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[Starcraft Remastered] Now Live!

1456810

Posts

  • Lord_AsmodeusLord_Asmodeus goeticSobriquet: Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered User regular
    Raynor is mashup of his original and SC2 appearance, it looks like. Same facial structure as in the later games, but with the close shaved hair n beard of the original.

    He looked like that in the Wings of Liberty flashback CGI scene where they abandoned Kerrigan - he's visible on a screen next to Mengsk with his short hair.

    Also he was never blonde! I always thought he was black til SC2 happened. ;P

    He had, at the very least, much lighter hair than they present in SC2 and they've gone more with this SC2 look than his SC1 look. And this is what Sarah Kerrigan looked like before they changed her

    ukefid0.png

    and this is what she looks like in the remaster

    Sarah_Kerrigan_SCR.png

    That's a totally different person

    Lord_Asmodeus.gifLord_Asmodeus2.gifz1i30sg.png
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited August 2017
    aside from the hairstyle I don't really see a difference.

    certainly not one that can't be explained away by the impossibility of illustrating fine facial features with 7 total pixels

    Dhalphir on
    3clipseMMMigBrodyWingedWeasel
  • UselesswarriorUselesswarrior Registered User regular
    I have to say that this game looks pretty amazing now that I've played it. Aside from the portrait and maybe then Hyras they did a pretty amazing job of perserving the original art. So much so that I was sure the game always looked like this until I switched it off of hd.

    Hey I made a game, check it out @ http://ifallingrobot.com/. (Or don't, your call)
    KetBra3clipseBrody
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    I have to say that this game looks pretty amazing now that I've played it. Aside from the portrait and maybe then Hyras they did a pretty amazing job of perserving the original art. So much so that I was sure the game always looked like this until I switched it off of hd.

    interestingly the team actually said something to that effect during the later stages of development; something along the lines of "in people's minds, this is how the game looks. This is how they remember it, and even for those playing it still to this day, they've got so much love for the game and such an idealized version of it that when we sat some of them down in front of early alphas of Remastered, many of them didn't even pick up on it immediately"

    3clipseDarkMechakime
  • KetBraKetBra FISTS OF JUSTICE! Registered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    I have to say that this game looks pretty amazing now that I've played it. Aside from the portrait and maybe then Hyras they did a pretty amazing job of perserving the original art. So much so that I was sure the game always looked like this until I switched it off of hd.

    interestingly the team actually said something to that effect during the later stages of development; something along the lines of "in people's minds, this is how the game looks. This is how they remember it, and even for those playing it still to this day, they've got so much love for the game and such an idealized version of it that when we sat some of them down in front of early alphas of Remastered, many of them didn't even pick up on it immediately"

    Yeah, sitting down with this for a bit today, and aside from the portraits, it felt and looked like I was playing exactly the same game, from my memory. I think it speaks to the extent to which they managed to duplicate the original, and to the strength of the original's art design.

    The pathfinding definitely feels the same

    ohKiGmg.png
    Steam Bnet:KetBra#1692 Yo Satan
    DarkMechashryke
  • Lord_AsmodeusLord_Asmodeus goeticSobriquet: Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    aside from the hairstyle I don't really see a difference.

    certainly not one that can't be explained away by the impossibility of illustrating fine facial features with 7 total pixels

    Her eye color, skin color, and facial structure are all different. Top Kerrigan has a long lean face, small nose, tanned skin, and green eyes. Bottom Kerrigan has a shorter face, round cheeks, a larger nose, blue eyes and pale skin. I mean it's not the end of the world but Kerrigan 2 is basically a different woman from Kerrigan 1, like in Starcraft 2 and now in remastered they spent basically 0 effort in actually translating the character the original team made into a more detailed model. I know the first Kerrigan's portrait isn't a highly detailed masterpiece, but that doesn't like a real excuse for the laziness that lead to them basically just taking Nova and slapping Kerrigan's hair color on her and calling it a day. Hell, I bet the only reason they change Kerrigan's eye color from green to blue is that Nova's eyes are green and they thought it would be a bit too obvious if they didn't change them.

    Like I said, it's not the end of the world it's just annoying and lazy and it does effect the story to a small degree. They did not do a great job of updating Kerrigan or Mengsks' portraits into the remaster and that's a bit disappointing.

    Lord_Asmodeus.gifLord_Asmodeus2.gifz1i30sg.png
    BRIAN BLESSED
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    yeah same, I am gonna have ISSUES without grid, and it makes me wonder how much I wanna play considering I do intend to keep playing sc2

    NONY IS THERE today, very happy to see him, been a long long time.

    Can you not simply rebind all keys appropriately to emulate grid? SC2 allows you to bind the same key to more than one ability, so it should be possible, just laborious.

    yeah I think I could

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • UselesswarriorUselesswarrior Registered User regular
    Re: grid keys

    You can go through and set everything to grid style keys manually. BUT shortcuts aren't allowed multiple bindings and for commands like rally that are at different grid positions this means you can't have true grid keys. Ultimately you have decide which variant of command card you want to be grid and the other card will have a binding that doesn't make sense grid wise.

    If they were race specific I believe you could go grid keys. Might be a good feature request.

    Hey I made a game, check it out @ http://ifallingrobot.com/. (Or don't, your call)
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    KetBra wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    I have to say that this game looks pretty amazing now that I've played it. Aside from the portrait and maybe then Hyras they did a pretty amazing job of perserving the original art. So much so that I was sure the game always looked like this until I switched it off of hd.

    interestingly the team actually said something to that effect during the later stages of development; something along the lines of "in people's minds, this is how the game looks. This is how they remember it, and even for those playing it still to this day, they've got so much love for the game and such an idealized version of it that when we sat some of them down in front of early alphas of Remastered, many of them didn't even pick up on it immediately"

    Yeah, sitting down with this for a bit today, and aside from the portraits, it felt and looked like I was playing exactly the same game, from my memory. I think it speaks to the extent to which they managed to duplicate the original, and to the strength of the original's art design.

    The pathfinding definitely feels the same

    Pathfinding is still pretty weird but it's at least a little better, Dragoons don't seem to pace nearly as much.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    KetBra wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    I have to say that this game looks pretty amazing now that I've played it. Aside from the portrait and maybe then Hyras they did a pretty amazing job of perserving the original art. So much so that I was sure the game always looked like this until I switched it off of hd.

    interestingly the team actually said something to that effect during the later stages of development; something along the lines of "in people's minds, this is how the game looks. This is how they remember it, and even for those playing it still to this day, they've got so much love for the game and such an idealized version of it that when we sat some of them down in front of early alphas of Remastered, many of them didn't even pick up on it immediately"

    Yeah, sitting down with this for a bit today, and aside from the portraits, it felt and looked like I was playing exactly the same game, from my memory. I think it speaks to the extent to which they managed to duplicate the original, and to the strength of the original's art design.

    The pathfinding definitely feels the same

    Pathfinding is still pretty weird but it's at least a little better, Dragoons don't seem to pace nearly as much.

    It hasn't changed. They very deliberately did not change anything like that.

    MMMigBloodySlothUselesswarriorkime
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    KetBra wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    I have to say that this game looks pretty amazing now that I've played it. Aside from the portrait and maybe then Hyras they did a pretty amazing job of perserving the original art. So much so that I was sure the game always looked like this until I switched it off of hd.

    interestingly the team actually said something to that effect during the later stages of development; something along the lines of "in people's minds, this is how the game looks. This is how they remember it, and even for those playing it still to this day, they've got so much love for the game and such an idealized version of it that when we sat some of them down in front of early alphas of Remastered, many of them didn't even pick up on it immediately"

    Yeah, sitting down with this for a bit today, and aside from the portraits, it felt and looked like I was playing exactly the same game, from my memory. I think it speaks to the extent to which they managed to duplicate the original, and to the strength of the original's art design.

    The pathfinding definitely feels the same

    Pathfinding is still pretty weird but it's at least a little better, Dragoons don't seem to pace nearly as much.

    It hasn't changed. They very deliberately did not change anything like that.

    Guess I'm just lucky!

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
  • BRIAN BLESSEDBRIAN BLESSED Maybe you aren't SPEAKING LOUDLY ENOUGHHH Registered User regular
    edited August 2017
    I'm okay with Kerrigan's portrait (I think her older one is probably more visually distinct because of the way her hair frames her face) and Mengsk's one honestly looks p similar to the old one. So far down the campaign the portrait that makes me laugh (besides Raynor's kind of shoddy one) is the Firebat, because he looks like just as much of an indistinguishable gremlin as he did in the original and I don't know where his face ends and his firebat suit begins.

    Most other assets of the game look very much like an idealised, up-rezzed version of the original and they definitely capture the spirit of the old sprites. They look kind of funny when you zoom in super close, kind of like Harebrained Schemes' artwork in their Shadowrun games, but that's where sprite work is at when you have to deal with 4K ultra high definition in 2017

    BRIAN BLESSED on
  • swaylowswaylow Registered User regular
    I made an impulse purchase of Remastered last night after the 2nd day of Day9's stream ended.

    It just occurred to me that my Surface Book may not have the juice to run the updated graphics. I didn't even think about it, cause, ya know, 19 year old game and all...

    Wish me luck!

  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    Call me crazy, but I still find Broodwar a much better game than SC2. It's so much more about unit tactics whereas SC2 felt like an AoE game where you were just grinding economies against each other (even Day9 says it's more about income and food count than army comp and tactics).

    What really struck me is how much less economy macro I have to do in BW. Every race in SC2 has you fussing with economy micromanagement that felt like busy work.

    In BW, I'm keeping my covert ops center secret in a hidden area because Ghosts with lockdown will be devastating to his mech force and I need to catch him by surprise with it.
    In SC2, I'm going back to all my hatcheries every 30 seconds because I have to manually inject larva again.

    In BW, I'm setting up a picket line because a queens or science vessels can sneak in and pick off an expensive unit.
    In SC2, I'm dropping MULES.

    In BW, I'm setting up a counter-picket line to quickly destroy the enemy picket to sneak in a spell caster that can be devastating with a properly placed irradiate/broodling/storm/plague.
    In SC2, I'm going back every 30 seconds to manually spread creep.


    I'm just having way more fun with Brood War. I'm actually able to concentrate on tactics because a) They matter more, and b) I actually have time for them because I'm not forced to constantly go back to economy micro or get left in the dust.

    3clipseswaylowDhalphir38thDoeLord_AsmodeusIvan Hunger
  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Aye, mules, spawning larva, and chrono boosting were basically busy work mandatory to keep up with macro.


    Ultimately it just became a boring unfun task that all races had to do and the only "challenge" was the apm to keep all of that up.

    Granted, they removed the busy work of having to tell workers to mine in SC2 and put in relay mining, but they replaced it with a much more dull and unforgiving mechanic as those mentioned above.

    l4lGvOw.png
    Witty signature comment goes here...

    wra
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited August 2017
    every mule drop in sc2 is instead in BW having to go back like 6 times to make your scvs actually mine, or to your rax to produce

    I've never heard complaints of the sort I am reading right now, that sc2 requires more effort to macro than BW. or that tactics don't mean much, hrm.

    I'm in no way trying to argue they're the same or that sc2 is better... they are different. I don't think either is better, they're both extremely good and well balanced RTS games. both a blast to watch and play.

    and to be 100% clear, you should enjoy the one you enjoy and I look forward to playing either one with you!

    Variable on
    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
    WingedWeaselshrykekime
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited August 2017
    Re: grid keys

    You can go through and set everything to grid style keys manually. BUT shortcuts aren't allowed multiple bindings and for commands like rally that are at different grid positions this means you can't have true grid keys. Ultimately you have decide which variant of command card you want to be grid and the other card will have a binding that doesn't make sense grid wise.

    If they were race specific I believe you could go grid keys. Might be a good feature request.

    I'm finding your first paragraph a bit confusing to read but based on the second it seems that if I mostly intend to play one race I should be fine approximating grid. and that's great because TERRAN OR DEATH


    biggest hotkey bummer for me right now is that there's only 3 camera hotkeys and I can't change them.

    Variable on
    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited August 2017
    MrBody wrote: »
    b) I actually have time for them because I'm not forced to constantly go back to economy micro or get left in the dust.

    If you have more time for micro in BW than in SC2 then you're not managing your BW economy properly. Workers don't auto rally, buildings can't be selected in multiples. That alone adds minutes to your economy management cycle.

    Dhalphir on
    VariableWingedWeasel3clipseUselesswarriorshrykekime
  • WingedWeaselWingedWeasel Registered User regular
    I was watching grubby leave dozens of workers just idling the other day. Obviously not intentionally and he still crushed the other person . It's fine to like BW more than SC2, but I also find some of the comments a little strange

    shrykekime
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    I like the actual units and how significant each one feels in BW a lot more, and that fights aren't just AoE deathballs crashing into each other until someone falls over. I think the art is overall better too.

    The economic and macro parts of BW are waaaaay worse.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
    DarkMecha
  • KrathoonKrathoon Registered User regular
    So, it is all good except for Kerrigan's eyes.

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited August 2017
    3clipse wrote: »
    I like the actual units and how significant each one feels in BW a lot more, and that fights aren't just AoE deathballs crashing into each other until someone falls over. I think the art is overall better too.

    The economic and macro parts of BW are waaaaay worse.

    I agree to an extent, but I also completely understand why they chose to make no changes to it. Apart from wanting to keep the game identical, the fact is that you just can't predict what effect any individual change would have on the game. Imagine if they added multiple building selection and nothing else. That alone frees up a huge chunk of time from your macro, and maybe all of a sudden some micro elements start to become a bit unbalanced because Terrans suddenly don't have to click through 20 barracks against Zerg one by one, but instead have tons of extra time to control their marines.

    Brood War is one of the happiest accidents in gaming history, that it turned out to be as long-lived and relatively well-balanced as it is. You don't fuck with any part of a game like that, for fear that it invokes the butterfly effect.

    They originally weren't even going to allow custom hotkeys.

    Dhalphir on
    WingedWeaselBloodySlothLord_Asmodeuskime
  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    Don't forget how the early alpha used the Warcraft 2 engine.

    starcraft_alpha_build.jpg?type=w2

    As far as macro, you also don't need as many buildings in BW because you don't have the huge additional income from all that economy macro stuff.

    The main thing is that the spellcasters are so much deadlier and plain fun in BW. With the right comp and tactics, it was very realistic to defeat a force 3 times your own. That would never in a million years happen in SC2. If someone is outproducing you by even 50%, you're screwed. Comp and tactics might give you a slight edge but nothing huge. Plus every second you're spending on tactics micro, you're missing economy micro.

    I still have no clue why they couldn't make larva/MULES/Chrono have an auto cast option. Just struck me as an elitist thing, like it was the same people who fought against having an in-game clock.

    Golden Yak38thDoe
  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    I remember back in the day goofing off in FMP maps and you could have like 20 templars just annihilate waves of enemies. But in sc2 templars probably cant kill a zergling with a single cast. Which is probably why blob strats work so well, there isnt a really good way to force people to break them up.

    3ds FC: 0645 - 7166 - 9801
    3clipse
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    I like the actual units and how significant each one feels in BW a lot more, and that fights aren't just AoE deathballs crashing into each other until someone falls over. I think the art is overall better too.

    The economic and macro parts of BW are waaaaay worse.

    I agree to an extent, but I also completely understand why they chose to make no changes to it. Apart from wanting to keep the game identical, the fact is that you just can't predict what effect any individual change would have on the game. Imagine if they added multiple building selection and nothing else. That alone frees up a huge chunk of time from your macro, and maybe all of a sudden some micro elements start to become a bit unbalanced because Terrans suddenly don't have to click through 20 barracks against Zerg one by one, but instead have tons of extra time to control their marines.

    Brood War is one of the happiest accidents in gaming history, that it turned out to be as long-lived and relatively well-balanced as it is. You don't fuck with any part of a game like that, for fear that it invokes the butterfly effect.

    They originally weren't even going to allow custom hotkeys.

    Oh I was just comparing SC2 to BW, not saying they should have changed things. I totally get why they left it alone.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Enigmedic wrote: »
    I remember back in the day goofing off in FMP maps and you could have like 20 templars just annihilate waves of enemies. But in sc2 templars probably cant kill a zergling with a single cast. Which is probably why blob strats work so well, there isnt a really good way to force people to break them up.

    Ah, yes, SC2 storms absolutely can kill Zerglings with a single cast.

    However, you're right that overall, SC2 storms are much weaker than BW storms. This is because of how utterly broken they'd be if they were as strong as BW storms. Units in SC2 naturally clump up, you can't make them not clump even if you want to. AOE abilities have to be balanced with that in mind.

  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    Did they get rid of the black shroud for multiplayer? That was one of the other unfortunate archaic holdovers of BW.

    Uselesswarrior
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited August 2017
    They did not.

    Which actually is one of my only complaints and something I think they could have changed without affecting the game. SC2's method of greying out the map rather than blacking it out was a great way to make it less punishing to play on an unpopular map. I think it falls into the same category of cosmetic interface improvements as hotkeys do.

    However I don't think it would have been possible. SC:R is fully backwards compatible with the original Brood War, you can even toggle the graphics on the fly. So anything like that, I imagine, would be too significant a change to allow it to continue to be compatible.

    Dhalphir on
  • Duke 2.0Duke 2.0 Time Trash Cat Registered User regular
    Could you modify a map to reveal the map except spawn positions for a brief moment at the start of the game?

    VRXwDW7.png
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited August 2017
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    I like the actual units and how significant each one feels in BW a lot more, and that fights aren't just AoE deathballs crashing into each other until someone falls over. I think the art is overall better too.

    The economic and macro parts of BW are waaaaay worse.

    I agree to an extent, but I also completely understand why they chose to make no changes to it. Apart from wanting to keep the game identical, the fact is that you just can't predict what effect any individual change would have on the game. Imagine if they added multiple building selection and nothing else. That alone frees up a huge chunk of time from your macro, and maybe all of a sudden some micro elements start to become a bit unbalanced because Terrans suddenly don't have to click through 20 barracks against Zerg one by one, but instead have tons of extra time to control their marines.

    Brood War is one of the happiest accidents in gaming history, that it turned out to be as long-lived and relatively well-balanced as it is. You don't fuck with any part of a game like that, for fear that it invokes the butterfly effect.

    They originally weren't even going to allow custom hotkeys.

    I think most of us (at least those of us that were in the sc2 thread watching and p[laying for multiple years) are on the same page with being happy they made no changes. not sure who else has been watching tastosis cast 2 seasons of brood war this year but if anyone else has I'm sure you're with me in hoping they use remastered going forward (although I do not expect it... truly unsure). a VERY cool feature I saw in the menu is, you can set it so basically the mouse acts as though you're playing in full screen even while in wide screen. ie the amount of movement it takes to get the mouse from your minimap to the far right side of the screen can be made to be the exact same in widescreen as it would have been in fullscreen. for pros I'm sure we can all agree that's a feature that at least makes it plausible that they could switch to remastered. without that, can you even imagine the pain in the ass to relearn simple mouse movements after 10-15 years of refinement and perfection?



    edit - legacy of the void did a lot for the blob vs. blob - ness of sc2.

    Variable on
    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • UselesswarriorUselesswarrior Registered User regular
    How do you zoom out while playing?

    Or is that replay only?

    Hey I made a game, check it out @ http://ifallingrobot.com/. (Or don't, your call)
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    How do you zoom out while playing?

    Or is that replay only?

    Observer feature only.

  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    I played a game! got very crushed but my opponent was very nice!

    !

    great experience, if I'm gonna lose I'll take it that way every time.

    all I did was make stuff and then die. the idea of actually having to use my army is... well let's just say I tried to move out at the end and it took like 5 minutes to do anything and I couldn't find my army most of the time.

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
    DarkMechaMr Fuzzbutt
  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular

    Good LORD creep takes like 20 minutes to clear

    l4lGvOw.png
    Witty signature comment goes here...

    wra
  • KetBraKetBra FISTS OF JUSTICE! Registered User regular
    Man, 13 year old me remembers the campaign being much much more difficult

    ohKiGmg.png
    Steam Bnet:KetBra#1692 Yo Satan
    MMMig3clipseDhalphir38thDoeMr FuzzbuttKoopahTroopahLord_AsmodeusBRIAN BLESSED
  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Yeah, 2 control groups and most missions are done deal

    still fun though I'm skipping the chatter now since I re-heard it all on youtube a couple of weeks ago ^^'

    l4lGvOw.png
    Witty signature comment goes here...

    wra
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    KetBra wrote: »
    Man, 13 year old me remembers the campaign being much much more difficult

    Same, I remember strugglebussing. Now it's just like make 3 or 4 control groups and a-move, done.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
  • CyrenicCyrenic Registered User regular
    Is the matchmaking any good for the multiplayer? Will it actually find people as bad as I am at the game?

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Cyrenic wrote: »
    Is the matchmaking any good for the multiplayer? Will it actually find people as bad as I am at the game?

    Any ELO system is good with a sufficiently large playerbase if you are patient and give it a dozen games or so to learn your skill level

  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    Go ahead and try the Skezars Scavengers missions, theyll probably be a little bit harder lol

    3ds FC: 0645 - 7166 - 9801
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