As some have mentioned, I think, it's a kind of chicken-egg problem: Most people aren't buying PS3s because there aren't any good exclusive games for it (Armored Core being a possible exception, but I hear that game has a steep learning curve, so isn't really a blockbuster), and game companies won't want to develop PS3-exclusive games because there aren't enough people with PS3s.
Armored Core is out on the 360 was just playing it yesterday.
As some have mentioned, I think, it's a kind of chicken-egg problem: Most people aren't buying PS3s because there aren't any good exclusive games for it (Armored Core being a possible exception, but I hear that game has a steep learning curve, so isn't really a blockbuster), and game companies won't want to develop PS3-exclusive games because there aren't enough people with PS3s.
Armored Core is out on the 360 was just playing it yesterday.
Ah, my bad. I guess the PS3 has fewer redeeming characteristics than I thought
Own a 360 & PS3, as far as worthwhile titles thus far - I had a blast with Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Resistance is as good if not better than Gears of War (which I also enjoyed.) If your into small arcade games Super Stardust HD has sucked away quite a few hours of my life. Honestly I'm looking forward to PS3 exclusives coming out this year than the 360, got folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank future all hitting before the holidays. For multiplatform your still looking at Army of Two, Kane & Lynch, as well as Stranglehold.
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
Own a 360 & PS3, as far as worthwhile titles thus far - I had a blast with Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Resistance is as good if not better than Gears of War (which I also enjoyed.) If your into small arcade games Super Stardust HD has sucked away quite a few hours of my life. Honestly I'm looking forward to PS3 exclusives coming out this year than the 360, got folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank future all hitting before the holidays. For multiplatform your still looking at Army of Two, Kane & Lynch, as well as Stranglehold.
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
The reality is even though you are looking forward to folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank more, they probably won't sell as much combined as Halo 3 will. Sony doesn't have anything coming for a while that is going to move systems like Halo will.
I seriously "want" Sony in 3rd place this gen. Not a debatable third, solid, no questions asked, even in Japan, third.
Why? Because it will hopefully make them actually try and bring it to the table in a SERIOUS effort. No resting on their laurels, no reliance on brand name, but a serious ass kicking attempt to be great.
Nintendo had their time in the sun, got cocky as hell, and then got hit with the 1-2 punch of the N64 and the Gamecube. Their answer? The Wii.
Sega got smacked with a lot, the Sega CD, the 32x, and the Saturn. Their answer? The Dreamcast, and by no fault of the system they are gone.
Microsoft came out fighting with the Xbox, and even with a respectable showing, they hit us all up with the 360.
While none of the "answer" systems is perfect, it reflects a profound change from the systems before it, along with a company backing it that is much changed from what it was previously.
If Microsoft came and dominated this generation and then released an Xbox3 that was essentially a slightly more powerful 360, I'd want them to go down too.
Not to say the ps3 is a bad piece of hardware, it isn't... but it's nothing super special above the 360, and was mentioned... making it a forced flagship for an optical format of Sony's choosing was a bad move. So it's a good piece of hardware with "bloat", being backed by a very confident company that borders on arrogance in many of it's actions. It's time for Sony to take their time out in the corner and learn the same lesson others have, they can't rest on their laurels forever... they have to actually act like they want to stay in the lead, not like they are the guaranteed king.
Sorry Electric Groove. This forum is cliquier then a bunch of 15 year old school girls. No one here cares that you just spoke truth. So it's left to me, the utterly despised. What do you think makes the 360 anything other then another failure?
Own a 360 & PS3, as far as worthwhile titles thus far - I had a blast with Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Resistance is as good if not better than Gears of War (which I also enjoyed.) If your into small arcade games Super Stardust HD has sucked away quite a few hours of my life. Honestly I'm looking forward to PS3 exclusives coming out this year than the 360, got folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank future all hitting before the holidays. For multiplatform your still looking at Army of Two, Kane & Lynch, as well as Stranglehold.
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
The reality is even though you are looking forward to folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank more, they probably won't sell as much combined as Halo 3 will. Sony doesn't have anything coming for a while that is going to move systems like Halo will.
final fantasy 13 and final fantasy versus 13
metal gear solid 4
?
and don't you dare say "OLO RUMORS OF MGS 4 on 360"
final fantasy 13 and final fantasy versus 13
metal gear solid 4
?
and don't you dare say "OLO RUMORS OF MGS 4 on 360"
He said "for a while." Halo 3 is coming very soon. MGS4 isn't coming until January-March 2008, and FFXIII and Versus XIII till like 2009 or something.
Ayup.
I am actually kind of interested to see how August plays out. Madden 08 could move a lot of next gen systems. Which systems though? You would think with it running better on the 360, a cheaper price and halo just around the corner it would move 360s like crazy. But I still know a couple people who are determined to get a PS3 for their Madden fix for no other reason than they are used to gaming on the playstation. It boggles the mind.
Own a 360 & PS3, as far as worthwhile titles thus far - I had a blast with Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Resistance is as good if not better than Gears of War (which I also enjoyed.) If your into small arcade games Super Stardust HD has sucked away quite a few hours of my life. Honestly I'm looking forward to PS3 exclusives coming out this year than the 360, got folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank future all hitting before the holidays. For multiplatform your still looking at Army of Two, Kane & Lynch, as well as Stranglehold.
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
The reality is even though you are looking forward to folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank more, they probably won't sell as much combined as Halo 3 will. Sony doesn't have anything coming for a while that is going to move systems like Halo will.
final fantasy 13 and final fantasy versus 13
metal gear solid 4
?
and don't you dare say "OLO RUMORS OF MGS 4 on 360"
And it's all come around full circle again. The one common answer to this age old question of "Is the PS3 fucked or not".
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Seriously, why don't we stop the endless debate and just wait for them? Everybody seems to think that the ultimate fate of the PS3 is resting on those 2 game's shoulders. Barring some completely out of left field game that gets released in the next 5-6 months that becomes THE must have game of the century and EVERYBODY rushes for a PS3, nothing is likely to change. People will say it's boned, others will say it's fine, and that phrase will be repeated every few pages. "Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
The Wolfman on
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
Was MS correct in assuming that the company to release the console first in the generation wins? Was it really that simple?
No.
YES!
But seriously it seems like everything they are benefitting from now stem from that choice. Although I did feel like the Xbox had premature death at the time but now...
It makes sense. Where would MS be right now if they launched same month as PS3?
I am actually kind of interested to see how August plays out. Madden 08 could move a lot of next gen systems. Which systems though? You would think with it running better on the 360, a cheaper price and halo just around the corner it would move 360s like crazy. But I still know a couple people who are determined to get a PS3 for their Madden fix for no other reason than they are used to gaming on the playstation. It boggles the mind.
Yeah. It should be an interesting fall to say the least. Especially for those with all three systems trying to decide what to buy and what to wait on. I'm kinda happy and sad at the same time that I'm to poor to own anything more than my Wii (which I only own because my girlfriend demanded I get one). On one hand, I'm missing out on lots of stuff. On the other hand, I don't have to many decisions to make. On the third hand, I'll play all that other stuff when its either cheaper or I'm richer. I'm not a fan of online gaming, so missing out on those communities isn't a big loss to me. Really, I can't wait until this gen hits that $100 price point where I can own everything without spending an arm and a leg on it.
Own a 360 & PS3, as far as worthwhile titles thus far - I had a blast with Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Resistance is as good if not better than Gears of War (which I also enjoyed.) If your into small arcade games Super Stardust HD has sucked away quite a few hours of my life. Honestly I'm looking forward to PS3 exclusives coming out this year than the 360, got folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank future all hitting before the holidays. For multiplatform your still looking at Army of Two, Kane & Lynch, as well as Stranglehold.
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
The reality is even though you are looking forward to folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank more, they probably won't sell as much combined as Halo 3 will. Sony doesn't have anything coming for a while that is going to move systems like Halo will.
final fantasy 13 and final fantasy versus 13
metal gear solid 4
?
and don't you dare say "OLO RUMORS OF MGS 4 on 360"
And it's all come around full circle again. The one common answer to this age old question of "Is the PS3 fucked or not".
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Seriously, why don't we stop the endless debate and just wait for them? Everybody seems to think that the ultimate fate of the PS3 is resting on those 2 game's shoulders. Barring some completely out of left field game that gets released in the next 5-6 months that becomes THE must have game of the century and EVERYBODY rushes for a PS3, nothing is likely to change. People will say it's boned, others will say it's fine, and that phrase will be repeated every few pages. "Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Nintendo fans said the same thing last generation. Wait until Zelda and Mario! Wait until Resident Evil 4, etc.
Was MS correct in assuming that the company to release the console first in the generation wins? Was it really that simple?
No.
YES!
But seriously it seems like everything they are benefitting from now stem from that choice. Although I did feel like the Xbox had premature death at the time but now...
It makes sense. Where would MS be right now if they launched same month as PS3?
I think their success probably has more to do with how they have treated developers ( ie dev tools and money) and their price point. Although I don't think it hurt them getting to the market first, by a year even. That is a nice head start anyway you cut it.
Own a 360 & PS3, as far as worthwhile titles thus far - I had a blast with Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Resistance is as good if not better than Gears of War (which I also enjoyed.) If your into small arcade games Super Stardust HD has sucked away quite a few hours of my life. Honestly I'm looking forward to PS3 exclusives coming out this year than the 360, got folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank future all hitting before the holidays. For multiplatform your still looking at Army of Two, Kane & Lynch, as well as Stranglehold.
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
The reality is even though you are looking forward to folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank more, they probably won't sell as much combined as Halo 3 will. Sony doesn't have anything coming for a while that is going to move systems like Halo will.
final fantasy 13 and final fantasy versus 13
metal gear solid 4
?
and don't you dare say "OLO RUMORS OF MGS 4 on 360"
And it's all come around full circle again. The one common answer to this age old question of "Is the PS3 fucked or not".
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Seriously, why don't we stop the endless debate and just wait for them? Everybody seems to think that the ultimate fate of the PS3 is resting on those 2 game's shoulders. Barring some completely out of left field game that gets released in the next 5-6 months that becomes THE must have game of the century and EVERYBODY rushes for a PS3, nothing is likely to change. People will say it's boned, others will say it's fine, and that phrase will be repeated every few pages. "Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
but he said the ps3 didn't have anything that would sell as well as Halo 3
i just read it wrong slightly
i wasn't saying mgs4 and ff13 are going to be the ps3s saving grace and just you wait
Sorry Electric Groove. This forum is cliquier then a bunch of 15 year old school girls. No one here cares that you just spoke truth. So it's left to me, the utterly despised. What do you think makes the 360 anything other then another failure?
Well, define "another failure"? Was the oXbox a failure? I don't think so, otherwise Ms would have turned out like 3DO. It certainly wasn't the top seller, nor was it even an arguably close second place to the PS2, it was just a good solid console that had no chance against the ps2 last gen in terms of sales or market penetration.
This gen is obviously much different so far, as it's proving to be a better seller than the PS3 by a fairly wide margin. Not taking the Wii into at the moment however, as I really want to see how the games fare over the holidays this year... I think that will show the Wii's place in the scheme of things.
However, MS did a lot right with the Xbox, and they continue to do so with the 360... not perfect mind you, but good. Similar with Sony, they did ok with the PS2, but pretty good with the PS3 (strictly hardware here folks).
However, what makes the 360 not be a failure (at the moment) is the same thing that made the PS2 such a hit in the beginning. They came on the market with weak competition (Dreamcast for PS2, and nothing for 360), had some decent launch games (not great, but enough to tide over), a good selection of backwards compatible games (and the live arcade for 360), at a price that was right on the money. Additionally, both companies were good about making sure their systems were a known quantity, with an established pedigree if you will, and made sure to keep themselves in the gamers minds.
This let the PS2 obliterate the Dreamcast at the time, and snowball itself into the smashing success we all know. And it's letting the 360 do some serious damage to Sony's hopes of success.
The Wii was the unknown factor however... if it had flopped the 360 would be an undeniable beast right now... but, the Wii didn't flop... but it's impact on the console market as a whole is still an unknown quantity right now.
Own a 360 & PS3, as far as worthwhile titles thus far - I had a blast with Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Resistance is as good if not better than Gears of War (which I also enjoyed.) If your into small arcade games Super Stardust HD has sucked away quite a few hours of my life. Honestly I'm looking forward to PS3 exclusives coming out this year than the 360, got folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank future all hitting before the holidays. For multiplatform your still looking at Army of Two, Kane & Lynch, as well as Stranglehold.
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
The reality is even though you are looking forward to folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank more, they probably won't sell as much combined as Halo 3 will. Sony doesn't have anything coming for a while that is going to move systems like Halo will.
final fantasy 13 and final fantasy versus 13
metal gear solid 4
?
and don't you dare say "OLO RUMORS OF MGS 4 on 360"
And it's all come around full circle again. The one common answer to this age old question of "Is the PS3 fucked or not".
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Seriously, why don't we stop the endless debate and just wait for them? Everybody seems to think that the ultimate fate of the PS3 is resting on those 2 game's shoulders. Barring some completely out of left field game that gets released in the next 5-6 months that becomes THE must have game of the century and EVERYBODY rushes for a PS3, nothing is likely to change. People will say it's boned, others will say it's fine, and that phrase will be repeated every few pages. "Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Nintendo fans said the same thing last generation. Wait until Zelda and Mario! Wait until Resident Evil 4, etc.
Never turned anything around.
... So what hope does the Sony's game division have? To win the Blu-ray/HD-DVD war but loose the console war?
Own a 360 & PS3, as far as worthwhile titles thus far - I had a blast with Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Resistance is as good if not better than Gears of War (which I also enjoyed.) If your into small arcade games Super Stardust HD has sucked away quite a few hours of my life. Honestly I'm looking forward to PS3 exclusives coming out this year than the 360, got folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank future all hitting before the holidays. For multiplatform your still looking at Army of Two, Kane & Lynch, as well as Stranglehold.
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
The reality is even though you are looking forward to folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank more, they probably won't sell as much combined as Halo 3 will. Sony doesn't have anything coming for a while that is going to move systems like Halo will.
final fantasy 13 and final fantasy versus 13
metal gear solid 4
?
and don't you dare say "OLO RUMORS OF MGS 4 on 360"
And it's all come around full circle again. The one common answer to this age old question of "Is the PS3 fucked or not".
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Seriously, why don't we stop the endless debate and just wait for them? Everybody seems to think that the ultimate fate of the PS3 is resting on those 2 game's shoulders. Barring some completely out of left field game that gets released in the next 5-6 months that becomes THE must have game of the century and EVERYBODY rushes for a PS3, nothing is likely to change. People will say it's boned, others will say it's fine, and that phrase will be repeated every few pages. "Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Nintendo fans said the same thing last generation. Wait until Zelda and Mario! Wait until Resident Evil 4, etc.
Never turned anything around.
... So what hope does the Sony's game division have? To win the Blu-ray/HD-DVD war but loose the console war?
wait until heavenly sword, ratchet and clank, littlebigplanet ect.
I don't know if this data exists, but who are the people who are buying the various consoles? Obviously a lot of the 360 owners were X-box fans, and probably most of the Wii owners are either Nintendo fans or the previously elusive "new" and "lapsed" gamers, but what are the PS2 fans from last generation playing now? Obviously the majority of them aren't buying PS3s, so have they switched teams or are they just hanging onto their PS2s and waiting for a good reason to buy the PS3 in the form of a price drop and some strong exclusives?
I'm not a gamer in the way that a lot of the people around here are, but anyone can see that there is some very strong loyalty among the faithful for each of the major consoles. Is this just coming from a very vocal minority which has already purchased its console of choice for this generation, or are there actually millions of pureblood Sony fans out there who are just waiting on a price drop or a particular exclusive? I personally find this second scenario unlikely but, hey, I'm a casual right? What do I know? If there are a lot of Sony fans just biding their time, Sony could potentially come back and at least give the 360 a good run for its money.
I don't see the Wii being toppled just because of the casual market, which is potentially much larger than the entire hardcore market (we won't know how large until Wii supply catches up with demand) and is almost entirely in Nintendo's pocket.
Was MS correct in assuming that the company to release the console first in the generation wins? Was it really that simple?
No.
YES!
But seriously it seems like everything they are benefitting from now stem from that choice. Although I did feel like the Xbox had premature death at the time but now...
It makes sense. Where would MS be right now if they launched same month as PS3?
I think their success probably has more to do with how they have treated developers ( ie dev tools and money) and their price point. Although I don't think it hurt them getting to the market first, by a year even. That is a nice head start anyway you cut it.
I don't think this is really true, if you look here it seems to me that the xbox360 is only selling slightly better if you align the launches and the only thing that is making it the success that it is was being released earlier and as such has a larger base now.
Is vgcharts accurate or not? I've never seen anyone mention them on this forum but it seems like a decent play to get info as they have that nice chart setup. If its not then just ignore what I said above.
I don't know if this data exists, but who are the people who are buying the various consoles? Obviously a lot of the 360 owners were X-box fans, and probably most of the Wii owners are either Nintendo fans or the previously elusive "new" and "lapsed" gamers, but what are the PS2 fans from last generation playing now? Obviously the majority of them aren't buying PS3s, so have they switched teams or are they just hanging onto their PS2s and waiting for a good reason to buy the PS3 in the form of a price drop and some strong exclusives?
I'm not a gamer in the way that a lot of the people around here are, but anyone can see that there is some very strong loyalty among the faithful for each of the major consoles. Is this just coming from a very vocal minority which has already purchased its console of choice for this generation, or are there actually millions of pureblood Sony fans out there who are just waiting on a price drop or a particular exclusive? I personally find this second scenario unlikely but, hey, I'm a casual right? What do I know? If there are a lot of Sony fans just biding their time, Sony could potentially come back and at least give the 360 a good run for its money.
I don't see the Wii being toppled just because of the casual market, which is potentially much larger than the entire hardcore market (we won't know how large until Wii supply catches up with demand) and is almost entirely in Nintendo's pocket.
everyone has a ps2
i mean everyone
so you can expect not all of those 120 million people (and growing) who have ps2s not to be diehard sony fans and are playing their 360s and wiis right now
i'd imagine a lot of ps3 owners are also one of the few who didn't have a ps2 / psx and got it for backwards compatibility and others have one for blu-ray
wait until heavenly sword, ratchet and clank, littlebigplanet ect.
You mean all 0 of those system-selling games? One of which is getting generally "meh" previews (Heavenly Sword), another in a franchise that already passed its prime (R&C) and another one that's a glorified tech demo?
Then again, Wii Sports is basically a tech demo and it sold systems. So who knows. People will buy the dumbest shit.
Was MS correct in assuming that the company to release the console first in the generation wins? Was it really that simple?
hahaha. one would think that was their motto or determination.
Really what MS had a jumpstart on in this gen was LIVE! people are playing more games of UNO on live than they are playing store bought games. Social Entropy is winning their console war. It has produced the MS Fanboi, that I hate even more than a Sony Fanboy. MS has already announced a price drop on the console in August to combat the price drop of the PS3. If they are so confident and the price of hardware is still costing them money, why even make this price drop ? I have a good feeling that the only thing that will survive the Xbox360 is LIVE!, just like it did with XBOX. The console will be the first to fade out and replaced, but not until MS is sure they will be able to beat Sony in any type of tricks they might produce in the 2008.
Nintendo releases the Wii , a console that puts the most control in a users hands since, the Virtual Gameboy. A great idea for gameplay but now takes a huge shot for graphics. To think they would be the first console to fade out in the next 3 years though is crazy. Unlike the luck with the Dreamcast, there is no company that will attack Nintendo directly for shelf space. They will just not see them as a threat and continue to produce around them. The Wii will just be a console that is around and people who like it will play it.
As for Sony, though they did nothing but release an entertainment center with a suped up PS2, the PS3 will be the console to last. It provides you with, in my opinion, the format of the future as well as games that push the mark. The launch list was not great, but I expect like the PS2 the PS3 will have many different versions of the console. This is where Sony will be able to pull out more tricks to enhance experience. There were 12 version of the PS2 , I can only assume the PS3 will have multiple versions. Peripherals could also be a big move for Sony, with six-axis controllers there was early speculation that they could mimic the Wii controller's game interaction.
I have hope that Sony will be the lead out of the current 3, but there will always be competition. I never have been much of a Sony fan, but I have always hated Microsoft. So my opinion is of course biased in that sense.
Sorry Electric Groove. This forum is cliquier then a bunch of 15 year old school girls. No one here cares that you just spoke truth. So it's left to me, the utterly despised. What do you think makes the 360 anything other then another failure?
Well, define "another failure"? Was the oXbox a failure? I don't think so, otherwise Ms would have turned out like 3DO. It certainly wasn't the top seller, nor was it even an arguably close second place to the PS2, it was just a good solid console that had no chance against the ps2 last gen in terms of sales or market penetration.
Well, if you consider a "failure" as a product that loses a company money, then the entire Xbox line has been an utter failure.
At least the 3D0 made enough money to fund countless Army Men games and researching into the M2 technology, the rights of which were sold for a billion dollars, so as far as making money goes, the 3D0 was not a failure.
Hell, my cardboard SlurpeeBox 5000 game system is a smashing success compared to the PS3 and the Xboxen only because it hasn't cost me billions of dollars.
Mass Effect, Halo Wars, GTA downloadable content, Halo 3 downloadable content, Fable 2,Splinter Cell Conviction, Whatever Rare has up it's sleeve, another price drop. It's not going to stop raining anytime soon you know.
Not to mention the freezing wind.
Galaxy, SmashBros, Siims, Blue Ocean and the deluge of third parties finally getting into the action.
I seriously "want" Sony in 3rd place this gen. Not a debatable third, solid, no questions asked, even in Japan, third.
Why? Because it will hopefully make them actually try and bring it to the table in a SERIOUS effort. No resting on their laurels, no reliance on brand name, but a serious ass kicking attempt to be great.
Nintendo had their time in the sun, got cocky as hell, and then got hit with the 1-2 punch of the N64 and the Gamecube. Their answer? The Wii.
Sega got smacked with a lot, the Sega CD, the 32x, and the Saturn. Their answer? The Dreamcast, and by no fault of the system they are gone.
Microsoft came out fighting with the Xbox, and even with a respectable showing, they hit us all up with the 360.
While none of the "answer" systems is perfect, it reflects a profound change from the systems before it, along with a company backing it that is much changed from what it was previously.
If Microsoft came and dominated this generation and then released an Xbox3 that was essentially a slightly more powerful 360, I'd want them to go down too.
Not to say the ps3 is a bad piece of hardware, it isn't... but it's nothing super special above the 360, and was mentioned... making it a forced flagship for an optical format of Sony's choosing was a bad move. So it's a good piece of hardware with "bloat", being backed by a very confident company that borders on arrogance in many of it's actions. It's time for Sony to take their time out in the corner and learn the same lesson others have, they can't rest on their laurels forever... they have to actually act like they want to stay in the lead, not like they are the guaranteed king.
Sorry Electric Groove. This forum is cliquier then a bunch of 15 year old school girls. No one here cares that you just spoke truth. So it's left to me, the utterly despised. What do you think makes the 360 anything other then another failure?
Actually, it's because this sentiment has been said over and over. Few people here want Sony to pull out completely from the console market; and most people want them to make a more accessible/awesome console next time. This board is fairly sane compared to gamefaqs and its ilk.
I don't know if this data exists, but who are the people who are buying the various consoles? Obviously a lot of the 360 owners were X-box fans, and probably most of the Wii owners are either Nintendo fans or the previously elusive "new" and "lapsed" gamers, but what are the PS2 fans from last generation playing now? Obviously the majority of them aren't buying PS3s, so have they switched teams or are they just hanging onto their PS2s and waiting for a good reason to buy the PS3 in the form of a price drop and some strong exclusives?
I'm not a gamer in the way that a lot of the people around here are, but anyone can see that there is some very strong loyalty among the faithful for each of the major consoles. Is this just coming from a very vocal minority which has already purchased its console of choice for this generation, or are there actually millions of pureblood Sony fans out there who are just waiting on a price drop or a particular exclusive? I personally find this second scenario unlikely but, hey, I'm a casual right? What do I know? If there are a lot of Sony fans just biding their time, Sony could potentially come back and at least give the 360 a good run for its money.
I don't see the Wii being toppled just because of the casual market, which is potentially much larger than the entire hardcore market (we won't know how large until Wii supply catches up with demand) and is almost entirely in Nintendo's pocket.
I don't think the mainstream is "loyal" to anyone. Nintendo used to be the big shot in the industry, then they fucked up and Sony took over. Now the role seems to be reversing again.
wait until heavenly sword, ratchet and clank, littlebigplanet ect.
You mean all 0 of those system-selling games? One of which is getting generally "meh" previews (Heavenly Sword), another in a franchise that already passed its prime (R&C) and another one that's a glorified tech demo?
Then again, Wii Sports is basically a tech demo and it sold systems. So who knows. People will buy the dumbest shit.
of course games like those aren't going to sell a system (also i've heard a lot of praise for heavenly sword and it's only a like 5 minute demo)
but when
lair (average i know)
heavenly sword
ratchet and clank future
littlebigplanet
haze (timed i know)
UT 2007 (timed i know)
tekken 6
ect
are all coming out this holiday season, when someone looks at all those, that will probably sell systems
I actually am starting to think that Sony is headed for third place this round - in the US. I think overall worldwide we could see it in 2nd thanks to Japan's hatred of Microsoft.
The fact is, more and more developers are moving money away from the PS3 and towards 360 and especially Wii. I think the biggest tell for the PS3 (and I'll admit it's a ways off) will be next year's gaming conventions when we see just how much that shift has hurt/helped the various consoles.
MGS and Final Fantasy don't matter as much as they would have a few years ago - so many huge titles have gone multiconsole and so many "exclusive" titles have been rereleased later with extras for other consoles that most gamers aren't going to jump immediately over to a console for one or two exclusives. If gamers maybe have been burned by past "exclusives" and start taking a wait and see attitude as a whole, buying a console for those few games gets less and less likely.
EDIT: And to give some input to the person asking where the PS2 gamers have ended up that didn't go PS3 - I'm one of them, I sold my PS2 and have switched entirely to Nintendo - the DS pulled me back to the Nintendo fold after not owning any of their systems since the NES and Gameboy Pocket. My love of the DS convinced me to go Wii.
All this 'wait until insert title X' talk seems pointless to me. Because that's what Sony's doing - they're waiting for Miracle AAA Title X to save their asses when they should be spending every waking second finding someway, anyway, to drive down the price of the PS3 to an acceptable level. I don't care if Jesus Christ shows up on the PS3 in 18 months, if they don't find a way to get the price of entry below that of the 360 by the time the holiday rush hits they're done this time around.
By the time FFXIII et al drop Halo will have sold several million new 360s and most gamers will still be cursing over the dough they've dropped recently over Bioshock, Mass Effect, Galaxy, Brawl, MP3, Halo 3, etc, etc, etc. A few choice titles will not save the PS3 it's last place slot anymore than they saved the GameCube last time around. Only a truly epic price drop can do that now (unlikely), and that's only IF their competition remains at a static pricepoint (also unlikely).
wait until heavenly sword, ratchet and clank, littlebigplanet ect.
You mean all 0 of those system-selling games? One of which is getting generally "meh" previews (Heavenly Sword), another in a franchise that already passed its prime (R&C) and another one that's a glorified tech demo?
Then again, Wii Sports is basically a tech demo and it sold systems. So who knows. People will buy the dumbest shit.
of course games like those aren't going to sell a system (also i've heard a lot of praise for heavenly sword and it's only a like 5 minute demo)
but when
lair (average i know)
heavenly sword
ratchet and clank future
littlebigplanet
haze (timed i know)
UT 2007 (timed i know)
tekken 6
ect
are all coming out this holiday season, when someone looks at all those, that will probably sell systems
Mass Effect, Halo Wars, GTA downloadable content, Halo 3 downloadable content, Fable 2,Splinter Cell Conviction, Whatever Rare has up it's sleeve, another price drop. It's not going to stop raining anytime soon you know.
Not to mention the freezing wind.
Galaxy, SmashBros, Siims, Blue Ocean and the deluge of third parties finally getting into the action.
But you're right, HAZE, Tekken and Heavenly Sword will get customer attention and UT, Ratchet and Lair will real them in, Sony definitely has a hand to play.
I have. If you can call it that. It felt more like I pressed a few buttons, watched a movie for a few minutes, and then sat there, bewildered.
The only thing cool about it was the style-switching. And that's not enough to save it. Oh, and it looks nice.
see this is why listing games never worked
i could list 20 ps3 games set to come out to some wii owner and he could pick each game and say "oh that doesn't interest me too much" "i heard it's average" "could care less" "i guess that one's good" and it's happened before.
Quality is subjective, and if you like Heavenly Sword, that's your deal. But if you think a new IP from an unproven developer is going to sell systems, you're sorely mistaken.
Posts
Armored Core is out on the 360 was just playing it yesterday.
Ah, my bad. I guess the PS3 has fewer redeeming characteristics than I thought
I would have agreed with the PS3 third place argument a couple months back but I think Sony is heading in the right direction, It would not suprise me a single bit if they overtake MS at some point.
The reality is even though you are looking forward to folklore, heavenly sword, drakes fortune, and ratchet and clank more, they probably won't sell as much combined as Halo 3 will. Sony doesn't have anything coming for a while that is going to move systems like Halo will.
Sorry Electric Groove. This forum is cliquier then a bunch of 15 year old school girls. No one here cares that you just spoke truth. So it's left to me, the utterly despised. What do you think makes the 360 anything other then another failure?
final fantasy 13 and final fantasy versus 13
metal gear solid 4
?
and don't you dare say "OLO RUMORS OF MGS 4 on 360"
Why are you concerned about the snowball effect?
He said "for a while." Halo 3 is coming very soon. MGS4 isn't coming until January-March 2008, and FFXIII and Versus XIII till like 2009 or something.
Ayup.
I am actually kind of interested to see how August plays out. Madden 08 could move a lot of next gen systems. Which systems though? You would think with it running better on the 360, a cheaper price and halo just around the corner it would move 360s like crazy. But I still know a couple people who are determined to get a PS3 for their Madden fix for no other reason than they are used to gaming on the playstation. It boggles the mind.
And it's all come around full circle again. The one common answer to this age old question of "Is the PS3 fucked or not".
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
Seriously, why don't we stop the endless debate and just wait for them? Everybody seems to think that the ultimate fate of the PS3 is resting on those 2 game's shoulders. Barring some completely out of left field game that gets released in the next 5-6 months that becomes THE must have game of the century and EVERYBODY rushes for a PS3, nothing is likely to change. People will say it's boned, others will say it's fine, and that phrase will be repeated every few pages. "Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
"Just wait for MGS4 and FFXIII. Then we'll see..."
No.
YES!
But seriously it seems like everything they are benefitting from now stem from that choice. Although I did feel like the Xbox had premature death at the time but now...
It makes sense. Where would MS be right now if they launched same month as PS3?
Nintendo fans said the same thing last generation. Wait until Zelda and Mario! Wait until Resident Evil 4, etc.
Never turned anything around.
I think their success probably has more to do with how they have treated developers ( ie dev tools and money) and their price point. Although I don't think it hurt them getting to the market first, by a year even. That is a nice head start anyway you cut it.
but he said the ps3 didn't have anything that would sell as well as Halo 3
i just read it wrong slightly
i wasn't saying mgs4 and ff13 are going to be the ps3s saving grace and just you wait
Well, define "another failure"? Was the oXbox a failure? I don't think so, otherwise Ms would have turned out like 3DO. It certainly wasn't the top seller, nor was it even an arguably close second place to the PS2, it was just a good solid console that had no chance against the ps2 last gen in terms of sales or market penetration.
This gen is obviously much different so far, as it's proving to be a better seller than the PS3 by a fairly wide margin. Not taking the Wii into at the moment however, as I really want to see how the games fare over the holidays this year... I think that will show the Wii's place in the scheme of things.
However, MS did a lot right with the Xbox, and they continue to do so with the 360... not perfect mind you, but good. Similar with Sony, they did ok with the PS2, but pretty good with the PS3 (strictly hardware here folks).
However, what makes the 360 not be a failure (at the moment) is the same thing that made the PS2 such a hit in the beginning. They came on the market with weak competition (Dreamcast for PS2, and nothing for 360), had some decent launch games (not great, but enough to tide over), a good selection of backwards compatible games (and the live arcade for 360), at a price that was right on the money. Additionally, both companies were good about making sure their systems were a known quantity, with an established pedigree if you will, and made sure to keep themselves in the gamers minds.
This let the PS2 obliterate the Dreamcast at the time, and snowball itself into the smashing success we all know. And it's letting the 360 do some serious damage to Sony's hopes of success.
The Wii was the unknown factor however... if it had flopped the 360 would be an undeniable beast right now... but, the Wii didn't flop... but it's impact on the console market as a whole is still an unknown quantity right now.
... So what hope does the Sony's game division have? To win the Blu-ray/HD-DVD war but loose the console war?
wait until heavenly sword, ratchet and clank, littlebigplanet ect.
I'm not a gamer in the way that a lot of the people around here are, but anyone can see that there is some very strong loyalty among the faithful for each of the major consoles. Is this just coming from a very vocal minority which has already purchased its console of choice for this generation, or are there actually millions of pureblood Sony fans out there who are just waiting on a price drop or a particular exclusive? I personally find this second scenario unlikely but, hey, I'm a casual right? What do I know? If there are a lot of Sony fans just biding their time, Sony could potentially come back and at least give the 360 a good run for its money.
I don't see the Wii being toppled just because of the casual market, which is potentially much larger than the entire hardcore market (we won't know how large until Wii supply catches up with demand) and is almost entirely in Nintendo's pocket.
I don't think this is really true, if you look here it seems to me that the xbox360 is only selling slightly better if you align the launches and the only thing that is making it the success that it is was being released earlier and as such has a larger base now.
Is vgcharts accurate or not? I've never seen anyone mention them on this forum but it seems like a decent play to get info as they have that nice chart setup. If its not then just ignore what I said above.
everyone has a ps2
i mean everyone
so you can expect not all of those 120 million people (and growing) who have ps2s not to be diehard sony fans and are playing their 360s and wiis right now
i'd imagine a lot of ps3 owners are also one of the few who didn't have a ps2 / psx and got it for backwards compatibility and others have one for blu-ray
You mean all 0 of those system-selling games? One of which is getting generally "meh" previews (Heavenly Sword), another in a franchise that already passed its prime (R&C) and another one that's a glorified tech demo?
Then again, Wii Sports is basically a tech demo and it sold systems. So who knows. People will buy the dumbest shit.
hahaha. one would think that was their motto or determination.
Really what MS had a jumpstart on in this gen was LIVE! people are playing more games of UNO on live than they are playing store bought games. Social Entropy is winning their console war. It has produced the MS Fanboi, that I hate even more than a Sony Fanboy. MS has already announced a price drop on the console in August to combat the price drop of the PS3. If they are so confident and the price of hardware is still costing them money, why even make this price drop ? I have a good feeling that the only thing that will survive the Xbox360 is LIVE!, just like it did with XBOX. The console will be the first to fade out and replaced, but not until MS is sure they will be able to beat Sony in any type of tricks they might produce in the 2008.
Nintendo releases the Wii , a console that puts the most control in a users hands since, the Virtual Gameboy. A great idea for gameplay but now takes a huge shot for graphics. To think they would be the first console to fade out in the next 3 years though is crazy. Unlike the luck with the Dreamcast, there is no company that will attack Nintendo directly for shelf space. They will just not see them as a threat and continue to produce around them. The Wii will just be a console that is around and people who like it will play it.
As for Sony, though they did nothing but release an entertainment center with a suped up PS2, the PS3 will be the console to last. It provides you with, in my opinion, the format of the future as well as games that push the mark. The launch list was not great, but I expect like the PS2 the PS3 will have many different versions of the console. This is where Sony will be able to pull out more tricks to enhance experience. There were 12 version of the PS2 , I can only assume the PS3 will have multiple versions. Peripherals could also be a big move for Sony, with six-axis controllers there was early speculation that they could mimic the Wii controller's game interaction.
I have hope that Sony will be the lead out of the current 3, but there will always be competition. I never have been much of a Sony fan, but I have always hated Microsoft. So my opinion is of course biased in that sense.
Well, if you consider a "failure" as a product that loses a company money, then the entire Xbox line has been an utter failure.
At least the 3D0 made enough money to fund countless Army Men games and researching into the M2 technology, the rights of which were sold for a billion dollars, so as far as making money goes, the 3D0 was not a failure.
Hell, my cardboard SlurpeeBox 5000 game system is a smashing success compared to the PS3 and the Xboxen only because it hasn't cost me billions of dollars.
Not to mention the freezing wind.
Galaxy, SmashBros, Siims, Blue Ocean and the deluge of third parties finally getting into the action.
Actually, it's because this sentiment has been said over and over. Few people here want Sony to pull out completely from the console market; and most people want them to make a more accessible/awesome console next time. This board is fairly sane compared to gamefaqs and its ilk.
I don't think the mainstream is "loyal" to anyone. Nintendo used to be the big shot in the industry, then they fucked up and Sony took over. Now the role seems to be reversing again.
of course games like those aren't going to sell a system (also i've heard a lot of praise for heavenly sword and it's only a like 5 minute demo)
but when
lair (average i know)
heavenly sword
ratchet and clank future
littlebigplanet
haze (timed i know)
UT 2007 (timed i know)
tekken 6
ect
are all coming out this holiday season, when someone looks at all those, that will probably sell systems
The fact is, more and more developers are moving money away from the PS3 and towards 360 and especially Wii. I think the biggest tell for the PS3 (and I'll admit it's a ways off) will be next year's gaming conventions when we see just how much that shift has hurt/helped the various consoles.
MGS and Final Fantasy don't matter as much as they would have a few years ago - so many huge titles have gone multiconsole and so many "exclusive" titles have been rereleased later with extras for other consoles that most gamers aren't going to jump immediately over to a console for one or two exclusives. If gamers maybe have been burned by past "exclusives" and start taking a wait and see attitude as a whole, buying a console for those few games gets less and less likely.
EDIT: And to give some input to the person asking where the PS2 gamers have ended up that didn't go PS3 - I'm one of them, I sold my PS2 and have switched entirely to Nintendo - the DS pulled me back to the Nintendo fold after not owning any of their systems since the NES and Gameboy Pocket. My love of the DS convinced me to go Wii.
By the time FFXIII et al drop Halo will have sold several million new 360s and most gamers will still be cursing over the dough they've dropped recently over Bioshock, Mass Effect, Galaxy, Brawl, MP3, Halo 3, etc, etc, etc. A few choice titles will not save the PS3 it's last place slot anymore than they saved the GameCube last time around. Only a truly epic price drop can do that now (unlikely), and that's only IF their competition remains at a static pricepoint (also unlikely).
Disregarding its effect on the PS3 sales, I hope you like action games where you can't jump and automatically block when you do nothing.
not jumping isn't going to be a problem if the game isn't designed for it
and blocking i don't have a problem with
have you played the demo? or are you judging it on what people have said
The only thing cool about it was the style-switching. And that's not enough to save it. Oh, and it looks nice.
That is what I was responding to when I types
But you're right, HAZE, Tekken and Heavenly Sword will get customer attention and UT, Ratchet and Lair will real them in, Sony definitely has a hand to play.
see this is why listing games never worked
i could list 20 ps3 games set to come out to some wii owner and he could pick each game and say "oh that doesn't interest me too much" "i heard it's average" "could care less" "i guess that one's good" and it's happened before.