Leave it to The Flash to make a Groundhog Day episode without
the "fucking around for shits and giggles"
section.
It's been done. Eureka did it. So did ST Discovery.
But it's rare.
Librarians did one, with the irony being
That the "time loop" turned out to be a video game, where you had things like health packs and rocket jumps, where part of the mystery is figuring out the mechanics.
Unfortunately, it turns out that the level was an escort mission, specifically designed to kill off your companions, so there was no actual room for "fucking around" that didn't also create tremendous survivors guilt for the PC character of having to watch them die over and over again.
I'm amazed S&L made it. While the cast cuts suck, hopefully they can manage it. That show is the most faithful Superman adaptation I can remember since the Timm era.
Yeah, the cast cut is a real bummer. Hopefully they’re able to appear in guest/recurring roles to finish out their stories.
That was my first thought, but the variety article says they all "won't be returning", which sounds like it precludes recurring roles. Maybe there's room for a guest spot or two? But yeah, that's a solid half of the show's ongoing storylines just gone.
Ah, it stinks, it sucks, it's anthropologically unjust
S&L wasn't really part of the Arrowverse, unless later things reattached it. It was pretty clear from what I saw in S1 that while the titular characters had the same actors, it was kind of it's own thing.
Ok, it's been a while, and while I haven't been posting, I've been watching. A lot. Quick count puts it at about 150 episodes in the last four weeks. I haven't posted because there was never a decent break in the story happening at the same time I had sufficient time to write a post.
@amatuerhour, as to how I can manage it, one of the perks of my job, is that as long as I do my job, which is 5-8 hours of actual work in a 12 hour shift, as long as I'm there when needed, the rest of the time is up to me. And working nights, and not having much in the way of social commitments, I can burn through a lot of eps while still not having it completely dominate my free time.
Anyways, on to the reviews. Probably won't get too detailed, let's see how it goes.
Arrow S4E10-23
The Darkh plotline was pretty cheesy, and if it wasn't for the work of McDonough, it'd have been garbage. I've never really understood the philosophy. You've got that much money and power, buy a large enough fucking island, and start your own society. But that's not "entitled enough" apparently. At least Darkh wasn't JAFA (Just another fucking archer). He had some menace in a way we haven't had.
Ruve Darkh gave me real "Margot Kidder" vibes, and it's for good reason (she's her niece).
The Nissa/Malcolm control of the League was interesting enough, as was the decision by Nissa at the end to melt down the ring. No way that doesn't bite someone in the ass.
Normally I don't dislike the island stuff as much as some people do, but the Taiana and Reiter storyline dragged quite a bit.
Felicity dealing with the injury was both heart-tugging and also hilarious at points. Though the end (kinda) of Olicity annoyed me. Can we have a moratorium on "I love you but I can't be with you because X"? Especially as you usually CAN be with them, given some more time.
Flash S2E10-23
I liked the Jay Garrick "persona". Zoom did nothing for me. The actor had charm, but insufficient menace. Also, fuck off with "here's a speedster that worms his way into your life, only to betray you for something you aren't even aware of". And yes, I know what's coming.
I did like the whole Earth 2 stuff, and the dopplegangers.
The alt-Wells, fucking loved it. Being an ornery shithead, but slowly (and I mean slowly) coming around, kinda.
Was good to see Eddie in the flashback.
Eobard is still a dick, and I couldn't identify why I just didn't like him.
The idea of time remnants is pretty interesting (again, I'm a season ahead as of the writing, so yeah). As is the time wraiths, and the speed force continuum.
Cisco is definitely starting to grow on me.
Supergirl S1-20
More development of the main cast. I don't mind that in the first season, establising who these people are.
Alura gets the pointy end. It's one of the few times I don't mind that "need to keep the truth" being a truly understandable motive. And one that doesn't have much repercussion afterwards, as Kara takes out most of her emotional anguish on Hank, which he knew he was taking on.
Indigo... stellar casting, again. But fuck me, the costuming was terrible. I figure they were trying to capture the comics? But the makeup, especially the wig, was godawful. People mock Oliver wigs, but this is way worse than anything so far.
The Barry Allen episode (not really a crossover) was quite fun, getting to revisit some of the newness on both sides, and setting up the multiverse.
The ending was pretty mediocre, and I really didn't like the "lets fly Fort Rozz into space". It sets an upper limit to the character that's just absurd. I know there's shit in the Superman universe of him doing even more, but come on. You want these guys to be at least challenged by your week to week threats.
I'll try and do the LoT some time in the next couple days, and then Arrow S5, Flash S3, Supergirl and Legends S2 over the weekend. I have thoughts.
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
edited November 2023
Fuck Yeah!
I'm up to Arrow S3 and Flash S1 and just did the Arrow vs Flash/Brave and the Bold crossover!
Also that Jay (of Jay and Silent Bob) cameo in the Flash...
I never actually saw Constantine so I'm looking forward to that next
- I loved the reveal that the crew weren’t assembled for their capabilities so much as for their meaningless to the timeframe. And the rejection of that fate, and various forms of bonding.
- I made it clear in previous updates that I love the doofus that is Ray Palmer. Him getting a permanent position in Arrowverse is wonderful. He still gets shat upon, a lot. But he’s so cheerful, that it’s charming, rather than mocking.
- The Vandal Savage arc itself didn’t do much for me. But it’s the band of misfits aspect that’s the main star. That, and the constant 4th wall references (Palmer wanting to be a spy, Snart and Rory whenever there’s talk of prison breaks, and I know it’s in S2, but Stein’s insistance that the designer of the Titanic was an idiot had me giggling)
- I do like the base time travel concept they propose, that time is malleable (takes time to ‘set’), and that it’s to an extent ‘self-correcting’. Just fucking off the concept of the butterfly effect in most cases, and saying unless it’s keypoint issue, circumstances will twist to keep history on course.
- The Chronos reveal did catch me off guard, but I liked it. Rory’s character is initially very one note, but Purcell and the writers definitely give him more depth than I’d have expected.
- I love some of the time consequences, like Ray thinking it’s his work that brings about Per Dagaton’s rise, to find out it’s his brother, Sidney. And Anna Devare Smith as an elder incarnation of Kendra was fun. Then it gets dark when the Pilgrim starts trying to take out members before they grow up, especially the Rory backstory. Though elder Rory repeatedly threatening to kick the shit out of younger Rory had me laugh.
- I love love love Snart going out a hero, justifying Barry’s faith in him (and I’m glad Barry finds out in Invasion). I know Miller continues to play the role on and off, but it was still an awesome moment.
- The resolution of the Savage thing was weird, because if it’s at different points in time, there’s no reason to split up. Because it’s time. I suppose they could have made it clearer that the reason different people needed to kill him was to stop a paradox of sorts, but if that was the case, it wasn’t well explained.
- Also, the solution to the Savage problem was already obvious, with the resolution to the season. Yes, he’s immortal, but he’s not reincarnated like Kendra and Carter. He just heals. Rip has a spaceship capable of throwing an object into the sun. They captured Savage at least once. Get where I’m going? Enjoy being crushed by the intense gravity and being burned alive forever, or at least until the sun eventually burns out, you evil shit.
More recaps of the next season of all four shows, in a day or two.
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
I just got to the part in Arrow S3 where he suits up for the first time and Arrow takes him out in 20 seconds by finding his battery pack.
God Ray is the best, and S3 got us the two panel "Palmer wakes up having an epiphany, he should bang Felicity again" meme
One thing first, the opening narrations are all over the place for me.
- The Arrow ‘someone else, something else’ just gets weird. Initially I liked it, but I dunno, it’s not hitting the same anymore.
- The various Legends putting their own spin on it is fun. Especially when Rory gets a turn.
- The cadence of the Supergirl one is just off-putting. Especially the final ‘I am Supergirl’. Just feels really meh.
- But the Flash one REALLY bothers me. In the significant majority of episodes through S3 (at least until the reveal of Savitar), he’s just NOT the fastest man alive. Reverse-Flash is faster most of the time. As is Zoom. As is Savitar. False branding, dude.
Another thing, I’m pretty sure I mentioned it in the previous recaps in the other thread, outside of the big-tent movies, and modern TV, I have next to no knowledge of the DC Universe. So my takes are seeing all this from a relatively new perspective, not conflicting with the animated universe or the comics themselves.
On to Season A5/F3/S2/L2.
Arrow S5 Pre Invasion
- The building of Team Arrow 2.0. For the most part, I don’t mind the new guys, it was kinda necessary given the departure of half of the original team.
- The season villain, I’ll be honest, early I really had issues, because JAFA (Just Another Fucking Archer). I did enjoy Dorn’s voicework (as I did Tony Todd as Zoom), but was disappointed that it’s a comparatively mediocre white guy behind the mask. They both did satisfactory jobs, and I don’t think Dorn or Todd are up for the physical toll of the role, but it was still a weird step down.
- Arrow 2.0
- - Love Curtis. Is kinda strange that they put him out in the field so often, especially early. Him not wanting to stay behind, I get. But the others all had military or police training, or were legit superpowered. Just felt rushed, and kinda irresponsible.
- - Renee’s impulsiveness/recklessness was a bit frustrating, but he grew on me. Especially later on. Hoss.
- - Liked Ragman. But not as much as I liked Rory, and was disappointed that barring a few cameo eps listed on IMDB, he’s basically done for the universe.
- - Dinah I’ll get to in time.
- While the flashbacks (at least timeframe wise) are almost over, and the story is pretty meh, the casting remains on point, with Lundgren and Meunier bringing a lot. But it’s Nykl that does it for me. As a big fan of Stargate, Zelenka is my favourite recurring character across the entire franchise, and his role as Anatoly made me pay attention where I might have zoned out.
- It was good to see Lawton again, even if it was just a Diggle hallucination. Christopher Chance felt kinda wasted. And while I know it happened second, Freddie Stroma is my Vigilante.
Flash S3 Pre Invasion
- I liked the initial Flashpoint (though really, JAFSpeedster in Rival?), and that it was very butterfly effect. Though with what I said in the Legends S1 recap, it’s weird that the universe has two very different variations on the malleability of time. That it impacts Diggle’s child is weird.
- It took me a moment to figure out who Julian was, and I was really hoping they wouldn’t villanize him. The reveal made me really mad, but then the subversion (later) made me really happy. Will bring it back in the post Invasion recap.
- E2 Wells and Jesse Quick are always a welcome sight, though the enviousness of Wally that he didn’t get speed was a bit annoying.
- E19 Wells is really awesome (as were the rejected applicants), and I do wonder what Cavanaugh thought of just repeated variations of Wells (I have seen the Council of Wells). ‘Yeah, you’re going to be a series regular, but we’re going to keep resetting your character and have him be totally different people’. Seems like it’d be fun.
- E19 being an intellectual fraud was awesome.
- I liked the concept of Alkemy. It’s good that the season villain isn’t JAFS. Except whoops, it is. Except whoops on me, it’s an understandable choice. But that’s for later.
- Cisco comes across as a bit of a wanker with regards Barry’s refusal to save Dante, but I’m not sure most people in his shoes wouldn’t resent it at least a little bit.
- Caitlin’s struggle with Frost is fairly tropey, but I think Panabaker does a good job with what could have been a very tired storyline.
Legends S2 Pre Invasion
- Initially didn’t like Nate, but he and Palmer being nerds definitely grew on me. The various bondings (especially Palmer and Rory) continue to delight me.
- Doof is just such a frikkin hero. Saving Nate and giving him superpowers, and then giving up his exosuit the next episode, and yet for the most part, continues to remain upbeat and do the right thing.
- The JSA stuff was interesting, but the not-yet-titled Legion of Doom stuff was da bomb. But more on that later.
- As was pointed out prior to my binge watch (and along with the crossovers, inspired me to binge watch), the show has started to get absurd. Zombie Confederacy? Awesome.
- Which lead to Jackson having a very pointed moment, and while Sara came to terms with the decision point regarding her sister, this is one of the first of things as yet-named motto of ‘screwing things up, for the better’, where they realize they’re fucking with time, but fuck it, sometimes history deserves to be better.
Supergirl S2
- I have previously watched Superman & Lois (as I was assured it was mostly out of continuity with Arrowverse, which it proved to be). But dang does Tyler Hoechlin rule as Clark/Superman. I understand him not being a full time cast, but he hits it out of the park.
- Cat Grant’s infatuation with Clark is just hilarious. She was entirely unflappable the entire first season, but she just melts in his presence. It’s awesome, and I don’t blame her.
- I get it’s tradition and lore, but fuck me, I’m tired of the constant obviousness. Arrow gets JAFA, Flash gets JAFS, Supergirl apparently gets JAFBillionaire for the first half of the season, and JAFKryptonian (Daxamite, whatever, more on that later) for the second half. At least last year it was Lord. This year it’s another Luther? Fuck off. Even if Brenda Strong does a good job.
- Kara’s boss was just annoying and tropey.
- Olsen becoming Guardian just felt meh. I get wanting to do more, but running around beating up petty criminals, rather than using the resources at your disposal (investigative journalism would do more to fixing issues). I loved Winn as ‘the guy in the van’ though.
- I know some people find it PC etc, but I liked the Alex revelation. I am all for more representation on television, especially someone strong and competent (rather than the comedic sidekick), if not the lead. Arrow has Curtis, and Legends has Sara. But it’s more central to the story on Supergirl.
- Mon-El should be a tired trope, but I find the earnestness of the actor compelling enough. The laziness does lampshade the reveal of his true identity, which I liked.
- John and M’gann, I liked what they’re doing here, and I like what I think is coming (I’m about a season ahead, just catching up on recaps, but the story hasn’t fully resolved yet).
INVASION!
- Kinda weird that the Supergirl entry was a couple of unidentified wooshes (™ Stargate) throughout, and two minutes at the end of the episode. Though apparently that was due to the change from CBS to CW and still getting up to speed, so it’s understandable.
- Aliens! Ones that don’t look human! Interesting.
- Ep1 (Flash), the team gets together, and are introduced to Kara. I loved her taking Oliver’s ‘dont hold back’, and kicking nine shades of shit out of them without breaking a sweat, while being completely Kara about it.
- The brainwash thing allowed for some fun times, even if it’s an overused thing. Also wish they’d explained it affecting Kara a bit more. It’s revealed later in the Arrowverse that Dominators and Kryponians know each other, but a more explicit showing of that, so that a Kryptonian brain being affected in the same way as a human brain feels intentional.
- Ep2 (Arrow) I know the ‘paradise VR’ thing has been overused, but like timetravel or groundhog day, I don’t mind it if things are done well. And I really enjoyed it.
- Even though he was mentioned in passing (and as usual, with an in-joke about him being a doctor in Chicago, a role the actor was in at the time), and as a hologram, I’m disappointed they couldn’t get Tommy Merlyn back.
- Ep 3 (Legends) Couldn’t be a Legends episode without timetravel. I liked most of it, from the Dominators having appeared before, to the man in glasses in Ep 2 being the same one responsible for everything that happened in Ep 3, to the ‘are humans the bad guys’ torturing of the Dominators, to wondering if Glasses knew the Doominator’s plans to wipe out metahumans, would he have even opposed them? Bigotry often makes for strange bedfellows.
- Another instance of ‘screwing things up, for the better’ with Stein’s daughter. Given she was helpful, perhaps instrumental, in the victory, I was glad they figured out a way to keep her in existence.
Anyway, that’s it for now. I’ve still got some catching up to do, so I’ll try and finish out S5/3/2/2 recap tomorrow, by which I’ll have finished the viewing of Crisis, and pre-Crisis 6/4/3/3. Hopefully I can get that done before I finish out those seasons, so I'm not actually behind.
MorganV on
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
I'm about 2 seasons behind you on all of it right now, I haven't started legends yet, but I'm on S4E1 of Arrow, and S2E1 of Flash, and starting Constantine this weekend.
Thoughts on your posts:
- The Diggle kid thing was kinda weak, I'm assuming it was an easy casting swap to make, and it's purpose is to show Barry can affect people that aren't himself through time travel, but I feel like LoT does this MUCH better later on, personally.
- Ragman is my favorite. Such a unique character for the arrowverse.
- S2 of Supergirl is my favorite because it has the best TV superman alongside a show that is no longer on NBC so it's storylines are now connected better through a lower CW budget.
I'm about 2 seasons behind you on all of it right now, I haven't started legends yet, but I'm on S4E1 of Arrow, and S2E1 of Flash, and starting Constantine this weekend.
Thoughts on your posts:
- The Diggle kid thing was kinda weak, I'm assuming it was an easy casting swap to make, and it's purpose is to show Barry can affect people that aren't himself through time travel, but I feel like LoT does this MUCH better later on, personally.
- Ragman is my favorite. Such a unique character for the arrowverse.
- S2 of Supergirl is my favorite because it has the best TV superman alongside a show that is no longer on NBC so it's storylines are now connected better through a lower CW budget.
Part of the Diggle change might have been because they needed to retcon things because the Legends met Connor Hawke/John Diggle Jr in 2042, airing on Feb 25, 2016, with Flashpoint happening nearly 8 months later. I mean, they could have just given Dig another child, but this hit two birds.
The only fault I have with Hoechlin is his limited screen time. Because I want more of that Clark/Kal. I want all of it. And really enjoy S&L.
MorganV on
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
I still haven't watched the last season (or two?) of Superman and Lois. I'm saving them for my end of Arrowverse watch so I can enjoy them like I did S3 of Picard.
I still haven't watched the last season (or two?) of Superman and Lois. I'm saving them for my end of Arrowverse watch so I can enjoy them like I did S3 of Picard.
Me too. I paused S3 at a mid point (a very specific reveal), because I wanted to watch the rest of the season on a binge. Then when I heard S4 was going to be the last, I figured I'd binge just before that, so that I can end the Arrowverse with a bow (the present decoration, not the thing that shoots pointy bits).
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
Hey if you ever decide to take up archery, I did because of this show, and learned how to like make bows from actual trees, so I'm happy to help with that.
Hey if you ever decide to take up archery, I did because of this show, and learned how to like make bows from actual trees, so I'm happy to help with that.
I've got a medium weight draw compound bow (and a dozen or so target arrows) in the garage. The shoulder on my drawing arm is pretty jacked up at the moment (I'm old and have been for a while, so it's not healing quickly). And my opportunity to shoot is probably gone due to work and transport conditions (carrying a bow on a motorcycle wouldn't be fun without Arrowverse customizations, and I'm not willing to do that, and I don't think the police would approve).
I used to fence too, and that's definitely a hobby that I've aged out of. My knees, especially on my forward leg, are fucked for action sports, but not so bad that they disrupt my regular life, that I'm willing to take several months off work.
I used to climb too. Rock climbing, and some precursor parkour (before I knew it was a thing). But age, and an extra 80lb makes that a dumb fucking idea.
Helpful hint for the young 'uns. Don't get old. Keep staying young. Aging is not as fun as it looks. But I'm not resentful. I managed to do most of what I wanted to during my youth, and I don't have any real desire to relive it outside of my own memory.
I love these "watching for the first time and here's my thoughts" posts. I loved the Trek ones and these are no worse. I hope someone gets the bug to do a Stargate one too at some point
It's giving a bit of the "getting to watch for the first time, something I've watched several times" vibe.
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
Hey if you ever decide to take up archery, I did because of this show, and learned how to like make bows from actual trees, so I'm happy to help with that.
I've got a medium weight draw compound bow (and a dozen or so target arrows) in the garage. The shoulder on my drawing arm is pretty jacked up at the moment (I'm old and have been for a while, so it's not healing quickly). And my opportunity to shoot is probably gone due to work and transport conditions (carrying a bow on a motorcycle wouldn't be fun without Arrowverse customizations, and I'm not willing to do that, and I don't think the police would approve).
I used to fence too, and that's definitely a hobby that I've aged out of. My knees, especially on my forward leg, are fucked for action sports, but not so bad that they disrupt my regular life, that I'm willing to take several months off work.
I used to climb too. Rock climbing, and some precursor parkour (before I knew it was a thing). But age, and an extra 80lb makes that a dumb fucking idea.
Helpful hint for the young 'uns. Don't get old. Keep staying young. Aging is not as fun as it looks. But I'm not resentful. I managed to do most of what I wanted to during my youth, and I don't have any real desire to relive it outside of my own memory.
bruh I have 33 acres and run around like old Robin at 40 from this:
I love these "watching for the first time and here's my thoughts" posts. I loved the Trek ones and these are no worse. I hope someone gets the bug to do a Stargate one too at some point
It's giving a bit of the "getting to watch for the first time, something I've watched several times" vibe.
I can tell y'all I'll never do Stargate and I already did (most of) Farscape
I kinda wanna go back and do like the Kyle X/Y and Roswell and Smallville shit maybe?
I know a guy that worked with my wife, and he was in a band that did some licensed music for one of those shows, and now they're the warm-up band for an NFL team and just get paid to fly around and be localized rock stars from Nashville.
Smallville I'm sorta getting via Talkville with Rosenbaum and Welling going through it.
Why wouldn't you do Stargate (not that it's a problem, just curious)
Honestly, the next three months will prolly be Arrowverse, and super Honestly, I've never felt Stargate needed a series past the movie. Stargate is kinda Indiana Jones where it exists without Kurt Russell or not, and I feel like The Expanse (edit: books) did it more accurately.
Smallville I'm sorta getting via Talkville with Rosenbaum and Welling going through it.
Why wouldn't you do Stargate (not that it's a problem, just curious)
Honestly, the next three months will prolly be Arrowverse, and super Honestly, I've never felt Stargate needed a series past the movie. Stargate is kinda Indiana Jones where it exists without Kurt Russell or not, and I feel like The Expanse (edit: books) did it more accurately.
Fair enough on the time thing. As to Stargate I love me the movie quite a bit, the series does a REALLY good job of feeling like a continuation of the movie (to the point the principal two characters really feel like their movie versions) and then turns into it's own thing. If you haven't seen it, SG-1 especially REALLY takes a strong premise and just knocks it out of the park (S1 has a lot of the 90's sci fi TV issues, but it gets a lot better quickly). If you like Star Trek, Sliders, etc, you will almost certainly like SG-1.
EDIT: Just to add on, I had a VERY similar opinion as you before I watched it, and then I finally sat down with SG-1 and have never looked back. It in fact is right up there with Trek for me (to some degree I find the Stargate universe and the Trek universe to be like, siblings in that regard).
Smallville I'm sorta getting via Talkville with Rosenbaum and Welling going through it.
Why wouldn't you do Stargate (not that it's a problem, just curious)
Honestly, the next three months will prolly be Arrowverse, and super Honestly, I've never felt Stargate needed a series past the movie. Stargate is kinda Indiana Jones where it exists without Kurt Russell or not, and I feel like The Expanse (edit: books) did it more accurately.
Stargate SG-1 and following shows functionally have no connection to the movie itself. The stories are entirely divorced from each other in any meaningful sense. If you like goofy increasingly serialized scifi that has a lot of problematic early season stories then it is worth checking out on its own merits.
Smallville I'm sorta getting via Talkville with Rosenbaum and Welling going through it.
Why wouldn't you do Stargate (not that it's a problem, just curious)
Honestly, the next three months will prolly be Arrowverse, and super Honestly, I've never felt Stargate needed a series past the movie. Stargate is kinda Indiana Jones where it exists without Kurt Russell or not, and I feel like The Expanse (edit: books) did it more accurately.
Stargate SG-1 and following shows functionally have no connection to the movie itself. The stories are entirely divorced from each other in any meaningful sense. If you like goofy increasingly serialized scifi that has a lot of problematic early season stories then it is worth checking out on its own merits.
That's not really true. The first episode is almost essentially a sequel/hand off to the series, and events from the movie still manage to influence the series for a number of seasons. But yeah, the separation is a thing.
Smallville I'm sorta getting via Talkville with Rosenbaum and Welling going through it.
Why wouldn't you do Stargate (not that it's a problem, just curious)
I am waiting for them to get deeper into the series so I can do a Smallville rewatch paired with a Talkville listen.
Im thinking of doing the same with Supernatural and the "Chuck and Gabriel" podcast.
Loved it with Good Place.
I really wish Peter DeLuise and Gary Jones would do a Stargate one. There was a period on the DVD commentaries where they'd do them and meander off strictly talking about the episode a bit, and going in depth on other aspects of tge franchise. Having that as a podcast format would be cool.
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https://variety.com/2023/tv/news/gotham-knights-canceled-cw-renews-superman-and-lois-all-american-homecoming-1235641833/
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Librarians did one, with the irony being
Unfortunately, it turns out that the level was an escort mission, specifically designed to kill off your companions, so there was no actual room for "fucking around" that didn't also create tremendous survivors guilt for the PC character of having to watch them die over and over again.
Great news for Superman & Lois! Hopefully we’ll see Jordan go full Superboy.
I’m sad for people who enjoyed Gotham Knights, but I was not one of them. It felt like bad fanfiction.
Sexy bat-teens hanging out in a school is one of my favorite genres of bad fanfiction.
https://deadline.com/2023/06/superman-amp-lois-dylan-walsh-emmanuelle-chriqui-michael-cudlitz-promoted-regular-1235417430/
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That was my first thought, but the variety article says they all "won't be returning", which sounds like it precludes recurring roles. Maybe there's room for a guest spot or two? But yeah, that's a solid half of the show's ongoing storylines just gone.
Apparently they're moving to Metropolis so any Smallville characters will just stay there.
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Ah, I figured Supes was just packing up the family and moving to the fortress of solitude.
"Bottle episode? We can make a bottle season!"
Kandor confirmed?
https://tvline.com/news/superman-and-lois-cancelled-ending-season-4-the-cw-1235069776/
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S&L wasn't really part of the Arrowverse, unless later things reattached it. It was pretty clear from what I saw in S1 that while the titular characters had the same actors, it was kind of it's own thing.
Awesome, I'll bring my stuff over to this one, rather than feeling guilty about choking up the DCEU thread.
@amatuerhour, as to how I can manage it, one of the perks of my job, is that as long as I do my job, which is 5-8 hours of actual work in a 12 hour shift, as long as I'm there when needed, the rest of the time is up to me. And working nights, and not having much in the way of social commitments, I can burn through a lot of eps while still not having it completely dominate my free time.
Anyways, on to the reviews. Probably won't get too detailed, let's see how it goes.
Arrow S4E10-23
The Darkh plotline was pretty cheesy, and if it wasn't for the work of McDonough, it'd have been garbage. I've never really understood the philosophy. You've got that much money and power, buy a large enough fucking island, and start your own society. But that's not "entitled enough" apparently. At least Darkh wasn't JAFA (Just another fucking archer). He had some menace in a way we haven't had.
Ruve Darkh gave me real "Margot Kidder" vibes, and it's for good reason (she's her niece).
The Nissa/Malcolm control of the League was interesting enough, as was the decision by Nissa at the end to melt down the ring. No way that doesn't bite someone in the ass.
Normally I don't dislike the island stuff as much as some people do, but the Taiana and Reiter storyline dragged quite a bit.
Felicity dealing with the injury was both heart-tugging and also hilarious at points. Though the end (kinda) of Olicity annoyed me. Can we have a moratorium on "I love you but I can't be with you because X"? Especially as you usually CAN be with them, given some more time.
Flash S2E10-23
I liked the Jay Garrick "persona". Zoom did nothing for me. The actor had charm, but insufficient menace. Also, fuck off with "here's a speedster that worms his way into your life, only to betray you for something you aren't even aware of". And yes, I know what's coming.
I did like the whole Earth 2 stuff, and the dopplegangers.
The alt-Wells, fucking loved it. Being an ornery shithead, but slowly (and I mean slowly) coming around, kinda.
Was good to see Eddie in the flashback.
Eobard is still a dick, and I couldn't identify why I just didn't like him.
The idea of time remnants is pretty interesting (again, I'm a season ahead as of the writing, so yeah). As is the time wraiths, and the speed force continuum.
Cisco is definitely starting to grow on me.
Supergirl S1-20
More development of the main cast. I don't mind that in the first season, establising who these people are.
Alura gets the pointy end. It's one of the few times I don't mind that "need to keep the truth" being a truly understandable motive. And one that doesn't have much repercussion afterwards, as Kara takes out most of her emotional anguish on Hank, which he knew he was taking on.
Indigo... stellar casting, again. But fuck me, the costuming was terrible. I figure they were trying to capture the comics? But the makeup, especially the wig, was godawful. People mock Oliver wigs, but this is way worse than anything so far.
The Barry Allen episode (not really a crossover) was quite fun, getting to revisit some of the newness on both sides, and setting up the multiverse.
The ending was pretty mediocre, and I really didn't like the "lets fly Fort Rozz into space". It sets an upper limit to the character that's just absurd. I know there's shit in the Superman universe of him doing even more, but come on. You want these guys to be at least challenged by your week to week threats.
I'll try and do the LoT some time in the next couple days, and then Arrow S5, Flash S3, Supergirl and Legends S2 over the weekend. I have thoughts.
I'm up to Arrow S3 and Flash S1 and just did the Arrow vs Flash/Brave and the Bold crossover!
Also that Jay (of Jay and Silent Bob) cameo in the Flash...
I never actually saw Constantine so I'm looking forward to that next
- I loved the reveal that the crew weren’t assembled for their capabilities so much as for their meaningless to the timeframe. And the rejection of that fate, and various forms of bonding.
- I made it clear in previous updates that I love the doofus that is Ray Palmer. Him getting a permanent position in Arrowverse is wonderful. He still gets shat upon, a lot. But he’s so cheerful, that it’s charming, rather than mocking.
- The Vandal Savage arc itself didn’t do much for me. But it’s the band of misfits aspect that’s the main star. That, and the constant 4th wall references (Palmer wanting to be a spy, Snart and Rory whenever there’s talk of prison breaks, and I know it’s in S2, but Stein’s insistance that the designer of the Titanic was an idiot had me giggling)
- I do like the base time travel concept they propose, that time is malleable (takes time to ‘set’), and that it’s to an extent ‘self-correcting’. Just fucking off the concept of the butterfly effect in most cases, and saying unless it’s keypoint issue, circumstances will twist to keep history on course.
- The Chronos reveal did catch me off guard, but I liked it. Rory’s character is initially very one note, but Purcell and the writers definitely give him more depth than I’d have expected.
- I love some of the time consequences, like Ray thinking it’s his work that brings about Per Dagaton’s rise, to find out it’s his brother, Sidney. And Anna Devare Smith as an elder incarnation of Kendra was fun. Then it gets dark when the Pilgrim starts trying to take out members before they grow up, especially the Rory backstory. Though elder Rory repeatedly threatening to kick the shit out of younger Rory had me laugh.
- I love love love Snart going out a hero, justifying Barry’s faith in him (and I’m glad Barry finds out in Invasion). I know Miller continues to play the role on and off, but it was still an awesome moment.
- The resolution of the Savage thing was weird, because if it’s at different points in time, there’s no reason to split up. Because it’s time. I suppose they could have made it clearer that the reason different people needed to kill him was to stop a paradox of sorts, but if that was the case, it wasn’t well explained.
- Also, the solution to the Savage problem was already obvious, with the resolution to the season. Yes, he’s immortal, but he’s not reincarnated like Kendra and Carter. He just heals. Rip has a spaceship capable of throwing an object into the sun. They captured Savage at least once. Get where I’m going? Enjoy being crushed by the intense gravity and being burned alive forever, or at least until the sun eventually burns out, you evil shit.
More recaps of the next season of all four shows, in a day or two.
God Ray is the best, and S3 got us the two panel "Palmer wakes up having an epiphany, he should bang Felicity again" meme
- The Arrow ‘someone else, something else’ just gets weird. Initially I liked it, but I dunno, it’s not hitting the same anymore.
- The various Legends putting their own spin on it is fun. Especially when Rory gets a turn.
- The cadence of the Supergirl one is just off-putting. Especially the final ‘I am Supergirl’. Just feels really meh.
- But the Flash one REALLY bothers me. In the significant majority of episodes through S3 (at least until the reveal of Savitar), he’s just NOT the fastest man alive. Reverse-Flash is faster most of the time. As is Zoom. As is Savitar. False branding, dude.
Another thing, I’m pretty sure I mentioned it in the previous recaps in the other thread, outside of the big-tent movies, and modern TV, I have next to no knowledge of the DC Universe. So my takes are seeing all this from a relatively new perspective, not conflicting with the animated universe or the comics themselves.
On to Season A5/F3/S2/L2.
Arrow S5 Pre Invasion
- The building of Team Arrow 2.0. For the most part, I don’t mind the new guys, it was kinda necessary given the departure of half of the original team.
- The season villain, I’ll be honest, early I really had issues, because JAFA (Just Another Fucking Archer). I did enjoy Dorn’s voicework (as I did Tony Todd as Zoom), but was disappointed that it’s a comparatively mediocre white guy behind the mask. They both did satisfactory jobs, and I don’t think Dorn or Todd are up for the physical toll of the role, but it was still a weird step down.
- Arrow 2.0
- - Love Curtis. Is kinda strange that they put him out in the field so often, especially early. Him not wanting to stay behind, I get. But the others all had military or police training, or were legit superpowered. Just felt rushed, and kinda irresponsible.
- - Renee’s impulsiveness/recklessness was a bit frustrating, but he grew on me. Especially later on. Hoss.
- - Liked Ragman. But not as much as I liked Rory, and was disappointed that barring a few cameo eps listed on IMDB, he’s basically done for the universe.
- - Dinah I’ll get to in time.
- While the flashbacks (at least timeframe wise) are almost over, and the story is pretty meh, the casting remains on point, with Lundgren and Meunier bringing a lot. But it’s Nykl that does it for me. As a big fan of Stargate, Zelenka is my favourite recurring character across the entire franchise, and his role as Anatoly made me pay attention where I might have zoned out.
- It was good to see Lawton again, even if it was just a Diggle hallucination. Christopher Chance felt kinda wasted. And while I know it happened second, Freddie Stroma is my Vigilante.
Flash S3 Pre Invasion
- I liked the initial Flashpoint (though really, JAFSpeedster in Rival?), and that it was very butterfly effect. Though with what I said in the Legends S1 recap, it’s weird that the universe has two very different variations on the malleability of time. That it impacts Diggle’s child is weird.
- It took me a moment to figure out who Julian was, and I was really hoping they wouldn’t villanize him. The reveal made me really mad, but then the subversion (later) made me really happy. Will bring it back in the post Invasion recap.
- E2 Wells and Jesse Quick are always a welcome sight, though the enviousness of Wally that he didn’t get speed was a bit annoying.
- E19 Wells is really awesome (as were the rejected applicants), and I do wonder what Cavanaugh thought of just repeated variations of Wells (I have seen the Council of Wells). ‘Yeah, you’re going to be a series regular, but we’re going to keep resetting your character and have him be totally different people’. Seems like it’d be fun.
- E19 being an intellectual fraud was awesome.
- I liked the concept of Alkemy. It’s good that the season villain isn’t JAFS. Except whoops, it is. Except whoops on me, it’s an understandable choice. But that’s for later.
- Cisco comes across as a bit of a wanker with regards Barry’s refusal to save Dante, but I’m not sure most people in his shoes wouldn’t resent it at least a little bit.
- Caitlin’s struggle with Frost is fairly tropey, but I think Panabaker does a good job with what could have been a very tired storyline.
Legends S2 Pre Invasion
- Initially didn’t like Nate, but he and Palmer being nerds definitely grew on me. The various bondings (especially Palmer and Rory) continue to delight me.
- Doof is just such a frikkin hero. Saving Nate and giving him superpowers, and then giving up his exosuit the next episode, and yet for the most part, continues to remain upbeat and do the right thing.
- The JSA stuff was interesting, but the not-yet-titled Legion of Doom stuff was da bomb. But more on that later.
- As was pointed out prior to my binge watch (and along with the crossovers, inspired me to binge watch), the show has started to get absurd. Zombie Confederacy? Awesome.
- Which lead to Jackson having a very pointed moment, and while Sara came to terms with the decision point regarding her sister, this is one of the first of things as yet-named motto of ‘screwing things up, for the better’, where they realize they’re fucking with time, but fuck it, sometimes history deserves to be better.
Supergirl S2
- I have previously watched Superman & Lois (as I was assured it was mostly out of continuity with Arrowverse, which it proved to be). But dang does Tyler Hoechlin rule as Clark/Superman. I understand him not being a full time cast, but he hits it out of the park.
- Cat Grant’s infatuation with Clark is just hilarious. She was entirely unflappable the entire first season, but she just melts in his presence. It’s awesome, and I don’t blame her.
- I get it’s tradition and lore, but fuck me, I’m tired of the constant obviousness. Arrow gets JAFA, Flash gets JAFS, Supergirl apparently gets JAFBillionaire for the first half of the season, and JAFKryptonian (Daxamite, whatever, more on that later) for the second half. At least last year it was Lord. This year it’s another Luther? Fuck off. Even if Brenda Strong does a good job.
- Kara’s boss was just annoying and tropey.
- Olsen becoming Guardian just felt meh. I get wanting to do more, but running around beating up petty criminals, rather than using the resources at your disposal (investigative journalism would do more to fixing issues). I loved Winn as ‘the guy in the van’ though.
- I know some people find it PC etc, but I liked the Alex revelation. I am all for more representation on television, especially someone strong and competent (rather than the comedic sidekick), if not the lead. Arrow has Curtis, and Legends has Sara. But it’s more central to the story on Supergirl.
- Mon-El should be a tired trope, but I find the earnestness of the actor compelling enough. The laziness does lampshade the reveal of his true identity, which I liked.
- John and M’gann, I liked what they’re doing here, and I like what I think is coming (I’m about a season ahead, just catching up on recaps, but the story hasn’t fully resolved yet).
INVASION!
- Kinda weird that the Supergirl entry was a couple of unidentified wooshes (™ Stargate) throughout, and two minutes at the end of the episode. Though apparently that was due to the change from CBS to CW and still getting up to speed, so it’s understandable.
- Aliens! Ones that don’t look human! Interesting.
- Ep1 (Flash), the team gets together, and are introduced to Kara. I loved her taking Oliver’s ‘dont hold back’, and kicking nine shades of shit out of them without breaking a sweat, while being completely Kara about it.
- The brainwash thing allowed for some fun times, even if it’s an overused thing. Also wish they’d explained it affecting Kara a bit more. It’s revealed later in the Arrowverse that Dominators and Kryponians know each other, but a more explicit showing of that, so that a Kryptonian brain being affected in the same way as a human brain feels intentional.
- Ep2 (Arrow) I know the ‘paradise VR’ thing has been overused, but like timetravel or groundhog day, I don’t mind it if things are done well. And I really enjoyed it.
- Even though he was mentioned in passing (and as usual, with an in-joke about him being a doctor in Chicago, a role the actor was in at the time), and as a hologram, I’m disappointed they couldn’t get Tommy Merlyn back.
- Ep 3 (Legends) Couldn’t be a Legends episode without timetravel. I liked most of it, from the Dominators having appeared before, to the man in glasses in Ep 2 being the same one responsible for everything that happened in Ep 3, to the ‘are humans the bad guys’ torturing of the Dominators, to wondering if Glasses knew the Doominator’s plans to wipe out metahumans, would he have even opposed them? Bigotry often makes for strange bedfellows.
- Another instance of ‘screwing things up, for the better’ with Stein’s daughter. Given she was helpful, perhaps instrumental, in the victory, I was glad they figured out a way to keep her in existence.
Anyway, that’s it for now. I’ve still got some catching up to do, so I’ll try and finish out S5/3/2/2 recap tomorrow, by which I’ll have finished the viewing of Crisis, and pre-Crisis 6/4/3/3. Hopefully I can get that done before I finish out those seasons, so I'm not actually behind.
Thoughts on your posts:
- The Diggle kid thing was kinda weak, I'm assuming it was an easy casting swap to make, and it's purpose is to show Barry can affect people that aren't himself through time travel, but I feel like LoT does this MUCH better later on, personally.
- Ragman is my favorite. Such a unique character for the arrowverse.
- S2 of Supergirl is my favorite because it has the best TV superman alongside a show that is no longer on NBC so it's storylines are now connected better through a lower CW budget.
Part of the Diggle change might have been because they needed to retcon things because the Legends met Connor Hawke/John Diggle Jr in 2042, airing on Feb 25, 2016, with Flashpoint happening nearly 8 months later. I mean, they could have just given Dig another child, but this hit two birds.
The only fault I have with Hoechlin is his limited screen time. Because I want more of that Clark/Kal. I want all of it. And really enjoy S&L.
Me too. I paused S3 at a mid point (a very specific reveal), because I wanted to watch the rest of the season on a binge. Then when I heard S4 was going to be the last, I figured I'd binge just before that, so that I can end the Arrowverse with a bow (the present decoration, not the thing that shoots pointy bits).
I've got a medium weight draw compound bow (and a dozen or so target arrows) in the garage. The shoulder on my drawing arm is pretty jacked up at the moment (I'm old and have been for a while, so it's not healing quickly). And my opportunity to shoot is probably gone due to work and transport conditions (carrying a bow on a motorcycle wouldn't be fun without Arrowverse customizations, and I'm not willing to do that, and I don't think the police would approve).
I used to fence too, and that's definitely a hobby that I've aged out of. My knees, especially on my forward leg, are fucked for action sports, but not so bad that they disrupt my regular life, that I'm willing to take several months off work.
I used to climb too. Rock climbing, and some precursor parkour (before I knew it was a thing). But age, and an extra 80lb makes that a dumb fucking idea.
Helpful hint for the young 'uns. Don't get old. Keep staying young. Aging is not as fun as it looks. But I'm not resentful. I managed to do most of what I wanted to during my youth, and I don't have any real desire to relive it outside of my own memory.
It's giving a bit of the "getting to watch for the first time, something I've watched several times" vibe.
bruh I have 33 acres and run around like old Robin at 40 from this:
also there's this 70 year old that bikes every day and can't remember me but still does it every single fucking day.
Old ain't shit anymore. Get back into it. I've got a slipped disc.
I can tell y'all I'll never do Stargate and I already did (most of) Farscape
I kinda wanna go back and do like the Kyle X/Y and Roswell and Smallville shit maybe?
I know a guy that worked with my wife, and he was in a band that did some licensed music for one of those shows, and now they're the warm-up band for an NFL team and just get paid to fly around and be localized rock stars from Nashville.
Why wouldn't you do Stargate (not that it's a problem, just curious)
Honestly, the next three months will prolly be Arrowverse, and super Honestly, I've never felt Stargate needed a series past the movie. Stargate is kinda Indiana Jones where it exists without Kurt Russell or not, and I feel like The Expanse (edit: books) did it more accurately.
Fair enough on the time thing. As to Stargate I love me the movie quite a bit, the series does a REALLY good job of feeling like a continuation of the movie (to the point the principal two characters really feel like their movie versions) and then turns into it's own thing. If you haven't seen it, SG-1 especially REALLY takes a strong premise and just knocks it out of the park (S1 has a lot of the 90's sci fi TV issues, but it gets a lot better quickly). If you like Star Trek, Sliders, etc, you will almost certainly like SG-1.
EDIT: Just to add on, I had a VERY similar opinion as you before I watched it, and then I finally sat down with SG-1 and have never looked back. It in fact is right up there with Trek for me (to some degree I find the Stargate universe and the Trek universe to be like, siblings in that regard).
Stargate SG-1 and following shows functionally have no connection to the movie itself. The stories are entirely divorced from each other in any meaningful sense. If you like goofy increasingly serialized scifi that has a lot of problematic early season stories then it is worth checking out on its own merits.
That's not really true. The first episode is almost essentially a sequel/hand off to the series, and events from the movie still manage to influence the series for a number of seasons. But yeah, the separation is a thing.
I am waiting for them to get deeper into the series so I can do a Smallville rewatch paired with a Talkville listen.
Im thinking of doing the same with Supernatural and the "Chuck and Gabriel" podcast.
Loved it with Good Place.
I really wish Peter DeLuise and Gary Jones would do a Stargate one. There was a period on the DVD commentaries where they'd do them and meander off strictly talking about the episode a bit, and going in depth on other aspects of tge franchise. Having that as a podcast format would be cool.