Yeah, I'm a day 1 player, and I honestly had to work my way up through the spell tiers. I've long since sold or shattered my 1+2 star abilities, but during the first few months, players actually had to use Cure, Fire, Thunder, Blade Bash, and so forth.
Anymore, sure, 3-star orbs are easy and 3-star is basically the baseline. But that's just part of power creep. It wasn't always that way. The first few months were rough. I did not get my first natural 5-star relic until the 2nd time Tifa was made available. Tifa's Grand Glove was my first relic. And that was event #20.
100 pull got zilch. I gave a token 3 pull to see if I can get Squall's BSB andddddd...
Got Zell's gloves.
I'm not going to complain about getting a 5* in a realm I have a serious case of all eggs in one basket so I've got Zell in the party and working out how I can fit a MNK into the squad for now. 3 hit SB with self Protect/Shell/Haste scratches an itch I have in having some strong single target SBs. I'd love to work out some decent ability combos on MNKs so for now, Punishing Palm + Pound is a nice way to stack some pain. Worst case scenario, it's a weapon Gilgamesh can use while I put the swords on those who can only use the swords for damage.
Not sure if you're into 5* ability territory, but I made a copy of Exploding Fist for my Galuf and I'm pretty satisfied with it. It would synergize nicely with Punishing Palm if you don't have a Boostega.
Yeah, I'm a day 1 player, and I honestly had to work my way up through the spell tiers. I've long since sold or shattered my 1+2 star abilities, but during the first few months, players actually had to use Cure, Fire, Thunder, Blade Bash, and so forth.
Anymore, sure, 3-star orbs are easy and 3-star is basically the baseline. But that's just part of power creep. It wasn't always that way. The first few months were rough. I did not get my first natural 5-star relic until the 2nd time Tifa was made available. Tifa's Grand Glove was my first relic. And that was event #20.
As a recent player, I agree on the 1* and 2* items being wasted space / vendor fodder.
Strangely, 1* and 2* abilities still have a place as a new player, both because they are much easier to craft and hone, but also because higher abilities are just going to be hitting the damage cap.
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BeastehTHAT WOULD NOTKILL DRACULARegistered Userregular
Turns out the burst commands make Squall extremely valuable vs bosses with fire/wind weakness
With shout, apocalypse shield and armor breakdown + full break he was doing 39996 a turn vs Elnoyle+++
I'm super jelly of you folks who keep pulling BSB relics. I still don't have one. I mean, I don't need one. I've got Locke. But I'm still jealous anyway.
I'm gonna end up pulling pretty heavily on Banner #1 during BSB fest. Since I've got Cecil's SSB and Basch's shield, Cecil is a prime candidate for leading man in my party. I just need his Burst Soul Break to complete the set. I'm also going to hit Orb Fest pretty hard for Wind Orbs.
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BeastehTHAT WOULD NOTKILL DRACULARegistered Userregular
I wonder how far in advance we will get the BSB-fest banners. The BSB I want most right now is P.Cecil's, but the banner it showed up on in Japan is full of stuff I have (all great relics, but the only one I wouldn't mind a duplicate of would be Basch's shield). If the BSB-fest banners are not enticing for me, at least I'll have the FFIV event with P.Cecil's BSB, Rosa's SSB (Dreamstage clone), Kain's SSB, Edward's new harp and a decent katana for Edge to look forward to. Man that banner is pretty fantastic.
Ok Lion's Roar looks awesome and the animation is so much faster than Fenrir Overdrive.
Ride the pine for a bit, Cloud.
They actually learned a big lesson from Cloud's boring-ass unskippable motorcycle cutscene and drastically reduced the length of BSB animations
Some of them are almost as long but WAY flashier
That's good to hear. Seeing Bartz's BSSB in action is making a strong case for me to pull on his banner in the fest. Don't care what it does, looks so cool.
100 pull got zilch. I gave a token 3 pull to see if I can get Squall's BSB andddddd...
Got Zell's gloves.
I'm not going to complain about getting a 5* in a realm I have a serious case of all eggs in one basket so I've got Zell in the party and working out how I can fit a MNK into the squad for now. 3 hit SB with self Protect/Shell/Haste scratches an itch I have in having some strong single target SBs. I'd love to work out some decent ability combos on MNKs so for now, Punishing Palm + Pound is a nice way to stack some pain. Worst case scenario, it's a weapon Gilgamesh can use while I put the swords on those who can only use the swords for damage.
Not sure if you're into 5* ability territory, but I made a copy of Exploding Fist for my Galuf and I'm pretty satisfied with it. It would synergize nicely with Punishing Palm if you don't have a Boostega.
Starting to encroach on that holy ground. I'm eyeing off 5* abilities as a supplement for more damage and to bypass bad luck as something to work towards in the daily orb grinding. However, I'd like to work on 4* abilities first since I have limited copies or haven't got them made yet. I'd like to get the 4* spellblades because they're nice when I have a weakness I can exploit (Lightning is someone I try to fit in the team due to having her SSB) and I really want to get R4 ajas done and a second copy to R3 as secondaries if I don't have the physical powerhouses to get through Ultimates plus of course more summons. I could have theoretically done Rufus Ultimate but the numbers didn't line up; I didn't have enough ajas and hones to clock out the damage required.
That's good to hear. Seeing Bartz's BSSB in action is making a strong case for me to pull on his banner in the fest. Don't care what it does, looks so cool.
6 x 1.33 Physical attacks to one target + Burst Mode
ATTACK ⇒ 4 x 0.63 Wind + Water Physical attacks to one target
DEFEND ⇒ 4 x 0.63 Fire + Earth Physical attacks to one target
and it comes on the same banner as Tyro's BSB
Shellga, Protectga, Magic Blink to all allies + Burst Mode
ATTACK ⇒ 1 x 2.1 Physical hit and reduce ATK + MAG of one target (20%)
DEFEND ⇒ 1 x 2.1 Physical hit and reduce DEF + RES of one target (20%)
E: The best overall BSBs in Japan right now are Vaan (absolutely godlike), Gilgamesh (ditto), Celes, Faris & Tyro
The *4 Spellblades are a bit of a luxury. I have yet to not hit 9,999 with the 3* abilities.
In fact, I just did the Iguions archaeosaurs fight in the + boss rush, and I was hitting 9999 with the 2 star blizzard strike. Granted it was on Zack, who has his SSB and was using my one synergy sword for VIII with Pride of the Red Wings, but I was still a little surprised. Also the bosses in the boss rush have very little health, like sub-60k each.
That's good to hear. Seeing Bartz's BSSB in action is making a strong case for me to pull on his banner in the fest. Don't care what it does, looks so cool.
6 x 1.33 Physical attacks to one target + Burst Mode
ATTACK ⇒ 4 x 0.63 Wind + Water Physical attacks to one target
DEFEND ⇒ 4 x 0.63 Fire + Earth Physical attacks to one target
and it comes on the same banner as Tyro's BSB
Shellga, Protectga, Magic Blink to all allies + Burst Mode
ATTACK ⇒ 1 x 2.1 Physical hit and reduce ATK + MAG of one target (20%)
DEFEND ⇒ 1 x 2.1 Physical hit and reduce DEF + RES of one target (20%)
E: The best overall BSBs in Japan right now are Vaan (absolutely godlike), Gilgamesh (ditto), Celes, Faris & Tyro
Vaan's is crazy stupid, I remember that. I doubt we'll get that Banner as is, but Bartz and Tyro look absolutely worth pulling for.
I buckled and did an 11 pull. My heart rose when I saw 4 rainbows. But then it turned out that I just pulled all the garbage items and neither of the ones I wanted. Got Laguna's coat, Zell's glove, shared dagger, and a generic throwing weapon. Monks aren't in a great place right now, which means Zell isn't really going to see any play anytime soon. Not when I already have better relics for other physical fighters. And I probably won't use Laguna either. Plus the coat isn't his good item. His machine gun is what I would want.
This used to be the case, but isn't really true anymore. Not in the current meta at least.
I'm going to spoiler this as it's a VERY long write up about the current state of Monks, largely because I recently got Tifa to 80 and was curious how viable she was on my team.
First let's look at who all can be classified as a 'Monk' currently. I'm going to include 5* and 4* since those will be the most relevant abilities. Realistically though anyone with 4* at least will be able to do all the stuff a Monk should be able to since there is only one 5* Monk ability and while it's good, it shares Orbs with pretty objectively better 5* abilities.
So first you'll note I also listed what ranking of combat the character have as well, this is because every monk is both 5* Monk and 5* Combat (with the exception of Core Monk oddly enough....) . So right off the bat their available ability pool is pretty strong just from the 5* Combat angle. We're talking 5* Barrage, 4* Bladeblitz, 4* Pound, and 4* Life Siphon. Already they fit perfectly in the Life Siphon meta from that alone, but let's ignore the Combat aspect and take a look at just Monk stuff:
Weapon: Monk weapons used to be pretty bad, low attack, and not many could use them at the time. However in the various adjustment patches certain weapon types got a pretty big boost on later relics, mainly Fist weapons and Spears. These days a 5* Fist weapon tends to have pretty high attack for it's rank compared to more common swords and daggers. This means character that can use Fist weapons can bring some pretty decent damage right out the gate. That's all well and good but let's get to the meat of the issue with Monk abilities in particular:
Abilities: 3*
Kick: One hit on all targets <Physical x1.3>
Chakra: Restore HP and Increase attack of the user <20% ATK increase 25 secs>
Memento of Might: Increase attack of the user <30% ATK increase 25 sec> 4*
Pressure point: Damage and moderate chance to KO target <Physical x2.1, 50% KO>
Punishing Palm: Damage target and increase attack of user <Physical x2.1, 30% ATK increase 20 secs>
Piercing Strike: Damage target ignoring it's defense <Physical^20, ignores Defense> 5*
Exploding Fist: 5 Physical strikes on target with high chance for Critical <Physical 3.2/5, 20% Crit at x2.9>
One thing we'll note right off the bat is that Monk abilities generally tend to have two effects. There aren't a lot of abilities in play here but I'll detail the few I think are useful
Kick: Modifier isn't the best but it's only a 3* so honing it is super easy, this is great for clearing trash and personally I've got it honed to R3. Compared to it's more common 4* Cousin Bladeblitz at x1.5 modifier it's pretty nice. Sure you could just use Bladeblitz but again, one is much easier to hone than the other, and in grinding out EXP or other trash clearing scenarios you may even want both.
Punishing Palm: x2.1 modifier is solid, plus you increase your ATK on subsequent turns by 30% which is also solid. Not as useful in Shout meta since it doesn't stack but still solid damage compared to Pound's x2.3 or Life Siphon's x1.8
Piercing Strike: This one is tricky because it's actually weaker than just bringing Pound...until the enemy has 1000 DEF, then it edges it out. So on any high defense enemy, or one that packs protect etc you may actually want this in your arsenal. The downside is there are less high DEF enemies than there are high RES ones right now.
Exploding Fist: Just a solid ability in general, each hit is only at x0.58 but each hit that crits is at x0.87 meaning at minimum you are doing x2.9 damage and at maximum x4.35. Unlikely at 20% Crit per hit but on average you're looking at x3.2. The real problem here is that it uses Major Lightning Orbs which you probably want for Thief's Revenge or Full Break. Still it's certainly an option.
That's the general info so let's look at the Characters themselves. Mainly the level 80 ones since they are the ones someone is likely to use.
Tifa: Celerity 3* means she is a Tempo Flurry candidate making her good for any Slow requirements. Also her base attack at lvl 80 is 9th on the chart, pretty respectable at 169, just 1 point behind Cloud. Her RM2 gives 20% damage with Fist weapons so it's not hard to get her Attack up there. Being able to equip Light armor and Robes means she's able to use most of the common defensive relics out there. Her Burning Fist SB is only 2 hits on a single target but a 35% attack boost on the party, very solid if you lack a boostga. Dolphin blow not only gives her permanent +10 atk, but is a 4 hit attack on a single target (x1.95 each, x7.8 total) which is identical to Sephiroth's Black Materia modifier a very respectable damaging SB. It also boosts her own attack by at least 50% (I'm having trouble finding an exact number on this one) which means in the absence of Shout she can still pack a punch.
Galuf: His attack at 80 is on the lower end (160) but he can use Hammers in addition to Fists. He's pretty mediocre unless you have his Kaiser Knuckles (Tenactiy) which boost his attack by 50%, clear his debuffs, and makes him invincible for 30 seconds. He can only use Light Armor which limits his defensive options a bit, but the options he does have are typically sufficient. His RM2 is identical to Tifa.
Zell: Up and coming lvl 80 (not there yet in Global release) His attack is decent (163). He can use Celerity 4* so Dismissal is on the table as a very solid option alongside the Combat options. His RM2 is a x1.3 buff on Monk abilities, which could actually be a pretty solid increase to stuff like Exploding Fist or Piercing Strike. His SB's should you get them are Burning Rave (1 AoE hit at x3.3 + 30% ATK boostga) and Meteor Barrage (3 hits for total of x5.13) on a single target and Zell agins Protect, Shell, and Haste
Basically Monks actually do just fine currently, admittedly that's largely because every Monk is also 5* Combat so they can bring Pound or Life Siphon and pump out their SB's (which are pretty solid atm)
So if you do get any SBs for Tifa, Galuf or Zell you may actually consider them on your team, especially if you get their SSBs and they would be pretty powerful additions. Even without an SB though they have solid attack, and Combat 5* so you can fit them into pretty much any physical team, Zell especially once he gets lvl 80 as Dismissal is a really solid ability to bring.
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Good lord, Vaan's BSB is insane. Basically instant cast 7.5/5 to a single target, with a combined Magic Breakdown + Armor Breakdown, and then his two commands are quick-cast (ninja scroll speed) single hits with separate Magic Breakdown and Armor Breakdown. You can layer Full Break on top of all that and have a physical team that obliterates mage bosses.
@Delphinidaes I'm afraid you have misread the Exploding Fist effect. Each hit is 0.58x with a 20% chance to crit for 50% more damage on that hit. This results in a 2.9x multiplier with no crits and a 4.35x multiplier with five crits. The 3.2x multiplier listed in the various references (assuming you are using the PDF from Happy Pluto) is the average damage with crits factored in.
So it's still a pretty good ability, but it is nowhere near as good as your description implies.
That's good to hear. Seeing Bartz's BSSB in action is making a strong case for me to pull on his banner in the fest. Don't care what it does, looks so cool.
...
E: The best overall BSBs in Japan right now are Vaan (absolutely godlike), Gilgamesh (ditto), Celes, Faris & Tyro
And the new Thing Of The Moment in Japan is Cloud's new Overflow Soul Break (USB) weapon Ragnarok, which casts Finishing Touch, a one-hit 12x wind/non-elemental attack that breaks the damage cap. You'll know immediately if you've pulled it because its orb is a faceted rainbow-colored disco ball. Gauche awesomeness - no cool effects, but huge damage and takes 30 augments and has huge base stats. And people are complaining because apparently a 50% increase in damage multiplier doesn't make up for not having cool effects. Cry me a river.
@Delphinidaes I'm afraid you have misread the Exploding Fist effect. Each hit is 0.58x with a 20% chance to crit for 50% more damage on that hit. This results in a 2.9x multiplier with no crits and a 4.35x multiplier with five crits. The 3.2x multiplier listed in the various references (assuming you are using the PDF from Happy Pluto) is the average damage with crits factored in.
So it's still a pretty good ability, but it is nowhere near as good as your description implies.
Ohhhhhh that makes much more sense!
edit: updated my write up to include the accurate info.
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@Delphinidaes I'm afraid you have misread the Exploding Fist effect. Each hit is 0.58x with a 20% chance to crit for 50% more damage on that hit. This results in a 2.9x multiplier with no crits and a 4.35x multiplier with five crits. The 3.2x multiplier listed in the various references (assuming you are using the PDF from Happy Pluto) is the average damage with crits factored in.
So it's still a pretty good ability, but it is nowhere near as good as your description implies.
Ohhhhhh that makes much more sense!
Yeah the PDF is worded really awkwardly in some places, and also has not been updated in like a month. I'm not sure it will ever be updated again. I find Enlir's spreadsheet to be useful, though it can sometimes be difficult to find exactly what you want (like status IDs are listed very awkwardly), but it is still a good resource.
That's good to hear. Seeing Bartz's BSSB in action is making a strong case for me to pull on his banner in the fest. Don't care what it does, looks so cool.
...
E: The best overall BSBs in Japan right now are Vaan (absolutely godlike), Gilgamesh (ditto), Celes, Faris & Tyro
And the new Thing Of The Moment in Japan is Cloud's new Overflow Soul Break (USB) weapon Ragnarok, which casts Finishing Touch, a one-hit 12x wind/non-elemental attack that breaks the damage cap. You'll know immediately if you've pulled it because its orb is a faceted rainbow-colored disco ball. Gauche awesomeness - no cool effects, but huge damage and takes 30 augments and has huge base stats. And people are complaining because apparently a 50% increase in damage multiplier doesn't make up for not having cool effects. Cry me a river.
Cloud never gets cool effects on his stuff. The price of being first is also getting the most vanilla version of any specific item.
Re: spellblades. If you're using an elemental spellblade, it's probably because you want to hit a weakness with it (or you're Celes). Otherwise you'd just be using a Combat ability, which is available to a superset of characters. Here's the damage for elemental spellblades:
2*: 1.5x
3*: 1.8x
4*: 2.1x
If you're hitting a weakness, the modifier is doubled. So a 3* ability does 3.6x damage. In my experience, a 3.6x hit is usually plenty to hit the damage cap unless you're really underlevelled/undergeared/underbuffed. So the increase to a 4* ability isn't gaining you anything, and it's costing you a ton of power orbs that should probably be going towards things like Full Break.
If you have elemental boosting gear (e.g. Red Armlet X) and/or something that inflicts vulnerability (Strahl Strafe), there's more of a case for particular 4* spellblades, but that's a niche situation.
I buckled and did an 11 pull. My heart rose when I saw 4 rainbows. But then it turned out that I just pulled all the garbage items and neither of the ones I wanted. Got Laguna's coat, Zell's glove, shared dagger, and a generic throwing weapon. Monks aren't in a great place right now, which means Zell isn't really going to see any play anytime soon. Not when I already have better relics for other physical fighters. And I probably won't use Laguna either. Plus the coat isn't his good item. His machine gun is what I would want.
This used to be the case, but isn't really true anymore. Not in the current meta at least.
I'm going to spoiler this as it's a VERY long write up about the current state of Monks, largely because I recently got Tifa to 80 and was curious how viable she was on my team.
First let's look at who all can be classified as a 'Monk' currently. I'm going to include 5* and 4* since those will be the most relevant abilities. Realistically though anyone with 4* at least will be able to do all the stuff a Monk should be able to since there is only one 5* Monk ability and while it's good, it shares Orbs with pretty objectively better 5* abilities.
So first you'll note I also listed what ranking of combat the character have as well, this is because every monk is both 5* Monk and 5* Combat (with the exception of Core Monk oddly enough....) . So right off the bat their available ability pool is pretty strong just from the 5* Combat angle. We're talking 5* Barrage, 4* Bladeblitz, 4* Pound, and 4* Life Siphon. Already they fit perfectly in the Life Siphon meta from that alone, but let's ignore the Combat aspect and take a look at just Monk stuff:
Weapon: Monk weapons used to be pretty bad, low attack, and not many could use them at the time. However in the various adjustment patches certain weapon types got a pretty big boost on later relics, mainly Fist weapons and Spears. These days a 5* Fist weapon tends to have pretty high attack for it's rank compared to more common swords and daggers. This means character that can use Fist weapons can bring some pretty decent damage right out the gate. That's all well and good but let's get to the meat of the issue with Monk abilities in particular:
Abilities: 3*
Kick: One hit on all targets <Physical x1.3>
Chakra: Restore HP and Increase attack of the user <20% ATK increase 25 secs>
Memento of Might: Increase attack of the user <30% ATK increase 25 sec> 4*
Pressure point: Damage and moderate chance to KO target <Physical x2.1, 50% KO>
Punishing Palm: Damage target and increase attack of user <Physical x2.1, 30% ATK increase 20 secs>
Piercing Strike: Damage target ignoring it's defense <Physical^20, ignores Defense> 5*
Exploding Fist: 5 Physical strikes on target with high chance for Critical <Physical 3.2/5, 20% Crit at x2.9>
One thing we'll note right off the bat is that Monk abilities generally tend to have two effects. There aren't a lot of abilities in play here but I'll detail the few I think are useful
Kick: Modifier isn't the best but it's only a 3* so honing it is super easy, this is great for clearing trash and personally I've got it honed to R3. Compared to it's more common 4* Cousin Bladeblitz at x1.5 modifier it's pretty nice. Sure you could just use Bladeblitz but again, one is much easier to hone than the other, and in grinding out EXP or other trash clearing scenarios you may even want both.
Punishing Palm: x2.1 modifier is solid, plus you increase your ATK on subsequent turns by 30% which is also solid. Not as useful in Shout meta since it doesn't stack but still solid damage compared to Pound's x2.3 or Life Siphon's x1.8
Piercing Strike: This one is tricky because it's actually weaker than just bringing Pound...until the enemy has 1000 DEF, then it edges it out. So on any high defense enemy, or one that packs protect etc you may actually want this in your arsenal. The downside is there are less high DEF enemies than there are high RES ones right now.
Exploding Fist: Just a solid ability in general, each hit is only at x0.58 but each hit that crits is at x0.87 meaning at minimum you are doing x2.9 damage and at maximum x4.35. Unlikely at 20% Crit per hit but on average you're looking at x3.2. The real problem here is that it uses Major Lightning Orbs which you probably want for Thief's Revenge or Full Break. Still it's certainly an option.
That's the general info so let's look at the Characters themselves. Mainly the level 80 ones since they are the ones someone is likely to use.
Tifa: Celerity 3* means she is a Tempo Flurry candidate making her good for any Slow requirements. Also her base attack at lvl 80 is 9th on the chart, pretty respectable at 169, just 1 point behind Cloud. Her RM2 gives 20% damage with Fist weapons so it's not hard to get her Attack up there. Being able to equip Light armor and Robes means she's able to use most of the common defensive relics out there. Her Burning Fist SB is only 2 hits on a single target but a 35% attack boost on the party, very solid if you lack a boostga. Dolphin blow not only gives her permanent +10 atk, but is a 4 hit attack on a single target (x1.95 each, x7.8 total) which is identical to Sephiroth's Black Materia modifier a very respectable damaging SB. It also boosts her own attack by at least 50% (I'm having trouble finding an exact number on this one) which means in the absence of Shout she can still pack a punch.
Galuf: His attack at 80 is on the lower end (160) but he can use Hammers in addition to Fists. He's pretty mediocre unless you have his Kaiser Knuckles (Tenactiy) which boost his attack by 50%, clear his debuffs, and makes him invincible for 30 seconds. He can only use Light Armor which limits his defensive options a bit, but the options he does have are typically sufficient. His RM2 is identical to Tifa.
Zell: Up and coming lvl 80 (not there yet in Global release) His attack is decent (163). He can use Celerity 4* so Dismissal is on the table as a very solid option alongside the Combat options. His RM2 is a x1.3 buff on Monk abilities, which could actually be a pretty solid increase to stuff like Exploding Fist or Piercing Strike. His SB's should you get them are Burning Rave (1 AoE hit at x3.3 + 30% ATK boostga) and Meteor Barrage (3 hits for total of x5.13) on a single target and Zell agins Protect, Shell, and Haste
Basically Monks actually do just fine currently, admittedly that's largely because every Monk is also 5* Combat so they can bring Pound or Life Siphon and pump out their SB's (which are pretty solid atm)
So if you do get any SBs for Tifa, Galuf or Zell you may actually consider them on your team, especially if you get their SSBs and they would be pretty powerful additions. Even without an SB though they have solid attack, and Combat 5* so you can fit them into pretty much any physical team, Zell especially once he gets lvl 80 as Dismissal is a really solid ability to bring.
Monks make an interesting option for Cid's Missions. Which are weird, because what non-whale players have trinity items in more than a few realms (congrats to those with shared medicas). I've got medica in 8 (x2), 9 and 10, hastega in 8, 9 and 13, and boostga in 5, 6 and 8. And since when is protectga + shellga + FB + breakdown(s) sufficient mitigation against U/U+? Weird that my worst physical weapon synergy realm (8) is probably my best Cid's Missions realm. I'm expecting sourcing damage to be MUCH easier than sourcing mitigation for Cid's Missions.
5* Skill availability:
Some holes will be filled by new characters in coming events (e.g., Paine adds 5* Knight to X).
I'm at the point where I'm considering slowly building up the *4 Spellblades, mainly Blizzaga Blade for Ifrit, solely because I have a full compliment of 4* abilities in almost every category.
Only reason I'd consider doing it, though. Not much of a gain.
Edit: @Daffydd The pool of physical Darkness users is a bit larger than that.
Leon (II)
DK Cecil (IV)
Sephiroth (VII)
Seifer (VIII)
Jecht (X)
Unreleased:
Gabranth (XII)
Basch (XII) - Record Dive
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Managed to drop Mateus after creating and honing Syldra to rank 2
I did have to S/L once on Elnoyle when he one-punched my catgirl before any of my ATB bars were filled. Once I survived the first 5 seconds of the fight though he was a joke. Mateus was definitely tougher.
So decided to pull for physical synergy because why not. An 11 pull gave me no 5* but a 3 pull gave me sorceresses might! Turns out the game wants me to run mage parties for ff8.
Just did the Mateus fight, and the dreaded doublecast Blizzaja hit the party for 2x200 damage. (Wall, Shellga, Magic Breakdown, Full Break, Cleansing Strike)
Just did the Mateus fight, and the dreaded doublecast Blizzaja hit the party for 2x200 damage. (Wall, Shellga, Magic Breakdown, Full Break, Cleansing Strike)
I may not have Cleansing Strike, but heavy regen still means that Relm sits around twiddling her thumbs half the time.
The *4 Spellblades are a bit of a luxury. I have yet to not hit 9,999 with the 3* abilities.
I've had situations where because I have to choose Wall over offensive buff RWs that I haven't been able to cap damage with the 3*s against weaknesses. Things are a bit different now that I have a very good core and expanding of level 80s and a decent power increase with the stat sticks. However I'd rather overkill than go "Oh shit, I only hit for 6k because my ATK is shit in this realm but I have to bring wall to survive"
That said though, 4* spellblades are all the way down on the list and depending on how the next few months go with power creep, might not even happen.
The *4 Spellblades are a bit of a luxury. I have yet to not hit 9,999 with the 3* abilities.
I've had situations where because I have to choose Wall over offensive buff RWs that I haven't been able to cap damage with the 3*s against weaknesses. Things are a bit different now that I have a very good core and expanding of level 80s and a decent power increase with the stat sticks. However I'd rather overkill than go "Oh shit, I only hit for 6k because my ATK is shit in this realm but I have to bring wall to survive"
That's a fair point.
Still, your best bet, even in that situation, is getting your 4* Ajas up first. Maybe not second copies tho, I never felt the need, even with a Mage team using 3++/4++ trash rods.
Rufus Ultimate was where I saw that my collection of R3 Ajas would not have done the deed. Didn't have enough hones to get through ~310k HP before I ran out of abilities. Heck, even R4s it would have been dicey depending on how much AoE damage I could have stacked up due to only being able to bring a max of three mages (Support + WHM)
But getting multiple copies is again just an insurance measure so that I have the option to go double mage with crap stat sticks. ie: Absolute worst case scenario.
Re: spellblades. If you're using an elemental spellblade, it's probably because you want to hit a weakness with it (or you're Celes). Otherwise you'd just be using a Combat ability, which is available to a superset of characters. Here's the damage for elemental spellblades:
2*: 1.5x
3*: 1.8x
4*: 2.1x
If you're hitting a weakness, the modifier is doubled. So a 3* ability does 3.6x damage. In my experience, a 3.6x hit is usually plenty to hit the damage cap unless you're really underlevelled/undergeared/underbuffed. So the increase to a 4* ability isn't gaining you anything, and it's costing you a ton of power orbs that should probably be going towards things like Full Break.
If you have elemental boosting gear (e.g. Red Armlet X) and/or something that inflicts vulnerability (Strahl Strafe), there's more of a case for particular 4* spellblades, but that's a niche situation.
With Shout or something like that, sure. Without, no I don't agree. What was killing me on the XII +++ was Balthier, synergy up to level 67 or so, with a synergy weapon, was doing 6 to 7 thousand with the Aga Spellblade AFTER breaks. That's... not great damage.
Bergen down, full medals, no S/L. Wasn't too bad, other than almost losing people to unmitigated 3k hits before I got to take a turn. That's definitely a perk of being able to field a level 80 team rather than a level 65 team.
Cid down, full medals, ~3 S/L. First try I forgot to renew Wall, so Tyro ate a Drain for 4k and went down. Ouch. Next three runs were a comedy of execution errors, including launching Hail of Stones without a target when I intended to Tailwind (fortunately it at least went to Cid and not a Rook), and even healing Cid with a Curaja at one point when I meant to renew Reflect on him Eventually I had a run where I made few enough mistakes and got the win. That fight really made me want to get Saint's Cross up to R3, because every level of hone is a sweet 40k damage and holy crap did Cid have a lot of HP to chew through. I was about out of abilities to use when the fight was over (Tyro and Ramza were empty, I think Greg and Agrias had maybe one left each). Probably wouldn't have as big a deal if I had better realm synergy - weapons used were 5* XII dagger, 3++ XII sword, 4* XII axe, and 4* XII sword. Well below the softcap even with Shout, especially with Tyro who was only at like 260 atk on the stat screen. Also the weird item spread meant I couldn't use the nice 20% damage RMs that I'm used to. Glad I got through it.
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Anymore, sure, 3-star orbs are easy and 3-star is basically the baseline. But that's just part of power creep. It wasn't always that way. The first few months were rough. I did not get my first natural 5-star relic until the 2nd time Tifa was made available. Tifa's Grand Glove was my first relic. And that was event #20.
Not sure if you're into 5* ability territory, but I made a copy of Exploding Fist for my Galuf and I'm pretty satisfied with it. It would synergize nicely with Punishing Palm if you don't have a Boostega.
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As a recent player, I agree on the 1* and 2* items being wasted space / vendor fodder.
Strangely, 1* and 2* abilities still have a place as a new player, both because they are much easier to craft and hone, but also because higher abilities are just going to be hitting the damage cap.
MWO: Adamski
With shout, apocalypse shield and armor breakdown + full break he was doing 39996 a turn vs Elnoyle+++
Ride the pine for a bit, Cloud.
I'm gonna end up pulling pretty heavily on Banner #1 during BSB fest. Since I've got Cecil's SSB and Basch's shield, Cecil is a prime candidate for leading man in my party. I just need his Burst Soul Break to complete the set. I'm also going to hit Orb Fest pretty hard for Wind Orbs.
They actually learned a big lesson from Cloud's boring-ass unskippable motorcycle cutscene and drastically reduced the length of BSB animations
Some of them are almost as long but WAY flashier
That's good to hear. Seeing Bartz's BSSB in action is making a strong case for me to pull on his banner in the fest. Don't care what it does, looks so cool.
Starting to encroach on that holy ground. I'm eyeing off 5* abilities as a supplement for more damage and to bypass bad luck as something to work towards in the daily orb grinding. However, I'd like to work on 4* abilities first since I have limited copies or haven't got them made yet. I'd like to get the 4* spellblades because they're nice when I have a weakness I can exploit (Lightning is someone I try to fit in the team due to having her SSB) and I really want to get R4 ajas done and a second copy to R3 as secondaries if I don't have the physical powerhouses to get through Ultimates plus of course more summons. I could have theoretically done Rufus Ultimate but the numbers didn't line up; I didn't have enough ajas and hones to clock out the damage required.
6 x 1.33 Physical attacks to one target + Burst Mode
ATTACK ⇒ 4 x 0.63 Wind + Water Physical attacks to one target
DEFEND ⇒ 4 x 0.63 Fire + Earth Physical attacks to one target
and it comes on the same banner as Tyro's BSB
Shellga, Protectga, Magic Blink to all allies + Burst Mode
ATTACK ⇒ 1 x 2.1 Physical hit and reduce ATK + MAG of one target (20%)
DEFEND ⇒ 1 x 2.1 Physical hit and reduce DEF + RES of one target (20%)
E: The best overall BSBs in Japan right now are Vaan (absolutely godlike), Gilgamesh (ditto), Celes, Faris & Tyro
In fact, I just did the Iguions archaeosaurs fight in the + boss rush, and I was hitting 9999 with the 2 star blizzard strike. Granted it was on Zack, who has his SSB and was using my one synergy sword for VIII with Pride of the Red Wings, but I was still a little surprised. Also the bosses in the boss rush have very little health, like sub-60k each.
Vaan's is crazy stupid, I remember that. I doubt we'll get that Banner as is, but Bartz and Tyro look absolutely worth pulling for.
This used to be the case, but isn't really true anymore. Not in the current meta at least.
I'm going to spoiler this as it's a VERY long write up about the current state of Monks, largely because I recently got Tifa to 80 and was curious how viable she was on my team.
Level 80:
Tifa: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Galuf: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Zell: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Tyro: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Level 65:
Josef: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Refia: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Sabin: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Snow: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Amarant: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Jecht: 5* Monk 5* Combat
Level 50
Monk: 4* Monk (poor guy....)
So first you'll note I also listed what ranking of combat the character have as well, this is because every monk is both 5* Monk and 5* Combat (with the exception of Core Monk oddly enough....) . So right off the bat their available ability pool is pretty strong just from the 5* Combat angle. We're talking 5* Barrage, 4* Bladeblitz, 4* Pound, and 4* Life Siphon. Already they fit perfectly in the Life Siphon meta from that alone, but let's ignore the Combat aspect and take a look at just Monk stuff:
Weapon: Monk weapons used to be pretty bad, low attack, and not many could use them at the time. However in the various adjustment patches certain weapon types got a pretty big boost on later relics, mainly Fist weapons and Spears. These days a 5* Fist weapon tends to have pretty high attack for it's rank compared to more common swords and daggers. This means character that can use Fist weapons can bring some pretty decent damage right out the gate. That's all well and good but let's get to the meat of the issue with Monk abilities in particular:
Abilities:
3*
Kick: One hit on all targets <Physical x1.3>
Chakra: Restore HP and Increase attack of the user <20% ATK increase 25 secs>
Memento of Might: Increase attack of the user <30% ATK increase 25 sec>
4*
Pressure point: Damage and moderate chance to KO target <Physical x2.1, 50% KO>
Punishing Palm: Damage target and increase attack of user <Physical x2.1, 30% ATK increase 20 secs>
Piercing Strike: Damage target ignoring it's defense <Physical^20, ignores Defense>
5*
Exploding Fist: 5 Physical strikes on target with high chance for Critical <Physical 3.2/5, 20% Crit at x2.9>
One thing we'll note right off the bat is that Monk abilities generally tend to have two effects. There aren't a lot of abilities in play here but I'll detail the few I think are useful
Kick: Modifier isn't the best but it's only a 3* so honing it is super easy, this is great for clearing trash and personally I've got it honed to R3. Compared to it's more common 4* Cousin Bladeblitz at x1.5 modifier it's pretty nice. Sure you could just use Bladeblitz but again, one is much easier to hone than the other, and in grinding out EXP or other trash clearing scenarios you may even want both.
Punishing Palm: x2.1 modifier is solid, plus you increase your ATK on subsequent turns by 30% which is also solid. Not as useful in Shout meta since it doesn't stack but still solid damage compared to Pound's x2.3 or Life Siphon's x1.8
Piercing Strike: This one is tricky because it's actually weaker than just bringing Pound...until the enemy has 1000 DEF, then it edges it out. So on any high defense enemy, or one that packs protect etc you may actually want this in your arsenal. The downside is there are less high DEF enemies than there are high RES ones right now.
Exploding Fist: Just a solid ability in general, each hit is only at x0.58 but each hit that crits is at x0.87 meaning at minimum you are doing x2.9 damage and at maximum x4.35. Unlikely at 20% Crit per hit but on average you're looking at x3.2. The real problem here is that it uses Major Lightning Orbs which you probably want for Thief's Revenge or Full Break. Still it's certainly an option.
That's the general info so let's look at the Characters themselves. Mainly the level 80 ones since they are the ones someone is likely to use.
Tifa: Celerity 3* means she is a Tempo Flurry candidate making her good for any Slow requirements. Also her base attack at lvl 80 is 9th on the chart, pretty respectable at 169, just 1 point behind Cloud. Her RM2 gives 20% damage with Fist weapons so it's not hard to get her Attack up there. Being able to equip Light armor and Robes means she's able to use most of the common defensive relics out there. Her Burning Fist SB is only 2 hits on a single target but a 35% attack boost on the party, very solid if you lack a boostga. Dolphin blow not only gives her permanent +10 atk, but is a 4 hit attack on a single target (x1.95 each, x7.8 total) which is identical to Sephiroth's Black Materia modifier a very respectable damaging SB. It also boosts her own attack by at least 50% (I'm having trouble finding an exact number on this one) which means in the absence of Shout she can still pack a punch.
Galuf: His attack at 80 is on the lower end (160) but he can use Hammers in addition to Fists. He's pretty mediocre unless you have his Kaiser Knuckles (Tenactiy) which boost his attack by 50%, clear his debuffs, and makes him invincible for 30 seconds. He can only use Light Armor which limits his defensive options a bit, but the options he does have are typically sufficient. His RM2 is identical to Tifa.
Zell: Up and coming lvl 80 (not there yet in Global release) His attack is decent (163). He can use Celerity 4* so Dismissal is on the table as a very solid option alongside the Combat options. His RM2 is a x1.3 buff on Monk abilities, which could actually be a pretty solid increase to stuff like Exploding Fist or Piercing Strike. His SB's should you get them are Burning Rave (1 AoE hit at x3.3 + 30% ATK boostga) and Meteor Barrage (3 hits for total of x5.13) on a single target and Zell agins Protect, Shell, and Haste
Basically Monks actually do just fine currently, admittedly that's largely because every Monk is also 5* Combat so they can bring Pound or Life Siphon and pump out their SB's (which are pretty solid atm)
So if you do get any SBs for Tifa, Galuf or Zell you may actually consider them on your team, especially if you get their SSBs and they would be pretty powerful additions. Even without an SB though they have solid attack, and Combat 5* so you can fit them into pretty much any physical team, Zell especially once he gets lvl 80 as Dismissal is a really solid ability to bring.
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Monk stats aren't great but like with all things, if you got a relic they're super viable.
So it's still a pretty good ability, but it is nowhere near as good as your description implies.
And the new Thing Of The Moment in Japan is Cloud's new Overflow Soul Break (USB) weapon Ragnarok, which casts Finishing Touch, a one-hit 12x wind/non-elemental attack that breaks the damage cap. You'll know immediately if you've pulled it because its orb is a faceted rainbow-colored disco ball. Gauche awesomeness - no cool effects, but huge damage and takes 30 augments and has huge base stats. And people are complaining because apparently a 50% increase in damage multiplier doesn't make up for not having cool effects. Cry me a river.
Ohhhhhh that makes much more sense!
edit: updated my write up to include the accurate info.
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Yeah the PDF is worded really awkwardly in some places, and also has not been updated in like a month. I'm not sure it will ever be updated again. I find Enlir's spreadsheet to be useful, though it can sometimes be difficult to find exactly what you want (like status IDs are listed very awkwardly), but it is still a good resource.
Cloud never gets cool effects on his stuff. The price of being first is also getting the most vanilla version of any specific item.
2*: 1.5x
3*: 1.8x
4*: 2.1x
If you're hitting a weakness, the modifier is doubled. So a 3* ability does 3.6x damage. In my experience, a 3.6x hit is usually plenty to hit the damage cap unless you're really underlevelled/undergeared/underbuffed. So the increase to a 4* ability isn't gaining you anything, and it's costing you a ton of power orbs that should probably be going towards things like Full Break.
If you have elemental boosting gear (e.g. Red Armlet X) and/or something that inflicts vulnerability (Strahl Strafe), there's more of a case for particular 4* spellblades, but that's a niche situation.
Monks make an interesting option for Cid's Missions. Which are weird, because what non-whale players have trinity items in more than a few realms (congrats to those with shared medicas). I've got medica in 8 (x2), 9 and 10, hastega in 8, 9 and 13, and boostga in 5, 6 and 8. And since when is protectga + shellga + FB + breakdown(s) sufficient mitigation against U/U+? Weird that my worst physical weapon synergy realm (8) is probably my best Cid's Missions realm. I'm expecting sourcing damage to be MUCH easier than sourcing mitigation for Cid's Missions.
5* Skill availability:
5* Physical damage skill availability in realms, per class (accurate-ish):
Combat: 1-13, FFT
Celerity: 2, 4-13, FFT
Dark: 2, 4, 7, 8, 10 (not counting mages)
Dragoon: 2, 4, 7, 9, 10, 13
Knight: 1-6, 8, 9, 12, 13, FFT
Machinist: 6-8, 10-13
Monk: 2, 3, 5-10, 13
Ninja: 4, 6, 7, 14
Samurai: 5-7, 10
Spellblade: 5, 6
Support: 2, 4-FFT
Thief: 2, 5-7, 9-12
5* Magical damage skill availability in realms, per class (accurate-ish):
Black: 2-13
Dark: 4-9 (not counting physical)
Ninja: 4, 6, 7, 14
Summon: 3-13
White: 2-14
Edited in response to Shamus's comment re: Dark skill users. I'm (somewhat) trying not to include unreleased and Record Dived characters.
Only reason I'd consider doing it, though. Not much of a gain.
Edit:
@Daffydd The pool of physical Darkness users is a bit larger than that.
Leon (II)
DK Cecil (IV)
Sephiroth (VII)
Seifer (VIII)
Jecht (X)
Unreleased:
Gabranth (XII)
Basch (XII) - Record Dive
Just did the Mateus fight, and the dreaded doublecast Blizzaja hit the party for 2x200 damage. (Wall, Shellga, Magic Breakdown, Full Break, Cleansing Strike)
I may not have Cleansing Strike, but heavy regen still means that Relm sits around twiddling her thumbs half the time.
I've had situations where because I have to choose Wall over offensive buff RWs that I haven't been able to cap damage with the 3*s against weaknesses. Things are a bit different now that I have a very good core and expanding of level 80s and a decent power increase with the stat sticks. However I'd rather overkill than go "Oh shit, I only hit for 6k because my ATK is shit in this realm but I have to bring wall to survive"
That said though, 4* spellblades are all the way down on the list and depending on how the next few months go with power creep, might not even happen.
That's a fair point.
Still, your best bet, even in that situation, is getting your 4* Ajas up first. Maybe not second copies tho, I never felt the need, even with a Mage team using 3++/4++ trash rods.
But getting multiple copies is again just an insurance measure so that I have the option to go double mage with crap stat sticks. ie: Absolute worst case scenario.
With Shout or something like that, sure. Without, no I don't agree. What was killing me on the XII +++ was Balthier, synergy up to level 67 or so, with a synergy weapon, was doing 6 to 7 thousand with the Aga Spellblade AFTER breaks. That's... not great damage.
Cid down, full medals, ~3 S/L. First try I forgot to renew Wall, so Tyro ate a Drain for 4k and went down. Ouch. Next three runs were a comedy of execution errors, including launching Hail of Stones without a target when I intended to Tailwind (fortunately it at least went to Cid and not a Rook), and even healing Cid with a Curaja at one point when I meant to renew Reflect on him