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    BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    (Editor's note: CAUTION, this is a spacepost. Worse, this is a space business post. Turn back now. Abandon all hope ye who enter here.)

    Yaaaay

    Senate subcommittee vastly underfunded Commercial Crew (SpaceX Dragon v2, ULA, etc) in favour of additional funding for NASAs super-big overly-complicated, super-expensive proprietary launcher

    I am totally super pleased about this, totally ...

    Yaaaay

    You can also tell that I operate with no bias when I report on spaceflight news >_>

    The good news (for privatized spaceflight) is that a sweeping amendment has been put forth that could balance the numbers a little bit, though it is apparently unlikely to gain traction :(

    I've never spoken about NASA's super-heavy launch vehicle proposal , mostly because it's never flown (I tend not to get too excited until I see a thing do the thing it promised it could do). And while I do appreciate and recognize the need for a super-heavy lifter (which no commercial enterprise currently supplies - ULA operates the launch vehicle with the most capability, the Delta IV Heavy , while anything heavier flies on the ESA's Ariane V or on a Russian vehicle), I had hoped that it's development would not come at the expense of the Commercial Crew program.

    This is hardly a death knell, but it's certainly a financial setback - things move slower when there aren't dollars to grease the wheels!

    Development for the Space Launch System includes development of the Orion spacecraft which is pretty cool, I guess.

    It's no Dragon.

  • Options
    TavTav Irish Minister for DefenceRegistered User regular
    Julius wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Quid wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Neco wrote: »
    Of course, I pretty much go into immediate eye rolling exhaustion whenever I hear someone decry society for being too "PC"

    just like they do when told not to say something

    it's exhausting to have to fight for every word out of everyone's mouth, in either direction

    I can explain why it's a jerk move to call gay men effeminate. I can point out the long history of them dealing with being called not "real" men and the stereotypes that got attached to emphasize that. I'm not mindlessly saying "Don't say that" I can actually back up my reasoning. I doubt Jerry can do the same for his fear of the pc police.

    It sucks that someone somewhere probably did a terrible job of explaining themselves to Jerry. It doesn't change that Jerry insisting on continuing that stereotype is insensitive and turns people off.

    Except he can in his first interview when he explicitly states an example of why he thinks the way he does
    He continued, "I'll give you an example: My daughter's 14. My wife says to her, 'Well, you know, in the next couple years, I think maybe you’re going to want to be hanging around the city more on the weekends, so you can see boys.' You know what my daughter says? She says, ‘That’s sexist.’"

    Seinfeld said college students don't understand racism and sexism. "They just want to use these words: 'That’s racist;' 'That’s sexist;' 'That’s prejudice.' They don’t even know what the f—k they’re talking about.”

    He thinks people overreact to things, and then they overreacted about that.

    Claiming people overreact and then going "see! see! overreacting!" when people react isn't actually proving your case though.

    Like it can entirely be the case that people are reacting with the proper degree of reactionness to some dumb shit you said.

    nah, it's a total overreaction imo.

    I also think that a lot of the basis for the backlash that I'm seeing on fb/twitter comes from Seinfeld being an old white dude, because like I said, there wasn't even nearly the same level of vitriol levelled against Chris Rock for expressing the same opinion a few months back

  • Options
    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    "college students don't understand ______" is a pretty reasoned viewpoint

    Except, you know, making fun of the gays for being effeminate is not good.

    it's lazy comedy. a low-hanging fruit, if you will.

    I don't think that's a fair description of the joke

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • Options
    evilbobevilbob RADELAIDERegistered User regular
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    "college students don't understand ______" is a pretty reasoned viewpoint

    As someone who has returned to university as an adult it holds true in at least 60% of cases.

    l5sruu1fyatf.jpg

  • Options
    AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    if I rub it in that Brann SK lost another game I'd be kicking people while they were down

    not a person in the world would think that I was equating it to actual violence. That's... just, what?

    ftOqU21.png
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    JuliusJulius Captain of Serenity on my shipRegistered User regular
    Tav wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    what is the seinfeld thing

    he made a comment in an interview about how political correctness, especially in colleges, is killing comedy

    people got offended at the idea of someone thinking they're too easily offended, basically

    There aren't really any boundaries in comedy, but crassly offensive humor is the crutch of the shitty comic.

    Basically, if you don't punch down, you're doing it right.

    Nah. Crassly offensive comedy done well is an art in and of itself. Frankie Boyle is a national treasure, especially because people get positively apoplectic about his jokes, even when they are against powerful figures, and frankly ridiculous.

    Also, the entire "punching down" analogy is ridiculous, both because "down" is highly ill-defined, and comparing free speech to physical violence is a dangerous and irresponsible call for censorship. The famous analogy of "shouting 'fire' in a crowded theatre!" was never actually referring to that, but was referring to those dastardly anti-draft advocates expressing a political opinion via leaflets. If we want to talk about violence, well, comparing speech to things that aren't speech (treason, violence, war against God, whatever) is a slippery slope to causing actual violence, both state sponsored and mob, against people for having the wrong opinions.

    I think Mika was more referring to micers wondering why their abortion joke got more walk outs than usual rather than seasoned professionals like Boyle or Jeselnik.

    Well, bad comedy is bad. "What's the difference between a dump truck full of bowling balls and a dump truck full of dead babies?" is hilarious in middle school, but doesn't age well past its ridiculousness.
    Also, as someone who performs comedy regularly, the punching down analogy is apt. Like it really doesn't take a genius to figure out why it's there.

    You find that comics with less careful material send a lot of people to the emergency room?

    There's a difference between telling jokes that make some people uncomfortable and kicking someone on the ground until they shit blood. Violence is violence. Being put out of your comfort zone is not.

    The use of physical actions in metaphors is pretty common in the English language and complaining about it seems like an especially useless thing to do.

    And come on, if people want to censor they're going to censor whether you call it punching down or cuddling down.

  • Options
    ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    I mean maybe Seinfeld could just try being funny

    like i think that's step one, and then step two is finding out whether his jokes are funny enough to be granted immunity from the PC police

  • Options
    TehSlothTehSloth Hit Or Miss I Guess They Never Miss, HuhRegistered User regular
    edited June 2015
    oh god the andy grammar honey im good music video is the most disgusting celebration of monogamy what in the

    you can't rhyme I'm good with should not

    what kind of lazy bullshit slant rhyme garbage is this

    TehSloth on
    FC: 1993-7778-8872 PSN: TehSloth Xbox: SlothTeh
    twitch.tv/tehsloth
  • Options
    AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    also, I am calling something happening at the tail end of this episode

    I will not say what I think will happen but I'm just saying I'm calling it

    ftOqU21.png
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    So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    Whoa whoa, we can't have anyone say anything offensive in a comedy routine.

    at least, not anything offensive to me

    roight

  • Options
    durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    Whoa whoa, we can't have anyone say anything offensive in a comedy routine.

    I think the appropriate sequence of events is

    Comedian says funny/offensive thing
    Some people laugh
    Others say "woah what was up with that shit?"
    Depending on many factors, comedian either continues as is, adjusts the joke, or jettisons the joke.

    I've never felt like it's a comedian's job to never say terrible shit. They kind of make a living out of playing with that line. It's just that it's their job to... listen to the reaction to their jokes.

    Take a moment to donate what you can to Critical Resistance and Black Lives Matter.
  • Options
    AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    CALLED IT!

    EDIT: That happened sooner than I thought.

    Abdhyius on
    ftOqU21.png
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    y2jake215y2jake215 certified Flat Birther theorist the Last Good Boy onlineRegistered User regular
    This historical revisionism of Seinfeld not being funny is mind boggling to me

    C8Ft8GE.jpg
    maybe i'm streaming terrible dj right now if i am its here
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    TavTav Irish Minister for DefenceRegistered User regular
    Tav wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    what is the seinfeld thing

    he made a comment in an interview about how political correctness, especially in colleges, is killing comedy

    people got offended at the idea of someone thinking they're too easily offended, basically

    There aren't really any boundaries in comedy, but crassly offensive humor is the crutch of the shitty comic.

    Basically, if you don't punch down, you're doing it right.

    Nah. Crassly offensive comedy done well is an art in and of itself. Frankie Boyle is a national treasure, especially because people get positively apoplectic about his jokes, even when they are against powerful figures, and frankly ridiculous.

    Also, the entire "punching down" analogy is ridiculous, both because "down" is highly ill-defined, and comparing free speech to physical violence is a dangerous and irresponsible call for censorship. The famous analogy of "shouting 'fire' in a crowded theatre!" was never actually referring to that, but was referring to those dastardly anti-draft advocates expressing a political opinion via leaflets. If we want to talk about violence, well, comparing speech to things that aren't speech (treason, violence, war against God, whatever) is a slippery slope to causing actual violence, both state sponsored and mob, against people for having the wrong opinions.

    I think Mika was more referring to micers wondering why their abortion joke got more walk outs than usual rather than seasoned professionals like Boyle or Jeselnik.

    Well, bad comedy is bad. "What's the difference between a dump truck full of bowling balls and a dump truck full of dead babies?" is hilarious in middle school, but doesn't age well past its ridiculousness.
    Also, as someone who performs comedy regularly, the punching down analogy is apt. Like it really doesn't take a genius to figure out why it's there.

    You find that comics with less careful material send a lot of people to the emergency room?

    There's a difference between telling jokes that make some people uncomfortable and kicking someone on the ground until they shit blood. Violence is violence. Being put out of your comfort zone is not.

    what are you even talking about

    it's an analogy because saying "don't joke about people lower down on the socio economic/political/social scale than you because (a) it's low hanging fruit (b) probably full of hate and (c) probably not funny coming from someone in your position" doesn't have the same ring to it

  • Options
    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    y2jake215 wrote: »
    This historical revisionism of Seinfeld not being funny is mind boggling to me

    It was alright. Had some good bits. Nothing special.

  • Options
    OrganichuOrganichu poops peesRegistered User, Moderator mod
    i often see 'even if it's not offensive, it's not funny' as a proxy for 'it is offensive'. it seems like kind of a goofy sidetrack to the conversation. to resolve it, just imagine the joke in question was funny.

    idk it seems a little like deflection.

  • Options
    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    y2jake215 wrote: »
    This historical revisionism of Seinfeld not being funny is mind boggling to me

    you could put this on my tombstone

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • Options
    ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    y2jake215 wrote: »
    This historical revisionism of Seinfeld not being funny is mind boggling to me

    Seinfeld, the TV show was funny

    Jerry Seinfeld, the stand up comedian

    uh

  • Options
    TehSlothTehSloth Hit Or Miss I Guess They Never Miss, HuhRegistered User regular
    edited June 2015
    y2jake215 wrote: »
    This historical revisionism of Seinfeld not being funny is mind boggling to me

    The stand up or the tv show -- I was never terribly interested in his stand up but the TV show is one of (if not the) greatest sitcoms of all time, and he had a lot to do with that.

    edit: the stand up thing could have a lot to do with age, it was a little before my time

    TehSloth on
    FC: 1993-7778-8872 PSN: TehSloth Xbox: SlothTeh
    twitch.tv/tehsloth
  • Options
    21stCentury21stCentury Call me Pixel, or Pix for short! [They/Them]Registered User regular
    Variable wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    "college students don't understand ______" is a pretty reasoned viewpoint

    Except, you know, making fun of the gays for being effeminate is not good.

    it's lazy comedy. a low-hanging fruit, if you will.

    I don't think that's a fair description of the joke

    Oh, i didn't mean to say his gay french king joke was bad, sorry.

  • Options
    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    Variable wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    "college students don't understand ______" is a pretty reasoned viewpoint

    Except, you know, making fun of the gays for being effeminate is not good.

    it's lazy comedy. a low-hanging fruit, if you will.

    I don't think that's a fair description of the joke

    True it's not a fair description of the joke.

    Rather the joke relies on the assumption that gay people are effeminate. Also the French. Or at least their kings though that one is a bit tougher to check if true right now.

  • Options
    TavTav Irish Minister for DefenceRegistered User regular
    "...oh and also you totally can mention those people in your jokes. No one is banning you from doing that but don't make them the butt of your joke because have a bit of fucking decorum" should be tacked on the end there for good measure

  • Options
    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    Hmm I want to test this now.

    We need another revolution in France. Did they ever finish cleaning up the blood from the last one?

  • Options
    JuliusJulius Captain of Serenity on my shipRegistered User regular
    Tav wrote: »
    Julius wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Quid wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Neco wrote: »
    Of course, I pretty much go into immediate eye rolling exhaustion whenever I hear someone decry society for being too "PC"

    just like they do when told not to say something

    it's exhausting to have to fight for every word out of everyone's mouth, in either direction

    I can explain why it's a jerk move to call gay men effeminate. I can point out the long history of them dealing with being called not "real" men and the stereotypes that got attached to emphasize that. I'm not mindlessly saying "Don't say that" I can actually back up my reasoning. I doubt Jerry can do the same for his fear of the pc police.

    It sucks that someone somewhere probably did a terrible job of explaining themselves to Jerry. It doesn't change that Jerry insisting on continuing that stereotype is insensitive and turns people off.

    Except he can in his first interview when he explicitly states an example of why he thinks the way he does
    He continued, "I'll give you an example: My daughter's 14. My wife says to her, 'Well, you know, in the next couple years, I think maybe you’re going to want to be hanging around the city more on the weekends, so you can see boys.' You know what my daughter says? She says, ‘That’s sexist.’"

    Seinfeld said college students don't understand racism and sexism. "They just want to use these words: 'That’s racist;' 'That’s sexist;' 'That’s prejudice.' They don’t even know what the f—k they’re talking about.”

    He thinks people overreact to things, and then they overreacted about that.

    Claiming people overreact and then going "see! see! overreacting!" when people react isn't actually proving your case though.

    Like it can entirely be the case that people are reacting with the proper degree of reactionness to some dumb shit you said.

    nah, it's a total overreaction imo.

    I also think that a lot of the basis for the backlash that I'm seeing on fb/twitter comes from Seinfeld being an old white dude, because like I said, there wasn't even nearly the same level of vitriol levelled against Chris Rock for expressing the same opinion a few months back

    Maybe, maybe not. But I'm not just going to take your word on it that it is a total overreaction.

    What Seinfeld said seems to be pretty stupid, and I haven't seen anything I would label overreaction. Maybe I just missed it though.

  • Options
    ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    Also, if that interview is true, as stated here
    e continued, "I'll give you an example: My daughter's 14. My wife says to her, 'Well, you know, in the next couple years, I think maybe you’re going to want to be hanging around the city more on the weekends, so you can see boys.' You know what my daughter says? She says, ‘That’s sexist.’"

    Seinfeld said college students don't understand racism and sexism. "They just want to use these words: 'That’s racist;' 'That’s sexist;' 'That’s prejudice.' They don’t even know what the f—k they’re talking about.”

    I think Jerry himself missed the joke from his daughter there

  • Options
    ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    Like, "That's racist/sexist" is both an oft used rallying cry

    and also it has become it's own internet meme so I mean

  • Options
    Sir LandsharkSir Landshark resting shark face Registered User regular
    TehSloth wrote: »
    oh god the andy grammar honey im good music video is the most disgusting celebration of monogamy what in the

    you can't rhyme I'm good with should not

    what kind of lazy bullshit slant rhyme garbage is this

    oh like he needs to conform to Big Rhyme

    Please consider the environment before printing this post.
  • Options
    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    Quid wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    "college students don't understand ______" is a pretty reasoned viewpoint

    Except, you know, making fun of the gays for being effeminate is not good.

    it's lazy comedy. a low-hanging fruit, if you will.

    I don't think that's a fair description of the joke

    True it's not a fair description of the joke.

    Rather the joke relies on the assumption that gay people are effeminate. Also the French. Or at least their kings though that one is a bit tougher to check if true right now.

    if he said 'flamboyant king' the joke still stands

    I disagree that it relies on anything about gay people

    if you don't find it funny, okay. but as someone who does, a punchline without 'gay' or even 'french' still works.

    it absolutely uses gay, and yes french people as an unnecessary butt of the joke. I agree.

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • Options
    y2jake215y2jake215 certified Flat Birther theorist the Last Good Boy onlineRegistered User regular
    I was never a giant fan of seinfelds stand up but I also never really watched it. That's not the only thing that reflects "funny" however

    if Seinfeld was a hack I don't think so many huge comedians right now would consider him a big influence

    C8Ft8GE.jpg
    maybe i'm streaming terrible dj right now if i am its here
  • Options
    programjunkieprogramjunkie Registered User regular
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    what is the seinfeld thing

    he made a comment in an interview about how political correctness, especially in colleges, is killing comedy

    people got offended at the idea of someone thinking they're too easily offended, basically

    There aren't really any boundaries in comedy, but crassly offensive humor is the crutch of the shitty comic.

    Basically, if you don't punch down, you're doing it right.

    Nah. Crassly offensive comedy done well is an art in and of itself. Frankie Boyle is a national treasure, especially because people get positively apoplectic about his jokes, even when they are against powerful figures, and frankly ridiculous.

    Also, the entire "punching down" analogy is ridiculous, both because "down" is highly ill-defined, and comparing free speech to physical violence is a dangerous and irresponsible call for censorship. The famous analogy of "shouting 'fire' in a crowded theatre!" was never actually referring to that, but was referring to those dastardly anti-draft advocates expressing a political opinion via leaflets. If we want to talk about violence, well, comparing speech to things that aren't speech (treason, violence, war against God, whatever) is a slippery slope to causing actual violence, both state sponsored and mob, against people for having the wrong opinions.

    I think Mika was more referring to micers wondering why their abortion joke got more walk outs than usual rather than seasoned professionals like Boyle or Jeselnik.

    Well, bad comedy is bad. "What's the difference between a dump truck full of bowling balls and a dump truck full of dead babies?" is hilarious in middle school, but doesn't age well past its ridiculousness.
    Also, as someone who performs comedy regularly, the punching down analogy is apt. Like it really doesn't take a genius to figure out why it's there.

    You find that comics with less careful material send a lot of people to the emergency room?

    There's a difference between telling jokes that make some people uncomfortable and kicking someone on the ground until they shit blood. Violence is violence. Being put out of your comfort zone is not.

    nobody is saying it is actually like kicking or punching somebody, goddamn

    Words mean things. If by "punch down," you don't want to draw even the slightest comparison with punching people, don't use the word punch.

    For example, you could say, "Telling jokes which reinforce existing social stereotypes can lead to a bit more negative climate for people who are minorities," but that lacks the imagery of people imagining skinheads cornering an immigrant in an alleyway.

  • Options
    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    I'm not sure that I believe Texas really exists. It might all be faked on a sound stage, like the moon landing.

    You don't even think the Bronx exists.

    I can indeed confirm that large swaths of Texas unfortunately exist!

    Though other, smaller swaths fortunately exist too!

  • Options
    MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    Arch wrote: »
    Also, if that interview is true, as stated here
    e continued, "I'll give you an example: My daughter's 14. My wife says to her, 'Well, you know, in the next couple years, I think maybe you’re going to want to be hanging around the city more on the weekends, so you can see boys.' You know what my daughter says? She says, ‘That’s sexist.’"

    Seinfeld said college students don't understand racism and sexism. "They just want to use these words: 'That’s racist;' 'That’s sexist;' 'That’s prejudice.' They don’t even know what the f—k they’re talking about.”

    I think Jerry himself missed the joke from his daughter there

    I posted the actual joke and interview.

    It is the top hit on Seinfeld and Seth Meyers on youtube.

    You can just watch it and decide.

    I feel maybe that is the best idea because I am not sure tons of folks watched it after I even posted it.

    u7stthr17eud.png
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    So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Tav wrote: »
    Julius wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Quid wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Neco wrote: »
    Of course, I pretty much go into immediate eye rolling exhaustion whenever I hear someone decry society for being too "PC"

    just like they do when told not to say something

    it's exhausting to have to fight for every word out of everyone's mouth, in either direction

    I can explain why it's a jerk move to call gay men effeminate. I can point out the long history of them dealing with being called not "real" men and the stereotypes that got attached to emphasize that. I'm not mindlessly saying "Don't say that" I can actually back up my reasoning. I doubt Jerry can do the same for his fear of the pc police.

    It sucks that someone somewhere probably did a terrible job of explaining themselves to Jerry. It doesn't change that Jerry insisting on continuing that stereotype is insensitive and turns people off.

    Except he can in his first interview when he explicitly states an example of why he thinks the way he does
    He continued, "I'll give you an example: My daughter's 14. My wife says to her, 'Well, you know, in the next couple years, I think maybe you’re going to want to be hanging around the city more on the weekends, so you can see boys.' You know what my daughter says? She says, ‘That’s sexist.’"

    Seinfeld said college students don't understand racism and sexism. "They just want to use these words: 'That’s racist;' 'That’s sexist;' 'That’s prejudice.' They don’t even know what the f—k they’re talking about.”

    He thinks people overreact to things, and then they overreacted about that.

    Claiming people overreact and then going "see! see! overreacting!" when people react isn't actually proving your case though.

    Like it can entirely be the case that people are reacting with the proper degree of reactionness to some dumb shit you said.

    nah, it's a total overreaction imo.

    I also think that a lot of the basis for the backlash that I'm seeing on fb/twitter comes from Seinfeld being an old white dude, because like I said, there wasn't even nearly the same level of vitriol levelled against Chris Rock for expressing the same opinion a few months back

    there rings a hint of truthiness to the idea that Jerry was implying he knows better than college students everywhere (who are a large number of people) what racism, sexism, and prejudice are really like, and that may be a bit problematic to some people who have experienced those things (yes even college kids!)

    not that he can't have experienced those as a white dude but you see why people might go "hmm" or may be a bit more accepting of Chris Rock saying something about racism (I read his quote and it was more analogous to people complaining about tumblr to me but yeah)

    So It Goes on
  • Options
    surrealitychecksurrealitycheck lonely, but not unloved dreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Pony wrote: »
    sense8 is very good

    i am on ep 8

    sense8ional

    surrealitycheck on
    obF2Wuw.png
  • Options
    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    I think I'd say 'victorian king'

    maybe I'll give Jerry a call

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • Options
    wazillawazilla Having a late dinner Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    what is the seinfeld thing

    he made a comment in an interview about how political correctness, especially in colleges, is killing comedy

    people got offended at the idea of someone thinking they're too easily offended, basically

    There aren't really any boundaries in comedy, but crassly offensive humor is the crutch of the shitty comic.

    Basically, if you don't punch down, you're doing it right.

    Nah. Crassly offensive comedy done well is an art in and of itself. Frankie Boyle is a national treasure, especially because people get positively apoplectic about his jokes, even when they are against powerful figures, and frankly ridiculous.

    Also, the entire "punching down" analogy is ridiculous, both because "down" is highly ill-defined, and comparing free speech to physical violence is a dangerous and irresponsible call for censorship. The famous analogy of "shouting 'fire' in a crowded theatre!" was never actually referring to that, but was referring to those dastardly anti-draft advocates expressing a political opinion via leaflets. If we want to talk about violence, well, comparing speech to things that aren't speech (treason, violence, war against God, whatever) is a slippery slope to causing actual violence, both state sponsored and mob, against people for having the wrong opinions.

    I think Mika was more referring to micers wondering why their abortion joke got more walk outs than usual rather than seasoned professionals like Boyle or Jeselnik.

    Well, bad comedy is bad. "What's the difference between a dump truck full of bowling balls and a dump truck full of dead babies?" is hilarious in middle school, but doesn't age well past its ridiculousness.
    Also, as someone who performs comedy regularly, the punching down analogy is apt. Like it really doesn't take a genius to figure out why it's there.

    You find that comics with less careful material send a lot of people to the emergency room?

    There's a difference between telling jokes that make some people uncomfortable and kicking someone on the ground until they shit blood. Violence is violence. Being put out of your comfort zone is not.

    nobody is saying it is actually like kicking or punching somebody, goddamn

    Words mean things. If by "punch down," you don't want to draw even the slightest comparison with punching people, don't use the word punch.

    For example, you could say, "Telling jokes which reinforce existing social stereotypes can lead to a bit more negative climate for people who are minorities," but that lacks the imagery of people imagining skinheads cornering an immigrant in an alleyway.

    Whaaaaat

    wazilla on
    Psn:wazukki
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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    Variable wrote: »
    Quid wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    "college students don't understand ______" is a pretty reasoned viewpoint

    Except, you know, making fun of the gays for being effeminate is not good.

    it's lazy comedy. a low-hanging fruit, if you will.

    I don't think that's a fair description of the joke

    True it's not a fair description of the joke.

    Rather the joke relies on the assumption that gay people are effeminate. Also the French. Or at least their kings though that one is a bit tougher to check if true right now.

    if he said 'flamboyant king' the joke still stands

    I disagree that it relies on anything about gay people

    if you don't find it funny, okay. but as someone who does, a punchline without 'gay' or even 'french' still works.

    it absolutely uses gay, and yes french people as an unnecessary butt of the joke. I agree.

    If he had used something it would be better, yes. But he didn't. I'm not talking about the joke he could have made. I'm talking about the one he did make. Then proceeded to get upset when criticized.

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    So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    what is the seinfeld thing

    he made a comment in an interview about how political correctness, especially in colleges, is killing comedy

    people got offended at the idea of someone thinking they're too easily offended, basically

    There aren't really any boundaries in comedy, but crassly offensive humor is the crutch of the shitty comic.

    Basically, if you don't punch down, you're doing it right.

    Nah. Crassly offensive comedy done well is an art in and of itself. Frankie Boyle is a national treasure, especially because people get positively apoplectic about his jokes, even when they are against powerful figures, and frankly ridiculous.

    Also, the entire "punching down" analogy is ridiculous, both because "down" is highly ill-defined, and comparing free speech to physical violence is a dangerous and irresponsible call for censorship. The famous analogy of "shouting 'fire' in a crowded theatre!" was never actually referring to that, but was referring to those dastardly anti-draft advocates expressing a political opinion via leaflets. If we want to talk about violence, well, comparing speech to things that aren't speech (treason, violence, war against God, whatever) is a slippery slope to causing actual violence, both state sponsored and mob, against people for having the wrong opinions.

    I think Mika was more referring to micers wondering why their abortion joke got more walk outs than usual rather than seasoned professionals like Boyle or Jeselnik.

    Well, bad comedy is bad. "What's the difference between a dump truck full of bowling balls and a dump truck full of dead babies?" is hilarious in middle school, but doesn't age well past its ridiculousness.
    Also, as someone who performs comedy regularly, the punching down analogy is apt. Like it really doesn't take a genius to figure out why it's there.

    You find that comics with less careful material send a lot of people to the emergency room?

    There's a difference between telling jokes that make some people uncomfortable and kicking someone on the ground until they shit blood. Violence is violence. Being put out of your comfort zone is not.

    nobody is saying it is actually like kicking or punching somebody, goddamn

    Words mean things. If by "punch down," you don't want to draw even the slightest comparison with punching people, don't use the word punch.

    For example, you could say, "Telling jokes which reinforce existing social stereotypes can lead to a bit more negative climate for people who are minorities," but that lacks the imagery of people imagining skinheads cornering an immigrant in an alleyway.

    I feel like I'm taking crazy pills reading this

    what

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    evilbobevilbob RADELAIDERegistered User regular
    Variable wrote: »
    I think I'd say 'victorian king'

    maybe I'll give Jerry a call

    ageist

    l5sruu1fyatf.jpg

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    GimGim a tall glass of water Registered User regular
    Yay, the frame for my makeshift camera cage/stabilizer arrived! I need to find a place to test this out.

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