[Assassin's Creed] To fight the horde, sing and cry

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  • DeadfallDeadfall I don't think you realize just how rich he is. In fact, I should put on a monocle.Registered User regular
    I thought Syndicate was a step in the right direction. A bunch of glitches could only be snagged by thinking creatively with the grappling hook.

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  • UnbreakableVowUnbreakableVow Registered User regular
    I've found every collectible in nearly every AC game

    Meanwhile in Crackdown I only got enough agility orbs to get me to max agility and then stopped

    If your collectible isn't on a minimap it can fuck right off

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  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    For me, the actual act of collecting them has to be fun. I enjoyed not being handed a map and told "okay Billy go find the easter eggs!" In Crackdown I wanted to collect the orbs because I liked exploring that world and the movement system in it.
    Hiding unlocks or alternative endings behind them makes them feel even more tedious rather than rewarding. To be fair I haven't started Syndicate yet so it could have gotten better. The absolute worst one was Black Flag which required going back to multiple islands for little trinkets which I couldn't care less about hunting down.

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  • Rhesus PositiveRhesus Positive GNU Terry Pratchett Registered User regular
    Prohass wrote: »
    I am so excited about the rumours for a possible cleopatra era egypt/hopefully Rome

    I've been wanting them to do ancient or classical for so damn long

    Using rolls of carpet as hiding places

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  • altidaltid Registered User regular
    I usually like the "special" collectibles the AC series does - you know, the "get all of these to unlock a super suit" type. Unity had a pretty decent idea with riddles based on landmarks in Paris, but some of them I'd never have got on my own (thanks internet!). Syndicate's was a bit of a step back imo - it was literally just pictures of "here's where we've hid it". Problem is when it's some random back alley with practically no distinguishing features it becomes more annoyance than fun.

    Looking back at it, Unity was a much more ambitious game than Syndicate. It just tripped over itself in a few places.

  • The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    I just recently finished getting everything in Unity. I think after a while it was because I wasn't going to let it beat me. But that was sheer fucking bloat of the worst kind. None of the rewards were worth it, there was something like 200% more collectibles there even should have been, which meant by the time I fully cleared out the top half of the map - a feat that would have been any other game - I nearly despaired because I was only half way finished. What really got under my skin though was it wasn't really worth collecting anything at all until you unlocked the last lockpicking skill. Why bother when at any moment you can have your time wasted by a lock you can't touch?

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  • MorninglordMorninglord Registered User regular
    I collect stuff to give me something to do if I enjoy the game enough, but I didn't bother grabbing all those stupid animus things in Black Flag or Rogue.

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  • SpoitSpoit *twitch twitch* Registered User regular
    But really, Ubi are the worst about the stupid collectable junk. Even in their FPS games. especially in their FPS games

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  • MorninglordMorninglord Registered User regular
    It's a lazy way to pad out your game that works.

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  • MongerMonger I got the ham stink. Dallas, TXRegistered User regular
    IIRC, the collectibles in AC were originally a practical joke by Patrice Desilets intended to convince players that collectibles are dumb. Then it backfired and they just rolled with it, because fuck everybody.

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  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    Monger wrote: »
    IIRC, the collectibles in AC were originally a practical joke by Patrice Desilets intended to convince players that collectibles are dumb. Then it backfired and they just rolled with it, because fuck everybody.

    Uh... That's weird.

    In AC1 I really likes the Templar Knights as a "living" collectible. Finding a randomly spawned tough enemy and beating his ass was a lot more fun than picking up a flag.

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  • RandomHajileRandomHajile Not actually a Snatcher The New KremlinRegistered User regular
    Monger wrote: »
    IIRC, the collectibles in AC were originally a practical joke by Patrice Desilets intended to convince players that collectibles are dumb. Then it backfired and they just rolled with it, because fuck everybody.

    Uh... That's weird.

    In AC1 I really likes the Templar Knights as a "living" collectible. Finding a randomly spawned tough enemy and beating his ass was a lot more fun than picking up a flag.
    It specifically refers to the flags in AC1 and later the feathers in ACII.

  • MorninglordMorninglord Registered User regular
    edited January 2016
    Yeah people like collecting things.
    Lots of people complained because the collectibles in AC1 had no purpose. They didn't complain because they were there.

    Honestly as long as no story is locked behind them, I don't give a fug about it being there or not, nor do I care that it's part of an abstract number denoting my "completion percentage" as if the developers understand how I play games and know when I've finished with one.

    For example, in AC3, I was finished sometime after I figured out every single trick in the combat system and had gotten tired of using them all.

    So around, say, 4000 enemies, give or take a few hundred. :)

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  • ThirithThirith Registered User regular
    I thought Syndicate handled the collectathon fairly well and less intrusively (I liked the musicbox challenges), though I could do with it being done away with altogether.

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  • VeagleVeagle Registered User regular
    Collecting the beers rewards me with journal entries of Shaun breaking down, so I'll collect all of those.

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  • ThirithThirith Registered User regular
    edited January 2016
    Has anyone here watched Double Fine's Devs Play episode on Assassin's Creed 2? It's not bad - worth checking out if you need something to watch for an hour while working out, for instance.

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  • LeumasWhiteLeumasWhite New ZealandRegistered User regular
    Veagle wrote: »
    Collecting the beers rewards me with journal entries of Shaun breaking down, so I'll collect all of those.

    Oh yeah, it was worth it for those just to make him down a bunch of terrible, simulated historical alcohol.

    Syndicate's kind of weird about collectibles in general, though. It keeps rewarding you with stuff after every mission and contact level and activity you do, but it's 90% junk that you've already got the upgraded version of.

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  • captainkcaptaink TexasRegistered User regular
    Veagle wrote: »
    Collecting the beers rewards me with journal entries of Shaun breaking down, so I'll collect all of those.

    Oh yeah, it was worth it for those just to make him down a bunch of terrible, simulated historical alcohol.

    Syndicate's kind of weird about collectibles in general, though. It keeps rewarding you with stuff after every mission and contact level and activity you do, but it's 90% junk that you've already got the upgraded version of.

    If you're not a crazy collector like me, I bet that's helpful. You could just play through the story, grab a few things on the side, and have some decent equipment at the end.

  • VorpalVorpal Registered User regular
    I finished up AC IV and have dove into AC Unity with the snowstorm.

    And fucking hell, the game is fucking terrible. This is AFTER all the patches and them removing all the bullshit companion app/website nonsense...and I've still run into numerous bugs that block all progress in a mission.

    I could spend hours detailing how awful this game is. It's such a joyless slog. You run slow, sometimes, randomly, you'll run even slower ! You climb slow. You fight slow. Moving across the city is slow because some random asshole is always deciding to attack you - sometimes even the blue guards! Some fucking moron decided to introduce maze like sewers - in a series that is built upon the joy of fluid unbounded motion as you run wherever your heart takes you across beautifully rendered city roofscapes. Now you are slogging through a bare, drab, empty narrow tunnel maze, with no map, and random grates blocking your progress every few feet. Holy fucking shit.

    And the combat...what the fuck happened? Not since AC1 has the combat been such a joyless slog. We are back to having to wait for an enemy to attack you, THEN parry them, and THEN unleash a CHAIN of attacks that MIGHT kill that enemy. Even with fully upgraded everything 5 gold star blah blah de blah it takes AGES to kill a single enemy trooper out of a pack of them. Meanwhile you can be two-shot by the enormous number of enemy snipers, and all guards carry a revolver stuffed down their trousers. Am I missing something? What happened to the amazing fluid grace and power of Connor or Edward? Is there some way to dispatch hordes of goons quickly? I've tried heavy weapons, I've tried long weapons, I've tried smoke grenades, I've tried stun grenades...even once you use a grenade, you can usually only kill two guys. And the grenades don't stop people outside from shooting in, and of course everyone not in immediate melee range is blasting away. You can blast away at a single goon with multiple pistol shots and it won't even slow him down. I can kill anybody one on one easily, but in a huge crowd, someone always interrupts your slow ass parry chain before you can kill someone. Your special attacks take way too long to get off, even against single opponents, in my experience.

    And what..the ..fucking..hell..is up with the number of collectibles? I've spent 2 full days basically trying to clear the collectibles and I'm almost half done!

    Please tell me Syndicate is better. I've enjoyed every single AC game I've played so far, even 1 and 3, but this is just atrociously bad.

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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited January 2016
    From what I've heard, Syndicate is so much better.

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  • SyphonBlueSyphonBlue Registered User regular
    Syndicate is probably my second favorite AC game after Brotherhood.

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  • mere_immortalmere_immortal So tasty!Registered User regular
    I think Black Flag still edges out Syndicate just because the boat stuff was so much fun. Not sure who wins best sassy Welshman though, Edward and Jacob both have good bits.

    Ended up doing the platinum for Syndicate, only trophy that was a pain was the run over 5000 things one.

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  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    Syndicate was really solid.

    I have not played Unity, nor do I have any desire to.

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  • ThirithThirith Registered User regular
    Unity's Paris is amazing. If, like me, you love the experience of these historical cities, it's worth checking out Unity once it's come down enough in price. I like the characters quite a bit too, but the story is a mess, and the game forces collectibles and map icons down your throat like you're a goose and they're trying to produce foie gras.

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  • Rhesus PositiveRhesus Positive GNU Terry Pratchett Registered User regular
    Unity was the first AC game where I started properly using the bombs. Mainly to get the combat over with so I could just get on with my day of working out those riddles, which were the only side quest things that interested me.

  • DuffelDuffel jacobkosh Registered User regular
    edited January 2016
    Vorpal wrote: »
    I finished up AC IV and have dove into AC Unity with the snowstorm.

    And fucking hell, the game is fucking terrible. This is AFTER all the patches and them removing all the bullshit companion app/website nonsense...and I've still run into numerous bugs that block all progress in a mission.

    /rant

    It's easy not to notice, because it's very unobtrusive and all the enemies look exactly the same, but Unity and Syndicate both use an obnoxious levelling system for your gear and the enemies. Enemies in certain parts of Paris/London are exponentially tougher, stats-wise, than the same dudes in other parts of the city. That means, unless you are flawless at the combat system, and very patient (since your attacks will do pitiful damage against these tougher enemies), you're going to get pummeled by guards and thugs if you wander outside of certain restricted areas in the early game.

    This is further compounded by a totally bullshit gear system. Remember how in AC1 you just got more powerful weapons further in the story, while in 2 and 3 you got to choose from/buy a wider variety of weapons as the game unlocked? LOL. Hope you didn't enjoy that. Unity and Syndicate replace this was an extremely unfun tiered system, where you essentially buy the same weapons over and over again, they're just statistically stronger, and make it possible for you to survive against new enemies. Just got upgraded to level three? Great! I hope you want to spend three hours grinding money (not always easy or fun) for your level three weapon, and (in Unity) a level three hat, level three coat, level three gauntlet, level three pants, and level three belt (these will, of course, be much less useful when you make it to level four, and get to do it all over again).

    Making it even better, in Unity, is the fact that a lot of the gear is gated behind various forms of content - Co-op missions, as often as not - so I hope you're interested in waiting to do random missions with strangers to unlock gear on a game that's been out for over a year.

    Syndicate simplifies this drastically, and gets rid of the co-op nonsense entirely, although this does come at the expense of character customization (Unity's equipment system means you can really pick your own look for your character - if you want to be a dashing Scarlet Pimpernel-type with a rapier, a pissed-off sans-culotte wielding a nasty maul, a highwayman with a pistol and saber, or just about anything else you could want to be within a French Revolutionary context, go to town! it's actually really neat, and would be a lot cooler if it wasn't locked behind bullshit gates and money grinding).

    It's extremely frustrating, and disappointing, because honestly, I think the actual GAME fighting to get out of these entries is really great, Syndicate especially. The sneaking/climbing/assassination aspects of the game are very well done, the rendering of the historical eras is lovingly done and visually jaw-dropping, the cities feel as real and as alive as any cities I've ever seen in a video game. Walking around Paris, you'll see mobs dragging off frightened bourgeois, hoodlums walking around with looted church relics, people singing revolutionary songs, sneaking out of cafes with their lovers after dark... it's frankly amazing, and London is even better. But there's so much bullshit gating, grinding, and busywork to be done it takes more than a little fun out of it. Unity is one of the most bloated games I have ever seen. Look at the missions map sometime, it's totally absurd.

    What do companies actually get out of this sort of padding? Are people these days just acclimated to it and they don't care anymore? Are they that afraid of releasing a fun 25-hour game instead of an unfun 80-hour game? Do idiotic reviewers view this sort of thing as positive, and reward it with those oh-so-crucial metacritic rankings? I am honestly confused as to why there is this very noticeable trend. The gear gating, at least, makes a kind of mercenary sense - a lot of times they're trying to get you to buy those stupid XP/Money boosts with additional cash, which is nauseating, but I guess the way it is these days. And, to be fair, there's always been a bit of this in the AC series, which introduced the so-fun mechanic of running around for thirty minutes every time you open a new area so you can actually use the map, a basic feature in the vast majority of games. But it's definitely getting worse, and I really can't see the motivation behind a lot of it.

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  • UnbreakableVowUnbreakableVow Registered User regular
    edited January 2016
    I'm not sure what to say other than I wonder why you played it that way

    I finished Syndicate just fine and never once did anything remotely close to grinding

    Enemies never gave me any trouble either once you learn the battle system, I was taking on enemies well above my level and coming out relatively unschathed

    I bought new gear if I happened to have the cash on hand, but it was never in any way crucial

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  • DuffelDuffel jacobkosh Registered User regular
    Like I say, Syndicate is much better about it than Unity, but it's still there. I can usually take on objectives and enemies one level above what I'm "supposed" to (so, I could do level six stuff at level five), but more than that and I just got hammered.

  • The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    I never did click with Unity's combat. It was real frustrating at first, and really all I felt like I did was cheese it with a powerful weapon. Yellow meant you parried, red meant you dodged, but then there were some enemies where neither parry nor dodge did anything and you simply got smacked. And god help you once firearms entered the mix.

    If you really just want to power through it, then head to the DLC area the second it opens up. Even with a weak weapon, you can probably beat the first few chapters, and then they'll give you the guillotine gun which will help. But then soon after you unlock the riddles sidequest. Do all them, and you get the best sword in the game hands down. With it you can pretty much button mash to victory, and for the real bullshit encounters you can just cheese with smoke grenades.

    After that, prioritize social club missions to improve the money you earn from the theatre. Then start picking away at the fucking stupid amount of bloated collectibles there are, making sure to check the chest every hour. And before you know it you'll be rolling in cash and can afford all the 5 star gear.

    I completed the game, but yeah. Just shear bloat from end to end. And the plot and characters were completely forgettable. Maybe I would have cared more if I knew a thing about the French Revolution. And absolutely jack squat relating to the present day plot.

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  • SpoitSpoit *twitch twitch* Registered User regular
    I never did click with Unity's combat. It was real frustrating at first, and really all I felt like I did was cheese it with a powerful weapon. Yellow meant you parried, red meant you dodged, but then there were some enemies where neither parry nor dodge did anything and you simply got smacked. And god help you once firearms entered the mix.

    If you really just want to power through it, then head to the DLC area the second it opens up. Even with a weak weapon, you can probably beat the first few chapters, and then they'll give you the guillotine gun which will help. But then soon after you unlock the riddles sidequest. Do all them, and you get the best sword in the game hands down. With it you can pretty much button mash to victory, and for the real bullshit encounters you can just cheese with smoke grenades.

    After that, prioritize social club missions to improve the money you earn from the theatre. Then start picking away at the fucking stupid amount of bloated collectibles there are, making sure to check the chest every hour. And before you know it you'll be rolling in cash and can afford all the 5 star gear.

    I completed the game, but yeah. Just shear bloat from end to end. And the plot and characters were completely forgettable. Maybe I would have cared more if I knew a thing about the French Revolution. And absolutely jack squat relating to the present day plot.

    The DLC area chests also have a metric ton of money, to buy the higher tier armors

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  • VorpalVorpal Registered User regular
    I never did click with Unity's combat. It was real frustrating at first, and really all I felt like I did was cheese it with a powerful weapon. Yellow meant you parried, red meant you dodged, but then there were some enemies where neither parry nor dodge did anything and you simply got smacked. And god help you once firearms entered the mix.

    If you really just want to power through it, then head to the DLC area the second it opens up. Even with a weak weapon, you can probably beat the first few chapters, and then they'll give you the guillotine gun which will help. But then soon after you unlock the riddles sidequest. Do all them, and you get the best sword in the game hands down. With it you can pretty much button mash to victory, and for the real bullshit encounters you can just cheese with smoke grenades.

    After that, prioritize social club missions to improve the money you earn from the theatre. Then start picking away at the fucking stupid amount of bloated collectibles there are, making sure to check the chest every hour. And before you know it you'll be rolling in cash and can afford all the 5 star gear.

    I completed the game, but yeah. Just shear bloat from end to end. And the plot and characters were completely forgettable. Maybe I would have cared more if I knew a thing about the French Revolution. And absolutely jack squat relating to the present day plot.

    The fact I know a lot about the French Revolution is pretty much the only reason I am enjoying Unity at all, heh. Although I was outraged to discover in this game
    the scarlet pimpernel is a *bad* guy. Fuck you, game!

    Thanks for the tips about the DLC. I had been avoiding it.

    I haven't had any issues with money. I'm loaded in cash - I ran around and unlocked all the social clubs and renovated them and did their missions very early on.

    I don't know what a guillotine gun is, but it sounds amazing.

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  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    Updated OP finally lemme know if there's anything you'd like in there guys

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  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular

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  • MorninglordMorninglord Registered User regular
    So, given that I am fully aware of the problems with the gameplay of Unity and I've also seen plenty of people complaints about the plot too, I basically know the whole thing by now.

    How is the historical tourism of Unity? I plan to play the game in french with subtitles. One of the things I like in these games is just wandering around the city and seeing period appropriate stuff going on. The buildings, the city architecture, historical information about the buildings and what not.

    Hows all that stuff?

    Cos I'd be willing to pick it up on special just to see that.

    Plus, you know me, I want to see just how bad the combat is and see if there's any way to break it.

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  • RandomHajileRandomHajile Not actually a Snatcher The New KremlinRegistered User regular
    So, given that I am fully aware of the problems with the gameplay of Unity and I've also seen plenty of people complaints about the plot too, I basically know the whole thing by now.

    How is the historical tourism of Unity? I plan to play the game in french with subtitles. One of the things I like in these games is just wandering around the city and seeing period appropriate stuff going on. The buildings, the city architecture, historical information about the buildings and what not.

    Hows all that stuff?

    Cos I'd be willing to pick it up on special just to see that.

    Plus, you know me, I want to see just how bad the combat is and see if there's any way to break it.
    That stuff is all pretty good. It is a beautiful game, and the city is very well-realized. They perhaps fudge the history more than some of the other games, but frankly I think people judged that stuff more harshly due to its buggy reputation. Just know what you're going into and it'll be fine. I suspect you'll find some amazing way to break the combat, because you're a robot, but the combat was the most frustrating part of that game IMO. The off-screen enemy attacks drove me crazy.

  • MorninglordMorninglord Registered User regular
    edited January 2016
    Some people have already found ways to break it. Apparently the AI can't handle the corner kill at all.



    I'm just interested to see if there's any other way.

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  • ThirithThirith Registered User regular
    I'd also give a thumbs up to Unity's historical tourism. The collectathon mania is at an all-time high, which gets in the way a bit, but if you can ignore all the map icons and don't have a tendency towards OCD, Unity is worth it if you want a gorgeous, beautifully realised historical Paris. (I ruined it a bit for myself by running everywhere from the beginning and focusing too much on the Eagle Vision points of interest. In Syndicate I spent the first couple of hours walking to most places, and it gave me a much better feel for the city they'd created.)

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  • Johnny ChopsockyJohnny Chopsocky Scootaloo! We have to cook! Grillin' HaysenburgersRegistered User regular
    I just started playing Syndicate and I am absolutely adoring the Frye twins as characters. Love Jacob's meatheaded bravado and Evie's meticulous take-no-shittery.

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  • KadokenKadoken Giving Ends to my Friends and it Feels Stupendous Registered User regular
    I've been reading through a lot of AC stuff.

    I kind of want to play through the whole series now. I never played any games other than 2 and Brotherhood.

    Me and a friend are in the process of starting a game channel and we've been thinking of playing through whole series (Kotor, Max Payne, Final Fantasy) and I've really wanted to start with the AC series.

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  • DuffelDuffel jacobkosh Registered User regular
    I just started playing Syndicate and I am absolutely adoring the Frye twins as characters. Love Jacob's meatheaded bravado and Evie's meticulous take-no-shittery.

    One of the best things about Syndicate is that they decided to quit treating the plot like it was Serious Business, and actually have fun with it.

    The underlying mythology and framework of the AC series is goofy and insane. I like that they decided to just roll with it.

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