As was foretold, we've added advertisements to the forums! If you have questions, or if you encounter any bugs, please visit this thread: https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/240191/forum-advertisement-faq-and-reports-thread/
Options

[Xbox/XBL] Battlefront II SP Sucked (but Gavankar was great): A Retrospective

12467101

Posts

  • Options
    cloudeaglecloudeagle Registered User regular
    I'd bet cash money at least part of the original motivation to bankroll Scalebound was to hamstring/annoy Nintendo, which was rapidly becoming known as the "home" of Platinum.

    Switch: 3947-4890-9293
  • Options
    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    ....who would it be a "huge goodwill gesture to"?

    Platinum? Nintendo? Japanese audiences?

    Scalebound was kind of the figurehead of of a slate of cancellations that MS still gets shit on for. It was basically the central point of the "Xbox has no games" thesis. With Xbox trying to rejuvinate thier brand, bringing back Scalebound would be a pretty good way of saying things have changed. (You know, besides aquiring six new studios)
    I could just be too overtly cynical about how companies weigh bottom lines. There were lots of obvious reasons to cancel Scalebound, fewer to resurrect it.

    Though that would presumably exclude the possibility of it being it an exclusive (because, why would Microsoft pay for a Nintendo exclusive, even if their name was publisher?).

    Yeah, even if that switch rumor was true, I doubt it would have been an exclusive.

  • Options
    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Welp. Switching the graphics mode in DOA6 to "prioritize graphics" on my original shape Xbox One results in what looks like about 15fps and I'm not exaggerating. It's nowhere near 30. On "prioritize action" it looks like a good 60 or so but the resolution scaling is noticeable, and I'm playing on a 720p TV. It definitely makes me wonder what sort of framerate those of you with X1X's will get from the setting but I bet you'll get a decent bump in image quality either way.

    The Story mode portion of the demo is a couple of cutscenes and a fight between Marie Rose (you) and Helena (CPU), and that's it. So if you want more fighting the AI, you're going to have to go into Training mode and switch on the COM Action to whichever difficulty level you want. Still, now I can use my mains and other characters I'm more familiar with (the game's whole roster is available except Phase 4 and Nyotengu) I can get a much better feel for it.

    You're basically experiencing what it's like to play it on a PC...from 2013. Though admittedly, your situation is slightly worse than even if you were playing on a 1080p TV because of how resolution scaling is handled on 720p versus 1080p (it's almost certainly going to 1080p, then going back down to 720p for you, because that's how it typically works).

    Having had enough old PCs in my time that I've made do things they really shouldn't... yeah. The Witcher 3 on a 6990M comes to mind! It did it better than you'd think but it was on the limit of hardware that could do it.

    I have my Xbox set to 1080p output because it gives a much sharper image even on this TV (which obviously is 1366x768 or whatever it is, not native 720p because they never are). It's by no means unplayable (think DOA Dimensions in 3D mode) but on the whole I'd rather take the resolution scaling hit, even if it uglifies the backgrounds a bit. I'm not sure it's even applying it to the characters; if it is, it's not noticeable.

    Some of the new stages are awesome (Forbidden Fortune and Lost Paradise are instant new faves). I'm missing a lot of DOA5LR's guest characters, though. Still got my fingers crossed for DLC Momiji in the future.

    You may've hit upon why it's not coming to Switch (not yet anyway). But you're correct, DOA has been a 60 FPS franchise for...like 20 years now (see what I did there?), so your decision is correct. It's extremely hard to imagine it otherwise, compared to Tekken, which occasionally fell apart in terms of framerate on the PS2 (or maybe my PS2 was just one of the many defective ones).

    I see what you did there. :+1:

    Yeah, I'm not going to claim I'm not disappointed after rock-solid framerates in DOA2U, 3, 4, 5, 5U, 5LR... and Dimensions on the 3DS at least offers the consolation prize of really excellent 3D depth (and you can switch between modes mid-fight, of course) if you're prepared to take the framerate hit. 6 can absolutely maintain the required framerate on base Xbone hardware, at least; it just comes at a price. It's not enough to ruin the game, by any means, but any of you playing it on an X will be smiling. It's just a shame the resolution scaling is so noticeable, rather than the game using another method such as reducing the geometric detail in the environments, or something else you'd commonly find in a graphics menu in a PC game.

    Just for completeness' sake, I did bump the Xbox's own resolution down to 720p, but as expected there was no gain from it, and it produces a much softer image. So I put it back to 1080p.

    I don't doubt they'll get DOA6 onto the Switch eventually but it's going to take some downgrading to get it there.

    I'll be sure to give you my appraisal when I get home from work this evening and can try it out on my Xbox One X. Also anything I see about frame-syncing issues and HDR employment, because I've got a pretty boss Samsung Q6F TV. But I hope we do get a full technical breakdown from Digital Foundry soon.

    I look forward to it. It'll be a good comparo since your setup is on the other end of the spectrum to mine - although for what it's worth, my humble-resolution'd TV is still a decent (if old) Samsung.

    An interesting addition is the game now has the option to switch between 3-way and 4-way holds. 3-way being the "classic" method in DOA3 etc, 4-way being the DOA2U method of having to counter toward for mid-kicks. The choice applies to modes under the Fight heading (greyed out in the demo but where we'll find Arcade, Time Attack, Versus, etc etc in the full game) and Free Training; not sure if it will apply to Lobby matches online, or Story mode. It specifically does not apply to Ranked matches, where it enforces 4-way.

    One major problem I've just run into (for the likes of you, me and @baudattitude , and anyone else who was going to drop by) is that the Lobby match option appears to be greyed out under Online. I thought both Ranked and Lobby were meant to be available in this demo? That may scupper our plans for a PA game later on. :sad: Unless it gets switched on later, but that seems unlikely. Boo.

    Edit: confirmed, no Lobby play. Dammit. https://teamninja-studio.com/doa6/us/news190215c.html

    Jazz on
  • Options
    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    I'd bet cash money at least part of the original motivation to bankroll Scalebound was to hamstring/annoy Nintendo, which was rapidly becoming known as the "home" of Platinum.

    I'll have to take your word for it. I still think Nier: Automata is better known than Bayoneta II, and that still hasn't been announced for the Switch, as far as I know.

    a47mxf127i2c.jpg

    Nintendo's definitely the home for Bayonetta. But of the games Platinum has developed since 2015, they're pretty even spread out. A lot of them are on Nintendo platforms definitely, but there are exceptions--every year has at least one game franchise that doesn't come to a Nintendo platform, and in 2017, the one game they did put out--Nier: Automata--didn't come to Nintendo at all. But 2B's wild existential ride is also my favorite Platinum game, by far, so inevitably I will associate it with Platinum over anything else.

    Synthesis on
  • Options
    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    Wow, the 3-way/4-way option is huge.

  • Options
    cloudeaglecloudeagle Registered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    I'd bet cash money at least part of the original motivation to bankroll Scalebound was to hamstring/annoy Nintendo, which was rapidly becoming known as the "home" of Platinum.

    I'll have to take your word for it. I still think Nier: Automata is better known than Bayoneta II, and that still hasn't been announced for the Switch, as far as I know.

    Nintendo's definitely the home for Bayonetta. But of the games Platinum has developed since 2015, they're pretty even spread out. A lot of them are on Nintendo platforms definitely, but there are exceptions--every year has at least one game franchise that doesn't come to a Nintendo platform, and in 2017, the one game they did put out--Nier: Automata--didn't come to Nintendo at all.

    Which happened well after the original Scalebound deal. :P

    Of course, they did stuff for other systems. But in the early Wii U games, Platinum was considered as one of the few third-parties to really stick by Nintendo. And in the entertainment biz, "stealing" talent is quite common. It's a pride thing. (Think of DC immediately signing up James Gunn for Suicide Squad II after Disney freaked out over his past tweets and fired him. Or hell, Microsoft again with Sunset Overdrive, done by loyal Sony developer Insomniac.)

    Switch: 3947-4890-9293
  • Options
    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    I'd bet cash money at least part of the original motivation to bankroll Scalebound was to hamstring/annoy Nintendo, which was rapidly becoming known as the "home" of Platinum.

    I'll have to take your word for it. I still think Nier: Automata is better known than Bayoneta II, and that still hasn't been announced for the Switch, as far as I know.

    Nintendo's definitely the home for Bayonetta. But of the games Platinum has developed since 2015, they're pretty even spread out. A lot of them are on Nintendo platforms definitely, but there are exceptions--every year has at least one game franchise that doesn't come to a Nintendo platform, and in 2017, the one game they did put out--Nier: Automata--didn't come to Nintendo at all.

    Which happened well after the original Scalebound deal. :P

    Of course, they did stuff for other systems. But in the early Wii U games, Platinum was considered as one of the few third-parties to really stick by Nintendo. And in the entertainment biz, "stealing" talent is quite common. It's a pride thing. (Think of DC immediately signing up James Gunn for Suicide Squad II after Disney freaked out over his past tweets and fired him. Or hell, Microsoft again with Sunset Overdrive, done by loyal Sony developer Insomniac.)

    I'm just surprised Nier: Automata hasn't been announced for the Switch! :P

    Synthesis on
  • Options
    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Welp. Switching the graphics mode in DOA6 to "prioritize graphics" on my original shape Xbox One results in what looks like about 15fps and I'm not exaggerating. It's nowhere near 30. On "prioritize action" it looks like a good 60 or so but the resolution scaling is noticeable, and I'm playing on a 720p TV. It definitely makes me wonder what sort of framerate those of you with X1X's will get from the setting but I bet you'll get a decent bump in image quality either way.

    The Story mode portion of the demo is a couple of cutscenes and a fight between Marie Rose (you) and Helena (CPU), and that's it. So if you want more fighting the AI, you're going to have to go into Training mode and switch on the COM Action to whichever difficulty level you want. Still, now I can use my mains and other characters I'm more familiar with (the game's whole roster is available except Phase 4 and Nyotengu) I can get a much better feel for it.

    You're basically experiencing what it's like to play it on a PC...from 2013. Though admittedly, your situation is slightly worse than even if you were playing on a 1080p TV because of how resolution scaling is handled on 720p versus 1080p (it's almost certainly going to 1080p, then going back down to 720p for you, because that's how it typically works).

    Having had enough old PCs in my time that I've made do things they really shouldn't... yeah. The Witcher 3 on a 6990M comes to mind! It did it better than you'd think but it was on the limit of hardware that could do it.

    I have my Xbox set to 1080p output because it gives a much sharper image even on this TV (which obviously is 1366x768 or whatever it is, not native 720p because they never are). It's by no means unplayable (think DOA Dimensions in 3D mode) but on the whole I'd rather take the resolution scaling hit, even if it uglifies the backgrounds a bit. I'm not sure it's even applying it to the characters; if it is, it's not noticeable.

    Some of the new stages are awesome (Forbidden Fortune and Lost Paradise are instant new faves). I'm missing a lot of DOA5LR's guest characters, though. Still got my fingers crossed for DLC Momiji in the future.

    You may've hit upon why it's not coming to Switch (not yet anyway). But you're correct, DOA has been a 60 FPS franchise for...like 20 years now (see what I did there?), so your decision is correct. It's extremely hard to imagine it otherwise, compared to Tekken, which occasionally fell apart in terms of framerate on the PS2 (or maybe my PS2 was just one of the many defective ones).

    I see what you did there. :+1:

    Yeah, I'm not going to claim I'm not disappointed after rock-solid framerates in DOA2U, 3, 4, 5, 5U, 5LR... and Dimensions on the 3DS at least offers the consolation prize of really excellent 3D depth (and you can switch between modes mid-fight, of course) if you're prepared to take the framerate hit. 6 can absolutely maintain the required framerate on base Xbone hardware, at least; it just comes at a price. It's not enough to ruin the game, by any means, but any of you playing it on an X will be smiling. It's just a shame the resolution scaling is so noticeable, rather than the game using another method such as reducing the geometric detail in the environments, or something else you'd commonly find in a graphics menu in a PC game.

    Just for completeness' sake, I did bump the Xbox's own resolution down to 720p, but as expected there was no gain from it, and it produces a much softer image. So I put it back to 1080p.

    I don't doubt they'll get DOA6 onto the Switch eventually but it's going to take some downgrading to get it there.

    I'll be sure to give you my appraisal when I get home from work this evening and can try it out on my Xbox One X. Also anything I see about frame-syncing issues and HDR employment, because I've got a pretty boss Samsung Q6F TV. But I hope we do get a full technical breakdown from Digital Foundry soon.

    I look forward to it. It'll be a good comparo since your setup is on the other end of the spectrum to mine - although for what it's worth, my humble-resolution'd TV is still a decent (if old) Samsung.

    An interesting addition is the game now has the option to switch between 3-way and 4-way holds. 3-way being the "classic" method in DOA3 etc, 4-way being the DOA2U method of having to counter toward for mid-kicks. The choice applies to modes under the Fight heading (greyed out in the demo but where we'll find Arcade, Time Attack, Versus, etc etc in the full game) and Free Training; not sure if it will apply to Lobby matches online, or Story mode. It specifically does not apply to Ranked matches, where it enforces 4-way.

    One major problem I've just run into (for the likes of you, me and @baudattitude , and anyone else who was going to drop by) is that the Lobby match option appears to be greyed out under Online. I thought both Ranked and Lobby were meant to be available in this demo? That may scupper our plans for a PA game later on. :sad: Unless it gets switched on later, but that seems unlikely. Boo.

    Edit: confirmed, no Lobby play. Dammit. https://teamninja-studio.com/doa6/us/news190215c.html

    Hmm, technical hurdle, or just trying to keep the preview audience guessing?

    Thanks for the heads up about the hold options--nowadays, that's the sort of thing I could pick up, get used to, and never realize it was the option. Wasn't DOA4 also 4-way? I could've sworn that was the change.

  • Options
    cloudeaglecloudeagle Registered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    I'd bet cash money at least part of the original motivation to bankroll Scalebound was to hamstring/annoy Nintendo, which was rapidly becoming known as the "home" of Platinum.

    I'll have to take your word for it. I still think Nier: Automata is better known than Bayoneta II, and that still hasn't been announced for the Switch, as far as I know.

    Nintendo's definitely the home for Bayonetta. But of the games Platinum has developed since 2015, they're pretty even spread out. A lot of them are on Nintendo platforms definitely, but there are exceptions--every year has at least one game franchise that doesn't come to a Nintendo platform, and in 2017, the one game they did put out--Nier: Automata--didn't come to Nintendo at all.

    Which happened well after the original Scalebound deal. :P

    Of course, they did stuff for other systems. But in the early Wii U games, Platinum was considered as one of the few third-parties to really stick by Nintendo. And in the entertainment biz, "stealing" talent is quite common. It's a pride thing. (Think of DC immediately signing up James Gunn for Suicide Squad II after Disney freaked out over his past tweets and fired him. Or hell, Microsoft again with Sunset Overdrive, done by loyal Sony developer Insomniac.)

    I'm just surprised Nier: Automata hasn't been announced for the Switch! :P

    Probably a porting headache issue, maybe combined with Nintendo not making any efforts to make sure it comes over. (Which they do sometimes -- Dragon Quest 11 and DQ Builders 2 are coming to Switch because they're publishing them instead of Squeenix, for instance.)

    Switch: 3947-4890-9293
  • Options
    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Welp. Switching the graphics mode in DOA6 to "prioritize graphics" on my original shape Xbox One results in what looks like about 15fps and I'm not exaggerating. It's nowhere near 30. On "prioritize action" it looks like a good 60 or so but the resolution scaling is noticeable, and I'm playing on a 720p TV. It definitely makes me wonder what sort of framerate those of you with X1X's will get from the setting but I bet you'll get a decent bump in image quality either way.

    The Story mode portion of the demo is a couple of cutscenes and a fight between Marie Rose (you) and Helena (CPU), and that's it. So if you want more fighting the AI, you're going to have to go into Training mode and switch on the COM Action to whichever difficulty level you want. Still, now I can use my mains and other characters I'm more familiar with (the game's whole roster is available except Phase 4 and Nyotengu) I can get a much better feel for it.

    You're basically experiencing what it's like to play it on a PC...from 2013. Though admittedly, your situation is slightly worse than even if you were playing on a 1080p TV because of how resolution scaling is handled on 720p versus 1080p (it's almost certainly going to 1080p, then going back down to 720p for you, because that's how it typically works).

    Having had enough old PCs in my time that I've made do things they really shouldn't... yeah. The Witcher 3 on a 6990M comes to mind! It did it better than you'd think but it was on the limit of hardware that could do it.

    I have my Xbox set to 1080p output because it gives a much sharper image even on this TV (which obviously is 1366x768 or whatever it is, not native 720p because they never are). It's by no means unplayable (think DOA Dimensions in 3D mode) but on the whole I'd rather take the resolution scaling hit, even if it uglifies the backgrounds a bit. I'm not sure it's even applying it to the characters; if it is, it's not noticeable.

    Some of the new stages are awesome (Forbidden Fortune and Lost Paradise are instant new faves). I'm missing a lot of DOA5LR's guest characters, though. Still got my fingers crossed for DLC Momiji in the future.

    You may've hit upon why it's not coming to Switch (not yet anyway). But you're correct, DOA has been a 60 FPS franchise for...like 20 years now (see what I did there?), so your decision is correct. It's extremely hard to imagine it otherwise, compared to Tekken, which occasionally fell apart in terms of framerate on the PS2 (or maybe my PS2 was just one of the many defective ones).

    I see what you did there. :+1:

    Yeah, I'm not going to claim I'm not disappointed after rock-solid framerates in DOA2U, 3, 4, 5, 5U, 5LR... and Dimensions on the 3DS at least offers the consolation prize of really excellent 3D depth (and you can switch between modes mid-fight, of course) if you're prepared to take the framerate hit. 6 can absolutely maintain the required framerate on base Xbone hardware, at least; it just comes at a price. It's not enough to ruin the game, by any means, but any of you playing it on an X will be smiling. It's just a shame the resolution scaling is so noticeable, rather than the game using another method such as reducing the geometric detail in the environments, or something else you'd commonly find in a graphics menu in a PC game.

    Just for completeness' sake, I did bump the Xbox's own resolution down to 720p, but as expected there was no gain from it, and it produces a much softer image. So I put it back to 1080p.

    I don't doubt they'll get DOA6 onto the Switch eventually but it's going to take some downgrading to get it there.

    I'll be sure to give you my appraisal when I get home from work this evening and can try it out on my Xbox One X. Also anything I see about frame-syncing issues and HDR employment, because I've got a pretty boss Samsung Q6F TV. But I hope we do get a full technical breakdown from Digital Foundry soon.

    I look forward to it. It'll be a good comparo since your setup is on the other end of the spectrum to mine - although for what it's worth, my humble-resolution'd TV is still a decent (if old) Samsung.

    An interesting addition is the game now has the option to switch between 3-way and 4-way holds. 3-way being the "classic" method in DOA3 etc, 4-way being the DOA2U method of having to counter toward for mid-kicks. The choice applies to modes under the Fight heading (greyed out in the demo but where we'll find Arcade, Time Attack, Versus, etc etc in the full game) and Free Training; not sure if it will apply to Lobby matches online, or Story mode. It specifically does not apply to Ranked matches, where it enforces 4-way.

    One major problem I've just run into (for the likes of you, me and @baudattitude , and anyone else who was going to drop by) is that the Lobby match option appears to be greyed out under Online. I thought both Ranked and Lobby were meant to be available in this demo? That may scupper our plans for a PA game later on. :sad: Unless it gets switched on later, but that seems unlikely. Boo.

    Edit: confirmed, no Lobby play. Dammit. https://teamninja-studio.com/doa6/us/news190215c.html

    Hmm, technical hurdle, or just trying to keep the preview audience guessing?

    Thanks for the heads up about the hold options--nowadays, that's the sort of thing I could pick up, get used to, and never realize it was the option. Wasn't DOA4 also 4-way? I could've sworn that was the change.

    You know, I honestly can't recall with 4. I remember 2U introduced it but I really don't remember it being in 4, but I'm not certain.

    My guess is it's trying to limit the demo as much as possible to prevent people from playing the shit out of it for two days, calling it good and not buying the game. Same as why Arcade, Versus, etc aren't available.

    I just played three ranked matches, and despite some horrendous lag when the game rated the connection as good and much less lag when the game rated the connection as medium, managed to win two of them (playing as Helena, lost first match against a Brad Wong, beat him on the rematch, then moved on to a Zack and beat him too). So that's an okay start.

    Jazz on
  • Options
    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    IIRC, DOA2 was 6 way, DOA3 was 3 way, DOA2:Ultimate switched back to 6 way, so they compromised with 4 way for DOA4 and that has been the default ever since.

  • Options
    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    IIRC, DOA2 was 6 way, DOA3 was 3 way, DOA2:Ultimate switched back to 6 way, so they compromised with 4 way for DOA4 and that has been the default ever since.

    Having never played vanilla 2 (or 2H), I don't honestly know what that had but it's not strictly had 6-way since. 2U brought in 4-way (back-high, back-mid for punches, back-low, toward-mid for kicks as the fourth rather than just having back-mid take care of kicks too). And 5 was definitely 3-way.

    Unless my mind is really playing tricks on me. Or we're defining them differently?

    I'm gonna have to dust off 4 and see.

    Jazz on
  • Options
    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Crap, now I'm confused about it too.

    Plus, don't a few characters have...I don't know, "ambidextrous" mid-level counters? Forwards and backwards?

  • Options
    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    Oh, I could be COMPLETELY wrong.

  • Options
    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    Maybe we're all wrong :lol:

    Also, one round I KO'd that Zack with an environment hit. Dropped him off the big drop in Lost Paradise, he KO'd when he hit the ground.

    It is a VERY long drop. :lol:

    Jazz on
  • Options
    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Ooh...falling KO's are back? They've been gone since DOA3.

  • Options
    RickRudeRickRude Registered User regular
    Disappointed you can't do 2 players offline but it's expected . Might try out some of this online, but I was showing my gf some characters and I don't really get the game. I'm just mashing buttons and that doesn't feel satisfying like it does in say soul caliber or tekken.

  • Options
    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Ooh...falling KO's are back? They've been gone since DOA3.

    Pretty sure Dimensions did them too.

    Edit: and I could've sworn they were in 5 too... so I just fired it up to confirm (5LR on PC in 2-player vs, me against, er, me). Sure enough, KO'd Ayane by launch-kicking her off the edge in Lost World, and it was definitely not the kick that caused the KO, it was the landing.

    Were they just not in 4? That wouldn't surprise me.

    Jazz on
  • Options
    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    RickRude wrote: »
    Disappointed you can't do 2 players offline but it's expected . Might try out some of this online, but I was showing my gf some characters and I don't really get the game. I'm just mashing buttons and that doesn't feel satisfying like it does in say soul caliber or tekken.

    I think Soul Calibur is the closer comparison. DOA is pretty fluid in how a lot of the combo patterns play out; I remember when I first played DOA3 I felt like I could more or less create my own combos, at least with some characters. It's not actually the case, but it is far less regimented in how they work compared to Tekken (although admittedly I've not played a Tekken since 3, at least not for more than a few minutes, so I'm assuming the fundamental mechanics are more or less the same still; as well as rather stiff timing execution, Tekken demanded a lot of memorization which DOA really doesn't except for certain elaborate moves). It is entirely possible to play DOA with button mashing, as is also true of SC, but doing that you will often leave yourself wide open to be countered with holds (often also referred to just as counters). A lot of DOA is getting the "triangle system" (the "rock, paper, scissors" thing) down; holds beat strikes, strikes beat throws and throws beat holds, but throws and strikes in particular aren't built the same for all characters. A little playing around in the training mode can quickly teach you a lot of the basics with any character, certainly enough to get by on, but nailing everything with even one of them is gonna take a while.

    If you're new to it but want to try some 2 player vs offline, download DOA5 Last Round: Core Fighters for free. It's the F2P version of DOA5 and offers you 4 characters to play as much as you want with (although they are sort of similar characters, fast ninjas - Kasumi, Ayane, Hayabusa and Hayate), the idea being you could just add characters a la carte as DLC if you didn't want to buy the full game. It serves as a really useful demo, too - it's more full-featured gameplay-wise than the DOA6 demo, it just doesn't have the full roster available to you. Sometimes they have a couple of locked characters temporarily unlocked for you to try, as well.

    But all that said, if it doesn't click with you, that's okay too. I've found that with fighting games a lot of it comes down to feel, and it's entirely possible the feel of one major series may work for you where another does not. Still, I hope it does click for you :)

  • Options
    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Ooh...falling KO's are back? They've been gone since DOA3.

    Pretty sure Dimensions did them too.

    Edit: and I could've sworn they were in 5 too... so I just fired it up to confirm (5LR on PC in 2-player vs, me against, er, me). Sure enough, KO'd Ayane by launch-kicking her off the edge in Lost World, and it was definitely not the kick that caused the KO, it was the landing.

    Were they just not in 4? That wouldn't surprise me.

    Really? I thought for sure they were out of DOA5, they would just lower you to 1 HP.

    I guess not.
    RickRude wrote: »
    Disappointed you can't do 2 players offline but it's expected . Might try out some of this online, but I was showing my gf some characters and I don't really get the game. I'm just mashing buttons and that doesn't feel satisfying like it does in say soul caliber or tekken.

    In the demo, no. Though I think you might be able to trick you way in training mode with two people....

    Synthesis on
  • Options
    rahkeesh2000rahkeesh2000 Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    So JeuxVideo (big French gaming site?) is reporting that E3 will show off next gen xboxes. The same E3 that Sony isn't even attending. Preliminary specs for the systems are included.

    However they are supposedly actually releasing these boxes end of 2020.

    I have no idea what they are thinking.

    rahkeesh2000 on
  • Options
    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Ooh...falling KO's are back? They've been gone since DOA3.

    Pretty sure Dimensions did them too.

    Edit: and I could've sworn they were in 5 too... so I just fired it up to confirm (5LR on PC in 2-player vs, me against, er, me). Sure enough, KO'd Ayane by launch-kicking her off the edge in Lost World, and it was definitely not the kick that caused the KO, it was the landing.

    Were they just not in 4? That wouldn't surprise me.

    Really? I thought for sure they were out of DOA5, they would just lower you to 1 HP.

    I guess not.
    I'm remembering it too, definitely; but I just can't place where. I'll have to compare all the damn games again :lol:

    Maybe it's on certain stages and not others? Maybe it's even a difference between versions of 5.

    I dunno. I'm 99% sure you aren't mis-remembering, though. That 1 HP thing definitely happened somewhere.

    Synthesis wrote: »
    RickRude wrote: »
    Disappointed you can't do 2 players offline but it's expected . Might try out some of this online, but I was showing my gf some characters and I don't really get the game. I'm just mashing buttons and that doesn't feel satisfying like it does in say soul caliber or tekken.

    In the demo, no. Though I think you might be able to trick you way in training mode with two people....

    You can indeed do that, just no-one will ever win as health regenerates before someone gets knocked out!

  • Options
    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    So JeuxVideo (big French gaming site?) is reporting that E3 will show off next gen xboxes. The same E3 that Sony isn't even attending. Preliminary specs for the systems are included.

    However they are supposedly actually releasing these boxes end of 2020.

    I have no idea what they are thinking.

    Well, they probably don't have much else.

    That said, I'd be very surprised at a full reveal. I imagine it'll be something closer to the Scorpio reveal from 2016.

  • Options
    BRIAN BLESSEDBRIAN BLESSED Maybe you aren't SPEAKING LOUDLY ENOUGHHH Registered User regular
    So JeuxVideo (big French gaming site?) is reporting that E3 will show off next gen xboxes. The same E3 that Sony isn't even attending. Preliminary specs for the systems are included.

    However they are supposedly actually releasing these boxes end of 2020.

    I have no idea what they are thinking.

    Given that mid-cycle refresh consoles are now mildly successful and that Xbox are eager to tai chi this whole direct competition by rendering comparative console power moot (since there'll be so many different SKUs of varying power) it makes sense for them to shoot first with a proper spec and leave the old Xbox One in the dust (or at least with a machine who can present the next generation of graphics and present the current generation of games in a really flattering light)

    Add the fact that cross-gen compatibility is nigh certain for the Xbox brand and honestly they could announce it this year with no real issues

  • Options
    rahkeesh2000rahkeesh2000 Registered User regular
    Given that mid-cycle refresh consoles are now mildly successful and that Xbox are eager to tai chi this whole direct competition by rendering comparative console power moot (since there'll be so many different SKUs of varying power) it makes sense for them to shoot first with a proper spec and leave the old Xbox One in the dust (or at least with a machine who can present the next generation of graphics and present the current generation of games in a really flattering light)

    Shooting first would be like, actually releasing in 2019. Not the same holiday that Sony is probably releasing in.

    But then they did announce Scorpio early and not mind the lost sales in the meantime, so at least its consistent.

  • Options
    baudattitudebaudattitude Registered User regular
    Only got about 15 minutes with the DoA6 demo before leaving the house this morning. Pity about no lobby mode.

    My word, this is a pretty game in 4K graphics mode, but I could definitely feel the frame rate drops. I’m normally not sensitive to FPS drops as long as they don’t go sub-30fps, but apparently I’ve been playing enough fighting games lately that I actually notice.

    Also I managed to get surprised by the T-Rex even though I’ve seen it a bunch of times in trailers and gameplay footage. Really does just pop out at you. :)

  • Options
    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    PA DOA6 night will still have to happen, it'll just need to require the actual game. :)

  • Options
    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    Welp. Switching the graphics mode in DOA6 to "prioritize graphics" on my original shape Xbox One results in what looks like about 15fps and I'm not exaggerating. It's nowhere near 30. On "prioritize action" it looks like a good 60 or so but the resolution scaling is noticeable, and I'm playing on a 720p TV. It definitely makes me wonder what sort of framerate those of you with X1X's will get from the setting but I bet you'll get a decent bump in image quality either way.

    The Story mode portion of the demo is a couple of cutscenes and a fight between Marie Rose (you) and Helena (CPU), and that's it. So if you want more fighting the AI, you're going to have to go into Training mode and switch on the COM Action to whichever difficulty level you want. Still, now I can use my mains and other characters I'm more familiar with (the game's whole roster is available except Phase 4 and Nyotengu) I can get a much better feel for it.

    You're basically experiencing what it's like to play it on a PC...from 2013. Though admittedly, your situation is slightly worse than even if you were playing on a 1080p TV because of how resolution scaling is handled on 720p versus 1080p (it's almost certainly going to 1080p, then going back down to 720p for you, because that's how it typically works).

    Having had enough old PCs in my time that I've made do things they really shouldn't... yeah. The Witcher 3 on a 6990M comes to mind! It did it better than you'd think but it was on the limit of hardware that could do it.

    I have my Xbox set to 1080p output because it gives a much sharper image even on this TV (which obviously is 1366x768 or whatever it is, not native 720p because they never are). It's by no means unplayable (think DOA Dimensions in 3D mode) but on the whole I'd rather take the resolution scaling hit, even if it uglifies the backgrounds a bit. I'm not sure it's even applying it to the characters; if it is, it's not noticeable.

    Some of the new stages are awesome (Forbidden Fortune and Lost Paradise are instant new faves). I'm missing a lot of DOA5LR's guest characters, though. Still got my fingers crossed for DLC Momiji in the future.

    You may've hit upon why it's not coming to Switch (not yet anyway). But you're correct, DOA has been a 60 FPS franchise for...like 20 years now (see what I did there?), so your decision is correct. It's extremely hard to imagine it otherwise, compared to Tekken, which occasionally fell apart in terms of framerate on the PS2 (or maybe my PS2 was just one of the many defective ones).

    I see what you did there. :+1:

    Yeah, I'm not going to claim I'm not disappointed after rock-solid framerates in DOA2U, 3, 4, 5, 5U, 5LR... and Dimensions on the 3DS at least offers the consolation prize of really excellent 3D depth (and you can switch between modes mid-fight, of course) if you're prepared to take the framerate hit. 6 can absolutely maintain the required framerate on base Xbone hardware, at least; it just comes at a price. It's not enough to ruin the game, by any means, but any of you playing it on an X will be smiling. It's just a shame the resolution scaling is so noticeable, rather than the game using another method such as reducing the geometric detail in the environments, or something else you'd commonly find in a graphics menu in a PC game.

    Just for completeness' sake, I did bump the Xbox's own resolution down to 720p, but as expected there was no gain from it, and it produces a much softer image. So I put it back to 1080p.

    I don't doubt they'll get DOA6 onto the Switch eventually but it's going to take some downgrading to get it there.

    I'll be sure to give you my appraisal when I get home from work this evening and can try it out on my Xbox One X. Also anything I see about frame-syncing issues and HDR employment, because I've got a pretty boss Samsung Q6F TV. But I hope we do get a full technical breakdown from Digital Foundry soon.

    I look forward to it. It'll be a good comparo since your setup is on the other end of the spectrum to mine - although for what it's worth, my humble-resolution'd TV is still a decent (if old) Samsung.

    So, I had a bit to play around with the tutorial (those strike move thingies with the right shoulder button, those are new!), as well as training mode. I didn't play online because I'm easily intimidated.

    I was actually pleasantly surprised that I had no trouble fighting Kasumi as Ayane on basic coms, so the controls haven't changed very much. Ayane's move set seems very similar.

    Really, the biggest change seems to be the visuals. Is this in UE4? I suppose not, considering there wasn't a logo at the beginning (or I just blinked and missed it).

    I'm please that it holds up well next to SoulCalibur VI. Though, that's not surprising--putting aside gameplay, from a level and costume design standpoint, SCVI, especially on a UHD screen, looks like a discount SoulCalibur game, albeit a very modern one. Costumes are barely more detailed then they were when 7 years ago when SCV came out, and there's a lot of reuse of models and assets. DOA6 looks...substantially better, I think. I don't think it's actually a 2160p game, but it looks very sharp, and the colors jumped out a lot--maybe a little too much.

    Didn't get any slowdown but @baudattitude mentioned encountering it, so maybe I just lucked out with a small stage. Then again, I haven't played it on the prioritizing visuals mode, so maybe that's why? No screen tearing (good), HDR implementation seemed fine (nothing very special, but then again, the stages I played weren't particularly outdoorsy). It looks good. Better, I think, than when DOA5's first incarnation came out on Xbox 360/PS3--in relative terms. This genuinely impressed me. But maybe I just happen to catch the light particularly nicely, or maybe it's the TV.
    Given that mid-cycle refresh consoles are now mildly successful and that Xbox are eager to tai chi this whole direct competition by rendering comparative console power moot (since there'll be so many different SKUs of varying power) it makes sense for them to shoot first with a proper spec and leave the old Xbox One in the dust (or at least with a machine who can present the next generation of graphics and present the current generation of games in a really flattering light)

    Shooting first would be like, actually releasing in 2019. Not the same holiday that Sony is probably releasing in.

    But then they did announce Scorpio early and not mind the lost sales in the meantime, so at least its consistent.

    Was there evidence of lost sales due to the early reveal? The Xbox One S sold absurdly well the first month it came out, despite the Xbox One X being officially announced. It was actually the best selling console the month of its release, not a common occurrence for Xbox One (then again, people like hardware refreshes).

    Synthesis on
  • Options
    baudattitudebaudattitude Registered User regular
    I got home and played with the demo some more. Played a bunch of matches online, won one of them, usually won at least a round in the ones I lost. Generally accepted "rematch?" challenges unless they were "you just got bodied 0-3 and your opponent would like to play again, Y/N?"

    Biggest takeaway: I really need to learn how to hold.

    I love the S button, even though it never really turned the course of any matches. Just being able to jab on that and suddenly your character does something very cool looking takes some of the sting out of the rest of the fight.

    The tutorial looks great, there are individual ones for every character that show you at least a few basic attacks and a massive "every damn thing in the game" tutorial. I am looking forward to digging into that when the full game hits.

    I haven't seen slowdown on any stages except for the lost world one so maybe that one just has lots going on.

    One change I really like is that the ranked battle no longer shows you your opponent's rank, just their connection. If there's another "fight ten ranked matches online" trophy, I may actually get it this time. It took me ages just to get the "fight a single ranked match online" trophy on DOA5LR because people would see my fresh newbie rank, realize that they weren't getting anything from the fight and stood to lose a lot if they lost, and would decline almost every time.

  • Options
    LBD_NytetraynLBD_Nytetrayn TorontoRegistered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Ori would make a good mascot...if we were still in the age of console mascots. It's a shame Ori and the Blind Forest wasn't around in the original Xbox's life cycle, when the console was looking for a mascot (and tried various things, most of which are long forgotten). The Master Chief basically became the unofficial mascot, but by then, I personally think the console mascot era came to an end. Crash was obviously the Playstation 1's mascot, but I don't think people were saying "Oh yeah, he's Playstation's mascot" the same way by the PS3's long life cycle. Mario is more of an exceptional case, but that's reflecting Nintendo's unique formula of retelling existing stories in new games (the Zelda effect)--plus, he's Mario, a juggernaut of the industry.

    Ori definitely belongs in a sort of "pantheon" of Xbox heroes and heroines, protagonists, or whatever you'd call them--along with the Master Chief, Cortana, the Arbiter, multiple "gears" from Gears of War, Cuphead and Mugman, Sam Fisher, and the survivor from Sunset Overdrive (just because that's such an excellent game). Maybe Ryu Hayabusa too, as his most famous modern incarnations are still very closely associated with Xbox, but as discussed in the last thread, Team Ninja basically killed Ninja Gaiden as a franchise very shortly after it went multiplatform, so maybe not anymore. It's hard to say if Ori is more deserving than all of those.

    Basically, these are the characters I'd "draft" if Microsoft suddenly decided Xbox needed its own version of Playstation All-Stars Battle Royale (probably don't call it that). Of course, considering how well that worked on Playstation--and how much stronger its historical line-up is then Xbox's--it'd probably be at least as big a mistake.

    Heh, I guess Microsoft could do what Sony did, and try and get a few characters who are barely associated with Xbox but technically on it. Noctis, 2B, Senua, Dante or Virgil from Devil May Cry. And a Big Daddy, why not?

    I just feel like Ori makes a nice figurehead or icon, though not in a Mario way, necessarily. Even though he's in Rivals of Aether (and thus my main interest in playing that), I have a hard time imagining Ori being the focus of, say, a kart racer.

    I'll admit part of my thought process is loving what I saw in the reveal trailer and being part of why I wanted an Xbox One, falling in love when I finally got to play it, and even the power-on chime and light just remind me of Ori somehow.

    I don't think Ori should be a "Mr. Video" type role as Mario was made for, but maybe closer to the Pixar lamp.

    Side note: PlayStation had this weird habit of having mascots they didn't even own, didn't they? Crash was Naughty Dog and Universal before getting passed around and handed to Activision, and wasn't Lara Croft considered the PlayStation mascot for a time, despite being owned by Eidos and being on PC and Saturn as well?

    Ori is cool, don't get me wrong, and has a certain minimalist elegance--but it's only been around since 2015, twelve years into the Xbox division's lifespan, and only for the last four years. Ori's still a newcomer, to the point where it would be awkward to suddenly hoist it up as the brand's champion of sorts. That's purely my own feelings, it's entirely an artistic choice no matter what.

    Honestly, Cortana is a better "figurehead" in that role (though certainly not the perfect one), even if that is practical (part of Microsoft's wider AI/voice command integration) in a way Ori wouldn't be. Plus, however you feel about the system itself, the circular emblem is very well suited to that.

    Though all this conversation though has left me thinking about who I'd want a on "dream roster" for Xbox Heroes Rumble (it's important the name be as bad as Playstation's Smash Brothers clone), whether it was an arena fighter or, as @baudattitude proposed, a Musou game. You can be damn sure Ori would be there, and I think it'd be kind of brilliant to have the Sea of Thieves pirate and the Sunset Overdrive Employee-of-the-Month as randomly generated male or female characters (that maybe you can configure in the selection screen) that have all the same controls/move list. I've had way too much fun thinking of different tiers and Playstation-style guest characters. :lol:

    Just realized I kind of misspoke; I see Ori as the Xbox One mascot, rather than Xbox as a whole, though I'd be thrilled if he were adopted as the latter (or either, really).

    But, that's just what he represents to me.

    Regarding an in-company crossover, it vexes me to no end that they haven't revived/soft rebooted Diddy Kong Racing -- minus Diddy Kong, of course, unless this Nintendo relationship really is going places.

    But MS owns Rare, who made the original "Mario Kart killer." I can't believe they've never leveraged that. (Yes I can.)

    Banjo and Kazooie and Conker returning, maybe some of the other characters who don't belong to any franchise. And while I said I couldn't see Ori carrying his own kart game like Mario, a crossover title would of course be different.

    I'd like to see custom rides for each racer, a la Sonic ASR, or let anyone race anything from a wide variety, like recent Mario Karts. Master Chief with a Warthog and a Scorpion, Battletoads with those Turbo Tunnel things, and I'm sure plenty more could be done as well.

    Argh, just thinking about it... come ON, Microsoft!

    qjWUWdm.gif1edr1cF.gifINPoYqL.png
    Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
  • Options
    LBD_NytetraynLBD_Nytetrayn TorontoRegistered User regular
    Wraith260 wrote: »
    cloudeagle wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    [Xbox Thread] So, is the Switch a home console or not?

    I believe the Switch thread is up to eight extended shouting matches over that issue.

    only eight? nice to know they're showing some restraint.

    Well, they are only two pages in...

    qjWUWdm.gif1edr1cF.gifINPoYqL.png
    Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
  • Options
    tastydonutstastydonuts Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    So, Atlus is running a survey (SurveyMonkey) regarding maybe porting and this question is one of them:

    3v4y2gyady8n.png

    There's a chance to get a gift card or something if you fill it out too. But I wonder what they're expecting to see on that question, lol.

    also this question:
    ryiteok6hpn7.png

    It's open to US Residents only.

    tastydonuts on
    “I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
  • Options
    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    I do kind of chuckle that Microsoft and Nintendo which both have headquarters in Redmond have a seemingly good working relationship. I wonder if that geographic closeness helped?

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • Options
    rahkeesh2000rahkeesh2000 Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    I do kind of chuckle that Microsoft and Nintendo which both have headquarters in Redmond have a seemingly good working relationship. I wonder if that geographic closeness helped?

    Well being geographcially close to Sakurai seems to help your IPs get into Smash...

  • Options
    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    I do kind of chuckle that Microsoft and Nintendo which both have headquarters in Redmond have a seemingly good working relationship. I wonder if that geographic closeness helped?

    Well being geographcially close to Sakurai seems to help your IPs get into Smash...

    So Sakurai is not in Redmond. :lol:

  • Options
    EspantaPajaroEspantaPajaro Registered User regular
    Would be cool if the Crunchyroll app would work. I am actually interested in some of the seasonal shows and would like to catch up.

  • Options
    Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    Would be cool if the Crunchyroll app would work. I am actually interested in some of the seasonal shows and would like to catch up.

    For how much money they make, the app really should work

    They're literally the Netflix of anime and the app is a joke compared to others. I have stopped paying for Crunchy completely because of the app.

  • Options
    EspantaPajaroEspantaPajaro Registered User regular
    Guess I shouldn’t complain cause I’m a free user . Anyway it worked after five tries now to catch up with Kaguya sama . The show is so silly and sugary sweet I can’t stop watching.

  • Options
    BRIAN BLESSEDBRIAN BLESSED Maybe you aren't SPEAKING LOUDLY ENOUGHHH Registered User regular
    The AnimeLab app we have down here is okay (though the streaming service itself is kinda pants)

  • Options
    baudattitudebaudattitude Registered User regular
    I’ve had good luck with the updated Crunchyroll app except when they’re being DDOSed by salty Brazilians. It’s better than the AndroidTV app anyway.


    No, really. The AndroidTV crunchy app is THAT bad. I regularly have to actually delete it and redownload it before it will update my queue.

This discussion has been closed.