom is, for a kid it's much harder to deal with, especially with all the other preteen stuff they are already going through socially/physically/etc. I always tried to avoid talking about the mother in bad terms around her, because in the end we don't want her to hate her mother, despite how hurt feelings are at the moment. I also always try to help give her an escape - we have board game nights, roadtrips, and try to make sure she knows someone cares about her hapiness. Assuming your dad gets custody back, also try to monitor her interactions with your mom as much as possible, it takes just one text message or phone call for things to go downhill quickly and leave a kid shattered.
My big advice for you is simply to save EVERYTHING. Every text, every voicemail, if there are Facebook posts/messages screen capture them. It sounds petty, it sounds like a pain in the ass, but when my niece has met with social workers and therapists having things to actually show them has been a big help. Sometimes people take kid's vantage points of things with a grain of salt - but a cruel or bizarre series of text messages says volumes and can help when they are trying to figure out custody.
Finally, try as best as you can to take care of yourself. We had my niece all summer and the situations and battles and stress were huge. I took it all in, but often didn't let anything out and it will lead to you getting sick too - whether it's feeling broken down physically or emotionally. For me, I ended up feeling better more or less the same way as you - I talked it out a bit in the forums (in my case the parenting thread). Just having that reassurance that you're a good person and doing the right thing can really help some days when the shit just hit the fan. I can't tell you how many times I've been at the point of losing my shit entirely only to have the folks in that thread bring me back up.
Sorry so long - it's a path I'm fairly familiar with...if you ever need anything let me know.
Thanks again for the advice and your story. It means a lot.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
So, background, I worked for child protection in Louisiana. If this is your state I can give you a lot more advice. If not I can give you some general guidelines and hopefully walk you through the rest. I am not a lawyer, but I know what judges like to hear. It is pretty universally true, and should you have to get someone like me involved it will put them on their ease very, very quickly which you want.
First, do NOT bring her back to your Dad's house without getting a 100% ironclad plan to keep him out while she is there. Document the plan in detail via text or something else that has a time stamp that is accurate and hard to alter. Do this fresh every time you have to bring her there. If it is unnecessary because he is out of town then have solid documentation he is out of town. I am assuming "PFA" is some local form of what we called a protective order and judges do not fuck around with those. Your mom is likely going to be in deep shit with a judge if you can prove the stuff she said is false. Judges are entitled, arrogant, power mad jack asses in my experience. Respect their authority though and things go well. If you don't then life becomes as much of a living hell as they feel like.
Secondly document everything in regards to your sister's well being. Have her text you everything she feels is unsafe or otherwise is not in keeping with making her safe. This includes lack of food in the house, lack of cleaning, and leaving her in an unsafe position. Here we have a thing called the "Children's Code" which is basically a set of laws on what you can and can't do with your kid. Un-medicated bi-polar puts you on the bad side of that set of laws. This is not grounds for removal in and of itself, of course, but it absolutely is a factor that is considered.
The age that a child can be considered to be left alone varies greatly, but 11 sounds like a borderline case for wherever it is. Leaving the child alone after school with no plans, however, comes extremely close to child abandonment or endangerment (CPS is not criminal but work closely with the police so I only know what they used to like to try and charge them with in similar situations but not the end charges). If she is left alone like that call your local child protection line (not 911 so you will have to look it up) and explain the situation. Explain you have no where to bring her as you do not have access to your mothers house, and you cannot reach her. Explain there is a PFA (they will know what it means) and while you have made arrangements with your father to keep him out of the home that it is not a permanent solution. Explain as much of the situation as you feel like as CPS is social workers so they will end up getting down to the nitty gritty anyways.
Thirdly, get a list of relatives she can stay with. Confirm it. Have it at the ready with names, addresses, and numbers. Get a list of close family friends you trust to respect court orders as well. It sounds like your sister can be at extreme risk of harm with your mother, and she cannot stay with your father until the PFA is resolved. If CPS determines this (and I have no where near the information I would need to make a definitive statement) then this list is what they will want. Foster care is not like the bad old days. First and foremost you are supposed to try with friends and family that will keep the child safe and keep the parents away. If that fails, or your state has a shitty set up (let me know which one and I will look into it) then foster parents are tried. Typically these people are genuinely angels sent to earth. There is no much money, and the risk of getting your house burned down (and the woman stayed a foster parent.) This is still a bad place for your sister for a number of obvious reasons. It is still better than having her at risk of not eating or being left at school all night.
Fourthly at the PFA hearing do not make this about your mother. Keep it clean and simply address what is written. The crazy will come out all on its own. It always does. I have seen people with lawyers talk themselves into contempt of court because the crazy never stays hidden. The time and place to document your mother's failures is at her PFA hearing. If/when that comes make sure to have a list of verifiable, and provable allegations. Make sure that each and every one directly relates to your sister's care. If you cannot make it directly relate, then it is not relevant. Do not pull punches, but don't make it into a witch hunt. Cold, hard facts that either have been directly observed by, or to your father (hearsay would be permissible in initial hearings here, but that may vary locally) or that your sister can attest to (less weight but still good).
I know I am dumping a ton on you, but this is not a situation for surprises. I am hoping to arm you with enough information to keep your sister safe and healthy. Take it all in one step at a time and don't worry about getting ahead of yourself as the situation might resolve itself without any involvement from you. If it doesn't though I want you to be able to resolve it with minimal drama and the above steps will help with that. Best of luck and let me know if I can do anything else.
Like I mentioned before my mom hastily filed this lawsuit, and it's pretty obvious that she did. She checked off a clause that should have allowed my sister to contact and see my dad still, but then didn't fill out any of the following paragraph with what permissions she's allowed to contact him. So really she said "Yeah they can do all the things I say, but I'm not gonna say anything." She even texted me when I picked my sister up from school trying to convince me that my sister can still see my dad. Clearly she didn't know exactly what she was doing. What's the point of removing her from the house if you're just going to try to give her back to us the next day? Not only that, but you made it illegal for us to take her back when that's all we want anyway. Good job.
I just texted my sister good night since it's her bed time, and she has school tomorrow depending on the weather. We live in PA by the way, snow and temperatures are brutal right now. I'll text her how she's doing tomorrow to get a better grip on her situation. Last we talked she said that she's okay, there's heat, there's food, she has her own room so there's privacy, enough clothes for the week, etc... So there's no immediate danger apart from living with a psycho. Also, the cousin that was supposed to stay here is actually staying over there.
I doubt I'll even have a chance to speak at the hearing, but I'm prepared to answer whatever questions the judge has for me if any. Not to mention that it's really not my fight right now, the hearing is about the PFA which only has my moms, my dads, and my sisters names on it. In any case, thanks for the steps.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Ok so yeah it's what we call a protective order. I stand by my advice for her visiting the home. I understand that she is not literally barred from being there, but since it is your dad's house she is functionally barred. This is the voice of experience. The advice I always gave was keep them away since it looks better. It sounds like less of a plan for you though. You will only be able to offer moral support for the PFA hearing, but you might be able to help gather documentation for your dad. He will need as much support as possible obviously.
That box for contact feels like a trap to me. Not intentionally set mind you, but it smells like something that will explode on someone. Respect it's vagueness and go for as little as possible. Asking for clarification might let your mom have the floor long enough to say something super crazy. "What kind of contact is ok?" and then she talks herself out of an abuse case since all contact is ok anyways. Rope a dope if you will.
Deep breaths and patience. This is the worst part. I have been there in a form myself and it is agony. I have watched and in a way put families through it and helped them reconnect many times. The pain is immense but temporary. When she is home it will be heaven. Focus on that and it will happen before you know it.
Also super happy to hear your sister is ok and someone known to be stable is there. Hopefully nothing happens and this blows over super quick.
After yesterday the future was looking pretty bleak. Like I mentioned my dad got fed up with his lawyer (lawyer A) and him and I went to visit his old lawyer (lawyer B, which I think he should have gone to in the first place) and gotten a second opinion/looking for other representation. We were there for an hour but lawyer B talked quick, was very loud, and to the point. He had a really good understanding on where the case was going and who was involved already behind the scenes as far as my mom's lawyer and the judges appearing on certain dates for the hearings. He looked at the PFA my mom served my dad last week for less than 20 seconds and knew it was bullshit. So he had a sound plan on where to go which involved going into the hearing today and pleading for a continuance for further down the road so lawyer B could come in and appropriately represent my dad. Then my dad had to come home and write a formal discharge for lawyer A explaining that he has new council and thanks for all the help. The next step would be to file a custody complaint for my sister to get her back in our house, which would take a couple weeks to go through. Or he could try to find reasoning of physical abuse or neglect that would warrant an emergency custody complaint which would be done much much quicker. After the rescheduled PFA hearing, he would then try to settle on an agreement (which would take 90-ish days to settle everything involving custody) so the current PFA would then be gone, this would allow my sister to come back home since it would revert to 50/50 custody. At this point we would pick her up from school, and my dad would file his own PFA to keep my mom away from the house. Then my dad would go through the regular divorce stuff including custody battles, marital assets, etc... Pretty much he detailed out a year to two year long process in which they would bleed each other dry with lawyer fees and whatever else to end up with the divorce finally finished. It sounded like hell, but my dad wants full custody of my sister and doesn't care at all about the house or martial assets, so when we left this was the shitty road we were heading down. The lawyer mentioned that I probably shouldn't go to the hearing because it would be inappropriate, just like if my mom had brought my sister. It's really just between the two parents. So I decided that I wasn't going to go to the hearing today either.
Oh! My dad also called his lawyer A earlier in the week, and once again during the meeting with lawyer B, to get a continuance for the hearing today. He has surgery for his hernia tomorrow and he wanted to be properly represented by lawyer B. Well lawyer A didn't answer the phone or return his calls at all this week. Finally last night before dinner, he called my dad back explaining that he's been sick all week and that the hearing today was still on but that he can't show up so to ask for a continuance. Which is actually for the better because we were worried he might show up and try to settle an agreement at the hearing himself since both counsel and parties would be there. Like the judge would be like, "Oh everyone is here let's just do it now"-kindof deal. So now he's definitely getting discharged. Lawyer B had already been in contact more in the past 3-4 days than lawyer A has been in the past month. It's ridiculous.
Onto the good news.
So my dad went to the PFA hearing today alone and unrepresented, really expecting the worst but his only goal was to get a continuance to a different Thursday when his new lawyer is available. Afterwards he told me pretty much what happened. He went in early and their case finally got called a couple hours later. The judge read through the document really quick and before my dad had a chance to speak, my mom asked if she could withdraw the PFA. My dad said he was shocked, like a literal jaw-drop. So he decided to let this go on to see how it would go. The judge said that it was too early to withdraw the PFA, seeing how she just filed it and there might be some residual things happening where this is just regret when really this might be the best thing for them. My mom said that he was a good father and he takes care of his kids so he should have a right to see his daughter. She must have taken her medication today, that's like the nicest thing she's said to my dad in I want to say months but it might even be years. Instead what the judge did was he extended the temporary PFA time to 90 days, where they're still not allowed to talk to each other. Pretty much a legal separation where they have to keep out of contact of each other for 90 days. A couple exceptions including that my sister's name be removed from the document, meaning that she can come home whenever she wants!
P.S. When my dad called lawyer B to explain everything that happened during the hearing, lawyer B had mentioned that my mom no longer had legal representation. Apparently her lawyer and lawyer B for my dad know each other pretty well and lawyer B had called her lawyer to tell him that he was getting involved in the case. My mom's lawyer had advised against her filing the PFA in the first place, and when she went and did it anyway, he flew the coop. Hopefully this means that since she has no legal rep that things will go much smoother from here on out and she'll be more likely to settle on things instead of dragging this on longer than it has already been.
In any case, my sister can come home today if she wanted to, and after this weekend my mom is barred from the house for 90 days. So, I'm pretty happy.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
I'm glad your sister is not being used as barter anymore. She deserves better.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah