Britain and Europe are full of the most beautiful Religous Buildings you can imagine.
But when you remember the evil, exploitative, disgusting fuedal system which was used to tythe generations of poverty stricken peasents to produce them - they lose a certain luster in my eyes.
I'm a Catholic, but I don't talk about it much because I strongly disagree with the Church on many things. Such as the Church's view on gay people and single mothers.
I believe in God and Jesus, but not in a way that makes much sense along modern Christian lines. See, I believe that God is a beneficent deity and that all religion are simply aspects of God. Pantheons included. I don't think God cares much what people call It. Zeus, Buddha, Yahweh, whatever. I also don't hold to the creed that only good Christians get to go to Heaven because to me that's a pretty raw deal. God, at least my interpretation of the divine spirit, only really cares that we're good human beings. It doesn't care what particular religious story you adhere to and really, most of the Big Rules can be boiled down to God saying "Don't be dicks to each other." Jesus was born as an incarnation of this spirit and died as a sacrifice, something people of the time would understand, to absolve all humanity of sin.
I believe there's a hell, but I also believe that we're not sent there by a divine judge. I believe that, in a way, it's our own conscience that sends us to hell. People can understand, within their own morality, whether or not an action is good or evil and if a person has done enough evil acts their own guilty conscience, whether a conscious decision or not, confines them to a realm of torment. Admittedly, this aspect of my belief was informed very much by reading The Sandman comic at an early age.
I also believe that God did not create humanity to be servants. I think It must be lonely. Imagine that, to be the one unique thing in anywhere. I imagine God created humanity and sentience in an effort to create, for Itself, an equal with which it might converse. We aren't there yet, and we won't be there for some time, but I believe that eventually humanity or some other sentience will be able to actually commune with the divine spirit. In this way, science itself is divine for it is through understanding the world and spaces around us that we mught become that much closer to God.
Boy, this post turned out much longer and way more serious than I intended.
What happens to atheists that live good lives and are compassionate toward their fellow man?
RandomEngy on
Profile -> Signature Settings -> Hide signatures always. Then you don't have to read this worthless text anymore.
Great. So my love of old buildings (not just including churches, btw) is merely a result of peer pressure, and the only logical response is to despise what you grew up with?
My response to Loren was light-hearted, you're just being a bit of a dick.
I'm a Catholic, but I don't talk about it much because I strongly disagree with the Church on many things. Such as the Church's view on gay people and single mothers.
I believe in God and Jesus, but not in a way that makes much sense along modern Christian lines. See, I believe that God is a beneficent deity and that all religion are simply aspects of God. Pantheons included. I don't think God cares much what people call It. Zeus, Buddha, Yahweh, whatever. I also don't hold to the creed that only good Christians get to go to Heaven because to me that's a pretty raw deal. God, at least my interpretation of the divine spirit, only really cares that we're good human beings. It doesn't care what particular religious story you adhere to and really, most of the Big Rules can be boiled down to God saying "Don't be dicks to each other." Jesus was born as an incarnation of this spirit and died as a sacrifice, something people of the time would understand, to absolve all humanity of sin.
I believe there's a hell, but I also believe that we're not sent there by a divine judge. I believe that, in a way, it's our own conscience that sends us to hell. People can understand, within their own morality, whether or not an action is good or evil and if a person has done enough evil acts their own guilty conscience, whether a conscious decision or not, confines them to a realm of torment. Admittedly, this aspect of my belief was informed very much by reading The Sandman comic at an early age.
I also believe that God did not create humanity to be servants. I think It must be lonely. Imagine that, to be the one unique thing in anywhere. I imagine God created humanity and sentience in an effort to create, for Itself, an equal with which it might converse. We aren't there yet, and we won't be there for some time, but I believe that eventually humanity or some other sentience will be able to actually commune with the divine spirit. In this way, science itself is divine for it is through understanding the world and spaces around us that we mught become that much closer to God.
Boy, this post turned out much longer and way more serious than I intended.
What happens to atheists that live good lives and are compassionate toward their fellow man?
I think if LibrarianThorne is right, then us good atheists are a-ok. Maybe read past catholic next time :P
Though to be fair, by LibrarianThorne's own description he's not technically a Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic Church. But then in the eyes of the catholic church almost no catholic people are.
Great. So my love of old buildings (not just including churches, btw) is merely a result of peer pressure, and the only logical response is to despise what you grew up with?
My response to Loren was light-hearted, you're just being a bit of a dick.
I'm a Catholic, but I don't talk about it much because I strongly disagree with the Church on many things. Such as the Church's view on gay people and single mothers.
I believe in God and Jesus, but not in a way that makes much sense along modern Christian lines. See, I believe that God is a beneficent deity and that all religion are simply aspects of God. Pantheons included. I don't think God cares much what people call It. Zeus, Buddha, Yahweh, whatever. I also don't hold to the creed that only good Christians get to go to Heaven because to me that's a pretty raw deal. God, at least my interpretation of the divine spirit, only really cares that we're good human beings. It doesn't care what particular religious story you adhere to and really, most of the Big Rules can be boiled down to God saying "Don't be dicks to each other." Jesus was born as an incarnation of this spirit and died as a sacrifice, something people of the time would understand, to absolve all humanity of sin.
I believe there's a hell, but I also believe that we're not sent there by a divine judge. I believe that, in a way, it's our own conscience that sends us to hell. People can understand, within their own morality, whether or not an action is good or evil and if a person has done enough evil acts their own guilty conscience, whether a conscious decision or not, confines them to a realm of torment. Admittedly, this aspect of my belief was informed very much by reading The Sandman comic at an early age.
I also believe that God did not create humanity to be servants. I think It must be lonely. Imagine that, to be the one unique thing in anywhere. I imagine God created humanity and sentience in an effort to create, for Itself, an equal with which it might converse. We aren't there yet, and we won't be there for some time, but I believe that eventually humanity or some other sentience will be able to actually commune with the divine spirit. In this way, science itself is divine for it is through understanding the world and spaces around us that we mught become that much closer to God.
Boy, this post turned out much longer and way more serious than I intended.
What happens to atheists that live good lives and are compassionate toward their fellow man?
I think if LibrarianThorne is right, then us good atheists are a-ok. Maybe read past catholic next time :P
Though to be fair, by LibrarianThorne's own description he's not technically a Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic Church. But then in the eyes of the catholic church almost no catholic people are.
Well, the bolded part is supported by the New Testament. So, I don't he's that far off. Well, ok, he's a bit out there.
I also believe that God did not create humanity to be servants. I think It must be lonely. Imagine that, to be the one unique thing in anywhere. I imagine God created humanity and sentience in an effort to create, for Itself, an equal with which it might converse. We aren't there yet, and we won't be there for some time, but I believe that eventually humanity or some other sentience will be able to actually commune with the divine spirit. In this way, science itself is divine for it is through understanding the world and spaces around us that we mught become that much closer to God.
"Companions the Creator seeks, not corpses, not herd and believers. Fellow creators the Creator seeks--those who write new values on new tablets. Companions the Creator seeks, and fellow harvesters; for everything about Him is ripe for the harvest."
Nietzche was a tool, but he did have a very very few good ideas.
I'm a Catholic, but I don't talk about it much because I strongly disagree with the Church on many things. Such as the Church's view on gay people and single mothers.
I believe in God and Jesus, but not in a way that makes much sense along modern Christian lines. See, I believe that God is a beneficent deity and that all religion are simply aspects of God. Pantheons included. I don't think God cares much what people call It. Zeus, Buddha, Yahweh, whatever. I also don't hold to the creed that only good Christians get to go to Heaven because to me that's a pretty raw deal. God, at least my interpretation of the divine spirit, only really cares that we're good human beings. It doesn't care what particular religious story you adhere to and really, most of the Big Rules can be boiled down to God saying "Don't be dicks to each other." Jesus was born as an incarnation of this spirit and died as a sacrifice, something people of the time would understand, to absolve all humanity of sin.
I believe there's a hell, but I also believe that we're not sent there by a divine judge. I believe that, in a way, it's our own conscience that sends us to hell. People can understand, within their own morality, whether or not an action is good or evil and if a person has done enough evil acts their own guilty conscience, whether a conscious decision or not, confines them to a realm of torment. Admittedly, this aspect of my belief was informed very much by reading The Sandman comic at an early age.
I also believe that God did not create humanity to be servants. I think It must be lonely. Imagine that, to be the one unique thing in anywhere. I imagine God created humanity and sentience in an effort to create, for Itself, an equal with which it might converse. We aren't there yet, and we won't be there for some time, but I believe that eventually humanity or some other sentience will be able to actually commune with the divine spirit. In this way, science itself is divine for it is through understanding the world and spaces around us that we mught become that much closer to God.
Boy, this post turned out much longer and way more serious than I intended.
What happens to atheists that live good lives and are compassionate toward their fellow man?
I think if LibrarianThorne is right, then us good atheists are a-ok. Maybe read past catholic next time :P
Though to be fair, by LibrarianThorne's own description he's not technically a Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic Church. But then in the eyes of the catholic church almost no catholic people are.
Well, the bolded part is supported by the New Testament. So, I don't he's that far off. Well, ok, he's a bit out there.
No... the bolded part is the exact opposite of the new testament.
I'm a Catholic, but I don't talk about it much because I strongly disagree with the Church on many things. Such as the Church's view on gay people and single mothers.
I believe in God and Jesus, but not in a way that makes much sense along modern Christian lines. See, I believe that God is a beneficent deity and that all religion are simply aspects of God. Pantheons included. I don't think God cares much what people call It. Zeus, Buddha, Yahweh, whatever. I also don't hold to the creed that only good Christians get to go to Heaven because to me that's a pretty raw deal. God, at least my interpretation of the divine spirit, only really cares that we're good human beings. It doesn't care what particular religious story you adhere to and really, most of the Big Rules can be boiled down to God saying "Don't be dicks to each other." Jesus was born as an incarnation of this spirit and died as a sacrifice, something people of the time would understand, to absolve all humanity of sin.
I believe there's a hell, but I also believe that we're not sent there by a divine judge. I believe that, in a way, it's our own conscience that sends us to hell. People can understand, within their own morality, whether or not an action is good or evil and if a person has done enough evil acts their own guilty conscience, whether a conscious decision or not, confines them to a realm of torment. Admittedly, this aspect of my belief was informed very much by reading The Sandman comic at an early age.
I also believe that God did not create humanity to be servants. I think It must be lonely. Imagine that, to be the one unique thing in anywhere. I imagine God created humanity and sentience in an effort to create, for Itself, an equal with which it might converse. We aren't there yet, and we won't be there for some time, but I believe that eventually humanity or some other sentience will be able to actually commune with the divine spirit. In this way, science itself is divine for it is through understanding the world and spaces around us that we mught become that much closer to God.
Boy, this post turned out much longer and way more serious than I intended.
What happens to atheists that live good lives and are compassionate toward their fellow man?
I think if LibrarianThorne is right, then us good atheists are a-ok. Maybe read past catholic next time :P
Though to be fair, by LibrarianThorne's own description he's not technically a Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic Church. But then in the eyes of the catholic church almost no catholic people are.
Well, the bolded part is supported by the New Testament. So, I don't he's that far off. Well, ok, he's a bit out there.
No... the bolded part is the exact opposite of the new testament.
I'm a Catholic, but I don't talk about it much because I strongly disagree with the Church on many things. Such as the Church's view on gay people and single mothers.
I believe in God and Jesus, but not in a way that makes much sense along modern Christian lines. See, I believe that God is a beneficent deity and that all religion are simply aspects of God. Pantheons included. I don't think God cares much what people call It. Zeus, Buddha, Yahweh, whatever. I also don't hold to the creed that only good Christians get to go to Heaven because to me that's a pretty raw deal. God, at least my interpretation of the divine spirit, only really cares that we're good human beings. It doesn't care what particular religious story you adhere to and really, most of the Big Rules can be boiled down to God saying "Don't be dicks to each other." Jesus was born as an incarnation of this spirit and died as a sacrifice, something people of the time would understand, to absolve all humanity of sin.
I believe there's a hell, but I also believe that we're not sent there by a divine judge. I believe that, in a way, it's our own conscience that sends us to hell. People can understand, within their own morality, whether or not an action is good or evil and if a person has done enough evil acts their own guilty conscience, whether a conscious decision or not, confines them to a realm of torment. Admittedly, this aspect of my belief was informed very much by reading The Sandman comic at an early age.
I also believe that God did not create humanity to be servants. I think It must be lonely. Imagine that, to be the one unique thing in anywhere. I imagine God created humanity and sentience in an effort to create, for Itself, an equal with which it might converse. We aren't there yet, and we won't be there for some time, but I believe that eventually humanity or some other sentience will be able to actually commune with the divine spirit. In this way, science itself is divine for it is through understanding the world and spaces around us that we mught become that much closer to God.
Boy, this post turned out much longer and way more serious than I intended.
What happens to atheists that live good lives and are compassionate toward their fellow man?
I think if LibrarianThorne is right, then us good atheists are a-ok. Maybe read past catholic next time :P
Though to be fair, by LibrarianThorne's own description he's not technically a Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic Church. But then in the eyes of the catholic church almost no catholic people are.
Well, the bolded part is supported by the New Testament. So, I don't he's that far off. Well, ok, he's a bit out there.
No it isn't.
And what I mean is that whilst certain parts may suggest that, others do not like:
Mark 16:15-16Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Thats a pretty strong tenant in every christian faith. Admitadly he then lists the super powers they will gain by doing such a thing (special tongue voices, and healing touch). The trick with being a Christian is selectively reading the bible and pretending your not doing so.
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God's sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
I'm a Mennonite. We're pretty cool. Not perfect by any means, that wikipedia article points out a bunch of things that many of us moderate to liberal Mennonites find embarrassing, like excommunicating of churches that accept practicing LGBT members. Fortunately a lot of that is a product of the older generation, and at least in our denomination is falling by the wayside.
Finding contradictory quotes in the bible is a passtime of mine. We could do this all day.
Years, and years ago I once made my religous education teacher threaten to throw me out the class, because on the theme of "how we find our morals in the bible" we were given a list of topics (do not kill, love thy neighbour, help people, support your family, and so on...) and we had to find quotes in the bible that backed up these ideas.
I made a list of all the ones that said the opposite.
The point is, no ones morals come from the bible, their current societies morals are mearly being reflected in the bible, by how their culture choses to enterpret it.
And what I mean is that whilst certain parts may suggest that, others do not like:
the bible wrote:
Mark 16:15-16Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Thats a pretty strong tenant in every christian faith. Admitadly he then lists the super powers they will gain by doing such a thing (special tongue voices, and healing touch). The trick with being a Christian is selectively reading the bible and pretending your not doing so.
Maybe if you read that as believeth in being not a rat-bastard. Go preach the word, so that more people may not be rat-bastards.
Anyway, the various Gospels and stuff have some discrepencies, partly because some of the disciples didn't really like each other. There's some great polemics in there. My take, is that as long as your religion tells you to not be a greedy, hateful ass or otherwise horrible person, its fine by me. If you in fact have no religion and are still not an ass and horrible person, then that is also cool.
And what I mean is that whilst certain parts may suggest that, others do not like:
the bible wrote:
Mark 16:15-16Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Thats a pretty strong tenant in every christian faith. Admitadly he then lists the super powers they will gain by doing such a thing (special tongue voices, and healing touch). The trick with being a Christian is selectively reading the bible and pretending your not doing so.
Maybe if you read that as believeth in being not a rat-bastard. Go preach the word, so that more people may not be rat-bastards.
Anyway, the various Gospels and stuff have some discrepencies, partly because some of the disciples didn't really like each other. There's some great polemics in there. My take, is that as long as your religion tells you to not be a greedy, hateful ass or otherwise horrible person, its fine by me. If you in fact have no religion and are still not an ass and horrible person, then that is also cool.
"Some", to me, is an understatment, but :^: to that bro. I don't care what you do or do not believe, as long as you behave like a good person, and obey the golden rule, of treating others like you would like to be treated.
But there is a lot of truth in the quote "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." (which I've forgotten who said). Not that, that is limited to God, like the Astrology fearing, Numerology loving miltary junta in Burma.
I was, thankfully, raised by two parents who had no interest whatsoever in exposing me to organized religion. I was never taken to church, never given a talk about religion--nothing. I never asked any questions either. To me religion always seemed so utterly alien that, as a child, religious people really, seriously frightened me. My grandparents would, on the rare occasions that I'd spend time with them sans parents, inevitably give me long talks about how I had to accept Jesus in order to get into heaven. I know on at least one occasion I called my mother crying and she came and picked me up about 48hrs earlier than planned because of my mortal terror of this strange, irrational devotion to things that I could see had no relevance to the real world.
I'm not scared of religion anymore, but I certainly don't respect it. I've never met a religious belief that can stand up to even the slightest real questioning and, I'm sorry, I don't respect people who feel like the best way to understand the universe is to wave your hands, make something up, and then jam your fingers in your ears so you don't have to hear all the reasons you're wrong.
Luckily religion is on the way out. It'll take a long, long time, but beginnings of a slide into irrelevancy are pretty obvious in my opinion. Lies can't win when the truth is available in every public library.
Heaven for Mormons is a place of eternal learning - where we get to catch up on what the Lord knows.
And in response on what happens to the good atheists, as far as the Mormon church goes they do baptisms by proxy in the temples for those who are dead and never had a chance to learn or choose to be a part of what we think is the true gospel, so their spirits, in a waiting ground with everyone else until the second coming, have a chance to choose weather or not they want to accept the Baptism, (followed by other ordnances). This is why genealogy is so important to us.
Are there any other beliefs that think something like this?
I have been raised as a member of Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland but I am not really into religion that much. Frankly, I don't believe in 90% of the things Bible says. I hold a stronger belief on science and research, and I get a morbid sense of joy whenever I see yet another fundamentalist completely wtfpwned by scientific proof.
I do believe in afterlife, because it would just be so...well, unfunny if there wasn't anything after death. Whetether it involves a god or not, I don't know.
I hope that when we die, we become invisible and intangible spirits that can move with faster then light speeds and explore the universe for forever, with endless amount of things to see.
Of course, it isn't very probable that this will happen.
Wonder Hippie, you do realize that you have heaven so wrong, don't you?
Heaven is defined as being in perfect bliss forever. That's its definition in most Christian circles. To say that's unappealing only betrays a lack of comprehension of the nature of the thing in question.
I've read several different interpretations of it. I suppose I can't find any pleasure in that because pleasurable things only feel good in contrast to things that aren't pleasurable. Being in a state like that would lose all meaning if there's nothing to compare it to.
Look, I'm with you on it not making a lick of sense, but it's not defined as "pleasurable but without anything to compare it to so it just becomes nothingness."
It's defined as "pleasure without end. Lots of pleasure. Heaps of it. Like orgasming 70 times while playing Halo 4 with a supermodel forever."
The fact that it is a nonsensical concept doesn't mean we have to misunderstand it.
I don't misunderstand it, I realize that the concept just seems to be just flooding your conciousness with happy juices. I don't like the idea of, if there is an afterlife, it being that or eternal suffering. I would rather there just not be an afterlife than either of those options, because they both involve removing everything that makes me actually like and enjoy conciousness.
I was Chrsitian for six months in college (everyone experiments in college.) It didn't stick, largely because I didn't like the Christians I was around.
After a year or so of waffling on my beliefs, I set out to prove Christianity one way or another. I grabbed a stack of books and tried to prove, one way or another, the basic tenent of Christianity: A man named Jesus was crucified and later came back to life. After going through several pro- and con- books on the issue, it quickly became evident that no one actually has any concrete proof one way or another.
Given that the central tenet of Christianity didn't appear provable or disprovable barring new evidence, I settled for Agnostic, where I remain today, waiting for new inofrmation to come to light.
The biggest consequence of my position is that I am absolutely terrified of death, since currently I have to believe that the lights go out and no one is home. That scares the piss out of me, and I envy religious people who have a sense that something else happens after we die.
Oh hey thanks for derailing this thread into justifying your personal beliefs, hippie. And thanks for following along, J and shrike. Funny how you're all jailed. You've got ten minutes to tell me why I shouldn't temp-ban all three of you.
That's what I think of an aspect of religion. I don't like it, and I was discussing it. I see absolutely no reason for you to call me a jackass. It's really getting absurd.
This thread has been pruned. You've made your position clear, grinding your axe in yet another religion thread is not the topic. Read the OP's later posts where he makes it perfectly clear that he wants to hear stories about other beliefs, not your blithering on for pages about how stupid you think other people's beliefs are. Get out of this thread.
Does anyone here fancy him or herself a pagan or some other kind of earth-worshipper?
I ask because I'm curious about what if any belief structure is involved, as I think the closest I've ever come to a real religious experience was being absolutely in the middle of nowhere on a hillside standing in the ruins of Rievalux Abbey near Yorkshire. Thirty minutes standing there seemed to justify thousands of years of earth worship and transcendentalism. It's a sight to behold, and an incredibly serene place to absorb
This thread has been pruned. You've made your position clear, grinding your axe in yet another religion thread is not the topic. Read the OP's later posts where he makes it perfectly clear that he wants to hear stories about other beliefs, not your blithering on for pages about how stupid you think other people's beliefs are. Get out of this thread.
In fact, everyone get out of this thread, because page 10 olol.
ElJeffe on
I submitted an entry to Lego Ideas, and if 10,000 people support me, it'll be turned into an actual Lego set!If you'd like to see and support my submission, follow this link.
Posts
And lack taste. :P
But when you remember the evil, exploitative, disgusting fuedal system which was used to tythe generations of poverty stricken peasents to produce them - they lose a certain luster in my eyes.
2009 is a year of Updates - one every Monday. Hopefully. xx
What happens to atheists that live good lives and are compassionate toward their fellow man?
Well, no. If you are forced to eat bacon and eggs every morning for 8 years, you're going to despise the smell of bacon and eggs.
Um, I'm saying that I have eaten bacon and eggs every morning for 8 years, and still like the smell.
Pressure is a funny thing.
Wow. Yay for misattribution.
My response to Loren was light-hearted, you're just being a bit of a dick.
I think if LibrarianThorne is right, then us good atheists are a-ok. Maybe read past catholic next time :P
Though to be fair, by LibrarianThorne's own description he's not technically a Catholic in the eyes of the Catholic Church. But then in the eyes of the catholic church almost no catholic people are.
2009 is a year of Updates - one every Monday. Hopefully. xx
When I said pressure I was refering to Loren.
Well, the bolded part is supported by the New Testament. So, I don't he's that far off. Well, ok, he's a bit out there.
Nietzche was a tool, but he did have a very very few good ideas.
No... the bolded part is the exact opposite of the new testament.
Romans 2: 12-16
No it isn't.
And what I mean is that whilst certain parts may suggest that, others do not like:
Thats a pretty strong tenant in every christian faith. Admitadly he then lists the super powers they will gain by doing such a thing (special tongue voices, and healing touch). The trick with being a Christian is selectively reading the bible and pretending your not doing so.
2009 is a year of Updates - one every Monday. Hopefully. xx
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God's sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
Years, and years ago I once made my religous education teacher threaten to throw me out the class, because on the theme of "how we find our morals in the bible" we were given a list of topics (do not kill, love thy neighbour, help people, support your family, and so on...) and we had to find quotes in the bible that backed up these ideas.
I made a list of all the ones that said the opposite.
The point is, no ones morals come from the bible, their current societies morals are mearly being reflected in the bible, by how their culture choses to enterpret it.
But regardless, we are derailing the thread.
2009 is a year of Updates - one every Monday. Hopefully. xx
Maybe if you read that as believeth in being not a rat-bastard. Go preach the word, so that more people may not be rat-bastards.
Anyway, the various Gospels and stuff have some discrepencies, partly because some of the disciples didn't really like each other. There's some great polemics in there. My take, is that as long as your religion tells you to not be a greedy, hateful ass or otherwise horrible person, its fine by me. If you in fact have no religion and are still not an ass and horrible person, then that is also cool.
"Some", to me, is an understatment, but :^: to that bro. I don't care what you do or do not believe, as long as you behave like a good person, and obey the golden rule, of treating others like you would like to be treated.
But there is a lot of truth in the quote "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." (which I've forgotten who said). Not that, that is limited to God, like the Astrology fearing, Numerology loving miltary junta in Burma.
Though lets not forget secular arseholes as well.
2009 is a year of Updates - one every Monday. Hopefully. xx
The very fact that it is so perfect should raise warning bells on whether or not it exists.
I was, thankfully, raised by two parents who had no interest whatsoever in exposing me to organized religion. I was never taken to church, never given a talk about religion--nothing. I never asked any questions either. To me religion always seemed so utterly alien that, as a child, religious people really, seriously frightened me. My grandparents would, on the rare occasions that I'd spend time with them sans parents, inevitably give me long talks about how I had to accept Jesus in order to get into heaven. I know on at least one occasion I called my mother crying and she came and picked me up about 48hrs earlier than planned because of my mortal terror of this strange, irrational devotion to things that I could see had no relevance to the real world.
I'm not scared of religion anymore, but I certainly don't respect it. I've never met a religious belief that can stand up to even the slightest real questioning and, I'm sorry, I don't respect people who feel like the best way to understand the universe is to wave your hands, make something up, and then jam your fingers in your ears so you don't have to hear all the reasons you're wrong.
Luckily religion is on the way out. It'll take a long, long time, but beginnings of a slide into irrelevancy are pretty obvious in my opinion. Lies can't win when the truth is available in every public library.
And in response on what happens to the good atheists, as far as the Mormon church goes they do baptisms by proxy in the temples for those who are dead and never had a chance to learn or choose to be a part of what we think is the true gospel, so their spirits, in a waiting ground with everyone else until the second coming, have a chance to choose weather or not they want to accept the Baptism, (followed by other ordnances). This is why genealogy is so important to us.
Are there any other beliefs that think something like this?
I do believe in afterlife, because it would just be so...well, unfunny if there wasn't anything after death. Whetether it involves a god or not, I don't know.
I hope that when we die, we become invisible and intangible spirits that can move with faster then light speeds and explore the universe for forever, with endless amount of things to see.
Of course, it isn't very probable that this will happen.
That would be pretty cool too. To know everything.
I don't misunderstand it, I realize that the concept just seems to be just flooding your conciousness with happy juices. I don't like the idea of, if there is an afterlife, it being that or eternal suffering. I would rather there just not be an afterlife than either of those options, because they both involve removing everything that makes me actually like and enjoy conciousness.
After a year or so of waffling on my beliefs, I set out to prove Christianity one way or another. I grabbed a stack of books and tried to prove, one way or another, the basic tenent of Christianity: A man named Jesus was crucified and later came back to life. After going through several pro- and con- books on the issue, it quickly became evident that no one actually has any concrete proof one way or another.
Given that the central tenet of Christianity didn't appear provable or disprovable barring new evidence, I settled for Agnostic, where I remain today, waiting for new inofrmation to come to light.
The biggest consequence of my position is that I am absolutely terrified of death, since currently I have to believe that the lights go out and no one is home. That scares the piss out of me, and I envy religious people who have a sense that something else happens after we die.
That's what I think of an aspect of religion. I don't like it, and I was discussing it. I see absolutely no reason for you to call me a jackass. It's really getting absurd.
I ask because I'm curious about what if any belief structure is involved, as I think the closest I've ever come to a real religious experience was being absolutely in the middle of nowhere on a hillside standing in the ruins of Rievalux Abbey near Yorkshire. Thirty minutes standing there seemed to justify thousands of years of earth worship and transcendentalism. It's a sight to behold, and an incredibly serene place to absorb
In fact, everyone get out of this thread, because page 10 olol.