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    FryFry Registered User regular
    edited July 2018
    Imperil is slang for "add slight vulnerability". It moves the target's elemental resist/weakness profile 20% in your favor. So a neutral enemy becomes 20% weak, and an enemy with 50% resist moves to just 30% resist. You can stack up to a total of 60% movement with three casts of the SB, or you can mix-and-match the Imperil SB with effects like those present on certain 5* abilities or from certain legend materia that move the element profile by 10% ("minor Imperil").

    I wouldn't spend one of the BSB AA selections on an imperil, because they're generally not that useful. There are a few available in the SB and SSB selections though. Here's the list of Acolyte Archives selections, CTRL-F for "imperil"

    Fry on
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    JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    It feels like imperil was the new hotness for like...2-3 months, then everyone realized it wasn't nearly as powerful (generally speaking) as enElement so they mostly disappeared.

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    DaffyddDaffydd Registered User regular
    I'm not the first to have my bad impulses rewarded.

    OSB Dream Select: 2/11, one disco, Garland SSB and Shadow USB. Wow, the chase hits on Shadow USB are 2.16x, likely to cap against dark-weak, pretty well guaranteed with a dark chain. [Inigo voice] Which I have! [/Inigo voice]

    Cloud OSB (BSB, USBs 1&2, LD) or Papalymo OSB (SSB2, BSB): thoughts?

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    EnlongEnlong Registered User regular
    Papalymo is more likely to neednit, I think.

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    JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    edited July 2018
    Shadow USB is a fantastic get, and it's carried me through tons of content. Easily worth a legend dive with that.

    As for the select, If you don't have it, TGCid OSB.

    It's the hardest hitting OSB, and it gives him 3x cast speed for 25s.

    Between the two you asked, Papalymo would be your best choice - with Cloud USB1, you're better off just doing that and Omega Drive than using meter on the OSB.

    e: For comparison, Cloud's is 12x multiplier. TGCid's is 15x.

    Papalymo's is 38, but that's magic vs physical.

    Jragghen on
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    Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    Jragghen wrote: »
    It feels like imperil was the new hotness for like...2-3 months, then everyone realized it wasn't nearly as powerful (generally speaking) as enElement so they mostly disappeared.

    bosses were also frequently 200% weak or not at all and enelements were really bad (f for lightning's SSB2), so imperils were pretty relevant when you were off element, which i was most times.

    aeNqQM9.jpg
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    FryFry Registered User regular
    edited July 2018
    Jragghen wrote: »
    It feels like imperil was the new hotness for like...2-3 months, then everyone realized it wasn't nearly as powerful (generally speaking) as enElement so they mostly disappeared.

    The landscape was much different when imperils first came out, starting with Balthier's Strahl Strafe SSB. Back then, almost every difficult boss of note was neutral to all elements, and element auras did not exist. There really weren't many ways to increase party damage at the time, so 7.92/6 AND increase party damage by 20% was like WTF amazing. (edit: or as Knight said, already at full weakness to element, so imperil would do literally nothing)

    The fundamental change wasn't so much that element auras became ubiquitous (although that's certainly part of it), it's that most significant enemies these days have some element weakness and are usually resistant to all other elements. If the enemy starts at 50% weakness, the value added by moving it to 70% is not nearly as much (effectively +13% damage, rather than +20% damage). If the enemy starts with resistance to your element, you should just use the correct element instead, of course.

    5* magicite start at only 20% weakness to their chosen element, so the very best imperil SBs may make a bit of a comeback for those. I wouldn't expect old SB and SSB tier imperils to be very useful, though.

    Fry on
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    BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Yeah, I feel like the big change is going from, "Just about every boss can be made weak to w/e element you are packing", to "after three imperil's you'll almost be doing normal damage".

    "I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."

    The Monster Baru Cormorant - Seth Dickinson

    Steam: Korvalain
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    DaffyddDaffydd Registered User regular
    edited July 2018
    Diablos CM was fun, if brief. Kinda weird not to bring a support unit, Blindga took care of most of the physical damage, which is all you're allowed to do (like a Gravity version of the Bartz fight). Though it probably would have been even easier if I'd brought Irvine instead of Fujin, to SB-pump Selphie. I'm feeling pretty good about Torment 2.0 - still short on power in 0, 1, 2, 11, and 15, and maybe 9 and 14, but 10/17 ain't bad.

    Fujin Wrath / Icicle Shot / BSB / Ace Striker
    Rinoa Chain Blizzaga / -- / CSB / MM
    Squall SSS / -- / -- / LMR, LM2, TGM
    Edea Chain Blizzaga / Blindga / -- / +BM damage
    Selphie Curada / -- / USB / DMT
    RW: OK mUSB
    Magicite: Enkidu / Dullahan 99 (+10 ice), Isgebind 99 (+15 ice), Evrae 99, Evrae 99

    Daffydd on
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    SelnerSelner Registered User regular
    kuhlmeye wrote: »
    Last night I tried the ff4 and 5 torments. I got the ff4 d200 down, mainly because I have a decent Holy team. TGC with usb, Ramza with bsb2, Cid Raines with bsb. Went alright, mainly just blitzed him with soul breaks. I also honed up a bladeblitz, helped so much with the trash.

    Then I tried the FF5 d200. I was so close, but I'm lacking in good aoe offense. One Thing I missed here was debuffs, so I need to try it again with some dancing probably to drop their magic and defense. I was just so close but got overwhelmed at the end.

    Thanks for the tip on the holy-weak Torment :) .
    I had meant to scroll through and see which ones were weak.

    I just put down the 200 FFIV ones. It was a bit of a squeaker, as TGCid ran out of attacks with Assault Sabre. But I still managed to Champion the fight, and got the motes. The class motes were Bard. I'm not currently using any Bards. I'm not sure I've even got any Bard relics. I probably do.

    Then I looked through the list, and it looks like FFT is the only other holy-weak. 200 was a super easy fight. I'll probably try the next one here in a minute.
    The only difficulty I had was dealing with the 4 rounds of trash mobs. The mobs are resistant to holy, so the most damage actually comes from Ayame and Demonsblood. I wonder if I can sub in a BM for her with Meteor.

    Oh, and I should probably use my 30 Knight 5* on TGCid's Aegis Strike line? Or is there a better use for those?

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    JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    Hold on to job motes until you need them.

    They're going to be your rarest resource in the game.

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    DaffyddDaffydd Registered User regular
    Jragghen wrote: »
    Shadow USB is a fantastic get, and it's carried me through tons of content. Easily worth a legend dive with that.

    As for the select, If you don't have it, TGCid OSB. It's the hardest hitting OSB, and it gives him 3x cast speed for 25s.

    Between the two you asked, Papalymo would be your best choice - with Cloud USB1, you're better off just doing that and Omega Drive than using meter on the OSB. (snip)

    Long since have TGCid's, that one's a no-brainer, hardest hidding and TGM. What I'm looking for is an elemental finisher. I was thinking either Cloud using USB2 -> USB1 -> Raging Quad -> OSB, or Papalymo using SSB2 -> BSB or Meltdown (no fire chain!) -> OSB. Both seem to be stretching possibility for available SB meter, but I have most of the other interesting alternatives I can think of. Cid Raines, TGCid, Terra, Beatrix, Agrias, Sephiroth, etc.

    Maybe Kefka, Tidus, or Vayne for the stat stick? May be Locke, to go with his USB and to help support Terra? (Though it looks like my VI buff will be Mog BSB, which is hastega/mag/mnd.) Maybe Noctis? ... though his bonus effects are useless in hard content, and I only have his BSB.

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    FryFry Registered User regular
    edited July 2018
    Jragghen wrote: »
    Hold on to job motes until you need them.

    They're going to be your rarest resource in the game.

    Spending 30 job motes on one character for +3% damage is a decision you're likely to regret unless you've collected every job mote released to date.

    Generally the best use is to give 6* ability access to characters who are going to use it. Most of the 6* abilities that you get "for free" from the second level of the job sphere are pretty bad, but within the next month or two we're going to start getting some new 6* job abilities that will be very good, and you'll want lots of characters to have access to them.

    IMO do one character to the second level to get a copy of the ability if it's something you want to use (Snowspell Strike for sure, maybe also Stitch in Time, Allegro Con Moto, and/or Mug Bloodlust). For Snowspell Strike specifically, maybe get a second copy if you have two ice characters that use spellblades or you want one character to equip it in both of their ability slots.

    Suggest staying away from Aegis Strike, Lifebane, Penalty Snipe, and Demonsblood. The 5* equivalent to Sky High is only slightly worse, so you probably don't need Sky High either. Mug Bloodlust and Stitch in Time are not useful all that often, so you may want to skip them as well.

    Fry on
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    SelnerSelner Registered User regular
    Jragghen wrote: »
    Hold on to job motes until you need them.

    They're going to be your rarest resource in the game.

    Okey dokey, I will hold on them.

    I do have 60 of them, as I had missed the FFI was holy-weak as well.
    I goofed slightly on that one, and had to do the 200 twice. The first time I let Aerith die on round 4 because I was trying to use a BSB to kill the last of the mobs. Missed that she was at a sliver of health, so she promptly died at the boss. Even with no healer, and everyone at very little health I still almost killed him. If TGCid had not been blinded I think he would have soloed the boss.

    And just as a point of reference, if I RW in Cloud's USB that let's the character break the 9k cap on damage, right? So those 15 9k attacks would've been significantly higher.
    I RW'd godwall, so it wasn't really an option. But just something to consider for the future.

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    DarklyreDarklyre Registered User regular
    Daffydd wrote: »
    Jragghen wrote: »
    Shadow USB is a fantastic get, and it's carried me through tons of content. Easily worth a legend dive with that.

    As for the select, If you don't have it, TGCid OSB. It's the hardest hitting OSB, and it gives him 3x cast speed for 25s.

    Between the two you asked, Papalymo would be your best choice - with Cloud USB1, you're better off just doing that and Omega Drive than using meter on the OSB. (snip)

    Long since have TGCid's, that one's a no-brainer, hardest hidding and TGM. What I'm looking for is an elemental finisher. I was thinking either Cloud using USB2 -> USB1 -> Raging Quad -> OSB, or Papalymo using SSB2 -> BSB or Meltdown (no fire chain!) -> OSB. Both seem to be stretching possibility for available SB meter, but I have most of the other interesting alternatives I can think of. Cid Raines, TGCid, Terra, Beatrix, Agrias, Sephiroth, etc.

    Maybe Kefka, Tidus, or Vayne for the stat stick? May be Locke, to go with his USB and to help support Terra? (Though it looks like my VI buff will be Mog BSB, which is hastega/mag/mnd.) Maybe Noctis? ... though his bonus effects are useless in hard content, and I only have his BSB.

    Cloud OSB isn't that useful if you have both of his USBs, since his USB1 makes him dump OSB-level damage with abilities and his USB2 is a chase that doesn't activate on SBs.

    Tidus is nice only if you have Bartz water stuff, since the USB blitzball works better with Sapphire Shot. I also wouldn't recommend picking a holy sword since you're likely to pick up a few just randomly.

    Vivi OSB is a 6* +fire staff, and Vayne OSB is great since it's a hybrid +dark sword. Those were my picks the past times an OSB draw came up, and they've been pretty beastly as stat sticks.

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    EnlongEnlong Registered User regular
    Locke OSB is neat, as it uniquely has a faster cast speed than other OSBs.

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    SelnerSelner Registered User regular
    Oh, and quick question looking at the rewards for the 250 Torments.

    What's Dark Matter? It's a 5* thing, but I don't know what it's used for.

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    ElderlycrawfishElderlycrawfish Registered User regular
    Cloud USB has the potential to have your hits break the damage cap, but by how much will depend on your ATK value, buffs, the Target's defense/elemental resistance, etc.

    It's not an instant guarantee to demolishing things but with the right team config to set the conditions right, it will smash faces.

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    EnlongEnlong Registered User regular
    Selner wrote: »
    Oh, and quick question looking at the rewards for the 250 Torments.

    What's Dark Matter? It's a 5* thing, but I don't know what it's used for.

    You use it to upgrade equipment that you have combined 3 copies of together, increasing its level cap by 5.

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    DarklyreDarklyre Registered User regular
    Cloud USB has the potential to have your hits break the damage cap, but by how much will depend on your ATK value, buffs, the Target's defense/elemental resistance, etc.

    It's not an instant guarantee to demolishing things but with the right team config to set the conditions right, it will smash faces.

    Right, but if you aren't breaking the cap with his USB1 active I'd hesitate to say that an OSB would do much more than 50k.

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    BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Selner wrote: »
    Oh, and quick question looking at the rewards for the 250 Torments.

    What's Dark Matter? It's a 5* thing, but I don't know what it's used for.

    Dark Matter is for polishing whale dongs.

    "I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."

    The Monster Baru Cormorant - Seth Dickinson

    Steam: Korvalain
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    Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    Dark matter is for accumulating since I don’t even bother to reforge the few 5x3s I have because 6*s are so much higher stats.

    aeNqQM9.jpg
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    ArtereisArtereis Registered User regular
    Cleared out all the torment dungeons thankfully. I didn't get all the jumpstart cid missions, but I got at least 1 of them from each. All of that was just in time for a shitload of jumpstarts, apparently.

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    silence1186silence1186 Character shields down! As a wingmanRegistered User regular
    FF8-2 100 gems: 3* blah

    Data for posterity:
    13 misses in a row

    36/291 lifetime

    3/36 this batch

    14/95 2nd batch (about on EV for this batch.)

    9/65 1st batch (0.1 items below EV, which is pretty much exactly expected return, though quite a few duds even on my hits)

    Note to self: No whining, Rikku USB, never forget. Also Cloud BSB2, Mustadio USB, Water Chain (dupe), Seymour Chain, Basch USB, Nine USB, Sephiroth USB, Pecil USB1

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    FryFry Registered User regular
    Got the Diablos mission:

    Squall BSB2+Arcane
    Laguna Blind Shell and then die to sap, oops
    Irvine turn 1 Entrust to Squall, Wrath another 3 bars and pass to Squall
    Selphie Hastega + Curada + SSB, Gathering Storm
    Fujin LMR+BSB, Stitch + Meltdown
    Magicite Enkidu, mixed ice/wind ATK/MAG offense set
    RW Selphie USB (Slots Full Cure)

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    JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    No announcement. I feel so empty.

    Also bleh. 9 or 10 keystones in the past two days, 0 Garuda which is the only one I wanted.

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    kuhlmeyekuhlmeye Registered User regular
    It was a slog of a night. Took down the d200 torments of FF5, 9, and tactics. Tactics went down to the wire with only the two cids left alive. 9 was a joke thanks to Zach chain and ultra, plus cloud roaming warrior allowing 50k aerora strikes (!), and 5 just required some tweaking.

    Thanks for suggestion on stacking imperils. Locke got them all to 3x fire imperil, and Tifa stacked earth damage. Another key was having tyro just do support, and dance the night away with multibreak and whichever one knocks down magic. It reduced the damage to the point where aeris's bsb was enough healing.

    Plus I did nightmare necrophobe today, which was the easiest I've done. Didn't even bother with the gimmick, just dps rushed him to death.

    PSN: the-K-flash
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    DarklyreDarklyre Registered User regular
    Since we're no longer getting data-mined announcements, just a PSA - tomorrow is probably when DU46 is released. Realms are VII:CC, XIV, and Type-0, so big possibility of junk and dupes on the lucky draw.

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    SelnerSelner Registered User regular
    So I decided to try a couple Nightmares yesterday.

    Reraise and Quadruple Foul down, woo.

    It took me a couple of tries with each, as I needed to understand the fight and I kept making mistakes.
    For some reason I have this really bad habit of forgetting to hit the RW button. And when my RW is Godwall, things go badly when I don't use it :) .

    I also ran out of hones trying to heal Evrae Altana to death. So I had to go splurge on honing various healing abilities and holy-based abilities.
    It was kind of fun to build Ramza's holy chain with heal-damage though.
    In the fight I won I did manage to somehow miss a Lens and Aerith got herself petrified. And she had the biggest damage spells. But after my hone splurge everyone had enough heals to take it down.

    I really hate that CPU battle. I basically rage-killed it because I kept messing up the fight.
    I figured out that TGCid can one-shot the Nodes with Assault Sabre and the Holy Chain up. So I saw screw making them go haywire. Gave Mako Might to Cid and DMT to Ramza. They gave eachother a fist bump and proceeded to murder the darn thing.

    And a new day just started, I had 19 RW uses of my Ayame. That's a personal best.
    I guess people are using her on the Corridor of Trials event? That's an ice-weakness thing.

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    kuhlmeyekuhlmeye Registered User regular
    Oh man I hear you about that cpu fight. That was so frustrating. The other one that has given me trouble so far was the tonberries, only because I had a hard time timing up my actions with when the phases changed.

    I've got 4 more nightmare dungeons to finish up. Does anybody remember when the 1/2 stamina ends? Wondering if I should pound through my remaining gate keeper fights there before it does.

    PSN: the-K-flash
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    JaysonFourJaysonFour Classy Monster Kitteh Registered User regular
    It's nice to know I'm not the only one stuck on that fight. I still can't seem to get it down.

    steam_sig.png
    I can has cheezburger, yes?
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    SelnerSelner Registered User regular
    kuhlmeye wrote: »
    Oh man I hear you about that cpu fight. That was so frustrating. The other one that has given me trouble so far was the tonberries, only because I had a hard time timing up my actions with when the phases changed.

    I've got 4 more nightmare dungeons to finish up. Does anybody remember when the 1/2 stamina ends? Wondering if I should pound through my remaining gate keeper fights there before it does.

    I scrolled through the announcements, and it looks like we've got 1/2 stamina through 7/17.

    In other news, I took down the 3* mote Giant raids. Super easy, didn't even break a sweat.
    Then I took down the first of the Odin raids. Also reasonably easy for my holy+Ayame team. I do need more 4* vitality motes.

    Lots of fun to actually complete content :) .

    Speaking of completing content, I had the funny experience of doing Torments and Nightmares, then taking a small "vacation" to do some Classic Realm Dungeons.
    One-shoting trash and totally wrecking bosses was a good change of pace :) .

    If the bar on the side is accurate, I'm about half-way through the Realm Dungeons? The difficultly is in the high 90s.
    Sitting on a pile of 325 mithril too.

    I can barely use the relics I have now, due to not having enough growth eggs to raise characters. So I don't need to spend the mithril, so I'm a gonna hoard it (unless a nice draw comes up I guess).

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    FryFry Registered User regular
    edited July 2018
    The CPU fight was basically a freebie if you used Multi Break (dancer version of Full Break), IIRC.

    edit: to be more specific:
    Step 1: figure out what it takes to drop Attack Node and Defense Node simultaneously once at the start of the fight. If you happen to have some AOE 5* or 6* abilities, this'll be pretty easy.

    Step 2: Line up characters to do these attacks as soon as Attack Node and Defense Node revive: Power Breakdown on Attack Node, Armor Breakdown on Defense Node, THEN Multi Break

    Step 3: Punch CPU in the face repeatedly. Have your dancer standby to use Multi Break again as soon as the nodes pop out of haywire mode. IIRC using Tyro as my dancer, he could just alternate Multi Break and Full Charge and the timing worked out perfectly. Probably wouldn't craft Full Break just for this, though - do some regular attack, wait a little bit, then do the Multi Break.

    Fry on
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    DaffyddDaffydd Registered User regular
    edited July 2018
    Evrae Altana can be cheesed using Minwu's first burst, which has hastega and an AoE holy command, as RW. Possibly the only time when that SB really shines.

    Daffydd on
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    DaffyddDaffydd Registered User regular
    Mastered 200 Torment II CM. Leon's ancient Hand of the Emperor SB did yeoman work, and Maria BSB of course ripped everything to shreds - even more so with Magicite. Hailstorm/Flashing Blade is still the best skill combo for Torment trash waves. Just I and XI left now, and I'm not going to be bothering with a nearly SB-less XI (possible, but too annoying). Everything else in Torment is done, I'll be content after I finish the 200 CM for I.

    I wish DeNA would come up with new Torment dungeons like the old ones. The rhythm of the trash-to-boss fight is different from anything they're throwing at us now, in a good way. I think it would be a fun challenge to have hard trash leading up to a 3* or 4* magicite-level boss fight. Might actually have to use a combination of SB types.

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    EnlongEnlong Registered User regular
    My road to clear all the Torment Cid missions before they vanish is continuing. I cleared Golbez, who I had considered the hardest Torment, so things are looking promising. My biggest fear is XI: I have no soul breaks at all for Aphmau, and I would rather not spend one of my AA BSB picks on her unless I need to. Probably I can brute force it with Ayame and Lion.

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    DaffyddDaffydd Registered User regular
    Mastered 200 Torment I CM. Master USB, Warrior of Light LMR, Garland SSB, Sarah BSB. Kinda overkill, really. It's amazing how much 4 hit abilities trivialize old content. Maybe I'll try XI after all, just remembered I have Ayame OSB, Lion BSB, and Aphmau SSB (terrible, but it's an astra)...

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    JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    Oh hey, apparently they're updating the Vault to have all the search options of everything else sometime soon.

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    38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    edited July 2018
    @enlong

    Search on reddit there are many relic less clears for that torment.

    I did it relicless also.

    38thDoe on
    38thDoE on steam
    🦀🦑🦀🦑🦀🦑🦀🦑🦀🦑🦀🦑🦀
    
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    DarklyreDarklyre Registered User regular
    I did the XI CM Torments with a mixed party and no Aphmau relics using a shared medica, so it's definitely possible.

This discussion has been closed.