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Webcomic art - MUST SEE

milknpeachesmilknpeaches Registered User
edited June 2007 in Artist's Corner
In literary terms, a 'hook' is something that draws the reader in and makes them wild to know more. When I typed MUST SEE it was a 'hook.'

OQ.jpg

So that's one comic from my new site, milknpeaches.powweb.com , and I'd love to get some constructive crit.

milknpeaches on
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Posts

  • UnknownSaintUnknownSaint Registered User
    edited May 2007
    I'll give you the long and short of it (hurhurhur) before anyone else does. Also, your 'hook' is annoying bullshit.

    First of all, the art style is poorly aped early PA stuff. The line quality on the strip (not so much how you drew it, but that aint great either) is really poor.

    The first two panels are the same thing, with the exception of a changed mouth and eye position. Talking heads comic...no thanks. Also, the text bubbles at the top thing really has to go, because it makes it look like too much stuff is connected. The joke is pretty bad in what you have shown as well. Zombie nuts...anal orgy. Class act.

    If you are going to make a comic about people talking about video games most of the time, you are probably going to get harpooned for it unless it is fucking good.

    UnknownSaint on
  • NightDragonNightDragon 6th Grade Username Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    So basically, you're trying to copy Gabe's art, and you're trying to copy Penny Arcade's humor. End result - you're trying to make a duplicate Penny Arcade Strip.

    Do you see where I am going with this?

    NightDragon on
  • CrashHollywoodCrashHollywood Registered User
    edited May 2007
    I thin that your art work looks similar to early PA, I would make sure to diversify yourself from PA and other comics by developing your own definitive style. Also you need to make sure you release a new comics on a regular basis. One thing that PA did really well when they first started is they released a comic three times a week religiously for years. If people don't expect to read your comic on a certain day or at a certain time, they won't continue to read it. I also thought your post after the strip was a bit blan. If you make your post more aesthetically appealing its going to also entice viewers to read it.

    CrashHollywood on
  • UnknownSaintUnknownSaint Registered User
    edited May 2007
    I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, but after reading the rest of your stuff you're basically just a bad hack.

    UnknownSaint on
  • core tacticcore tactic Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Phew! Thought I was going to be the only one who thought it was kind of rip-offish of PA.

    core tactic on
    6700ab2ed7bb6f9876150c388a78a011.png
  • KazhiimKazhiim __BANNED USERS regular
    edited May 2007
    what are you talking about guys this is really good

    Kazhiim on
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  • Kewop DecamKewop Decam Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    spacing is bad, art is bad, it's basically PA Ultra LITE and who said the last line? A ghost?

    Kewop Decam on
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  • core tacticcore tactic Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Today's comic makes me feel bad deep down in the core of my soul.

    core tactic on
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  • bread of wonderbread of wonder Registered User
    edited May 2007
    The world doesn't need another comic about two guys that like to talk about video games.

    And yeah it does look like early PA stuff but at least early PA stuff had good humor. That's what kept me reading, anyway... and this lacks it. It seems like the whole point of the strip was to point out that analogy is one "r" away from anal orgy, and you used world of warcraft to get there - but why it's there really makes no sense.

    bread of wonder on
    Long distance runner, what you standin' there for?
  • milknpeachesmilknpeaches Registered User
    edited May 2007
    1. I've done 5 comics so far. So UnknownSaint? Yes, I'm still bad and yes, I'm a hack - that is, I'm trying to duplicate the style and quality other people. What am I supposed to do about it, just throw in the towel before I've even begun?

    2. I posted this IN A PENNY ARCADE FORUM... yes, I'm aping Gabe's art style. Yes, I like Tycho's writing style. Yes, I have the same sense of humor (why else would I be here in the first place?) I've followed their comic almost since it first came out. I can't help aping both of them, not when I'm just starting out at least.

    3. Please just tell me how to draw better. I REALIZE THE ART IS SHITTY. That's why I asked for constructive crit in the first place.

    milknpeaches on
  • TheBogTheBog Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    Sigh.. the art isn't horrible.. mostly because you're straight up ripping off PA. You're not even trying to be original. Nothing here is of your doing. If you're content with that, go for it.

    TheBog on
  • IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited May 2007
    How to make the art better

    1. Go do some life drawing rather than trying to make a reinterpretation of some one else already simplified style. Its the only way.

    2. Seriously

    3. why the hell would you want to make another penny-arcade? If you like gabe and tycho, do them a favor and dont rip them off

    Iruka on
  • UnknownSaintUnknownSaint Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Copying others is not a way to improve. Just because this is a penny arcade forum does not mean people enjoy you doing a poor job of stealing a style. As far as the art goes, foundation first, style comes later. If you are going to copy something that is already stylized, you are not going to get anywhere. Being a beginner gives you a (poor) excuse to be bad, but not to copy other people's work.

    UnknownSaint on
  • Kewop DecamKewop Decam Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    Iruka wrote: »
    How to make the art better

    1. Go do some life drawing rather than trying to make a reinterpretation of some one else already simplified style. Its the only way.

    2. Seriously

    3. why the hell would you want to make another penny-arcade? If you like gabe and tycho, do them a favor and dont rip them off



    I like Step 2 the best

    Kewop Decam on
    pasigfa7.jpg
  • MagicToasterMagicToaster JapanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2007
    In literary terms, a 'hook' is something that draws the reader in and makes them wild to know more. When I typed MUST SEE it was a 'hook.'

    In advertising a 'hook' or 'brand promise' is the assurance that you make to the consumer about the quality of your product. Breaking a brand promise can happen when you 'over sell' or 'embellish' attributes that don't exist. If you do this, your audience/consumer/mother will no longer trust you, thus causing you to loose readers.

    Interestingly enough I was just reading this book that lists all the violations that one can make to break brand promises. One of which is having a product be too similar to the lead product. You just plead guilty to this one.

    MagicToaster on
  • core tacticcore tactic Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Did you do this in MSpaint? That's what I'm getting from looking at it.

    core tactic on
    6700ab2ed7bb6f9876150c388a78a011.png
  • NightDragonNightDragon 6th Grade Username Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    Toaster, I <3 you.
    2. I posted this IN A PENNY ARCADE FORUM... yes, I'm aping Gabe's art style. Yes, I like Tycho's writing style. Yes, I have the same sense of humor (why else would I be here in the first place?) I've followed their comic almost since it first came out. I can't help aping both of them, not when I'm just starting out at least.

    I'm sorry, but that is an incredibly foolish statement.

    Do you think we do not realize this is a PENNY ARCADE FORUM!? Do you think this validates your posting a PA rip-off? It doesn't.

    And you know what? I know this may be hard for you to fathom, but when you're starting out...you can do OTHER THINGS aside from copying established comic strips! :shock: ZOMGTEHSHOCKZORZ

    ...and it may even benefit you to NOT copy comic strips! This is where originality comes in. Why would anybody bother to read a comic strip that looks and feels like a rip-off/copy? If you want to look at some of the most successful comics out there, you should notice something about them - for a number of them, they're incredibly unique...in art, in text, both, etc. Copying somebody else's style will really get you nowhere if you're trying to make the ART better - honestly, especially Gabe's, because his artwork is so heavily stylized. Develop your own style - how? Through lots and lots of drawing, and hell, even by trying out different styles. "Trying out" does not mean "making a crapload of examples in one style". Do not try to copy Gabe. Seriously. And yes it is possible to do other things aside from copy another artists style to use in your own comic.

    NightDragon on
  • NakedZerglingNakedZergling A more apocalyptic post apocalypse Portland OregonRegistered User regular
    edited May 2007
    art is bad
    writing is bad.

    BUT let me give you serious words of advice.

    if you're going to do the "2 guys talking about video games" comic...which i honestly have no problem with like some people, you have to make it your own. you may be able to get away with trying to write like tycho because he is funny, but the first thing people notice is the visuals...and you straigt ripped gabe off.

    if you are serious about getting better, and i'm so sick of saying this to people, because they NEVER want to listen. there is only ONE WAY!!! And that way is to draw from life, and practice every day. draw everything. understand the anatomy. that is literally ALL THERE IS. its the only rule. newbies to art see pro work and want to "draw like that". and thats good! its great to have a goal. in high school i wanted to draw like joe mad more than anything in the world. but you must practice every day, and i don't mean draw other peoples art. draw from life (or photos of real life).

    there are no other shortcuts. i have been learning how to use photoshop, and i'm leaps and bounds above where i was a year ago..because i read forums, and i sketch and mess around every day. i should prob devote more time to it and less time to games actually.

    do what you want with that info, but i promise ask every artist you think is good and they will tell you this exact same thing.

    NakedZergling on
  • DangerousDangerous Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    GUYS! Hey sorry I don't want to derail this thread as it is obviously going good places but I need help urgent! Can you all tell me what you think of my new web comic idea seriously?

    Basically it is about a sass talking robot who doesn't take any guff from anyone. I have paired him with a buff yet comically effeminate (Not gay) balding man named steve, who serves as a hilarious foil. Also the robot may or may not have magical abilities.

    Ladies and gentlemens I give you the newest web comic superstar, Sassy Robot.

    sassyrobot.jpg

    Dangerous on
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  • DMACDMAC Moderator mod
    edited May 2007
    He looks more angry than sassy.

    DMAC on
  • Aaron LeeAaron Lee Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Back on track...

    It's been said many times, and we're all thinking it. There's already a Penny Arcade comic, why do we want another? And honestly, the gaming centered webcomic trend is getting trite.

    Secondly, there's nothing inherently wrong with imitating someone's art style initially (it can help the learning process) but you have to learn where you're being inspired, and where you're blatantly ripping off. And even if you're ripping off initially, work at it until your own style starts cutting through. Many of us have completely ripped off other artist at some point (I used to do an impressive Jim Lee back in the day), but I don't go around showing people that. I worked on it until my own style came through, THEN I show it around to see how I might improve that.

    Don't take offense to the advice offered. Partly because it makes you seem uninterested intaking the crits seriously, and also because the backlash will just get worse, and you'll learn nothing.

    Lastly, Blambot. There's no excuse for choosing the font you have. Dialogue fonts exist for a reason.

    Aaron Lee on
  • beavotronbeavotron Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    heheheh PA i have missed you.


    Welcome.jpg

    count yourself lucky your thread didn't get turned into a sandwich thread. i feel you got off pretty easy and even had some good suggestions and crits, heed them my friend, back away from the PA comics when you go to draw...walk towards the naked people and oranges in a bowl sitting in natural light :)

    beavotron on
  • milknpeachesmilknpeaches Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Toaster - yeah. Brand promise broken. I'm pretty embarrassed.

    NightDragon - your sarcasm hit me like a solid thing. It has an actual, physical presence. And you're right. Posting this in a PA forum doesn't validate ripping them off.

    Core Tactic - yeah, this was done in Paint.net. That bad, huh?

    Beavotron, Aaron Lee, NakedZergling - Draw from life. Gotcha.


    I would like to take the advice I've been given. I have removed all comics from my website because they were ripping off Penny Arcade.

    milknpeaches on
  • MagicToasterMagicToaster JapanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2007
    I'm in shocked... this has never happened before. You're actually listenign to us?

    *gasp*

    *GASP* I say!

    Welcome to the AC!!!

    MagicToaster on
  • PotUPotU __BANNED USERS
    edited May 2007
    In WoW you can't have numbers in your name.

    PotU on
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  • vascyvascy Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Your joke isn't very good.

    Add an "r" to "analogy" and you get "anal orgy".
    But what about the space?

    It also feels like they aren't really talking to each other, so the dialogue doesn't flow.
    The character sat down says his parts, almost ignoring the character stood up...

    I'd say the art looks fine, but it *is* obviously in the penny arcade style.

    The monitor perspective is wrong...
    The monitor looks more like it's so the guy stood up can see it...

    I've seen worse webcomics, but try to think of better jokes.

    vascy on
  • MaydayMayday generation three hybrid Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    I'm in shocked... this has never happened before. You're actually listenign to us?

    *gasp*

    *GASP* I say!

    Welcome to the AC!!!

    Idiot.
    He's lying!
    Again!

    Mayday on
  • EntrYEntrY Registered User
    edited May 2007
    yeah, it's too good to be true...

    EntrY on
    beavotron wrote:
    hang on, i need to go put an adult diaper on before you continue explaining.

    Flickr ... Myspace
  • GrifterGrifter BermudaModerator mod
    edited May 2007
    Looks like they're all still there to me.

    Grifter on
  • Stupid Mr Whoopsie NameStupid Mr Whoopsie Name Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited May 2007
    WIOLM.gif

    I'm going to admit this one made me giggle foolishly. I think its the defiant little not-burrito in the last panel.

    That being said, don't brush off the advice given here lightly. As its been stated, aping one's style is no way to improve and is by far more detrimental. You need to break off on your very own and see where your own talents and skills can take you.

    There is nothing wrong with gleaning inspiration from other artists, but that is no substite for a solid foundation of your own.

    Stupid Mr Whoopsie Name on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • The One 52The One 52 Registered User
    edited May 2007
    I'm sure I'v read that joke about World of Warcraft on another webcomic before. Maybe it was on Penny-Arcade... but yeah, I won't state the obvious, I think everyone pretty much summed up what needed to be said about your comic.

    The One 52 on
    bigbosssig.gif
    The internet does not qualify as grounds where you can act like a bouquet of dick.
  • MagicToasterMagicToaster JapanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2007
    Mayday wrote: »
    Idiot.
    He's lying!
    Again!

    But... but... I was nice!

    :(

    I don't feel like humping anything anymore...

    *runs out crying*

    MagicToaster on
  • lyriumlyrium Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    Mayday wrote: »
    Idiot.
    He's lying!
    Again!

    But... but... I was nice!

    :(

    I don't feel like humping anything anymore...

    *runs out crying*

    aww!! D:

    hmm... I know what might make you feel better... something with bread and lettuce and maybe some turkey...

    lyrium on
  • beavotronbeavotron Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    ellioto i laughed at the last panel of that one too
    but the rest of the comic is not as great

    beavotron on
  • core tacticcore tactic Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Why is it honestly so hard for some people to take criticism? To draw on what others have suggested and possibly improve?



    To answer my own question, it's often because some people have rocks in their head.

    core tactic on
    6700ab2ed7bb6f9876150c388a78a011.png
  • core tacticcore tactic Registered User
    edited May 2007
    SW.gif
    Why are you making CtrlAltDel 2.




    Why.

    core tactic on
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  • FletcherFletcher Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    You gotta admit thats a damn good sandman face

    Fletcher on
  • HanSaganHanSagan Registered User regular
    edited May 2007
    Copying others is not a way to improve.

    I have to disagree with this. Copying other artists to improve and develop a style is a well established tradition. People are allowed and in fact encouraged into major galleries such as the louvre to learn from the great masters by copying.

    http://janicenowinski.com/article.htm

    HanSagan on
  • IncenjucarIncenjucar Audio Game Developer Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited May 2007
    Copying is a time-honored tradition, the thing is that you use that to -learn-, not to produce, just like with anatomical drawings.

    I grew up first with TMNT, then Marvel Comics, then Gold Digger as artistic inspirations, with a smattering of anime and whatever else, and you can see a lot of it in my art in how I do some of my lines, but my style is distinct from those influences just the same, and I doubt anyone would confuse my work with any other artist's.


    ...And not just because I suck.

    Incenjucar on
  • JCMJCM Registered User
    edited May 2007
    Toaster - yeah. Brand promise broken. I'm pretty embarrassed.

    NightDragon - your sarcasm hit me like a solid thing. It has an actual, physical presence. And you're right. Posting this in a PA forum doesn't validate ripping them off.

    Core Tactic - yeah, this was done in Paint.net. That bad, huh?

    Beavotron, Aaron Lee, NakedZergling - Draw from life. Gotcha.


    I would like to take the advice I've been given. I have removed all comics from my website because they were ripping off Penny Arcade.

    Congrats man, this is how you go about things.

    Heck, the first time i posted my art all I got was "you suck, but could become a decent inker".

    Looking at when you drew from life-


    SW.gif

    The only panel I liked was the sandman face, which you drew from life. I´d say continue doing so, I´d love to see your stuff as you develop your art.

    JCM on
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