I'm throwing bricks in a glass house here as a Drukhari player currently, but that looks bonkers strong to me on paper. A potential army-wide -1 to damage is huge.
What are the current ML rules again? I don’t have the 8e book and they change every edition…
That said, just allowing pathfinders to shoot and mark at the same time would be a huge benefit, never mind giving them the other toys from the kill team kit.
I'm throwing bricks in a glass house here as a Drukhari player currently, but that looks bonkers strong to me on paper. A potential army-wide -1 to damage is huge.
Units with more than 2w that you could supplement with include: biovores, raveners, pyrovores, venomthropes, zoans, lictors, hive/tyrant guard, warriors, neurothropes, nid primes, basically all the HQ's.
So you lose stealers, gaunts, gants, ripper swarms, gargoyles.... and I think that's it?
So you really have access to most of the book and get -1d on all your big gribblies.
This is literally the army I dreamed of when I still played nids. Buff up all the big stuff and don't require me to take 100+ little bugs to be competitive. Guaranteed it's going to get the nerfbat like Ork buggies did. The -1d ability not being limited to S7 weapons or less means those big bugs are actually kind of scary now.
Even before potential buffs from the upcoming codex, which I assume would include WS/BS buffs like a lot of other books have gotten on big models, carnifexes with a 5++ and -1d and counting as 8 models each at full health actually seem scary and not just "distractions" anymore.
What are the current ML rules again? I don’t have the 8e book and they change every edition…
That said, just allowing pathfinders to shoot and mark at the same time would be a huge benefit, never mind giving them the other toys from the kill team kit.
That’s kind of a whole stack of lame, isn’t it? Somehow, despite being nearly identical, the KT21 version is much more interesting; 1 ML is re-roll one attack die (all KT21 attacks have multiple dice), 2 is ignore cover save bonuses, 3 is +1 to hit, and 4 + 5 don’t have a direct equivalent in 40K but the cumulative effect is “ignore terrain completely and treat them as if they were in LoS and in the open.” Roughly.
What are the current ML rules again? I don’t have the 8e book and they change every edition…
That said, just allowing pathfinders to shoot and mark at the same time would be a huge benefit, never mind giving them the other toys from the kill team kit.
That’s kind of a whole stack of lame, isn’t it? Somehow, despite being nearly identical, the KT21 version is much more interesting; 1 ML is re-roll one attack die (all KT21 attacks have multiple dice), 2 is ignore cover save bonuses, 3 is +1 to hit, and 4 + 5 don’t have a direct equivalent in 40K but the cumulative effect is “ignore terrain completely and treat them as if they were in LoS and in the open.” Roughly.
Absolutely. There's basically zero value at 2 and 4 markerlights. 3 is debatable depending on the board and army you're playing against. It also means having to, to a degree, build your army around how readily you can stack markerlights.
It's a really poorly designed army rule. Part of why I'd like to see it completely overhauled. Whiffing hard on getting 5 markerlights on a viable target really hinders your bigger guns from being effective.
What are the current ML rules again? I don’t have the 8e book and they change every edition…
That said, just allowing pathfinders to shoot and mark at the same time would be a huge benefit, never mind giving them the other toys from the kill team kit.
That’s kind of a whole stack of lame, isn’t it? Somehow, despite being nearly identical, the KT21 version is much more interesting; 1 ML is re-roll one attack die (all KT21 attacks have multiple dice), 2 is ignore cover save bonuses, 3 is +1 to hit, and 4 + 5 don’t have a direct equivalent in 40K but the cumulative effect is “ignore terrain completely and treat them as if they were in LoS and in the open.” Roughly.
Absolutely. There's basically zero value at 2 and 4 markerlights. 3 is debatable depending on the board and army you're playing against. It also means having to, to a degree, build your army around how readily you can stack markerlights.
It's a really poorly designed army rule. Part of why I'd like to see it completely overhauled. Whiffing hard on getting 5 markerlights on a viable target really hinders your bigger guns from being effective.
Building from KT rules:
ML hits place a token with the target unit. As long as they’re there, other T’au get the following benefits:
Re-roll 1s to hit
Target loses cover bonus to saves
Get +1 to hit
Target loses hit penalties from cover
Then you can have a separate rule that says you can deduct a ML token from a unit to fire a seeker missile at it, but that missile fires at regular BS and ignores cover & LoS.
Oh and no daft markers or other guns rule either; the thing is literally integrated into their guns.
A strat to give a big bug +1 to hit, wound, and damage in close combat. Ability to buff two warrior squads to a +2 ws/3+ bs base. Transhuman. Fight on death for big monsters in close combat. Big guns never tire for warriors. Ways to up attacks. And a flat 5++ across the entire army.
Its good.
+2
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-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
edited December 2021
Since getting back into 40k my Drukhari playing friend has also been dabbling in Primaris marines. He never really got past painting a few though.
With all of the Eldar rumours - in particular the rmours of a massic revamp to Craftworlds range with lots more Plastic kits - he's decided to drop the Primaris Marines and concentrate on all things Aeldari (likely bolstered by the fact that he completely painted his Wych Cult and is now looking at other Drukhari stuff).
This is awesome. Fighting different kinds of Eldar is different experiences, they can mix and match now through Ynnari which is even more interesting, and I don't have to bash my head against that 3+ armour wall.
On the subject of plastic kits, at first I was dubious. Every Craftworld Eldar codex release has the same rumours. 'All Aspect Warriors going plastic, new Guardian kits' which turn out to be either completely bogus or just one kit gets released (ie, Banshees). But, I think the lack of new kits lately gives a bit of credence to it. Genestealers look like they're getting a single character. IIRC Druukhari got the same? Black Templars got quite a few releases but they're Space Marines.
I wonder if the lack of Drukhari and Genestealer kits was to move production over to doing a much bigger Aeldari release. New Guardian Kit and a few Aspect Warrior kits and a few characters (maybe Pheonix Lords for each redone Aspects and a Farseer) would be a pretty big relaunch of Eldar.
Since getting back into 40k my Drukhari playing friend has also been dabbling in Primaris marines. He never really got past painting a few though.
With all of the Eldar rumours - in particular the rmours of a massic revamp to Craftworlds range with lots more Plastic kits - he's decided to drop the Primaris Marines and concentrate on all things Aeldari (likely bolstered by the fact that he completely painted his Wych Cult and is now looking at other Drukhari stuff).
This is awesome. Fighting different kinds of Eldar is different experiences, they can mix and match now through Ynnari which is even more interesting, and I don't have to bash my head against that 3+ armour wall.
On the subject of plastic kits, at first I was dubious. Every Craftworld Eldar codex release has the same rumours. 'All Aspect Warriors going plastic, new Guardian kits' which turn out to be either completely bogus or just one kit gets released (ie, Banshees). But, I think the lack of new kits lately gives a bit of credence to it. Genestealers look like they're getting a single character. IIRC Druukhari got the same? Black Templars got quite a few releases but they're Space Marines.
I wonder if the lack of Drukhari and Genestealer kits was to move production over to doing a much bigger Aeldari release. New Guardian Kit and a few Aspect Warrior kits and a few characters (maybe Pheonix Lords for each redone Aspects and a Farseer) would be a pretty big relaunch of Eldar.
GSC and Custodes are pretty new lines and look great. Eldar followed by CSM have the oldest kits now. And they seem to be replacing some of both if rumors are correct.
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-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
GSC and Custodes are pretty new lines and look great.
No argument there. But from a customer standpoint, I have a 3k army already and all they're selling me is a single character for the next few years.
Not complaining there either, but it lacks a bit of excitement.
Its just part of the issue of having limited production lines, time from sculpt to production, and 14 factions. Especially when some have some really in need models like Eldar, Guard, and CSM.
Like building my Deathwatch has been a joy because every single kit is 7th edition or later except for the first born bikes which I hated. Its made them feel so much better. And I didn't even get a new character for them.
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-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
edited December 2021
Biggest surprise for me is it appears there's no resculpted Purestrain kit. The current kit is pretty old - IIRC from 4th edition, and it shows.
Luckily I managed to hunt down about 15 of the Deathwatch Overkill Purestrains.
-Loki- on
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
GSC and Custodes are pretty new lines and look great.
No argument there. But from a customer standpoint, I have a 3k army already and all they're selling me is a single character for the next few years.
Not complaining there either, but it lacks a bit of excitement.
Personally I'd rather have rules that makes what I do have not the bottom of the barrel, after it's been hollowed out and dug to the other side of the planet it's that bad.
Non-shit rules so I can use my 3k points is what I want from GW before they even attempt to sell me new models for GSC.
What are the current ML rules again? I don’t have the 8e book and they change every edition…
That said, just allowing pathfinders to shoot and mark at the same time would be a huge benefit, never mind giving them the other toys from the kill team kit.
That’s kind of a whole stack of lame, isn’t it? Somehow, despite being nearly identical, the KT21 version is much more interesting; 1 ML is re-roll one attack die (all KT21 attacks have multiple dice), 2 is ignore cover save bonuses, 3 is +1 to hit, and 4 + 5 don’t have a direct equivalent in 40K but the cumulative effect is “ignore terrain completely and treat them as if they were in LoS and in the open.” Roughly.
Absolutely. There's basically zero value at 2 and 4 markerlights. 3 is debatable depending on the board and army you're playing against. It also means having to, to a degree, build your army around how readily you can stack markerlights.
It's a really poorly designed army rule. Part of why I'd like to see it completely overhauled. Whiffing hard on getting 5 markerlights on a viable target really hinders your bigger guns from being effective.
Building from KT rules:
ML hits place a token with the target unit. As long as they’re there, other T’au get the following benefits:
Re-roll 1s to hit
Target loses cover bonus to saves
Get +1 to hit
Target loses hit penalties from cover
Then you can have a separate rule that says you can deduct a ML token from a unit to fire a seeker missile at it, but that missile fires at regular BS and ignores cover & LoS.
Oh and no daft markers or other guns rule either; the thing is literally integrated into their guns.
Agreed, that’s another thing I like in KillTeam21, if your Pathfinders stay stationary, they can fire their rifle and marker light at the same target in the same turn.
GSC and Custodes are pretty new lines and look great.
No argument there. But from a customer standpoint, I have a 3k army already and all they're selling me is a single character for the next few years.
Not complaining there either, but it lacks a bit of excitement.
Personally I'd rather have rules that makes what I do have not the bottom of the barrel, after it's been hollowed out and dug to the other side of the planet it's that bad.
Non-shit rules so I can use my 3k points is what I want from GW before they even attempt to sell me new models for GSC.
I am starting a GSC army from shadow throne. Going to not get more till I see the codex. The previews so far are promising. Especially crossfire.
Mazzyx on
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-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
edited December 2021
My main concern is still Acolyte heavy weapons.
I spent a decent amount of time and money hunting down 4 extra Rock Saws for 2 of my Acolyte squads to have 4 each. The other squad has 4 demo charges.
Wyches went from being able to take any combination of Wych weapons to 1 of each type per squad. If they do that to Acolytes... ugh. I'm going to have to hunt down Rock Drills and Rock Cutters.
-Loki- on
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
I am really happy to see the new rules and especially if they make special weapons X/10 or whatever.
But I really need to make sure I didn't spend a lot of money on 100+ infantry to basically have them as useless as they are now. Once they fix the army and make it competitive, give me new stuff.
-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
I'd like to see Goliaths of both variety worth taking as well.
Because they look awesome and it sucks they rarely see the table.
+1
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
Yeah my first models for the army were bikers and a goliath. I've used it only twice and it's never seen the table again. I don't expect that to change in a world of instant death melta weapons etc.
-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
I'm lucky that my DE playing friend loads up on Disintegrators rather than Dark Lances, so at least my Achilles and Rock Grinder aren't instantly evaporated. But even then, the Rock Grinder is not that great in what is meant to be its primary role - running over jerks with its drilldozer. Mostly it's another Heavy Mining Laser platform.
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Gabriel_Pitt(effective against Russian warships)Registered Userregular
edited December 2021
I'm hoping that the Tau and Tyranid updates are hot, because I've hit the point where I just have so much -stuff- I need to start simplifying, and as much as I loved those armies, I need to make room. I bought the bulk of my third edition nid army to finance a friend's engagement ring, and ended up with some much stuff I was able to give away a 700 point nid army as the secret santa gift a couple years later.
So I'm selfishly hoping that they turn out to be hot hot, so people are interested in giving a big army a good home, but not so hot hot that I decide to keep and play them. XD
Gabriel_Pitt on
+1
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-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
I recently gave away a bunch of stuff for that reason. My nephew was getting into Chaos, so I gave him the Chaos stuff I had lying around, and my brother plays Yu Jing in Infinity so he got my Yu Jing stuff from the starter set they did.
Not I've got some stuff to sell as well. Just too much stuff taking up too much space.
Gabriel_Pitt(effective against Russian warships)Registered Userregular
I mean, that's pretty much what would make me keep the 'nids on the shelf. XD Swarms, nidzilla, my fourth edition edition flyrant that I made by putting metal Nightmare wings on a Red Terror, because the Red Terror didn't have fourth edition rules, and the winged hive tyrant didn't have a model...
That also makes me miss the early edition Death or Glory rules - when my Necron Pariah was run down by a landraider, and rolled so high on his penetration roll that the LR split in half around him. Or that time my flyrant was charged by a Rhino, and he failed his DorG roll so bad, he got splattered on the windscreens like a bug... XD
Really the things I am curious about the tyrainds is the overall playability of building random forces. If they have a flying warrior can i do all flying forces with the gargoyles? how scary warriors will be?
I know currently and because of the synapse preview doing the massive swarm of termagants lead by tervigons for a carpet of pew pew. Will it still be playable when the codex drops. All big bugs is another detail I am curious about as what are some of the options? Can I still play with an all warrior force? Some of the bigger bugs kind of suck {venomthropes, hive crone, harupex and the spores!} So how will they change?
Out of all the codexes the tyranid one is really one that does not lend itself to a couple of themes throwing in CP and such opens it even more
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-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
I’m going to assume Shrikes/flying Warriors are out. The Warrior box was redone pretty recently and wings weren’t included. Their last chance is alternate builds in a Lictor box, since they’re both based on the Warrior but with less armour, but I really don’t see that box happening.
I know the warrior box was redone since most of the warriors I have come from before the prime parts
I really don't assume anything is out as it's just my wish to get a flying warrior but then again this would be a mono kit and gw is more into multi kits
The Leviathan rules already had me interested in nids again, but now I'm torn because those new rules also look really cool. And although I think huge swarms of gaunts look awesome and are iconic for nids, as a painfully slow painter I dread the thought of having to paint that many models.
fray on
"I told you," said Ford. "Eddies in the space-time continuum."
"And this is his sofa, is it?" said Arthur.
Nah, Eldar tech has those little bumps all over. Actual gems including the spirit stones have a setting (a little ring around the stone), setting them apart from those other thingies.
I'm never playing competitively and don't know much about how T'au play, but is a bonus that only starts in round 3 and has it's biggest bonus in round 5 even remotely viable compared to a having a bonus in the first three rounds?
There are entire Marine armies that don't turn on till turn 3 and do fine. Aka white scars and BA.
It requires a very specific style of play. I think Mont'ka is better on first glance. But Tau have stuff they can do to keep a lot of stuff alive. And playing dodgy with others. Like the current Crisis Suit blob would be nuts since it is so hard to kill its better to ignore it. It exploding on 6+/5+ with all its shots in turn 3/4 is a huge boom.
It does feel like a full change to how Tau play. Curious how it interacts with like Farsight and Shadowsun who have bonuses and focuses.
Posts
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
Plus...big bug army.
I'm curious what army comp would look like.
The -1d ability applies to:Hive tyrants/swarmlord, tervigons, OOE/Carnifexes (and variants), Maleceptors, Haruspex's, Exocrines, Tyrranofexes, toxicrenes, mawlocs, trygons/primes, the tyrranocyte, Harpys/hive crones, Sporocyst.
Units with more than 2w that you could supplement with include: biovores, raveners, pyrovores, venomthropes, zoans, lictors, hive/tyrant guard, warriors, neurothropes, nid primes, basically all the HQ's.
So you lose stealers, gaunts, gants, ripper swarms, gargoyles.... and I think that's it?
So you really have access to most of the book and get -1d on all your big gribblies.
This is literally the army I dreamed of when I still played nids. Buff up all the big stuff and don't require me to take 100+ little bugs to be competitive. Guaranteed it's going to get the nerfbat like Ork buggies did. The -1d ability not being limited to S7 weapons or less means those big bugs are actually kind of scary now.
Even before potential buffs from the upcoming codex, which I assume would include WS/BS buffs like a lot of other books have gotten on big models, carnifexes with a 5++ and -1d and counting as 8 models each at full health actually seem scary and not just "distractions" anymore.
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
That’s kind of a whole stack of lame, isn’t it? Somehow, despite being nearly identical, the KT21 version is much more interesting; 1 ML is re-roll one attack die (all KT21 attacks have multiple dice), 2 is ignore cover save bonuses, 3 is +1 to hit, and 4 + 5 don’t have a direct equivalent in 40K but the cumulative effect is “ignore terrain completely and treat them as if they were in LoS and in the open.” Roughly.
Nintendo Network ID: AzraelRose
DropBox invite link - get 500MB extra free.
Absolutely. There's basically zero value at 2 and 4 markerlights. 3 is debatable depending on the board and army you're playing against. It also means having to, to a degree, build your army around how readily you can stack markerlights.
It's a really poorly designed army rule. Part of why I'd like to see it completely overhauled. Whiffing hard on getting 5 markerlights on a viable target really hinders your bigger guns from being effective.
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
ML hits place a token with the target unit. As long as they’re there, other T’au get the following benefits:
- Re-roll 1s to hit
- Target loses cover bonus to saves
- Get +1 to hit
- Target loses hit penalties from cover
Then you can have a separate rule that says you can deduct a ML token from a unit to fire a seeker missile at it, but that missile fires at regular BS and ignores cover & LoS.Oh and no daft markers or other guns rule either; the thing is literally integrated into their guns.
Nintendo Network ID: AzraelRose
DropBox invite link - get 500MB extra free.
I think it’s a WD article
A strat to give a big bug +1 to hit, wound, and damage in close combat. Ability to buff two warrior squads to a +2 ws/3+ bs base. Transhuman. Fight on death for big monsters in close combat. Big guns never tire for warriors. Ways to up attacks. And a flat 5++ across the entire army.
Its good.
With all of the Eldar rumours - in particular the rmours of a massic revamp to Craftworlds range with lots more Plastic kits - he's decided to drop the Primaris Marines and concentrate on all things Aeldari (likely bolstered by the fact that he completely painted his Wych Cult and is now looking at other Drukhari stuff).
This is awesome. Fighting different kinds of Eldar is different experiences, they can mix and match now through Ynnari which is even more interesting, and I don't have to bash my head against that 3+ armour wall.
On the subject of plastic kits, at first I was dubious. Every Craftworld Eldar codex release has the same rumours. 'All Aspect Warriors going plastic, new Guardian kits' which turn out to be either completely bogus or just one kit gets released (ie, Banshees). But, I think the lack of new kits lately gives a bit of credence to it. Genestealers look like they're getting a single character. IIRC Druukhari got the same? Black Templars got quite a few releases but they're Space Marines.
I wonder if the lack of Drukhari and Genestealer kits was to move production over to doing a much bigger Aeldari release. New Guardian Kit and a few Aspect Warrior kits and a few characters (maybe Pheonix Lords for each redone Aspects and a Farseer) would be a pretty big relaunch of Eldar.
Still I am 8 boxes of termagants away from 300! behold the horror of pew pew and the use of movement trays in a non apoc game
GSC and Custodes are pretty new lines and look great. Eldar followed by CSM have the oldest kits now. And they seem to be replacing some of both if rumors are correct.
No argument there. But from a customer standpoint, I have a 3k army already and all they're selling me is a single character for the next few years.
Not complaining there either, but it lacks a bit of excitement.
Its just part of the issue of having limited production lines, time from sculpt to production, and 14 factions. Especially when some have some really in need models like Eldar, Guard, and CSM.
Like building my Deathwatch has been a joy because every single kit is 7th edition or later except for the first born bikes which I hated. Its made them feel so much better. And I didn't even get a new character for them.
Luckily I managed to hunt down about 15 of the Deathwatch Overkill Purestrains.
Personally I'd rather have rules that makes what I do have not the bottom of the barrel, after it's been hollowed out and dug to the other side of the planet it's that bad.
Non-shit rules so I can use my 3k points is what I want from GW before they even attempt to sell me new models for GSC.
Agreed, that’s another thing I like in KillTeam21, if your Pathfinders stay stationary, they can fire their rifle and marker light at the same target in the same turn.
MWO: Adamski
I am starting a GSC army from shadow throne. Going to not get more till I see the codex. The previews so far are promising. Especially crossfire.
I spent a decent amount of time and money hunting down 4 extra Rock Saws for 2 of my Acolyte squads to have 4 each. The other squad has 4 demo charges.
Wyches went from being able to take any combination of Wych weapons to 1 of each type per squad. If they do that to Acolytes... ugh. I'm going to have to hunt down Rock Drills and Rock Cutters.
But I really need to make sure I didn't spend a lot of money on 100+ infantry to basically have them as useless as they are now. Once they fix the army and make it competitive, give me new stuff.
Because they look awesome and it sucks they rarely see the table.
So I'm selfishly hoping that they turn out to be hot hot, so people are interested in giving a big army a good home, but not so hot hot that I decide to keep and play them. XD
Not I've got some stuff to sell as well. Just too much stuff taking up too much space.
That also makes me miss the early edition Death or Glory rules - when my Necron Pariah was run down by a landraider, and rolled so high on his penetration roll that the LR split in half around him. Or that time my flyrant was charged by a Rhino, and he failed his DorG roll so bad, he got splattered on the windscreens like a bug... XD
I know currently and because of the synapse preview doing the massive swarm of termagants lead by tervigons for a carpet of pew pew. Will it still be playable when the codex drops. All big bugs is another detail I am curious about as what are some of the options? Can I still play with an all warrior force? Some of the bigger bugs kind of suck {venomthropes, hive crone, harupex and the spores!} So how will they change?
Out of all the codexes the tyranid one is really one that does not lend itself to a couple of themes throwing in CP and such opens it even more
I really don't assume anything is out as it's just my wish to get a flying warrior but then again this would be a mono kit and gw is more into multi kits
Seems kind of uninspired as a change, that almost feels like a sidegrade compared to the flat -1 damage it's got currently.
Part of the ranger jetbike
"And this is his sofa, is it?" said Arthur.
Those are going to look so good.
Looking forward to dioramas set on the Endor.
Soul stone on a leather boot? Waitaminute 😝 *hiddenDrukhari*
MWO: Adamski
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/12/14/master-the-ways-of-montka-and-kauyon-with-codex-tau-empires-new-tactical-philosophies/
And the boni of Kauyon don't even work at the same time.
It requires a very specific style of play. I think Mont'ka is better on first glance. But Tau have stuff they can do to keep a lot of stuff alive. And playing dodgy with others. Like the current Crisis Suit blob would be nuts since it is so hard to kill its better to ignore it. It exploding on 6+/5+ with all its shots in turn 3/4 is a huge boom.
It does feel like a full change to how Tau play. Curious how it interacts with like Farsight and Shadowsun who have bonuses and focuses.