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So how long until we war with Iran?

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    Fleck0Fleck0 Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    I missed Ahmadinejad talking to Mike Wallace last night, did he actually let himself be interviewed or was it more of a "Wallace listens to Ahmadinejad rant"

    Fleck0 on
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    PicardathonPicardathon Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    I thought Wallace was retired? They're essentially rolling him out for the Ahmadinejad interviews now?
    The last interview between them I heard was Ahmadinejad making wild accusations when Wallace quoted him as wanting the Jews wiped of the earth. It actually made me feel quite good that he wasn't willing to make a stand, shows that he doesn't really have the balls to do what he wants to do.

    Picardathon on
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    monikermoniker Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    I thought Wallace was retired? They're essentially rolling him out for the Ahmadinejad interviews now?
    The last interview between them I heard was Ahmadinejad making wild accusations when Wallace quoted him as wanting the Jews wiped of the earth. It actually made me feel quite good that he wasn't willing to make a stand, shows that he doesn't really have the balls to do what he wants to do.

    ...he doesn't want to glass Israel.

    moniker on
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    MuttnikMuttnik Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    Sentry wrote: »
    Wow... I think the ignorance of American's is vastly underestimated.
    Shinto wrote: »
    Yeah, I know. It's fun to feel like you're better than other people.

    Sigged.

    Muttnik on
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    GorakGorak Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    Stealth bombers have a thermal masking technology that reduces their effective engine heat signature. Modern strategies for detection involve non-LOS radar systems - basically, you assume the radar beam will end up somewhere funny and so you use an array of detectors around your emitter to work out if it's nothing or if there's a real radar reflector out there.

    There's also the possibility of tracking the gap that they leave as they absorb the prevailing em radiation. From what I remember though, it's a bit beyond the Iranins capabilities.

    Alternatively, you can use the Mk. 1 human eardrum. The plane that got shot down over the Balkans was because they kept using the same route home and people on the ground heard them fly over and correlated it with bombings

    Gorak on
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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    They institute the draft (yes, I know, ain't going to happen) and watch how fast Don't Ask, Don't Tell gets dropped.

    Or watch the number of gay guys in this country skyrocket temporarily.

    MuddBudd on
    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    allen1234allen1234 Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    Evenin guys,
    Hussein was an unapologetic supporter of terrorism. He went on TV giving checks to those who successfully blew up Israeli's. Heck, even Al Gore said so back in the early 90's when running for VP. Sure it's a 14 year old video of Gore saying Saddam supported terrorists, but it was post Gulf War and if he was still supporting terrorists in 1992 after the Gulf War, and he was on TV supporting terrorists in the late 90's early 2000's, and many of the major AQ in Iraq leaders are noted for being in Iraq in 2002 (the year before the invasion) it's not hard to see that he did, in fact, support terrorism.

    Iran is currently trying to kill American soldiers in Iraq. They are shipping bombs to Iraq and personnel to train/use the bombs. They're sending money and arms. They're sending the fighters too. American soldiers have recovered laptops and files from safe houses raided with detailed evidence of who the contacts with Iran were for support, equipment and financial. There have been cases where American soldiers have been deployed along the border with Iran on patrol being attacked by Iranian Guard units, the units would hit and run when the Americans resisted. It is considered likely that the Iranians were trying to capture American soldiers to use as hostages like they did the British sailors.

    Iran has been sending weapons, money and bombs to the Taliban remnants in Afghanistan. The US has Predator drone footage of convoys leaving Iran and traveling toward Taliban elements that were intercepted by NATO forces in Afghanistan and captured intact, the cargo was roadside bombs. The bombs had the same markings as the bombs recovered in Iraq and credited to Iranian design and construction.

    Iran is sending troops to Iraq to fight Americans. They can't win a straight up fight so they rely on roadside bombs built in Iran and use car bombs to kill Iraqi civilians. The bad news is that it's still a hard fight with too many Iraqi civilians in the middle. The good news, however, is that the Iraqi Army is standing up and taking greater control over national security than before. Currently half the territory is under sole Iraqi control and it's expected that by the end of the year all but Baghdad will be under Iraqi control and Baghdad will be turned over by January/February. At that point our forces are scheduled to become primarily logistics and training forces with quick reaction on standby.

    Calling Iraq a civil war is a stretch of the term, similar to saying someone with sensitive gender specific roles is being tortured by being questioned by a female. In Iraq the guys doing the most damage are foreign fighters who came to Iraq to fight the United States. The local Iraqi's are pointing them out in greater numbers with the highest numbers of safehouses and weapons stores being captured at any point since this started. AQ relies almost entirely on foreign fighters whipped into a jihadist zeal to do the mass bombings of shops and cafe's. Compared to the casualties of the bombings, the sectarian strife is relatively small. And none of this even considers the damage being done by the criminals that Saddam released from prison prior to the 2003 invasion. If we emptied out our prisons today what do you think the crime rate would look like in 6 months here?

    allen1234 on
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    electricitylikesmeelectricitylikesme Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    They institute the draft (yes, I know, ain't going to happen) and watch how fast Don't Ask, Don't Tell gets dropped.

    Or watch the number of gay guys in this country skyrocket temporarily.
    Sounds like a good excuse for some harmless experimentation to me!

    electricitylikesme on
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    ProtoProto Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    allen1234 wrote: »
    Calling Iraq a civil war is a stretch of the term, similar to saying someone with sensitive gender specific roles is being tortured by being questioned by a female. In Iraq the guys doing the most damage are foreign fighters who came to Iraq to fight the United States. The local Iraqi's are pointing them out in greater numbers with the highest numbers of safehouses and weapons stores being captured at any point since this started. AQ relies almost entirely on foreign fighters whipped into a jihadist zeal to do the mass bombings of shops and cafe's. Compared to the casualties of the bombings, the sectarian strife is relatively small. And none of this even considers the damage being done by the criminals that Saddam released from prison prior to the 2003 invasion. If we emptied out our prisons today what do you think the crime rate would look like in 6 months here?

    Oh bullshit.

    Whether you acknowledge it or not, iraq IS in the middle of a simmering civil war. It may not be all out civil war yet, but it's happening. If the US left, it would decend rather quickly. Those 20-40 bodies that are left on the streets on a daily basis (that no one ever seems to talk about)? Where do you think those come from? That "it's mostly foreign fighters" excuse may have worked in 2004, but not now.

    And despite your cheery outlook on the situation, the reality is that it's worse then ever in iraq.

    Proto on
    and her knees up on the glove compartment
    took out her barrettes and her hair spilled out like rootbeer
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    Andrew_JayAndrew_Jay Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    allen1234 wrote: »
    Iran is currently trying to kill American soldiers in Iraq. They are shipping bombs to Iraq and personnel to train/use the bombs. They're sending money and arms. They're sending the fighters too. American soldiers have recovered laptops and files from safe houses raided with detailed evidence of who the contacts with Iran were for support, equipment and financial . . .
    America is currently trying to kill Soviet soldiers in Afghanistan. They are shipping bombs to Afghanistan and personnel to train/use the bombs. They're sending money and arms. They're sending the fighters too. Soviet soldiers have recovered laptops and files from safe houses raided with detailed evidence of who the contacts with America were for support, equipment and financial . . .

    I was never a big fan of Ad-Libs, but I can make exceptions.



    About the Taliban - they and Iran have pretty much always been at odds, not least of all because of their oppression of Afghanistan's Shi'ite minority. Iran is also not on great terms with Pakistan (and India has typically pursued good relations with Iran in order to counter Pakistan), and the Taliban is largely a creation of that country's ISI.

    Reuters - No evidence Iran supplying Taliban-NATO general

    Andrew_Jay on
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    MalkorMalkor Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    Andrew_Jay, that was like, 27 years ago. Stop living in the past hippie.

    Malkor on
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    DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    So I'm thinking America may do something that no one ever thought possible. We could unify the middle east! Against us of course but hey, what are you gonna do.

    Doodmann on
    Whippy wrote: »
    nope nope nope nope abort abort talk about anime
    I like to ART
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    monikermoniker Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    Proto wrote: »
    allen1234 wrote: »
    Calling Iraq a civil war is a stretch of the term, similar to saying someone with sensitive gender specific roles is being tortured by being questioned by a female. In Iraq the guys doing the most damage are foreign fighters who came to Iraq to fight the United States. The local Iraqi's are pointing them out in greater numbers with the highest numbers of safehouses and weapons stores being captured at any point since this started. AQ relies almost entirely on foreign fighters whipped into a jihadist zeal to do the mass bombings of shops and cafe's. Compared to the casualties of the bombings, the sectarian strife is relatively small. And none of this even considers the damage being done by the criminals that Saddam released from prison prior to the 2003 invasion. If we emptied out our prisons today what do you think the crime rate would look like in 6 months here?

    Oh bullshit.

    Whether you acknowledge it or not, iraq IS in the middle of a simmering civil war. It may not be all out civil war yet, but it's happening. If the US left, it would decend rather quickly. Those 20-40 bodies that are left on the streets on a daily basis (that no one ever seems to talk about)? Where do you think those come from? That "it's mostly foreign fighters" excuse may have worked in 2004, but not now.

    And despite your cheery outlook on the situation, the reality is that it's worse then ever in iraq.

    Also, foreighn fighters make up less than 10% of all the insurgent attacks. To claim that they are the direct cause of most of the bloodshed is just flat wrong. Particularly with all the morgues filling up with people who weren't in the middle of a carbombers path but in the way of a local cleric's militia. Also, the various rival militias and sects are using carbombs themselves, so...yeah. Bullshit.

    moniker on
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    MuttnikMuttnik Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    Also, the roadside bombs are largely made in country.

    See: Marine corps and Second Fallujah.

    Muttnik on
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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    They institute the draft (yes, I know, ain't going to happen) and watch how fast Don't Ask, Don't Tell gets dropped.

    Or watch the number of gay guys in this country skyrocket temporarily.
    Sounds like a good excuse for some harmless experimentation to me!

    All I know is that if by some terrible miracle I get drafted, I'm announcing loud and clear that I'm gay and have no intention if hiding it. If things go so bad I'm forced to fight I'm making damn sure these straight boys know who is saving their ass.

    MuddBudd on
    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    ThaoxThaox Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    I heard an interesting point the other day. I was speaking with a friend of mine and said something to the effect of "So with reserves lower than anyone ever expected are you at all afraid of a draft?"

    To my surprise she said "Actually I hope there is a national draft."

    After some explanation was offered this was her point: The national guard is being used for the wrong purposes and should be focused on keeping our nation safe on it's home front, and not overseas. She was advocating a draft for service in the National Guard rather than a military draft which would be sending unwilling combatants into a terrible situation. Some people have already said they would have no problem with a draft if they were fighting on their own soil. Do you have any comment on this unorthodox viewpoint?

    Thaox on
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    MalkorMalkor Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    I don't think any generals would ever make a stipulation that draftees don't have to go overseas right now. That's a great idea for the future though.

    Malkor on
    14271f3c-c765-4e74-92b1-49d7612675f2.jpg
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    ThaoxThaox Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    Well there are plenty of true homeland problems at the moment if I'm not mistaken. The situation in the areas affected by a hurricane which I believe were all familiar with is less than optimal. Border security isn't exactly up to par, The FBI is trying to track terrorists and combat drug trafficking.

    I think that most of my friends here at my University would be opposed to being required to spend a year or so in the national guard after high school though less so than having to go to Iraq.

    Thaox on
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    Alexan DriteAlexan Drite Registered User regular
    edited June 2007
    Muttnik wrote: »
    Also, the roadside bombs are largely made in country.

    See: Marine corps and Second Fallujah.

    There is something to be said about this though. When the war began, the IEDs and weapons were largely primitive. Like that video with Saddam on the History channel prior to the start of the war.

    As the war has dragged out, they've gotten much more sophisticated, using lasers and anti-jamming technology. They're being made with components and techniques that are likely coming from Iran. Not many people know this, but Iran has one of the best Special Forces units in the world. Look at the attack on the US base a few months back, that was probably Iran. We've also captured some of their peoples giving techniques, technology, strategy, and military advice to insurgency groups in Iraq.

    But that's just par for course. US has done this about a million times, and probably better. Ask yourselves this... if there was major unrest, insurgency, even wars and violence going on in our backyard (such as Panama, Columbia, Haiti, Nicaragua or Cuba), don't you think the CIA or even the US military would do something?

    The difference is, the US is a hyper power. Iran is trying to reacquire the regional role (and possibly some aspirations beyond that) it played before the revolution, and they intend on acquiring that position without the west's backing this time.

    Alexan Drite on
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