[Seven Dragon Saga] And in developer resurrection today...... SSI as TSI

C2B

*Bad OP incoming*

*A hobo approaches you*

Hey, hey you there!

Uhm, do you mean me?

Yes, yessss. Let me ask you a question!

I.... I really don't have t

Do you remember old-school D&D crpgs?

... You're not going away, are you?

Nope

Well, I did play Baldur's Gate, I guess....

NONESENSE. I'm talking about the golden age here. You know..... the REAL good stuff.

....
Ah, lets just do this

*The hobo opens his coat to reveal*



So, which developer people seemed to care about that one time is making this?


Multiple actually. All of them once worked at a developer and publisher called SSI (Strategic Simulations Inc.). Formed in the late 70's the company wanted to bring wargames to the digital world. Over the years they developed tons of games, most famous the Gold Box D&D games (As well as the Panzer General series). The common engine the games were using became known as the Gold Box engine due to the gold-colored boxes the games arrived in. The partnership between TSR and SSI lasted for thirty! titles. The most famous being (Not the C:\\ formatting disgrace that shall not be named) Pool of Radiance.
Anyway, David Shelley and Keith Brors, two of the designers that worked on these games, recently designed a new p&p system which they want to adapt for a crpg. To this end a few members of SSI reformed to form TSI. Tactical Simulations Interactive.



Then is this going to be crowdfunded?

Nope. You're reading this thread, are you? Look up the forum rules.

Tell me some more about the game.....

There is not much to tell as of yet. According to TSI it is going to feature 6 different classes, full party creation, a focus on strategic combat, choices and consequences and is developed on Unity. And thats about as much as we know. You can look up the P&P game, but for some reason TSI restricted access. Don't know if there are some non-final things in there.

At least let me look for some (very early) info myself.

Website

http://www.tsi-games.com/

Interviews

http://www.kotaku.co.uk/2014/09/19/glorious-return-crpg
http://www.digitallydownloaded.net/2014/09/interview-developer-looking-to.html
https://docs.google.com/document/d/18jD2UZkHckVIfoosgVG0QQ1cyRrCObgiu3YuBy39bUk/edit

korodullin

It should be noted that the Gold Box AD&D titles were called that because... well... their boxes were gold-colored. As far as I'm aware, the engine never had a formal name.

Aside from that, this looks fairly promising, if absurdly early.

I'm actually glad to see that it's not being crowdfunded, though.

TOGSolid

I remember attempting to play Eye of the Beholder as a kid and getting my shit absolutely wrecked. Colour me interested.

C2B

korodullin wrote: »

It should be noted that the Gold Box AD&D titles were called that because... well... their boxes were gold-colored. As far as I'm aware, the engine never had a formal name.

Aside from that, this looks fairly promising, if absurdly early.

I'm actually glad to see that it's not being crowdfunded, though.

Fixed. I didn't put that much effort in the OP and I'm a bit too young to know that stuff from memory (Though I have played several of them years later) so I'm glad for the correction. Theres probably other stuff wrong too.

Elvenshae

TOGSolid wrote: »

I remember attempting to play Eye of the Beholder as a kid and getting my shit absolutely wrecked. Colour me interested.

EotB is actually a different series; a modern take on EotB is Legends of Grimrock.

C2B

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iz86EjBduV0

Yeah

Yeah

So, apparently its a Kickstarter again. After them removing any indication of crowdfunding from their website AND stating in an interview that they decided against a Kickstarter.


UNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNGGGGGGGG


Yeah, thanks to that piece of astronomicaly bad PR I have once again made a thread that goes against the Kickstarter rule. Should I message Tube now or who?

Fawst

I thought the rule was against linking to a Kickstarter specifically? I guess drop the links to their site if they redirect? Then again, the rule is kind of vague.

Tube

Don't worry about it, not your fault. Besides, there are no direct links.

Drez

I loved Secret of the Silver Blades and Curse of the Azure Bonds. I remember making elaborate maps with graph paper for both. I think that was the second gold box trilogy, right?

I also loved Hillsfar for what it was. But it was in a white box. Same size as the Gold Boxers. Very different game.

I had and completed the SEGA Genesis version of Buck Rogers: Countdown to Doomsday which was actually a Gold Box title (despite neither being D&D nor packaged in a gold box). I begged my dad to buy the PC version and the sequel Matrix Cubed. The PC version of Countdown to Doomsday seemed a billion times harder than the Genesis version so I never got far. But damn it if that wasn't my favorite Gold Box title.

Drez

Did anyone else try to make their own Gold Box Adventure with Unlimited Adventures? That was fun. Never succeeded though.

Auralynx

Drez wrote: »

Did anyone else try to make their own Gold Box Adventure with Unlimited Adventures? That was fun. Never succeeded though.

Yeah, some of my earliest gaming memories involve UA, mostly the downloading-mods version but I did bang on that a bit.

Fawst

I never got to play the original Gold Box games because I didn't have a PC when they came out. I did pick up Strahd's Posession, Stone Prophet and Dark Sun: Shattered Lands (which was quite fun). I remember seeing Azure Bonds and Pool of Radiance being listed for NES but I don't know if either ever came out.

Edit: Pool of Radiance came out on NES but I never found a copy. Azure Bonds did not.

Auralynx

Fawst wrote: »

I never got to play the original Gold Box games because I didn't have a PC when they came out. I did pick up Strahd's Posession, Stone Prophet and Dark Sun: Shattered Lands (which was quite fun). I remember seeing Azure Bonds and Pools of Radiance being listed for NES but I don't know if either ever came out.

Those first two were surprisingly good games for the lack of name-recognition they get. The two Dark Sun ones, not so much.

Docken

SSI reborn huh?

... So... To which dark god of Chaos do I need to sacrifice to get these guys to publish Final Liberation 2?

I am guessing Tzeentch.

As a consolation prize, will also accept People's General 2.

Drake

SSI and SSG is responsible for the monster I have become. Their games are the scorched, blackened iron core of my formative gaming experiences on the computer.

Elvenshae

Drez wrote: »

I loved Secret of the Silver Blades and Curse of the Azure Bonds. I remember making elaborate maps with graph paper for both. I think that was the second gold box trilogy, right?

Nah - that was the first set. The first Gold Box series was Pool of Radiance, Curse of the Azure Bonds, Secret of the Silver Blades, and Pools of Darkness; you could have some ridiculously OP characters if you imported them from one to the other (though paladins and rangers weren't availabing in PoR, only in CotAB onward, so you needed to create new characters if you wanted to take advantage of the new classes). They also did an excellent Dragonlance set - Champions of Krynn, Death Knights of Krynn, and Dark Queen of Krynn.

My favorite Gold Box game was actually Neverwinter Nights.

The Gold Box games were the first ones I ever found and used an exploit in - by firing characters from your party and reloading appropriately, you could easily duplicate items. Good times.

C2B

RPG Codex Interview

http://www.rpgcodex.net/content.php?id=9644

RPG CODEX: Tactical Simulations Interactive (TSI) has more in common with the defunct Strategic Simulations Interactive (SSI) than just the name. Could you give us a run-down of SSI-related personnel involved in this project, and perhaps tell us a little about how you all got together (again) and started this project?

TSI: The top personnel are as follows: Keith Brors and David Shelley created the Seven Dragon Saga role-playing system. David Shelley is acting as Producer/Lead Designer and Paul Murray is our Systems Designer. We've also had some contributions from SSI alumni such as Laura (Bowen) Shelley and Maurine Starkey. Honestly, our passion for these types of games has never wavered and a group of us meet regularly once a week for a tabletop session. David Klein, is a veteran business development executive that has a passionate for RPG's. His desire to see more Gold Box type games was the basis for forming the company. ​

You are adapting your own intellectual property, the Seven Dragon Saga pen and paper system, for your studio's first RPG. It seems a little less traditional than the D&D worlds explored in the GoldBox titles. What can you tell us about Seven Dragon Saga – how it originated and what it's about?

The developers of the Seven Dragon Saga are all long time game industry veterans with a passion for paper and pencil role-playing as well. While giving most new systems a try, the team decided they could do better. Being engineers, the system takes a lot from the algorithms and numerical balancing Keith, Paul, and David use when creating computer games. It has spent many years in development and polishing, so when TSI decided to do an original first title, Seven Dragon Saga was a natural choice.

For a setting, we wanted a world with more color than a classic medieval/Tolkien setting, without tying ourselves down to a specific real world culture. The Empire of the Seven Dragons rules much of the world and recruits powerful characters from all its lands, providing us the chance to create a variety of races. The Firewind Coast, where the first game takes place, has a classic fantasy feel, with more exotic environments and enemies found through exploration in ancient ruins and wastes.

In terms of combat, we decided to create broader, more cinematic moves, while retaining tactical choice. In terms of increased mobility, the opportunity to eliminate multiple opponents, and spectacular spell effects, we create a more visually exciting battlefield, and avoid the static stand and shoot feel of some turn based games. So we have a hybrid of Eastern (wuxia: leaping onto spires, appearing behind the enemy) and Western (Arthurian/Tolkien heavily armored knights, agile Elvish archery) character types, with the ability to customize the exact mix of abilities, and party balance. ​

The early press release told us that Seven Dragon Saga will be turn-based. It also told us it would incorporate terrain advantages and destructible environments. Are you looking at something more dynamic like what Divinity: Original Sin did with its flammable oil patches, extinguishable fires and freezable water? Or will it be more passive, like in the vein of classic strategy games?

We are looking to incorporate additional modern tactical choices, like Divinity: Original Sin offers with its elemental magic, but not to the exclusion of common advantages such as cover, flanking and height advantage. It will be rare that the solution to a battle is simply to light up a pool of oil. Each character's mobility, weapon and armor choices, and details of the environment will determine the best approach to each situation. ​

In the press-release, one bullet-point touches on the importance of choices and consequences in the game. How will these choices be present, and how are you keeping track of the consequences? Will you be using something like a reputation system? Also, will there be any moral or ethical dispositions for characters – something like D&Ds alignment system?

The player's party represents the Empire in a newly conquered land during a time of crisis, so the NPCs on all sides fall into factions, which we will track with a reputation system. Players' choices at critical junctures can also modify the relative strengths of these faction. For instance, if the player liberates a border fort, he may have the option to raise the flag of one faction or another, granting them control of the fortress and surrounding lands. Should they come to regret the choice, another conquest of the fort may be in order.

We are currently balancing out a Goals system for individual characters. During character creation, the player will be able to select from a limited list of Goals. When the resolution of a quest aligns with that character's goals, they receive a benefit. Not all quest resolutions will have the full range of Goal alignment, so simply having a 'Greedy' party will not provide an optimum solution. Choosing a range of sometimes conflicting goals provides the party a potentially greater benefit, but may begin to clash with the player's personal goals, or lead to the alienation of useful factions. ​