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Some of these [chat]s are Ostriches.

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Posts

  • credeikicredeiki Registered User regular
    credeiki wrote: »
    Tcheldor wrote: »
    credeiki wrote: »
    But actually I'm thinking that instead of playing an rpg next maybe I want to try bloodborne? We were talking about Dark Souls and I was like hmmm and suddenly felt the urge to be really bad at an atmospheric game for a while.

    Sekiro? It's just....better, imo. Well ok, maybe a totally different feel, but god that game is good.

    I don't want to play Sekiro. People say it's more difficult than Dark Souls and I already struggle a lot with Dark Souls. (I would posit that I am the worst of anyone in chat at Dark Souls (who has played for more than 0 seconds, and worse than many people who haven't played as well).) I'm interested in Bloodborne specifically as it comes highly recommended.

    You would very much enjoy everything about the aesthetic and story delivery and mystery and tone in Bloodborne. Hugely.

    But it is fucking hard as balls. I think it's the hardest Soulslike aside from Sekiro. Enemies are very aggressive and you're very fragile, despite having a very powerful dodge and lots of options at your disposal.

    I want you to try it because I think hard games are worth it but be prepared!

    Ah I'm definitely prepared. The way I played Dark Souls 2 would make anyone just die to watch me; I'm really bad at it. But it's a solo game so it's only my own problem, and if I am ok with a glacial pace of improvement and never really learning how to do some things, then it's ok!
    I'm feeling like want a game to play through instead of a more episodic game, but also not an rpg, so this is probably the one.

    Steam, LoL: credeiki
  • FeralFeral MEMETICHARIZARD interior crocodile alligator ⇔ ǝɹʇɐǝɥʇ ǝᴉʌoɯ ʇǝloɹʌǝɥɔ ɐ ǝʌᴉɹp ᴉRegistered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    I don't know what hidden flag you could be talking about in the later XCOM games, Feral

    In the original I assume you're talking about psionics

    That's what I'm referring to, yes

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.

    the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    I should just replace my Xbox so I can finish dark souls 3 and the Witcher dlc.

    u7stthr17eud.png
  • FeralFeral MEMETICHARIZARD interior crocodile alligator ⇔ ǝɹʇɐǝɥʇ ǝᴉʌoɯ ʇǝloɹʌǝɥɔ ɐ ǝʌᴉɹp ᴉRegistered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    I'm pretty bad at FTL.

    I'm even worse at Convoy.

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.

    the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    edited February 2020
    Feral wrote: »
    I don't know what hidden flag you could be talking about in the later XCOM games, Feral

    In the original I assume you're talking about psionics

    That's what I'm referring to, yes

    I don't recall there being some crucial psionic stat in the new XCOM? It's been a while though, maybe I'm misremembering

    I do recall that psionics weren't that important. Shotgun man is best, no for brain gun

    I think 2 is vastly mechanically better and it definitely uses the psiops facility to just train up a rookie

    Evil Multifarious on
  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    I never beat FTL either but got to the end not than a few times. Almost won once.

    u7stthr17eud.png
  • Fuzzy Cumulonimbus CloudFuzzy Cumulonimbus Cloud Registered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    i got a key for being regarding as a strategic person in LoL
    i am obviously very good still at this game

  • credeikicredeiki Registered User regular
    edited February 2020
    Feral wrote: »
    I don't know what hidden flag you could be talking about in the later XCOM games, Feral

    In the original I assume you're talking about psionics

    That's what I'm referring to, yes

    I don't recall there being some crucial psionic stat in the new XCOM? It's been a while though, maybe I'm misremembering

    I think 2 is vastly mechanically better and it definitely uses the psiops facility to just train up a rookie

    There is not a psionic stat in xcom2; you make a psionic person by putting any rookie in the psi chamber

    the stat that varies from person to person is 'combat intelligence', which determines how much xp they get from going on missions

    there's also presumably a hidden stat determining compatibility with their fellow soldiers

    credeiki on
    Steam, LoL: credeiki
  • credeikicredeiki Registered User regular
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    I never beat FTL either but got to the end not than a few times. Almost won once.

    ah everyone I lived with including me was in the 'beat the game a million times on a million ships' category

    and yes, you develop best practices to mitigate the effects of rng, as you do with any game with a lot of randomness

    Steam, LoL: credeiki
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    Combat intelligence is nice to have but I mostly ignored it and it was fine

    I beat classic ironman with a bunch of dummies for the most part. Because they lived, and that's the most crucial qualification

  • BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    Mechanicus has no cover yeah (although Advance Wars does have damage reduction 'cover' and I still find it lacks the strategic side that's so addictive about XCOM - and I love Advance Wars and kinda hope the spark's still there when I end up picking up Wargroove).
    Feral wrote: »
    BTW I am pretty unconvinced that there's a meaningful difference between a puzzle game and a (human-vs-computer) strategy game.
    My feelings on this are basically rooted in a CompSci/Maths/Game Theory question of whether something has a solution or not. The more discrete and deterministic the game, the more it becomes an explicitly solvable puzzle. The less, the more it's strategy that reflects the sort of plays you like making (targeted aggression on high priority targets, general defence across your units while taking shots at what you safely can, more classic strategies like oblique offensives against formation, etc.).

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
  • BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    Feral wrote: »
    I don't know what hidden flag you could be talking about in the later XCOM games, Feral

    In the original I assume you're talking about psionics

    That's what I'm referring to, yes

    I don't recall there being some crucial psionic stat in the new XCOM? It's been a while though, maybe I'm misremembering

    I do recall that psionics weren't that important. Shotgun man is best, no for brain gun

    I think 2 is vastly mechanically better and it definitely uses the psiops facility to just train up a rookie

    I'm pretty sure that in the XCOM reboot
    you need to have at least one psychic soldier to complete some of the end game objectives.

    If they keep getting sniped, welp.

  • A Kobold's KoboldA Kobold's Kobold He/Him MississippiRegistered User regular
    edited February 2020
    I just learned that the guy who composed the music for Dark Souls also composed the music for Golden Sun

    edit: just thought I should share that with y'all

    A Kobold's Kobold on
    Switch Friend Code: SW-3011-6091-2364
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    Wargroove is tbh exceedingly grindy

  • BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    In XCOM EU,
    you had to have at least one psionic soldier (and I think they had to achieve the third rank of psionics) in order to complete the game. Can't go to the Temple Ship without one. One of the DLCs for EW intentionally gave the player 4 psionicly-apt, levelled soldiers to make sure it was a sure thing, rather than randomly testing all your main squad and finding none of them had psi-aptitude.

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
  • ElendilElendil Registered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    sekiro is great but it's no bloodborne

  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    The key to making more deterministic games less solvable seems to be better AI and more options for the AI

    Advance Wars is a marvelous game against a human opponent who might make varied, unusual decisions. Extremely good. But XCOM is just total garbage for PvP. All those random hit %s decoupled from the careful systems of campaign battles produce swingy nonsense and total matchup domination based on team comp.

  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    Elendil wrote: »
    sekiro is great but it's no bloodborne

    Put this claim down, flip it and reverse it

  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    Damnit I just got back into Isaac, don't make me get out FTL again!

    He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
  • TTODewbackTTODewback Puts the drawl in ya'll I think I'm in HellRegistered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    I have a law I want to propose
    That greenland must be to scale with other places on a map
    greenland is a size lying bastard
    making greenland appear large on a map should be punishable by 10 years hard labor in the gulag

    Bless your heart.
  • PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    Bethryn wrote: »
    GMTK had a video on randomness recently that's worth a watch because it does accurately sum up how game designers (as a whole, not necessarily individuals) view randomness.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwI5b-wRLic

    I disagree with a lot of what's said in this video because I find the reason why players find "out randomness" frustrating is often nothing to do with the randomness itself, but because they aren't really building a strategy, and the game designer has at no point attempted to teach them how to build a strategy. Once players start to understand strategies that aren't greedily reliant on constant success, they often end up doing very well consistently. This is extremely evident in the roguelike and roguelite communities. Faster than Light is a great example of this. A lot of players haven't beaten it. A small contingent of players have beaten it once or twice and stopped after that. And a smaller group of players have beaten it on a large number of different ships. But if you poll people, a lot of the time you'll get feedback that the game was "too random to win consistently," even though that last population demonstrably shows that it isn't. XCOM's very similar though I don't think Jake's ever been quite as up front (and also Jake explicitly says that the Normal mode AI shackling is to make sure people can have fun without developing an overall strategy, which is totally fair!). The answer is that almost guaranteed success in an "out random" game like FTL is based around good strategy built around minimising the effects of failure and hedging your bets correctly.

    I have beaten FTL with every model of every ship. I would not call it a very good example of a game that you can win consistently. Some ships can win consistently because they start with everything you need until the midgame or later and you don't need to hedge any bets because you can kill every ship you meet. If you are given the tools required (a few lasers or teleporter) from the start you're set, but if you're firing missiles or don't start with shields you need luck upon luck to get out of the starting hole you're in before you just die or run out of resources

  • BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    I was a Sonja player in Advance Wars multiplayer, which many would describe as incredibly dirty, unfair or even 'cheating'. It's not my fault all the cool obfuscation/recon abilities are on one CO!

    Also, second best OST (after Drake's)

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
  • FeralFeral MEMETICHARIZARD interior crocodile alligator ⇔ ǝɹʇɐǝɥʇ ǝᴉʌoɯ ʇǝloɹʌǝɥɔ ɐ ǝʌᴉɹp ᴉRegistered User regular
    edited February 2020
    They're all ostriches.
    I just looked it up and there are ways to game the psionic unlock in 2K Enemy Unknown. Gifted isn't a fixed hidden flag that is merely revealed by the psi lab (as I thought it was) but is generated pseudorandomly based on various game state factors, including but not limited to your soldier's willpower stat.

    That's better, but I wouldn't have known that without looking under the hood at a wiki just now, and the game sure does make it feel like Gifted is set when a character is first generated and is deterministic from there.

    Feral on
    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.

    the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
  • FeralFeral MEMETICHARIZARD interior crocodile alligator ⇔ ǝɹʇɐǝɥʇ ǝᴉʌoɯ ʇǝloɹʌǝɥɔ ɐ ǝʌᴉɹp ᴉRegistered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    credeiki wrote: »
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    I never beat FTL either but got to the end not than a few times. Almost won once.

    ah everyone I lived with including me was in the 'beat the game a million times on a million ships' category

    and yes, you develop best practices to mitigate the effects of rng, as you do with any game with a lot of randomness

    What's your secret?

    Because I could never figure out what the trick was.

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.

    the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
  • PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    edited February 2020
    Feral wrote: »
    credeiki wrote: »
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    I never beat FTL either but got to the end not than a few times. Almost won once.

    ah everyone I lived with including me was in the 'beat the game a million times on a million ships' category

    and yes, you develop best practices to mitigate the effects of rng, as you do with any game with a lot of randomness

    What's your secret?

    Because I could never figure out what the trick was.

    Always get a teleporter, always go full lasers, screw drones unless you start with them and have the recovery mod. Learn to do and always prefer boarding actions for the extra resources. Shields to lv 4 -> dodge to 45 -> max weapon energy, cloak > mind control > hacking

    Phyphor on
  • IlpalaIlpala Just this guy, y'know TexasRegistered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    I just learned that the guy who composed the music for Dark Souls also composed the music for Golden Sun

    edit: just thought I should share that with y'all

    Damn really? Would not have thought that.

    Still remember that battle theme. Good shit.

    FF XIV - Qih'to Furishu (on Siren), Battle.Net - Ilpala#1975
    Switch - SW-7373-3669-3011
    Fuck Joe Manchin
  • TenzytileTenzytile Registered User regular
    Man I wish I liked turn-based strategy more. Whenever I play it, I tend to gravitate to more conservative styles of play and I end up boring myself. Like X-COM becomes the overwatch game, and even in something like Fire Emblem, I end up shimmying my troops at a distance where we're certain to get the first strike on the enemies. I guess it doesn't help that both of these games can be extremely punishing about a single lost unit. I'm sure there are more aggressive, riskier options in these games, but they require both more playtime and a deeper understanding of the mechanics, neither of which I'm likely to provide for myself.

  • BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    Phyphor wrote: »
    I have beaten FTL with every model of every ship. I would not call it a very good example of a game that you can win consistently. Some ships can win consistently because they start with everything you need until the midgame or later and you don't need to hedge any bets because you can kill every ship you meet. If you are given the tools required (a few lasers or teleporter) from the start you're set, but if you're firing missiles or don't start with shields you need luck upon luck to get out of the starting hole you're in before you just die or run out of resources
    Stealth B is the only one I think that's statistically inconsistent. All the missile/drone based ones you mitigate with a strategy based around keeping 80 resources on you and prioritising stores (and certain event outcomes) in the first two zones, at which point you have a very good chance of bringing them into line. You can see how consistent those success strategies are in part by looking at the all ship/random ship hard mode win streak records. I think the highest is still 39, but a fair number of people pulled off the all ship winstreak. I think the scene's died down nowadays, but LethalFrag, DolphinChemist, Billy1kirby, jorbs etc. had long-running winstreak runs on Twitch explaining the strategies for all the ships on hard mode (DolphinChemist taking it to the next level doing it no pause which is mildly insane).

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    Feral wrote: »
    BTW I am pretty unconvinced that there's a meaningful difference between a puzzle game and a (human-vs-computer) strategy game.

    the latter that become too much like the former often makes one lose interest - a predictable foe is a very dull one.


    but for a lot of strategy games, who gives a shit? Look at my city! look at the map, look how it is in pretty colours!

    ftOqU21.png
  • MrMisterMrMister Jesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered User regular
    edited February 2020
    They're all ostriches.
    SUPER LATE:

    The thing I don’t like about Pathfinder Kingmaker and a bunch of other DND games is setting up buffs before encounters, which is fiddly and tedious when you know a buff-worthy encounter is about to start and then occasionally punishing when you get ambushed and have to save scum

    Also the possibility of always having buffs up just in case is too obnoxious to even contemplate
    Also the kingdom management dumped a bunch of tutorials and shit on you eight hours in and then I just bailed

    MrMister on
  • TuminTumin Registered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    The best strategy games are all about information management. Can you execute a plan that topples your opponent before they can manage a guarding response

    I don't wanna play spreadsheet wars, I wanna have my first artillery unit pop out as your stupid siege towers and spearmen appear on the horizon. I want to see your certainty of victory turn to ash in your mouth.

  • MrMisterMrMister Jesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    Oh, not that late I guess

    Also I like smaller parties because I prefer to micro my characters, but microing a bunch of characters is tedious

    Kind of like how I only like Civ type games when they enable tall play

  • MrMisterMrMister Jesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    I’m on a plane getting ready to take off, gotta speed post

    Bear with me

  • credeikicredeiki Registered User regular
    Feral wrote: »
    credeiki wrote: »
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    I never beat FTL either but got to the end not than a few times. Almost won once.

    ah everyone I lived with including me was in the 'beat the game a million times on a million ships' category

    and yes, you develop best practices to mitigate the effects of rng, as you do with any game with a lot of randomness

    What's your secret?

    Because I could never figure out what the trick was.

    It's been a long time; teleporter strategies were definitely good and foolproof; otherwise I think I just focused on specific types of weapons that I considered good, and also I avoided certain random encounters consistently/never risked it. Hm also there was some particular way I explored/chose routes, but I am not sure!

    Steam, LoL: credeiki
  • BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    Tumin wrote: »
    The best strategy games are all about information management. Can you execute a plan that topples your opponent before they can manage a guarding response

    I don't wanna play spreadsheet wars, I wanna have my first artillery unit pop out as your stupid siege towers and spearmen appear on the horizon. I want to see your certainty of victory turn to ash in your mouth.
    Oh Daniel, I teched to Mammoth Tanks 35 minutes ago.

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
  • MrMisterMrMister Jesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    Ok goodbye for three hours aka forever

  • Fuzzy Cumulonimbus CloudFuzzy Cumulonimbus Cloud Registered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    credeiki wrote: »
    Feral wrote: »
    credeiki wrote: »
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    I never beat FTL either but got to the end not than a few times. Almost won once.

    ah everyone I lived with including me was in the 'beat the game a million times on a million ships' category

    and yes, you develop best practices to mitigate the effects of rng, as you do with any game with a lot of randomness

    What's your secret?

    Because I could never figure out what the trick was.

    It's been a long time; teleporter strategies were definitely good and foolproof; otherwise I think I just focused on specific types of weapons that I considered good, and also I avoided certain random encounters consistently/never risked it. Hm also there was some particular way I explored/chose routes, but I am not sure!
    I beat it maybe three times. Husband is way better and beat it routinely.

    Learning which encounters to just straight up avoid was very helpful and boarding and teleporting gives a strong advantage.

    The end boss can still be just totes insane and impossible sometimes though.

  • TTODewbackTTODewback Puts the drawl in ya'll I think I'm in HellRegistered User regular
    They're all ostriches.
    i got this plan
    100% chance of success
    to get ahead
    go home
    and play video games
    8-)

    Bless your heart.
This discussion has been closed.