Ness' echo character would be Paula. You can't have Mike hovering around and shooting energy blasts.
It remains to be seen if they're willing to pull echo characters from other franchises anyway.
Mike didn’t have PK powers but he did have laser guns. Besides, we already know Paula won’t be a fighter since she’s in Ness’ final smash.
I’m not even the biggest Startropics fan. I’d just like to see the series get some love.
Sakurai always seems to add one oddball or obscure fighter. Melee had Game & Watch, Brawl had ROB and Wii U/3DS had Duck Hunt and WiiFit Trainer. What would Sakurai go with this time?
Gyromite guy? Mach Rider? Or maybe Mike will have his day. I hope we get something truly unexpected.
Ness' echo character would be Paula. You can't have Mike hovering around and shooting energy blasts.
It remains to be seen if they're willing to pull echo characters from other franchises anyway.
Mike didn’t have PK powers but he did have laser guns. Besides, we already know Paula won’t be a fighter since she’s in Ness’ final smash.
I’m not even the biggest Startropics fan. I’d just like to see the series get some love.
Sakurai always seems to add one oddball or obscure fighter. Melee had Game & Watch, Brawl had ROB and Wii U/3DS had Duck Hunt and WiiFit Trainer. What would Sakurai go with this time?
Gyromite guy? Mach Rider? Or maybe Mike will have his day. I hope we get something truly unexpected.
Ness' echo character would be Paula. You can't have Mike hovering around and shooting energy blasts.
It remains to be seen if they're willing to pull echo characters from other franchises anyway.
Mike didn’t have PK powers but he did have laser guns. Besides, we already know Paula won’t be a fighter since she’s in Ness’ final smash.
I’m not even the biggest Startropics fan. I’d just like to see the series get some love.
Sakurai always seems to add one oddball or obscure fighter. Melee had Game & Watch, Brawl had ROB and Wii U/3DS had Duck Hunt and WiiFit Trainer. What would Sakurai go with this time?
Gyromite guy? Mach Rider? Or maybe Mike will have his day. I hope we get something truly unexpected.
Labo Man
Sounds like I had one of those monkey’s paw wishes.
Ness' echo character would be Paula. You can't have Mike hovering around and shooting energy blasts.
It remains to be seen if they're willing to pull echo characters from other franchises anyway.
Mike didn’t have PK powers but he did have laser guns. Besides, we already know Paula won’t be a fighter since she’s in Ness’ final smash.
I’m not even the biggest Startropics fan. I’d just like to see the series get some love.
Sakurai always seems to add one oddball or obscure fighter. Melee had Game & Watch, Brawl had ROB and Wii U/3DS had Duck Hunt and WiiFit Trainer. What would Sakurai go with this time?
Gyromite guy? Mach Rider? Or maybe Mike will have his day. I hope we get something truly unexpected.
Labo Man
I can totally see Labo stuff showing up as an item of some sort, or the robot as an assist trophy.
Ness' echo character would be Paula. You can't have Mike hovering around and shooting energy blasts.
It remains to be seen if they're willing to pull echo characters from other franchises anyway.
Mike didn’t have PK powers but he did have laser guns. Besides, we already know Paula won’t be a fighter since she’s in Ness’ final smash.
I’m not even the biggest Startropics fan. I’d just like to see the series get some love.
Sakurai always seems to add one oddball or obscure fighter. Melee had Game & Watch, Brawl had ROB and Wii U/3DS had Duck Hunt and WiiFit Trainer. What would Sakurai go with this time?
Gyromite guy? Mach Rider? Or maybe Mike will have his day. I hope we get something truly unexpected.
Labo Man
I can totally see Labo stuff showing up as an item of some sort, or the robot as an assist trophy.
Ness' echo character would be Paula. You can't have Mike hovering around and shooting energy blasts.
It remains to be seen if they're willing to pull echo characters from other franchises anyway.
Mike didn’t have PK powers but he did have laser guns. Besides, we already know Paula won’t be a fighter since she’s in Ness’ final smash.
I’m not even the biggest Startropics fan. I’d just like to see the series get some love.
Sakurai always seems to add one oddball or obscure fighter. Melee had Game & Watch, Brawl had ROB and Wii U/3DS had Duck Hunt and WiiFit Trainer. What would Sakurai go with this time?
Gyromite guy? Mach Rider? Or maybe Mike will have his day. I hope we get something truly unexpected.
Labo Man
I can totally see Labo stuff showing up as an item of some sort, or the robot as an assist trophy.
Snake should use a Labo box to sneak around in.
I can already see it now if the Labo mech shows up:
"A weapon to surpass Metal Gear..."
Peach's Castle
Big Blue
Tortimer Island
Dr. Wily's Castle
New Pork City
Coliseum
Great Cave Offensive
Prism Tower
Green Greens
Midgar
Kongo Falls
Fucking Lylat Cruise
Spirit Train
Frigate Orpheon
Green Hill Zone
Wrecking Crew
Yoshi's Island
There were some others in the other footage that should probably be added.
Castle Siege, Hyrule Temple, Skyloft, Pokemon Stadium, Mario Galaxy, Balloon Fight, Boxing Ring, Bridge of Eldin, Distant Planet, Corneria, Wii Fit, Summit, Miiverse, Port Town, Suzaku Castle, Umbra Clock Tower, Saffron City, Subcon, Magicant, Mario Circuit, Mushroom Kingdom U, Living Room, Moray Towers, Shadow Moses, Skyworld, Town & City, Fourside, Luigi's Mansion, Rainbow Cruise, Flat Zone X, Onett, New Donk City, Pilotwings, Luigi's Mansion, Spear Pillar, Kalos Pokemon League, Mushroomy Kingdom, WarioWare, Garden of Hope...
You know, I'm just going to assume everything is coming back.
It seems like they're trying for every stage but weren't willing to commit to that or they would have said it in the Direct. Or maybe there are just a couple exceptions.
It seems like they're trying for every stage but weren't willing to commit to that or they would have said it in the Direct. Or maybe there are just a couple exceptions.
I wouldn't be surprised if a few ones here and there don't make it -- since Miiverse is pretty much just Battlefield with background messages, there's not really a point to it without Miiverse. And some just might not have been ready to show or tease at this point. But hey, there's always DLC...
Think we may see additional stages for returning guests? Probably not, since Sonic didn't get an extra stage in For, but it could be neat to think about. The Cathedral of Cascades could be a neat Bayonetta stage. Or perhaps a flyby stage in Paradiso.
Gameexplain has gone through every stage they found so far, and yea, I think that they are going to just have every stage in Smash history come back. Sakurai went bonkers.
It's not "every stage" without Majora's Mask from Trophy Tussle 3!
They should add trophies to the stage creator.
+3
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Dyshow am I even using this gunRegistered Userregular
I was trying to think of a good echo fighter fit for Ice Climbers, and I actually think the cartoon-y Mario Bros. from the Mario and Luigi games would work pretty well?
They have a lot of cooperation based moves from those games as well as frequent hammer use, so I think it would translate super easily.
Eventhubs has made a good case for Dark Samus becoming a possible Echo Fighter, as Samus's eighth colour variation from Smash 4(which was a reference to Dark Samus) has changed in Ultimate.
Evidently in Wooly World, the amiibo code for any given costume unlock is set up to allow a specific amiibo, or an amiibo from any series. Daisy in particular was set up to allow from any series despite only being in the Mario series. Also in that position is Waddle Dee.
With Echo Fighters being a thing and there not being that many true newcomers, how many Echo Fighters do you think we may get to expand the roster with characters whom otherwise wouldn't make it? What are some possibilities?
Dark Samus is the most obvious possibility, especially with them showing Metroid some love with Ridley being added and Metroid Prime 4 being in development. What other possibilities could be likely? Mr Sandman (Little Mac), Black Shadow (Captain Falcon), Funky Kong (Donkey Kong), Dixie Kong (Diddy Kong), Ken (Ryu), Someone else from Animal Crossing (Villager).
Mike from Star Tropics for Ness? They fight with baseball bats, yo-yos, learn psychic abilities (though Mike only does in the second game, and not to the same degree as Ness does, but you could probably substitute some of the magic items from the first game for some of the Pk moves), and fight aliens. Main thing missing is that Mike's specifically mentioned as a talented baseball pitcher and IIRC Ness doesn't have a projectile that would suit it.
Edit: Ninja'ed by RidleySaria. I should know better than to post before fully catching up on a thread.
I think there's no possible way they'll add an echo for every character, that would result in a lot of very poorly matched movesets. IMO the only reason to add an echo character is if you have a moderately popular character you want to add but they're not different enough from another character to have an interesting moveset. Thus Lucina and Daisy. Dark Samus makes some sense, the character is a bit obscure but also easy to design. If I were them I wouldn't shortchange a new franchise by adding it as an echo character to an unrelated character though. That's even worse than a clone.
+6
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H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
Ness' echo character would be Paula. You can't have Mike hovering around and shooting energy blasts.
It remains to be seen if they're willing to pull echo characters from other franchises anyway.
Mike didn’t have PK powers but he did have laser guns. Besides, we already know Paula won’t be a fighter since she’s in Ness’ final smash.
I’m not even the biggest Startropics fan. I’d just like to see the series get some love.
Sakurai always seems to add one oddball or obscure fighter. Melee had Game & Watch, Brawl had ROB and Wii U/3DS had Duck Hunt and WiiFit Trainer. What would Sakurai go with this time?
Gyromite guy? Mach Rider? Or maybe Mike will have his day. I hope we get something truly unexpected.
Also, Mike does learn an upgradeable psychic shockwave attack from Merlin in Startropics 2.
I think there's no possible way they'll add an echo for every character, that would result in a lot of very poorly matched movesets. IMO the only reason to add an echo character is if you have a moderately popular character you want to add but they're not different enough from another character to have an interesting moveset. Thus Lucina and Daisy. Dark Samus makes some sense, the character is a bit obscure but also easy to design. If I were them I wouldn't shortchange a new franchise by adding it as an echo character to an unrelated character though. That's even worse than a clone.
Yeah, my understanding was that the idea of Echo characters is that they can share a skeleton and thus animations, which means their moves have to be so similar as to preclude things like the custom moves options from Smash For. I think they're just gonna have changes to their statlines & some fiddling with the numbers for their moves. Maybe swap the effects for certain moves (like electric instead of fire). Hopefully Lucina's hitboxes continue to not have tip/edge preference.
Clones are where we'd see good use of the Smash For custom moves; the whole idea there is to make them similar but with major differences (different skeleton, different animations, and mechanical differences for some of the moves). See Wolf's everything, Ganondorf's increased use of his sword now, Roy's mechanical differences for moves like his neutral special. I kinda hope they'll lean into it for Young Link and make more changes to reflect the differences between him and adult Link in OoT (even just superficial things like having him use the slingshot instead of a bow), since that would help to differentiate him more from Toon Link as well.
I think there's no possible way they'll add an echo for every character, that would result in a lot of very poorly matched movesets. IMO the only reason to add an echo character is if you have a moderately popular character you want to add but they're not different enough from another character to have an interesting moveset. Thus Lucina and Daisy. Dark Samus makes some sense, the character is a bit obscure but also easy to design. If I were them I wouldn't shortchange a new franchise by adding it as an echo character to an unrelated character though. That's even worse than a clone.
I don't know, coming up with a whole specific term for it and then only having 3, and not including Falco, Ganon, or Dr. Mario in that listing seems like it's laying the groundwork for something. Maybe not something huge, but significant.
What I'm saying here, I guess, is that Rawk Hawk is totally in and he's a DK clone.
Also Groose is going to be a Captain Falcon clone.
H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
edited June 2018
I agree that since they've made a point of establishing the distinction, I'd be surprised if there aren't a number of echo fighters either yet to be announced, or planned as DLC after release. But I don't think it will be anywhere near the whole cast.
Also, I like the idea mentioned somewhere upthread of it being a toggle when selecting a character (sort of like picking Omega mode versions of stages) instead of them getting their own spot on the roster.
Going down the list of known characters, I can think of a handful of plausible echos:
DK: Funky Kong
Diddy Kong: Dixie Kong
Pikachu: Raichu / Alola Raichu
Samus: Dark Samus / SA-X
(FE sword guy): (other FE sword guy/girl)
Villager: Isabelle
Little Mac: Bald Bull?
Sonic: Shadow
Mega Man: X
Pac-Man: Ms Pac-Man
Bayonetta: Jeanne
Ryu: Ken
Cross-franchise characters would mix up the character selection screen IMO and only very rarely are a good fit anyway. It's still a bit unclear where they draw the line in cloniness to qualify as an echo character. But if Pichu isn't one then it must be pretty strict.
Going down the list of known characters, I can think of a handful of plausible echos:
DK: Funky Kong
Diddy Kong: Dixie Kong
Pikachu: Raichu / Alola Raichu
Samus: Dark Samus / SA-X
(FE sword guy): (other FE sword guy/girl)
Villager: Isabelle
Little Mac: Bald Bull?
Sonic: Shadow
Mega Man: X
Pac-Man: Ms Pac-Man
Bayonetta: Jeanne
Ryu: Ken
Cross-franchise characters would mix up the character selection screen IMO and only very rarely are a good fit anyway. It's still a bit unclear where they draw the line in cloniness to qualify as an echo character. But if Pichu isn't one then it must be pretty strict.
Dixie seems kind of wasted as an echo character, you could do way more unique things with her as a standalone fighter.
Also, Raichu and Alolan Raichu are way taller than Pikachu, so they wouldn't really work either. Also, Alolan Raichu is a Pokeball Pokemon already.
Posts
Mike didn’t have PK powers but he did have laser guns. Besides, we already know Paula won’t be a fighter since she’s in Ness’ final smash.
I’m not even the biggest Startropics fan. I’d just like to see the series get some love.
Sakurai always seems to add one oddball or obscure fighter. Melee had Game & Watch, Brawl had ROB and Wii U/3DS had Duck Hunt and WiiFit Trainer. What would Sakurai go with this time?
Gyromite guy? Mach Rider? Or maybe Mike will have his day. I hope we get something truly unexpected.
Labo Man
Sounds like I had one of those monkey’s paw wishes.
I can totally see Labo stuff showing up as an item of some sort, or the robot as an assist trophy.
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
PSN: AbEntropy
Snake should use a Labo box to sneak around in.
I can already see it now if the Labo mech shows up:
"A weapon to surpass Metal Gear..."
Colonel, this looks like a fishing rod!
Big Blue
Tortimer Island
Dr. Wily's Castle
New Pork City
Coliseum
Great Cave Offensive
Prism Tower
Green Greens
Midgar
Kongo Falls
Fucking Lylat Cruise
Spirit Train
Frigate Orpheon
Green Hill Zone
Wrecking Crew
Yoshi's Island
There were some others in the other footage that should probably be added.
Castle Siege, Hyrule Temple, Skyloft, Pokemon Stadium, Mario Galaxy, Balloon Fight, Boxing Ring, Bridge of Eldin, Distant Planet, Corneria, Wii Fit, Summit, Miiverse, Port Town, Suzaku Castle, Umbra Clock Tower, Saffron City, Subcon, Magicant, Mario Circuit, Mushroom Kingdom U, Living Room, Moray Towers, Shadow Moses, Skyworld, Town & City, Fourside, Luigi's Mansion, Rainbow Cruise, Flat Zone X, Onett, New Donk City, Pilotwings, Luigi's Mansion, Spear Pillar, Kalos Pokemon League, Mushroomy Kingdom, WarioWare, Garden of Hope...
You know, I'm just going to assume everything is coming back.
twitch.tv/Taramoor
@TaramoorPlays
Taramoor on Youtube
I wouldn't be surprised if a few ones here and there don't make it -- since Miiverse is pretty much just Battlefield with background messages, there's not really a point to it without Miiverse. And some just might not have been ready to show or tease at this point. But hey, there's always DLC...
Gameexplain has gone through every stage they found so far, and yea, I think that they are going to just have every stage in Smash history come back. Sakurai went bonkers.
Nintendo Network ID - Brainiac_8
PSN - Brainiac_8
Steam - http://steamcommunity.com/id/BRAINIAC8/
Add me!
They should add trophies to the stage creator.
They have a lot of cooperation based moves from those games as well as frequent hammer use, so I think it would translate super easily.
https://www.eventhubs.com/news/2018/jun/18/metroids-dark-samus-could-be-echo-fighter-newcomer-super-smash-bros-ultimate/
This is literally the only stage i care about.
Nintendo ID: Pastalonius
Smite\LoL:Gremlidin \ WoW & Overwatch & Hots: Gremlidin#1734
3ds: 3282-2248-0453
That and Orbital Gate Assault for me, but then again I'm a fan of crazy crap.
Mike from Star Tropics for Ness? They fight with baseball bats, yo-yos, learn psychic abilities (though Mike only does in the second game, and not to the same degree as Ness does, but you could probably substitute some of the magic items from the first game for some of the Pk moves), and fight aliens. Main thing missing is that Mike's specifically mentioned as a talented baseball pitcher and IIRC Ness doesn't have a projectile that would suit it.
Edit: Ninja'ed by RidleySaria. I should know better than to post before fully catching up on a thread.
The winged anklet and ray guns from Star Tropics 1 say otherwise.
Also, Mike does learn an upgradeable psychic shockwave attack from Merlin in Startropics 2.
Yeah, my understanding was that the idea of Echo characters is that they can share a skeleton and thus animations, which means their moves have to be so similar as to preclude things like the custom moves options from Smash For. I think they're just gonna have changes to their statlines & some fiddling with the numbers for their moves. Maybe swap the effects for certain moves (like electric instead of fire). Hopefully Lucina's hitboxes continue to not have tip/edge preference.
Clones are where we'd see good use of the Smash For custom moves; the whole idea there is to make them similar but with major differences (different skeleton, different animations, and mechanical differences for some of the moves). See Wolf's everything, Ganondorf's increased use of his sword now, Roy's mechanical differences for moves like his neutral special. I kinda hope they'll lean into it for Young Link and make more changes to reflect the differences between him and adult Link in OoT (even just superficial things like having him use the slingshot instead of a bow), since that would help to differentiate him more from Toon Link as well.
I don't know, coming up with a whole specific term for it and then only having 3, and not including Falco, Ganon, or Dr. Mario in that listing seems like it's laying the groundwork for something. Maybe not something huge, but significant.
What I'm saying here, I guess, is that Rawk Hawk is totally in and he's a DK clone.
Also Groose is going to be a Captain Falcon clone.
twitch.tv/Taramoor
@TaramoorPlays
Taramoor on Youtube
Also, I like the idea mentioned somewhere upthread of it being a toggle when selecting a character (sort of like picking Omega mode versions of stages) instead of them getting their own spot on the roster.
DK: Funky Kong
Diddy Kong: Dixie Kong
Pikachu: Raichu / Alola Raichu
Samus: Dark Samus / SA-X
(FE sword guy): (other FE sword guy/girl)
Villager: Isabelle
Little Mac: Bald Bull?
Sonic: Shadow
Mega Man: X
Pac-Man: Ms Pac-Man
Bayonetta: Jeanne
Ryu: Ken
Cross-franchise characters would mix up the character selection screen IMO and only very rarely are a good fit anyway. It's still a bit unclear where they draw the line in cloniness to qualify as an echo character. But if Pichu isn't one then it must be pretty strict.
Would much prefer Tails. Tails is the best.
Nintendo ID: Pastalonius
Smite\LoL:Gremlidin \ WoW & Overwatch & Hots: Gremlidin#1734
3ds: 3282-2248-0453
Dixie seems kind of wasted as an echo character, you could do way more unique things with her as a standalone fighter.
Also, Raichu and Alolan Raichu are way taller than Pikachu, so they wouldn't really work either. Also, Alolan Raichu is a Pokeball Pokemon already.