And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
It would be my own form of hell to be told that I will be paid very well but I also don't have anything to do besides come into work every weekday and do whatever. Give my idle hands purpose
And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
It would be my own form of hell to be told that I will be paid very well but I also don't have anything to do besides come into work every weekday and do whatever. Give my idle hands purpose
I mean...as long as they aren't monitoring me, I'd just start spending all day drawing. Maybe make a web comic.
*edit* also GS 15 starts at like 150k so yeah...I could manage.
And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
You missed my edit, but what happened to the HUD whistleblower for Carson's scandals? It doesn't look like she got a cushy sinecure, she got demoted and then hounded out of the Department. So I'm not surprised people were willing to be the first domino in this. However, now that everything seems to be falling down there isn't as much risk to bring proof of criminality.
Other bit to remember IGs are independent bodies that are designed to work outside the chain of command in departments for this exact reason. They report to the secretaries but in reality they are beholden to Congress.
And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
It would be my own form of hell to be told that I will be paid very well but I also don't have anything to do besides come into work every weekday and do whatever. Give my idle hands purpose
I mean...as long as they aren't monitoring me, I'd just start spending all day drawing. Maybe make a web comic.
*edit* also GS 15 starts at like 150k so yeah...I could manage.
It would be great at first, but then the isolation kicks in when I realize that everyone else in the office is actually doing work and here I am goofing about while being paid the same. At best I'd just be outcast socially.
+4
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BlackDragon480Bluster KerfuffleMaster of Windy ImportRegistered Userregular
You know how you sometimes read about the antics of mad kings in the history books and the Learned Historians gravely note that this was the accusations of their enemies and probably an exaggeration for political purposes?
I'm starting to believe Caligula married his sisters and made his horse a consul.
Not sure on the former, but I thought the thinking on the latter was more a rebuke to the other candidates - less "I love my horse" and more "my horse would be a better consul that you morons".
Given what I have learned about mad kings during this reign of mad King Trump, it's quite possible that the Learned Professors were wrong and Caligula was just being randomly batshit.
Nah, the incident with Incitatus was a joke at the expense of certain senators.
Him being randomly batshit would be the ordering of a 1 mile long pontoon bridge to be built on the Bay of Baiae, hosting a multi-day wine party on it while driving a chariot up and down the bridge and wearing the breastplate of Alexander the Great, and ordering the execution of party-goers that weren't getting crunk enough.
Sorta like Trump and his moat.
No matter where you go...there you are. ~ Buckaroo Banzai
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ElJeffeRoaming the streets, waving his mod gun around.Moderator, ClubPAMod Emeritus
And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
You missed my edit, but what happened to the HUD whistleblower for Carson's scandals? It doesn't look like she got a cushy sinecure, she got demoted and then hounded out of the Department. So I'm not surprised people were willing to be the first domino in this. However, now that everything seems to be falling down there isn't as much risk to bring proof of criminality.
Yep, I also imagine there's safety in numbers as far as retribution goes. If one whistleblower (either formal or informal) gets demoted or harassed, you could possibly make a case that it's just coincidence, not retribution. When the fifteen people talking to congress all get fired at once, it's a liiiiiiitle harder to justify that.
I submitted an entry to Lego Ideas, and if 10,000 people support me, it'll be turned into an actual Lego set!If you'd like to see and support my submission, follow this link.
+29
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Drake ChambersLay out my formal shorts.Registered Userregular
And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
You missed my edit, but what happened to the HUD whistleblower for Carson's scandals? It doesn't look like she got a cushy sinecure, she got demoted and then hounded out of the Department. So I'm not surprised people were willing to be the first domino in this. However, now that everything seems to be falling down there isn't as much risk to bring proof of criminality.
FWIW, the demotion and transfer of Helen Foster (the HUD whistleblower) happened before she blew the whistle, and as such formed part of the basis for her complaint.
The current piling-on of career employees early makes a lot of sense - no adverse action has been taken against them yet, and anything happening in the future could easily be construed as retaliation.
Also if a whistleblower just sees something sooorta fishy, they might assume that that was it and actually everything is still sane. But then stuff like this gets in the news and people start connecting dots and then filling reports themselves.
Not unlike sexual harassment reporting, really. Isolated weirdness is recontextualized as a problematic pattern.
Kana on
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
I've perpetually heard rumors of these GS-15s with no jobs and responsibilities...
I've not met one in 12 years yet. I mean, I'm not saying it's never happened, but it's not typical. At all.
I have at times met administrative employees who are frustratingly disengaged and/or disinterested in their jobs, only to later realize that HR is hiring @ GS-6 for those type positions, so... Offer poverty wages, get poverty performance, I guess?
And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
It would be my own form of hell to be told that I will be paid very well but I also don't have anything to do besides come into work every weekday and do whatever. Give my idle hands purpose
I mean...as long as they aren't monitoring me, I'd just start spending all day drawing. Maybe make a web comic.
*edit* also GS 15 starts at like 150k so yeah...I could manage.
It would be great at first, but then the isolation kicks in when I realize that everyone else in the office is actually doing work and here I am goofing about while being paid the same. At best I'd just be outcast socially.
Oh see, I'm already an office outcast being the art guy in engineering/manufacturing.
Isn’t there supposed to be a hearing with members of the State Department today, or is that tomorrow?
State's IG was to brief them on urgent matters, not officially enumerated, this morning. Haven't kept up on if that happened; Volker, and possibly the others, are tomorrow.
And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
It would be my own form of hell to be told that I will be paid very well but I also don't have anything to do besides come into work every weekday and do whatever. Give my idle hands purpose
That's basically my dream job. If I'm going to be forced to work to continue being able to pay for food/housing/etc., instead of staying at home forever doing what I want to do, then I want it to be as easy as possible.
Isn’t there supposed to be a hearing with members of the State Department today, or is that tomorrow?
State's IG was to brief them on urgent matters, not officially enumerated, this morning. Haven't kept up on if that happened; Volker, and possibly the others, are tomorrow.
And here is another report that the State Department IG wants to inform about Pompeos attempts to retaliate against anyone who cooperated with Congress.
Carl Quintanilla of CNBC/NBC News: * U.S. State Department Inspector General plans to brief congressional committees on recent instances of potential political retaliation by agency leadership against career officials over Ukraine -- two sources familiar with matter
Sounds like the career govt employees have finally gotten sick of being treated so badly. So now we've got at least some of the rank and file of both the State Department and the Intelligence community working against the White House. Amazing.
They also likely feel that they will have actual protections if they come forward now, to an impeachment inquiry. Before it might have been a lot more iffy. Not that there won't be retaliation, but they'll have a much better case for wrongful termination.
Part of me is wondering what took so long.
The other half of my brain keeps reminding me that these positions are full of people who work for whatever leadership is elected, and therefore are generally pretty non-political/non-partisan. For them to finally be fed up is a pretty big deal.
I mean, bureaucrats are pretty damn political. Just not on the clock. Because they are also professional.
But yeah, are you willing to give up your job, and health insurance, and likely any prospect of working for the Federal Government ever again? Which, bear in mind, these mid-level employees have specialist skills that are... basically focused on federal government work. Especially at State, since Virginia doesn't have foreign policy, but at least it does have a DOT. They can't just walk into any firm on K street and get a corner office. Being a whistleblower will likely fuck up their life for a long time, at best. It's a lot to ask. Especially when all the crimes seemed to keep landing with a big wet this and little more.
On the contrary - status as a whistleblower protects a career employee's status and job security, to an even greater degree than the substantial security career employees have already.
Depending on the situation and how the employee takes advantage of it, this can be... abused. In a previous life I was acquainted with one such individual who had been tucked away in his own office as a GS-15 with virtually no day-to-day job responsibilities whatsoever. He worked well into his 80's and spent the majority of his time walking around the office with a cup of coffee and chatting people up.
It would be my own form of hell to be told that I will be paid very well but I also don't have anything to do besides come into work every weekday and do whatever. Give my idle hands purpose
My form of hell is to actually do nothing productive while being commanded to look busy. And fielding complaints and problems of an utterly trivial nature non-stop.
I'd prefer a job where I'm allowed to write my own job description. Boredom is a good problem to have.
Schiff, House Intel Chairman, Got Early Account of Whistle-Blower’s Accusations
They've already accused the whistleblower account of being written by a "law firm", now they'll skip right to suggesting it originated directly from Schiff...
I'm loving how some of what's coming to save the US, is the fact that we had implemented a shit ton of anti-spoil system measures. Probably safe to say if we didn't have that, these shit lords would have sacked most of career people. Given that they can't do that and that we have laws in place to protect them, a ton of Trump's shit goblin lietenants along with Trump, are going to get a very hard lesson on the fact that the US is not one of their shitty businesses and the very reasons why that is so.
No doubt, the asshole republicans will try to dismantle the anti-spoils system stuff and democrats should do everything they can to strengthen though. Possible even get some of that shit codified as a constitutional amendment because we'd probably be pretty fucked if Trump's people had free reign to just fire whoever they want and then replace them with whoever they want.
This is true. Being an actual government employee is far different from the at will employment Trump is used to and he probably has no idea how to handle it.
Public Unions are important.
It's why conservatives are always trying to delegitimize them. They are the best protection a state has against official corruption, and too many states are basically official corruption factories.
Schiff, House Intel Chairman, Got Early Account of Whistle-Blower’s Accusations
They've already accused the whistleblower account of being written by a "law firm", now they'll skip right to suggesting it originated directly from Schiff...
Mr. Schiff’s aides followed procedures involving whistle-blower’s accusations, Mr. Boland said. They referred him to an inspector general and advised him to seek legal counsel.
Mr. Schiff never saw any part of the complaint or knew precisely what the whistle-blower would deliver, Mr. Boland said.
Schiff wrote the whistleblower report I guess? Yeah this is a thing the President said. Also what is the NYT thing it is talking about?
Trump made the comment in response to a question about a New York Times report stating that Schiff had learned the outlines of the whistleblower’s concerns days before the individual filed a formal complaint.
“Well, I think it’s a scandal that he knew before,” Trump said of Schiff. “I’d go a step further. I think he probably helped write it, okay? That’s what the word is. … He knew long before, and he helped write it, too. It’s a scam. It’s a scam.”
Schiff said in a statement ahead of the news conference that “at no point did the Committee review or receive the complaint in advance,” and that his panel did not receive the complaint until the night before acting Director of National Intelligence Joseph Maguire testified last Thursday.
Also the DoJ says that White House it guesses will comply with records retention laws...
Justice Department attorneys promised a federal judge Wednesday that the White House will not destroy records of the president’s calls and meetings with foreign leaders while the court weighs a lawsuit brought by historians and watchdog groups.
In a two-page filing, Justice Department lawyer Kathryn L. Wyer told a federal judge in Washington that the Trump administration and executive office of the president “voluntarily agree … to preserve the material at issue pending” litigation.
I'm not sure I know enough about the American political system to understand why Schiff seeing the Whistleblower report might be a problem?
It's not a problem at all, standard procedure was followed. However, anyone and everyone trying to protect Trump are going to muddy the waters with confusion as much as they can.
I'm not sure I know enough about the American political system to understand why Schiff seeing the Whistleblower report might be a problem?
It isn't. And now I know what is going on a quick timeline for folks not wanting to read the NYT for various reasons.
Whistleblower made an anonymous complaint to CIA chain of command. Realizes that it is being buried as the CIA had to take it to the WH. (not a whistleblower complaint).
Whistleblower following the above policies goes to Rep. Schiff's office to make the complaint as he is the head of the intelligence committee and a protected entity to report to. Staff direct and guide the WB to the IG.
WB makes an official complaint with the IG. IG investigates and writes the actual report. This is what was getting buried till basically the IG said something. And thus impeachment.
This is me being really sloppy but that is the way it goes.
As for politics Trump and his cronies are jumping on this to try and discredit the complaint saying it was written by Rep. Schiffs' office and thus is just not real and thus the impeachment is faulty and Trump is an angel and perfect. Threw up a little in my mouth writing that last part.
It is just another way to try and discredit a report deemed credible by the IG.
Trump, whether through ignorance or an intentional method of obfuscating/misdirecting/interfering with things, is treating this like a criminal trial where he has the "right" to see his accuser face to face.
Ignoring that impeachment isn't a criminal trial.
Also ignoring that they haven't even gotten to impeachment yet, they're still investigating.
Why would the person who reported an unusual noise to the police be the "accuser"? Like a person who says, "yo, I heard some shit is happening but I cannot be 100% sure," is not really what I think of as an accuser.
I've lost the ability to tell what is and isn't a big deal
Is this?
No. Here is a helpful guideline: if it’s coming from the trump admin and/or elected Republicans and/or conservative media it can be safely filed away as nonsense
I've lost the ability to tell what is and isn't a big deal
Is this?
No. Here is a helpful guideline: if it’s coming from the trump admin and/or elected Republicans and/or conservative media it can be safely filed away as nonsense
I've lost the ability to tell what is and isn't a big deal
Is this?
No. Here is a helpful guideline: if it’s coming from the trump admin and/or elected Republicans and/or conservative media it can be safely filed away as nonsense
Conservative media to include the New York Times until further notice on this matter
Raskin says that "there may be misconduct" by Sec Pompeo & State officials in distributing it.
A package was circulated to Pompeo w/ misinformation about the former US ambassador to Ukraine in May, says @jamie_raskin.
IG "has no idea" where the doc came from, it is of mysterious & uncertain providence, Raskin says. Then says the document is described as "amateur-ish."
(CNN reporter)
Persons unknown sent Pompeo an "amatuerish" package full of misinformation about, at least, fmr Ambassador Yavonovich. Rep. Raskin (D-MD) was also quoted says it doesn't relate to Trump-Ukraine, but...
it's hard to see how an attempted smear against Yavonovich (who was removed, and Trump mentioned in the phone call as being corrupt and 'going through some stuff') does not relate to the overall game here.
I'm not sure I know enough about the American political system to understand why Schiff seeing the Whistleblower report might be a problem?
It's not a problem at all, standard procedure was followed. However, anyone and everyone trying to protect Trump are going to muddy the waters with confusion as much as they can.
And the whistleblower complaint and Republican attempts to discredit it are also moot because Trump publicly released the memo showing he committed the crime in question. The investigation benefits from the full complaint by providing a list of corroborating witnesses, other activities in furtherance of the crime, and the admin's attempts to cover up the crime.
Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
I've lost the ability to tell what is and isn't a big deal
Is this?
No. Here is a helpful guideline: if it’s coming from the trump admin and/or elected Republicans and/or conservative media it can be safely filed away as nonsense
In reality, it is not a big deal, or even improper. Whether Trump & co can spin it into a Big Deal (TM) and proof of Witch Hunt!! remains to be seen. Because they're certainly going to try, or at least try to get Schiff knocked off leading the impeachment hearings...
Also the memo the WH released to try to be the WB's complaint was incriminating on it's own.
It's great that the impeachment process is a political one. I love that Schiff said that ignoring subpoenas will just be seen as obstruction and the worst of what we think was in the documents will be assumed. There is no burden of proof needed to be attained and if the WH is not happy with how the lack of information is being handled they they can just provide the document.
This is all just flailing. For once they can't distract the media with imaginary shiny objects and there's no good spin for the call. Their best argument (that Joe Biden and his son were corrupt and the president took it upon himself for some reason to pressure a foreign country to investigate a political rival) is equal parts a lie and not exculpatory. Even if we take this White House at its word (which, no), they admitted to doing crimes, and barking about an agenda rings hollow because in this situation their opponents' agenda is to find the truth and do their constitutional duty of oversight.
President Donald Trump has publicly admitted he discussed Joe Biden with Ukraine and the White House released a memo on his July 25 phone call that shows he asked his Ukrainian counterpart to investigate the former vice president and his son, Hunter Biden. Still, only 40% of Republican voters believe he did so, according to a Monmouth University poll released Tuesday.
The Monmouth poll found about 62% of Americans "believe it is likely that Trump mentioned the possibility of an investigation into Biden" during his phone call with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky. Meanwhile, 15% say he probably did not do this and 23% are unsure.
Split across partisan lines: 85% of Democrats believe Trump mentioned investigating Biden in the call compared to just four-in-ten Republicans.
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It would be my own form of hell to be told that I will be paid very well but I also don't have anything to do besides come into work every weekday and do whatever. Give my idle hands purpose
I mean...as long as they aren't monitoring me, I'd just start spending all day drawing. Maybe make a web comic.
*edit* also GS 15 starts at like 150k so yeah...I could manage.
You missed my edit, but what happened to the HUD whistleblower for Carson's scandals? It doesn't look like she got a cushy sinecure, she got demoted and then hounded out of the Department. So I'm not surprised people were willing to be the first domino in this. However, now that everything seems to be falling down there isn't as much risk to bring proof of criminality.
It would be great at first, but then the isolation kicks in when I realize that everyone else in the office is actually doing work and here I am goofing about while being paid the same. At best I'd just be outcast socially.
Nah, the incident with Incitatus was a joke at the expense of certain senators.
Him being randomly batshit would be the ordering of a 1 mile long pontoon bridge to be built on the Bay of Baiae, hosting a multi-day wine party on it while driving a chariot up and down the bridge and wearing the breastplate of Alexander the Great, and ordering the execution of party-goers that weren't getting crunk enough.
Sorta like Trump and his moat.
~ Buckaroo Banzai
Yep, I also imagine there's safety in numbers as far as retribution goes. If one whistleblower (either formal or informal) gets demoted or harassed, you could possibly make a case that it's just coincidence, not retribution. When the fifteen people talking to congress all get fired at once, it's a liiiiiiitle harder to justify that.
FWIW, the demotion and transfer of Helen Foster (the HUD whistleblower) happened before she blew the whistle, and as such formed part of the basis for her complaint.
The current piling-on of career employees early makes a lot of sense - no adverse action has been taken against them yet, and anything happening in the future could easily be construed as retaliation.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
Not unlike sexual harassment reporting, really. Isolated weirdness is recontextualized as a problematic pattern.
There's one tomorrow with the special envoy. There was supposed to be one today but after the Pompeo threats, it got pushed back to the 10th.
I've not met one in 12 years yet. I mean, I'm not saying it's never happened, but it's not typical. At all.
I have at times met administrative employees who are frustratingly disengaged and/or disinterested in their jobs, only to later realize that HR is hiring @ GS-6 for those type positions, so... Offer poverty wages, get poverty performance, I guess?
Oh see, I'm already an office outcast being the art guy in engineering/manufacturing.
State's IG was to brief them on urgent matters, not officially enumerated, this morning. Haven't kept up on if that happened; Volker, and possibly the others, are tomorrow.
That seems less than ideal
edit: well, I guess it's happening this very second!
in front of some 10 committees!
That's basically my dream job. If I'm going to be forced to work to continue being able to pay for food/housing/etc., instead of staying at home forever doing what I want to do, then I want it to be as easy as possible.
Update:
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/10/02/politics/state-department-inspector-general-briefing-congress/index.html
State IG: Now (Closed hearing)
Volker: Thurs
Yavonovich: Fri
"Three Others": Next week (maybe)
My form of hell is to actually do nothing productive while being commanded to look busy. And fielding complaints and problems of an utterly trivial nature non-stop.
I'd prefer a job where I'm allowed to write my own job description. Boredom is a good problem to have.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/02/us/politics/adam-schiff-whistleblower.html
They've already accused the whistleblower account of being written by a "law firm", now they'll skip right to suggesting it originated directly from Schiff...
It's why conservatives are always trying to delegitimize them. They are the best protection a state has against official corruption, and too many states are basically official corruption factories.
National security attorney
So uh.....no
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
I've lost the ability to tell what is and isn't a big deal
Is this?
Article is here:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-impeachment-whistleblower/2019/10/02/80df829a-e494-11e9-b403-f738899982d2_story.html
Schiff wrote the whistleblower report I guess? Yeah this is a thing the President said. Also what is the NYT thing it is talking about?
Also the DoJ says that White House it guesses will comply with records retention laws...
It's not a problem at all, standard procedure was followed. However, anyone and everyone trying to protect Trump are going to muddy the waters with confusion as much as they can.
It isn't. And now I know what is going on a quick timeline for folks not wanting to read the NYT for various reasons.
Whistleblower made an anonymous complaint to CIA chain of command. Realizes that it is being buried as the CIA had to take it to the WH. (not a whistleblower complaint).
Whistleblower following the above policies goes to Rep. Schiff's office to make the complaint as he is the head of the intelligence committee and a protected entity to report to. Staff direct and guide the WB to the IG.
WB makes an official complaint with the IG. IG investigates and writes the actual report. This is what was getting buried till basically the IG said something. And thus impeachment.
This is me being really sloppy but that is the way it goes.
As for politics Trump and his cronies are jumping on this to try and discredit the complaint saying it was written by Rep. Schiffs' office and thus is just not real and thus the impeachment is faulty and Trump is an angel and perfect. Threw up a little in my mouth writing that last part.
It is just another way to try and discredit a report deemed credible by the IG.
Ignoring that impeachment isn't a criminal trial.
Also ignoring that they haven't even gotten to impeachment yet, they're still investigating.
No. Here is a helpful guideline: if it’s coming from the trump admin and/or elected Republicans and/or conservative media it can be safely filed away as nonsense
Good point
It should also be pointed out (I think) that both of those things occurred before the complaint was made available.
Conservative media to include the New York Times until further notice on this matter
(CNN reporter)
Persons unknown sent Pompeo an "amatuerish" package full of misinformation about, at least, fmr Ambassador Yavonovich. Rep. Raskin (D-MD) was also quoted says it doesn't relate to Trump-Ukraine, but...
it's hard to see how an attempted smear against Yavonovich (who was removed, and Trump mentioned in the phone call as being corrupt and 'going through some stuff') does not relate to the overall game here.
And the whistleblower complaint and Republican attempts to discredit it are also moot because Trump publicly released the memo showing he committed the crime in question. The investigation benefits from the full complaint by providing a list of corroborating witnesses, other activities in furtherance of the crime, and the admin's attempts to cover up the crime.
It's great that the impeachment process is a political one. I love that Schiff said that ignoring subpoenas will just be seen as obstruction and the worst of what we think was in the documents will be assumed. There is no burden of proof needed to be attained and if the WH is not happy with how the lack of information is being handled they they can just provide the document.
Can't find the quote though.
That is pretty much what most Republicans already believe.
https://www.businessinsider.com/only-40-percent-republicans-believe-trump-asked-ukraine-investigate-biden-2019-10
I am surprised it is that high.
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