So I really don't need it (all I play is monster hunter world, and that runs fine) but I looked at newegg today just to see "maybe I can buy a graphics card" and...so I guess we are going back to prebuilts? prebuilt with 1TB SSD, intel i7 11700F (no clue if that is good) and a 3060 TI for 1600ish. Reviews just say it's got insufficient cooling, but compared to the hell of everything else swapping a cooler doesn't seem so bad. Talked myself out of it, but is this just where we will be for a while while consumers can't get individual parts? Or is this worse than it looks? Or maybe the parts lotteries aren't so bad now?
That's not a terrible price just to get the card (they're going around $1000 last I checked), if you could flip the rest somehow or just fix the issues with it like you said (cooling, etc).
Good to know my grasp hasn't slipped too much. At any rate talked myself down, I really, really can't justify the cost for a toy that I already basically own.
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OrcaAlso known as EspressosaurusWrexRegistered Userregular
The good news is that supply constraints on CPUs has eased, but GPUs are still "lol good luck".
good luck trying to buy DDR5 RAM for that Alder Lake CPU though.....
DDR5 is just out. Availability for RAM early on is always sketchy/extremely expensive. We saw the same thing with RDRAM back in the day and that didn't have the supply shocks of today. If it's still a problem in 6 months to a year, yeah, that's a pain in the ass.
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
Decided not to fully crack all the parts and test bench boot my daughters BLD Kit. The way it's setup it would just ruin too much of the fun for her of getting things out of the box, learning what they are, matching them to the instructions, etc. So I verified all the parts are there and look undamaged which is a big 10-4. The 3060 Ti it came with is an EVGA FTW3, which is a welcome brand choice.
So I really don't need it (all I play is monster hunter world, and that runs fine) but I looked at newegg today just to see "maybe I can buy a graphics card" and...so I guess we are going back to prebuilts? prebuilt with 1TB SSD, intel i7 11700F (no clue if that is good) and a 3060 TI for 1600ish. Reviews just say it's got insufficient cooling, but compared to the hell of everything else swapping a cooler doesn't seem so bad. Talked myself out of it, but is this just where we will be for a while while consumers can't get individual parts? Or is this worse than it looks? Or maybe the parts lotteries aren't so bad now?
This is exactly where we are now and will be for quite a while. Basically things will not start to become available and affordable until 6-12+ months after consumer GPUs are no longer useful as money-printers.
And before anyone says it, Etherium has been supposed to be "going to 'proof of stake' within 3-6 months" for well over a year now.
Decided not to fully crack all the parts and test bench boot my daughters BLD Kit. The way it's setup it would just ruin too much of the fun for her of getting things out of the box, learning what they are, matching them to the instructions, etc. So I verified all the parts are there and look undamaged which is a big 10-4. The 3060 Ti it came with is an EVGA FTW3, which is a welcome brand choice.
You may as well register the card to turn on the warranty.
Nah, there's nothing wrong with that EVGA power supply or card.
EVGA has been doing a better job keeping their video card markups in the 'reasonable gouging' range where ASUS is just yoloing. I also think the FTW3 line is the bottom end of EVGA's line and STRIX is mid-high end for ASUS, but nothing to justify a $600ish price difference for the card alone.
And who the hell knows what Newegg is even doing, they've been doing plenty of marking up / gouging themselves since they are about the only game in town if you can't catch a Best Buy drop / camp a Microcenter.
No, the FTW3 is EVGA's top of the line card not counting the Kingpin stuff, and is equivalent to Asus's Strix which is their top of the line cards. Both are triple 8-pin cards with higher power limits and overclocking potential with very robust cooling solutions.
EVGA's baseline stuff is the XC3 and Asus's TUF is their mid-tier line (for video cards).
That evga bundle is actually not bad considering, their current MSRP for that card is $1400 usd
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jungleroomxIt's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovelsRegistered Userregular
edited November 2021
Yeah the FTW3 is comprable to the Strix, if only because the Kingpin line is sort of an overclocker card as opposed to a gaming card.
Also EVGA is an easy recommend for power supplies. They're up there with Corsair and just behind Super Flower and Seasonic.
jungleroomx on
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3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
<curmudgeon voice>Top end/mid/low end for 3080s is basically a wash, it's a sub 5% performance difference for nearly every manufacturer, ragl ragl markups</curmudgeon voice>
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
The only thing buying an upper tier card gets you is some assurance it will hold a certain frequency. That's really it. It may have more headroom, it may not. You're buying more tickets to the silicon lottery, raising your chances of getting a top binned chip...but it's still a lottery. Plus with the 3000 series the lottery, at least for daily use, is really about how much you can undervolt the thing and hold a good gaming frequency not how far you can push it.
I have yet to try undervolting my 3080 TUF. It's currently running at 2025-2100mhz maxing out in the mid-50 degrees watercooled. Undervolting is definitely worth playing around with when I have the time though.
I also have yet to play around with the voltage curves on my 5900x. If I'm honest it sounds like an enormous amount of work checking stability that I'd rather spend doing something else. For once I'm happy to leave PBO on and let the chip do it's own thing.
GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited November 2021
I've never felt the need to undervolt my Ryzen CPU's. They don't go haywire even with PBO turned on.
My Ampere GPU's are another thing entirely, especially my 3090. I'm not comfortable with my extremely expensive GPU spiking to 350+ W and pushing nearly 90C under max stress workloads. Especially not after we found out that Nvidia's reference power design can't handle some of the nastier spikes on the top tier chips. Nvidia has a very "Over current protection? What's that?" style of design around their power management and I'm not willing to risk it.
Dangit. I got my new SSD but realized two things the moment it arrived:
I don't have a heatsink for this one, so I should get one. I also don't have any screws to attach this to the motherboard. Or in fact any screws to attach my soon to arrive HDD.
What sort of heatsink should I get for the SSD that will allow it to not melt, and what size screws do I need to install this and a standard size 3.5" HDD? I have a hardware store nearby so I figure I'll just pick those up there, but if there's somewhere I can easily grab both the heatsink and the screws at once I would also be into that.
Yeah the FTW3 is the top line...I think they just never updated the pricing for the cards when they started adding margins.
I was able to get a 3080Ti FTW3 Ultra for $1599 or $1699 CDN. I can't remember exactly which price after staring at video cards for so long. The thing is a beast though, I edge out my buddy with the EVGA 3090 at 1440p.
Dixon on
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Brovid Hasselsmof[Growling historic on the fury road]Registered Userregular
NVMe SSDs benefit from a heatsink plate on top of them yeah. Especially PCIe 4.0 ones. They get fairly hot while writing a lot and the heatsink helps keep their spike temperatures inside the preferred operating range of under 70c. SATA SSDs don't get as hot and don't need to worry about it. Motherboards with the NVMe M.2 slots typically come with heatsinks for at least one of the slots, but you can also get them separately.
Samsung 970 Evo Pro, 2TB. Sufficiently expensive that if a $10 heatsink helps it stay alive longer I'd like to grab one. I've got a heatsink in the system SSD slot, so I figured it probably counts as necessary, though I thought the new SSD would come with one, and the screws! Turns out no.
Also fun times, I just tried to install a new fan... only to find out that the CPU power cables are in the way. This case is quite nice and has a lot of the wiring done via the back panel to keep things clear of clutter... but that means that the bump from those wires is obscuring the top fan mounting area. I don't really feel like unthreading them, particularly since I'm generally horrible at cable management... I'm hopeful that between the liquid cooling, the SSD heatsinks, and a generic case fan it'll run reasonably cool.
Maybe I'll replace the back fan? Or maybe I'll replace my old computer's janky fan. I do still want it to be usable and right now it gets a weird clicky noise for a half hour like half the times it starts up.
Actually also this was my first aftermarket fan, and I noticed that it came with screws but no threading on the fan's plastic what I guess count as screw holes. Are these a thing you can install and then uninstall, or are the screw holes kind of destroyed once the thing's fastened?
Talked myself out of it, but is this just where we will be for a while while consumers can't get individual parts? Or is this worse than it looks? Or maybe the parts lotteries aren't so bad now?
Personally I'm doubting the thread title. Or at the very least it is going to be years. I wouldn't feel bad about "overpaying" right now for a video card (or via prebuilt), because it will probably be obsolete by the time prices come down.
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-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
In my experience, it's not so much that you can't buy GPUs at the moment, it's just that they're obscenely expensive. Like the build I just did should have been 25% less than it was because the GPU took up half of the entire build budget.
But GPUs are available, and not just from scalpers. Stores, both online and brick and mortar, have them, but they're marking them up as well because why not? Not may not get the brand you want, but you'll probably get the model you want from a store, you'll just pay a lot for it.
I noticed that it came with screws but no threading on the fan's plastic what I guess count as screw holes. Are these a thing you can install and then uninstall, or are the screw holes kind of destroyed once the thing's fastened?
You can reuse them many times
The screws are self tapping, so it might be a bit harder to turn them the first time. They need to bite into the plastic
Man the screws for my M.2 drive and then the second screw for the heatsink that came with my mobo were absolutely the hardest screws to start and thread I've ever dealt with in my life.
Getting those two things mounted and screwed down took as much time and pain as the rest of my build put together. And I ended up having to go back to my screw collection and finding a different screw to get the heatsink down and reliably fastened, the one that came with it just would not tighten and stay.
Everything else was simple and easy and clicked together. But that sucked and was painful and if I hadn't known I was doing it right i probably would have called off / asked for help / returned something.
I'm pretty sure my pc came with a heat sink for my ssd, but if I wanted to get another what brands are good?
If you want to avoid buying a third party heatsink, lots of PCIE 4 NVME's come with them. I got a Gigabyte Aorus that came with a huge copper brick of a heatsink that I'm using instead of the motherboard heatsink.
I've never felt the need to undervolt my Ryzen CPU's. They don't go haywire even with PBO turned on.
My Ampere GPU's are another thing entirely, especially my 3090. I'm not comfortable with my extremely expensive GPU spiking to 350+ W and pushing nearly 90C under max stress workloads. Especially not after we found out that Nvidia's reference power design can't handle some of the nastier spikes on the top tier chips. Nvidia has a very "Over current protection? What's that?" style of design around their power management and I'm not willing to risk it.
In fairness is there a game other than New World that's cooked 30*0 GPUs?
I'm pretty sure my pc came with a heat sink for my ssd, but if I wanted to get another what brands are good?
There should be a bunch out there. Just choose the one that looks best to you or matches well enough with your motherboard. There look to be some without any logos or branding too.
Posts
That's not a terrible price just to get the card (they're going around $1000 last I checked), if you could flip the rest somehow or just fix the issues with it like you said (cooling, etc).
DDR5 is just out. Availability for RAM early on is always sketchy/extremely expensive. We saw the same thing with RDRAM back in the day and that didn't have the supply shocks of today. If it's still a problem in 6 months to a year, yeah, that's a pain in the ass.
This is exactly where we are now and will be for quite a while. Basically things will not start to become available and affordable until 6-12+ months after consumer GPUs are no longer useful as money-printers.
And before anyone says it, Etherium has been supposed to be "going to 'proof of stake' within 3-6 months" for well over a year now.
If it helps your decision any, the Monster Hunter Rise system requirements are very low. The demo is even playable on integrated graphics.
You may as well register the card to turn on the warranty.
Is that EVGA power supply that bad? Are ASUS cards that horribly overpriced? All of the above?
EVGA has been doing a better job keeping their video card markups in the 'reasonable gouging' range where ASUS is just yoloing. I also think the FTW3 line is the bottom end of EVGA's line and STRIX is mid-high end for ASUS, but nothing to justify a $600ish price difference for the card alone.
And who the hell knows what Newegg is even doing, they've been doing plenty of marking up / gouging themselves since they are about the only game in town if you can't catch a Best Buy drop / camp a Microcenter.
EVGA's baseline stuff is the XC3 and Asus's TUF is their mid-tier line (for video cards).
Also EVGA is an easy recommend for power supplies. They're up there with Corsair and just behind Super Flower and Seasonic.
I also have yet to play around with the voltage curves on my 5900x. If I'm honest it sounds like an enormous amount of work checking stability that I'd rather spend doing something else. For once I'm happy to leave PBO on and let the chip do it's own thing.
My Ampere GPU's are another thing entirely, especially my 3090. I'm not comfortable with my extremely expensive GPU spiking to 350+ W and pushing nearly 90C under max stress workloads. Especially not after we found out that Nvidia's reference power design can't handle some of the nastier spikes on the top tier chips. Nvidia has a very "Over current protection? What's that?" style of design around their power management and I'm not willing to risk it.
I don't have a heatsink for this one, so I should get one. I also don't have any screws to attach this to the motherboard. Or in fact any screws to attach my soon to arrive HDD.
What sort of heatsink should I get for the SSD that will allow it to not melt, and what size screws do I need to install this and a standard size 3.5" HDD? I have a hardware store nearby so I figure I'll just pick those up there, but if there's somewhere I can easily grab both the heatsink and the screws at once I would also be into that.
I was able to get a 3080Ti FTW3 Ultra for $1599 or $1699 CDN. I can't remember exactly which price after staring at video cards for so long. The thing is a beast though, I edge out my buddy with the EVGA 3090 at 1440p.
Also fun times, I just tried to install a new fan... only to find out that the CPU power cables are in the way. This case is quite nice and has a lot of the wiring done via the back panel to keep things clear of clutter... but that means that the bump from those wires is obscuring the top fan mounting area. I don't really feel like unthreading them, particularly since I'm generally horrible at cable management... I'm hopeful that between the liquid cooling, the SSD heatsinks, and a generic case fan it'll run reasonably cool.
Maybe I'll replace the back fan? Or maybe I'll replace my old computer's janky fan. I do still want it to be usable and right now it gets a weird clicky noise for a half hour like half the times it starts up.
Actually also this was my first aftermarket fan, and I noticed that it came with screws but no threading on the fan's plastic what I guess count as screw holes. Are these a thing you can install and then uninstall, or are the screw holes kind of destroyed once the thing's fastened?
Personally I'm doubting the thread title. Or at the very least it is going to be years. I wouldn't feel bad about "overpaying" right now for a video card (or via prebuilt), because it will probably be obsolete by the time prices come down.
But GPUs are available, and not just from scalpers. Stores, both online and brick and mortar, have them, but they're marking them up as well because why not? Not may not get the brand you want, but you'll probably get the model you want from a store, you'll just pay a lot for it.
Even then I don’t see why they would, they can charge higher prices and people will pay.
Maybe once competition on performance halts a bit they’ll move to lowering prices to secure the sale.
Samsung’s 960 Pros would like a word.
Edit: to be clear, most all *current* gen 3 drives are fine. But a bunch of early ones had overheating problems.
You can reuse them many times
The screws are self tapping, so it might be a bit harder to turn them the first time. They need to bite into the plastic
Getting those two things mounted and screwed down took as much time and pain as the rest of my build put together. And I ended up having to go back to my screw collection and finding a different screw to get the heatsink down and reliably fastened, the one that came with it just would not tighten and stay.
Everything else was simple and easy and clicked together. But that sucked and was painful and if I hadn't known I was doing it right i probably would have called off / asked for help / returned something.
If you want to avoid buying a third party heatsink, lots of PCIE 4 NVME's come with them. I got a Gigabyte Aorus that came with a huge copper brick of a heatsink that I'm using instead of the motherboard heatsink.
A couple of Samsung 980's do. Most manufacturers have a handful that come with a heatsink. Usually in the 1tb+ sizes.
In fairness is there a game other than New World that's cooked 30*0 GPUs?
There should be a bunch out there. Just choose the one that looks best to you or matches well enough with your motherboard. There look to be some without any logos or branding too.