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How to avoid getting my voice shut down?
SophieSophie
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
So many times I feel like women's voices are silenced, and there are so many times in my life when I've been told that my voice isn't welcome, or it isn't the right time for a woman's voice.
I found a great article here about this issue, but would love advice from anyone else about how to deal with this traumatic issue? Thank you!
I found a great article here about this issue, but would love advice from anyone else about how to deal with this traumatic issue? Thank you!
Iruka on
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This is something most non-white, middle class, straight, male folks still struggle with, there isn't going to be a magic bullet sadly. My boss is a tenured professor who leads in her field, but several times a year has less established colleagues eat up her presentation time because they can. Despite her standing and education, she is often listed as her first name rather than Dr. So-and-so (which is how the rest of the introductions of her male colleagues go). This shit is endemic even in academia, where things are arguably better than most of the private sector.
I can only speak for myself, but as a white, middle class, straight male person when I was informed I was mansplaining something, I immediately apologized and took some introspection to determine when and for how long I had been doing that. Having it pointed out to me helped me realize things. I doubt most folks will be that way, but a lot are. Which is why being firm and polite about it may get you some degree of success. But there will be plenty of times when jerks will be jerks, and they will refuse to listen to you. And I don't think anyone knows of a way to get through with close-minded individuals.
Arguably this entire post is mansplaining to a degree, though through it I am simply passing along what my boss has told me is her strategy for dealing with this.
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Frankly, if people don't give two shits about you, there's little motivation for them to hear what you have to say. It's not a problem exclusive to women.
So when you speak publicly, ask "What's in it for them? What will they get out of listening to me?" and then figure out if any of that is what they actually want. If it isn't, then there's no point in speaking there, you have no social currency, and people will go listen to someone else they find more interesting. Don't take it personally. If you are speaking in a forum where people are there to re-enforce their beliefs and world views, speak true to those beliefs and world views and watch how many will suddenly pay attention.
Guys try to talk over you you talk right over them
Yeah there's an additional little burden that you have to be better and louder and more assertive--so take it on and do it.
It's not easy advice to take, right, because you get socialized to think that it's completely rude to interrupt even if some guy just interrupted you, and people around you will absolutely think of you as arrogant (for displaying the same degree of confidence as a man) and overly aggressive or bitchy. But there isn't really a good alternative.
You're MechE, right? So that's going to be like...90% guys, and you have to contend with being "the only one in the room" sometimes, and probably zero of your professors are female and people will be full of completely bullshit assumptions about your natural abilities in the field, or once you graduate they'll be like 'oh our clients don't want to work with women' and it is...quite bad, but it is also the way things are and probably will be for at least another generation or three. You have to decide whether you will put yourself forward and push back, or be ok with being quiet and less assertive and sometimes getting overlooked or mistreated (and hoping the quality of your work silently speaks for itself--which sometimes it does!)
I'm talking about this from a very academic or professional perspective. Let us know if you mean in more social situations or what (although my advice is the same).
I get that this can be hard if you are shyer and also harder the more femme-presenting you are. My undergrad physics major had 0 female professors and I had 0 female classmates, so I very much *get it*--but I'm also naturally pretty aggro and also not a feminine person so this is never a big problem for me. For my sister, a shyer and more feminine stats+cs person, it's different, and I'm not sure how she contends with it.
Also you like dropping the buzzwords of young internetty progressives, and that's fine here and we know what you mean, but I think it's going to get you a lot of pushback elsewhere. Do you really mean this is a traumatic issue? Or do you mean that it's an issue that is aggravating af and risks costing you half a grade point here and there (if you let a guy take the accolades for group work in a class) as well as nice resume-boosting opportunities if you feel edged out of leadership opportunities in campus organizations? Or have people been so awful in the past that you legit feel shut down and intimidated in every situation (in which case: therapy, for sure).
Feel free to PM if you want to discuss more; I enjoy talking about the circumstances women in STEM fields face
As a male, I was asked to be someone's ally in this regard in the past, and it had the dual benefit of not only making me much more sensitive to when others do it, but also when I myself do it. Having an ally it puts some of the pressure off of you, and people are often more receptive to these kinds of things when they are brought up by others who aren't the victims (or women) themselves. It can be as simple as someone else interrupting the interrupter and saying, "I'm sorry, I was really interested to hear what X had to say, can we let her finish her thoughts first?". Or it can be something on the side, like part of a different conversation after the meeting where they make a non-accusatory observation such as, "Did you notice how X said this idea first and Y repeated it later?" or, "I wish I had as much patience as X does whenever she gets interrupted, I would hate to always get drowned out like that."
You may also find more resources available nowadays that tackle these issues head-on, such as training seminars. In many cases, people are conditioned to behave this way and are unaware that they are doing it. Helping them come to that realization without singling them out or persecuting them can often help both their own introspection and the larger culture within which they operate. However, it may not do much good against particular individuals who are blatantly sexist or bullies.
It is the worst advice. When you lean in, you are just furthering the culture that silenced you. You should not have to act like a man just to be heard.
BE a woman, and do the things the way you feel you is right for you and comes natural to you. If you just give up, and think "Its a man's world, gotta be more aggressive and assertive like a man" you will never truly find your own voice. Your entire experience in life will be like a passenger. When you feel like that, it means you have not truly found yourself, and if you don't know yourself, you can't have a confident voice. And certainly no one will care what you have to say.
Leaning in is no guarantee that you will be heard. You can shout, stomp your fist and your feet and argue breathlessly to be heard, and still be ignored all the same. If your message doesn't fall in line, you're out. There are women who spend their lives leaning in, faithful that it will make them who they want to be, until one day they find they've leaned in all the way and it's too late.
The problem again is not you, it's the people. They do not want to listen to you. They might hear you, but it doesn't mean they are listening. There's only one thing you can do. Reject those who do not see your value, and go be with the ones that do. Don't try to squeeze blood from a stone. The only blood will be from your hands.
Being aggressive doesn't mean being "like a man."
You can be a woman in any number of different ways and it's ridiculous to claim otherwise.
It can be hard to disentangle what is "natural"-feeling and what is a result of years of being told to be pretty and shut up. Leaning in means deciding you don't feel like listening to those voices any more.
It is not practical or realistic advice to reject every situation where you encounter sexism or people who have become habituated to talking over women (...because that's every situation. Almost).
It is bizarrely paternalistic and troubling to assume someone would lose themselves by being more assertive because that's somehow not natural to women.
This is not being aggressive, it's throwing a tantrum. No one should do the bolded regardless of who they are. This is also an extremely unfortunate way to characterize a woman being aggressive.
OP: Credeiki's advice is solid. I work in a male dominated field and the most successful women, the ones that are my bosses, they pushed against people trying to get them to be quiet. It rarely convinced the person they argued with but that person wasn't the only one in the room.
The sad reality is there's almost definitely a group that, when you're not around, bemoans the inclusion of women. You could ace every exam and pull off every lab flawlessly, to them you're someone they have to behave differently around and that's all. There's no appeasing them so I'd recommend not bothering.
As far as being shy, I can identify with that. Starting out I was relatively withdrawn and avoided conflict. The best advice I have for that is find a mentor if you can. It can be a major boost knowing you have someone that has your back and to be available for advice. The other part sounds trite but the phrase "fake it til you make it" has some truth to it. When I started pushing back against people I was terrified. But I imitated my boss at the time and managed to get a couple successes. If you appear confident, even if you don't feel it personally, people will think it.
Leaning In is a bullshit fad that ultimately sacrifices long term progress for short term gains, that's if it even works at all. Sexist men these days know how to deal with women who are trying to "lean in".