I was in doma castle last night and did the first couple of pulls and the healer was like “can you pull more” and I responded that it was my first time just a little scared and they said “don’t worry regular dungeons are mostly tuned that you can double pull fine” and I don’t know if that’s true but it gave me some more confidence.
At least the Confidence enough to actually use my Gnb oh shit button for the first times. That’s uh sure a cooldown.
From today's congestion and login post linked last page.
Maintenance sometime tonight in the AM. Lobby server maintenance today, but that won't effect people already in game.
2002s
We are now ready to deploy the backup development servers to the public lobby servers, which will improve the management capacity of the lobby server and raise the maximum number of players in the queue to around 21,000. Since this will not require any maintenance, we will err on the side of caution and proceed with the deployment outside of peak hours. It is scheduled to be completed late in the night of December 7, Japan time.
3001s
We currently have a general idea of what is causing this issue with extremely overloaded Worlds, and a fix is underway. However, these are areas where complex processing is carried out and careful fixing is required for this process. As such, fixing/confirming/implementation into the lobby server will require time. This will be implemented in the maintenance scheduled for December 8, and we are putting our full effort into it, but haven’t been able to determine the full details. Further details regarding this will be announced at a later timing as well.
4004s
We have been able to locate the cause of this error that occurs due to extremely high server loads and are currently fixing the source code for the lobby servers. Although the fix itself is finished, the process of checking whether the fix has actually resolved this issue requires time as it is an extremely complex process. In addition, due to the complexity of the conditions of occurrence itself, it is possible that we have not yet addressed more detailed conditions, but we will reflect the fixes and continue to monitor the situation. As soon as our preparations are ready, we will carry out the work through the aforementioned lobby server maintenance. We ask that you wait a little longer until the fix is made.
So yeah, the 2002's happen when 17000 people per data center are in the queue.
We are now ready to deploy the backup development servers to the public lobby servers, which will improve the management capacity of the lobby server and raise the maximum number of players in the queue to around 21,000.
Am I reading this right? They're repurposing some unused or underused dev servers as lobby servers? That's certainly a... novel approach, and shows just how desperate they are to get this fixed.
In any case, that's a wonderfully informative and transparent look at the issues. I don't think I've ever seen a game or web service so respectful of their user base.
How are Astrologians this patch? I haven't seen much talk about them.
I liked ShB AST and all the AST changes looked great to me. Not tying their Divination to seals, adding a self-buff, separating Arcana out, and the Earthly Star radius buff are all great changes, but they're mainly QOL.
There's also a lot of under-the-hood math fuckery that's happening with Trusts
Like, your DPS buddies do less damage, if YOU'RE doing more damage, so ensure that you're never completing Trust dungeons faster than your average Duty Finder dungeon..
The same healing spell cast by your healing trust friend will heal for more if you're taking more damage. This was probably designed more for gearing sake, if players are ill-equipped, but it also has the side-effect of basically allowing for larger pulls with no downside.
If you're a tank and you're taking 10k damage/second or 2k/second, a players Benefic will always heal you for X. But if you're in a Trust, the same Benefic will heal you for X if you're taking moderate damage, and then 2X once you start getting trucked.
AST is more AST, there's not much to say. I'm not in love with the Lord & Lady having a separate button to play after you summon them, just in raw "how many buttons do we have to devote to cards and seals come on guys". Gravity got its mana cost lowered which is great for blowing through dungeons.
On fights where I am familiar enough with boss mechanics to be able to anticipate big group damage, I love the combo of Eukrasia Prognosis + Kerachole to shield everyone and give 10% DR. Feels real good to drop combos like that.
I'm 80 now and I can also stack Panhaima with that as well, but I actually have not run any 80+ instances yet and had an opportunity to use Panhaima in the field.
AST is more AST, there's not much to say. I'm not in love with the Lord & Lady having a separate button to play after you summon them, just in raw "how many buttons do we have to devote to cards and seals come on guys". Gravity got its mana cost lowered which is great for blowing through dungeons.
How is it without sects though? I liked the flexibility, and am curious if it makes much of a functional difference. EDIT: I'm sure there was one that was the "correct" sect when doing end game content, but whenever I was healing just roulette stuff, particularly 8/24m, I'd just switch to the sect that provided the thing that the other healer didn't.
Also, just from clearing the removed abilities from all my job bars, it seems like they lost a redraw ability? I wasn't paying too close attention because I don't play AST that much anyway.
AST is more AST, there's not much to say. I'm not in love with the Lord & Lady having a separate button to play after you summon them, just in raw "how many buttons do we have to devote to cards and seals come on guys". Gravity got its mana cost lowered which is great for blowing through dungeons.
How is it without sects though? I liked the flexibility, and am curious if it makes much of a functional difference. EDIT: I'm sure there was one that was the "correct" sect when doing end game content, but whenever I was healing just roulette stuff, particularly 8/24m, I'd just switch to the sect that provided the thing that the other healer didn't.
Also, just from clearing the removed abilities from all my job bars, it seems like they lost a redraw ability? I wasn't paying too close attention because I don't play AST that much anyway.
Redraw still exists.
Regen sect was always the "better" one, but you wanted to go shields if you were paired with a WHM. I think now Trials and Raids try to force one shield and one regen healer?
It's hard to say what the roulette matchmaking rules are. With most healers in queue being sages at the moment, I think whatever rules the system has are just giving up and letting double sages in. Every 8 man run I've been on, whether MSQ Roulette or Trial Roulette, it has always been double sages.
I would not describe it as meaningfully changing the buttons you press, is the thing. And notably, you get to store two charges of the shield ability at 88
AST is more AST, there's not much to say. I'm not in love with the Lord & Lady having a separate button to play after you summon them, just in raw "how many buttons do we have to devote to cards and seals come on guys". Gravity got its mana cost lowered which is great for blowing through dungeons.
How is it without sects though? I liked the flexibility, and am curious if it makes much of a functional difference. EDIT: I'm sure there was one that was the "correct" sect when doing end game content, but whenever I was healing just roulette stuff, particularly 8/24m, I'd just switch to the sect that provided the thing that the other healer didn't.
Also, just from clearing the removed abilities from all my job bars, it seems like they lost a redraw ability? I wasn't paying too close attention because I don't play AST that much anyway.
Noct AST was living suffering. Sage is a vastly more refined vision of what a mitigation/shield healer should have been. It's certainly not perfect(I have a few problems with it) but it feels way better than what they tried to make Noct do.
I'm not seeing many sages at all really. 1 yesterday in alliance, 2 today, none in trials/raids
The Sage-curious people are probably filtering out at this point. (likely once they realize playing Sage means they'd have to actually heal, ha)
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
And then there's the, as Echo puts it: Heal Heal Revolution.
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
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admanbunionize your workplaceSeattle, WARegistered Userregular
I think anyone who was expecting Sage to be White Mage But For Shields has probably fallen off. Sage is no less clunky-feeling than ShB Scholar and arguably more clunky feeling than EW Scholar. It's APM is closer to AST than WHM (which has to be close to the lowest in the whole game, even with the GCD change.) I think it rules, but I also like Scholar and dislike WHM...
but I failed real hard at wall to wall pulls in the third ew dungeon so I should hand in my faerie and book
The X5 leveling dungeon of each xpac has traditionally been kinda a "oh, things actually hit kinda hard now" check in the past few expansions, and it felt similar here.
I mean, I am merely a lowly DPS player, and have also only run that dungeon once, but it did seem that our tank was taking some gross amounts of damage during wall to wall pulls.
but I failed real hard at wall to wall pulls in the third ew dungeon so I should hand in my faerie and book
The X5 leveling dungeon of each xpac has traditionally been kinda a "oh, things actually hit kinda hard now" check in the past few expansions, and it felt similar here.
I mean, I am merely a lowly DPS player, and have also only run that dungeon once, but it did seem that our tank was taking some gross amounts of damage during wall to wall pulls.
When it's early and nobody is well geared and such, yeah, it's just rough. And I keep messing up my timings to be able to keep dropping my preferred mitigation pattern on the tank for the pulls, making it worse. The last MSQ dungeon was awful (of course, I kept missing mechanics, the PLD was a real hero who managed to heal the DPS through the first two bosses to clear them)
The trick to sage for me so far has been exploiting all that mitigation.
A rotation of Kerachole > Taurochole > Kerachole > Holos > Kerachole > Taurochole > Kerachole gives you an uninterrupted 1 minute and 50 seconds of damage mitigation.
With Kardion ticking away between that and Haima/Panhaima/Physis picking up any slack it's been fine.
There's also a lot of under-the-hood math fuckery that's happening with Trusts
Like, your DPS buddies do less damage, if YOU'RE doing more damage, so ensure that you're never completing Trust dungeons faster than your average Duty Finder dungeon..
The same healing spell cast by your healing trust friend will heal for more if you're taking more damage. This was probably designed more for gearing sake, if players are ill-equipped, but it also has the side-effect of basically allowing for larger pulls with no downside.
If you're a tank and you're taking 10k damage/second or 2k/second, a players Benefic will always heal you for X. But if you're in a Trust, the same Benefic will heal you for X if you're taking moderate damage, and then 2X once you start getting trucked.
I didn't know this. That changes my thought process.
I still think big pulls mostly come down to the tank, but if Trusts are getting some help under the hood then they'll definitely occasionally outperform an an inexperienced healer who might not be able to handle what they can handle.
In general though, I feel like it's the tank's responsibility to turn the pull into something any healer can handle
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
A slightly related point; I've noticed that the healer/tank "blame dynamic" (for lack of a better word, I don't mean it in a negative way I just can't think of a positive alternative) in this game tends to lean pretty heavily on the healer. Every time I've died in a dungeon, even if it's because I didn't hit my planned Rampart in time and got bursted down, or stood in an aoe, the healer will immediately hit me with an apology. It seems like healers take the burden of group being alive on them more or less always, even when it wasn't their fault.
Is it just that the game, generally, doesn't give you great tools to know why someone died if you didn't actually see it happen? There's no Details death recap to see what they took damage from or how quickly they died, etc.
+1
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admanbunionize your workplaceSeattle, WARegistered Userregular
A slightly related point; I've noticed that the healer/tank "blame dynamic" (for lack of a better word, I don't mean it in a negative way I just can't think of a positive alternative) in this game tends to lean pretty heavily on the healer. Every time I've died in a dungeon, even if it's because I didn't hit my planned Rampart in time and got bursted down, or stood in an aoe, the healer will immediately hit me with an apology. It seems like healers take the burden of group being alive on them more or less always, even when it wasn't their fault.
Is it just that the game, generally, doesn't give you great tools to know why someone died if you didn't actually see it happen? There's no Details death recap to see what they took damage from or how quickly they died, etc.
That's pretty much just the MMO dynamic. If you don't play tank (or do but aren't good at math) you assume that healer has 90% of the responsibility for the tank's health pool, so if they die that's who you're going to blame. Of course, FFXIV groups rarely turn toxic so you get the healer apology instead of attacks.
WoW is pretty much the same. I don't know how much of a bubble you played in, but most of the time if the tank dies in M+ and didn't obviously mis/over-pull, the healer gets blamed for it. Bad tanks blaming healers for their deaths in raids is common as well.
That said, I think large pulls in FFXIV are even responsibility. If the tank dies extremely quickly, it's the tank's fault for not popping cooldowns. If they die slowly, but not too slowly, it's the healers fault for not popping or misusing cooldowns. If they die very slowly but inevitably, it's the DPS's fault for not getting the mobs down quickly enough.
I think anyone who was expecting Sage to be White Mage But For Shields has probably fallen off. Sage is no less clunky-feeling than ShB Scholar and arguably more clunky feeling than EW Scholar. It's APM is closer to AST than WHM (which has to be close to the lowest in the whole game, even with the GCD change.) I think it rules, but I also like Scholar and dislike WHM...
I'm actually curious as to what you're (or anyone else's) thoughts on SGE and SCH are right now, especially in comparison to each other. Like, what exactly changed with SCH, and how does it compare to SGE? I talked to a healer friend in my old static, but I think he was looking at it from a solo-healing raid perspective, which is something they're trying to discourage with the pure/barrier split.
A slightly related point; I've noticed that the healer/tank "blame dynamic" (for lack of a better word, I don't mean it in a negative way I just can't think of a positive alternative) in this game tends to lean pretty heavily on the healer. Every time I've died in a dungeon, even if it's because I didn't hit my planned Rampart in time and got bursted down, or stood in an aoe, the healer will immediately hit me with an apology. It seems like healers take the burden of group being alive on them more or less always, even when it wasn't their fault.
Is it just that the game, generally, doesn't give you great tools to know why someone died if you didn't actually see it happen? There's no Details death recap to see what they took damage from or how quickly they died, etc.
That's pretty much just the MMO dynamic. If you don't play tank (or do but aren't good at math) you assume that healer has 90% of the responsibility for the tank's health pool, so if they die that's who you're going to blame. Of course, FFXIV groups rarely turn toxic so you get the healer apology instead of attacks.
WoW is pretty much the same. I don't know how much of a bubble you played in, but most of the time if the tank dies in M+ and didn't obviously mis/over-pull, the healer gets blamed for it. Bad tanks blaming healers for their deaths in raids is common as well.
That said, I think large pulls in FFXIV are even responsibility. If the tank dies extremely quickly, it's the tank's fault for not popping cooldowns. If they die slowly, but not too slowly, it's the healers fault for not popping or misusing cooldowns. If they die very slowly but inevitably, it's the DPS's fault for not getting the mobs down quickly enough.
The caveat I would add to this is that in WoW the healer often gets yelled at when the tank dies despite the fact that the healer died first.
God. . . .
A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited December 2021
In WoW the gameplay mechanics give tanks so much personal agency that it's pretty much always their fault when they die. Healers generally should only need their passive heals to keep a tank up in most WoW content - if they need to do more than that, they should, but it's still the tank playing poorly if they need to.
FFXIV does feel a little different for some of the tanks, with less agency, but at least on PLD I feel more or less like a WoW tank in that I really don't die unless I personally screw something up, more or less regardless of what the healer does.
I only have Scholar experience I haven't played WHM or AST or Sage.
Oh, I want to say this, though. And I am going to spoiler it but it's just a comment about the battle theme in this expansion:
I love LOVE LOVE the final fantasy 6 battle theme from this expansion
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drunkenpandarenSlapping all the goblin hamIn the top laneRegistered Userregular
Hey, I did quit WoW when I came back in Cataclysm because I told the group I haven't played in a year and if there's anything I should know about this dungeon. Let me know. First wipe on the first boss I get kicked and told I was trash.
I did get a healer calling me out the other day in FFXIV, saying I wasn't hitting my CDs on pulls. I was hitting my CDs and they were just too busy not healing me. They even tried to do a kick, in which the two DPS in the group called the healer out since they see me popping those CDs so the healer left.
Honestly though, the first big pull is a pretty good test on the healer and tank. If I'm getting healed pretty steady on that first one, I just keep going. If not, then I'll resort to pulling a pack, get them down to about half then go on to pull the next pack to chain pull.
Origin: HaxtonWasHere
Steam: pandas_gota_gun
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
Posts
CorriganX on Steam and just about everywhere else.
At least the Confidence enough to actually use my Gnb oh shit button for the first times. That’s uh sure a cooldown.
Maintenance sometime tonight in the AM. Lobby server maintenance today, but that won't effect people already in game.
2002s
3001s
4004s
Am I reading this right? They're repurposing some unused or underused dev servers as lobby servers? That's certainly a... novel approach, and shows just how desperate they are to get this fixed.
In any case, that's a wonderfully informative and transparent look at the issues. I don't think I've ever seen a game or web service so respectful of their user base.
also potency was doubled for the explosion damage.
I liked ShB AST and all the AST changes looked great to me. Not tying their Divination to seals, adding a self-buff, separating Arcana out, and the Earthly Star radius buff are all great changes, but they're mainly QOL.
Like, your DPS buddies do less damage, if YOU'RE doing more damage, so ensure that you're never completing Trust dungeons faster than your average Duty Finder dungeon..
The same healing spell cast by your healing trust friend will heal for more if you're taking more damage. This was probably designed more for gearing sake, if players are ill-equipped, but it also has the side-effect of basically allowing for larger pulls with no downside.
If you're a tank and you're taking 10k damage/second or 2k/second, a players Benefic will always heal you for X. But if you're in a Trust, the same Benefic will heal you for X if you're taking moderate damage, and then 2X once you start getting trucked.
Of course, this is very intense focused button mashing, because weaving stuff into mostly every GCD is some Heal Heal Revolution shit.
I'm 80 now and I can also stack Panhaima with that as well, but I actually have not run any 80+ instances yet and had an opportunity to use Panhaima in the field.
How is it without sects though? I liked the flexibility, and am curious if it makes much of a functional difference. EDIT: I'm sure there was one that was the "correct" sect when doing end game content, but whenever I was healing just roulette stuff, particularly 8/24m, I'd just switch to the sect that provided the thing that the other healer didn't.
Also, just from clearing the removed abilities from all my job bars, it seems like they lost a redraw ability? I wasn't paying too close attention because I don't play AST that much anyway.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Redraw still exists.
Regen sect was always the "better" one, but you wanted to go shields if you were paired with a WHM. I think now Trials and Raids try to force one shield and one regen healer?
Noct AST was living suffering. Sage is a vastly more refined vision of what a mitigation/shield healer should have been. It's certainly not perfect(I have a few problems with it) but it feels way better than what they tried to make Noct do.
The Sage-curious people are probably filtering out at this point. (likely once they realize playing Sage means they'd have to actually heal, ha)
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
but I failed real hard at wall to wall pulls in the third ew dungeon so I should hand in my faerie and book
ugh and now is when the queue gets bad
Scholar's oGCD healing output was insane in ShB. Their changes in EW were pure QoL, but that's actually huge for their kit.
The X5 leveling dungeon of each xpac has traditionally been kinda a "oh, things actually hit kinda hard now" check in the past few expansions, and it felt similar here.
I mean, I am merely a lowly DPS player, and have also only run that dungeon once, but it did seem that our tank was taking some gross amounts of damage during wall to wall pulls.
When it's early and nobody is well geared and such, yeah, it's just rough. And I keep messing up my timings to be able to keep dropping my preferred mitigation pattern on the tank for the pulls, making it worse. The last MSQ dungeon was awful (of course, I kept missing mechanics, the PLD was a real hero who managed to heal the DPS through the first two bosses to clear them)
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
PSN: AbEntropy
Also, the previous "why don't they use AWS?" conversation is kind of hilarious in retrospect today, since AWS has been down most of the day.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
A rotation of Kerachole > Taurochole > Kerachole > Holos > Kerachole > Taurochole > Kerachole gives you an uninterrupted 1 minute and 50 seconds of damage mitigation.
With Kardion ticking away between that and Haima/Panhaima/Physis picking up any slack it's been fine.
I didn't know this. That changes my thought process.
I still think big pulls mostly come down to the tank, but if Trusts are getting some help under the hood then they'll definitely occasionally outperform an an inexperienced healer who might not be able to handle what they can handle.
In general though, I feel like it's the tank's responsibility to turn the pull into something any healer can handle
Is it just that the game, generally, doesn't give you great tools to know why someone died if you didn't actually see it happen? There's no Details death recap to see what they took damage from or how quickly they died, etc.
That's pretty much just the MMO dynamic. If you don't play tank (or do but aren't good at math) you assume that healer has 90% of the responsibility for the tank's health pool, so if they die that's who you're going to blame. Of course, FFXIV groups rarely turn toxic so you get the healer apology instead of attacks.
WoW is pretty much the same. I don't know how much of a bubble you played in, but most of the time if the tank dies in M+ and didn't obviously mis/over-pull, the healer gets blamed for it. Bad tanks blaming healers for their deaths in raids is common as well.
That said, I think large pulls in FFXIV are even responsibility. If the tank dies extremely quickly, it's the tank's fault for not popping cooldowns. If they die slowly, but not too slowly, it's the healers fault for not popping or misusing cooldowns. If they die very slowly but inevitably, it's the DPS's fault for not getting the mobs down quickly enough.
I'm actually curious as to what you're (or anyone else's) thoughts on SGE and SCH are right now, especially in comparison to each other. Like, what exactly changed with SCH, and how does it compare to SGE? I talked to a healer friend in my old static, but I think he was looking at it from a solo-healing raid perspective, which is something they're trying to discourage with the pure/barrier split.
Steam: pazython
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
The caveat I would add to this is that in WoW the healer often gets yelled at when the tank dies despite the fact that the healer died first.
God. . . .
FFXIV does feel a little different for some of the tanks, with less agency, but at least on PLD I feel more or less like a WoW tank in that I really don't die unless I personally screw something up, more or less regardless of what the healer does.
Oh, I want to say this, though. And I am going to spoiler it but it's just a comment about the battle theme in this expansion:
I did get a healer calling me out the other day in FFXIV, saying I wasn't hitting my CDs on pulls. I was hitting my CDs and they were just too busy not healing me. They even tried to do a kick, in which the two DPS in the group called the healer out since they see me popping those CDs so the healer left.
Honestly though, the first big pull is a pretty good test on the healer and tank. If I'm getting healed pretty steady on that first one, I just keep going. If not, then I'll resort to pulling a pack, get them down to about half then go on to pull the next pack to chain pull.
Steam: pandas_gota_gun
In my experience this tends to be worse than just going pack by pack. DPS don't know what to do with their CDs when you do this.