I've been trying to figure out where to put the blame on for that one since it got published a week ago. I think it's primarily AAPD, then the university generally and especially the Title IX office (which I have consistently heard sucks). I think I'm less troubled by the athletic department directly (though indirectly it probably influenced AAPD/prosecutors, I'm not naive) I'm also not totally clear on the timeline on what Harbaugh knew and when and about whom so I can judge how he handled it. Which is further complicated by the Trump administration being pro-rape and preventing anybody at universities from punishing people for sexual harassment without a formal hearing in their revision to the Title IX regulations. Title IX office held no such hearing.
Also not fun fact: the bystander player O'Maury Samuels that should have been interviewed in this case was...kicked off the team for domestic violence.
Also for clarity: she didn't kill herself, she took fentanyl laced cocaine. The trauma fed her addiction, according to all her friends, so that was still the ultimate cause of her death.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
I've been trying to figure out where to put the blame on for that one since it got published a week ago. I think it's primarily AAPD, then the university generally and especially the Title IX office (which I have consistently heard sucks). I think I'm less troubled by the athletic department directly (though indirectly it probably influenced AAPD/prosecutors, I'm not naive) I'm also not totally clear on the timeline on what Harbaugh knew and when and about whom so I can judge how he handled it. Which is further complicated by the Trump administration being pro-rape and preventing anybody at universities from punishing people for sexual harassment without a formal hearing in their revision to the Title IX regulations. Title IX office held no such hearing.
Also not fun fact: the bystander player O'Maury Samuels that should have been interviewed in this case was...kicked off the team for domestic violence.
Also for clarity: she didn't kill herself, she took fentanyl laced cocaine. The trauma fed her addiction, according to all her friends, so that was still the ultimate cause of her death.
A UM scholar studying sexual violence did an actual academic paper on "why, exactly, are Title IX officials so bad at their jobs?":
We know that almost all Title IX cases end in institutional betrayal for the survivors who sought help. But how do administrators rationalize the work of retraumatization?
I answer that question in a new paper out today in the Journal of Higher Education.
Nassar got stabbed a couple times last night. Survived though.
oh no....anyway
It's not really okay: the hypothesis here is most likely he was pushed out into a position where this could happen by prison administration. If the law didn't decide that killing him was something the state should do, it's not suddenly okay for it to happen while he's in the care of the state.
I suppose to make my thoughts on this clearer: if I'm not okay with the death penalty, then I'm not okay with violence within prisons. Prisoners shouldn't be used as de facto executioners (i.e. who stabbed him? Could've been a murderer, could've been some 20 year old who was talked into it) when the state or the citizenry just don't want the blood on their own hands.
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jmcdonaldI voted, did you?DC(ish)Registered Userregular
Nassar got stabbed a couple times last night. Survived though.
oh no....anyway
It's not really okay: the hypothesis here is most likely he was pushed out into a position where this could happen by prison administration. If the law didn't decide that killing him was something the state should do, it's not suddenly okay for it to happen while he's in the care of the state.
I suppose to make my thoughts on this clearer: if I'm not okay with the death penalty, then I'm not okay with violence within prisons. Prisoners shouldn't be used as de facto executioners (i.e. who stabbed him? Could've been a murderer, could've been some 20 year old who was talked into it) when the state or the citizenry just don't want the blood on their own hands.
i'm pretty firmly in the fuck around and find out camp.
my understanding is prisons and prisoners are generally self-policing. there's just too many variables and people for guards to really control if they don't want to be controlled. Nassar had shit papers, and he was policed the way people with shit papers are policed. this is not unique to him, and it's not unique to the United States either.
Nassar got stabbed a couple times last night. Survived though.
oh no....anyway
It's not really okay: the hypothesis here is most likely he was pushed out into a position where this could happen by prison administration. If the law didn't decide that killing him was something the state should do, it's not suddenly okay for it to happen while he's in the care of the state.
I suppose to make my thoughts on this clearer: if I'm not okay with the death penalty, then I'm not okay with violence within prisons. Prisoners shouldn't be used as de facto executioners (i.e. who stabbed him? Could've been a murderer, could've been some 20 year old who was talked into it) when the state or the citizenry just don't want the blood on their own hands.
Yeah, I've never understood that. Sure, let's let the people you've imprisoned be vigilante justice instead of making a system to deal with these things.
That being said, if someone was to be stabbed today, glad it's him.
No, but it's helping normalise that prison is not just a punishment in and of itself, but carries a reasonable expectation of being an extra judicial one.
I don't care about Nassar. I don't care if he lives or dies. He has a heart attack in his sleep, whatever. Not going to lose sleep myself.
I care about the state either wilfully looking the other way on this kind of thing, or being so inept they can't prevent it.
You shouldn't be in fear of being brutalised in prison.
Nassar got stabbed a couple times last night. Survived though.
oh no....anyway
It's not really okay: the hypothesis here is most likely he was pushed out into a position where this could happen by prison administration. If the law didn't decide that killing him was something the state should do, it's not suddenly okay for it to happen while he's in the care of the state.
I suppose to make my thoughts on this clearer: if I'm not okay with the death penalty, then I'm not okay with violence within prisons. Prisoners shouldn't be used as de facto executioners (i.e. who stabbed him? Could've been a murderer, could've been some 20 year old who was talked into it) when the state or the citizenry just don't want the blood on their own hands.
The staff is also apparently firmly in the "don't give a shit" stage of overworked. The prison has less than half of it's intended staff but isn't actually hiring, the people there are working 16 hour shifts five plus days a week with no support and can be forced to work longer if there's a call off or no show on short notice. I doubt they make a lot but there's no number you can pay somebody to give a fuck on that kind of schedule. I love my job and even at the end of a voluntary double I'm pretty damn sluggish to pick up the radio if there's a call.
My last 16 hour shift was to kill an aggressive seagull pair that was living in the tank farm and if there was a CPR call at my 14 hour mark my battery would have mysteriously died at 13:45
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Zavianuniversal peace sounds better than forever warRegistered Userregular
I think imprisonment should be about rehabilitation to the extent that the person incarcerated learns the damage of their actions and the process of feeling genuine remorse towards the victims can begin
of course some people are so sociopathic that perhaps they are unable to be rehabilitated due to any number of factors (brain damage, mental disorders, past traumas, etc.) but I certainly don't think they deserve nonjudicial violence
Yeah, the problem with talking about prison violence is it basically only ever gets reported on or discussed when a person who is both famous and an awful piece of shit gets attacked, because the only way prison violence sells as a story is if the victim "had it coming".
Obviously, the impulse to say Nassar or whoever got what they deserved is there and like others said, I wouldn't shed a tear for him personally, but also the only place to actually bring up how prison violence sucks is on these kinds of stories.
I ate an engineer
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ButtersA glass of some milksRegistered Userregular
Lack of institutional control in American prisons is how you end up with Jeffrey Epstein hanging himself in his cell with blankets to avoid implicating unknown co-conspirators. The "self-policing" is one of many cultural and policy failures of the American carceral system.
Lack of institutional control in American prisons is how you end up with Jeffrey Epstein hanging himself in his cell with blankets to avoid implicating unknown co-conspirators. The "self-policing" is one of many cultural and policy failures of the American carceral system.
No, let's not continue conspiracy theories, especially when the reality is ugly enough. Epstein was very much up his own ass ego-wise, and those sorts do not take a sustained and permanent fall from grace well (see also: abusive coach and Nassar enabler John Geddert taking his own life when charges were announced against him by MI AG Dana Nessel.)
Lack of institutional control in American prisons is how you end up with Jeffrey Epstein hanging himself in his cell with blankets to avoid implicating unknown co-conspirators. The "self-policing" is one of many cultural and policy failures of the American carceral system.
No, let's not continue conspiracy theories, especially when the reality is ugly enough. Epstein was very much up his own ass ego-wise, and those sorts do not take a sustained and permanent fall from grace well (see also: abusive coach and Nassar enabler John Geddert taking his own life when charges were announced against him by MI AG Dana Nessel.)
What conspiracy theory? Piss poor security is how Epstein was able to take his own life instead of facing his charges and then possibly implicating more sexual predators.
Lack of institutional control in American prisons is how you end up with Jeffrey Epstein hanging himself in his cell with blankets to avoid implicating unknown co-conspirators. The "self-policing" is one of many cultural and policy failures of the American carceral system.
No, let's not continue conspiracy theories, especially when the reality is ugly enough. Epstein was very much up his own ass ego-wise, and those sorts do not take a sustained and permanent fall from grace well (see also: abusive coach and Nassar enabler John Geddert taking his own life when charges were announced against him by MI AG Dana Nessel.)
What conspiracy theory? Piss poor security is how Epstein was able to take his own life instead of facing his charges and then possibly implicating more sexual predators.
He didn't kill himself to protect names, he did it because his ego got deflated violently and suicidal ideation is a common response to that.
Lack of institutional control in American prisons is how you end up with Jeffrey Epstein hanging himself in his cell with blankets to avoid implicating unknown co-conspirators. The "self-policing" is one of many cultural and policy failures of the American carceral system.
No, let's not continue conspiracy theories, especially when the reality is ugly enough. Epstein was very much up his own ass ego-wise, and those sorts do not take a sustained and permanent fall from grace well (see also: abusive coach and Nassar enabler John Geddert taking his own life when charges were announced against him by MI AG Dana Nessel.)
What conspiracy theory? Piss poor security is how Epstein was able to take his own life instead of facing his charges and then possibly implicating more sexual predators.
He didn't kill himself to protect names, he did it because his ego got deflated violently and suicidal ideation is a common response to that.
I think we’re talking to the motivation of the prison staff rather than the prisoner here. You’re correct as to why he killed himself. But the question is why was he *allowed* to. Which is still in conspiracy theory land, but a pretty plausible one.
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ButtersA glass of some milksRegistered Userregular
Lack of institutional control in American prisons is how you end up with Jeffrey Epstein hanging himself in his cell with blankets to avoid implicating unknown co-conspirators. The "self-policing" is one of many cultural and policy failures of the American carceral system.
No, let's not continue conspiracy theories, especially when the reality is ugly enough. Epstein was very much up his own ass ego-wise, and those sorts do not take a sustained and permanent fall from grace well (see also: abusive coach and Nassar enabler John Geddert taking his own life when charges were announced against him by MI AG Dana Nessel.)
What conspiracy theory? Piss poor security is how Epstein was able to take his own life instead of facing his charges and then possibly implicating more sexual predators.
He didn't kill himself to protect names, he did it because his ego got deflated violently and suicidal ideation is a common response to that.
I'm not talking about motivation, I'm talking about the after affect of we can't get any more useful information out of a dead person.
Lack of institutional control in American prisons is how you end up with Jeffrey Epstein hanging himself in his cell with blankets to avoid implicating unknown co-conspirators. The "self-policing" is one of many cultural and policy failures of the American carceral system.
No, let's not continue conspiracy theories, especially when the reality is ugly enough. Epstein was very much up his own ass ego-wise, and those sorts do not take a sustained and permanent fall from grace well (see also: abusive coach and Nassar enabler John Geddert taking his own life when charges were announced against him by MI AG Dana Nessel.)
What conspiracy theory? Piss poor security is how Epstein was able to take his own life instead of facing his charges and then possibly implicating more sexual predators.
He didn't kill himself to protect names, he did it because his ego got deflated violently and suicidal ideation is a common response to that.
I think we’re talking to the motivation of the prison staff rather than the prisoner here. You’re correct as to why he killed himself. But the question is why was he *allowed* to. Which is still in conspiracy theory land, but a pretty plausible one.
Occam's Razor still leans towards institutional lack of care and dehumanization towards prisoners, though.
Basically our country has a real issue with allowing prisoners to come to harm. Whether it’s prisoner on prisoner violence, or self-harm, or dismissal of legitimate medical issues we are pretty happy to treat avoidable injury or death as just “part of the punishment.”
It’s common enough that it honestly gets tough to tell malice from negligence.
Though at a societal level it’s pretty much pure malice. We underfund prisons because we want them to be hellholes, because (for most “middle class” Americans) we cannot imagine ourselves or someone we care about ever winding up in those hellholes. I say this as somebody who has had friends and loved ones wind up in prison, and thus knows better.
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HerrCronIt that wickedly supports taxationRegistered Userregular
When push comes to show, deep down, a lot of people DO believe on the death penalty. Is really that simple.
Is the way it is.
A lot of people have no qualms with people they don't consider human visiting violence on other people they don't consider human.
I'd argue that it's not the same as supporting the death penalty and it's, in fact, worse than that.
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SummaryJudgmentGrab the hottest iron you can find, stride in the Tower’s front doorRegistered Userregular
edited July 2023
Right, saying we've got a problem with extrajudicial violence done to Nassar isn't because we think Nassar is a swell guy, it's because it's corrosive to institutional control and it's a an infringement on the government's monopoly on violence by a state actor acting in a personal capacity, which should be subject to harsher penalty and scrutiny then normal vigilantism
(Assuming that the guards set him up intentionally, and not that he's the most infamous rapist of the past however many years and that, as a rule, that doesn't go over well)
SummaryJudgment on
Some days Blue wonders why anyone ever bothered making numbers so small; other days she supposes even infinity needs to start somewhere.
Nicole Markus, Alyce Brown, Cole Reynolds and Divya Bhardwaj of the Daily Northwestern released a story July 8 with details of the alleged hazing that took place within the Northwestern football program, coming from a former player with a second former player confirming the allegations.
The hazing that took place centered around a phrase called “running”, where according to the former player, a student-athlete that made a mistake in practice “would be restrained by a group of 8-10 upperclassmen dressed in various “Purge-like” masks, who would then begin “dry-humping” the victim in a dark locker room.”
The player said that this was prevalent around the holidays, where “Runsgiving and “Runsmas” would take place, and a whiteboard with a list of players under the phrase “Runsgiving” and “Shrek’s list” would be seen. “Running” would be signified by players clapping their hands above the player, in what was called a “Shrek Clap”.
“It’s a shocking experience as a freshman to see your fellow freshman teammates get ran, but then you see everybody bystanding in the locker room,” the player said. “It’s just a really abrasive and barbaric culture that has permeated throughout that program for years on end now.” (per the Daily Northwestern)
According to The Daily, the player also said that Fitzgerald may have known about the hazing that took place.
According to the player that came to The Daily, Fitzgerald would repeatedly make the gesture, specifically towards freshmen. This was seen as deliberate encouragement to continue the hazing.
NW commissioned their own independent investigation ex summary, which found
Current and former players varied on their perspective of the conduct; however, the investigation team determined that the complainant’s claims were largely supported by the evidence gathered during the investigation, including separate and consistent first-person accounts from current and former players. While the investigation did not uncover evidence pointing to specific misconduct by any individual football player or coach, participation in or knowledge of the hazing activities was widespread across football players.
The investigation team did not discover sufficient evidence to believe that coaching staff knew about the ongoing hazing conduct. They determined, however, that there had been significant opportunities to discover and report the hazing conduct.
With this information in hand, they promptly...suspended the head coach Pat Fitzgerald for 2 whole weeks of July.
I saw a couple of reddit posts that basically say they probably released him and called up the prisoners who laid claim to the right to beat him up
apparently beating up pedos in high security prisons gives you status, so much so that maybe you won't be harassed (by people looking to up status), or won't have to pay for things after you get out of solitary
Nicole Markus, Alyce Brown, Cole Reynolds and Divya Bhardwaj of the Daily Northwestern released a story July 8 with details of the alleged hazing that took place within the Northwestern football program, coming from a former player with a second former player confirming the allegations.
The hazing that took place centered around a phrase called “running”, where according to the former player, a student-athlete that made a mistake in practice “would be restrained by a group of 8-10 upperclassmen dressed in various “Purge-like” masks, who would then begin “dry-humping” the victim in a dark locker room.”
The player said that this was prevalent around the holidays, where “Runsgiving and “Runsmas” would take place, and a whiteboard with a list of players under the phrase “Runsgiving” and “Shrek’s list” would be seen. “Running” would be signified by players clapping their hands above the player, in what was called a “Shrek Clap”.
“It’s a shocking experience as a freshman to see your fellow freshman teammates get ran, but then you see everybody bystanding in the locker room,” the player said. “It’s just a really abrasive and barbaric culture that has permeated throughout that program for years on end now.” (per the Daily Northwestern)
According to The Daily, the player also said that Fitzgerald may have known about the hazing that took place.
According to the player that came to The Daily, Fitzgerald would repeatedly make the gesture, specifically towards freshmen. This was seen as deliberate encouragement to continue the hazing.
NW commissioned their own independent investigation ex summary, which found
Current and former players varied on their perspective of the conduct; however, the investigation team determined that the complainant’s claims were largely supported by the evidence gathered during the investigation, including separate and consistent first-person accounts from current and former players. While the investigation did not uncover evidence pointing to specific misconduct by any individual football player or coach, participation in or knowledge of the hazing activities was widespread across football players.
The investigation team did not discover sufficient evidence to believe that coaching staff knew about the ongoing hazing conduct. They determined, however, that there had been significant opportunities to discover and report the hazing conduct.
With this information in hand, they promptly...suspended the head coach Pat Fitzgerald for 2 whole weeks of July.
Well, up till the story got legs, which now has the school looking like the geese they are, and very appropriately named NW president Michael Schill is now rapidly backpedaling on Fitzgerald's punishment, especially with the evidence that he knew.
Edit: I think the part that pisses me off most is that they call the testimony lies...then talk up the independent investigation which found that the claims made were accurate!
Hopefully, they'll do a full investigation and charge everyone that needs to be charged and prosecuted. This shouldn't stop at Fitzgerald or any school leadership that covered the fucker. They should also be looking into the athletes as well. Part of teaching people to be decent human beings, is also knowing where you draw the lines and expectations on decency. I'm sorry, some of those little shits should have been old enough to know better and their is a need to hold them reasonable accountable so they don't fucking do it again and to make clear to future students, that "no, we will not give you a free pass on certain behaviors because your young, dumb, a student athlete and might have come from a place with shitty ideas. You'll end up having to seat through various lectures on shit you're not suppose to do. It's you're own damn fault you didn't internalize it and follow the fucking rules; especially, if you've been here for more than a semester because you don't even get the excuse to say your hometown was really fucked up on that sort of stuff."
This isn't just in regard to the hazing, but also the racism issues. Again, even if someone came from the most racist, insular shithole that America has produced. Once you spend enough time on campus, you do hit a point where it's "No fucker, you continue to choose to be racist and you should have picked up that shit ain't gonna fly here. Yeah, you can have your shitty beliefs, but we do not have to keep allowing you to attend here."
I have a feeling though this shit is going to be the tip of the iceberg. I've heard the stories of vile shit that many members of the college/university/high school sports team, that are held in high regards for their athletics ability, get up too. I know there are plenty of cops that are happy to turn a blind eye to it because it'll hurt the team or bullshit about how they don't wan to ruin their career.
Yes, fun story of an acquaintance that did Lyft rides around ODU. Where the was suppose to pick someone up from one a party that one of the football players. The person never showed up, but as he was leaving he saw several members of the team trying to extort a young women, that wasn't invited who showed up with her friend, for sex as the price of admission. So he intervened said her ride was there, when she was clearly looking for an out. So the punk ass bastards threatened to beat him up because they figured they'd win the fight. He made the point that he knew he wouldn't win the fight, but he could make sure all the fuckers end up having to go the the hospital and that the coach and university will not be happy about having to explain to the media why a bunch of their football players are in the hospital after getting into a fight with an Asian Lyft driver; especially, when the details for why the incident happens go public. The little shits were smart enough to back off. Though when he tried to file a report, the campus police refused to act because the line given to him was "we don't want to ruin some young man's life.'" So but those shits ruined their own life by thinking they could act that way. This was a few years ago, so possible that some house cleaning was done, but I'm not at all optimistic, given that the ODU football team is a vanity project by the university governing board and no doubt they have been using unethical means to shield their process sports team from anything that could interfere with them possible winning games (last I checked they were pretty rubbish in their current league).
Anyways, there are probably some really shitty things that have been swept under the rug, that might come out when a proper investigation is down. Though really, there needs to be a long hard look taken out the various sports programs at various institutions because there is a real culture of "we don't want to address or acknowledge some really vile shit and a bunch of problematic shit because we me have to kick some people out and suspend others. Actions that we don't want to take because it means we might not do as well in the season and then we'll end up making less money or it'll make the institution look bad." I feel bad for the honest athletes playing for those institutions because they are being screwed over, since that shit becomes an open secret and then everyone in the sports programs gets a certain level of suspicion cast their way. "Is that one of the assholes that gets to get away with shit because they are good at spots? Wonder what shit that fucker has gotten away with?" Probably also infuriating when the bad actors are getting all the positive attention for the teams success, while they are allowed to be shitty people. Sure maybe the team wouldn't do as well if standards were properly applied, but at least the athletes that are being honest people would get the recognition they deserve instead of being overshadowed by assholes that don't belong on the team, even if those assholes don't belong in jail.
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Also not fun fact: the bystander player O'Maury Samuels that should have been interviewed in this case was...kicked off the team for domestic violence.
Also for clarity: she didn't kill herself, she took fentanyl laced cocaine. The trauma fed her addiction, according to all her friends, so that was still the ultimate cause of her death.
A UM scholar studying sexual violence did an actual academic paper on "why, exactly, are Title IX officials so bad at their jobs?":
oh no....anyway
It's not really okay: the hypothesis here is most likely he was pushed out into a position where this could happen by prison administration. If the law didn't decide that killing him was something the state should do, it's not suddenly okay for it to happen while he's in the care of the state.
I suppose to make my thoughts on this clearer: if I'm not okay with the death penalty, then I'm not okay with violence within prisons. Prisoners shouldn't be used as de facto executioners (i.e. who stabbed him? Could've been a murderer, could've been some 20 year old who was talked into it) when the state or the citizenry just don't want the blood on their own hands.
i'm pretty firmly in the fuck around and find out camp.
my understanding is prisons and prisoners are generally self-policing. there's just too many variables and people for guards to really control if they don't want to be controlled. Nassar had shit papers, and he was policed the way people with shit papers are policed. this is not unique to him, and it's not unique to the United States either.
i'm not shedding a tear for this asshole.
Yeah, I've never understood that. Sure, let's let the people you've imprisoned be vigilante justice instead of making a system to deal with these things.
That being said, if someone was to be stabbed today, glad it's him.
No, but it's helping normalise that prison is not just a punishment in and of itself, but carries a reasonable expectation of being an extra judicial one.
I don't care about Nassar. I don't care if he lives or dies. He has a heart attack in his sleep, whatever. Not going to lose sleep myself.
I care about the state either wilfully looking the other way on this kind of thing, or being so inept they can't prevent it.
You shouldn't be in fear of being brutalised in prison.
The staff is also apparently firmly in the "don't give a shit" stage of overworked. The prison has less than half of it's intended staff but isn't actually hiring, the people there are working 16 hour shifts five plus days a week with no support and can be forced to work longer if there's a call off or no show on short notice. I doubt they make a lot but there's no number you can pay somebody to give a fuck on that kind of schedule. I love my job and even at the end of a voluntary double I'm pretty damn sluggish to pick up the radio if there's a call.
My last 16 hour shift was to kill an aggressive seagull pair that was living in the tank farm and if there was a CPR call at my 14 hour mark my battery would have mysteriously died at 13:45
of course some people are so sociopathic that perhaps they are unable to be rehabilitated due to any number of factors (brain damage, mental disorders, past traumas, etc.) but I certainly don't think they deserve nonjudicial violence
Obviously, the impulse to say Nassar or whoever got what they deserved is there and like others said, I wouldn't shed a tear for him personally, but also the only place to actually bring up how prison violence sucks is on these kinds of stories.
Is the way it is.
No, let's not continue conspiracy theories, especially when the reality is ugly enough. Epstein was very much up his own ass ego-wise, and those sorts do not take a sustained and permanent fall from grace well (see also: abusive coach and Nassar enabler John Geddert taking his own life when charges were announced against him by MI AG Dana Nessel.)
What conspiracy theory? Piss poor security is how Epstein was able to take his own life instead of facing his charges and then possibly implicating more sexual predators.
He didn't kill himself to protect names, he did it because his ego got deflated violently and suicidal ideation is a common response to that.
I think we’re talking to the motivation of the prison staff rather than the prisoner here. You’re correct as to why he killed himself. But the question is why was he *allowed* to. Which is still in conspiracy theory land, but a pretty plausible one.
I'm not talking about motivation, I'm talking about the after affect of we can't get any more useful information out of a dead person.
Occam's Razor still leans towards institutional lack of care and dehumanization towards prisoners, though.
It’s common enough that it honestly gets tough to tell malice from negligence.
Though at a societal level it’s pretty much pure malice. We underfund prisons because we want them to be hellholes, because (for most “middle class” Americans) we cannot imagine ourselves or someone we care about ever winding up in those hellholes. I say this as somebody who has had friends and loved ones wind up in prison, and thus knows better.
A lot of people have no qualms with people they don't consider human visiting violence on other people they don't consider human.
I'd argue that it's not the same as supporting the death penalty and it's, in fact, worse than that.
(Assuming that the guards set him up intentionally, and not that he's the most infamous rapist of the past however many years and that, as a rule, that doesn't go over well)
NW commissioned their own independent investigation ex summary, which found
With this information in hand, they promptly...suspended the head coach Pat Fitzgerald for 2 whole weeks of July.
apparently beating up pedos in high security prisons gives you status, so much so that maybe you won't be harassed (by people looking to up status), or won't have to pay for things after you get out of solitary
Well, up till the story got legs, which now has the school looking like the geese they are, and very appropriately named NW president Michael Schill is now rapidly backpedaling on Fitzgerald's punishment, especially with the evidence that he knew.
Zero chance in Illinois, because all non-alums loath Northwestern.
It's like they think we're stupid.
Edit: I think the part that pisses me off most is that they call the testimony lies...then talk up the independent investigation which found that the claims made were accurate!
Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining.
Didn't Charlie and Frank invent this and called it night crawlers
Because the "official" punishment was to run sprints after practice.
Once again - do not pick fights with people who buy ink by the barrel.
This isn't just in regard to the hazing, but also the racism issues. Again, even if someone came from the most racist, insular shithole that America has produced. Once you spend enough time on campus, you do hit a point where it's "No fucker, you continue to choose to be racist and you should have picked up that shit ain't gonna fly here. Yeah, you can have your shitty beliefs, but we do not have to keep allowing you to attend here."
I have a feeling though this shit is going to be the tip of the iceberg. I've heard the stories of vile shit that many members of the college/university/high school sports team, that are held in high regards for their athletics ability, get up too. I know there are plenty of cops that are happy to turn a blind eye to it because it'll hurt the team or bullshit about how they don't wan to ruin their career.
Yes, fun story of an acquaintance that did Lyft rides around ODU. Where the was suppose to pick someone up from one a party that one of the football players. The person never showed up, but as he was leaving he saw several members of the team trying to extort a young women, that wasn't invited who showed up with her friend, for sex as the price of admission. So he intervened said her ride was there, when she was clearly looking for an out. So the punk ass bastards threatened to beat him up because they figured they'd win the fight. He made the point that he knew he wouldn't win the fight, but he could make sure all the fuckers end up having to go the the hospital and that the coach and university will not be happy about having to explain to the media why a bunch of their football players are in the hospital after getting into a fight with an Asian Lyft driver; especially, when the details for why the incident happens go public. The little shits were smart enough to back off. Though when he tried to file a report, the campus police refused to act because the line given to him was "we don't want to ruin some young man's life.'" So but those shits ruined their own life by thinking they could act that way. This was a few years ago, so possible that some house cleaning was done, but I'm not at all optimistic, given that the ODU football team is a vanity project by the university governing board and no doubt they have been using unethical means to shield their process sports team from anything that could interfere with them possible winning games (last I checked they were pretty rubbish in their current league).
Anyways, there are probably some really shitty things that have been swept under the rug, that might come out when a proper investigation is down. Though really, there needs to be a long hard look taken out the various sports programs at various institutions because there is a real culture of "we don't want to address or acknowledge some really vile shit and a bunch of problematic shit because we me have to kick some people out and suspend others. Actions that we don't want to take because it means we might not do as well in the season and then we'll end up making less money or it'll make the institution look bad." I feel bad for the honest athletes playing for those institutions because they are being screwed over, since that shit becomes an open secret and then everyone in the sports programs gets a certain level of suspicion cast their way. "Is that one of the assholes that gets to get away with shit because they are good at spots? Wonder what shit that fucker has gotten away with?" Probably also infuriating when the bad actors are getting all the positive attention for the teams success, while they are allowed to be shitty people. Sure maybe the team wouldn't do as well if standards were properly applied, but at least the athletes that are being honest people would get the recognition they deserve instead of being overshadowed by assholes that don't belong on the team, even if those assholes don't belong in jail.
battletag: Millin#1360
Nice chart to figure out how honest a news source is.
Not surprising at all - once this got attention, the NW administration had few options.